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good to be with you, i'm katy tur. today has been a such a strange day. we're going to get to that surprise mayhem on capitol hill this morning with the unannounced hunter biden visit in a moment, but we've got to start with what is about to hus hit us, the iowa caucus is monday. as candidates prepare and voters prepare, law enforcement is preparing as well because the threats around this election have never been greater, meaning the threats around any election have never been greater. we are living in a scary time, and it's not me saying that. it's everyone involved in politics from the election officials, judges and lawmakers, to the poll workers, canvassers and voters. some iowa republicans telling us they are afraid to say who they are supporting. it is a twist from what we saw in 2016 when some voters said they were worried to tell

pollsters on their friends they supported donald trump. now some were saying they're scared to say they're not supporting donald trump. we have concerning reporting from vaughn hillyard underscored by a recent poll from prri and brookings, finding almost a quarter of americans support political violence ahead of the presidential election. now, couple that with the wave of threats and intimidate toward public officials and government billions, in the electoral system and the justice system, over the last few days, more than a dozen state capitols have been hit with phony bomb threats, forcing evacuations and closures. and nbc news is reporting judge tanya chutkan, and special counsel jack smith have also fallen victim to fake swatting calls on their homes. joining us now, nbc news justice reporter, ryan reilly, we want to talk to you about this because you cover so much of these threats, you cover so much of what happened in the fallout of january 6th, tell us what the

sources you have and the justice department and the national security apparatus are telling you about when they are concerned about as we kick off this election year. >> yeah, i mean, it's a real worry. the justice department has sort of focused some of their attention on setting up the task force to deal with threats against election workers, but really just dealing, i think, with the scope of this, and the constant flow of these threats is really difficult, i think, for any bureaucracy, really to handle. and really, if you boil this down, the core of this goes back to the idea that a lot of americans believe a bizarre conspiracy theory about the 2020 election. they continue to believe that donald trump should be president, right, they think that a lot of these conspiracy theories he's putting out there that the election was stolen from him is true. it's not, but that's what they believe, and some of the people who believe that are going to act in a way if you think the election is stolenment if you think that joe biden shouldn't be in the white house and he's a presidential usurper, he might

decide to act in a certain way, and a lot of people are acting on that. it's an inevitable consequence of lies that have been spread since 2020. a lot of targeting of individuals that we have seen, especially coming, i think, from one of the people with the biggest bull horns in the country especially when he was president, donald trump. >> so how do you prepare for that, guard against that when the main candidate, front runner could change is the one that's going out and warning that, you know, if he doesn't win, it's not fair. it's rigged. he did it once. he tried to do it in 2016 for a little while until he realized he was winning and he stopped. what happens if he does it again in 2024? >> even if 2016, as you know, he continued to believe that he won the actual popular vote. you can see that he lost the popular vote and more americans voted for hillary clinton than donald trump even though he obviously won the electoral college. that's something he can't seem to let go of, and unfortunately it takes a lot of energy, and a

lot of pushback, i think, from news organizations. even though, you know, he's delegitimized a lot of news organizations in the eyes of supporters, that he only believe the things that are coming out of his mouth. having sat through so many of these january 6th cases and watching these defendants go to sentencing, there's a real distinction between the individuals who continue to believe those lies, who have a real tough time being apologetic for their conduct that day, even if they offer some sort of surface level apology to maybe score a few points with the judge, but it's really the people who realize who the fever broke for is fascinating. there have been moments in court, and i really believe them when they said they were tricked, they were fooled. we had, for example, ray epps was just sentenced yesterday, and he's someone whose life has been torn apart by bogus conspiracy theories. somebody on the internet, somebody who used to work in the trump white house spread this conspiracy theory that he was an

fbi source, ridiculous on its face, and the fact that he was convicted and sentenced for criminal activity, also just completely eliminates that. it's not possible for someone who was a fbi confidential human source to be charged and convicted. that would be a real raw deal for him, and he probably wouldn't go down quietly were that true. his life has been torn apart, and what was fascinating about his sentencing, he wrote this letter to the judge, he says he was tricked by fox news, he no longer believes the lies about the election, and wants to spend the rest of his life correcting this and encouraging people to make sure they have faith in elections and don't try to dispute election results, especially some election that was as secure as 2020 was. >> such a good example. ryan reilly, thanks. joining us now, msnbc legal analyst, lisa rubin, former chief of homeland security and intelligence for the district of columbia, danell harvin, and former congressman from pennsylvania, charlie dent. you relatively recently retired from congress, there have been a

lot of retirements lately, especially among republicans, among those who have dared to go against donald trump. what is the threat environment if you're a lawmaker right now? >> the threat environment has been real for a long time, post gab bee giffords, steve scalise, many took precautions. we had a safe room in my district office because there were people who would make threats. there are more people making threats. we used to have space between our staff and the waiting room, you had to be buzzed in. anytime we noticed a meeting in public where people could show up uninvited, police, we always had law enforcement at meetings. and, again, the situation has gotten worse with all the swatting that's occurred and the bomb threats over the last few days. it's worst, all of these medical examiner -- members are in a heightened sense of awareness of

their security and their family's security. you will have people in your district who will call your home and threaten your family. that's happened to me once when i served, so it's a big problem. it's gotten worse since i left. >> and you mentioned gabby giffords and steve scalise, i want to narrow in on today and what 2024 is like and how much different it's gotten. what's it like? i know you're not campaigning right now, but if you were, what's it like to campaign in this moment? >> it's a real challenge. until you have donald trump out there, who's always using incendiary rhetoric, that can incite people. that's another issue. but if you're out there campaigning, i think it actually limits what you will do in your campaign activities. you will often do some type of risk analysis, things are just going to get out of control or

there's potential for some type of violence. if you're running a campaign, you're probably weighing security as a factor in your determination of whether or not to even have an event in this environment. that's how bad it is. >> does it limit what you might say and what you might not say? could that be one of the reasons we're not hearing so many direct, i don't want to say attacks, but direct, i'll use attacks for lack of a better word, against the candidates and donald trump because it's scary to go against him. we saw after the insurrection, a lot of republican lawmakers saying enough is enough, lindsey graham, for instance, and a couple of days later when they were trying to get on planes to go home, they were screamed at, intimidated at the airport, and, you know there's a feeling that if not for that there would have been more republican lawmakers who voted to convict, who really detached themselves, disentangled themselves from donald trump in the aftermath of january 6th. >> well, i think it's certainly fair to say that for some

members of congress, you know, the threat of attack from trump supporters has had a chilling effect on their speech. now, some are simply afraid, too, because they don't want to antagonize his pace. i would have to think that some are also doing it out of fear for security or their family's security. the ones running against them for president. i don't think they're fearful of that type of attack. i think they have security around them, and so they should be less inhibited but for your rank and file member or republican member of congress, you do have to take that into consideration every time you open your mouth knowing there's somebody. >> it's wild to have it in the back of your mind, even if you did have security. lisa, let's talk about what's happening in the court system. there are a lot of court cases against donald trump. what's happening to those officials who are overseeing trials, those officials who may be trying to prosecute them. >> we have seen two examples in the last week alone, katy,

right? we have seen swatting attempts at the home of judge tanya chutkan, and the special counsel, jack smith, who is not only prosecuting that case but the classified records case in florida, and of course we've seen a number of threats against the law clerk and this little fraud trial, the judge in the civil fraud trial, the threats against the law clerk were so extensive that you had a new york court security officer essentially testify in a document that it would fill up 237 single spaced pages to type out all of the things that were said in voice recordings to her. so i think there's an absolute link between the legal proceedings and those who have had those threats against them, and of course being abated and encouraged by a person who we understand on january 6th, 2021, when he was told that his own vice president was in the cross hairs, essentially, said so what. he knows what he's doing. he continues to stoke his supporters and allies. >> and then there are the poll

workers, the individuals who are trying to administer our elections. there are poll workers, it's hard to hire poll workers across the country right now. they don't feel safe. we saw what happened in georgia with the two poll workers that donald trump individually attacked and rudy giuliani did as well. if you were working at the homeland security department right now, how do you prepare for this? what are you watching? >> well, must be terrifying for poll workers. we didn't mention all the letters in november that were laced with fentanyl. the fbi still looking for a suspect in that case. so i think what we're seeing right now, and i want to be very clear i think americans should be very clear, what we're seeing right now in my opinion, is a slow burn, silent insurrection. the ground work for this was laid for january 6th. and what you see is intimidation. and really, attacking the roots, the heart of our democratic processes, that's election

workers, officials, individuals that may speak out against the former president, and the entire election infrastructure is at risk. the answer to your question, what we need to do is make sure all the polls are secured. all the election workers and those officials at the state level feel safe and comfortable in doing their job and speaking out when they see wrong doing. and that's all buttressed by the fact that there's a lot of mis and disinformation going on, some of it within our country, and some from foreign adversaries. it as snowball that started on january 6th, and it's rolling down the hill, and there's no stop in sight for it. >> could we be overstating the threat? could this be not that big of a deal? could we be headed for an everything's fine election? >> it's always possible. we routinely see those scenarios in intelligence. you have all the bred crumb trails for a violent confrontation, and what we're seeing right now is also like a cyber insurrection. when you look at the swatting, the doxxing, keep in mind that

president trump doksed former president obama last year, and soon there have, a january 6th defendant was found driving a van crammed with arms, guns, you know, just looking around, driving around former president obama's neighborhood as well as doxxing other members of congress, and so the former president not only incites but he also invites this type of political violence, and it leads to terrorism, it's quite dangerous. i think it's a grim outlook for 2024. >> lisa, what did the attorney general say about what he's been seeing? he called it a deeply disturbing spike. the doj is clearly watching. >> the doj is watching, and monitoring, and yet, as our guests know, trying to prevent this swatting or even detect who's doing it is one of the hardest forms of domestic terrorism to prevent because we don't always have the

technological means to determine where it is coming from. it is what makes this as a terroristic device so successful is that we can't always prevent or determine where it's coming from, and it really is terrorism. i want to underscore that, katy, because the goal here is to have people live in terror just for doing their jobs. for overseeing in courts, for administering elections or even for participating in a free press. >> i want to underscore the poll. 23% of americans agree that because things have gotten off track, true american patriots may have to resort to violence to save our country, up from 15% in 2021, which is, frankly, a pretty big number. everyone, thank you very much for joining us, starting us off on this conversation. still ahead, we've got a little bit more on it. you have heard about trump's silent supporters helping him win in 2016, about what his silent detractors in 2024. >> i don't talk about donald

trump a lot because i'm afraid of the backlash. >> and after months of republicans asking where is hunter biden, hunter biden shows up on capitol hill. what happened when he surprised the house oversight committee? first, though, a violent takeover of a tv station while anchors were on the air. what's happening in ecuador, and why experts say it's unlike anything the region has experienced before. we're back in 60 seconds. back is

part of the explanation for donald trump defying election polling and winning in 2016 was this idea that there were silent trump voters out there, that there were people who didn't feel comfortable telling a pollster they supported donald trump but were definitely going to pull the lever for him in the privacy of the voting booth. this year, we might be seeing something similar but with a twist. except this time, it could be

republicans who now feel uncomfortable admitting they don't support him. joining us now in des moines, indiana, is nbc news correspondent, vaughn hillyard, so talk to us about what you discovered? >> reporter: we talked so much about the silent majority, those were donald trump's own words to describe the movement that was around him. let's be clear, not only does polling bear this out, but also our conversations with the folks on the ground here in iowa and around the country that those opposed to donald trump, they are silent, by and large, but also the minority, not the silent majority, which has made it difficult in their conversations with their friends and their family, and those in their community when talking about donald trump. take a listen to a few of the folks, though, who were willing to speak to us on camera. >> people go below the belt and take after donald trump. donald trump goes below the belt. >> kyle claire fell in love with politics in 2015 because of donald trump.

>> he made jokes on stage, you know, he had these big fun rallies. >> no place like being at a trump rally. >> but now a junior at the university of iowa and a college republican, he wants the party to move beyond trump. we first met kyle in august at a gop debate watch party where he first shared with us his changed view. and frustrations with those supporters still loyal to trump, on a video posted on tiktok. >> they don't want to believe he lost the election. >> the fallout from speaking out, personal attacks, including on his sexuality by others who watched the video online. >> i had someone come up to me who recognized me just from the video and put a camera in my face and was filming me and said, asked me why i was scared of donald trump, i should be scared of getting aids from

section. >> you voted for trump in 2016. >> yeah, i thought, maybe this man is going to really do something good. >> reporter: barbara said she's one of the only outspoken voices against him at her nursing home. >> there's so many things that he said he's going to do this and that to get even with people. >> i am your retribution. i am your retribution. >> and that's just like an accelerant. >> reporter: barbara and kyle are not alone. we have heard this often over the last years and those publicly speaking out, anxious of being shunned by family, friends or others in the community. >> i don't talk about donald trump a lot because i'm afraid of the backlash, and so for me to do this is really a step out of my comfort zone. >> reporter: public polls of the republican presidential contest show that trump remains popular with most gop voters. it's more than just candidates like nikki haley and ron

desantis choosing how far to go in taking on trump. it's also the party's voters. >> people can be vicious online. especially behind a screen. you know, people can leave -- can say things about you and they don't even know you. i want people to know that i'm still a conservative. i still have conservative values. i'm a republican, but just because i'm not a big fan of donald trump right now does not mean that i'm not a republican. >> reporter: katy, kyle, barb, jodi, they represent a wing of the republican party today that does not have a home. each of those three told me they wish that liz cheney was running for the president of the united states, but obviously that is not reality, and as we approach not only the iowa caucus but other primaries around the country, it is folks like kyle, barb and jodi that are wondering where they fit in the american political system today. >> you know, i wonder what we

might see when people actually start voting. we rely on polling and polling shows one thing. what happens when people actually start casting their ballots in the privacy of the voting booth. vaughn hillyard, thank you very much. coming up, nikki haley is rising in the polls, could the gop race make a surprise turn when voters, again, actually start voting. first, though, what republicans who want to hear from hunter biden did when hunter biden offered himself up for questioning in person today. , your eye symptoms could mean something more. that gritty feeling can't be brushed away. even a little blurry vision can distort things. and something serious may be behind those itchy eyes. up to 50% of people with graves' could develop a different condition called thyroid eye disease, which should be treated by a different doctor. see an expert. find a t-e-d eye specialist at isitted.com

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>> yes, i'm looking at you, hunter biden, as i'm speaking to you. you're not above the law at all. i believe that hunter biden should be held completely in contempt. i think he should be hauled off to jail right now. >> let's vote. let's take a vote. who wants to hear from hunter right now, today. anyone? come on. who wants to hear from hunter. no one. >> mr. biden doesn't make the rules. we make the rules. >> mr. chairman, you make the rules and the rule you made is that he can choose. >> excuse me, hunter, apparently you're afraid of my words. >> joining me now, "punchbowl news" cofounder, and msnbc political contributor, jake sherman. can you explain what happened today. >> i can try, katy. here's the irony. let's take a step back here. republicans have asked hunter biden to come in for a closed door private deposition. hunter biden said i'll come in for a public hearing where you

can't cherry pick what i say and put it in the public domain, and the committee has said no, and there's in traditional times good reason to have private depositions in public hearings. i understand hunter biden's point, they're going to take whatever i say out of context and put it in the public domain. listen, here's the strange thing for republicans. republicans actually have a somewhat decent argument here, which is people shouldn't dodge subpoenas. kevin mccarthy shouldn't have dodged his subpoena. jim jordan shouldn't have dodged his subpoena when they got subpoenaed by the january 6th committee. congressional subpoenas are a real thing. this hearing went completely off the rails, katy, in a way that only house republicans could do. it turned into a circus as we saw just now. if they kept this narrowly focused on the fact that hunter biden was subpoenaed, he is not complying with the subpoena, then that would have been an interesting argument for them to make. instead this turned into a complete circus like it does with house republicans.

>> i assume they're going to hold a vote to hold him in contempt and go to the full house. it will likely pass. is that your expectation? >> i would assume it passes, katy. i would assume it goes to the floor next week and passes. listen, they have a two-seat majority at this point. they're completely ungovernable. they are losing, they just lost a vote not long ago on the house floor on a procedural motion. conservatives voted against the leadership, so taking nothing for granted, yes, i assume this passes. >> are they expecting to ever get testimony from hunter biden. if the doj holds them in contempt, maybe, but if not, what are they going to do? >> i mean, they could agree to a public, listen, james comer says he sets the rules for the committee. undoubtedly he does. they could get testimony from him if they agree to do this in a public setting. there frankly is no reason, katy, they shouldn't be able to do this in a public setting. they're not talking about classified information.

they're not talking about national secrets, state secrets, they could do this in a public setting. it wouldn't be ideal based on traditional comings and goings of the house oversight committee, but they could do this in a public settling and get testimony. >> you talk about the thin majority. there's a spending deal, a handshake deal between speaker mike johnson and majority leader chuck schumer. i get word that mike johnson is standing a few feet from you doing an interview with fox news, is this spending deal in jeopardy? >> well, he was just standing next to me. the spending deal probably is not in jeopardy in the sense that johnson agreed to it. it's already the law of the land, the spending limits, but the big picture here, katy, is mike johnson is the man who stepped in to yesterday. these are the same problems that house republicans had under kevin mccarthy, the same problems. they are freezing. conservatives are freezing up the house floor. they can't bring anything to the floor this week. now the conservatives voted

against this rule. they are going to have a tough time keeping the government open. mike johnson needs to decide in short order whether he's going to pass a stopgap next week or let the government shut down next friday. this is the same problems, new face, same problems they faced under kevin mccarthy, nothing has changed. >> who's wilson, chip roy, matt gaetz? >> i'll put some thought into that and get back to you. and i will be providing the narration for it, i would say. >> jake sherman, thank you very much. >> thanks, katy. >> my friend. the u.s. navy shoots down more houthi missiles on the red sea. what antony blinken is warning iran. >> and nikki haley is rising in the polls, could there be an actual race for the gop nomination? don't go anywhere. ve you tried downy rinse and refresh♪ it helps remove odors 3x better than detergent alone. it worked guys! ♪yeahhhh♪ downy rinse and refresh.

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five days out from iowa, and polls still show donald trump leading by double digits, but there is some movement. joining us now, nbc news national political correspondent steve kornacki. give us the lay of the land today. >> i can give you the lay of the land from our most recently nbc news "des moines register" iowa poll, and i can mention we will have a final one that is going to come out this weekend. it's usually the most anticipated poll before the iowa caucuses, so everything i'm about to show you, the question we're looking at is this weekend, has anything changed, is anything changing at the last minute. as of a few weeks ago, the last

time we were checking in on iowa, this is what it looked like, donald trump the run away leader here, seeing this all year or all of 2023 here, and now into 2024, and the question in that poll, and the question a lot of people are talking about is desantis and haley, what about that race for second place. can somebody get second, do a surprisingly strong second, get momentum out of iowa, certainly ron desantis is practically camped out in the state. he's really almost made it a make or break test for him. he has pressure on to get second place. you see the battle. what are some of the numbers that go into that. let's look at it from desantis's standpoint first at 19%. 30 points behind trump in our poll. the issue for desantis is not that republicans in iowa don't like him, they like him a lot. the same poll, 2/3 have a favorable view of him. less than 30%, unfavorable. the problem for desantis is he seems to in his message and his style, his approach, he seems to be trying to go after the voters

who are attracted to donald trump, that seem to be, originally, the idea of the desantis campaign, trumpism without trump. that was sort of the informal pitch when desantis got in the race, and the problem he's running into is just that these republican voters, they are looking at desantis and saying they like him, and they're saying when it comes to voting, they like trump more, a lot more. this is trump voters in iowa. we asked him, who's your second choice. overwhelmingly, it's ron desantis. so trump voters like desantis in iowa. a lot of them like desantis, and it seems like if trump weren't there, they would be ready to vote for him. trump for these republicans is standing in the way of desantis. now for nikki haley, her core support here, this is from the same poll, independents. independents make up maybe about 20% of the iowa caucus electorate. trump leading with this group in our poll. haley, last time we checked in moved over 20%.

23% with independents. we're seeing this in other states as well. independents, a group gravitating toward nikki haley. starting to gravitate towards nikki haley. if she's going to get second place in iowa, seems like republican voters who don't like trump, are skeptical of trump, they seem to be disproportionate incline toward haley. if she's trying to get ento second -- into second place and make a statement, there could be enough to get her. >> does that give enough momentum to move to new hampshire, already surging in that state, and what happens to the rest of the race. go ahead. >> sorry, i didn't realize you were trying to wrap up with that. >> no, tell me. >> this is the new hampshire average, and there is haley sitting in second place. the key with new hampshire, independents can make up half of the electorate. >> steve kornacki, thank you very much. joining us, the "des moines

register's" chief political reporter and msnbc political reporter, breann fannensteel. the expectation in iowa is donald trump has it far and away. >> i don't think we can be sure until caucus day, certainly the polling indicates that donald trump remains incredibly strong in iowa. over the weekend, he held an event in clinton, iowa, you know, people were lining up two to three hours before the event started for them to get in, and donald trump was about three and a half hours late and everybody stayed. there was not a mass exodus. when you're just looking at the enthusiasm and the willingness of people to go and to see donald trump, you know, his events are unlike any of the other candidate events we're seeing in iowa. he is still commanding that attention, that enthusiasm that we're seeing anecdotally and not born out by the polls. >> iowans are used to bad

weather in januar a snowstorm around caucus is not unusual. being cold around the caucus is not unusual. it's going to be very cold, though, on monday. is it your expectation that that's going to change turnout? >> it could. you know, as you say, a cold january isn't news in iowa, but this could be historically cold. we had our data reporter dig back through past weather reports and this could be the coldest iowa caucus on record. and so that can change things, right, especially when you look at the potential caucus going electorate, it sends to be older republicans, and that can be a real deciding factor, if they're not feeling safe to go out in that weather, if they don't have the right kind of vehicle, and so that really could depress turnout a little bit, and so that's what i'm looking to some of these campaigns who say that they're very well organized. what are they doing to make sure that their supporters can show

up and have the resources that they need to get out to their caucuses. >> you watched caucus night, watched any of us report, you know that it can be very unpredictable. thank you very much. talk to you soon. and an armed takeover of a tv studio and police kidnappings, what is driving a new wave of violence in ecuador, pretty stunning video in a moment. first, though, what the united states and its allies say they will do to stop houthi attacks in the red sea.

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two currently administration officials tell nbc news that the united states and its allies are considering a stronger military response to shut down houthi rebel attacks on commercial ships in the red sea. on tuesday, the u.s. navy shot down 21 houthi missiles and drones launched from yemen in one of the largest attacks to take place in the red sea in months. joining us from teheran, bureau chief ali arouzi. iran backs the houthis, what is iran currently saying and what is the u.s. currently warning iran? >> reporter: well, the u.s. and the uk and others keep warning the houthis and their patrons here in iran to stop these attacks in the red sea or there will be consequences, and almost

after every warning comes a bigger attack, katy. the last one according to the british defense secretary is the largest attack by yemen houthi rebels on red sea shipping. the u.s. military says the iranian designed one-way attack drones, anti-ship cruise missiles, and ballistic ship missiles, launched from houthi controlled areas of yemen towards international shipping lanes of the southern red sea. 18 drones, two cruise missiles and one ballistic missile were shot down by four u.s. warships and a british destroyer. and just to give you an idea, katy, of how expensive it is for the coalition to fight the houthis, the british shot down the houthi drones with what they call sea viper missiles. each one of the sea viper missiles cost $1.3 million. each one of the houthi drones only cost $20,000, and of course there's the cost of global shipping, which has been totally disrupted by the houthis, bedrock of global trade, and one of the most critical waterways in the world.

and secretary blinken is sounding the alarm. he had a warning for the houthis and iran. let's take a listen to what he had to say. >> i'm not going to telegraph or preview anything that might happen. all i can tell you is, again, we've made clear, we have been clear with more than 20 other countries that if this continues, as it did yesterday, there will be consequences. we've also repeatedly tried to make clear to iran as other countries have as well, that the support that they're providing to the houthis, including for these actions, needs to stop. it's not in their interest to see the conflict escalated. >> reporter: so despite all of these warnings, despite this international coalition in the red sea, the houthis confirmed that they carried out this massive attack, and they vowed to continue these attacks to prevent ships navigating in both the red sea and the arabian sea

until they say the aggression on gaza comes to an end. >> it is a massive cost disparity between what the missiles cost and drones cost, a million to 20,000. ali arouzi, thank you very much. and joining us from tel aviv is nbc news foreign correspondent raf sanchez. so antony blinken was touring the middle east. he was in tel aviv. he was on the west bank, talking to mahmoud abbas. he was hearing from regional leaders that they want to normalize relations with israel, but they're only going to do so when hostilities end and when there is a clear and functional path toward a palestinian state. what was the reception that antony blinken got in israel from the prime minister and his government? >> well, he had a lot to say. he was offering a carrot, in one said, telling the israeli government that the prospect of normalization with saudi arabia is still on the table.

but that israel is going to have to make concessions. the war in gaza needs to end, there has to be a pathway towards a palestinian state and they need to accept that the palestinian authority, which is in charge in some ways in the occupied west bank will also return to the gaza strip, and it's not clear that the government or prime minister are able, prepared to make those kinds of concessions even in exchange for the prize of normalization with saudi arabia. as you said, secretary blinken was in ramallah earlier. he was meeting the head of the palestinian authority. that sounds like it was a tense meeting. the palestinians want the u.s. to push israel for an immediate cease-fire. that is not something that the biden administration is prepared

to do saying israel needs more time to continue its mission of dismantling hamas. there's a lot of frustration among the palestinian that is the far-right israeli finance minister is withholding palestinian tax revenues. there is real concern in the u.s. among israeli security officials that the economic meltdown we're seeing in the west bank is going to turn into a security meltdown. you have palestinian workers who aren't able to go into israel to work anymore since october 7th and this money being withheld, they want the u.s. to do more to get those funds released. the u.s. has said to israel that needs to happen, but so far no sign of a those funds being transferred. >> thank you very much. coming up next, a tv station in ecuador attacked while it is on the air. that's one thing that's been going on in a wave of violence that is taking over that country. what's happening in ecuador? nin?

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ecuador's president is ordering all armed gangs to be neutralized after this disturbing incident at a news station. authorities say the 13 gunman were all arrested and will be charged with terrorism. nobody was killed. but the incident followed 24 hours of similar attacks and abductions of police officers across the country. after two leaders of ecuador's most powerful gangs escaped prison. joining us now guad venegas. what's driving this? >> reporter: katy, we should also acknowledge that these gangs are essentially criminal organizations. they're also functioning the way drug cartels function in mexico.

in fact, the most notorious leader who was missing from his cell on sunday triggered this new wave of violence because the president decided to declare a state of emergency right after that. that leader of the gang has been associated to the cartel. what's happening, after the president declared the state of emergency which gives the police more power, the gangs escalated the violence, taking over some prisons, also kidnapping police officers, and as you mentioned, going into this television station. now the government has not identified individuals that enter that tv stations as members of a specific gang, but they have now declared 20 different gangs as terrorist organizations and today we're also hearing from some of the employees of that tv station talking of what it was like when these men entered the station. here's one of them.

>> reporter: and now the president has also responded with a series of videos on his instagram page, especially promoting his campaign against what are now called terrorist organizations in ecuador. one of the biggest problems are the leaders of these gangs inside of prisons that have essentially been operating inside of those prisons, controlling the gangs. so now the military will have to go into all of ecuador's prisons and take control, and take back that control as they gain this new power, what the president says is now an armed and

internal arm conflict which will be quite a challenge because it has been months, it's been years since ecuador has had full control of the inside of these prisons. and the violence that has been escalating around the country, katy. >> and this escalating violence, this escalating instability drives migration, it's part of what we're seeing as people flee countries like ecuador that aren't stable and safe to look for a better life. thank you very much for joining us. that is going to do it for me today. "deadline: white house" starts right now. ♪♪ it is 4:00 here in new york. i'm in today for nicolle wallace. this afternoon at long last it is here, a frenzied week of legal reckoning for donald trump circled in red sharpie on our calendars