and see the universe in a new way. >> more than enough for him to plan his trip for this one in 2024. he's now organized a group of 85 friends and family ranging in age from 7 to 87 for a trip to dallas. where everyone will be crossing fingers mother nature plays along. >> the analogy i give, is that a 90% partial solar eclipse is a young child playing the triangle in the school talent show. it is good. it is fun to watch. but 100% totality, that is taylor swift rocking madison square garden. >> i love that. hey listen, if you're not in the path, come back here on monday we'll do a two-hour special starting at 2:00 p.m. eastern and i'm leading it. we'll show you totality throughout the afternoon. please join us it. it will be fun. don't go anywhere. "deadline: white house" starts

right now. hi there, everyone. happy friday. it is 4:00 in new york. voter this is year face a stark choice behind curtain number one, the most notorious snake oil salesman, from the moment he descended trump tower, he sold himself to the people and the base as a successful businessman who with hire only the best people. not ome did that carefully craftic image of trump as some sort of business mogul collapse like a house of cards if the wake of tish james' uncovering years of financial fraud but trump is the first president since herbert hoover to leave office with fewer jobs in this country than when he entered office. and not to mention many of his people, those so-called best people that trump bought on, think that donald trump should never ever get close to the white house again.

now, behind curtain number two, a serious public servant surrounded by other serious public servants and officials and experts who together bring decades of experience to the table. managing what is by practically an economy that is roaring. news today that the u.s. added 303,000 jobs, that is well ahead of expectations. and that the unemployment rate fell to 3.8%. that is nearly as low as it has been in half a century. it is yet another data point in what is a remarkable string of economic successes and wins. even inflation, which soared in the wake of the covid pandemic, is down from the 2022 highs. because he's incapable of facing facts, especially in this area, trump has been spinning a version of the economy over on earth two that he calls a cesspool, he said that at a rally last month. but as cnbc points out, the numbers paint a different picture. one more in line with biden's

narrative of american economic dominance than trump's apocalyptic warnings. the biden campaign touting the great job numbers today saying president biden inherited the worst economy from trump because trump only cared about one job, his own. those folks at fox business had to admit, the economy is in pretty good shape. >> at the end of the day, we start off discussing the economy is doing better than everybody expected. we were all thinking there was a recession late last year, 12 months ago. and then you got 3% gdp growth and right now it looks like that is going to continue for a while. >> so we start today with some of our favorite reporters and friends with me here at table. nbc senior business correspondent christine romans. plus host of the on brand podcast donnie deutsche here and president of the national action

network, the reverend al sharpton is here. it is so nice to have you here. and we've interconnected and sort of known each other through different roles and i admitted in the makeup room that when i worked in republican area, i had a context of a presidential came and i want to understand from you, first, the facts and, two, the difference between what people think of biden's economy and what the facts say. >> in any era, a report like this would be received in any office of the white house as we have an "a" report card today. 300,000 net new jobs would be good. and 3.8 unemployment is a good number and broad based job gains. but there is something interesting happening here. one is the story of a strong economy resilient and actually getting better by the day by the week. accelerating job creation and beginning part of this year. and the other side where people

say they don't feel it. and i think the big reason there is that inflation story and inflation scars run pretty deep. and the white house did push out the council of economic advisers a chart that shows the story. inflation prices are rising faster than wages for a long time. for a yearar two. you could see it there. it only recently have wages been rising faster than inflation. and it might take more time for people to start to really feel that change, that switch and they might start feeling better later this year. but for now, everybody said my economy is find but everything is going in the wrong direction. >> and it is a branding problem. and you say how are you doing? are you doing better than four years ago? how is the economy? the economy sucks. and you get the job out there. the jobs and the wage growth and inflation is softening and consumer confidence is up and the unemployment rate is at a

all-time low and our gdp compared to the rest of the world, it is not rational. i think what is happening is when you say to people, how is the economy, they take that as a hell of things. i see immigrants on the street and crime is up. how are you doing? i'm doing well. how are you feeling? i'm not feeling so well and think economy has become this weird substitute for the ether out there. because the numbers are the numbers. and people say, i am doing better. so the messaging has to be not about the economy, it has to be about you. they have to take it to the voters and i think you said your entire life, the simple question, are you better off than you were four years ago. not make it about the economy. but how are you doing? >> but you know, better than anybody, that trump is answering the questions for voters and telling them about crime numbers. we could have started with the crime numbers, it is the same

story. crime is down and people are afraid to have a layover in an american city. >> which is why i keep saying, the only path for the democrats, this is not a logical thing. you have to stay however you're feeling now, this is how dark it will get. i don't know where else to go. as a marketer, as an advertiser, it is not registering. i talk to people, i talk to educators, affluent people and i give them the facts, yeah, but. yeah, but, yeah but biden sucks. he's old, so is trump. he just sucks. there is this weird lack of common sense. it is weird knack of rational thinking. and trump just plays on that. >> take me through the places where president biden can legitimately take credit for the things that are surging in the economy. >> it is interesting, the chips act, they just put all of the

money in domestic manufacturing of semiconductors and that was a bipartisan action. democrats and republicans agreed on that and that is just getting underway. i was just in arizona at an intel factory where there will be 6,000 jobs and these are good union 100,000 jobs. the white house keep going back to the people, they agree that the system isn't fair to them so they're going after junk fees and credit card late fees but those are places where they've been trying to tell people for last year, we feel your pain that you're feeling nickelled and dimed and we're lowering prices and where is the republican plan. and that is what they keep trying to focus on. >> you talk to business leaders, on and off tv, where does the affinity for the trump economy come from? >> it is so interesting, because

this time around privately what ceos will tell you is they are bracing for uncertainty in chaos if there is a second administration. >> say more. >> but by the same token, their preparing for it. and just like last time, the world did not fall apart with a trump presidency. they are worried about tariffs, that is one thing he would like to do more of. but president biden did not take off the trump tariffs either. so that is still a area where i think we'll have to see what the trump economic plan is go fog be. >> do they see the reporting and they're not all brilliant people, sorry, but a lot of them are smart. but do you understand if stephen miller is the white house chief of staff and they invoke political instability. >> ceos have been lamenting that there is not a middle.

there is not -- that both sides have moved so far. and the middle is good for american business. and they all say that. the people -- the middle and stability is good for american business. and that is what they lack. >> and we talked about it a few days ago. that if he takes over, just look at what happens. that you could be a ceo of a company, and you're daughter could tweet something negative about trump and he could go after your company. >> they're also, everyone said to me a lot could happen before november. i don't know what they think will happen before november and so right now, the companies are going great. earnings are fine and even with the high interest rates, they are still making money. record highs. >> do they credit the current administration?

>> you know, i think that presidents get too much credit and too much -- >> i agree with that. >> and honestly they're looking at a.i. and other things that are happening. and remember, we're coming out of a covid crouch. so it is hard to find out what is exactly normal yet. i also think that that covid crouch may have stolen a lot of optimism which might be one of the reasons that we're seeing so much the commune sentiment polls. >> but do they give the biden administration any credit. >> on the chips side. >> and getting the vaccine out. the idea that trump had done what biden was able to do -- >> i'll tell you that a lot of business leaders avoid crediting or blaming either of these gentleman with anything because they don't know who the next president will be. >> i want to show you what trump thought should happen to the economy. do we have that? >> we have an economy that is incredible. we have an economy that is so

fragile and it is running off the fumes of what we did. it is running off the fumes. and when there is a crash, i hope it is going to be during this next 12 months. because i don't want to be herbert hoover. >> you already had and athe only people running on fumes are the insurrectionist. what do we do with again the failure to imagine someone like that who literally said this is not a scoop. he said i hope the economy crashes in the next 12 months. >> he said out loud what his own cult followers don't want to hear. i hope economy crashes and disaster comes and then i could come in and save the economy and the country. when the fact of the matter is, we had a pandemic that he could have done things to avoid the

impact. he was in denial. he was same guy that stood on television as president of the united states, and said it will be over in two weeks. don't worry about it. and then finally he told us to take bleach. so now we're going -- i think that the collective amnesia, that a lot of americans are having, is the challenge that the democrats have to put out there, say this is the guy that you voted out. remember, now, he ran for re-election. you didn't want him back again. don't let him con you now with this boogeyman politics, the boogeyman is coming, the boogeyman is coming. he was the boogeyman. and joe biden saved us from the boogeyman. now, the boogeyman is going to tell you that we're going through the same game again. look at the numbers that was explained here. we have the lowest unemployment numbers that we've seen in maybe half a century. even in the black community, we

had 6%. higher than white, but lower than we've seen african american numbers in a long time. and you got people walking around talking about are black men going to go for trump, why? >> well why? what is the answer? >> because he's playing on style and swagger. but i think a lot of is going to crash as the biden administration gets its messaging together. but don't forget, when it is said that the lot could happen between now and november, one of the things that could happen is he could be convicted of felonies monday after next, a trial starts and you talk about the economy, do ceos want to explain to the world why a man convicted of felonies of hush money to a porn star, who sells bibles, after he goes to court defending that he had sex with a porn star.

and get my bible, i'm giving you a discount. $59.99. you don't have to pay $60. that is how low down of a con man he is. >> here is the less when we look at the numbers. it is not the economy, it is abortion and democracy. it is guttural issues. it is white issues. women are going to save us. i think biden could stand from the rooftop and hire the smartest guy in the world, guys like me to tell the economic story, it is not registering. you have to hit people in the gut. and you have to hit women and say your health care is being taken away. your right to live the way you want is being taken away and you have to hit democracy. >> aand agree with you. but here is what i think. i don't think biden should have to. because i think if you have a successful company and you have american workers, you shouldn't want them to live out the hand maid's tale. you shouldn't want what the rev

just described. if you're aneemer, you should be invested in america to not pick the guy that is running as on autocrat. i have never been so disappointed in sort of a major chunk of american civic life. >> and not only ceos, bnd i said this also, that any wealthy person who has enjoyed what this country has to offer, who -- >> who has benefited. >> that is what i'm saying. they're the ones that make me sick. that wait a second, you're willing to blow it all up just because maybe you're tax break or you want to go to mar-a-lago or whatever it is. those are the people, shame on you. shame on you for not understanding what is at stake. that you don't care if your kids could vote again. that you don't care if your granddaughter might have to go to another state or not be able to get an abortion period. shame on you. just for the buck. and those are people that i just make -- make my skin crawl.

>> i'm going so stay out of that. some of this is a siloed way that we treat business. it is not integrated into the kochgs. we know how important it is. and i wonder if you think that you're seeing anyone feel more pressures engaging in the conversation either around abortion bans and states that they have large female work forces or around voting or around -- i mean, major league baseball moved out of the state of georgia after a bill was passed and you haven't seen anything close to a boycott since. >> and there is a tight rope. if you listen to earning calls you will not hear diversity and inclusion and because of the anti-woke mob but they know what employees are demanding so there is an interesting conversation and they're having with shareholders and they know they have to have diversity and inclusion and they're not

bragging about it on conference calls any more. people 35 and under felt less confident about the economy, people 55 and older felt better. you know why? because the job market. >> the stock market is at record highs. that is good for someone 55 and older with a retirement plan and the health value is high, so there is this stability about how people feel who are oehler -- who are older. >> and that is where biden has the urgent message. >> that is where i think biden should be talking about i'm the one that brought student debt loan and trump supreme court stopped me and i still found a way to do it. he needs to just show the contrast, the advantage that he has is that trump was president for four years so you don't have to imagine what he would do. look at what he did. and when i thought about today, we had an earthquake here in new jersey that we all felt in new york, and what i thought about,

i'm looking at the television and biden is there in baltimore dealing with a crisis as he's going to other places and i thought about the crisis when trump was the president, he went down to puerto rico and threw paper towels at people from six feet away. that is what you want to have back? here, i'll throw you -- don't get near me. >> we forget the greatest hits. >> we'll make a reel. could we work on that. and his arm isn't what he used to be. it is a pleasure to have you here and i have to do a better job. i hope we could turn on you. i count on you to inject these conversations with all of the fakes and what is really going on here. it is really a treat. thank you so much. everyone else sticks around. when we come back, two sitting members of congress have reportedly been called on two explain what exactly they know about the extreme to steal arizona's vote in 2020. a big sign that the attorney general there could be very close to deciding on charges. one of the reporters who broke

the story will be with us next. plus this morning as the rev just previewed at about 10:20 a.m., did you feel that? yes, 42 million people felt a rare earthquake throughout much of the northeast. if you're from california, you know everything was okay. but it is still an omg moment. look at that. and he said he would surround himself with only the best. now a new list of quote/unquote trump's best people are emerging for what could be a potential second term starting team. who he's planning to surround himself with and more when "deadline: white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere today. k break. n'dot go anywhere today. okayn is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy. yay - woo hoo! ensure, with 27 vitamins and minerals, nutrients for immune health. and ensure complete with 30 grams of protein. (♪♪)

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did you also receive a call from u.s. representative andy biggs of arizona on the morning of january 6? >> i did. >> and what did mr. biggs ask you to do? >> i believe that was the day that the vote was occurring to each state to have certification. or two declare that the certification of the electors. and he asked if i would sign on both to a letter that had been sent from my state, and/or that i would support the decertification of the electors and i said i would not. >> up to his elbows in there and finally some accountability coming for trump's allies in congress. would were deeply involved in every facet of trying to overturn trump's defeat in 2020.

congressman andy biggs, who we just heard about, and congressman paul gosar has been subpoenaed by arizona investigators who are probing the fake electors plot in their state. the subpoenas ordered the two republicans to testify before a grand jury. there is no indication that arizona attorney general chris mays who is leading the probe is considering brings charges against either lawmakers but the subpoena themselves in conjunction with other aggressive recent months shows that may, as a democrat, has cast a far wider net had her probe than previously understood. congressman biggs was subpoenaed by the january 6 select committee but refused to comply with them. joining our coverage, one of the reporters with this scoop and this great new reporting, betsy woodruff swan. take us through what you're reporting. >> in february of this year, paul gosar, another very

conservative republican who was connected to all of january 6 efforts, communicated to the speaker of the house, mike johnson, that he had been subpoenaed by arizona attorney general chris mays. we have learned from sources that he issued a subpoena to andy biggs as well. what we don't know if either have testified to the grand jury or if they've found ways to use the constitutional tools at their disposal to try to fight back against any efforts she may have to get then to testify. what it shows that mays in her investigation has been willing to take fairly dramatic steps as she tries to get more information as special as to the activities in arizona that have not yet come to light. of course, members of congress were black boxed the january 6 select committee will find out whether or not mays was able to extract more information from them than other investigators have been. what we also know is that mays's

office has communicated to numerous of the fake electors that she is targeting them in her probe. so those people who participated in that fake elector scheme, have been told there is a decent chance that they will face dime. what we've already reported is that when some of the folks have communicated to mays office they would plead the fifth if put in front of a grand jury, mays office has said, you still have to go and make that pleading in person and we've already reported that some of those fake electors have already appeared before mays' grand jury to take the fifth. that again it an unusual step for a prosecutor to take. most prosecutors don't make people plead the fifth in front avenue grand jury. but it just shows how addressive and the approach mays and her team are taking as they target the fake electors. one other thing about makes, she was a republican until 2019. she said in an interview she

changed parties because of way that trumpism had taken over the gop. she won her election to the arizona attorney general by fewer than 400 votes in 2022. it was a total nail-biter. and now we're seeing how an extremely tiny vote margin in a very populous and purpose state is already having dramatic consequences. >> betsy, you're right, that all of the members were a black box to the january 6 select committee. but this is what they were able to learn about congressman biggs. representative biggs was involved in numerous elements of contesting the results as early as november 26th, 2020, he text marg meadows encouraging the state lectors and told meadows not to let trump concede his loss. between then and january 6 representative biggs coordinated

with arizona state representative mark finch to gather signatures from arizona lawmakers endorsing fake trump electors and contacted fake trump electors in one state seeking evidence related to voter fraud. i'm wondering if the probe in michigan or other state probes into the fake electors plot, if those are contours we should be watching and if that is getting at what they're likely going to ask these two members about? >> what is interesting about these state level probes targeting the fake electors is that they're entered territory that jack smith thus far has not entered by accusing these fake elocators of crime, and once that starts there are all sorts of avenues that the investigators could look down. and i could tell you that rusty bowers has already spoken with investigators in chris mays' office and he was totally a open book to the select committee.

but the fact that mays' office is speaking to him is another indicator of the thorough approach that she's taking into this investigation. biggs and gosar are helping to understand what happened and two of trump's key lieutenants, two of his top house allies at multiple levels of this undertaking and of course their both still prominent national figures. they have some counterparts in arizona who have not household names but could become two of the fake electors, anthony kern and state hoffman are now state senators. both of those men are in the space where mays is considering potentially bringing indictments, one of them state senator kern had a press conference outside of a courthouse in arizona within -- within the last week or two saying that he thought chris may was trying to put him in prison because he was too supportive of

trump. and these feel like stories when you talk about state lawmakers but they have consequences because arizona is essential to whoever is next president without a doubt just looking at the electoral map and it is a state where the republican party has essentially eaten itself by internal fighting over whether or not the mark finchem or the john mccain wing is going to win out. the john mccain wing is defunct and democrats have galloped over republicans in a host of state wide races in arizona with thus far minimal line of letting up. but who knows what happens in the fall. >> and addicted to losing. thank you very much for spending time with us and thank you for this great reporting. we'll stay on the story. the table sticks around. republican leadership on the hill means some of the fringiest embracing members of congress, the latest claims coming from inside of the house, next. e, ne. to be in our hpv vaccination ad.

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-was that after i texted the age to screen was now 45? [both] because i said cologuard®! -hey there! -where did he come from? -yup, with me you can screen at home. just talk to your provider. [both] we'll screen with cologuard and do it my way. cologuard is a one-of-a-kind way to screen for colon cancer that's effective and non-invasive. it's for people 45+ at average risk, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider for me, cologuard. congressional republicans have been on their back foot when to comes to january 6. with fln intentional refusal to accept the facts that led to the violentin surection. clay higgins accused the fbi of entrapping rioters and said on a podcast that ghost buses took

undercover agents to wash d.c. and then they tricked the rob rioters into carrying out the violent assault. luke broad water in the"new york times" said even by a conspiracy theorist standards, claims tand out. and if you think he's just another loon, nope, not in mike johnson's caucus. "the new york times," from the fringe of our increasingly fractured congress has elevated him. they made him the chairman overseeing border enforcem and speaker johnson named him as tasked for trying to remove the homeland security secretary from office in a senate trial set to take place next week. we're back with donnie and the rev. they're playing government people, but they don't do anything for the people.

>> they're playing this kind of sportsman like game. like this is some card game or some table or moving game like chess or checkers. and they're not even thinking about people. if you look at the fact that this congress has been the most ineffective congress in terms of passing legislation or getting anything done, that you either have one of two republicans saying what are we doing here and what have we gotten done and that is the issue. and people are not even looking at that any more. we are being driven now but our emotions, and not thinking and not looking at what is going on. and i think that that is what is dangerous and what scares someone like me because when you have people that are not thinking, the loudest voices or the flashiest kind of can man, which donald trump is, could lead them astray. that is how this happens.

>> well the other way it happens is republicans successfully move over to the window faster than democrats could get them sfz in a room and do the things that democrats value, build consensus and make a strategy. the fact is, that january 6 was a deadly insurrection in which trump supporters beat cops with flagpoles, full stop. i don't know who this guy is. he's telling lunatic stories because even karl rove knows if the democrats focus on this, january 6 is a huge loser for republicans. let me show you what he had to say. >> if they were smart, they would take the january 6 and go hard at it and say, he wants to pardon these people who attacked our capitol and what those people did when they violently attacked the capitol, in order to stop a constitutionally mandated meeting of the congress to accept the results of the electoral college is a stain on

our history and every one of those sons of bitches that we find we ought to try and find them and send them to jail. and if -- and one of the critical mistakes is that donald trump is now said i'm going to pardon those people because they're hostages. no they're not, they're thugged. so look, i'm a republican, i don't want to have a democrat president, i want to have a republican president. but we're facing as a country a decision and everybody gets to make it, as to what kind of leadership we're going to have and to me it is a mistake on the part of the trump campaign to allow the president's impulses to identify himself with the people who assaulted the capitol rather than people who stand for law and order. >> i don't care if it is karl rove, he's addressing the problem with the trump campaign. problem with the biden campaign is that there is timidity. when a trump going to a funeral

of a law enforcement official, joe biden should have the people that support it and it shouldn't be political but it is because donald trump made it political and there is still timidity that karl rove called b.s. on him. >> and we could criticize trump without saying and we could criticize biden. what i still can't get at and it is not so different than the economy, why isn't this registered. people have seen this videotape. >> we have eight -- on election day people care about what they tell them. >> i'm asking, in order to -- but this is the trillion dollar question. understood to understand why it is not registering, we have to figure out what else is going on here. i'm a marketer. and i'm trying to sway the person in front of me. and here is this tape. look at what trump did, they

killed cops and tried to take over the government. look at what -- and it doesn't register. so what i keep bringing up, the question, until we answer that question, the facts and the videotape and the reality is not real. so, i wish we actually have a sociologist, psychologist at this table. >> well let me give you someone in that category. sarah longwell, the republican voters are looking for permission structure. i would say that karl rove just gave democrats a permission infrastructure to pursue the hell of january 6 as a winning strategy. >> i keep coming back to that something is not registering. and we have -- i don't -- by the way, i've sat with dozens and dozens of people and said january 6, look at what he cause and they go, ah. you know, there are some crazy people. there is an irrationality that i

think we have to start -- we, the people that believe in what we believe and are trying to sway minds and hearts, there has got to be a different way into the psyche because to your point, people are going to believe what -- i have a -- the anet benning thing. >> not too many people care about -- an that is an activist mind as well. activists don't get what they want in the first year of an effort or the first ten years sometimes. sometimes it is 40 years down the road. the idea that eight months out doesn't mean anything. i don't accept that. i worked on campaigns until the last 12 hours. >> i'm saying -- >> i know what you're saying. >> i think you're right and when you brought up jack, i said for years we need police reform. and for people to be held accountable, we're fighting against a crime because we're the majority of the people getting -- becoming victims in

our community, but police should not -- those out of line should be dealt with. it took them seeing a tape with a someone with a knee on their neck and they thought about it, that could be me. and i think that that is what we are facing. when will the moment come, because i agree with donnie, they're not dealing with, but when they say wait a minute, that is me that is there. i think a lot of the mistake that the democratic party is made and those of biden is this beltway talk, this abstract. you have to make people understand, this is you. that is your kid that went to school and tried to become something, that was getting beaten up on january 6. that is your kid that was the officer that was standing there, that could have got killed. saying you ran mike pence down the hall doesn't make it personal. if you put the people in the uniform and make it personal, people start saying, wait a minute. and you're excusing that trump,

i think you've got to put it in everybody's living room and bedroom that we're talking about you, we're not talking about what happens in d.c. >> i associate myself with everything you both just said. it was felt over a huge flock of the country this morning. one of the largest east coast kwark earthquakes happen today and we'll try to understand why it happened here after the next brake. -dad, what's with your toenail? -oh, that...? i'm not sure...

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. this really happened. for some 500 miles along the american east coast, from our nation's capitol in washington, d.c., all the way up to portland, maine and beyond it was the question on everyone's lips. did you feel that? that around 10:30 a.m. was an earthquake measuring 4.8 on the -- magnitude on the shallow fault system in new jersey. a trembler according to the u.s. geological survey. for 35 seconds the earth shook igniting concern here in new york. for construction and subways make rumbling feel routine. this video of the statue of liberty was provided by earth cam. the good news is appears that everything is fine and no report to major damage to key infrastructures. to our friends in the west coast, yes, i'm from there and wee deal with this all of the time and we don't get get out of bed unless it is over a 7, but it is historic because it is so

rare. you have to go back to end of the revolutionary war, almost 250 years to find an earthquake that hit the state of new jersey harder. it was a remember where you were moment for us here in new york. mere days before another one, the solar eclipse, welcome to 2024. joining our conversation an expert on earthquakes from california state university at bakersfield, where they know what they feel like, matthew harman is here. so tell me what happened this morning and does it mean anything, does it mean this could happen again or is that not something that you could learn from today? >> yeah, earthquakes happen on the east coast. they are much less frequent than where i'm from here in california. but they do happen occasionally. and we could see that if we look at the records and the catalogues. there are some patches of earthquakes that happen along the east coast. and so, you know, even though they're less frequent and there one is fairly small, probably wouldn't pay attention to it if it was in california, it is something that a lot of people

noticed on the east coast because it is rare. >> so i lived along the san andreas fault so i saw it the way you did. but i want to understand if the science has moved to understand connectivity. is there any connection between the earthquake in taiwan and what happened today on the east coast? >> yeah, these are always logical things to ask when we have big earthquakes in short succession, but they're too far away from space and time to be related with each other. but i was working on the tie would be earthquake for the past 48 hours and there is interesting things about that. so when i woke up this morning and there was news about a new earthquake, i assumed it was an after shock. i had no idea it was the east coast of the u.s. and that is something like 40, 45 million people would have felt it. so that came as a big surprise to me. >> are there places that go from

being rare sights of earthquakes to common? does that happen? could new york become a place that sees these more frequently? >> probably not on human time scale. we do see human activity where we could do things like induce earthquakes, who a file, oklahoma had more earthquakes than california but that is unlikely to happen along the east coast. it is not a active plate boundary and not enough deformation to generate a lot of seismic activity. that said, we do see infrequent and significant damaging earthquakes. >> thank you and i'm sure this is been a busy day and week for you. thank you for spending some time. >> could i just make one more -- >> yes, please. >> trump has been selling himself as a god like figure for last week. god took the message today that the epicenter was right near the trump national golf course.

and there was an earthquake there. i think if we don't take that as a message, we're not paying attention. >> so my first thought -- >> that they're going to ask for a delay in his trial now that new york is earthquake ready and we may have another earthquake and he can't come. >> so after covering it for nine years i could see the storms coming. i did not see the conspiracy theories from eric balling and other people after the bridge attack coming. i didn't think that they would go to all of the dark places. my first thought was how will the crazy right turn this into some political moment, which of course our experts tell us it was not. we'll be right back. we have to sneak in a quick break. thank you very much for spending time with us.

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the cabinet we're going to have all best people. >> we need to get the best and the finest. >> we're going to work so hard. we're going to have the best people in the world. >> high, again, everybody. it is 5:00 in new york. he said it over again and the voters believed him. that was from the 2016 campaign promising to surround himself with the best people. and we'll let this high turnover rate speak for itself at the trump white house, but now as the four timed indicted disgraced ex ever ex-president eyes another term, he would expect his definition of the best people to have changed. he values most now is simply undying loyalty to him. and dedication to maga movement. take what he just did at the rnc installing his daughter-in-law in a staunch election denier to lead the rnc as a mol model. if he does win back the white house, he will fill the cabinet

with those who share his goal as a anti-democratic policy agenda. people like jeffrey clark, who is a potential attorney general, a former trump doj official who attempted to overthrone the results and help keep trump in power and landing clark in legal hot water as he could be momented away from being disbarred. a disciplinary panel in washington has found that jeffy clark has violated ethic rules to try to subvert the 2020 election and it could lead to suspension or even permanent revoking of clark's license to practice law. and then there is paul manafort. he's rumored to be in the running for a campaign adviser.

and stephen miller is overseeing plans to focus on anti-white racism. he would likely play a key role in a second trump white house. and there is brand-new reporting in the guardian that takes another look at a potential front-runner for something big. rick grenell is currently running a shadow foreign policy campaign that is alarming experts, quote, grenell who served as an ambassador to germy an the acting director of national intelligence during trump's first term has carve carved a niche as the articulator and chief of noble affairs that appears to echo his political masters voice. a veteran washington foreign policy and arms control specialist told the guardian this, quote, there are many aspect to what grannel is doing, one is grift, looking for business deals in serbia where trump has long standing business interests and trump is helping him pursue this and another is more sinister.

it looks as though grenell is trying to build up a authoritarian network to form access that trump might govern by reaching from putin to erdogan. all of those democratic forces and using democracy to overthrow democracy. we start with some of our favorite reports and friends. from fox and author of the agenda how a republican supreme court is reshaping america, plus contributor and columnist charlie psychs is back. and also attorney general for national security at the justice department, marry mccord is here. and "new york times" reporter eric lipton is here with great reporting on one of the folks that we just mentioned in a second. i want to start with you, ian, and the failure to take this all in. you hear he's got an affinity

tor autocrats and he really likes orban but trump gets away with more than a normal politician because he's viewed as hapless and districted and he has folks working on this stuff all day every day. >> yeah. i mean, i think one of the biggest challenges that those of you who would prefer not to have a second trump administration have is that the first administration happened and it wasn't great, but it didn't end in a authoritarian rule of the united states. not everyone who worked if the first trump administration was a maga authoritarian. there are plenty of generals so that they think that trumps are macho. second term will not look like that. first time around, trump didn't think he would win. none of the republican

institutions, the heritage foundation thought he would win so they didn't come up with a list of people that they could hire. second time around, they are doing that work. first time around, trump didn't know anyone in washington. so he didn't know who to hire. now he knows who his loyalists are. that is who he's going to appoint and put on the bench. so the second term, i mean, you're going to be looking at a much more authoritarian regime than the first term. >> and carly, it goes beyond more effective people moving us toward authoritarian so all of the people that were so far right they were disdainful to those in the center left. none of them -- it is so bad that mike pence is not voting for him and neither are any of the other people that served in his cabinet. it is hard -- it is all relative. rear going to choose between a republican or democrat, no, between a republican who is so

repulsive to his own former vice president that he will not vote for him for the first time in american political history. >> right. and you're hearing the same sort of things from his former national security adviser. it is interesting looking back at 2017, the original trump administration was staffed with a lot of normal republicans, a lot of generals, a lot of people who were very conventional. but i think that donald trump and his inner circle have decided that is one of the reasons that he did not succeed more. that he did not surround himself with the chemical loyalists, the people hike rick grenell and stephen miller and jeffrey clark and i think that is the big difference. that he doesn't want any of the convectional and he doesn't want the mike pences of the world, he wants people who will do his bidding. and i think that people need to think about that. rick grenell is basically a

jumped up internet troll tv personality. the fact that he was acting director of the national intelligence is just one of the most remarkable things. if we would have said this 10 years ago that he would be the bast ambassador to germany or stephen miller is the architect of domestic policy including the -- what is -- the policies on border, people would have said these are exactly the kind of people you don't want near the levers of power and these the kinds people who he will bring back into a second trump term. >> mary, there was some incredible work done by the select committee on the sort of end game strain that trump put on other life long national security experts. but to charlie's point, you didn't have all of the agencies run by kash patel, and rick

grenell. they were there. they weren't running the cia or the pentagon. in a second term, they would be. could you just describe that sort of clash, not just of values and cultures of but those who want to protect americas lull in a democracy and as a democracy and what their promising to do on day one. >> well that is what is so scary about this, right. as ian laid out, the list that they're coming up with now are the most extreme people. they are a lot of good people who thought they could sort of keep the government, you know, within the rails, right, and keep the institutions and protect the institutions and abide by norms an the rule of law and when trump realized you're not going to do my bidding, he got rid of them. and we might need to worry. people might think how bad could it be because anybody who he

appointed to position in his cabinet will have be confirmed by senate. well, putting aside for the moment that, you know, both houses of congress have quite a bit of their own turmoil in polarization, mr. trump toward the second half of the administration said to heck with getting my nominees confirmed. i'll just abuse the acting process, right. and so he used vacancies to -- and he said to just appoint acting people, and i like acting, basically, because i could get rid of them if i don't like what they're doing. so, we won't -- there couldn't be much of a check, i think, on those he appoints. i think we'll see the most extreme people. and at the very beginning of his administration he had appointing mike flynn as his national security adviser. mike flynn didn't make it more than a few months because he lied to the fbi about the conversations he was having with those within russia's

government, about things that were going to be taking place after mr. trump became the president. now, in this environment, would that result in mr. trump firing mike flynn? i don't think so. and the other thing that we have to worry about, besides the leaders of the departments and agencies including our national security agencies, is what he's promising to do to the civil service. get rid of people who are not willing to be loyalists. and that is got to be very concerning, too. eric, you've written about a piece of this that doesn't get much attention but john bolton wrote about it when he wrote his tell-all that bill barr went to extraordinaries lengths to try to get published and i shared with bill barr about the potential of foreign policy has been corrupted by business interests there turkey. in a second trump term, there would be no guardrails on the mixing of u.s. foreign policy and commercial business

interesting either. i think a lot of people worry and i want to bring back into the conversation a story we shared when you broke it and put this into the mix. the plan by jared kushner to redevelop in belgrade echoed interest from donald trump a decade ago for a similar proposal pushed during his white house term. rick grenell, a special envoy pushed a related plan during the trump administration that serbia and the united states worked to rebuild the defense ministry site. and he argued in favor of using american investments while he was still serving in his official capacity as an american diplomat in 2020. according to transcripts and a recording of remarks during several government news conferences, it is harder to get at, this recording is extraordinary because it does that, but talk about this story an the sort of comingling of

official diplomatic roles in the way you present yourself around the world and business deals? >> yeah, this is quite striking because first you have donald trump when he was a private citizen, before he was running for president, and when he expressed an interest in perhaps building a hotel in the center of belgrade. that plan did not come to fruition. but then when rick grenell was working as a special envoy to serbia and kosovo, he made a proposal to redevelop that same exact site. that doesn't happen. now in a private sector, rick grenell is working with jared kushner and yet again the same site, they're building a hotel. so you have private citizen trump proposing a hotel in one place, rick grenell, while a diplomat proposing the united states help redevelop that site and now rick grenell working with jared kushner. so it is -- there was a mixing of activities in the private sector to the government to the

private sector again. and then turkey, what happens there, you have the folks in the justice department pressuring the local prosecutor to drop a case against a state owned bank. this is when president trump was in office. and the u.s. attorney and in new york trying to resist that. but erdogan was pressuring trump and in this case then the justice department was pressuring the u.s. attorney. so i have a government official urging trump to intervene and that happens and then in the first administration. so, it is to be seen how this plays out, if in fact he goes back to the white house. but there is this comipgling of duties that raises questions that we've been examining over time. >> and ian, we focus on the autocrat tools that trump talks about the most. right. wielding his justice department to prosecute his political

enemies but what eric is describing is in some ways perhaps the part of being an autocrat or a dictator that create the more lore for trump to enrich him and himself. and there was great reporting about how his hotels were the ones that the secret service had to use or that refuelling stops had to happen near the scotland golf property. people got at it a little bit. but if you're talking about an absence of any guardrails an eliminate of all of the norms and national security agencies and not even a ruiz of any ethics, this is what may appeal to him the most. >> i think the most important thing to understand about donald trump, he doesn't have an ideology. he's just greedy. and like one thing that it means that he will bring in extreme

ideologies that someone who had a moral compass, would say that person goes to far and he will use the government to enrich himself. it will create vehicles like his hotels, that foreign diplomats could stay at or trump social that they could invest in. so they could get a ride and then the other thing that we have to worry about, this is one of my biggest concerns, we have a second trump term, is that trump lost a lot of lawsuits in his first term. he is going to appoint many judges if he's president again. the judges who he's already appointed will be there. they weren't there at the beginning of his term. so the cores are already trumpier than they were the first time around. and on top of that, he knows which judges to appoint this time. not every judge that he appointed the first time around, he delegated judicial selection to the federalist society and the federalist society wasn't necessarily on board with everything that trump want.

all of the personal enrichment. but now he knows who the judges are that he could appoint. think of someone like ilene canyon and has asked like one of the defense attorneys and this judge down in texas who tried to ban an abortion pill and rubber stamp any order that republicans ask him to issue. he knows who to appoint so he could get away with anything and that means when he pursues an agenda of personal grief and enrichment, no one is going to be there to stop him. >> it is such a good point. mary, i want to show you one more piece of sound on rick grenell, because the guardian is so on the nose here and the next phase in the grenell conversation will be what is he going to do with it? will he make him the head of the fbi, state department, because he will be viewed as someone that in this reporting that eric has done of wearing dual hats, people should remember his role

in trying to over turn a free and fair election in the words of his own fellow administration staffer chris krebs, most secure in american history. here is what he was caught doing? >> rick grenell, we're live on msnbc, you could talk about the evident you're claiming thousands of illegitimate votes here in nevada. what is the -- >> you should go in and ask the question of the -- >> no. >> you guys just made the claim and you said there is no election observers. and it is democratic and republican observers and mr. grenell. former and acting dni, where is the evident of the fraud. you haven't presented any evident of fraud? so we're live on msnbc you said thousands of illegitimate ballots. thousands of illegitimate ballots? where are they? >> not a protector of america's democracy and now thanks to this great reporting, top of trump's list, mary, for perhaps the key

national security role. >> yeah, and you know there is another role that he could have have that doesn't even require going in front of the senate and that is national security adviser. right. and that is a whole -- the person in that role speaks daily with world leaders and has the ear of the president all day long, all night long. because national security is one of the president's major top priorities. every morning the president gets a daily brief and he's sitting with his national security adviser. so, to hear that kind of things that rick grenell, look back on what he's done in the past and see the engagements he's having now overseas which do seem to be very transactional in nature and to hear him to be so dismissive of protecting democratic processes, you know, certainly needs to be raising alarm bells about what he would do if he were in a position like national security adviser or one of the

cabinet positions you were mentioned earlier. and you know, these are things that people need to know. before they go to the polls. i mean, all of us talk about this all of the time. but it is just unclear to me how much of this is really sinking in and getting out there to the public. >> well we'll stay on it and in the public's defense they have seb months to start taking all of this in. no one is going anywhere. when we come back, the disgraced ex president's foreign policy in real life right now on the golf course. how he stands to cash in by hosting a golf tournament bank rolled by the saudis. that story is next. and later, if there is someone who thinks the 2020 election was stolen or that january 6 didn't matter, you now have two choices for president this november. we'll tell you how robert kennedy jr. is revealing his true colors on the issue we cover on this program almost daily. protecting democracy. so "deadline: white house" returns after a quick break. don't go anywhere. returns after a quick break. don't go anywhere.

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well alarm bells are ringing loudly among the ethics interested segment of the population about the financial ties and assistance donald trump may be getting from the saudis. the liv golf brings questions about foreign policy to his ties to the saudi government whose sovereign well fund is backing the tournament at his resort and set up by jared kushner, from "the new york times," trump spoke recently with saudi arabia leader crown prince, two people briefed on the discussion said that biden administration has been working on a middle east

peace plan. it is not clear what they discussed. the reporting adds, that the indirect revenue from the trump family could be considerable on display this week at doral where hotel occupancy is up and they decline to sayre what shares the trump family gets or other payments it received. a liv golf spokesperson said the arrangement was comparable terms with any other u.s. venue. we're back with eric lipton, who and mary and charlie as well. eric, what could you tell us about what is happening and what is your reporting detailing some of the concerns on the ethics foreign policy money front. >> i think what is happening that jeer entering a period again where so much of the business endeavors that donald trump has engaged in, before he was in office and since he left

office, everything now comes with a potential for it creating at least an appearance of a conflict of interest. and for a while, we -- the attention of the public and other government officials was on his activities in the aftermath of the election and but not as much about what he was doing as a business man, because he was a private citizen. but now that he is the presumptive nominee, he's still engaged in the private aekt sector and these will create a real conflict of interest. so in the case of liv golf, they have three tournaments at his golf course and again this weekend and we're talking about a million dollars a piece going to the trump org to cover the cost and there are occupancy at the hotel, and restaurants and other revenue sharing that is going on.

and so, you have the liv golf that is paying money to the family of the presumptive nominee for the republican presidential nomination. it is just -- on its face, that is seems problematic when this is the same person who could potentially very soon again be in charge of foreign policy as it relates to the middle east. so, i mean, i think we kind of re-entered this period of examining these conflicts of interest. and it is only just beginning. >> eric, i'm thinking back to -- and you're right, he's out of office and he's the presumptive nominee makes clear in his own words, his deep interest in returning to office, i'm thinking too, though of his statements in the new york civil fraud trial where he said that his valuations of mar-a-lago were because the saudis would pay anything for it. if we take trump by his own word, he's made clear that the saudis will pay whatever he

wanted for mar-a-lago. so a deeper understanding of the financial, some of the money that flows between the sovereign wealth fund associated with mbs and the trump orbit? >> it is just sort of odd to me as a reporter that has written a number of these reports. and building trump villas and a golf course and in oman and you have liv golf that had four tournaments in the last year approximately at his venues in the united states. and then you have the same wealth fund that is backed both his former secretary of treasury nunchin, and his son-in-law. so there is just a lot -- now again, this is one of the richest countries in the world with an oil backed sovereign wealth fund that has hundreds of

billion dollars and investing all over the world. but there is a frequency of this relationship that, again, makes us wonder, as reporters and as the public, as to what is behind this. why are they so interested in backing the trump family and it is something that we'll continue to examine. >> and you know, charlie, there is something so -- it is actually sad, i was going to say comical, but it is sad. trump's political reflex is to goose white grievance, that is his one trick. while he's lining his pockets literally and figuratively with mountains of saudi cash. >> well, an it is also alarming because he is talking with mbs, what is he talking about? what is he promising? what is he saying that he will do for the saudis and obviously the ties go very, very deep. and i guess let me put this for blunty. i think the american people have

a right to know whether or not the murder of jamal khashoggi is trying to buy off the future president of the united states. that is -- that teams -- that seems like it would be beyond the pail of any normal scandal. you have someone desperate for cash an money an it is very clear, his hotel business is in decline and reliant on golf and the golf, his golf courses are reliant on the saudi money. they have been engaged in these -- in this conflict of interest, but what part of the national interest might he be surrendering. what promises is he making? is he in fact doing anything to undermine this country's peace initiative in the middle east? we are in completely unprecedented, once again, territory but the implications

are alarming because what does he expect in return for all of this investment and this largesse. >> there is the $64 million question that hangs over everything that happens over the next seven months. this conversation to be continued with all of your help. ian and mary and eric, thank you for starting it off. charlie sticks around. when we come back, for fin curious about the presidential candidacy of a guy named rfk jr. he revealed a lot about himself this week and he might be ideology a same he's twin with donald trump. we'll explain after a quick break. don't go anywhere. switch to t-mobile, and we'll pay off your phone. and upgrade you to one of the latest 5g phones, free. [music playing] tiffany: my daughter is mila.

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so you are a voter and you think for the coming election is a candidate who has downplayed the violent insurrection on january 6, you don't have to two choices. curtain number one or two. curtain number one, the disdprased ex president. who planned an insighted and stoked the violence of that day. but you have another dhois, you could pick curtain number two and that is conspiracy theorist robert kennedy jr. he's making a third party bid for president. if you heard before -- about it. and he started peddling anti-vax

theories andize views have become more stupid and extreme. other members of the kennedy family have come out calling his bid for the presidency, quote, dangerous to our country. and yesterday, his campaign was forced to disavow itself and so sending fundraising emails referring to january 6 people as activists saying, this, quote, this is the reality that every american citizen faces from ed snowden to julian assange to the january 6 activists, sitting in a washington, d.c. jail cell. strips of their constitutional liberties. please help our campaign call out the ill liberal action of oiz own government. his campaign released a statement blaming their own campaign, specifically a marketing contractor and saying the emails do not reflect kennedy's personal views but

here is how he referred to january 6 in past. in his own words. >> it was more dangerous to our republic, these, you know, the yahoos who invaded that building, on january 6, which, by the way, what is the worst thing that could happen, right. you could rebuild a capitol. you know, you eliminate the constitution, there is really nothing left in america. >> you characterize january 6 as an insurrection? is that a word you could use? >> i don't know. i've seen all kinds of, you know, sort of contrary evidence and i don't -- i have not drilled down on it. >> today in an apparent trip to clean up, walk back, all of those comments, not just the fundraising emails, but robert kennedy jr. released a statement on the events of january 6 that reads in part, quote, i'm

concerned about the possibility that political objectives motivated the vigor of the prosecution of the january 6 defendants. as president, i will appoint a special council to investigate whether prosecutorial discretion was used to political ends in this case. i'm glad he cleared it up. joining our conversation, "new york times" political correspondent paul goal and author of the prompt 2024 newsletter alexi is with us and charlie is still here. michael gould, what makes rfk send out the clean-up if these are his views? what alarms went off in that world? >> i think that the email and the subsequent retraction of the email created space for him to actually have to clarify his position on what happened on january 6 and where he stands. and i think something that maybe coming to the forefront that rfk has gotten a lot of attention

over the last year for running, for being a member of kennedy family but there is not much known about what his views actually are. >> and we'll try to share some of them with our audience. because i have to admit, i hadn't scratched too far beneath the whacky surface myself. and let me just show our viewers some more of this. this is rfk jr. in his own words on pardoning the january 6 insurrectionists. oh, i'm sorry, this is the transcript. i would not comment on that, rfk jr. said, that is not something that i would comment on until i'm president of the united states. i intend to use the pardon power, you could extend that to those who riots on january 6 and he said, quote, i would look at individual cases. he's clearly, again, a trump alternative if you want to treat the insurrectionists and there

was some great reporting in politico what they did. they took flagpoles to the eyes and ears and heads of police officers and cops an sprayed them with chemical irritants, and these are not as trump might say the best people. but they've been turned into political hostages in the fictional earth on which trump lives and what is interesting and what raises to our level of wanting to turn to it, is robert kennedy lives there too. >> yeah, you know, as i'm listening to your segment here, i'm thinking, the rfk jr. clean-up wasn't a clean-up at all. >> right. >> it mainly referred to him as activist. but his clarification where he said he's going to appoint a special counsel, is clearly me maga adjacent on that entire issue. aid don't have any data here,

but i'll take the rather con tearan position, i know the conventional wisdom that is rfk jr. poses the greatest threat to joe biden. i think the more he talks, the more we'll find he appeals to the kind people that would otherwise be in trump land, who would support donald trump that he's going into people buying into the alternative reality of what happened on january 6. the facts that he's even floating the idea of pardoning people who attacked on the capitol in an attempt to over turn the election, would beat and tased cops and used bear spray on cops, who caused the injury and deaths of police officers. that tells you that he's not competing for the centrist voters, he's not competing for biden votes. he's competing for people who would be trump supporters in november. now whether he'll succeed, i don't know. but that is clearly the space he's occupying right now and his

clean-ups don't seem to be changing that in any way whatsoever. >> yeah, i want to come back to your reporting. because the person who agree with him is donald trump. you wrote this. trump asserted that kennedy's woo be a boon to his own effort to help biden and they show kennedy drawing support from independent supporters that could be hard for trump and biden and he's asked his advisers selecting rfk as his number two. and this is the anti-vax conspiracy theories and january 6 was a good day in american history kinds of voter sentiment, isn't it? >> i think what is clear is that no one really knows how prominent robert kennedy jr. campaign will effect either candidate. trump would much more support

him when kennedy was running against joe biden and as soon as kend shifted gears, trump was more critical. it is interesting after months of silence trump finally felt the need to say something and he's insisting that kennedy is a liberal, almost as a way ofushing him in the lane of people who miebt might be interested in joe biden but it is clear from his position on vaccines from his position on january 6 that he also has a lot in common with people who might have backed donald trump and we know there are people who supported trump in the past that are tired of him now and those voters might be attracted to robert kennedy. >> alexi, the democrat angst about rfk is rooted in the name. that is a 1988 concern. because we live in sort of joe rogan's america, if you will. and everybody knows who rfk is, what he believes and it is not a world view shared by any democrats. it is the trump world view. >> yeah, but i think kind of to

michael's reporting an the trump campaign saying they have polling that shows rfk jr. could take independents from trump and biden equally, he's going for the folks that hade biden and trump equally. he's going for the people that feel disaffected or unhappy with the situation, of course, the statement that he put out today as you all have noted sounds more maga than it does as someone trying to get those middle of the road independent swing voters in the tates that he would need to win. and also let's just remember while he's trying to pivot to the general election by naming a vice presidential candidate alongside him, just the other week, the impact on the scale of the impact he'll have in 2024 depended on ballot access and his team is trying to get on ballots. there is one state confirmed in which he's on the ballot. so you could hope that people might write in his name but he has a long way to go before he's

even considered a legitimate operation in the eyes of voters. >> alexi, as usual, it is right. i have to sneak in a break but i want to ask all of you whether and if we should even be talking about him in your view as journalists. no one is going anywhere. we'll be right back. ok y'all we got 10 orders coming in... big orders! starting a business is never easy, but starting it 8 months pregnant... that's a different story. i couldn't slow down. we were starting a business from the ground up.

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when you join the cause, your $10 monthly donation can help communities in need of lifesaving treatments and nutrients, prevent children from dropping out of school. support our work with communities and governments to help children go from short term surviving to long term thriving. and now, thanks to special government grants, every dollar you give can multiply up to ten times the impact. that means more food, water, medicine and help for kids around the world. you'll also receive a free tote bag to share your support for children in need. having your childhood eaten away by hunger is unimaginable. get fed up. call us now or visit getfedupnow.org, today. well there goes michael and alexi and charlie. all three of you have done more

on rfk jr. than i have. i've been reluctant to stick my toe into -- i know he's seriously running in his head. and i know he could seriously impact the candidates biden and trump. but i've had a hard time navigating when and how much and i wonder, dharly, what is your take or advice on this? >> you know, i have mixed feelings about it. rfk jr. has one of the most storied names in american politics. and depending on his ballot access, you have to take -- you have to at least keep an eye on him. but, look, the reality is that 2024 is a two-person race. it is a choice between joe biden and donald trump. and one of the big stories of week was the failure of the know labels effort to mount a -- to mount a serious third party bid and that crashed and burned in spectacular fashion because ultimately any third party, fourth party bid is going to be a side show and it comes down to

the main event. and i think that we need to keep our focus on it. but any time you know somebody names robert f. kennedy jr. on the ballot, he's going to draw a certain amount of interest and needs some scrutiny. especially every time he opens his mouth he exposed something about himself that is not -- that is perhaps not flattering but which voters and viewers of this network need to hear about. >> yeah, michael gould, you are a star and you scooped everybody on the santos story and you've written some smart stories on rfk. your thoughts on who he is and why he should pay attention? >> well, i think >> well, i think if you look at the polls, with the caveat that polling on third party candidates is always a little fuzzy, he's polling higher than any third party candidate has in years. he has name recognition on both sides of the aisle. when you think how trump shifted the alignment of the republican party, there are a lot of

working class voters that like the kennedy name. the think i will say, it a es so hard to know what's going to matter by november. when you look at some of these states in 2020, in wisconsin, 20,000 votes, georgia, 12,000 votes. any candidate polling at 15% could be enough to move the needle in one direction or another. that's why it's important we let people know what this man's views are. >> lexi, last word. >> with someone like that, it's not important to cover just what he's saying but who he's speaking to. i have written previously about how he talks about being against vaccines and this distrust in government and medical professionals is a way for him to try to appeal to black voters. he talks about it as a civil rights movement and medical racism. it's important to look at not just the crazy things he's saying, which is easy to dismiss, maybe even the more calculated or sinister ways he's selling that to voters, trying

to appeal to what is a real deep rooted racism and fear that black folks have but twisting it in a way that is just beneficial to his controversial conspiratorial views. >> thank you all so much for that. a quick break for us. we'll be right back. ick break fs we'll be right back.

ava: i was just feeling sick. and it was the worst day. mom was crying. i was sad. colton: i was diagnosed with rhabdomyosarcoma. brett: once we got the first initial hit, it was just straight tears, sickness in your stomach, just don't want to get up out of bed. joe: there's always that saying, well, you've got to look on the bright side of things. tell me what the bright side of childhood cancer is. lakesha: it's a long road. it's hard. but saint jude has gotten us through it. narrator: saint jude children's research hospital works day after day to find cures and save the lives of children with cancer and other life-threatening diseases. thanks to generous donors like you, families never receive a bill from saint jude for treatment, travel, housing,

or food, so they can focus on helping their child live. ashley: without all of those donations, saint jude would not be able to do all of the exceptional work that they do. narrator: for just $19 a month, you'll help us continue the life-saving research and treatment these kids need. tiffany: no matter if it's a big business or just the grandmother that donates once a month, they are changing people's lives. and that's a big deal. narrator: join with your debit or credit card right now, and we'll send you this saint jude t-shirt that you can proudly wear to show your support. nicole: our family is forever grateful for donations big and small because it's completely changed our lives and it's given us a second chance. elizabeth stewart: saint jude's not going to stop until every single kid gets that chance to walk out of the doors of this hospital cancer-free. narrator: please, don't wait. call, go online, or scan the qr code below right now.

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millions across the country are preparing for monday's total solar eclipse, with more than 30 million people live within the path of totality, where the total eclipse will be visible. an additional 150 million people live within 200 miles of that path. if you are unsure, nasa will tell you what time to expect to see the eclipse in your area. more than half of u.s. cities in the path of totality are fully booked out of their short-term rentals for the occasion. the last time americans got to witness a solar eclipse was a partial one in 2017. we learned a couple of lessons, but the most important, wear your glasses. yeah, remember that. they gave the president of the united states glasses. a white house aide even shouted "don't look." he did. so monday around 3:00 p.m. here in new york, break out your eclipse glasses, and dear god, whatever you do, do not stare directly at the sun. we will have special coverage monday starting at 2:00 p.m.

eastern on msnbc. another break for us. we'll be right back. bc another break for us we'll be right back.

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thank you so much for letting us into your homes for another week of shows. "the beat" with katie fang for ari starts right know. >> thank you. have a wonderful weekend, as always. good to see you. and to the rest of you, welcome to "the beat." i'm katie fang in for ari melber. another bad week for donald trump in court. facing a legal hurdles in three separate jurisdictions. as judges in the states of new york, georgia, and florida all rejected the former president's attempts toit