breaking news at the top of the. our united states forces announced it conducted several strikes yesterday, strikes against targets in hutu- controlled areas of yemen. united states central command says they were in self-defense and targeting unmanned vessels at multiple missiles in the red sea. this happens we captured the united states announced a weeklong campaign against iran- backed militias in the region. we want to switch to the united states senate, a package would aid for taiwan -- but we're here still, michael steele is not serious when he said he was running for the rnc chair. and we have thoughts about this package. it did clear a major procedural hurdle last night with 64 senators voting to advance it. but still faces a number of uphill battles before that can be a final floor vote. it also comes just days after senate republicans blocked a different aid bill.

that bill had major concessions from democrats within the senate on the southern border. joining us now is the senator who was in the room, democratic senator alex padilla of california. welcome, welcome, sir. thank you for coming to the table. >> senator, if he cannot be in california with a, family after be here in washington at the best of rand paul, i'm glad you're at least with us. they've bungled this so badly, republicans. they made those complicated in ways it never needed to be complicated. talk to me about the stakes of not getting this done and not getting it done in a timely fashion. >> i appreciate this, because it's important for the people to know. some people use the phrase that the republicans the dog that caught the cart. how have they demanded we need to secure the border, address the border and then they negotiated deal, the deals on the table and they all run away from it. why? one reason. trump said no. or at least wait until november when i get there. they'll niall, right?

>> which is not how legislation works, there is no wait for me. >> karen but this because -- they voted no because of politics, i voted no because some of the policy that wasn't in the policy that was not, for the first time, there is an immigration or border proposal on the table that had some enforcement, some smart, some definitely not. but no dreamer would have benefited from the package, no farmworker would've benefited from the package, no legal pathways for people who have earned it, in my opinion. no, the next step is, well, let's footed the rest of the foreign aid package. which is what we should've done a long time ago. aid to ukraine insurgent. not just aid to israel but the humanitarian aid that so necessary for the region. aid to taiwan and strengthening our posture at the indo-pacific region. all that done months ago but was held hostage by republicans. they are very blunt about it. the price for this is border.

now they can't even do that. the hypocrisy is amazing. right? the senate, the negotiators insisted on putting secretary mayorkas on the road to make sure it's a substantive deal. >> he was in the room, right? >> in the, house they're trying to piece together. what? is it make up your mind. until they make up their, mind not prevail to get serious about border but the rest of our domestic international business has to move forward. >> it's a domestic in the foreign piece that republicans and democrats, schumer and mcconnell in the senate, agreed to. they put together the package to get it out. now we're in the space. i want to play a little bit of senator rand paul on the new foreign aid packages that are in front of you know in the future of the package. >> i'm not going to object to the amendment but i'm going to object to condensing timeline. it will struggle through this for two or three more days.

we're going to be the crap out of them for someone else's board are not our own. and we're going to see where the cards lay. this is a minority of republicans, including the leader of the republican party appear, who are all for protecting some other countries bordering not our own. >> that for me is such a disingenuous statement in position to take. in, fact it's outright total bs in terms of what is right in front of you. you stated the case of this is about securing our relationship and protecting our friends and helping ukraine and the people of ukraine right now who need a help, which is part of what nato allies do you. have you read the movement to sort of break this? is he going to hold a lock on this for two or three days and then, three top, before okay, now you can do it. >> it's not what people want here but the process of the senate, -- we'll start early next week but it will get done.

that's a good, news only matter of time before this package gets done. >> this is just theater then? >> absolutely theater. it's not surprising that it's him because in one package it's about our border versus other allies, next time is going to be about cutting the federal government budget when we should be investing more infrastructure in health care and so many other things. we will see when his old colleagues on the republican side finally get fed up and have to say, come on. >> to be, clear he walked away from the border deal, right? >> you walked away for the border deal. and let me point out yet another example of the hypocrisy. there, saying we've got to get tough on the, border secure the border. biden has to do his job. we have governor abbott in texas using state troopers to prevent federal agents from access to the border. to enforce the law. i only bring that up because there is an attempt by senate republicans last week to say, well, let's just empower

governors to protect the border. we see examples of what's going to happen if something like that would go through. still waiting for them to get serious. >> aid, you believe this aid package is going to. pass all the foreign aid will pass. question, is what happens in the house? that's not your gm. >> will be tough. the state affairs in the house of representatives. unlike the border deal. i have not heard state speaker johnson, -- we need to be hard, very narrow majority. nancy pelosi had deleted caucus with the very slim majority. >> it's not like it can't be done. >> with this regular border into suspension, et cetera, the encouraging pieces that there has not been an announcement on the horizon. >> that's an important point. >> to the point about leadership in the distinction between the senate in the house, there's been recent reporting on mitch mcconnell's winning influence over his own caucus. i, wonder someone who's obviously not a member of the caucus but has a front seat to

the way they operate. if you sense that is the case, if you think he does not have the howard ability to whip votes that he once had. >> every issue is maybe a little bit different. and up in divided on a different topic. ukraine i think it's at the core of the dysfunction of senate republicans. here's my assessment. remember trump's first impeachment? what was a four? would you call this a any to investigate something? >> president zelenskyy. >> ukraine. putin clearly has something over trump and trump has a hold on the republican party. when trump says jump they say, how? high with trump sustained down they, say yes, sir. when trump says wait till november, that's what they're going to try to do. it is the trump effect that mcconnell is up against. >> in doing that, they are conceding the global fight for democracy over autocracy. sometimes we talk about you created it seems as though this only matters to ukraine, with

what we are talking about is a much bigger struggle here. who in fact their publicans would absolutely concede, that, incredibly alarming press with americans. >> we're tired of wearing a potential world war. vladimir putin is not going to stop in ukraine. >> there used to be republican party -- people flee to oppressive regimes. whether it was for this way, like cuba, other countries. that's not the case today. >> you raise an interesting point about how this plays out with the leadership, within the leadership of the republican caucus and mcconnell's influence there. the jockeying that has already, begun which interior where of. who is going to replace mcconnell. do you sense that there are republicans in the senate that democrats can go to? not just on the issue of foreign aid but on other things like the border, to sort of say, look, let's massage this a

little bit differently and come to a different spot because we do need, whether together are separate, we do need to address both of these issues. and we do have a way forward because we had it. what are the prospects or is this just going to be political theater for the rest of this cycle until we get to november and then probably looking at a different lineup anyway? >> if you keep hope alive, this is tough if you don't keep up alive. >> he said it is, like i've got to keep it alive. made immigration reform, modernization, whatever term you want to use, priority of mine something out of the senate where the three years ago. because i know her date of the immigration system is. i've been to better reach. republicans, maybe a little easier than others. maybe some will support this but not that. you're trying to find that sweet spot. one of the frustrating things for me is how many republicans have told me, that hosted orders. dreamers. but first we've done to secure

the border. let's hope farmworkers, other essential workers during the pandemic. control of the border. which is part of what enraged me this last week. then they negotiated deal that they felt, i didn't updated, would secure the border. why not add relief for dreamers and others to the package? but that was walkway from it. we saw it in 20, 13 they negotiated, deal with vehement. we saw the 2018. there is a bipartisan deal on its way to a floor vote in the senate until trump tweets. and a bunch of them walk away and we're seeing it again in 2024. republicans have to decide when to get serious. >> they had the deal, that's a critical thing people need to understand. they had the deal. >> they voted against it. >> they voted against the, deal they didn't take the win that democrats, much to the chagrin of certainly the more progressive members of the democratic caucus, didn't want that. did what those pieces. it was a conservative bill on the border. indians to republicans to

sighted, because trump made a phone call to the speaker, we are killing him. >> we take a minute as to why i voted on that bill. that bill was another way to get back to what we used to call title 42. shut down the border. which we know did not work. numbers went up during the trump administration when title 42 was in place. if you want to be smart about addressing the migration issue, you've got to first of all look that root causes. why are people so desperately trying to come here to begin with? let's work with our partner countries are at the atmosphere and either get people hope and opportunity back home or work with other partner countries or the hemisphere that everyone do their part to better manage this float. the biggest pressure that feeds unlawful migration is it is so hard to come here illegally. they wanted to meet in the city system tougher, you can do that only one. you can build a wall as high as you want but you're not going to get people to ec numbers and

tell you address those causes and engage our partners. that was not reflected in the bill. that wasn't reflected of the bill. >> there's nothing about that. everton replies of migration when i worked for the vice president up. white house always a two- pronged approach. the, border infrastructure the border but what is happening in the countries. the person who has been very at the forefront of all these conversations with secretary mayorkas, as you raised. that looks like they are going to bring his impeachment vote back up again. >> one more time. >> they might have the votes in seattle. if they vote, they're going to send it to the senate. i think that the democrats are poised to impeach secretary mayorkas. >> we could have been every time in the senate. there may be a full trial or something less than that. >> could be a trial still. >> we don't, we have to get this for new package and then we'll get to that piece if it gets out of the. house has tried and failed last week. every minute, and a spending of, that every minute that has been since a complete waste of

time. >> i think lots of folks would agree with you. senator padilla, thank you so much. you get to go home. >> he's sticking with us. >> sticking around. everybody is, like he's not going anywhere, don't let him go. we do need you to stay. >> i have a follow-up appointments of the. said we want to get to that. >> after the break, it's good that you're going to stay because we need to discuss the response from biden to the special counsel report from robert hur in much more. y'all stay with us because you're watching the weekend. th. if you're like me, one of the millions suffering from pain caused by migraine, nurtec odt may help. it's the only medication that can treat a migraine when it strikes and prevent migraine attacks. treat and prevent, all in one. don't take if allergic to nurtec. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. relief is possible.

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the white house is defending president biden after the release of special councils robert hersh's report. counselor is designing to who found evidence that biden, quote, willfully retained and

disclosed classified materials after his time as vice president when he was a private citizen. democratic senator alex belinda is with us. >> senator, what did you think of the report? >> i think the conclusion was spot on. >> what was the conclusion? >> that biden did nothing wrong. and matter-of-fact he fully participated with the investigators. voluntarily returned the documents that he should've had. what >> a stark contrast, right? the special prosecutor acknowledges the way president biden and his team handled all of this, in contrast to how donald trump handled it. that is appropriate. the commentary on his age, appearance, sympathy from whoever, i thought that was very inappropriate. bs, if you asked me. >> that part, i think, is what i find the most galling. in the first paragraph the prosecutor the special counsel

lays out with, oh there's nothing here. let's move on. no crime, no reason to pursue. let me tell you how old this guy is. how this, how that. that response i found to be interesting among democrats and republicans. i did take note of one republican who had something to say. listen to what senator mitt romney said on this whole matter of biden's age. >> i've interacted with the president, i have found anything particularly out of the ordinary now guard. he's an older guy. when president trump last week, or the week before, said nikki haley multiple times in certain nancy pelosi, recognize that's gonna happen with a couple guys soon to be in their 80s. one of them now. but another will be soon. >> do you feel like he's fit to be president for another term? >> yeah, i disagree with him on issues, and he's not someone i would like to vote for. i'm certainly not gonna vote for president trump. so, i've got some challenges ahead. >> we all have some challenges

ahead. that is the critical thing. you hear a united states senator saying i've been trying to at the president. he is doing his thing. i can talk to him, he talks back. i have points, he has points. i disagree with him on policy. that's the rub. this is the problem democrats have. amongst themselves before you even get out into the world with the rest of us among them selves democrats are having this internal fight over this man's name age instead of recognizing what mitt romney just said. he is a guy in his 80s. he's gonna say things that aren't always just right there. it might be dealing with ham he is doing the job, it's unfit to be president? yes! i do disagree with him on policy. what is the disconnect here with biden and his age and the success that he has had on the streets with the policies that he has put in place? >> i hear you. as someone who's been in the room with him, as well. whether it is the roosevelt room, oval office, or out there in advance. he is getting it done. so that is our task between now

and november on the campaign side to remind the american public not only is he fit to do the job, he is doing a heck of a job, right? if he was weak he wouldn't have been able to rally allies to support ukraine against putin's aggression. he wouldn't have driven the economy to such great success. inflation is down, unemployment continues to be down. wages are up. the evidence, the pile is there. we have to push on. that >> senator, the president didn't have a very fiery response. he had a press conference thursday night. prior to that he had democrats and our own nbc news reporting, headline is, a nightmare. special counsel's assist in the bidens mental fitness triggers democratic panic. what is with the bed-wetting? i mean, i am just saying! what is going on? a number of democrats did not do what you just did initially

an hour after that report came out. they answered the fawn when the reporter called. they peed on themselves, for lack of a better term. what is going on? >> i think we have to get a little bit more of a backbone sometimes. the fight is on. and we have to get after it. i think the case of the american people because if we don't the only thing we will be hearing is the misinformation and the disinformation coming from donald trump and the republican party. >> there is a great op-ed by stuart stevens, republican. basically saying that democrats need to stop calling president biden a good president. they need to say he has been a great president. it is a question of these forcefulness with which democrats are out there. not even this question of, should there be another candidate? no. actually standing up for his record. what strikes me, -- you need him to succeed, number one,

because you want this place to function. but also it will be tied to democrats own electoral success down ballot. it does not put you in a position of strength to say, all, well, he's good enough. >> we also have to give the public in the voters a lot more credit. pretty soon it will be clear biden is our nominee. trump will officially be the republican nominee. that is the choice people have to make. you do have to track records to look. at four years of the biden presidency. what it has meant for public safety, the economy, investment in communities. advancement of equity concerns throughout the country. and the dumpster fire that was the trump administration. right? from the economy, the pandemic, everything else. >> is there an effort, you think, -- and i know you are not tied into the campaign or anything like that but do you sense that there is an effort, to alicia's point, to really re- frame the narrative for this

administration? i have always said it would probably work best if you let president biden let senator biden, uncle joe. let him do his thing. he's gonna stumble here and there but let him do his thing. the infrastructure behind him is the more forceful in your face, no, this has been a great president for these reasons. do you sense that that now has broken open for democrats in light of both legal events that have been occurring as well as the political events occurring on the republican side? where it is very clear where maga now has full control of the political process, are and see up and down. you have a clear runway now of what is in front of you. >> this is clear now because it is time. two or three years ago there was a president election. the primary season is off and running. it is clear to everyone that trump will be the nominee.

all of the focus of the press, with all due respect, has been on the republican primary. what is gonna happen? how many challengers? remember, there used to be this desantis guy in the mix? >> i remember him, yeah. >> we are going to get there. all the attention has been on that side. not on the democratic primary because biden is our president. we have a strong record that we are proud of that we are going to run on. as we get closer to the summer and the conventions, that will be the focus. the contrast is going to be clear. beyond that, you mentioned, let joe it'll be joe. people love joe. but when people see donald trump, most americans whether they publicly admit it's not, what is that they feel? -- i'm >> scared. >> they're feeding off the bitterness, the chaos. i confidently believe that come november we will see, not just biden versus trump. but a biden victory. and by a larger margin than last time. >> what you just described as a

choice as much has been written about the fact that the biden campaign in the white house would like this to be a choice election. is it really a referendum on joe biden? i do think it is a choice. it is a choice between joe biden and what looks to be donald trump. you described how people feel? i know how i feel. i'm scared. these are precarious times. we just had the former general montana on to talk about this. it is a choice election. >> no doubt. every election is, in some regard. but this one couldn't be more of a contrast, couldn't be more of a difference. the stakes could not be higher. we thought 2020 was consequential, that was before january 6th. that was before a former president with countless indictments becomes more and more popular in his party and it's putting his stomach down on the problem solving in the 90s congress. people have a choice to make members of congress -- they feel the work we have to do is

too serious. >> senator padilla, i think now i can say thank you. [laughter] we appreciate your time. >> a shout out to angie and my boys back home. i'll be home soon as i can. >> thank you. ahead, folks, another dad but a dad who is in trouble. donald trump's control of the republican party is tighter than ever. everyone is too afraid to stop it. this is the weekend on msnbc. t like when it needs to be a big soft shoulder to cry on. which is why downy does more to make clothes softer, fresher, and better. downy. breathe life into your laundry. here's to getting better with age. here's to beating these two every thursday. help fuel today with boost high protein, complete nutrition you need... ...without the stuff you don't. so, here's to now. boost.

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which penetrates deep to target the source of pain with nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory medicine directly at the source. voltaren, the joy of movement. ♪ directly at♪the source. you know i am pretty judicious and bow laying donald trump out. and there was something he said last night. a speech in pennsylvania. i want to play it because we have been having this conversation about mental acuity. take a listen. >> we have to win in november, we are not gonna have --

pennsylvania! they're gonna change the name in pennsylvania. >> michael, you said something the other day, i was like, yes! donald trump, obviously, he has trouble stringing a sentence together. the american people, the voters at least, do not think of him as senile, or crazy, his inability to put a sentence together. they are not registering concerned about his age. i think there is because there has not been a sustained campaign from the time donald trump came onto the stage down a little elevator to brand him as such. >> i agree. the reason why it's hard to do it is because donald trump is so dammed entertaining. because he is entertaining us, you don't look at him through the same critical lens you look at the guy who is obviously much more serious, the president of the united states. you then pick apart those flaws. the guy who you find

entertaining has them, as well. he can't put a scent of together correctly. wants to rename pennsylvania. that says a lot about how donald trump stepped into the space. why he is the ptc barnum of politics. why he is the guy who is running the circus around everyone. the high wire act, the clown car, all these various pieces are moving around at the same time. he is orchestrating that movement. it is all centered on him. you find it entertaining. you are not looking at donald trump. a lot of people react, i think. but there is not that same critical assessment of him. which is why they don't see the issue when he has an access hollywood tape. why that is a problem, right? why they don't see the issue when he goes out and calls nikki haley's name instead of

nancy pelosi. they are being so entertained by everything else. they are not looking critically at it. i think that gives him an advantage. you're right, the dems and others need to break that some kind of way. >> i wonder to what extent this is also true because the democrats have focused their attacks on the criminality -- >> recently. it wasn't before. it was just he was dangerous because he wasn't experienced. >> some great reporting by mccain coppins in the atlantic about how trump during his time as an entertainer and a businessman always wanted to have the level of control and authority that he has been able to assert over the republican party. there is a great anecdote about him going to jeff's occur at the time that he was gonna be the apprentice. i want to make as much as the cast of friends combined and he was like, or give you 60 k. it was jeff zakhar thing know that may don't time quebec and say, all right. i will take the 60 k. what

stands out to me is we have not seen that from republicans. we have not seen anyone willing to say no. he is not a master negotiator. he doesn't actually understand the art of the deal. this is a persona he has crafted that had only been successful inside this republican party. >> i think what is really important, first of all, people should read that mccain pumpkins piece because a different classic. but to this point about people looking at him as an entertainer and not critically, that is why we were playing that sound this morning, it is critical. talking about the things that donald trump is saying and doing. it is critical and important. he should be scrutinized at the. high-levels his statements should be pulled apart. i should say he cannot string together a coherent send me while joe biden of the can. he's doing all these other things to say the republican. donald trump has escaped accountability on so many fronts. i think because not just republican voters but other

people were very entertained. not people who work here, but some other people. >> that's the, just to be clear. >> well, y'all, coming up how the non-entertainer, donald trump, managed to get senate republicans turned against the gray border bill they negotiated. we will hear more from senator padilla. you're watching the weekend on msnbc. re watching the weekend n msnbc. you ready? surprise! i don't think you can clear this. i got this. it's yours now.

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correspondent for the atlanta journal constitution, tia mitchell. welcome to the table. >> thank you for having me. >> we are so happy to have you here. given the chaos that we have become accustomed to at the hands of the house gop, i was thinking to myself, whether it's over this week? why that what happened at that we need to be feels different? it felt like a declaration. republicans are not going to be able to get anything done between now and november. we may have thought that. it might have been the subtext. it is now abundantly clear. i just don't understand, a washington correspondent like yourself, wonder what you will do for the next few months. knowing that they are not actually going to actually be legitimately trying to push pieces of legislation. even when they do deals that they like, they get ready to sign off on. it they have enough votes for the steal. they still can't get it passed the finish line. >> to your point the only thing that gets done in this election year of the must pass bills. there are a lot of them when

you think about. it faa reauthorization. the farm bill. surveillance, appropriations. the government shutdown deadline coming back again march 1st. i think they're going to have to figure. now it is going to still be messy but i think some of these things they're gonna have to figure out a way forward. because of the dysfunction, particularly among republicans, it is that much more difficult to do things that everyone agrees must be done. the extra, like border security, to your point, it is highly unlikely to get anything done. i think the further we get into the summer, especially as they start clearing off some of this must pass legislation, there is not going to be much going on as far as actual accomplishments for us to tick off in congress. >> that is unacceptable. i think it should be unacceptable for the american people. what happened this week, particularly in the house, they

can't count. republicans in the house could not count. that very slim majority, they could not count. they put a bill on the floor they did not have the votes floor. the speaker himself is gambling it in talking about how this is failing. that is a mess of their own making. it's not like a slim majority is much to blame. speaker pelosi had a slim majority. >> to me what was so interesting about that border security vote that failed in the house, i'm sorry, the vote that failed in the house, it was tied. they -- it's not even just that they couldn't count. they made assumptions that did not prove to be true. it was a political miscalculation. which is even more damning. it was embarrassing for them not to have known that al greene was going to show up in dramatic fashion and tie the boat. that is where, i think, it was the mayorkas. i know i said border security but i'm at the new yorker's

impeachment. again, they did not plan well. they were embarrassed in realtime on the national stage. again, speaker johnson he was not groomed for this. i think some of his lack of experience shows in these critical points like this. that is one thing, nancy pelosi, you could never say she was not groomed, trained. she did not have the experience. >> he was really formidable. >> are you saying an inexperienced white man raised his hand for a job that he probably wasn't ready for? perhaps. >> we have seen this before in history. it is not unusual. i want to focus in on what the former chair of the nevada republican party said. look at it through your lens as a correspondent covering these issues. when she talks about trump's stronghold on the party, not just on a republican base. it is, i call it, an infection

that has hit the senate now. it started in the house, it has now moved to the senate. we looked at what happened with the border bills. we looked at what happened with new york's. how do you see that? how do you see this republican party devolution around the evolution and rise of donald trump? to the point that we have what we saw this week? you call it a dog evolution, i call it an evolution. people have different points of thought on whether it is a good thing or bad thing. i think that the republican party shifted before donald trump. you know that as the former chair. he took advantage of it. a lot of it is not so much about trump but about what they know they can accomplish with trump at the head. i think that at the end of the day it is about what is the republican party? who do they want to be? what we see, particularly in congress, they want to pull to the right. christian nationalism is a big

part of where they are coming from ideologically. again, to your point, it started more in the house. but we are seeing more and more members of the senate winning primaries, winning in conservative states and are representing that further right movement of the republican party. >> stick around, tia. we've got a little more we want to talk to you about. a quick programming note. tonight, our colleague jonathan capehart is sitting down with new york governor, kathy hochul, to talk about immigration and the border bill that senate republicans have blocked. that is tonight right here on the saturday show with jonathan capehart at six pm eastern only on msnbc. next, an nbc news poll on the 2024 race has of scratching our heads. yeah, i've got something to scratch out here. this is the weekend only on msnbc. on msnbc. y have already been vaccinated against the flu, but don't forget this season's updated covid-19 shot too.

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i would not have done what mike pence did. i do not think that was the right approach. i stand by what i said on the house floor. and i stand by my statement. it was unconstitutional, and an overreach. >> that was a hot mess. >> t is back, yes. to be clear, what mike pence did was his job in certifying the election, and his constitutional duty. >> what does it tell you that we are now locked in some reality version of america's next top vice president? >> that, to me, is what this comes down to. as elise stefanik is in the conversation to be his vice president. what is before the voters is a choice, he has. both trump and biden have r downside. what the biden campaign is trying to stress is the downside to a potential trump presidency as you put people in place who may change the fabric of our democracy.

again, you might say i want that to happen. you might want to support a trump ticket. if you are concerned about what that could mean the new might not want trump to be an office. quite frankly, that could put at least stefanik in position to make the types of decisions that she is now criticizing former vice president pence for making. it is a true decision. i think sometimes that gets lost in some of the other side conversations. the risk of a trump presidency is that trump and his allies, they've said it over and over again, certain decisions that pence and others were praise for making on january 6th, or the days leading up to january 6th, they would not have made. >> which tells us a you just take what we now know, what trump wants. you transported back to january six. elise stefanik standing at that rostrum would produce a

decidedly different opportunity in a moment for the country. i think that that is an important element to understand. >> i would be interested to hear, okay. you wouldn't have done what pence did? what would you have done? be specific. a lot of people think that pence could've done other things. again, a lot of legal scholars believe pence did the exact right thing. constitutional scholars, things like that. what would you have done different? let's back that out as to what would've been the outcome of these other decisions. again, we could have been in a true constitutional and democratic crisis. january 26th without enough already. i say that someone who was there when it happened. it was bad enough already. we have the hindsight of not having to have lived out worst- case in areas on that day. >> we are accustomed to at

least stefanik's revisionism which seems to be seeping into some segments of the american electorate. our new poll found 40% of voters now say donald trump's presidency was better than expected. i don't know what to make that number. >> that is, again, contextualizing and looking backwards fondly. we have seen voters do that. they tend to look back on the time they were cursing realtime, ten years later, eight years later, five years later. saying that it was different. in this case it is a little more disturbing for me. it really confirms for me something that i think is really important for people to understand. it is one thing to sit back and criticize donald trump. to say you are anti magra. the most important thing you have to do right now is understand what is in front of you. you have to understand what they are saying and why they are saying it. the 40% of voters now saying donald trump's presidency was better what is really happening around them is part of the fog

that donald trump has created, narratively speaking. and the elements that are within that fog are all of the things we are dealing with. the trials and this and that. how do we clear that fog? that is the question. how do we level up the conversation in reporting into sermon by those of us who are trying to have that moonstruck moment. just snap out of it. >> you traveled with the president and the vice president. you go back to georgia often and report about what is happening in georgia. i also think that, maybe, we need to talk about what, to your point, is happening in front of us. the things that the president and vice president have been doing so that voters have a better understanding so they can make their decisions. >> also, to the poll, to me two things stand out. number one, most voters had a really low expectation for the trump presidency starting out.

i think it makes sense that he had nowhere to go but up omar hooters when you look at how they look at his four years. i do think, to michaels point, people tend to think more fondly as former presidents are out of office. george w. bush has benefited from the hindsight, as well. in realtime he was criticized for a lot of his decision- making. think about hurricane katrina and the weapons of mass destruction conversation. that is, to me, the way we look at former presidents is one conversation. trump, particularly if he remains a former president, he is always going to benefit from some of that hindsight. to your point, simone, the fact that he is not just a former president. he is a former president who wants to be president again. we do have to be sober minded and truthful about what that could mean. >> he said he would be a dictator on day one. tia mitchell, thank you for

coming to the table with us. that does it for the weekend this saturday morning. be sure to follow our show on social media at the weekend msnbc. tomorrow on the show we will be joined by former trump aide john bolton on his very gerard warning that is old boston fit to be president. we will get into it tomorrow only on msnbc. velshi will start right after a quick break, with charles coleman. we will see you tomorrow. will with a streamlined shipping network. and new, high-speed processing and delivery centers. for more value. more reliability. and more on-time deliveries. the united states postal service is built for how you business. and how you business is with simple, affordable and reliable shipping. usps ground advantage. i know what it's like to perform through pain. if you're like me, one of the millions suffering from pain caused by migraine, nurtec odt may help.

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