candidate in this cycle. and who says that the, who says the, excuse me, who said that this was a very big win for the climate. it was a big win for the climate movement. >> not just for the movement, but the world. it is a good policy, thank you, hunter walker and hunter -- the truce, wherever you get your books. it's a good one. get your books. that is all in on this thursday night. alex wagner tonight starts right now with alex in south carolina and my friend aman mohyeldin in new york. take it away you first, alex. >> three msnbc hosts for the price of one. this is history right here. thank you, chris. as you say i'm in charleston, south carolina, where i spent some time with the governor of california, gavin newsom getting a sense of the state of play as he sees it in the potentially

general election matchup between biden and trump, and we're going to have some clips of that interview to play for you momentarily, but first i'm going to send it up to you in new york, ayman. it to away, my friend. >> you're going to give us a big preview and the latest on the 2024 presidential race and the sper spective down there in south carolina. we do want to start with the front-runner in new york. the republican primary was once again in a new york courtroom. this afternoon trump took the stand in the damages case brought by writer e. jean carroll. the former president has already been found liable of sexual abuse and defamation by a civil jury. trump today testified for only three minutes, but in those three minutes, believe it or not, the judge had to tell the jury multiple times to disregard trump's out of order testimony. at the same time trump was taking the stand, there was a split screen, a jarring split

screen. president biden was hitting the campaign trail at a campaign event in wisconsin. president biden touted the $5 billion in new infrastructure investments that came as part of his bipartisan infrastructure law. he also got to tout brand new economic numbers that came out today showing the u.s. economy grew at a record pace last year. biden is hoping to make this campaign about his accomplishments, and this is really the split screen moment that he wanted. trump is hoping to make this campaign about retribution and revenge for those seeking to hold him accountable for what he has done to our country. and in so many ways this is also the split screen moment that he wants, too. and despite the long shot campaign of nikki haley, both trump and biden are kicking off their general election campaign. the person who has emerged as joe biden's top campaign surrogate this year is none

other than california governor gavin newsom. last year newsom undertook a national campaign to challenge republican governors across the country and highlight their extreme agendas in video ads and roadside bill boards. that campaign led to a lot of speculation particularly in right-wing media that newsom himself was looking to possibly become the democratic nominee in 2024. gavin newsom turned that speculation on its head. he took all that media attention and used it to promote joe biden's re-election. he went on fox news in prime time. he defended biden's record on issues like immigration and the economy. he debated presidential candidate like ron desantis live on fox, helping to accelerate the disastrous collapse of desantis' capped d.c. and now gavin newsom is in south carolina, the state where president biden is kicking off the presidential primary and where trump hopes to put an end to the republican presidential

primary. as we mentioned at the top of the show, alex sat down with governor newsom. and he told her despite a poll showing a tight race, he's optimistic about democratic chances come november. >> progressives, republicans, independents, whoever might be a little bit stunned you have, what did you say, an incredible feeling of wellness? >> well-being. >> well-being, sorry. >> we're just getting started. tag you're it, democrats. isn't this great? we're now on the campaign trail, nation's first primary february 3rd, elections today, tomorrow, this weekend. early voting. this is what it's about. what we're best at because we keep crushing it. democrats, we keep crushing it. look at all the elections you've won, democrats. you keep winning, outperforming.

it's extraordinary. our values, they're universal values. policies, republicans begrudgingly celebrate and estate. i heard the governor in the state of the state last night and he talked about the new ev investments in his state. really, mr. governor, they tried to post that? they can't even help themselves but they're beneficiaries of all this and that's the character in the democratic party. >> alex, governor newsom also talked about the republican primary race, ron desantis' epic exit and the failed effort to take on trump within his own party. >> can you just talk about ron desantis and just, like, the mic is yours. does he have a political future anymore? >> i think he saves it by dropping out. >> really? >> yeah, i think he did. i think if he continued in his own -- i think this is haley's big concern, it has to be. he was going to get trounced in his own state. last time i checked when he did

that debate about 40%. desantis was down in his own home state against trump. just on a humanizing level having spent a bit of time with him but studying him for some time, he's a different guy now. i'm like who's that guy. he sees wound up. joyless. >> joyless. and say what you want about trump, he seems a little less wound up. he's sort of winding up in terms of his rhetoric, but a little more entertaining in that respect. but you got to know your why. and i never felt he had a why. >> do you think the whole primary thing was an exercise in few tilt? was it always going to be donald trump in. >> with trump in the race you were going to try to somehow deconstruct and connect and attach yourself to trumpism with trump in the race and sort of take it from him and out-trump trump? i mean the premise of it is rather -- i don't mean this as a

cheap shot but rather delusional as just as a political analysis, factual just based on the evidence. maybe you didn't think he was going to run, maybe you thought he'd be convicted earlier for a crime. i don't know what they were thinking, but it's so predictable. all this is predictable. and with respect to nikki haley, i don't know any state she can win, let alone her own state. i appreciate her state of mind she's saying, you know what, all right let's play this for the next few weeks, see if we can close close the gap a little bit, and if we can close the gap, stay in single digits maybe i'll risk losing in south carolina but picking up some delegates around the way. >> see if the raptor comes. >> what would be the political benefit for a former governor to lose a point state?

>> yeah, the humiliation. >> i don't think she should do that. but i see no signs in the last couple days that she has any chance whatsoever. >> all right, joining me now from south carolina is alex wagner, the host of alex wagner tonight. also with us is jen palmieri, former communications director for the obama white house and hillary clinton's 2016 presidential campaign. alex, i'll start with you. i mean it's quite remarkable because i can't think of another politician in america who commands so much authority as a political analyst as governor newsom does, and he says it right there in that sound bite we played. nikki haley has no shot in her home state. am if she wants to win, she needs democrats and independents to show up for her like they did in new hampshire. even bigger numbers. give us a sense how it feels on the ground there. >> first off, let me say i've always wanted to be a guest on this show, so this is a gold star day for me.

but to your question, ayman, you know, in addition to interviewing governor newsom i spent some time with the chair at the get out your vote event because i happened today have a few extra hours. it was interesting. there were a lot of democratic strategist talking about this rapture strategy, right? nikki haley can stay in it if she's the only person with electors where the only person that can stay in it. nobody here is talking about that. nikki haley, the only mention we heard of nikki haley at this democratic event -- and again, nikki haley would need democrats and independents to turn out for her, which something i think everyone understands mathematically. the only mention of her in this state in south carolina was the fact she closed rural hospitals. democratic voters it seems understands that we are in the

general election. and the contrast that is being drawn right now is between trump and biden. and the focus of the sort of remarks that i heard from mr. harrison today were, you know, let's remember 2020, let's remember the sense of hopelessness, the feeling of your soul being crushed by covid, but also just being disenfranchised in the political system and let's remember what joe biden has done in the last four years, three years. let's look at the way your vote has helped change this country in a very short time, and i think that that's not just of course a reminder of the legacy of the biden administration thus far, but a real desire to enfranchise the voters who are going to be key to biden's success in all this and to encourage them to get off the side lines, to make it as much about them as it is about the incumbent president. i thought that was really interesting. but the idea somehow is south carolina voters talking about the sort of chess of a nikki

haley candidacy lasting until the convention, as i saw it here, that wasn't happening. >> yeah, so, jen, the question to you is based on what alex was saying, what we heard from governor newsom there. do you see her staying in this race until super tuesday even if he loses south carolina? does she have any incentive whatsoever to stay in this race beyond -- beyond south carolina? >> i mean, yeah. the governor identified the reason why you would do it, which is stay in until super tuesday with the thought that on super tuesday a lot of these states are winner take all but not all on super tuesday, so that she could accrue some delegates on that day. and then if the rapture comes or something happens, she's perhaps better positioned in the convention because she actually has delegates she earned to try to win over other delegates. it is -- i suspect having been in presidential campaigns most of the ones i worked on, no, not

all of them. barack obama, he won, bill clinton, he won. >> don't sell yourself out like that, jen. >> the point is i know about losing and having to decide when to drop out. and it's very hard to do. coming out of new hampshire you're exhausted. i think her team is probably pretty amped up and motivated and happy now. she put out this t-shirt because trump had a truth social post that said if you give money to her you'll be permanently barred from anything having to do with trump ever again. she put on a t-shirt and last night in south carolina she was hot. i mean she really went after him in a way we have not seen, and i think they might try to say -- and that can feel great in the moment, but then they have to, you know, the next two weeks look and see, okay, where are we really and what makes sense? losing in your home state is

unattractive. it's also unattractive to get out before your home state and get out before super tuesday. if you come out this war and you want try to win some delegates on super tuesday so you're positioned in case something happens and pick a new convention nominee, which i guess was her and ron desantis' strategy all along. her strategy was not -- it doesn't appear to be ever take trump on the real until this moment. >> i think some people are watching her know and showing this fight she has in her against trump and going after trump and wondering why in the world did you not showcase this before, why are you doing it now when you're being knocked out of this race. i want to go back to the governor. you talk about how he engages with right wing media, which is master class, going into the heart of conservative media, fox news, debating ron desantis and i would argue effectively knocking him out of the race for anyone watching that live debate.

but what he did have to say about that and his decision to do that? >> yeah, he is a singular figure in the democratic world not just because he'll go on fox, but he seems to relish the pugilism, if you will. and i sort of asked him about whether that was the -- to what effect all of that. this is what he had to say. do you feel like you're making a difference when you're going on fox news? >> i don't know. my father-in-law he says oh, you're on -- >> your father-in-law. your family, okay. i'm not saying that critically. >> everybody who wants to be loved needs to be loved. this fundamental notion we're just all human beings. and i have love and respect for people i disagree with. i don't want to talk down or past anyone. quite the contrary. i am listening to fox and i do listen. it is hard. it's demoralizing sometimes,

too. the misinformation and disinformation is next love. you can be in denial about that and accept it and say that's not the world i live en, we're all in this together, and we have to cross pollinate, and we divorce is not an option. it's not an option, we can't afford that. getting on the platforms, showing to the extent i can respect by showing up, and then i can assert because we have to disabuse ourselves we can actually win by stating all these facts, and goes back to the conversation and statistics. we've got to get into the zeitgeist of how people are feeling, and we've got to push back. we've got to get into that blood stream. >> do you think president biden should do these fox interviews? >> i wonder now if i should do anymore after the last few appearances or so. so i'll leave that to president biden. >> i was surprised at how honest he was, right? like, it can't be that fun to go

into the lions den like that, right? but he understands the fundamental utility of not ignoring a sizable portion of the american electorate. i guess -- i mean, look, i kind of understand where he's coming from insofar as someone has to do it. he clearly doesn't think president biden is necessarily the person to do it. but i don't know, jen, what you think whether this is something democrats need to do more of. >> i think he's right to question the utility of it in terms of moving fox viewers to the democratic side. i think what's valuable, it's the kind of thing that democrats like to watch. you know, we think -- we like to watch it because gavin newsom was so effective in deconstructing an argument and showing the flaws in it. and he fights back, and it is

good for democrats to fight back, and it's invigorating for democrats to see a democrat fight on fox news. whether you're convincing fox viewers of -- whether he's actually moving their viewers, i don't know. i'd be really interested to have -- you know, to see a focus group that did that because my concern is that they just are in so much of a different ecosystem that he's not breaking through in the way that you would -- that you would like. but i think it is -- there are people that watch fox news who can be persuaded, and it is a big audience. and i'm a fan of people going on it including the president. you just have to be careful what you do because they orchestrate it so they can use whatever you say to produce misleading shows for the next five days. so it's, you know, tricky. >> suggesting that fox manipulates what politicians say seems very on brand for the

network. jen palmieri, thank you so much. alex, stick around we. have more of your interview with california governor gavin newsom. after the break we'll hear what the border state governor has to say about republican legislatures might have about deciding it might not be important to legislate or do whatever, not if it hurts donald trump's campaign. that's next. it hurts donald trump's campaign that's next. you can sell your policy - even a term policy - for an immediate cash payment. call coventry direct to learn more. we thought we had planned carefully for our retirement. but we quickly realized we needed a way to supplement our income. our friend sold their policy to help pay their medical bills, and that got me thinking. maybe selling our policy could help with our retirement. i'm skeptical, so i did some research and called coventry direct. they explained life insurance is a valuable asset that can be sold. we learned we could sell all of our policy, or keep part of it with no future payments. who knew? we sold our policy. now we can relax and

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i think we called it right.

immigration's a big deal, a very big deal. we have millions and millions of people flowing into our country illegally. it's just killing our country. >> just minutes into celebrating his victory in the new hampshire primary on tuesday donald trump underscored the policy issue he is staking his campaign on, you heard it there immigration. republican voters have so far agreed that immigration is, in fact, a very big deal. in new hampshire and iowa republican voters and caucus goers flagged immigration as the issue that matters most to them second only to the economy. it's such a big deal that for months congressional republicans insisted they would onlyport legislation that sent more aid to ukraine if only it was paired with strict border security laws. that's how big it was for them, until this week of course when negotiations and the senate was finally on the precipice of a real border security deal, and

donald trump pushed to pull the plug on it. in a closed door meeting on wednesday senate minority mitch mcconnell cast doubt on the border deal, telling fellow republicans we don't want to do anything to undermine trump. earlier today alex interviewed border governor state gavin newsom of california about the willingness to torpedo their border deal so trump can keep running on his border chaos. >> mitch mcconnell, i thought that was shameful what was reported out. we started with the weakness of the current speaker of the house. we don't want to deal, period, full stop, they don't want to make this quote-unquote a campaign win for biden. it's everything you know about the fraud they're perpetuating. consistently they have wanted to make it. ever since there were a few brave souls with that gang of eight. >> yeah, i'm old enough to

remember that. >> sever since then they walk away, run away. not the next day, the same day gets sworn in, he puts out a comprehensive immigration plan. and yet you didn't have a counter, they had no strategy in terms of the republican party, even combating that they just wanted to kill it. they didn't want to debate it, didn't want to engage. $14 billion proposal, $14 billion that's his latest proposal to address their stated issue of border security. 2,300 new border patrol agents, another 1,000 in addition to that to deal with fentanyl, close to another billion dollars, $850 plus million for new technology, and then addressed some of the issues of backlog and asylum to address those that are here waiting for asylum. they won't touch it, they don't want to solve this problem, they want to use it for political purposes. and again i say this as a border state governor who introduced me to this issue with the largest port in the western hemisphere in the state of california. we live this, and i think it is

a disgrace what the republican party is doing, what donald trump is doing. and this is in hidden in plain sight. he sent out a tweet or some tweet whatever saying kill it, and these guys are so weak. how bad so patheticically weak this republican party and the new speaker. we don't care about america. we don't care about our freedoms and liberties, we care about politics exclusively at the expense of the american people. all we care about winning for winning's sake. that is shameful. >> back with me from south carolina alex wagner. alex, very impassioned argument being made there by the governor, and i want to ask you about that because we've seen the recent polling that shows registered voters trust republicans with the issue of border security more than they trust democrats. you've got this "the new york times" siena college poll of registered voters in six battleground states showing that voters specifically trust donald trump to do a better job on immigration than joe biden, but the question to governor

newsom's point, can american voters consistently reward republicans on this issue of immigration, this political issue when republicans are the ones tanking border legislation? well this wind up hurting republicans? >> yeah, and i think it's the sort of signal moment here, right? the idea that they would put naked political gain ahead of a problem they say is intractable and the demise of america, that is poisoning the blood of the country, and that it would be so nakedly partisan i think is a searing referendum on the modern day gop. i mean to be honest, ayman, i'm a little surprised this story even leaked because it makes republicans who support trump look so bad. this is not a border deal. look, we don't know exactly what was in it, but from the initial reporting that we have, it was not a deal that democrats really liked. i mean this was in exchange for funding ukraine, and i honestly think this moment plays very well for president biden, right,

who starts his presidency with a comprehensive immigration plan, it goes nowhere. he basically plays with republicans on their terms, and they scuttle it because it's not going to help trump, or it could help biden and therefore hurt trump in an election year. i mean it's so craven as to almost seem like a democratic plot. unfortunately, i don't think it is. you know, i think it's literally how the republican conference is run at this point. mitch mcconnell, the man who said that donald trump was effectively betrayed the country on january 6th just sent an amicus brief in support of donald trump's bid to stay the ballot on the 14th amendment case due to go to the supreme court. this is a man whose wife donald trump personally attacked in racist terms. there is no standard anymore, there is no red line. so i guess this is what you get. in an election year and i think this really hurts them on an issue that they care so deeply about or at least they say they

do. >> it's going to be up to the president there and drive home that point they were ready to make a deal, it was the republicans who consistently stand in the way of border security, and it's nothing more than lip service from the republican party. >> indeed. i mean, this is -- in it way it's like biden never has to actually present the bitter pill to democrats to get it passed. he can say, look, i tried really hard and it's all their fault and they don't want to move on this, and i think for nmts and swing voters who see the sort of transparent calculation here, i do think it's a -- it is devastating for the republican party. whenever immigration comes up, this is going to be the biden campaign's retort. >> a full capitulation of the republican party to donald trump is as we've seen under way. alex, good to see you. i know you'll be back here tomorrow hosting the show from new york. i'll keep the chair warm for you, my friend. >> thank you so much for the work, ayman. i appreciate you. >> take care, my friend. still ahead we'll talk to the

bulwark's tim miller about what happens if republicans do tank this border deal and what's at stake both as a matter of policy and as a matter of 2024 politics. that's coming up next. r of 2024 politics that's coming up next.

all right, so just two contests into the 2024 primary, the republican national

committee appears ready to call it. today nbc news reports that some rnc members have been circulating a draft resolution declaring donald trump their presumptive presidential nominee. in part it states all evidence negates the possibility of a mathematical path forward to the 2024 republican nomination by any candidate other than president trump. now, this draft won't be official until an affirmative rnc vote takes place next week, but senate republicans are behaving as though the matter is already settled. in fact, donald trump is their nominee, and what he says goes. days after trump's decisive win in new hampshire, senate minority leader mitch mcconnell is reportedly backing away from a bipartisan immigration deal that would include aid for ukraine because i guess trump says so. trump who's the presumptive nominee is campaigning on the southern border. last night mitch mcconnell who previously supported this deal,

this very same deal suddenly told his members we are in a quandary. republicans could try to solve a problem that they claim to care about, but they're choosing not to. why? because donald trump wants to deny joe biden a legislative win ahead of the election. joining me now is tim miller, writer at large for the bulwark and msnbc political analyst. so you've got house republicans forcing strict border measures into a deal for ukraine funding which democrats and some republicans were adamant about. now they're trying to blow up this whole deal because it might make joe biden look good politically, and i guess the question is does the ripockeracy of taking a deal they ask for actually register or matter to republican voters? >> well, i don't think at the

scale or he wouldn't do it. the question is is there a minority of trump voters or mianother of republican voters that can be convinced about republicans absolutely shameful abdication of their responsibility by democrats. i was pretty impressed with his messaging in that last segment. i think that making an argument that the republicans care about donald trump's wins more than they care about the border, more than they care about ukraine, more than they care about the ukraine people is a very compelling argument who do genuinely care about this. unfortunately there's not enough to defeat donald trump in a primary, but enough to make a difference in a general election. i just think, ayman, it's unbelievably cowardly, embarrassing and mitch mcconnell, my god.

ukraine was the one thing that he pretended that he cared about. i mean, yeah, there shouldn't even be a deal. i don't even understand why immigration is tied to ukraine in the first place. mitch mcconnell and the republican senators should be working with this administration and the democratic senators to give ukraine the weapons they need no strings attached. but if they're going to demand immigration which has nothing to do with ukraine be tied to it, at least negotiate in good faith, democrats need to shame them in order to cleave off the voters that do care about this. >> we've seen this time and time again about police reform and tim scott negotiating in good faith with democrats and delayed, delay and they keep working on something until there was nothing. how long and why does democrats continue to play this game with republicans. why was ukraine tied to immigration in the first place maybe because democrats felt they could either expose republicans or feel they could make a deal.

we see that blowing up in their face that republicans are not sincere about making a deal, and this is all falling apart. can democrats effectively rup on the message you and governor newsom were highlighting, that republicans are sabotaging legislative deal after legislative deal? >> i think so. especially tied to trump. this notion is pretty baked in with swing voters, that trump only cares about himself. it's not just him, it's the whole party that they're just cult and service to trump. they don't even care about what they claim to care about. i do think that is going to resonate with certain voters. and i've got to tell you going back to strategy, i think democrats should play greater hardball on this. we're coming up on the next budget deal in march. i interviewed for the board the democrat of massachusetts this morning, and he's arguing that democrats shouldn't bail republicans out of their budget mess. if republicans can't put together a budget to keep the government open, well, maybe the democrats should extract things

from the republicans if they're going to bail them out as they've had to do ever since mccarthy and johnson got in charge. some of ther more liberal and democratic agenda items from the border could be included in that or other issues. >> why do you think mitch mcconnell did what he did? >> as you said he was bullish on ukraine, he does want to help ukraine. he claims he cares about ukraine. he's distanced himself from donald trump mittically. he's ignored some of it. now he's ready to do what trump wants. why? >> he can seem unbelievably weak right now. mitch mccomhas always been a power player. whether you like him or not, he's always been someone who has control of that republican conference and feels he's in charge. he's not in charge now. he's been run over. the party did not follow what he wanted to do over the past two

years. i think he got in touch with the base once. obviously he's aging. and so i think for a variety of reasons mitch mcconnell just doesn't have the juice anymore. i hope he finds it. i've got to tell you, i do think this is it for mitch mcconnell. i think he's either going to retire or someone will replace him. if you're going to retire, at least go out with some dignity. mich mcconnell is a cynical guy, but there's a few thing he cares about, and i would hope he finds some backbone in the next few weeks instead of getting run over by a third rate real estate guy out of new york. it's crazy how pathetic mitch mcconnell looks right now. >> i was going to say he can take a page out of mitt romney's book as he lev leaves the senate and standing up what he believes is the right thing to do. thank you for your time tonight. up next on alex wagner tonight, a peek inside the courtroom where donald trump testified today. we'll get the latest from someone who was inside next. e l

someone who was inside next.

all right, so former president donald trump took the stand today to defend himself i guess arguably in the civil trial to decide how much he should have to pay for defaming writer e. jean carroll. trump's testimony only lasted three minutes. but believe it or not in those three minutes trump managed to break the court's rules enough part of his testimony actually had to be stricken from the

courtroom today. and going to help us break that all down in just a moment, but wasn't the only testimony from trump the jury heard today. it was the mostmatic but maybe not the most significant. the facts in this case are not in question at this point. back in may a different jury found trump liable for sexually abusing and defaming writer e. jean carroll, and they ordered him to pay $5.5 million. the issue before the jury today is the question of more damages for different instances of defamation. and because that was the question at hand, carroll's lawyers decided to use trump's own words against him. it was a piece of the other deposition they played for the jury today, deposition from the new york attorney general's civil fraud case against trump in which he brags about how wealthy he is. >> i don't need the money. you probably see the cash, a lot of cash. we have substantially in excess

of 400 million cash. we have a lot of cash, we have great assets, and we have a very valuable company. maybe $10 billion or something from the brand. >> joining us now is lisa reuben, msnbc legal analyst in the room for today's proceedings. i know it's been an exceptionally long day, another one of many for you, but i'll start broadlych what did you make of donald trump's taking the stand today and what he had to say? >> focus on the legal perspective and not really incrementally not adding much political one, either. everything donald trump said on the stand today is something that those who hang on his every word already knew. he denied e. jean carroll's allegations, he stands by that. he know that because he says that all the time on truth social on the campaign trail. and he denied he says to defend himself. nothing about that is surprising. again, i think a total wash both legally and politically. >> the clip we played of donald

trump there was from the attorney general's case not the e. jean carroll case. but what does it say to you about the argument her lawyers presented this as a piece of evidence in this case and the intersection of these two trials? >> let's start with the fact that any time a party to a lawsuit says something in a different venue that can be used as an admission, that can be admissible in another completely unrelated legal proceeding if it bears on some of the same issues. we know that donald trump every time he either takes the stand or is deposed says something that's damaging to himself. so last friday when this video came out from the new york attorney general's case where donald trump was deposed last april most of us thought no big deal, why is this a big thing? it's a huge thing because e. jean carroll's lawyers have never seen this video before. without the release prompted by the freedom of information request they'd never be able to play it today. it's really an opportunity to see how all of his worlds are

converging on one another, legal, political, and all the different proceedings converging as well. >> it's another thing to hear in his own words talk about it and the manner and tone is certainly a factor for the jurors. and speaking of the jury, we understand the closing arguments will be tomorrow. give me your sense how you think it plays out from here, when we might expect a decision, how soon that might happen? >> you know i'm not a magic 8 ball. >> you know everything. >> i nothing that someone who hasn't been in my position trying a case before a jury wouldn't tell you, which is that jurors hate having to come back after a weekend. they want to go back to their normal lives. so if they're instructed by early afternoon tomorrow i predict they might come to a verdict by tomorrow evening. also judge luke kaplan has made provisions for them to get meals instead of lunches, which how a previous order of the court read. that's not a big thing to you or me, but it signals to me he's anticipating perhaps keeping the jury there late into the evening and making accommodations for

that, ayman. >> let me get your final thoughts in switching gears a bit from this case to the alvin bragf case. he's quietly preparing his hush money case. it was kind of like the first case out of the gate so to speak, but we're coming back to it now because of all the importance it still carries as a legal case but also what it means politically. i just want to get your thoughts as we see alvin bragg move forward with that case. >> "the new york times" reporting on that today. the most important thing that stood out is alvin bragg forecasting this case. it's an election interference case of its own. it's about donald trump's attempt to interfere with voters ability to make an informed choice in 2016. i thought that was a really savvy way of looking at the case. i still don't think that case gets tried in march. if there's a possibility that judge tanya chutkan can try that case in march, april or may,

doesn't want to be in a position to try that case. >> we appreciate you doing double duty as a legal analyst and breaking down for us the magic 8 ball, greatly appreciate it. take care. we have one more story for you tonight. what president biden doing in a last ditch effort to rescue a peace for hostages deal between israel and hamas. more on that after the break. israel and hamas more on that after the break until they're gone for good. attention hearing loss sufferers! do you struggle to hear loved ones? do you have trouble keeping up with conversations? do you listen to tv on max volume? hearing loss affects your life. you miss out on important moments... you feel alone. start hearing better today with rca's all new, advanced hearing aids. these aren't cheap amplifiers that don't really work, and you'll never have to pay thousands again. the fda now allows us to bring true, high-quality hearing aids direct to you. through rca's hearing america program, you can get your choice of two,

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this week the british television news network i-tv broadcasted a horrific incident

captured by one of their cameramen. before we play this video from itv, we have to give you a warning it is very disturbing. on monday a tv journalist was filming a group of civilian men fleeing combative areas in khan yunis seen here holding a white flag. according to i-tv these men were trying to go back to an area under israeli fire in order to rescue their relatives who were trapped and in danger. the cameramen then interviewed one of the men seen here in black on the right-hand side of the screen. moments after finishing that interview, the cameraman captured this. the man he interviewed now laying on the ground after being shot dead, his blood seen on the white flag the men were carrying. the shooting sparked wide

condemnation. amnesty international called it evidence of a war crime. an israeli military spokesperson told nbc news the video is clearly edited and we have no way to comment. the u.s. state department for its part also notably declined to comment on whether the shooting was a war crime or not. also in khan yunis israeli forces have surrounded two hospitals trapping thousands of palestinians inside. they're among the last still providing medical care in the strip. now the israeli military has ordered evacuations for that part of the city raising fears of more air strikes. and in gaza city today at least 20 people were killed and more than 150 injured according to gaza's health mipistry after the shelling in a crowd of people waiting for humanitarian aid. sounds of gunfire caused hundreds of millions to panic and run with whatever they could carry. in the north of gaza there are reports like this one on social

media of so little food palestinians are resorting to eating animal feed, milling it into flour to make bread. at least 27,500 people have been killed in gaza since the start of the war. that is according to the same palestinian health authority. 70% of the victims, 70% are women and children. it has now been 110 days since the october 7th hamas attacks on israel. and more than half of the hostages abducted remain in captivity. nbc news has learned this weekend president biden plans to dispatch cia director william burns to meet with israeli and qatari diplomats in hopes a deal could be brokered to secure the release of those hostages still held inside gaza. whether that deal will include a large humanitarian pause or even a cease-fire is still a mystery to everyone. as the biden administration continued its support for the

war, 35% of americans believe, and when you look exclusively at president biden's supportersinate number rises to 50%. what is clear the longer this war lasts, the worst it gets for hostages and the innocent civilians inside gaza, and the world will bear to more devastation, and more unimaginable suffering. and it will be clear which steps were and were not taken to stop it. that is our show for tonight. you can catch me back here on the weekends at 7:00 p.m. eastern. alex will be back here tomorrow with more of her interview with california governor gavin newsom. "way too early" with jonathan lemire coming up next. jonathan lemire coming up next. i just reject the idea that we should reserve a crisis for a better time to solve it. you know, it's -- people -- what's interesting to me is there's a lot of angry people out there, and that's why the border crisis is the number one issue for voters. i don't see how we have a better

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