efforts to overturn election results? >> yeah. i received subpoenas from jack smith's investigation in washington. d.c.. and i received subpoenas from fani willis is investigation in fulton county, georgia. >> okay. in your op-ed piece, you mentioned trump's latest legal battle, and you say if trump is sure heas immunity, then he should work with and not against prosecutor jack smith. can you explain that? why? >> is that my quote? >> yeah? >> okay? i don't recall making that, but will run with it. it may not have been verbatim. i could keep looking through here. there's some things -- >> -- i >> would there be reason for donald trump to work with jack smith if he says, look, i did nothing wrong! there's a whole immunity thing! >> yeah. not being a lawyer, i wouldn't

suggest that a potential defendant cooperate with a prosecutor, just because he might be wrong about his blanket immunity statements. but look. it's very clear evidence wise that voter fraud is not why the election was lost. in fact, the middle part of my book explains in great detail with verifiable proof why trump lost the election. there is a simple explanation. it has nothing to do with fraud whatsoever. and when i'm free to talk about it, everybody will understand. it makes perfect sense. president trump is not actively making sure that all conservative voters are in his camp. bottom line. and it's really hard to win an election when you carve out a piece of the electorate and tell them, you are dead to me.

which is what former president trump has done many, many times. you have to have a broad coalition to win an election, and president trump has actively narrowed his base of support overtime. >> okay. it's disproven, it's coming out march 12th, it will probably be required reading for many in the world and beyond. thank you very much, kenneth. i look forward to meeting you again. in the meantime, in moments, back to iowa. a bitter chill in the air. only slightly more intense than the bitter republican fight for the 2024 presidential nomination. we've got live reports ahead in just moments. just moments a very good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york, welcome, everyone, to the second hour of alex witt reports. we're following breaking news. the u.s. launched a new strike against houthi rebels in yemen overnight. that's according to two defense officials. this comes one day after the u.s. on the unitedngdo struck doz sites belonging to the iranian-backed

group. president biden responded to the strike to a chemist off in philadelphia. pennsylvania, rather, friday. >> authorities -- they know -- >> yes actually thought, well you continue with the strikes? >> we will make sure that we respond to houthis if they continue -- our allies. >> the strikes come in response to weeks of houthi attacks on ships in the red sea. now, the militants are vowing to retaliate. our nbc news correspondents are covering those developments from overseas, as well as the white house, as we welcome you both. we're going to bring in nbc's josh lederman, joining us from tel aviv in israel. josh, what is the latest on the strikes and also, the war in gaza? >> well, alex, the houthis in yemen today are racing to try to show that they are not deterred by these u.s. airstrikes. in, fact they held a military parade in yemen today, where they practiced firing mortars and displaying weapons marching through the streets to try to

show that they are not going to back down, and they have not been pushed back by these u.s. strikes. but here in israel, the government really has their hands full with the other threats in the region, from hezbollah and lebanon. to hamas in the gaza strip, where the humanitarian crisis continues to deteriorate. we're hearing from the u.n. and other aid groups, saying they are still unable to get aid to the places that need it, because of what they call delays or denials for permission from the israeli government. there's one piece of good news there, which is that israel says it is now reached a deal with hamas to be able to get badly needed medicine into the gaza strip. both for severely and palestinians, but interestingly, also for those israeli hostages in the gaza strip. more than 100 of them, some of whom are in bad need of that medication. and as we prepare for israel to mark 100 days before, tomorrow, alex, we are also awaiting a decision from the international court of justice in the hague after two days of hearings on

south africa's allegation of genocide against israel. it is now up to the court to rule whether to order israel to immediately halt its operation in the gaza strip. that could take weeks. and it's not any clearer, alex, if israel would follow that ruling if it did come down. it's real, of course, is firmly denying and calling faithless and the allegations of genocide. >> okay. thank you very much, josh, for that. the very latest from tel aviv. let's go now to nbc's erin gilchrist. joining us from the white house, so, aaron, welcome to you. what are we hearing from president biden about where the relationship between the u.s. and iran stands right now? >> well, alex, we know there is no formal diplomatic relationship between the u.s. and iran, but the biden administration, the president himself, has said time and again that they understand iran's role in what's been happening in the middle east er the last several months in particular. obviously, iran has not taken direct action in gaza. in israel, in yemen, or the red sea. but the u.s. says that iran's fingerprints really are all

over the militia action has been happening in iraq, in syria, in the red sea, and coming out of yemen by way of the houthis. president biden was asked in particular about the actions that the u.s. has taken now against the houthis inside yemen. as well as the connection to iran. i want you to hear some of what he said. >> we will make sure that we respond to the houthis -- outrageous behavior, along with our allies. >> are we in a de facto proxy war with iran? >> say again? >> are we in a de facto proxy war? >> no. no, iran does not want war with us. >> that really is the understanding, the global understanding right now. iran doesn't want a war with the u.s.. the u.s. doesn't want a war with iran, for that matter. t the president has said secretary of state, the defense secretary, they've all said that as the houthis and these iran proxies take action in the middle east, they're going to do everything they can to stamp t those actions without really trying to create a

larger conflict outside of what they are seeing happen in gaza and in israel. at the same time, the president through these actions that we saw over the last couple of days, the strike in yemen, we know that there's been pushback from the democratic party. i want you to hear a little bit about what congresswoman had to say here on msnbc about the president taking action against the houthis in yemen. >> we've had weeks where the president could come to congress have sight, this is the plan. in fact, i had a conversation yesterday with a top state department official, where they explained all the rationale. well, come explain it to congress. let us have that conversation, because in my mind, this is both about how we protect our shipping routes, but it's also about the war in gaza, and how do we make sure that that does not expand? >> the presidentng his stop in , pennsylvania yesterday, whether he had used the correct authority, whether he needed to ask congress for authorization

to take that action against the houthis. the president said that they're wrong. the democrats said that they did not do that properly, and they set the board about what exactly action he was taken to them yesterday morning, after that initial action was taken, alex. at the same time, they're still the question that stands now. were these strikes in yemen successful, to the point where the houthis would not be able to take the same sorts of actions they've been taken in the red sea? >> okay. aaron gilchrist, thank you very much from the white house. appreciate that. joining me right now, democratic congressman from washington, adam smith. he is the ranking member of the armed services committee. welcome, sir. it's good to see you again. so, the biden administration, tried to keep this report contains, right? but following the strikes on the houthis, the u.s. is now engaged in something of a regional war, at least on the brink of one, can this conflict be contained now? >> yes, i think it can. look, it's a continuous effort to try to contain it, make sure it doesn't spread. and thus far, it has not

spread. you don't have full scale fighting in any of these other places. but it's dangerous. i mean, we have iranian-backed melissa was attacking u.s. forces in iraq and syria. hezbollah is, you know, lobbing missiles occasionally from the north. and we've got with the houthis are doing. so far, the president has done a good job of containing this. this part of the reason for the strike against the houthis. to not let them continue to attack the shipping lanes with impunity. in the hope that this will tamp down that behavior, and we do -- ability to do it, it's going to be a really tough challenge to sort of stop this from spreading. but thus far, it has not spread into a wider regional full scale war. >> let's revisit what aaron was reporting there from the white house. some fellow democrats, including progressive caucus chair, pramila jayapal as you, heard and congressman -- can be added, other republicans like -- so the president violated the constitution by not asking for approval before striking the houthis. is that valid rather,?

should the president have brought this to congress? >> two things. first of all, in terms of the authorities the president has, this is a very clear article two authority. this is self-defense. article two says the president has the right to act in self-defense to to protect u.s. interests. the houthis were attacking u.s. ships. certainly, they were attacking merchant vessels from a variety of different countries, but they were also attacking the u.s. military, and he responded specifically to those attacks. now, i share some of the concerns that i know congressman khanna has expressed in the past about how presidents have widened that authority. there have been some strikes in the past i felt were not justified by the self-defense doctrine, where he should've had to come to congress. this isn't one of them. i would also point out that the white house, and national security team, has communicated with congress. they've certainly communicated with my committee, with the armed services committee, and others about their plans and their feelings about what's going on in yemen.

but this circumstance is in self-defense. i don't believe that required congressional authorization, authorization before he could go forward and make the strikes. >> can i ask, assuming a military action is on the horizon, when with the president need to get approval from congress? >> it's a case by case basis, as a hypothetical going forward. look, part of the problem here it is also, you know, i have to acknowledge is congress it's a difficult place to pass things. the houthis are hitting our ships in the middle of the red sea, interrupting commerce. and we say to them, you know, as soon as congress passes something we're, we're gonna deal with this. i don't think that's going to be particularly effective. so, we also in congress have to be clear about how we exercise our authority in a way that enables our country to carry out policy, it needs to carry out. >> can i ask you, do you think of political pressure at all, pressure from both sides, by the way, was part of the calculus behind the strike for the president? >> absolutely not.

in fact, the criticism you're hearing from republicans, even has he's done what i think most national security experts say he should have done, is he should've done it sooner, okay? and the president has been feeling this pressure. the houthi started these attacks two months ago, roughly? almost two months ago? and has been pressured from day one from a variety of sources that the president should act militarily. but what he did with the active deliberately and intelligently. he didn't shoot first and ask questions later. he assess the situation and was mindful of the fact that military action is a serious thing not to be taken lightly. he waited the appropriate amount of time, weighed the pros and cons, make sure of what he was doing, and then, acted in the u.s. interest. i think that was the exact right thing to do, and the timing was exactly right. >> we heard the president earlier saying we are not in a de facto proxy war with iran, and they do not want a war with us. do u.s. and other allies strikes on the houthis, doesn't draw iran into this conflict?

even if they say they don't want war, and how much control, i'm curious, over hamas and the houthis does iran actually have? >> yeah. well, there is conflict and then there's conflict. you know, it would be wrong to say that we're not in a conflict with iran. obviously, they are. their proxies are shooting at us, and we are shooting at them. but that's a good deal different than the full scale war we were engaged in iraq and afghanistan. like anyone would tell you. and that's what we are trying to avoid. these relatively low level strikes. is to deter the actions without stumbling into a full scale war. to answer your question, at this point, iran absolutely has a significant amount of control. certainly, over the houthis, but also over hamas. this is part of a wider effort by iran to destabilize the region, and attack their adversaries. certainly, the u.s. and israel, but, also a variety of arab states as well. it could attack saudi arabia,

they protect the uae, they're destabilizing iraq, so, yes. this is definitely iran that is driving this conflict. >> despite being out of time, let me quickly asabout dispensatory lloyd austin. there's anyone have to be held to account for the fact that he did not she s whereabouts being hospitalized with the white house or others that he ought to have? >> yes. i think we have questions to answer, as to whether or not anyone should be held to account. it depends about the answers to those questions are. it is simply unacceptable that the president did not know that his secretary of defense was in the hospital for, i think it was two or three days. after he was there. that should not have happened. it should never happen again. we need to understand why it happened, and if people are responsible for that, then, yes. accountability must be taken. but i think we need answers to those questions before we can definitively determine what bound accountability looks. like >> looks like period

exclamation point from you my friend. thank you so much, congressman adam smith. when michelle obama said about what keeps her up at night, plus, whether the biden administration is doing enough to deliver for black voters. we're back in 60 seconds. e back in 60 seconds clears throat ) for fast sore throat relief, try vicks vapocool drops. with two times more menthol per drop, and powerful vicks vapors to vaporize sore throat pain. vicks vapocool drops. vaporize sore throat pain. if you have chronic kidney disease you can reduce the risk of kidney failure with farxiga. because there are places you'd rather be. farxiga can cause serious side effects, including ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration, urinary tract, or genital yeast infections, and low blood sugar. a rare, life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking farxiga and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, an allergic reaction, or ketoacidosis. ♪ far-xi-ga ♪ nexium 24hr prevents heartburn acid for twice as long as pepcid.

get all-day and all-night heartburn acid prevention with just one pill a day. choose acid prevention. choose nexium. we are now just two days away from the iowa caucuses, were frigid and unprecedented sub-zero temperatures could hinder turnouts. the national weather service predicts that temperatures will be a brutal minus six degrees when the caucuses start at seven pm on monday. listen to the wind chill, minus 27. here's what the candidates are saying about the weather. >> all eyes are on iowa. -- sets the tone for where our country goes from here. >> i'll ask you for your support on monday, i know it's going to be cold, i know it's going to be not the most pleasant, but i don't think you'll ever be able to cast a vote that has more impact, given the circumstance. >> and we should note that at

07 sdy found that just an inch of snowfall above the average led to about a half percent drop in turnout. so, we're gonna see what happens on monday. joining me now is nbc's garrett haake, joining me from des moines. are you, garrett, getting a sense of the record breaking temperatures expected monday are going to impact turnout? i mean, look, folks in iowa or winter hardy, but this hearty? >> that's right. well, look. it certainly unpleasant, but one of the wrinkles in it is that the caucus is not a primary, which means are not going about people waiting in line around the block, or outside the building to get into their local precinct and vote throughout the course of the day. you show up at the appointed time, some of it opens the door, and everybody goes inside for process that will be entirely indoors so, basically, if you make it from your front steps or your car in your driveway, you can probably make it into caucus without being too exposed to this cold. nevertheless, these campaigns aren't taking any chances here. you played some of the sound from ron desantis and nikki haley, trying to urge their folks to come out. the campaigns are stocking up on trying to find their

volunteers who have four wheel drive vehicles, trying to make sure anybody who is still dealing with snow or ice as the opportunity to get there, and they're using the voter contactless they have built so meticulously for months and months to send out messages like this one from donald trump to his supporters, which hit inboxes and social media accounts thimorning. but a lot ofpeople say that are voters it's actually good for me, because our voters have a lot of spirit more speared than the other peopleand they're gonna get out and vote ter what. so we will see but you, know it's ae co up there. i start the journeytomorrow morning. it's a tough journey because i guess ey've never seen a coal like they have this snow and gold. it's pretty rough weather but i'll get up there one way or the other. >> forgive me, that's from a telephone town hall, another modern turn of phrase, which basically means you get a phone call and it's the candidates talking to you. it's like a conference call, i

didn't know we were going to be so lucky to be invited to. but the point the same, everybody is sort of building in their expectations about the weather, it's become the favorite parlor game of the reporters here, to try to figure out how this might impact things. the working theory, or at least the one i subscribe to, is that donald trump supporters, at least the ones that i've been dealing, with our so dug in and so committed to him as an individual, that they see most likely to show up, although they are also the least politically active. so the is a kind of weird balancing ayer to make sure that these folks who trul believe in him know where to, go and when to go, so they can turn that belief into something that will count. but we will see, the other campaigns are just as active behind the scenes, trying to make sure that everybody there who they come in contact with last spring knows that this is the time. >> listen, i'm glad you're on the case my friend, thank you so much. -- in the meantime, there are growing concerns democrats are not doing enough to appeal to african americans. a recent usa today poll finds only 63% of black voters say

they plan on voting for president biden. that is a sharp decline from the 87% he carried in 2020. during a new interview with my colleague joy reid, radio host charlamagne tha god and social justice advocate angela -- discussed why they are not surprised by these numbers. >> i have been in meeting after meeting, both on the hill and off the hill, with the party about their failure to reach their base, their most faithful base. for years, this is not new information. >> -- i'm up my listeners, what am i supposed to tell them? what am i supposed to tell them other than look man, donald trump's a fascist. you may think things can't get, worse but they absolutely positively can. but if they feel like we already lived through a trump -- i lived through reagan, how much worse can that get? like, it's like what do i tell? them they are not afraid of just telling you to go out and vote because of the fear anymore. >> joining me now is --

democratic strategist and former senior aide for the biden harris campaign. and symone sanders-townsend, co-host of the new msnbc show the weekend. and former chief spokesperson for vice president kamala harris. ladies, welcome to you both. simone, you first hear. do you agree with charles maine and angela -- ? i mean, is the biden campaign doing enough to earn the support of black voters? >> i don't agree. if, and i think charlamagne posed a good question. he said what am i supposed to tell my listeners? they were -- images supposed to tell them basically donald trump is very bad, and he's planning to be a dictator on day one? well yes, i think that's important for people to know. but i also think it's important to tell them that if they benefited from the child tax credit in 2021, or they had extra money in their bank account every single month, that was due to the biden administration. i think they should tell them that if they go and they fill their gas tank -- anywhere across the country right now, it is substantially cheaper now than it was a number of months ago.

that is a function of the biden administration. i mean, i could go on. talk about the student debt relief that has happened, and the student debt relief that has got to happen, which i don't think donald trump will do. so perhaps you should look at the other candidates in the race that say that they will in fact do that, and that is joe biden. and so, i agree, and i do think angela is absolutely correct. she's been there a long time on capitol hill, former executive director of congressional black caucus. and every single cycle there are multiple, multiple, multiple meetings about how to engage these voters. i do think that's important, that's key, because from my perspective, democrats should look at their base voters, young people, black voters, the kenow voters, voters of color writ large, as persuadable voters. there should be just as much energy put to those voters as energies -- into independents and quote unquote suburban women. and i think the biden team -- from what i have seen, has made a record investment in communicating to these voters. but i think the next step is

infrastructure. what does the on the ground organizing look like? they just hired a youth vote coordinator, and i would note -- alex, i prefer talking about young people and young voters. but that's right, but what how are they organizing the progressive infrastructure? where is the surrogate operation? i'm gonna start there because -- knows more about running a solid surrogate operation than anybody i know. >> i think you guys know a lot about whatever your perspective lanes are. but let me get to you then, this poll that i mentioned, adrian, it also finds one in five black voters say they plan on supporting a third party candidate in november. that's a heck of a wrinkle there. if you are inside the biden camp, are you alarmed by this? and what would you do to address it? >> yeah i mean look, we talked a lot about this, the fact that we are ten months out, in that the polls are actually starting to take a little bit more, and have a little bit more of an impact than they did say six or seven months ago, because we are getting closer to that one on one likely matchup with donald trump. and of, course there are some third party candidates in this

too. but they still provide a roadmap. and i think when we do look at the polling that shows that one in five black voters are interested in potentially supporting a third party candidate, you take notice, you take action, and you figure out what your strategy is to talk to those voters -- as simone mentioned, and get them back in your camp. and there is still plenty of time for the biden campaign to do. that i am not concerned. and i just want thrown a few more spots that simone was taking. off all of the incredible work that the biden administration has done for black americans. just to add a few more, record unemployment among -- records small businesses for black americans. we can go on and on. this administration has done so much. so really, when you start seeing the paid media campaign truly take effect, which will start taking effect, it will start taking effect now, but will really be ramped up as we get closer to the election. there will be a lot of targeted ads, ads that we won't even see on msnbc. they are very targeted toward the black community, to make sure that they understand what this administration has done, they understand what this

administration will do for them in the future. and most importantly, that they understand what would happen if a trump administration came back in. it would not be good for black americans, it frankly wouldn't be good for a majority of americans. >> so this week, former first lady michelle obama shared her concerns with the upcoming election. let's take a listen to that. >> our people are people get a vote? and why aren't people voting? are we too stuck to our phones? i mean, those are the things that keep me up, because you don't have control over them. and you wonder, where are we in this? you know, where are our hearts? what's going to happen in this next election? i am terrified about what could possibly happen, because our leaders matter, who we select, who speaks for us, who holds that bully pulpit, it affects us in ways that sometimes i think people take for granted. you know, the fact that people think that government, it does it really even do anything? and i'm like oh my god, does

government do everything for us. and we cannot take this democracy for granted. and sometimes i worry that we do. those are the things that keep me up. >> -- simone, given the popularity, the respect that michelle obama in joyce, how can democrats get the former first lady's message across before the election? >> well, they could ask her to come out and do some things. i think that, and i am sure that democrats have put in a number of asks before the former first lady, and she and her team are likely figuring out how and when they are going to engage. but i think what michelle obama has put forward is the real feelings of a lot of folks out there. there are voters across the country, some of them young voters, some of them not so young voters, who do wonder who do feel as the government hasn't worked for them. and i think that we have to take those concerns seriously as a country, and campaigns

have to respond to that. similar to the black voters that feel as though i don't really know what this administration has done for me, the answer is to not just tell them, but you have to get out into the communities and show them. but also engage in a dialogue. we have to be willing to hear from folks, and apply what they are hearing. and, so i don't think it is wrong for folks, voters across the spectrum to have these concerns. but what i do think needs to happen, if people do want folks to go out and vote, is you have to go out and get the -- where they are in their communities. and there's a lot to -- say and young people are just on college campuses. the oldest millennials are 40, 41 years old. where they are, they have families, they are some of these suburban moms. how are we reaching and connecting and talking to them, and encouraging them, and letting them know that their participation does in fact have the power to change? thanks >> yeah, good point. adrian look, michelle obama doesn't usually engage in --

donald trump right, but she also didn't explicitly mention president biden. what do you make of that? was it a missed opportunity for her and for the white house? >> no, i don't think was a missed opportunity. i think it was a conversation that she had as part of a broader interview. and look, simone is exactly right. the campaign, and i am sure that they are talking to michelle obama's team, we will certainly be working with her to activate her on the campaign trail. she is one of the absolute top surrogates, and she's actually the top surrogate with a certain type of voter. she is seen as somebody who is relatively nonpartisan, who is kind of above the fold when it comes to politics. and i think that is one of the reasons why she is expressing her nervousness. she will activate, there is no question, there is so much at stake. she is obviously very close with president biden, with the first lady. and then obviously with the vice president as well. so i have no question, and no doubt that she will. and i think we will be hearing a lot more from her in the months ahead. >> and to both of you, too i might add, -- you will be on the show for

sure. and here is the deal with simone. you can all watch simone, along with michael ee and alicia menendez on thr w, show the weekend. it ery saturday and sunday beginning at 8 am eastern here on msnbc. i watch this, morning it was so good. my think >> -- thank you >> so if donald trump wins in november, how maga will his second administration be. a former administration official is going to weigh in on that. and then later, steve kornacki on to iowa, 2016 compared to now. red to now. clinically proven dandruff protection with just 9 essential ingredients no sulfates, no silicones, no dyes. dandruff protection, minimal ingredients. job done. my husband and i have never been more active. shingles doesn't care. i go to spin classes with my coworkers. good for you, shingles doesn't care. because no matter how healthy you feel, your risk of shingles sharply increases after age 50.

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who was not impeached, could he be subject to promote criminal prosecution? >> if he were impeached and convicted first. >> he didn't kill anyone, he didn't cause an insurrection, he didn't get charged for it, but they are using hypotheticals tooth fright frighten america. >> the problem is with trump, this isn't super outside of the realm of possibility that we would be in a scenario like that. he, in a meeting that i was in -- with a dozen other staffers, said that an aid shou b executed for leaking something negative about him. >> so that was the second time e fact that alyssa farah griffin made that claim on the view, when she said at the first time, a spokespers for trump denied to news outlets that trump wanted the staffer executed. but right now joining me is olivia -- former homeland security and counterterrorism adviser to former vice president mike pence. and a really good friend to us. so olivia, look, crazy question, but considering the source. because donald trump at least get credit for not killing anyone? i mean, he is the one who said he could stand in the middle of fifth avenue and shoot someone, and not lose a single vote.

>> well i mean, this is certainly something that -- in many in his inner circle. and we are seeing that surface now, as we see some of these tapes that are coming, out especially with roger stone. but i think he can get credit for now, but what will it be like in the future if he is granted immunity? this is a man who claims that he has presidential immunity. by the, way during the second impeachment, it was actually trump himself who said that there is an investigative process that could play out in the courts, and that no one should be, no one is above the law, and no one should be immune from that process. which is interesting because now he has flipped that america -- so i think that is why the question of immunity could be of interest, because of the president -- . and i also think about the message that we are sending to the world, internationally as they watch this. we are saying that the office of the president is not going to be held accountable, and it is above the law. that is a message that is similar to a banana republic, not of the united states of america. >> i mean, we have seen other

presidents, former presidents from countries, if they have some level of malfeasance or corruption or whatever in a trial, they are found guilty, they are put in jail. we have seen that, and that's not from banana republics. other countries as well. certain countries. so let's take a listen to what trump said on tuesday about his prosecutions, and why he should a presidential immunity. >> are they feel this is the way they're doing to try and win, and that's not the way -- it will be bedlam in the country. it is a very bad thing, it is a very bad precedent, as we said, it is the opening of a pandora's box. >> how do you interpret that, olivia? >> well i think that's trump using -- these court proceedings for his own political advantage. he is kind of turning them into a trump rallies, i would say, because that is how he is reaching audiences. and he is saying it is political motivation, again, it goes on to this witch hunt narrative. but the reality is, this is the -- and it is catching up with him. and that is the truth about this. the issue is that there are a lot of right-wing networks that are not going to accept that

narrative, and they are not going to tell the truth about it, and they continue to enable trump to push this talking point that is dangerous for our democracy in our country. >> well in, fact another trump staffer -- ty cobb gave this pretty terse assessment. watch this. >> i think you have to take trump seriously, because he poses the greatest threat to democracy that we've ever seen. >> there, go straight to the point, and echoing your sentiments as well. we've been hearing it so often these these days, how can you break down the actual ways that democracy will be threatened by a second trump presidency? what is concerning you most, olivia? >> honestly, just think about who he will place in his cabinet. and the one thing that trump has learned from his first term is that he will place people there -- he doesn't need senate confirmed people, you just keep rotating them in their roles. which is extremely dangerous. you're going to see boulet kash patel, mike flynn, rick -- you will see steve bannon out there. i mean, who knows what you will get that will be at the heads

of our -- defense community, and across the government. that is incredibly dangerous, and i also worry for the federal workforce. there is that project 2025 plan that is being -- but when there is a federal worker that hasn't -- the traditional process for a whistleblower is to go to the inspector general. i will tell you this, i saw them do this. they were specifically looking at those -- placing them with loyalists. so i think that across the federal government, there is a fear they will feel, where they have nowhere to turn to. that is authoritarianism. >> yeah, that is extraordinary. if it's my recollection properly, what you are mentioning their relative to the heritage foundation, i think they are trying to flood the federal employees, almost ten fold with the number of trump loyalists them would be typical for any incoming administration. i mean, it is pretty frightening to think about. but donald trump did this one 80 this week on his previous promise to voters, when he said he would be their retribution. listen to this.

>> i'm not going to have time for retribution, we're going to make this country so successful again, i'm not going to have time for retribution. [applause] and remember this. our ultimate retribution's success. >> few, no time for retribution. i'm curious, what suddenly dawned on him? what do you think prompted this about-face? >> well i think he was advised by his campaign advisers that he really needed to focus on putting forward a policy, because of the retribution narrative was not playing out in his favor. but i will say this, even though he is saying that, he is still talking about retribution, because it is front and center. this is someone who is vindictive, who is a narcissist, we know this. and we know that he will exact revenge. and we know it because often his surrogates, people like steve bannon and kash patel, who we just talked about, have acted been out there saying that they were going to use the cia against the media and journalists. these are things that they have said recently, so we know that that is the game plan, regardless of what donald trump

is now trying to walk back. but he also, during that town hall that he did, he also said well, it wouldn't be bad if i did though? some would say that it wouldn't be bad. so he kind of tease it out, but then he says oh we are going to -- being successful. and that is really the focus, but we know that is not true, that is not who he is. >> a sage voice, because of your exposure to all of this. thank you my friend, olivia troye. coming up next, steve kornacki on what a difference eight years makes in iowa. here is a bit of what voters told us back in 2016. >> what do you think about donald trump? >> you know, he's a celebrity. i watch his show, but i don't know, i'm afraid of what he might do once he's in office. he's flip-flop on a lot of his views, and i just don't know if i can quite trust him. so, i'm going to go with crews. >> [inaudible] [inaudible [inaudible with two times more menthol per drop, and powerful vicks vapors to vaporize sore throat pain.

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in iowa. candidates, battling each other in the bitter cold to win over republican support in the critical caucuses, now just two days away. it will all come down to turn out, and that is very much a question right now, as a life-threatening bristling or bears down on iowa. the candidates have all had to cancel events, and shift their schedules, injecting a new level of uncertainty into the race in its final hours. nbc -- 's is covering the republican front runner donald trump for us. welcome, you have moved from the car to endorse, so how concerned, ivan, is team trump

about the turnout on monday? >> well i hope you are impressed by the outfit change here alex. [laughter] we made our way underneath five layers of clothing outside of the trump campaign headquarters, where we were invited in to go and talk to some volunteers and folks, as they tried to turn out the vote. this is an operation that has been going for the last, year alex, where they have identified the about 300,000 voters that they have contact for, folks who have supported donald trump here in the past. and now they are working to make sure that they actually get out -- . i want to let you hear part of the conversation that i had with kari lake here. because the weather is undeniable, here we are talking about negative 35-degree wind chills come monday night. and for each of these campaigns, you said, they can only afford to lose so many of their committed supporters. take a listen to my question to kari lake. >> what will the results on

caucus night here in iowa, and in new hampshire, tell us about the state of the republican party? >> well i believe, and i think you probably have seen the polling here that president trump is going to win. he is going to win big. you know, anything over 12% is going to be historic, and i think the biggest victory, if i am right, you might want to check this number, if i am right i think it's the 12% victory in a crowded race. so anything over 12% is great, i think he's going to do much better than that. >> it was in fact a 12 point victory by bob dole back in 1988. and right now, polling indicates that donald trump is interrupting 25 to 30 percentage points. our new nbc news des moines poll coming out at nine pm eastern tonight will give us a better idea here but. i was talking to a senior adviser to donald trump over at the campaign headquarters. what is the campaign doing to try to help through the cold weather here? and he told me that they are offering rides to folks that need at, and we are talking about a situation where folks are going to have to actively

leave their front doors, get into a very cold vehicle, just long off to turn up some heat, get there, go through a parking lot, walk over that black ice. the caucus begins at seven pm, well after sundown, so these would be really difficult conditions. but when you are looking at polling data, donald trump supporters consistently say that they are the most enthusiastic and firmly behind him of any other candidate, and that is exactly what the trump operation, the data that they are looking at, and anecdotally conversations that i've had with folks who have watched and stand out in lines in very cold temperatures before, that is exactly what they need to ultimately happen come monday night, alex. >> oh my gosh, i'm quoted just thinking about it. anyway, thank you. and yes, you look very sharp, like nook of the -- but thanks my friend. coming up next, steve kornacki, on a key voting bloc in iowa. oc in iowa (dad) it's our phone bill! we pay for things that we don't need! bloated bundles, the reckless spending! no more... (mom) that's a bit dramatic... a better plan is verizon. it starts at 25 dollars a line. (dad) did you say 25 dollars a line?

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new york post, this week, desantis gained 50 new endorsements fromstors and faith leaders across the state. but axios reports donald trump em to be more popular overall among iowa's evangelicals. nbc's steve kornacki -- with a close look at what could be a close right race in the hawkeye state. steve? >> you know, northwest iowa really, this is an area where evangelicals play a big role in iowa caucuses in general. back in 2016, 64% of the iowa republican electorate was evangelical christian. but it's especially true in northwest iowa, and it's not just folks who are affiliated as evangelical christians, it's folks who go to church regularly. church is a major part of your, lives and i think it is no true anywhere else but sue county. and we saw in 2016 how skeptical evangelicals or of donald trump. many were at the beginning, but the story of the last eight years has been this political bond trump seems to have

generated with them. there's a story about donald trump, has he improved his standings with evangelicals? how much as he improved standings with evangelicals? is he winning this county, is he winning at big? there's also a story about ron desantis. ron desantis is going to make a stand on monday night, he is really courted evangelicals aggressively, got endorsement from the top evangelical leaders in the state. now from nikki haley's standpoints, if you zoom out all the counties, here nikki haley found her strongest support for political independents, college educated voters, higher income voters, voters in the suburbs, voters with a more negative view of donald trump. broadly speaking, the coalition that haley has been putting together in iowa and elsewhere resembles the coalition that marco rubio had in iowa back in 2016. so haley, if she is going to have a surprise showing, here a really strong showing in iowa here, it's not just winning or doing well in those rubio counties. showing inroads in the rural -- with low concentrations of college degrees, where rubio didn't register at all, and where the types of voters -- there are not many number so

far. >> okay steve, thanks for that. steve is going to be back tonight at nine eastern, with exclusive new poll results from nbc news, as well as the des moines register. and msnbc -- 's katie will be joining with live coverage. coming up next, the results of a new election, and why they are making china very unhappy. china very unhappy. i know what it's like to perform through pain. if you're like me, one of the millions suffering from pain caused by migraine, nurtec odt may help. it's the only medication that can treat a migraine when it strikes and prevent migraine attacks.

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victory for william lai. he got about 40% of the vote going into the vote today. he was seen as being neck and neck with -- who is the candidate from the main opposition party -- . but a few hours into counting the ballots, which by the way is done by hand here, and in full public view, -- conceded defeat, apologize to his supporters, realizing that the numbers were just not going his way. and his victory speech, -- took to the stage and thanked people for helping write this chapter in taiwan's history. and also said this election shows the world that between between, quote democracy and authoritarianism, we chose to stand on the site of democracy. and the u.s. state department has sent its congratulations. here is a bit more of what his supporters had to say about the win supporters had to say about th i feel so excited!

i'm about to cry! i want to cry, because i feel that, feel so good. the best choice! >> lai's victory means democracy in taiwan winds! >> -- i think. >>? >> no. i think china is all of the neighborhood, in my opinion, is my friend. >> your friend. >> -- maybe enemy, maybe friends. so, we can cooperate. >> lai's victory is not going well, though, in beijing, where he's regarded as a separatist and a troublemaker, because of past remarks he has made on taiwan independence. be taiwan affairs office in