more modernly, it has been used across media taking on many forms to represent difference and contrast. or to evoke suspension and reflection. to make us laugh. >> the cosmic ballet goes on. >> does anyone want to switch seat seats? >> reporter: song and dance. but experiencing a solar eclipse in the moment is nothing short of sensational. >> it was spectacular, not only do see it with the cloud cover, right? i think we had some divine intervention. we were all here for this. >> how do you feel? you have seen history! we saw history! >> i was chanting as well. i was lucky enough to join those guys in charleston in

august of 2017. we built our own pinhole projector. you don't need to do that. you do need to get eclipse glasses if you plan to look up. in many places in the u.s. on monday, you will be able to see at least a partial eclipse. go to science.nasa.gov. plug in your zip code for the exact information. on that note, i wish you a very good night. i promise tomorrow night is going to be a good one. from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late and e i will see you tomorrow. today in vanity fair, gabe sherman published a featured story about the trump 24 campaign. there is a lot that is alarming

but what jumped out as the most alarming detail was that within the actual trump campaign, the person whose name is being floated to be trump's attorney general of the united states to run the justice department is this guy. >> we will go out and find the conspirators not just in government, but in the media, yes. we will come after the people in the media who lied about american citizens, who helped joe biden rig presidential elections. we will come after you. whether it is criminal or civilly. we will figure that out. >> that is kash patel. a man apparently on the short list of attorney general if donald trump retakes office. now trump has not been shy about his desire to weaponnize the doj. and we should probably take him at his word about that. i do think he is serious. but don't take it from me. trump announced all of the

january 6th committee members should go to jail. and today, the la times interviewed some of those members who ask how seriously they were taking those threats. congresswoman zo loftgrand said i learned to pay attention to listen to what trump says because he means it. if he intends to eliminate our constitutional system and start arresting his political enemies i guess i would be on on that list. the paper interviewed congressman adam schiff who trump has made one of his top political enemies. he told the times he is having realtime conversations with his staff about how to make sure he stays safe if trump follows through on his threats. so the danger is very real. and the biden administration is doing something about it. attorney general patel told steve bannon he would use the

government to go after trump's enmies. he would have to cleanous. >> do you believe you could deliver the goods on this in a short order to get rolling? >> i will not say their names now so the radical left wing media can terrorize them. but we learned we have to put in all america patriots top to bottom. today the biden administration issued a new rule to trump proof the white house. the rule strengthens job protections for federal workers so trump can't just clean house. so question, trump could try to go after his enemies and he could still try to install someone like patel to do so, but that attorney general would have a much harder time going

full banana republic if the people carrying out the work under him were career government workers and not political stooges. there are adults in the room and they are trump proofing it in case trump gets back in office. the bad news is there is a much more immediate threat coming from trump right now have. and it is highly unclear what anyone can do about it. do you remember the guy who rammed his suv into the fbi field office in atlanta on monday? authorities have not released an official motive but in the past 24 hours we may have gotten a clue. a few years back, an account believed to be the suspect's posted i love you donald trump. if you feel like you have having deja vu that is reasonable but this guy is different from the guy who attacked an fbi field office in cincinnati two years ago. but that guy also apparently loved donald trump. and was enraged that the fbi

searched mar-a-lago. and both of these attacks came after months of trump demonizing the fbi and telling his followers things like the fbi and the justice department have become vicious monsters controlled by radical left scoundrels. trump is not just going after federal law enforcement but the prosecutors and the judges trying to hold him accountable. nbc news can report police have filed felony charges against a man who has allegedly been sending threatening voice mails to attorney general letitia james. ag james is leading the civil trial against trump. the man sent messages saying mark my words i will kill you if you dare to permanently steal trump's assets or property. naloxone kind of threat to a prosecutor or a judge overseeing a case involving a

former president of the united states, that should be front page news. but it is not anymore. because the idea the trump's followers would threaten the people he liables as enemies has become totally normalized. the judge in trump's hush money case expanded a gag order against trump because he was singling out and lying about his daughter. but somehow, despite literally being reprimanded in court just days ago in court, trump had the gal to post this a few hour ago today. trump called special council jack smith deranged and said that he should be sanctioned or censured for the way he is attacking judge aileen cannon. well, trump is referencing here the fact that jack smith disagreed with judge cannon in a legal filing. that is it. that is the sum total of what donald trump considers an attack when the attacker is someone other than donald

trump. what makes that post so particularly unhinged is that the attacker here is very clearly donald trump. trump demonizes people and trump dunce disavow any of it. the pattern is incredibly clear and the pattern has poisoned our national politics. trump has normalized the idea that an appropriate response to political disagreement is physical violence. earlier this year, reuters did the math and found serious threats against federal judges, threats that are so serious they trigger an investigation by the u.s. marshal's, those throats have doubled since 2021. and serious threats against federal prosecutors more than doubled. the director of the u.s. marshal said judges mostly faced threats from people upset about their own cases. now, he said, many more are coming from people enraged because of politics. joining me now is andrew

weissman. cohost of the essential msnbc podcast prosecuting donald trump. thanks for being here. to an ordinary citizen, this is disturbing, but for those who knows judges and courtrooms, i can't imagine how this lands with you. and just first, you know, as you see these judges become the object of trump's ire, and really, targets for violence. what do you make of it and how how chilling is this? >> when i started out as a prosecutesser i did organized crime work here in new york city. something you did not have to worry about when you did organized crimework. all my friends would say, were you ever worried? no. the rule was in organized crime, you do not go after

anyone in law enforcement. it wasn't because they were so moral. it was because what's the point of that. you will only attract more attention and it would just be another person coming in to prosecute and you would have all of this heat attracted to you. i think you are opening talking about how this is normalized. and that after it happens, if you want a really good sign of the intent of donald trump, it is the same way you look at january 6th and you want to know what his intent was then? think about what he did after ward. he wasn't saying this was terrible. if you see what happened and you see the fbi being attacked, you see judges being attacked. and people taking the call and response. if that was not the response you intended, you would be saying absolutely don't do this. what i meant was to just first

amendment, i disagree with what jack smith is saying. i disagree with the judge's ruling. a lot of us have strong views of the supreme court in its rulings. that is fine. what is not is obviously resorting to violence and it has been completely normalized. i do think the fbi has its hands full dealing with this. and making sure just one thing i would note is the attacks on judges. the bipartisan attacks. not just words. but deeds. that is the kind of thing that has to be much more front page news and like the january 6th investigation. it needs to be something that people take seriously and call out politicians who don't say you have to stop this. >> i do want to talk about the attacks from the left. we are talking about a candidate for president. >> absolutely.

>> who is directly fomenting violence against everyone in the judicial branch. in his expanded gag order. for history, about this moment, and the threats these judges are withstanding, he says this pattern of attacking family members of presiding jurors, serves no legitimate purpose. it merely injects fear in those assigned that not only they, but their family members as well are fair game for the defendant's vitriol. why don't the judges, judge merchon extended the gag order to include family members. is it just perceived neutrality? it doesn't seem practical. >> i agree with you. i think it does emanate from

this feeling that i'm going to do my duty. i can take, i can deal with it when it is an attack on me personally. i don't want to inject myself into the process i need to maintain being octave and fair and not taking sides. the more i can do that, the better especially when the risk is just me. but i think that judges are seeing including in this clip you just read, it is to allow it to go on with respect to anyone in the process, sends a message to everyone in the process that this is allowed. though you say don't do this to witnesses. >> you are suggesting it is a new norm. the other piece of it is jury selection. and witnesses. talk to me. already that is a process that

is complicated in this day and age and i wonder what your assessment is. you are going to be sitting on the trump trial or you are a witness with valuable information about donald trump's criminal acts. are you really going to come forward? >> so, picking a jury in a high profile case which i have done has distortion affects on both sides. you have people i do not want to be in the limelight. i do not want to suffer, i'm scared. all of that. you have some people, most people don't want to serve on the jury. with high profile matter where there are strong opinions you have some people who are saying i don't want to be on it. but you have the biggest fear on both sides that somebody will lie to sneak on and say they can be fair when they have

firmly held views. that is a real concern. >> the other piece of this, when you were working in the fbi, there is no sort of, there is no standard guiding procedure for what to do with oh, are you a target of a former president who is going on trial? there is no expectation you will become a target. so i would assume there is no protocol. there are no guardrails in place for you know, witnesses for jurors, or for prosecutors. is the justice department even sort of manned in a way to offer protection or some sort of insurance to these people? it doesn't sound like it is at all. >> i would say because it is such a new phenomenon, we understood certainly we saw that donald trump was going to attack prosecutors. the media. but it was short as these cases were brought, you knew that the

judges and the judicial system was going to have its turn. because donald trump will vilify. he plays the umpire. he says you know what? if i win, it is fair, and if i lose, it's not fair. so he is attacking all the judges except for judge cannon because he thinks she is favored to him. so this is such a new phenomenon. i'm not sure the justice department has a team devoted to. >> within protection. >> witness protection, not just witness protection program. but the idea you are going to really have a team that looks at attacks on witnesses. attacks on jurors and judges. and that is their main focus. you have a group doing this. and unfortunately, there is time. >> i want to talk just, you know, quickly about the larger issue of justice. as you point out, there are

attacks from the left for people from people who believe the supreme court has done something appalling, un- american. and needs to be punished wrongly. physically. because of their opinion on roe v. wade. and that betrays an uninvestment in the court or a cynicism about the court. you have trump saying the court and the justice system is acting purely politically. it's a witch hunt. the fact you have actors on both sides now casting real dispersions on the justice system, seems like a big problem. >> it is. and the problem is you don't have enough people speaking out in defense. i kept on remembering when mr. pelosi was attacked, i remember thinking this is so abominable. of course this will be widely

condemned so, i'm naive. and it is the same phenomenon. where you sit there and say who could possibly be for this? and so, it is such a sign of where we are as a country that people don't understand you can have violent disagreements in terms of how you talk about something. and you can really, really care about an issue to your core. but, that is where it ends. you voice those concerns. without society saying that is unacceptable. and that is where i really do think trump is just completely normalized what we are seeing in washington. mostly on the right. in the far left and right. making it normal and acceptable to engage in this kind of

behavior. >> that is what he is doing in his post presidency. the question is if he returns to officer, what then? andrew weissman, please do not leave yet. i have a lot more to ask you: can donald trump really declassify documents with his mind? today sort of seems like we got an answer. also ahead, i will talk to voting rights activist stacy abrams about what democrats need to do to get people to the polls. that is coming upright after the break. ht after the break.

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“the price lock, the price lock...” so, if you could change the price, change the name! it's not a lock, i know a lock. so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that's uncalled for. if you are the president of the united states, you can say it is declassified even by thinking about it. >> in 2022, we all wondered how trump's i declassified it with my mind defense would actually work in trial. today we got a glimpse of the answer. just a glimpse. today, the judge overseeing his

classified documents trial rejected the request to dismiss the case against him. his attorneys argued the presidential records act gave him the power to retain the documents. transport but aileen cannon says it does not provide a pretrial basis to dismiss any of the charges. while that might seem like cannon is ruling in favor of jack smith who has argued repeatedly it has nothing to do with the prosecution here, judge cannon left the door open for him to use the presidential records act as part of his defense during the trial. that means jurors or the judge herself could acquit trump based on his interpretation of that law. andrew, how are you

interpreting aileen cannon's move? >> it is what jack smith wanted. he wanted a decision. we say it doesn't apply at all. we want a pretrial ruling. in fact the rules say they are entitled to that. just decide one way or the other. for good. not halfway. undecideing pretrial. that it doesn't apply. but trial. who cares about that? i care about what you are going to say at trial. why? the big thing people need to understand, once the jury is sworn, double jeopardy attaches. meaning if the jury acquits or if the judge acquits, it is over. so the judge has the power once the jury is sworn to say, and it can be on an idea like the presidential records act.

so, jack smith is saying i need a decision that it doesn't apply not just pretrial because guess what? no one is deciding anything like about guilt or innocence pretrial. that will happen at the trial so i need you to know what your view is at the trial. why is she not going it? because as jack smith said with that ruling, if i disagree with it, i have appellate rights. i can go up to the 11th circuit. she is doing what ever she can to prevent an appeal. without getting into that, it is a short filing but she uses very strong language. she calls jack smith's position unjust. and she basically dirty harries it and is like go ahead. make my day if you want to go to the 11th circuit and appeal this. what do you make of that posture in the context of all of this? >> you have to remember, she has been reversed twice by the

11th circuit in scathing language. she hasn't acquitted herself well. whether it is because she is partisan or both. my opinion is it is both. that she is both inexperienced and she is consistently ruling in unlawful ways for only one side. when i say unlawful, that is not just my opinion. that is the 11th circuit. she is not helping herself by using language that is not becoming of an art of three judge. that inaccurate is a charitable way to describe it. >> and does that hold water with the 11th circuit? if jack smith can get to the 11th circuit without getting into the technicalities does he find a sympathetic audience there? >> so that is where it will

depend on the panel. so, the 11th circuit is made of a number of judges. a random group of three is chosen so you don't really know who that is beforehand. so that i can't answer. but, you always sort of say to yourself if i'm dealing with judges who are rational and fair minded, and you sort of have to take that as a basis, it is very hard to look at what she has done and say that is the correct legal answer. the pra is a civil statute. >> came about after water gate. >> here is the really key thing. it is a civil statute. this is a criminal case. civil statutes don't apply. >> andrew, you know we were talking about confidence in the judiciary.

butten ma, judge cannon, she tests the bounds of that every day. andrew, my friend, it is great to see you. >> nice to be here. still to come this evening, we will talk to obama's former white house communications director dan pfifer about what biden is saying about bibi and to bibi and if anything is about to change. plus a controversial call to democrats. we will get reaction from stacy abrams. that's next. action from stacy abrams. that's next.

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i need you to remind people of how important this election is coming up in november and ask people to register to vote or check their registration status, that would mean a lot. >> that's easiment you know i got you. >> that was vice president kamala harris and queen lateefah urging a black audience to make sure they are registered to vote this november. the democratic party has long been focused on voter registration as a core principal and it has benefited from non-partisan voter registration efforts in years past. but the washington post reports this week that there is a confidential strategy memo circulating from top donors warning if they want democrats to win in november, they need to rethink their approach. the memo reportedly cites

polling data showing the share of unregistered citizens who would likely register as democrats has declined and those who would register as republicans has risen to the point where the two groups are almost even and reportedly cites polling showing that trump is popular among unregistered voters. the post said if they were to blindly register non-voters an get them on the rolls, they would be distinctly aiding trump's quest for a personal dictatorship. the author called on donors to focus their spending instead on specific heavily pro biden populations like black americans. joining me now is the perfect person to discuss this. the great stacey abrams. the author of can you believe this? 15 books including the political thriller rogue

justice out now in paperback. you, your prolific authorship, we will get to that in a moment. but first, i just wonder what you think of this memo. there is a lot of conflict democrats feel learning about it. >> it raising an important point of the efficacy of voter registration but misses the larger picture, we should have non-partisan registration because that is how we protect democracy. getting people to own their right to their citizenship. to their ability to cast a ballot and participate in elections should be an effort by everyone because we want more americans involved. the partisan piece comes in when we want them to get the things they need and my party i believe does a better job of delivering the outcomes

communities need. however, the misunderstanding that and the tension we are hearing is that we see this as an either or. we recognized that voter registration is teaching someone how to drive or giving them the keys to a car. then you have to teach them how to drive and those components. registration gives them the keys, helping them to understand who is in charge and what is happening. then you engage them saying here is where we want to go now. now that you have those pieces. what we should be focused on is how do we engage nonvoters who believe their voices didn't matter enough to put their names on the rolls? we have to stop these reductive

argumentments. the success in georgia proves this works. what we were able to do over the course of starting in 2014 with registration, when you look at the 2016 election cycle. you had black voters considered super voters. they voted in almost every election. that number is now closer to 870,000 people. a 65% increase. that happened simply because more people got on the rolls, we kept them engaged, we made certain they understood who was responsible and what their power was. and what i would urge the democratic party to do is to lean in once again on the extraordinary success of the biden harris administration, what we have done but we cannot

get distracted on whether or not we should engage more people in our democracy. >> i do wonder what you found in that first step giving the people the keys to the car. their level of interest in driving it. in 2016, pew did some research to unregistered voters and what motivated them. 44% said they didn't want to vote. 27% said they hadn't gotten around the vote. 6% said i don't know how. 25% said no candidate inspired me. i don't know how is the easiest one to get. but the largest share here, the i don't want to vote, and, no candidate or issue inspired me. that, what is that conversation like? what do democrats or anybody interested in a functioning representative democracy like, what is the beginning of that lesson as you found it in your

experience? >> we know i don't want to vote often is an easy shorthand for i'm angry, i'm upset, i'm despairing or the people who represent me don't actually hear me. i created fair fight which is really focusing on protecting the infrastructure, governors and legislators can't have them thrown off the rolls which is what governor kemp and his cronies are doing in georgia right no such. it is about connecting the dots. i don't want to vote doesn't mean i don't know how to vote, but i don't know who to vote for or why voting matters so i created a second organization called fair count that really focuses on connecting the dots, we use the census as our point of entry, but we explain, this is the issue that you are concerned about in your community. here is who is responsible. but, if we don't do the hard

work of connecting the dots, we have stories to tell. we can explain why you should want to vote. we should ask people why don't you want to vote? what holds you hostage and what are you angry about? what disturbs you? and what would make you joyous and excited about being a part of it? one of the ways you get to inspiration is asking people what inspires them. what do you need and how can we work together to get you there? >> you have written 15 books, i guess you have all this free time between trying to save democracy, et cetera. what is the narrative to talk

about democracy or economic policy. from a story teller's perspective, what is the narrative this campaign should be focusing on if you are joe biden? >> i think they are doing it. today was the announcement of record $27 billion being invested in climate action specifically in helping low income communities access the clean energy technology that so many others can take for granted. that is going to solve real problems. to get someone a hot water heater which sounds small, but if you lived without running water in your house two months and someone on the eve of christmas says i can help you and i can make sure your house is warm and safe and comfortable and your bills are not going to go up? they will want to know why and they will tell their friends and neighbors. and that is what joe biden has accomplished. we should be telling that story but we should also be asking others what else do you need?

ask them who will deliver importantification and false promises. and who will actually deliver the goods. that's the conversation we need to have. >> who is putting in the work and delivering the goods. stacey abrams. such a pleasure to hear from you. thanks for your time tonight. >> thank you for having me. coming up, president biden says he ratcheted up the pressure in a call with israeli prime minister netanyahu today. and tonight, there has been some movement on that front. we'll have more on that coming upright after the break. upright after the break.

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inflection point. that is how one u.s. official described the phone call between president biden and benjamin netanyahu. biden pushed for quote an immediate cease fire. and for the first time ever suggested that the u.s. may condition its aid to israel unless netanyahu implements a series of specific concrete and measurable steps to address the protection of civilians in gaza. the president also labeled israel's recent killing of seven aid workers as terrible. joining me now is dan pfifer,

cohost of pod save america. dan, thank you for being here, what do you make of the read- out of this call and i guess what we will call one of the results of it which is the opening of this aid corridor? >> i think the language inflection point is exactly right. this represents a change in how the president plans to use his leverage against with prime minister netanyahu to get israel to change how it is handling civilian casualties in gaza and aid for the people in gaza. and the proof will be in the pudding. will israel follow through on this and if they don't, will the president be willing to condition aid. but tonight delivered results and that is a good thing. >> we get these sort of leaks or reporting that biden is infuriated with netanyahu and wants an immediate cease fire and that is not unimportant, it

is significant of course. in terms of the broader posture. but then there is reporting that on the same day that seven world central kitchen workers are killed, the white house approves the transfer of hows more bombs to israel. granted that was approved by congress earlier, but i mean, how much does that undercut biden's position? >> i think the shift in rhetoric and saying if you don't do a better job, we will reassess how we are helping you is the result of a very real and challenging political position for the president where he was saying things, expressing oftentimes in background leaks from white house aides his anger and frustration. and prime minister netanyahu sticking his thumb repeatedly in the president of the united states' eye. that made the president look ineffective in the eyes of the public. it was frustrating to the people in his party.

my real hope is that this represents a change in policy. because this is ultimately not a messaging problem. it is not that the president wasn't saying the right things. could he have said better things? absolutely. but it was a policy problem. the decision the president made that would be the best ability to influence how israel conducted the war was not i think proceeding as they had hoped and that israel was not being, was not doing what the white house wanted them to do. so there is a shift and i think if today's phone call represents a change in approach, that is a very positive thing substantiatively and politically for the president. >> let's talk about the politics. i agree with you that i think this was driven by policy and biden's own instincts about what to do on this. but he has borne a political cost among young people voters of color. as a political strategist, what has been the constituency that biden has been concerned about,

you know, up into the point of taking a more aggressive stance with netanyahu? what do you think as a political calculation thus far? >> i don't think it was. it was bad politics domestically on every dimension. it was an actual legitimate decision the president made because he believed this was the best way to influence israel's conduct. because he is getting hammered from the right. he is getting hammered from the left. he was looking less effective than he would like in the eyes of the folks in the middle so you see, this as a domestic political person in the white house dealing with national security issues, this is a frustration i felt all the time. it is the policy. decided on by the president influenced by his non-political national security advisers often put were based on what they believe was in the best interest of the united states globally. and global security and homeland security and all of those things but were often really bad politics so i don't

believe the president's position here. picking voters on the right over the left. it is what he thought was the best and there were political consequences to be made. what i think the conclusion is the policies networking, he is changing palsy. the change in policy i think will be better politics. it is a policy decision made here. >> as biden grappled with this, i want to remind people that donald trump is out there saying get it over with. that's the degree of detail he is offering the american public as he runs for office a third time. dan, my friend, thank you for talking about this complicated topic with me. i really appreciate it. coming up, while he was president, donald trump oversaw the separation of thousands of children from their parents at the border and tonight, he seem to be signaling a willingness to do it again. only worse. in a second term. that story is next. d term. that story is next. made by reae

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in 2018, the country was rocked by this. some of you viewers might find it very disturbing. >> that was the sound of one of trump's hallmark immigration policies. the sound of children being ripped away from their families at the u.s. mexico border. during the trump administration, more than 5,000 families were separated that we know of. the trump administration took zero steps to ensure those families could be reunited and

about 1,000 children remain separated from their families. the cruelty did not end there. during the trump administration, immigrants were detained in appalling conditions. children were kept in cages. court filings described migrant children being given rotten sandwiches and given water that smelled like chlorine. outbreaks of disease went untreated. lawyers for the administration argued in open court that they shouldn't have to provide toothbrushes and soap to migrants in their custody. treating human beings, treating children like animals. that should be the great shame of the trump administration. but instead, trump has made it part of his platform for reelection. >> the democrats said please don't call them animals. their humans. i said they're not humans. their not humans. they're animals. >> that was donald trump at a campaign rally in michigan this

week. trump has been teasing an even more radical vision for immigration in his second term. one that includes mass detention camps and deportation. while trump has stopped short of saying whether he would resurrect his family separation policy, there are signs he plans to do just that. in recent interviews trump has tried to rebrand his federal kidnapping program as a success. >> we did family separation. a lot of people didn't come. it stopped people from coming by the hundreds of thousands because when they hear family separation, they say well, we better not go and they didn't go. >> tonight, nbc news reports trump is attending a gala sponsored by an anti- immigration advocacy group featuring several architects of his family separation policies. it is important to remember what america's immigration system really looked like under donald trump and how much is still left to repair. things like the unsafe open air