sophisticated in my mind. if they had gotten that, they would've believed it was the president calling. that has an impact on voters. i think it's been corrected in time incense that i've received two text messages from the write in biden folks saying, don't pay attention to that. it's not true. i've got to praise governor sununu for being on top of it. he actually did say that he believes that whoever did to this should be prosecuted to the full extent. it's good to see that we are united behind it and we look forward to finding out who it is and we hope they do it because we don't want this to go anywhere else. let this stop here, now, and not continue across the country. >> people think these things are funny or goofy or silly. they are not. they are deadly serious. more partly, they are dangerous. greg, jennifer, thank you so much. we will have to leave it there. but the clock. our

special coverage on the new hampshire primary is starting right now. -- just, no forceable cast ballots in the first-in-the-nation primary. you know that new hampshire is just the second contests of the 2024 election cycle, it can very well be the end of the republican race. yes, the primary base could be wrapped up tomorrow night before january even comes to a close. of course, it's naturally over. until it's over. as of last night, the florida governor ron desantis dropping, out this is now finally the one-on-one race that nikki haley has wanted, the one she's been asking for. right now, on the eve of this new hampshire primary, she's the only one is still standing between donald trump and the republican nomination. she is also currently 19 points behind him in the latest new hampshire tracking poll, just out this morning.

what does nikki haley have to justify sticking in the race after tomorrow? that seems to be the million dollar question. 4 million dollar question. can she do well enough to more to make it an actual race for a little bit? maybe. surprising things do happen here. i mean, john mccain won a stunning upset victory against george w. bush in 2000 and hillary clinton defied the polls in 2008, and bested barack obama in the state, i remember that one quite well, i was with the obama campaign and i can tell you that definitely did not see that one coming. and nikki haley does seem to have some good things going on for her here in new hampshire, at least on paper. she is the endorsement of the states popular governor, chris sununu, joining me on the set later this hour. she has the endorsement of the top conservative newspaper in new hampshire, the union leader, who is leading among independents, a huge voting bloc in the state which is kind of the big leg up that in normal years, normally, would put any candidate on the path to victory. and she is out on the trail. doing the work that again, any normal candidate would do a day before a primary election. today she is at a

local new hampshire workshop, she spoke directly to voters, she literally held a baby. all very normal election new stuff. the problem with that is that this is not the normal year. in this republican party, it's not the republican party of 20 or even ten years ago. she may have been born in the wrong decade, this year with this republican party, the four times indicted former president, also recently found liable for sexual abuse is still leading haley in the state by a wide margin, and he's not just leading among the hard-core conservatives, the maga voters, you might expect that, he's even leading here with voters you might not expect. including those under the age of 50 by more than 20 points. so, the youth thing is it working among them i guess, so did nikki haley do well here tomorrow? it is possible. but we could also very well be about 24 hours away from the start of what is essentially a donald trump coordination. coronation for

the guy i think playing out again, was playing to spend the day today not visiting new hampshire restaurants, not doing babies, that may have been, better but sitting in a new york city courtroom and even when the hearing was delayed for covid concerns, because of the parents of alina habba, which even for the snl writers out there is also too on the nose. trump still spent the day attacking e. jean carroll on social media. and taking credit for being there on time and on schedule. rather to get out the vote strategy he has out there. but that's how republican primaries front runner spent the day in the primary. and that is the majority of what the electorate is wrapping their arms around. join me now, here in new hampshire, stuck from the -- national affairs analyst for nbc news, john hamilton, and nbc news correspondent ali

vitali, who has been closely following the haley campaign. aly i want to start with you, because you interviewed governor haley today. she had some interesting things to say. let's talk about. we will talk about it. >> in your speech you say that chaos follows trump fairly, or unfairly. what is the example of fair chaos that has followed the president? >> look at his twitter at any point in time. look at the fact that he feeds off of chaos. he creates it by going on temper tantrums, or creating rants, or saying things that he should not say that we don't want dictators to hear. he creates that chaos. >> it is an unsatisfying attack line just. putting my cards on the table here. but what else did she have to say during the interview? >> the other half of that. because in the stump speech he said after that he's chaotic friendly or unfriendly. that's a fair stuff. the unfriendly stuff are the politically minded cases that he is defending in court. some of them anyway. she points out that manhattan for example. but that is a pretty unsatisfying answer too. the thing that we are seeing consistently with nikki haley is a lot of these key issues, especially those that relate to trump, she really does find a way to be on both sides of it. the january

6th, the cases, the chaos, even the things that she brings up she brings up with either, i'm sorry on the mental fitness front. or she's doing it out of the both sides of her mouth. >> senator martin you've written about nikki haley, you said recently wrote about her, she obviously is a big surprise if she were to win here tomorrow. safe to say. quite a surprise but with 24 hours out from polls closing. what would she have to do two things to stay in the race? >> the fact that it is a two-person race gives her some runway. if she, the math will work out that she will get more votes tomorrow than she would have normally gotten. probably at the four in the 30 somewhere. maybe in the 40s if she does really well. i think that will at least give her a take it out of here. i will say that in the tradition of surprise candidates in new hampshire, she's not the normal profile of someone who is very cautious. usually new hampshire likes a network-y, insurgent, mccain type. >> a come from

behind. yeah. >> and new hampshire voters live free and die, construction is they don't like to be told. they don't like to be predicted about. they don't like to be told what they want to do. they love being counter intuitive. part of its self image that we hear so much of in new hampshire. that may work in her favor. but ultimately we know, it's not. >> you know we feel something. you know when something's gonna happen, you feel it in the, air there's buzz, the events are bigger, we've all been spending time at events over the last couple of days, you don't really feel that here, beyond nikki haley, we will see what happens tomorrow, it's kind of important to start talking about what could happen after that i think it's fair to say? trump could be very close to walking in the nomination if all these legal troubles. he is running this closing message of basically being a dictator. you've covered him for a long time, why does that work? and why is it still working here with, in a state where it should not work by all logic?

>> first i want to answer the question you asked mark, just briefly. there's two people in the race. she has a ticket as long as she--she's got credits on the airline. she can go as long as she has donors who will pay for her to go. >> there's two seats in those two candidates? >> there is no other tickets there. she has a guy in new hampshire who wants her to win. and i think it goes back to our friend that also makes this in the situation. when somewhere, when the state, you could also beat donald trump. >> second is also last here? >> yes, the question is you have south carolina. for her it's the calculus. you can argue, it's not for us to say is right or wrong, but for her it's gonna be can i win in south carolina or not? whatever --

i think that the calculus for her. it's going to be, could i get enough? whatever that, is donors, supporters, things in south carolina to make sense, to proceed for another month. >> which is what it would basically be it. because it's a 24. one of the things that has been, over the last couple of days we have seen these big endorsements pile up. it's created this air of inevitability, which trump obviously wants. what strikes me, and i know we're not dealing with a normal year, is that since 2016 or 2020, a lot has happened. january 6th happened, he's basically said he wants to go out after his political enemies using the justice department. i mean,, mark, why do all these people lineup? why is the inevitability of this moving forward like this? >> i think a part of it is exhausted. the republican party seems to have lost the will to fight with itself. and itself by definition is donald trump at this point. defiance takes a lot of energy and over several

years, you kind of lose the world. and look, the endorsements feel inevitable. and again, i think that works in haley's favor, because new hampshire hates inevitability, they pride themselves on fighting against inevitability that could work for her. but ultimately i think it is part of the same passive equation that we have seen of this party for a long time. >> one of the things, i, mean i went to a haley event the other day, we have all gone to seen her, she's a good speaker, good debater, lots of issues but the depth of the message sometimes i think it's safe to say. but when you talk to voters, what is their issue with her? she is conservative on quite a few issues. >> they don't have an issue, the ones at her rallies, don't have an issue with her, they have an issue with the fact that they i think no in the heart of hearts that she is not getting out of this primary. i think that is the problem. i even talk to a voter today who is basically the exact profile of what we would look for, the day after desantis dropped out, to go to a nikki haley event. and two-time trump voter, was gonna vote for desantis, decided that he was wavering and desantis made the decision for him. he's voting for hailie. and i said all right, what happens if it makes in 2024, biden versus trump. and they said i would

vote for trump. and i said what was the breaking point for him for 2020? he said january 26th, he did not do what a president should've done. that wasn't his fault, but i think it did not feel right. and he still going to vote for him. that's a tribalism in american politics we talk about it. general elections, if you have an r next to your name, or d next year and, and that's where they associate. but that's what i hear and nikki haley rallies. voters want to try, but they know that they're probably not going to succeed. there for her part she told me today, she will not say that she is going to win south carolina. she said i want to keep doing better, and better is not a win. >> that safer at this point. i will say one more thing, because it's exactly how they covered the state. she is, she could have been in this insurgent candidate. >> what did you want to do? >> i would've told you what you would have to do. she would not have canceled on the debate that she did last, week what new hampshire likes is new hampshire likes to be the story, like what you said to me, the best broad message in the new

hampshire primary is, here is your chance to screw iowa. >> they don't know what they're talking about. prove them wrong. >> they want to be made the story. and so, to come here and say i am not going to debate in this, the statewide television is wmur. >> it's cycle after cycle, the idea of anybody saying, well after the circumstance, i'm not gonna go in the debate with desantis, new hampshire voters are debating. that is a snub. they want to see her working every day. she is not taking questions from voters on the town hall, this is not the mccain model. i will go anywhere, and take questions from anyone, i will debate anyone. i will call for more, debates she is not giving new hampshire wet new hampshire demands in a state or a time when they want, they may not want to be for her, but trump has not really gone up or down

here. he's gone at 55. he's been stuck there pretty much throughout there for months. >> he hasn't given them a choice. >> she hasn't allowed them to want her. >> one of the things that i think, which is frankly wishful thinking, is if we can just get rid of trump it will be over. if we just get rid of trump. it's like cutting off the head of the snake or whatever the analogy is. it will be over. i do not buy that. i mean, matt gaetz was here. he's the heir apparent. there is a lot of people campaigning for that. but what do you think about that? >> i get, that i agree with that to a point. i also think though that trump is a singular thing. without the center of gravity that he represents and has provided for so long, the republican party would be completely loss and they would collapse in on itself in a way that it might not survive. so i think to some degree they're hanging on with him, and he's obviously not a young man. he's not gonna be here forever. but i do think that his singularity should not be underestimated. >> he's not gonna be here

forever. thank god. >> i'm not sure. but i hope it's true. >> why do you guys think it wasn't a true political idea for her? to try to level the playing field with trump, debate wise. i think that was a strategy that made sense to me. >> that by not lowering herself to defenses. >> it is, but no one blames him for it. she needs to be seen. and he's much better known then she is. once she gets on tv she does pretty well for herself. >> it's a clever thing to say. i will not debate again until it's donald trump or joe biden. but in the end, you are the underdog here. if she had a lead, and she was trying to preserve the lead, it would've been i think a clever move, but when you're trying to still reach a bunch of voters who have to get a bunch of people here who might vote for you under some circumstances, but are not yet convinced, reaches many people there as possible and i guarantee you if you ask him in the abstract, is it better for her to try to reach, have as much exposure as possible in these eight days? between iowa and new hampshire, he said yes. as many as

possible. came media, free media, debates, everything. >> a good tease from john to wrap us up here. and governor sununu if you're watching, be prepared for that question. john, mark, ali vitale. thank you all for kicking us off this evening. and coming up! one conversation with one voter that tells us so much about how toxic that donald trump could be for republicans in the manchin. and some swath of the electorate. plus a searing new ad from the biden campaign features a doctor in texas who was forced to leave the state to end a life-threatening pregnancy. the doctor who is brave enough to shed a light on this issue, will join me in just a few minutes. and, later republicans governor chris sununu, we just previewed already, will join us on set in manchester to talk about the path forward for the preferred candidate, nikki haley. we're just getting started this hour. and we will be right back after a very quick break! your risk of shingles sharply increases after age 50.

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new hampshire on tuesday. the conversation could quickly shift to the general election. and the state is a pretty good case study in just how toxic trump could be in november. recent polling shows that in a head to head matchup here in new hampshire, president biden would defeat trump by a comfortable margin of seven percentage points. obviously there's a long way to go. but if biden were to face haley in the general haley would actually win by three points. so hypothetically, if haley's name is on the ballot this november. president biden would be spending a fair amount of time and money to win. if trump is the nominee, new hampshire seems to be a harder hill to climb. at least at this point in time. sometimes a political dynamic like that can be crystallized in one conversation with one voters. that's what happened to me when i was talking to a voter named gary, here in new hampshire over the weekend. take a look. >> so you are here waiting for a nikki haley event. are you excited to get the support on tuesday? >> i think i am a nikki supporter. i certainly do

not want trump back in the white house. i think he is a disaster. i think he creates chaos and a lot of negativity and he is a threat to our democracy. and i think nikki has the right. she is a unifier and i think she will bring rationality back to the white house. >> do you know that nikki could very well when new hampshire on tuesday? with a vote like yours and others. in the primary are you open to supporting trump in the general election? >> i will not. i will not support him in any way shape or form. >> are you open to supporting joe biden? >> i am. i voted for him in the last election. i haven't been pleased with some of his policies. >> what have you been most displays with? >> just the spending. and his treatment of the border. i think we have got real problems that he is failing to recognize and do

something with. but he's a much better choice than trump. >> a nikki haley supporter who voted for biden in 2020 but has been supported by some of his actions including spending at the border. but he would vote for biden again in the general election because in his words he is a much better choice than trump. i think it's fair to say that all of the gary's out there, i hope there is many carries, could be a challenge for trump in november. at least they should be prime targets for the biden campaign. joining me now is in manchester,'s democratic chris pappas of new hampshire. thank you for coming by this evening. i have had the pleasure of spending the last couple of days here and talking to voters. you represent a good number of voters. what gary had to say there, the demographics are unique as we've been talking about this evening. the number of independents. >> i

think gary embodies the democratic sphere that you find here in new hampshire. voters can be unpredictable. they tend to split their tickets. that's why you get the republican governor and legislature, democratic federal legislation and democratic president through the last few election. so i think this does present an opportunity for the biden campaign moving forward and for democrats. we have got the red wave here in new hampshire in 2022, picked up seats in the legislature. maggie hansen was reelected. we both maintain congressional seats in targeted races. we did that by reaching people like gary, folks who are in the middle. that can vote for republicans but reject the sort of extremism that we have seen from the maga republican party and who wants solutions. i think at the core that is what this presidential election is going to be about. who is in that voters corner? who is working to meet the moment and solve problems, work together, encourage the spirit of bipartisanship in washington. joe biden has done that, donald trump would not do that. he has destroyed any prospects that we would have to get things done. >> who is in your corner is a

good way of defining it. and because as you know from being elected people do not vote on day, that they vote on how you make them feel. before we get to the general election, we have to at least get through the primary tomorrow and of course the president is not on the ballot because of the dnc rules and the decision to move south carolina first. there is a write in campaign, how is that going and what does success look like for you? >> this is a really bottom up grassroots effort in new hampshire, the dnc handed us a bushel of lens with respect to the primary calendar and a bunch of activists in new hampshire deciding to make some lemonade in terms of this primary. we want to be heard, new hampshire is voting tomorrow, and folks are upset with what the dnc tried to do but you know what's? we are more upset with the overturning of roe v. wade, we are more anxious about the threats to our democracy, more concerned about the extremism that we are seeing with donald trump and how that is going to disrupt our ability to get things done in the government. so i think that's motivating folks to turn

out tomorrow and we know that this general election is already coming into focus in new hampshire i think we'll continue to be a state where that is contested in the presidential race and at all levels, and so we want to see a big turnout tomorrow and i do think that this grassroots effort for president biden will succeed. >> it sounds like you are ready to get to the general election, i think the biden campaign probably shares that. and here's the new digital ad for trump with some help from haley. >> he's going on and on mentioning me multiple times as to why i did not handle the january 6th better. >> nikki haley is in charge of security. we offered her 10,000 people. they don't want to talk about that. >> i was not in office then. they're saying that he got confused! >> it's all just happened this weekend of course, there could be more fodder to use. do you think it's a smart strategy to use the republican candidates running against trump against trump? >> i think

so. because again i think that there are voters like gary who are out there who may pull a ballot for nikki haley birds are free agents when it comes to the general election and do not want to see donald trump reelected, so again this is about building a coalition and democrats have shown further do that successfully here in new hampshire, and i think that we are really eager for the moment where we do get this clear contrast, the general election campaign that is coming up because it is a fight that we have to wage and win and we have to be very focused over the next few months about what is at stake. a woman's right to choose, our democratic institutions and again how we deliver results, more class, get things done enough bipartisan basis. >> congressman chris pappas, thanks so much for coming by and chatting meet with me this evening. i really enjoyed it. coming up! she is a mother and an ob/gyn, right now, doctor is the new face of the biden campaign. focus on abortion laws in states like texas. and she's gonna be on in just a few minutes. and later, what does nikki haley have to do here on tuesday to keep the campaign going? i'll ask governor chris sununu when he

stops by! we're back live from manchester after a very quick break!

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duckduckgo comes with a built-n engine like google, but it's pi and doesn't spy on your searchs and duckduckgo lets you browse like chrome, but it blocks cooi and creepy ads that follow youa from google and other companie. and there's no catch. it's fre. we make money from ads, but they don't follow you aroud join the millions of people taking back their privacy by downloading duckduckgo on all your devices today. >> today marks 51 years since the supreme court decided roe v. wade which protected the right of women in the united states to have an abortion. just 19 months ago the new conservative super majority on the supreme court, including sorry judges appointed by donald trump struck down that

right. a right that they held for nearly half a century and opened a door to an america where millions of women no longer have the freedom to make their own decisions and doctors can provide jail time. desperate mothers are forced to suffer things except, this leading another life-threatening symptoms before they can get the care they need. i should come as no surprise, and american people by large don't like it. according to a poll the wall street journal this last fall a majority of voters believe that they should be able to get an in cases where the health of the mother is under threat. we voters will turn out to protect reproductive rights, of course they do. the biden administration is betting that this will still be the case and

they'll be holding their own ballot initiatives to protect these fundamental rights. what this is including voters who may not seem excited about voting right now. they kicked -- >> will be a nationwide to her to dry attention to the impacts of abortion restrictions. she highlighted up number of heartbreaking cases of women being denied care, women being forced to carry fetuses who won't live outside of the room. and she used those stories to make very important point. >> i think it's very important to understand the courage it takes to share those kinds of stories. and the reality of what is happening in realtime. across our country. every story that we hear there are so many that we do not hear about. >>

it's so important to remember that there are so many that we don't hear about. for all the women that we know have told their stories there's so many more that have suffered in silence. once it makes this ad so incredibly powerful. >> i'm an ob/gyn in texas. i'm a mother of three wonderful children. having this beautiful, messy, chaotic family is the joy of my life. i never thought that i would need an abortion for a planned pregnancy but i did. two months ago became pregnant with a baby that i desperately wanted. i had a routine ultrasound. i learned that the fetus would have a fatal condition and that there was no chance of survival. in texas, you are forced to carry that pregnancy. that's because of donald trump overturning roe v. wade. the choice was completely taken away. i had to

continue my pregnancy, putting my life at risk. it is every woman's worst nightmare and it was absolutely unbearable. we need leaders that will protect our rights and not take them away. that is joe biden and kamala harris. >> joining me now is the woman who shared her story in that i have from the biden campaign. dr. denard, first of all this is probably not re-pictured yourself. you are mother three year ob/gyn what made you want to tell your story? >> well, exactly i never really thought i was going to be on television, let alone in the political ad to be honest. i really just a mom working in texas trying to raise my children and be the best ob/gyn that i can be. here we are. >> here we are. i think the mom doing best she can in texas is exactly the kind of stories that people need to hear to understand what is at

stake. so, tell me what the reaction has been from your community and people in the public. have you heard from a lot of people so far? >> i have, a year ago if this opportunity had been placed in my lap, i think that would've been too scared to say yes to it. when they say that time heals all wounds. i don't know if my wounds will ever heal for my pregnancy losses. i don't think anybody really truly gets over the type of pain that is caused from pregnancy loss. but i have been very inspired to make my voice a little bit louder from women who have been doing this before me, one of whom was a patient of mine. they really inspired me to start talking about it. what has happened with these laws is they've cause so much fear, so much anxiety that they've silenced

people and i felt very silenced for a long time. it's more traumatic than having to go out of state for an abortion. your story is so unique because of your personal experience but also because you are a doctor yourself. you deal with this carry yourself on a daily basis. tell us a little bit about since the texas abortion ban went, what is the impact with how you communicate with your patients in high talk about options? >> well, the fear that has been infected with these laws has really silenced and paralyzed both physicians and patients. it's terrifying to talk to patients about access to care, saying the word abortion gives you chills, it makes you think he could be thrown in jail that

you could have your license revoked. it's really impacting the ability to openly communicate and have honest conversations between doctors and patients. let's be honest, the most intimate conversations should be happening between an ob/gyn and their patient. now that privacy has been taken away. >> and you know, it is so interesting and helpful to hear this. as painful as it is, i think a lot of people out there who are in states where abortion is still legal, don't fully understand what the impact would be. and you've experienced that, i'm so sorry for your loss too. you know it in so many ways, but should people who are watching right now and sitting in states where abortion is legal understand about what this would look like if those rights were taken away in those states? >> well, this is something that i spoke about at a senate briefing just last week with doctor floyd and jessica valenti. i've said it

before and i will say it again, this is not a drill. it's really happening the cruelty in my state towards women, the lack of mercy for us in a reproductive health care. people are suffering. i'm seeing it every day. and doctor floyd, who works in a state where there is access to care. she is seeing it every day because patients that are in texas have to travel now. it's really overloading those states that do have access. and if we aren't vigilant about what is going on, i'm afraid that we will lose access everywhere. >> what you did was so incredibly brave and it's not easy to tell your story about telling your personal story and your story of loss is so difficult is also so powerful so thank you for doing that. but what would you say to women out there who have experienced similar losses and are contemplating on whether they should tell their story.

>> well we're all suffering it's terrifying in my personal experience has been that as i've been more open in discussing my abortion and what my family and i had to go through to receive the care that we needed. the more outpouring of love i have received and the more i've been able to connect with other women who have had a similar diagnosis as me but i also think any parent or anyone on this planet our hope is to make the world a better place and leave it better than it was when we were here and that's what i want to do i want my daughter and my son to be living in a world where they can get good access to care and unfortunately that's just not the state of texas. >> thank

you again for sharing your story it's incredibly powerful and courageous. i know a bit of what it's like to be changing diapers while working busy lives. so, thank you for doing this while you're also doing that at the same time. thank you for your time tonight. >> thank you so much, it's been an honor to be here. >> and coming up, new hampshire governor chris sununu is standing by here in manchester in the studio to talk about what comes next for nikki haley. i will ask him about his plan to support the republican nominee president. no matter who it is. that is next after a quick break.

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gosh republican primary two person race, donald trump pulling early 20 points ahead of her. she's facing tough questions, not just about her future but what she could've done differently. >> did you go on offense to late in new hampshire? >> now, of course not. we had more people in the race. one my job was to not go over trump from the very beginning. you have to go one of the time. >> maybe a marathon, maybe a sprint. it says a lot that fox news is wondering which didn't go after donald trump especially in new

hampshire. -- she still hoping that that strategy surprises people. there's a history that here. when the state's governor has been by her side constantly since endorsing her last month. the last check as the 63% approval rating in his state. even correct me if it's higher than. that i don't know. governor chris sununu joins me now. let's start with the politics of this. even more than 50 events, maybe more than that with nikki haley. and you are quite popular, as i mentioned in this state. she is currently running to the tracking poll, 19 points behind donald trump. i know you will tell you that polls don't matter, we will see tomorrow. the question i have for you is, if she performs 19 points behind trump. if she gets second by 19 points, is that enough to stay in the race? >> she's going to her home state so let's understand there's a lot of opportunity. >> before she goes there. she is here in a state that you're very popular if she loses by 19 points was that enough to stay in the race after tomorrow. >> one of course two months ago no one said nikki haley has to win new hampshire. only donald

trump had a mandate. two in new hampshire. >> she has to win somewhere. there's 48 other states and new hampshire is very important. the most important part is you want to clear the field, not everybody out of the race. she got 20% in iowa. she is going to far out pace that hand in hampshire so to go into your home state not with election next week three or four weeks down the road that's momentum building. what she's further behind. >> no one is driven a message yet. >> trump had a bunch of south carolina endorsers here in new hampshire on saturday. >> who. >> tim scott, please? >> a number of people that were elected, just to be clear if she loses by 19 points you should still stay in the race. and you think that you could win in south carolina? >> what i don't care what the results are. -- >> i don't know if it's a coronation if you win by double digits in both the

first states. you recently said that he would support donald trump. you and said that for a while with a couple of interviews where you didn't say that you did recently say that. we did talk about this back in august and you said something that did stick with me so let's play it. >> oh boy. here we go. >> there is a tape for everything. >> you can't win in november. independent state. it there's no way donald trump when anything above 31% of the independents. that's why republicans as a whole get crushed. as bad as he would before being on top of the ticket because we lose the presidency, he hurt school boards, governors, congressional, senate. we will use the seat races in 2022. with him, that brand, that, messaging those candidates in that. he brings the entire party down. >> i understand he's not your choice. nikki haley is your choice. but do you still believe that he would

take people down? governors races? >> there's no question that trump on the ticket hurts our senate races. that is why i love nikki haley so much. she doesn't just win. she wins the swing states. she makes it easier to win everything else. she carries a mandate because the poll numbers are so strong against biden. here in new hampshire, trump leads by seven or eight points minimum against biden. she would win. all the polls show. that there is value in making, not just in terms of the presidency but getting in a mandate. trump didn't get enough done. she would be able to do that. and back then, yes, again it would be a nail-biter between trump and biden. i don't want nail-biter. some tired of losing races as a republican. we should have that big races in 2020, two you should've known. that trump was still the standing one of the party. if you're new hampshire, don't sit at home. do you think trump is a threat to democracy, beat him at the box. don't wait for -- we want to get as high vote as possible tomorrow. if

we do, that she is a real chance. >> do you think he is unfit as nikki haley saying? >> mentally unfit. >> i'm not gonna get into all that. my whole focus is making sure nikki wins the nomination. if she wins here, i still think she can. no one thought it was possible that is all of our focus is right now. >> just understand why would you support him in november if you think you would bring down take it raises. if you think it's distraction? >> biden is gonna help my races and. this is how bad joe biden has been the talk about inflation. it is a tax. alone can families. >> joe biden is leading by seven points in your home state. >> i know, is it is

surprising when a support the nominee? >> i mean do everything i can to make sure that that's possible. >> there are many options, i haven't been an advocate for third party candidates. chris christie, someone who you endorsed has been rumored to be in discussions. >> i didn't endorse chris, but okay. he's a friend. >> we will say that. way he is a friend. he has been rumored to be on their list of people that they would have run. nikki haley, if she doesn't win the nomination which will be an uphill path. all sorts of things happen in new hampshire. >> you have to be careful there are sore loser rules you can be a third party. at this point,, look, if you wanted to do a third party, i'm not advocating. i want -- you kept someone, a republican, again relational difference, someone charismatic. i'm not sure who that would be. >> here's my question. wouldn't you be open? why wouldn't you be open to supporting a third party candidate? if trump is somebody who you are not really

really for the, clearly, and support biden. >> i don't know if america's looking for a third party candidate. i really thought about it. the processes, are people looking? people hate the trump biden ticket. but it is amazing how at the end of the day, a lot of folks -- we are a two party country right now. people will get scared about oh, if i won for a third party i'm not doing service to the party i tend to lean to. they panic and go back into the corner. so, i'm not saying it's not possible or viable. i haven't thought about it too much other than to say, i don't know what that ticket would be. i'm just making sure that the republicans win. i want fiscal discipline in this country. i want the fact that people understand that we have 34 trillion in debt. that is not government debt, that is your debt. that is your kid's debt. that is our debt. we have to pay that back. >> the two trillion higher tax did contribute to that. >> i would say trump's eight trillion dollars was a bigger problem. >> fair, i think we can say he was a big spender. we can agree on that. >> huge, awful. >> let's go back to politics

because i've won here several times. your family has come from salem, we're all looking more to watch tomorrow we have a long history of public office. trump got 40% of the vote in 2017. >> he had 40% and salem. there was a much smaller field now obviously., he could get a bigger percentage. and your hometown. >> or you get a smaller percentage. >> what if he gets larger than? 48% >> that's a microcosm event. what would you say, i think i said that they would run the table and dixville notch claude tomorrow. and where donald trump got a couple of votes last time. >> nikki could run the table. you can look at these microcosms. >> all are going to see how the state is going to, go you watch -- here >> not all of them, i look at, and i -- think -- >> what are you watching tomorrow? i would watch bedford, i would watch two of the specific words in manchester. i

would watch bedford -- hampton, new hampshire. the sea coast towns. up north, i would take a look at wolfeboro and conway. >> which one of those do you think that haley will do well.? >> i think that she could do well in all. then i think she will do really well in manchester, specifically. i think that she would surprise people and bedford. >> let me ask you -- >> look, all of the energies behind haley. did you see the rallies last night, 1200 people they're all going crazy and trump sat there were 300 people and it was one of the most role reversal. trump is getting the endorsements of all these establishment candidates out of d. c.. now nikki's, she is the one bucking the trend. >> we will see if she bucks the trends tomorrow. we will certainly seeing the voters with the voices heard. thank you for stopping by and joining

me. that is up for me this hour. we have so much more for the new hampshire primaries coming up. i will take over four pm eastern tomorrow, right here from new hampshire. but here from the set. rachel maddow and team will pick up things at six pm eastern tomorrow with steve kornacki, of course, at the big board. ross what he? be speaking of racial medal, she's under the weather tonight. we want her to rest up for a big night. everybody needs to hear her guide us through the evening tomorrow. she will join me as a guest in the live hour for manchester, coming up after a quick break. coming up after a quick break.

good evening, from manchester where new hampshire. i'm jen psaki. and i know you are used to seeing rachel maddow at this hour on mondays. believe me, me too. i'm usually watching her