this point. just to wrap it up, you know, kind of tie it to what we were talking about at the beginning of the segment with angela brooks. a lot of democrats last night that i was texting with democrats online were essentially saying maryland's primary race shows us that you can't believe the polls. angela brooks was trailing trone at some points during that primary so they are pointing to that right now. we are less than six months out and i think we will see more movement as we get closer to november. >> those same polls suggest that some of those senate candidates running ahead of president biden in those states and see if that lasts between now and november. good stuff, as always, from julia manchester. thank you, julia. thanks to all of you getting up "way too early" for us on wednesday morning. >> cohen continued to testify in

president trump's hush money trial. he laid out tons of evidence during his testimony including tapes and emails and photos and calendar events. impressive. one of trump's lawyers might win a case. >> well, outside the court defending trump, he made a fraudian slip. >> let's pray for our other side on this shameless prosecution. >> good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it's wednesday, may 15th, along with joe, willie and me, we have the host of "way too early" jonathan lemire. >> you know how long it took us to book him? years to get stephanopoulos and longer to get jonathan lemire. >> he just wandered?

>> he is a chief columnist. how do you like it? >> i love it. don't give me a hard time. i've been in this seat at least three and a half minutes. three and a half minutes! >> yeah. >> early. >> right, you were. >> early. >> yelling! >> there is that. >> i'm shocked. >> i'm shocked that john couldn't modulate his voice. >> i usually do that on "good morning america." >> heilemann is here. author of the book "how the right lost its mind" charlie sykes is with us. >> charlie will have fun today. you know? charlie, i'll be honest with you. charlie's agent extraordinarily tough and we usually have to, like, blow our budget for two months to ever get him on but we saw something he wrote last night and we said we need to get the wisconsin badger in to take it to the fans at the courthouse. depressing, depressing

courthouse? >> tight with time this morning. former u.s. attorney and msnbc legal analyst joyce is here and she just joined the brennan center for justice at nyu law as a senior. my goodness! congratulations! >> thank you. roll tide! >> bring it to the big apple. >> yesterday, we were always talk about the fact that donald trump and his supporters say how horrible america is. we are number one militarily and economically and culturally and strong in the universities. whackos there but universities best universities on the planet. yesterday, a study came out that comes out anally and america had 19 of the top 25 universities on the planet and the list didn't even include the best one. >> really? >> alabama. >> what? >> it just means america is stronger. we got tired of being number

one. >> sometimes you have to take a year off. >> we got a lot to get to this morning. >> we start with, willie? >> new york knickerbockers! 30-point win last night. a lot of concerns had they ran out of gas after blown out by 30 points in indiana. it was bad. concern with the injuries and no depth on the bench. the garden came alive last night for the knicks! jalen brunson had 44 points. 28 in the first half. that guy isaiah hartenstein was incredible on the boards. they are all heart, john heilemann. >> were you there? >> i was not but watching with george and lucy on the couch. what an effort. >> were you there? >> i was not but i'll be there on sunday night if there is a game sunday night. >> you know a guy? >> i do. >> larry? >> i'll say they were all hard. tom thibodeau is great coach but the concern is he runs his players into the ground and they are great players and that was the concern coming out of

mother's day massacre. but, yesterday, man. they were on fire. jalen brunson keeps making the case for -- he's as good as anybody in the league and in the nba. >> his fourth time going over 40 points in the playoffs. he was worn down on sunday. msg is a special place and that crowd carried the knicks. they rolled over the pacers. look. winning game six in indy will be hard. a series the home team has won every game so far but you feel pretty good about a game seven. >> you believe in these guys the way they play. they were left in dead for indy and momentum in indianapolis but a season worth's of evidence saying don't give up and they play too hard and too together and good last night. >> we said yesterday when people were freaking out. when there was the memorial day massacre and celtics went into l.a. and absolutely crushed them and i think game two, game one or game two of the '85 series, lakers came back and won. you got to play all seven and

put it behind them. a guy who wishes he could put something behind him. you know where we are going? >> are we going to the trump trial? hush money criminal trial? >> in real-time, mika and i were watching the brady roast with a friend! >> everybody was laughing. we are doing this. >> no. i was like why is he doing this? right? >> you got to help the pacing of the story, sweetie. i'm talking to the jury here. we saw it. we were laughing and then as we walked across to our house, which we did, we looked at each other and go, did he forget that he has kids and he's got a mother of the kids. >> and friends? >> and friends. we figured that out in real-time. i think most other parents who saw that figured that out in real-time. i really am completely shocked that it took tom brady this long

and the backlash that he had to figure out that this was horrible. >> what is going on there? >> especially when he is angry when they tell a joke about, the guy we love, but his billionaire owner, but let some skewer the mother of his children and his children. >> yeah. gisele and bridget moynahan, the mother of his son went after him. dude, why are you doing this? how much is enough? they are pay him $25 million. he just find 400 hundred million contract, he doesn't need $5 million. >> what does fox sports think about their 400 million dollar investment? i'm dead serious. we are cheering for tom brady and everybody likes tom brady but, seriously, who is around him? i want to know who is around

him. like, does he listen to anybody? >> this is something -- >> no. you've got to have people around you that protect you that say, no, tom, don't do that. no, tom, if you're going to make a statement, don't say how sorry you are and say finish with i hope everybody had a great time. who is around this guy? we blame you, jonathan lemire! >> i can tell i'm getting the brunt of this. he didn't listen to me. i wouldn't have advised him to do this to be sure. to willie's point i think he is transitioning his life. he is trying to humanize himself and doing a lot of ads but this was clearly a mistake. yesterday, he said i gave an interview on podcast and said it's fine to take jokes for me but i find that some of them were hurtful to the people i love the mother including his children and mother of his children. he expressed real regret about that, john heilemann. why didn't he see that in

real-time? why didn't someone get ahead of it and say other ways to humanize yourself but not a roast. >> have you ever seen these things? they are so mean. >> two times in a person's life you bring the team in what are you attacked with or joked about? one of those is running for president. you got to hire people to look in your background and what the attacks are going to be. if you're doing a roast, on live television you got to have a team that goes what is the worst-case scenario? what are the jokes they could make about who in your life? you would think that if you had the right team doing that, you would say if you're tom brady and say, i think i'll pass. >> the thing is, also, he did it jeff frost here is the deal, jeff. i'll do this and say whatever you want to say about me. i don't care. make fun of me all you want and call me stupid and this and call me that and this. the second anybody makes a joke about my kids, or makes a jokes about my kids' moms, i'm walking

off the stage and you're going to be sitting there tap dancing the next two hours. that's all he had to say. all he had to say. they would have said, okay, tom. he didn't say it. he didn't think ahead. i ask again -- it's his responsibility but who in the hell is around him? does he have nobody taking care of him? saying, tom, don't do this. because, listen when i say taking care of him he is a grown man, yeah, he has been playing football since he was 8. i don't expect him to be like james carville, you know? no. he's a football player. he needs to be protected and he needs to protect himself. >> why are we talking about this right now? he did an interview with the pivot podcast he talked about this and he said i got out of football. he said i'll be honest, i'm drifting around a little bit trying to figure it out and i'm gobbling things up. that sounds fun, let's do that. i think he now realizes he needs to focus a little bit.

here he is on that podcast yesterday. >> i loved when the jokes were about me. i thought they were so fun. i didn't like the way that it affected my kids. so it's the hardest part about, like, the bittersweet aspect of when you do something that you think is one way and then, all of a sudden, you realize, i wouldn't do that again because of the way it affected me. actually, the people that i care about the most in the world. >> what john was talking about they could have done, go to youtube and type in nicki glazer and i think you'll know what is coming. >> lordy! >> looking very crest fallen. does the defense rest? >> i've been sitting on this one here but he's made curious decision when he made the comeback. he doesn't know what to do in his life and a mistake we should all turn the page. >> speaking of mistakes, mika. >> yeah. >> i have said for the past

couple of days, as i've said for the past couple of months, that -- i believe now that there is a conspiracy. i do believe in conspiracies. i think psychiatrists in blue states have conspired with a "the new york times" polster and said, listen. we will split the profits on psychiatric care if you guys will have the craziest methodology, which they always have. maybe they are trying to make up for 20 when they skewed in biden's direction by about four or five points? but every one of these "the new york times" siena polls have been widely skewed when you compared them to other polls that come out at the same time. for those who say that is not the case, we will be glad here at "morning joe," as you all know, we have a betting line. we will be glad to take all comers who think that donald trump is going to win nevada by 12 points. >> okay. we are going to get to that

moment. first, exactly one month into donald trump's trial, there is new polling that finds, for the first time, the majority of americans believe the former president is guilty. in the latest yahoo! news ugov national poll, 52% said he conceal hush money payments to a porn star and up four points from last month and up seven points from when the charges were filed last year. if convicted, 51% would approve of trump serving prison time and 36% disapprove putting him behind bars. >> look at that, willie. i guess this isn't a far left wing conspiracy? >> no. it's the majority of americans. >> yeah. wait. i went to alabama. that is a majority, 51? >> yes. once you get to 51. >> as for the political ramifications, the poll shows

trump and president biden tied at 45% in this year's election among registered voters. when asked who they would support, if convicted, trump is convicted in the hush money case, if he is, biden takes a seven point lead 46% to 39%. the latest morning consult tracking poll over 10,000 registered voters finds 44% for trump and 43% for biden. that is within the poll's margin of error. separate new polling of registered voters finds joe biden leading trump in this poll. biden 47% to 43%. we should know the margin of error is plus or minus 6% for the poll. >> so, so i got to say it's fascinating, willie and we will get into this. "the new york times" ran a few

polls. they ran "the new york times" siena poll which they roll off 15, 16, 17 stories that make people run around manhattan with their hair on fire and washington with their hair on fire. "the new york times" ipsos poll run at the same time by "the new york times." biden is ahead by four points nationally. four points nationally. not even an article about it. any way. >> as for that "the new york times" philadelphia polling that came out monday morning in the battleground states, a lot of reaction so that as we know. some of the most trusted polsters in the country are calling into question the methodology of the results. >> you think? >> john ralston calls trump having a 13-point lead in the

state, quote, bizarre. adding that nothing remotely similar has been seen in the state in decades. the founders of uva center for politics larry sabato laughed after seeing the nevada numbers and recommend others do the same. marc caputo calls the nevada poll, quote, a total outlier. john is raising questions how biden could lose the youth vote in 24 points in michigan and winning it by 27 points in wisconsin. >> a million monkeys with a million cell phones making calls as pollsters is how you do it. >> greg sargent expressed dismay and shows 20% of the likely

voters polled did not vote in the last two midterms. >> they are likely voters? >> but did not vote. >> 20% didn't vote in the last two midterms? >> and didn't vote in the last general election or the last two midterms or they have never voted at all. >> but wait, john heilemann. there is more. people are calling saying this is a reaction to one poll. you go go back and look at the tape. we do this every time when this poll comes. it's always an outlier and "the new york times" always gets 15 or 16 articles out of them that everybody rushes to because it says earth ends at 5:00. hit link. "the new york times" 15 times and hit it and they keep writing articles about it. npr has found some of these voters that said you know a voter for biden before, but

wait. this guy we checked the voting roll. he has never voted. not just the people in the surveys but people, "the new york times" quoted in their article. here is one of many people we interviewed who is disillusioned and voting for trump. no record of him voting. >> yeah. >> okay? >> no. >> are you feeling something, john heilemann, that you want to say? >> i think maybe an overreliance of voters telling the truth about things in general. hate to say it. reporters find this occasionally that the reporters lie. here is what i say about this poll. if i were to ask you this question, joe, do you know anybody on either side who don't think it's the case of the battleground states that joe biden is stronger in michigan and wisconsin than he is in nevada, arizona, and georgia?

>> it sounds about right. i've seen some polls that shows george is close. greg bluestein had an article -- >> i'm not saying it's not close. i'm not carry water for "the new york times" or the methodology of this poll. i keep going back to the thing i try to say every time we talk about these things. i know you know this. what are the polls showing us directionally about the race? >> it's a different with "the new york times" siena poll and you know this. "the new york times" feasts on it with click fake stories like a dozen at a time. >> what i'm trying to focus on what i think people should pay attention to. >> i'm focusing on "the new york times" is actively shaping the election cycles where this poll comes out on a sunday and on monday, people go, oh -- i heard

it. i'm going don't be so stupid and why we are doing this. hold on. what i hear is after the siena polls coming out, every time, everything that joe biden has done since the state of the union address the money he has put out and all of the campaigning is for not. no, it's not. no, it's not. there is one poll that is wildly skewed every time and it does shape -- if it's a "the new york times" poll versus a morning -- poll and "the new york times" amplifies it 15, 17, times, it warps reality and everybody responds to that in the media and in the political world. >> all i'd say about this is that i agree with you. unless you want to suggest you think is there a conspiracy at "the times" about this which --

>> their methodology is bizarre and larry sabato said this and others said this. >> you're saying "the new york times" systematically putting the polls out in a way to amplify them to drive the news circle. >> -- cycle. >> yes, i am saying that. >> i'm curious as someone i understand your level of sophistication reading the media why you think that is true. what i'm trying to say is i agree with you. the best bull work against any polls outliers or anything else for people who are actually consumers of this information is to not let these -- any given news outlet or any given poll shape your perception of the race unduly. >> john, a that is not realistic. and i'll tell you why it's not realistically. i know people come up to after every "the new york times" siena poll comes out. it completely changes the political battlefield out there for about a week, week and a half. it distorts the questions that are asked of the white house.

it distorts the questions that are asked of donald trump. it distorts all of the opinion. it distorts everything. that keeps happening every month when this comes out. and then about two weeks later after the residue of "the new york times" siena poll leaves, people go i think joe biden is on a winning streak. two weeks later it comes out again and it's garbage and outlier. yes, "the new york times" when they have all of these experts questioning the methodology, when they are calling 20% of the people likely voters who who didn't vote in the last two primaries or never voted before, when they are even quoting people who say they are switching their vote from joe biden who have never voted before? i'm sorry! "the new york times" has to know what they are doing! >> most of the voters in this country don't live in washington or new york. and certainly most of the

electoral college votes are in a different part of the country so the polls have an outside influence of the people doing most of the voting. >> the white house, the biden campaign reacted with anger about these polls and aides have been telling me the last couple of days it doesn't match up what their own internal numbers show and what they are seeing on the ground. they feel the state of the union was an inflection point in this race. they acknowledge it's close and they are losing in some of the sun belt states but not by 10, 12 points and think they have work to do there and feel the blue wall of pennsylvania, wisconsin, and michigan are, right now tossups but they feel they are pretty good about where they are. charlie sykes, you're there in michigan -- wisconsin, i should say. you're in one of the states the poll suggests a tight race. wisconsin is more consistent than others and not outlier like nevada. how do the polls match up what you're see there on the ground each and every day?

>> it's always close in wisconsin. i certainly can't imagine that the youth vote in wisconsin would be dramatically differently than the you know what vote in michigan and pennsylvania and doesn't make sense. we are a battleground state. there have been no significant developments that would suggest, you know, a major shift in the dynamics toward either candidate at this particular time. i think wisconsin will be what it is in every election. by the way, anything about this election is predictable -- i have to say, joe, i gave up obsessing over polls for lent and decided that i'm not going back. i got about 24 years of scars. >> charlie, i do, too. but, unfortunately, everybody around us did not. and they are always coming up asking and they are ready to jump off of, like, window ledges. when i hear reporters going, you know, well, you know all of

biden's gains, obviously, for not. it twists. one poll specifically. i don't pay attention to polls day in and day out, but, charlie, don't you agree this one poll specifically has a. >> i agree with your theory with the psychiatrists and siena poll. you can almost predict the health lines light up every monday morning when these polls come out. a reason why -- >> like george w. bush one the second time, charlie. >> we take crazy pills. >> not to pour kerosene on the fire but here is another poll this morning in "the new york times." >> oh, my. they will. there have been 15 stories so far about this one poll that the

smartest people in politics say has a screwed up methodology. >> i'm distracted by the speaker johnson. >> talk about a segway. >> she is good. >> i've done this before. >> she's a pro. let's first talk about the testimony. michael cohen was back on the stand. we turn from correct questioning to cross-examination from donald trump's defense team yesterday. what were your takeaways in court? >> early time and another full day of cross-examination coming. i think it's safe to say that michael cohen exceeded expectations. he kept a calm demeanor and big part of this is less evidence coming out and the way the jury perceives michael cohen. they have to believe him in order to convict. there is too much in his testimony. if he continues on this path, you may just pull it out. >> it seemed to be that todd

blanche, the attorney for donald trump pushing the idea that michael cohen was sort of a jilted former employee of donald trump and he brought up the social media post, about the cheeto dust and said you're a liar and not to be trusted. did he make a convincing argument of either of those yesterday? >> he may have more. i've had a lot of cases where that is the strategy on cross-examination. and where the defense lawyer tries to imply that the witness is biased against the defendant. look. these witnesses are always biased against the defendant and the prosecution handles that. >> the prosecution also suggested that cohen would be their last witness and we don't know if the defense is going to call any. i mean, trump still toys at the idea he may take the stand and we are all kind of skeptical at that. we have been moving to summations and could we wrap up next week? >> i think that is a possibility. i'm a little bit surprised that

we are not hearing expert testimony on the campaign finance violations that have to be proven. it's possible the defense could put on, you know, a witness that will talk about that. but closing argument, that is not going to take a full day, i wouldn't think. then the jury is off to the races once they are instructed by the judge on the law. >> and how do you think from beginning to this point, how do you think it's going for the prosecution? >> you know, it is tough to say. what we are doing right now is we are listening to the story of all evidence. america is obsessing line-by-line over the questions. but the judge is about to tell the jury, you have to find two things. you have to find that donald trump created or caused to be created false business records. and you have to find that he did that with an intent to defraud and intent to commit or conceal another crime. we haven't really been looking at the evidence in that legal framework so far but that is what the judge will tell the

jury they have to do and that is a little bit different from listening to the story and saying, oh, i really think donald trump did this, which is more -- >> on those two questions, is the prosecution carrying its burden? >> you know, that is up to the jury, joe, as you well know. >> right. from what you've seen. >> i mean, i think on the first one, the issue is have they successfully put donald trump in the mix? there is no doubt that off business records were created. we have seen 34 of them. michael cohen, his testimony is corroborated to the extent that there are people who say meetings took place. there are phone records of calls. then it comes down to do you believe him based on all of the other that is out there, right? alan weisselberg notes. the jury doesn't have to take a huge leap of faith to believe michael cohen. it's like taking a couple of more steps on a straight line.

>> in a nation 77 million americans voted for donald trump, what is the possibility that the prosecution is going to get 12 people finding him guilty? >> you know, juries are very different than public opinion. i'll say as polly annish as i think it sometimes founds, as a prosecutor, you're used to looking at 12 american citizens and asking them to do their job, to listen to the evidence, to understand the law, to set aside any external noise. >> you seen they take it seriously. >> they do it and do it in public corruption cases. i think the question we are struggling with whether there is something about donald trump that is different even in the context of this jury. >> do you think in the ends that michael cohen is crucial to this or this counterargument which is -- put michael cohen on. do you think he is important or not important? >> yeah, i'm firmly in the camp that believes that michael cohen's testimony was essential. i don't think the prosecution could have tried this case without putting him on simply

because of the defense would have asked for an adverse inferchs, right? if they don't put cohen on, you would assume, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, that something he said would be harmful to them. >> do you see a path for reasonable doubt reasonable doubt to one juror. >> there is always a reasonable doubt reasonable doubt to one juror. >> still ahead on "morning joe," we are going to get the political side of trump's trial and how some of the former president's -- >> oh, my god! matching ties! they are all matching ties! look at this! >> i think we should all do that. >> who is coordinating that wardrobe is what i want to know. >> that hurts me. that hurts me. >> especially when this guy

burgum said he would never do business with donald trump several months ago because you were judged by the company you keep. >> right! >> yesterday, he said i'm here voluntarily. >> after withholding weapons last week for israeli. we will have that ahead. inside the strained courtship of donald trump and one of the biggest donors in the 2024 election circle. we are back in 60 seconds. ctione are back in 60 seconds.

a little bit of a gray day at the united states capitol. republican senator tommy tuberville said. >> i like purple! >> oh, man! >> said he accompanied donald trump to court to, quote, overcome the gag order imposed on the former president. in an interview yesterday, the alabama senator discussed his decision to speak outside the courthouse on monday where, among other things, he called into question the citizenship. >> c'mon, man! dope! >> middle anguish is trying to be pushed on republican candidate for the president of the united states. that is all this is. he's been a here a month. i'm disappointed in looking at

supposedly the american citizens in this courtroom. this judge pretty much got everybody hog-tied, i would call, from president trump on down and anybody on his side. hopefully, we have more and more senators and congressmen go up to represent him and be able to overcome this gag order. we went to speak our peace for president trump. >> donald trump was joined in court yesterday by more of his allies to help him get around that gag order and among them is house speaker mike johnson who repeated about the falls claims against him. the man second line in president he criticized michael cohen's testimony and attacked the judge's daughter on behalf of the former president. >> what would happen if nancy pelosi went to hunter biden's trial and attacked the key witness against hunter biden and then attacked the judge's daughter? let's just play that game out for a second. >> wall-to-wall coverage and

full meltdown. >> full meltdown. >> full meltdown. >> of course, she would never do it. >> like the matching outfits? >> that is a picture -- >> there we go. >> side board. >> this is all of the men who showed up to support donald trump yesterday. republican congressman and governor of north dakota and doing the people's business of north dakota in lower manhattan and vivek ramaswamy there. all wearing the same suit and same red tie favored by donald trump. what do you see in these images, charlie? >> i see politicians running toward what their master is demanding of them. we shouldn't be surprised but it's still shocking and still amazing that you have these politicians embracing donald trump in the middle of a hush money trial, and could walk out

of that courtroom as a convicted felon. it's one thing for republicans to say we like donald trump because of his policies on taxes or on the border or on education but what is happening now is that it's become the new litmus test and you have to embrace it all. you have to embrace the election denial, the lies. you have to embrace the insurrection and the hush money to a porn star, the multiple affairs. you have to embrace the obstruction of justice. you have to make yourself part of the obstruction of justice. i mean, that was one of those moments where you go, okay, we need to remind everybody that this is not remotely normal that the speaker of the house of representatives would show up at the felony trial supporting donald trump not in spite of his character, but embracing all of it. then basically using his position to -- to violate the gag order, to say things that the judge says do not -- you

know, this would affect the trial. now, whether this is going to have effect on the jury, we don't know. whether it is going to intimidate the jury, whether it is going to impress the jury. but, again, we are seeing a scene in american politics that we have never seen before and which was unimaginable until last two days. by the way, as you guys have pointed out, so much for the party of morality and so much for the party of law and order. >> former republican congresswoman liz cheney mocked mike johnson for his appearance at the trial. she posted on social media, quote. democratic congressman jamie rask of maryland said the following, quote.

world class fraudster and con man for cooking the books to cover up hush money payments he made to a porn star, to conceal his adultress affair. he talked about his world view shortly after he was elected speaker last fall. >> i am a bible believing christian. someone asked me today in the media, they said it's curious. people are curious what is mike johnson think about any issue under the sun? i said, well, go pick up a bible off your shelf and read it. that is my world view and that is what i believe. >> joe, i know you're a bible scholar. we have talked about the bible a lot on this show at various times. i remember when mike johnson said if you want to know who i am, look at the bible. it's an incredible spectacle. it's almost more of the two

things that are incredible about this, one is that the speaker of the house is doing this and the other is that it's the speaker of the house willing to come down here and stand up for donald trump. it's like he has no memory of things he just say just -- he doesn't remember the things he said a few months ago. >> my parents did drag me to church four times a week. >> that makes you a bible scholar. >> i loved every second of it. charlie, here is a guy -- you go back to the very beginning. we criticized mike johnson for saying just look at the bible. when mike johnson's speakership was built on the biggest lie in american politics. >> right. >> specifically, the big lie. he was the guy that went around with the sign-up sheet to support ken paxton's big lie out of texas, trying to overthrow american democracy. so you could start there. you could go all the way to what

happened yesterday, unfortunately. like i said yesterday, charlie, i'm sure you're the same way, i'm cheering for speaker mike johnson, just like i would cheer for speaker hakim jeffries and any speaker. i want them to succeed because i want america to succeed. and, yesterday, was a very, very sad spectacle for america and for an institution i love. >> it was a bizarre spectacle. no. it's worth remembering that mike johnson became the speaker because he had a coup on his resume and played a role in the big lie. the reality is that mike johnson, speakership hangs by a thread, that he depends upon the favor of mar-a-lago, that all donald trump has to do is turn on him and he's out. you have mike johnson that

survived that vacate the speaker vote with democratic support, basically, showing where the real power in the republican party is. by the way, also not a surprise that he was fund-raising off of it. we know a picture of him and donald trump live from donald trump's trial for the various frauds to try to raise money. but this is who mike johnson is. the somebody built an identity on his christian morality. apparently he and his son have a monitor on one and another's use. this is a trial about donald trump having an affair -- i mean, having a fling with a porn star and a "playboy" model and mike johnson saying i'm with

you. not just on taxes or with you on the border, i am with you on this and i'm willing to help you obstruct justice by violating the gag order. >> i'm still thrown off by the whole thing. a little too deep in the shag carpet as they said in the 1970s. nothing after that. charlie sykes, please, figure out what the young-uns are doing in wisconsin and michigan and a 50-point swing between the two, according to "the new york times" siena poll and 38 articles about that coming up in the next two days. charlie, thank you. we appreciate it. i said on the show, i was grateful for mike johnson for finally approving aid to ukraine. "the new york times" next to this poll story right here which one of 800. important story here about russia starting to make really rapid gains in ukraine. the reason why?

because donald trump wanted to help vladimir putin and he froze the house of representatives and mike johnson was far too long. when johnson changed his mind, i've give him the benefit of the doubt just because. i think by that point, i think the responsible people in the party come to him and said, listen. we are going to get this through with or without you. but i just want to say even while we thank him for what he did, the cost of his delay, devastating to ukraine and a gift that keeps on giving to vladimir putin. >> two quick things. as charlie said, speaker johnson paying a debt to donald trump and trump pushed off mtg's motion to vacate. this is johnson saying thank you for keeping meal at my post. however, as charlie also noted he stayed in the post because democrats came to his aid. aftermath of his appearance in court yesterday a number of

democrats and some giving interviews saying that is not happening again. he just burned that bridge. we will not bail him out if there is another effort to push him out. a consequence from yesterday. u.s. official i talked the last couple of days watching the progress in russia say usa started to show up in the front and a process and that delay was costly. we are seeing russia take over a number of villages near kharkiv and they think advances will continue as russia sets up what they think is a spring/summer offensive. >> let's turn to gabe sherman who joins the table. you're looking into the strange strained courtship of donald trump and megadonor jeff yass. earlier this year, donald trump appeared to be flip on his position on tiktok, the app owned by the chinese company bytedance and posting on social media in march to warn against banning the platform. compare that to his comments

four years ago shortly before announcing a ban on tiktok for, quote, impairing the national security of the united states. take a look. >> we are looking at tiktok. we may be banning tiktok. we may be doing some other things. there are a couple of options. but a lot of things are happening so we will see what happens. but we are looking at a lot of alternatives. >> he had the time he thought tiktok was a tbs game show that came on at 6:30 week nights! >> he thought it was the metro gnome on the piano at mar-a-lago. >> he is supporting the community chinese government continuing to control political fraught he especially of younger voters. letting the chinese government into our -- >> rare source of bipartisan agreement. >> exactly. he shifted and he shifted, in

part, because of this -- >> donald said we will see what happens. what is happening is that donald trump needs money badly. one of the campaign's real weak spots this cycle is a lack of major fund-raising and donors. jeff yass is a based in pennsylvania and largest single political donor this cycle and yet to donate to trump's campaign. he has the single largest investor in tiktok. connect the dots. donald trump flips his position, throws his weight behind this investment, perhaps seeking to get a donation. this boils down to a simple thing. donald trump looks at politics through the prism what helps donald trump. it's not go ideally or pathology. >> jeff yass met with donald trump at mar-a-lago a week later and donald trump put out that post on social media making the case to keep tiktok around.

i know mr. yass is a liberty therien who spent a lot of money to buy ads to keep donald trump from winning. he is really throwing his support behind trump? >> this is stating. jeff yass came up through the world of political gambling and in gambling you try to play the sucker. he has gotten donald trump to flip his position in tiktok without having to donate to the campaign. who is the sucker? >> that points how desperate the campaign is. we keep hearing and see the numbers. people keep going, you knew. i guess maybe some of the same people who do "the new york times" siena poll. you know donald trump have people behind the gates. it's all talk. >> yeah. >> he is so desperate. they are pulling people in. any billionaire they find on the street they drag them? >> he only needs a few. >> any way. this guy, again, he still hasn't given, has he? >> no, he has not given.

i reported in my piece his team says he doesn't plan to give. he has the leverage over donald trump and dangling his money to get trump to flip on tiktok. >> john heilemann? >> just give me a sense. you spent a lot of time thinking about trump and money, right? >> uh-huh. >> yes is like trumping trump at this point, right? >> yes. >> he is going to betray him on the basis of your reporting. chris christie's camp and in everybody's camp he has been in. is this desperation of trump's camp or do you know how desperate trump is in financial terms heading into the general election? >> he is selling bibles, we know. selling sneakers. again, between his legal bills and his campaigns and anemic fund-raising this is a sign of desperation. if joe biden campaign has 100 million more on hands than the trump campaign. >> could i ask?

could you at least take one of us with you where you're going next and please let that person be me? >> no. >> taking my two kids. i think you're talking about going to -- on friday. >> you're taking your kids? >> i am. >> no reason you can't swap out one kid for joe. >> brady would. >> can you tell us where you're going to cannes? >> i wrote a movie about donald trump's rise in new york city in the 1970s and his relationship with roy cone and called "the apprentice." a character study about the formative years where donald trump became donald trump. >> wow. >> and he learned that at the feet of? >> of his master >> you know, it's still hard to believe willie when you're looking at turning point, the netflix series on the cold war. >> yes. >> you're looking at these 1950s pictures of roy cohn in the

middle of mccarthyism and it's still hard to connect something that happened that long ago with a guy who is, is channeling roy cohn every day in front of our eyes in manhattan. >> it is. he's in in the middle of that time line. to donald trump of 2024 and never apologize, always on the offensive. >> do you go up to the point where roy got aids and donald trump dropped him as a friend. >> the whole relationship. >> that's what happened. >> that's incredible. >> congratulations on the work. >> i can't wait. by the way eli gladstone at the press conference was asked about you. >> judge the movie as a film. as a piece of art. >> gabriel sherman, thank you so

much. we'll be his reading his piece online. coming up, a former "the new york times" reporter is questioning whether the progressive movement is actually helping people. her book "morning after the revolution." "morning joe" will be right back. back (♪♪) with wet amd, i worry i'm not only losing my sight, but my time to enjoy it. but now, i can open up my world with vabysmo. (♪♪) vabysmo is the first fda-approved treatment for people with wet amd

that improves vision and delivers a chance for up to 4 months between treatments, so i can do more of what i love. (♪♪) (♪♪) vabysmo works differently, it's the only treatment designed to block 2 causes of wet amd. vabysmo is an eye injection. don't take it if you have an infection, active eye swelling, or are allergic to it. treatments like vabysmo can cause an eye infection or retinal detachment. vabysmo may cause a temporary increase in eye pressure after receiving the injection. there is an uncommon risk of heart attack or stroke associated with blood clots. severe swelling of blood vessels in the eye can occur. most common eye side effects were cataract and broken blood vessels. open up your world with vabysmo. a chance for up to 4 months between treatments with vabysmo. ask your doctor. the all new godaddy airo helps you get your business online in minutes

with the power of ai... ...with a perfect name, a great logo, and a beautiful website. just start with a domain, a few clicks, and you're in business. make now the future at godaddy.com/airo sure, i'm a paid actor, and this is not a real company, but there is no way to fake how upwork can help your business. search talent all over the world with over 10,000 skills you may not have in house. more than 30% of the fortune 500 use upwork because this is how we work now. ♪♪ sandals jamaica sale is now on! with rates from $199 per person per night. visit sandals.com or call 1-800-sandals what causes a curve down there? is it peyronie's disease? will it get worse? how common is it? who can i talk to? can this be treated? stop typing. start talking to a specialized urologist. because it could be peyronie's disease, or pd. it's a medical condition where there is a curve in the erection, caused by a formation of scar tissue. and an estimated 1 in 10 men may have it.

but pd can be treated even without surgery. say goodbye to searching online. find a specialized urologist who can diagnose pd and build a treatment plan with you. visit makeapdplan.com today. frizz. dryness. breakage. new dove 10-in-1 serum hair mask with peptide complex. fortifies hair bonds at a molecular level. helps reverse ten signs of damage in one minute. keep living. we'll keep repairing. her uncle's unhappy. i'm sensing an underlying issue. it's t-mobile. it started when we tried to get him under a new plan. but they they unexpectedly unraveled their “price lock” guarantee. which has made him, a bit... unruly. you called yourself the “un-carrier”. you sing about “price lock” on those commercials. “the price lock, the price lock...” so, if you could change the price, change the name! it's not a lock, i know a lock.

so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that's uncalled for. whoa, what's that, grandpa? look at us knuckleheads. and they're all coming? those who are still with us, yes. you look good. you as well. one, two three. grandpa! what's this, ellie? your wings. light 'em up! gentlemen, it's a beautiful... ...day to fly. wooooooo! whoa!

on your wing, grandpa! welcome back to morning joe. a few minutes before top of the hour. our next guest questions the current state of the progressive movement and whether it's actually helping people. in a new book titled "morning after the revolution," nelly calls out major progressive actions over the past few years and explains why she, a hillary clinton voter who lived in progressive san francisco, decided the movement was too much and nelly joins us now. she's a reporter and head of strategy at the free press. also with us the president of the national action network,

reverend al sharpton is back with us this morning. nelly, welcome. congratulations on the book. >> thank you so much. >>. >> when you talk about the latte liberals, this is something that took a while for a lot of people to figure out the disconnect, right, the disconnect let's just say it, really extreme white progressives and black americans, hispanic americans and you see it in polling, one poll after another. >> i think you see it in the polls because that's the reality what she's writing about is real. those who are committed toward real progressive change moving the country forward and those who come on that are removed from the reality that we're fighting and just exploit it because they want a charge, the

latte liberals who sit up all day and philosophyize rather than deal with people's lives. you get though latte liberals, oh, we don't need the old guard and two months later the families never hear from them again, the community never hear from them again and all they have left is the people they were told to stay away and they exploited. formative, they don't believe in anything long range. >> a movement with very beautiful rhetoric that didn't want to engage with the tangible hard work with doing kind of anti-racism and progress, which invols copromise and getting legislation don. and the movement instead said

that anti-racism or progress can be an internal process, that we actually instead of trying to make laws and make things better for black americans we can work on our internal whiteness and our internal, there's a list that came out in the book, the characteristics of white supremacy and these lists include perfectionism, a sense of urgency, individualism, a crazy notion. >> right, and fragility where they get you coming and going, if you say you're racist you're racist and if you don't say you're racist you're fragile. to follow up what rev said, what are they talking about, we went back to 2020, right, when there were all the chants mainly from white people about defunding the police. >> yes.

>> rev and i brought up to "the new york times" and the rev saw it on the ground, actually black representatives and the bronx, in brooklyn said, no, no, don't defund the police. >> of course. >> we need more in our schools. we need more protecting our children as they walk from home to school, we need more guarding our stores, you people in park slope and you people in brooklyn heights, fine, but we actually need help. >> yes. i think you had a media movement that said basically let's not cover this complexity, let's not cover the reality on the ground. let's just look at the rhetoric. let's just look at the language and the beauty of the movement and the ideals. but, the reality on the ground which i tried to do in the book, go to different scenes and go to

different places and talk to people. the reality on the ground is more difficult. lot of the protests in 2020, the neighborhoods that were burned out, those were poor minority neighborhoods. these were not the rich, white business owners. >> and you got to remember one of the reasons that i talked about that with joe is that in the 80s and '90s we were fighting to get more blacks in the police department to reform how policing was done, one was a cop named eric adams who's now the mayor. it's an idealistic for people who are removed from the ground. >> yes, it's more fun.

it's revolution. >> we go -- you see george floyd killed two days of riots. four days later when we're fighting to get the special prosecutor got the case to the attorney general what happened to those people who turned down target, the family of george floyd hasn't heard from him since then because this idea of idealism doesn't make real change. >> nellie, can i ask you to branch out to other issues, where you think the progressive movement has maybe fallen short or not actually helping people. >> i think that when we talk about, when we talk about homelessness and the drug situation, i'm from san francisco, i have a chapter in the book and all about san francisco, anyone who's honest with them and walking around the city, realizes the reality on

the ground is very different from what we're being told. the reality is people are dying on the streets, from fentanyl overdoses. we're being told that it's the progressive response to walk past someone who's overdosing fentanyl on the sidewalk and to know the government's taking care of them in some way -- >> nellie, what happened in oregon. >> yes. >> the deaths, the addiction soared, they have to completely walk it back because it was an abject failure that caused more suffering. >> in my book, in my own transformation, realization that i was wrong about some things, not superwrong, just a little wrong, but like, i used to be for drug legalization, but if

your open your eyes, you have to be honest with yourself and i think that's what a lot of the progressive movement hasn't done and that makes ripe for reporting. they're refusing to see reality. if you look another reality you see the absurdity. >> do you think some of the most extreme elements of progressivism are given too much attention, amplified too much, that tiktok feeds them a narrative about israel, many of those students were there on good faith. we learn later what most people suspected. there were professionals behind a lot of it, do you think that we talk too much in the media or other places about the most extreme elements in.

>> i think that happens for both sides. but when it comes to to the progressive movement, yes, very much, the average american is really normal political, is mixed politically even, a complicated political mess, the reason the progressive movement has such a prominent place in our conversation is, because a lot of our american media in the mainstream is super progressive and bought into a lot of these ideas and philosophies, so it became the operating system of a lot of our great media companies. >> i think your point is very well taken because i consider myself progressive a lot of people are progressive but not extreme. just like you have people on the right who aren't extreme and i know people who are very conservative, who are very supportive of the conservative movement but they wouldn't go down and join the trumpettes in

the chorus line -- i think that's where we got to recapture what's progressive and the real definition is progressives should be people who are getting concrete progress not just making noise. >> so interesting. the new book is "morning after the revolution." nellie bowles, thank you very much. congratulations on the book. >> thank you so much. still ahead, nbc's blayne alexander sat down with republican voters in georgia, and asked them their thoughts on the criminal hush money trial and whether it's impacting their support for donald trump. also ahead, mark warner of virginia will join us ahead of a hearing today on the foreign threats facing the 2024 elections. "morning joe" will be right back. be right back - so this is pickleball? - pickle! ah, these guys are intense.

with e*trade from morgan stanley, we're ready for whatever gets served up. dude, you gotta work on your trash talk. i'd rather work on saving for retirement. or college, since you like to get schooled. that's a pretty good burn, right? we're here today to set the record straight about dupuytren's contracture. surgery is not your only treatment option. people may think their contracture has to be severe to be treated, but it doesn't. visit findahandspecialist.com today to get started. (reporters) over here. kev! kev! (reporter 1) any response to the trade rumors, we keep hearing about? (kev) we talkin' about moving? not the trade, not the trade, we talking about movin'. no thank you. (reporter 2) you could use opendoor. sell your house directly to them, it's easy. (kev) ... i guess we're movin'.

donald trump is entering his second month of the trial and his courthouse is becoming a pilgrim jj age for all of his supporters and wanna bee vps. this week alone we saw vivek ramaswamy, j.d. vance, michael johnson and whoever this guy is. like the met gala for people who don't believe in women's rights. >> welcome back to "morning joe." joining the conversation we have

msnbc contributor mike barnacle. donny deutsch is with us as well. donald trump's defense team will continue its cross-examination of michael cohen tomorrow as it tries to discredit the prosecution's key witness in former president's criminal hush money trial. laura jarrett has the latest. >> reporter: donald trump's defense team tearing into the prosecution's star witness suggesting that mr. trump's self-described fixer turn fierce trump critic michael cohen is out for revenge on his former boss. do you want president trump to get convicted in this case? >> sure. cohen acknowledged. confirming he recently said the former president belongs in a cage, like an animal. now his financial livelihood

including media appearances and podcasts centers on trashing mr. trump. cohen acknowledging that he's making $3 million. saying of his past praise of mr. trump, quote, at that time i was knee-deep into the cult of donald trump. the defense getting cohen to admit he previously described himself as obsessed with mr. trump. the state's case largely depending on jurors believing cohen's word as he's the only witness who said the former president knew his internal records were falsified to cover up cohen's payment of an adult film actress before the 2016 election. mr. trump has pleaded not guilty to those low-level felony charge and we had a very good day. i think we're exposing this scam for what it is. thank you very much. >> reporter: earlier today the prosecution questioning cohen who told the jury these invoices

seeking repayment for services rendered in 2017 were false records and the retainer agreement that he references never exist tdz. prosecutors guiding cohen through check after check. all false statements he said because they weren't for valid legal fees but reimbursements for the hush money. cohen describing a meeting with mr. trump at the white house in 2017 where he posed for this picture, cohen said they discussed mr. trump reimburing him for paying off stormy daniels. arranged by cfo allen weisselberg months earlier. i was sitting with president trump and he asked me if i was okay. i said i'm okay. all right, just make you deal with allen, cohen testifying. later said he was frightened when the fbi raided his home and office in 2018 saying mr. trump told him don't worry i'm the president of the united states,

stay tough. which cohen took to me, don't flip. cohen said he turned against mr. trump after consulting with his family, my wife, my daughter, my son, we're supposed to be your first loyalty. he's been disbarred and convicted of lying under oath. with the defense zeroing in on his motives. if he was motivated by fame. cohen suggesting that's not fair to say. then quoting this excerpt from cohen's book, quote, i want it all -- power, the good life, public acclaim, those are my words cohen said yes. >> joining us now is andrew weisman. this continues tomorrow. but so far, how has michael cohen fared for the prosecution and also for the defense, your thoughts? >> he's been quite remarkable. i think that, you know, a lot of

us on msnbc have seen him up close and personal and he can be at times volatile and strong willed and he's not shown any of that. i was in court observing him and he was really so far he's been a model witness on direct and on cross-examination. the one thing i would note for viewers is a slight difference in my take from laura's excellent presentation, which is, michael cohen does give incredibly damming evidence and he has direct evidence with respect to the former president being involved in this scheme and he has direct conversations but i don't think it's fair to say that he provides the only evidence with respect to donald

trump and his connection to this case, i think you have to think of both direct and circumstantial evidence and there's really a mountain of circumstantial evidence and michael cohen isn't even the only person who has direct evidence, for instance, donald trump signs the checks for the reimbursement payments and it's not just $130,000 it's $260,000 because they're disguising it according to d.a. as legal fees and so there's really substantial corroboration and independent evidence aside from michael cohen who certainly is an important witness but not a critical witness. >> andrew, any sense of how the jury was reacting or not reacting, were they bored, intrigued? how he was connecting with the

jury, if at all. and of course, this comes down to as joyce reminded us in the last hour the jury, their call on whether he's guilty of the two things election interference and the actual fraud with the records. it's, that seemed to be landing as opposed to the drama around their relationship that's coming out. >> you know, reading the jury is always a hard thing and you just never know. and so, the one thing i will say from looking at the jurors is they are extremely attentive, they're not to dozing off like the defendant seems to be. with his eyes closed. very frequently. they're looking at the witness and they're looking at the

documents as they come in. the last hour of michael cohen's direct testimony was pretty riveting because he was looking by and large directly at the jurors and the jurors were looking directly at him as he talked about his prior crimes, what he did, how he feels about that, why he decided to plea guilty and break from what he called the trump cult. and so that was quite a remarkable moment. the witness stand and the jury box are very close to each other, they're much closer than where the defendant is, donald trump, to the witness stand or the jury box. so they really can see each other very close and so that was -- certainly a dramatic moment, but you don't know until the end, we won't know -- and

that's why certain trials are so dramatic. we don't know how this is landing with the jurors. but they're paying close attention. >> mike. >> we know where allen weisselberg is physically, he's in rikers, will he be called to the stand, given the testimony thus far involving allen weisselberg? >> great, great question. the real issue, will there be an explanation for where he is give on the jurors, we all know that the reason he's not a witness is because he's behind bars having pleaded guilty to lying in the civil fraud case where he and donald trump were found liable, it's fair to infer he lead to protect himself and donald trump with respect to those charges.

it's important for the jurors to know why he has not been called as a witness presumably he would assert the fifth amendment and not testify voluntarily, so that would happen outside the presence of the jury, i think one way to remedy this is the court can give an instruction to the jurors saying you're not to consider why certain witnesses were not called and you cannot consider that in your jury deliberations. that would apply to allen weisselberg and the body guard keith schiller who was according to stormy daniels right outside the room when she said the sexual encounter occurred. he's the person who received the checks and invoices when he was at the white house with donald trump. so, the judge could explain that those not to speculate why those

witnesses weren't called -- >> why is keith not being called? >> i assume that he's somebody who the prosecutors, i'm speculating, a good prosecutor would try to get him to cooperate and trim to see if he would testify, i would assume that he's asserted the fifth amendment, we have a right to do that -- >> everybody does. >> exactly. i would assume if i were his defense counsel that's something they would advise him to do at which point the prosecutors have to decide whether they would imnice him and not prosecute him and i can see why they might not be willing to do that knowing what they know about his closeness and involvement with donald trump. you can immunize and still lie, not tell the truth. >> thank you so much.

so, donnie, you know michael cohen very well and you have for quite some time, you observed him yesterday in the courtroom. what did you see. >> you know, let me just back up a little bit, anyone who thought michael cohen would get rattled, he was prepared for this. the thing about michael, donald trump has been through how many attorneys, yet michael cohen was his personal attorney for ten years and kept that job, he's really good, really good on his feet and he's also very likable. there's something about him and the rev knows him, yes, he did this stuff for trump. you kind of feel like the guy was duped into it. i really believe he's connecting. i really believe that this is his moment and the other thing, yes, they're going to paint him and said, yes, he lied.

but everything is corroborated. they haven't left anything to chance here. when you combine his ability on the stand which so far by anyone's scorecard he's getting an a with the corroborating evidence -- >> rev, you know michael cohen as well. >> in the years we would deal with trump, mostly adversal he was the guy who kind of walked, look, he's not that bad of a guy. i met him, i was a little skeptical. we met at the regency and this is wide open. but he really convinced me that, you know, i was telling him everything would be all right. he said no, rev, i'm going to jail. be clear. but my kids don't deserve this. i think his family turned him around. he went to jail, he would send

messages and said, please call my son, which i did. he realized he was in a cult, a situation he admired somebody who wasn't worthy of that. very much convinced with the composure and conviction in which he went on the stand he wouldn't allow them to provoke them because of his family. he's standing up to redeem his family. >> when he was talking about his family the jury was very connected to him. >> michael cohen back on the stand in about two hours from now -- tomorrow he'll be back on the stand. meanwhile, as the criminal trial nears its conclusion how the verdict might impact voters in georgia.

blayne, good morning. >> reporter: guys, good morning to you. this is one of the most closely watched kouptdties here if key battleground state. perfect place to come out and talk to republican voters to see all of the coverage that we're talking about this new york hush money trial how is it impacting down there. they represent a very wide cross section of republican voters here in this county. i asked them how are they being impacted by this trial and what impact might a guilty verdict have on supporting the former president. >> do you each of your support donald trump if. >> i do. >> yes for all three of you if. >> yes. >> has this trial changed your opinion in. >> no. it's actually caused me to support him more, i just don't believe it's a coincidence we have a trial happening in

atlanta, we have one happening in new york, so the question people are beginning to ask themselves like i did, why now? >> it's pretty much everyone says they're picking on him. people are tired of going after him and you see it in so many areas, it's really not a big issue in the party, actually they're really making everyone mad and they look at a big bully and the government is the bully. >> this is your first time casting a ballot. what is it for you that drives your support of the former president. >> always fighting, defense from news, he still hasn't given up, he keeps fighting. >> i talk to many people who formerly eye dented as democrats they changed to independent. they're going to vote for donald trump. >> when you say they find commonality, what is that commonality. >> they've felt persecuted by

the system of american injustice. it's not a stretch for them to think that trump may be a victim as well people see there's some kind of commonality between himself and all the black men who have been incarcerated and the families who have been impacted. >> reporter: so, you heard a lot there, that was the sum total of about three hours of conversation, but let me tell you them about the voters, the chairman of the county gop, the republican party here, we talked a longtime volunteer, talking to voters every single day and also in that group who's going to cast their ballot for the very first time as a current 17-year-old. really what i heard among all of them is the trial only furthers their support of the former president in many cases and a guilty verdict wouldn't impact their support. gwinnett county, so crucial to

deciding the election this november. metro atlanta suburb, just outside the city of atlanta, the most diverse county in the state of georgia, and according to the county gop chairman this county actually has the state's largest republican voting bloc, that's why there's so much focus from the national republican party, so much focus from locals here as well, also important to point out after 2012 this county flipped blue in 2016 and 22020 presidential races. being watched closely by republicans and a lot of the democrats i'm speaking to as well this is the key to winning georgia in november. >> some fascinating answer there is. nbc's blayne alexander in gwinnett county, georgia. so fascinating to watch. we've heard this before, donald trump, 77-year-old billionaire, has a penthouse apartment on 5th avenue and a castle by the ocean, he's martyr and a victim of american society

and some people feel they share that with him. >> as we heard, a lot of young black men, rev, lot of people still nuclear secrets, then lie to the fbi and don't return them. try to influence the outcome of the election by paying hush money at the last second to a porn star, come on, this is ridiculous, by the way, the report's not ridiculous, i'm so glad and grateful for blayne because we get an insight into what these republican voters are thinking but this whole idea that donald trump is, like, suffering for our sins when in 2019 when all of us around this set said, if he loses he'll run for president again to protect himself from future prosecution, so he can say, we said that five years, this whole idea of people going, wait, now, why are they

bringing these lawsuits now? they're bringing the lawsuits now because they've been a long time coming. >> yes, what's the irony of the whole thing, looking yesterday, in the office, and i see the trumpettes i call them, michael johnson and them standing all dressed alike, they're standing in front of a building that donald trump had called on five young black and brown men to get the death penalty, and they were found to have not done the crime of raping a white woman in central park. they were convicted and went to jail. he said give them the death penalty. then was found through dna that didn't do it. donald trump said don't give them a dime.

they're still guilty even after dna had proven they didn't. for him to be a symbol of black men in jail he wanted black boys to go to jail and wanted them executed. he's the example of what that young lady was talking about we feel persecuted. he led the persecution of the central park five. >> this is what he does. what he did when he first ran for president. lot of voters said, oh, he's rich, he has gold toilets. i want to be like him. he's doing the same trick here. tapping into racial challenges that we face in this country and owning it with his gross trial with gross like situations where he i guess took a porn star into a hotel room, she can identify everything that was in the hotel

room so either believe her or believe him. >> they don't care about anything. i think, donny, when you look at blayne's great reporting there, i mean, it's the question is, okay, this is the reality, how does the biden campaign respond to that, reality? >> that's a great, great question. >> it's hard. >> biden has to stick to the facts. lowest unemployment for the blacks in a generation. there's something that doesn't make sense, when you look at the people of color, when you look at hispanics they're moving to trump and i just, i always have the answers. i don't have any answer and i think they've got to tell the real story, if i were running biden's campaign i put the central park five on tour to let them tell the story all over the country trump almost cost them

their lives. people who lived in new york trying to get contract, black businessmen with the trump organization never got one. one thing about all of the witnesses, haven't seen a black person stand up and say trump is responsible for my business grow. >>. >> circling back to michael cohen, he told me on so many occasions racist things that donald trump said. >> absolutely. >> the guy you know where his heart is. you know it. i think the rev actually, i think those are brilliant ideas. you walk right into it and you play the racism card i don't mean that lightly because the

man is racist. he started his campaign being a racist on the birther movement. you're right. you go pure emotion, this man, the last man standing up for you. coming up, one of the prolific writers of thriller and suspense novels with nearly 80 million books in print worldwide, that's a lot, author harlan coben joins us in studio. that's next on "morning joe."

voices of people with cidp: cidp disrupts. cidp derails. let's be honest... all: cidp sucks! voices of people with cidp: but living with cidp doesn't have to. when you sign up at shiningthroughcidp.com,

you'll find inspiration in real patient stories, helpful tips, reliable information, and more. cidp can be tough. but finding hope just got a little easier. sign up at shiningthroughcidp.com. all: be heard. be hopeful. be you. hi, i'm kevin, sign up at shiningthroughcidp.com. and i've lost 152 pounds on golo. i had just left a checkup with my doctor, and i'd weighed in at 345 pounds. my doctor prescribed a weight loss drug, but as soon as i stopped taking the drug, i gained all the weight back and then some. that's when i decided to give golo a try. taking the release supplement, i noticed a change within the first week, and each month the weight just kept coming off. with golo, you can keep the weight off.

so our next guest at 40 past the hour has written 36 books, eight of which that have adapted for netflix. harlan coben's next book "think twice" continues myron bolliter. how did you write 36 books. you're fairly young. >> one per year, i knew willie when he was in high school. >> stop. really? >> grew up at the same time in jersey. >> i know all of these guys. >> one of the nicest people. >> he's lying like a rug.

>> donnie. your books just sell, sell, sell. people love them. tell us about think twice. >> serial killer, imagine someone comes to you and they say we think who the killer is, we got his dna he died three years ago and you did his eulogy. that's how the book opens. you want an escape. it's my job we all know reading is good for us. we all know, there are studies now that reading books at night. >> books, no scroll. >> i suggest calm app for 20, 30 minutes and then read a book.

>> i'm curious about your process, someone as prolific and successful as you are, john grisham said his process he walks up on january 1st goes out to the barn on his property, no wifi connection, writes five hours a day. what's your process? >> i can write anywhere. >> you can write anywhere? >> when uber first started, i started writing in the back of the uber. whatever's working. i keep changing up what i do. >> you write every day? >> i think about it every day. as i'm walking in here and how

can i use this. >> oh, no. >> if i want that stud character i got mike right here. >> mike's looking good. >> you know what's really interesting from a personal point of view about all of your books my wife is a great reader, she reads all of your books, what she loves is the netflix movies based on the books how did that marriage occur, how long has it been going on and how does it happen? >> are you okay with that? >> you're all about them reading the books. watch me on netflix, by the way, you married way above your station. >> everybody says that. >> you know, netflix has been great. we made one and it really worked out. the most recent "fool me once," they're on forever. people watch it so quickly. 100 million families, or 100 million households watched eight

episodes of fool me once, 100 million it's all over the world. it's been really cool to take this thing and put it on the screen, not to get to too heavy, when you go on set and you see these people, realizing it's going to be in all these households i have -- >> in the back of the uber. >> you sold 80 million books. you talked to me once and said, you have the beginning and the end and you fill in the middle. you always start with a bang, you're like, okay, somebody's dead, oops, they're not. talk to me like, give me the moment of, like, i know this is happening. >> i got another beginning and ending. this ending is the most surprising. you said nobody is going to get it. >> nobody's going to get it. i got to compete against e

everything. i got to compete against you guys. a presidential candidate is on trial for paying off a porn star and the first witness is named pecker. >> i know. reality is crazy these days. . >> i got to compete with you guys. >> yeah, i see it. i also need to understand how you can pull off green glasses. have you noticed that, willie? >> he can pull off anything. >> i'm amazed. >> if i'm going to sit next to donny -- >> he's an icon. >> the book is "think twice." harlan coben, thank you very much. >> thank you. still ahead, we'll move back to politics, the a look at president biden's latest rounds of attacks on donald trump as he tries to draw a clear contrast between himself and his predecessor. we'll dig into the new polling

which shows a substantial bump for president biden if trump is convicted in the criminal hush money case. "morning joe" is coming right back. is coming right back oooh! i can't wait for this family getaway! shingles doesn't care. shingles is a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. ahhh, there's nothing like a day out with friends. that's nice, but shingles doesn't care! 99% of adults 50 years or older already have the virus that causes shingles inside them, and it can reactivate at any time. a perfect day for a family outing! guess what? shingles doesn't care. but shingrix protects. only shingrix is proven over 90% effective. shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. an increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix.

fainting can also happen. the most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling at the injection site, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. shingles doesn't care. but shingrix protects. ask your doctor or pharmacist about shingrix today. i have moderate to severe crohn's disease. now, there's skyrizi. ♪ things are looking up, i've got symptom relief. ♪ ♪ control of my crohn's means everything to me. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ feel significant symptom relief at 4 weeks with skyrizi, including less abdominal pain and fewer bowel movements. skyrizi is the first il-23 inhibitor that can deliver remission and visibly improve damage of the intestinal lining. and the majority of people experienced long-lasting remission at one year. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to. liver problems may occur in crohn's disease.

♪ now's the time to ask your gastroenterologist how you can take control of your crohn's with skyrizi. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ ♪ learn how abbvie could help you save. [ growl ] ready for the road trip. ♪ everyone comfortable. yep, there's plenty of space. i've even got an extra seat. wait! no, no, no, no, no. [ gasps ] [ indistinct chatter ] [ sigh ] let's just wait them out. the volkswagen atlas with three rows of seating for seven. everyone wants a ride. [ snoring ] ok, get in. [ speaking minionese ] yippee! and see "despicable me 4" in theaters july 3rd. rated pg.

why choose a sleep number smart bed? can i make my side softer? i like my side firmer. sleep number does that. now, save 50% on the sleep number limited edition smart bed. plus, 0% interest for 36 months. shop now at sleepnumber.com

a little bit of a hold --

oh, brunson, are you kidding? jalen brunson! >> an incredible shot and move by many by jalen brunson last night. the knicks star scoring 44 points in reaching the 40-point mark for the fifth time this season and the rebound with the blowout in indianapolis with the 121-41 win over the pacers in indianapolis. if they can win that they'll go to the eastern conference finals for the first time since the year 2000, in indianapolis, that's a tall task. donny, there is a chance we may have a game seven on sunday afternoon in madison square garden with the eastern conference finals on the line. >> there's a connection that you have to these knicks that theville nova three. they are a lunch pail, gritty team. this is the most likable team and even more likable than the early '90s teams with anthony

mason and what not. the garden has been insane. like there's nothing like -- what people forget about the garden is you're there. it's not like the other arenas like you're back there and even jonathan, this is what a big man you are that you were able to give kudos to the msg and the mecca and thattic mas you a big man. >> it ain't the garden when the floor is sweating in the 1980s. >> msg is a special place and we, maybe -- >> let's be, yeah, but we are one away and if they can take care of business against the depleted cavaliers team. celtics-knicks in the eastern conference finals would be a lot of fun and fracture relationships. >> we should go sit together and see what happens. >> i mentioned this to you earlier. a celtics-knicks final -- that's a great of matchup, but the

weakness in the thing for the celtics, jonathan is the knicks, in my suspicion are a little bit tougher than the celtics are. >> the knicks are tough. this is a celtics team that has taken the foot off the gas far too many times especially if they get porzingis back. >> let's not get ahead of ourselves, the superstitious knicks fans have to win in indianapolis or an anything goes. the nuggets mvp, nichola jokic got his award. >> he doesn't go home, he shoots guns, he plays horses. >> goes home to serbia, and he was asked after their huge win in the finals last year. he said i just want to go home. i'm tired. he didn't even have time to celebrate. last night after the mvp trophy,

he scored 40 points to lead 10er have to a 112-97 win in the second-round playoff series. the nuggets will try to close out the t-wolves on the road in game six. they won the first two games on the road in denver and some people were calling for a sweep here, but the nuggets are back in command up 3-2. >> so who is the basketball -- are you the basketball expert at the table? >> i'd say willie is. >> you play. >> let me ask you guys, i've seen the training regimens, of course, on instagram. i've seen the training regimens that young, tall, european basketball players do from the very beginning and we've seen it over the past several years, 6'10", 6'11", 7', big men being able to move extraordinarily gracefully and being able to take three-point shots.

are we starting to train our kids that way in the u.s.? because here it's, like, you're either a guard and you're fast and you eat and are underneath. >> victor wembanyama, he's 6'4", and he would have been sampson, that position doesn't exist in the nba anymore. you have to be able to shoot three-pointers. >> a lot of it has to do with three-point shooting. >> that's incredible. >> he would not be the force in the league because the teams are not that way, but to your point and to validate what you're saying, they play now with their face in the basket and those days are over. >> the game has changed. you have to be able to shoot three. other thing that people in the league say about the guys that grow up in european here it's more team oriented and here it's more individual and what do the european guys do? they also play soccer and that

helps with their footwork and that was always hakim olajuwon. >> i saw jokic -- >> luka. doncic. >> in terms of his ability and the passing ability. >> wow. >> still ahead, we're digging into new polling that donald trump's criminal hush money trial may be shifting americans' perception of the former president's conduct. >> and stick around we have big breaking news about the presidential campaign when "morning joe" returns. paign when "morning joe" returns. nce and i saved hundreds. that's great. i know, right? i've been telling everyone. baby: liberty. did you hear that? ty just said her first word. can you say “mama”? baby: liberty. can you say “auntie”?

baby: liberty. how many people did you tell? >> and stick around we have big (♪♪) with chewy, save 20% on your first pharmacy order so you can put an end to the itch. get flea and tick medication delivered right to your door. [panting] if advanced lung cancer has you searching for possibilities, discover a different first treatment. immunotherapies work with your immune system to attack cancer. but opdivo plus yervoy is the first combination of 2 immunotherapies for adults newly diagnosed with non-small cell lung cancer that has spread, tests positive for pd-l1, and does not have an abnormal egfr or alk gene. opdivo plus yervoy is not chemotherapy, it works differently. it helps your immune system fight cancer in 2 different ways. opdivo and yervoy can cause your immune system to harm healthy parts of your body during and after treatment. these problems can be severe and lead to death. see your doctor right away if you have a cough; chest pain;

shortness of breath; irregular heartbeat; diarrhea; constipation; severe stomach pain; severe nausea or vomiting; dizziness; fainting; eye problems; extreme tiredness; changes in appetite, thirst or urine; rash; itching; confusion; memory problems; muscle pain or weakness; joint pain; flushing; or fever. these are not all the possible side effects. problems can occur together and more often when opdivo is used with yervoy. tell your doctor about all medical conditions including immune or nervous system problems, if you've had or plan to have an organ or stem cell transplant, or received chest radiation. your search for 2 immunotherapies starts here. ask your doctor about opdivo plus yervoy. a chance to live longer. hi, i'm david, and i lost 92 pounds on golo. ask your doctor about opdivo plus yervoy. my life partner connie and i were in really rough shape

regarding our health. and our doctors told us that we needed to lose weight. i saw a golo commercial and i thought, "we really need to try this." as the weeks went by, the weight came off. we learned to make healthy choices and be supportive of each other. together, we've lost 170 pounds. golo worked for us. since losing weight on golo, i'm feeling grateful and hopeful about the future. (energizing music) what causes a curve down there? is it peyronie's disease? will it get worse? how common is it? who can i talk to? can this be treated? stop typing. start talking to a specialized urologist. because it could be peyronie's disease, or pd. it's a medical condition where there is a curve in the erection, caused by a formation of scar tissue. and an estimated 1 in 10 men may have it. but pd can be treated even without surgery. say goodbye to searching online. find a specialized urologist who can diagnose pd and build a treatment plan with you. visit makeapdplan.com today.

♪♪ breaking news here on "morning joe." president biden laying out his terms for participating in the presidential debates this fall. >> well, and the breaking news is that they're not going to go the commission route. donald trump has already said in the past he's not going to go the commission route. trump said he'll debate biden any time, any place. it looks like joe biden has taken him up on that. let's see what the president's saying. >> donald trump lost two debates to me in 2020. since then he hasn't shown up for a debate. now he want tos debate me again. make my date, pal. i'll do it twice. i hear you're free on wednesdays. >> oh! nothing subtle with that!

>> yeah. >> that was straight down the middle. >> for anyone that doesn't know, that is when court is in recess. >> they've said "no" to the presidential debate commission which is something that donald trump had said in the past he was going to say no to. >> correct. >> trump said he'd debate him any time, any place. biden said we're not going by those rules anymore. we'll debate you two times. >> june and september are the months that the biden campaign is putting forth. they'll have to come to an agreement on the actual dates. you're right, we should remember and the 2020. trump and the campaign savaged the commission and said we're not going to do that anymore. donald trump refused to participate in any republican primary debates. he would not be part of that. he has now taken to truth social and his media appearance saying i'll debate joe biden any time he wants. the biden campaign said we will

debate. there was never a suggestion that they'll duck the debates and now they're coming up with terms. june and september. >> they've also said we're not going to do debates after early voting has begun first of all, but secondly, the presidential commission, one of the reasons they're not doing it. you don't play by the rules. you let this guy come with covid because you were afraid to test him and his family? that's an absolute joke, and also we saw how donald trump crowded hillary, moved around and they're, like, let's have a real debate? no audience. you and me. >> even in the context of the commission on presidential debates historically, the debate about debates. what are the terms of the debates? who are the moderators going to be? what are the topics? these are always big debates in every presidential year, the negotiations go on for months, eventually someone threatens to pull out and you have rules that

everyone abides by. as you said, joe, i think the process in 2020 could not have been more broken if you think about what happened in that fall. >> yeah. >> in that context with the stakes that high. now you've seen donald trump and the way he's handled the republican debates or not handled them demonstrating that he has no respect for this process. he's just trying to advance his own interest. both sides do that, but this is a way for them to say, look, we are ready to -- >> call his bluff? we are debate in june. that's not far away, and that's next month if i've got my calendar right and now there are a big set of questions. who is going to moderate the debates? are these debates -- or the duration of the debates, what will be the topics of the debates? who will moderate them? i believe there will be no audiences and they'll step outside. they're not going to have screaming and they'll try to have a serious debate.

it's hard to do that with donald trump, but they're trying to seize control of the agenda here for a very important set of concerns as you said, before early voting starts. >> what they're trying to do is have a real debate. >> i am still stuck with "i hear you're free on wednesdays." wow. your thoughts? >> the best part of this announcement that was just made is that announcement that the president of the united states brief, punchy, clearly understandable and basically saying let's go, tough guy. i think that's what a lot of people are looking for from joseph biden. >> they just got it. >> going back to 2020, donald trump pulled out in the second of three debates because it was going to be held virtually and in the middle of covid and that got us into the town halls where savannah did such a great job with donald trump. the whole process was a mess, the question now will be has joe biden called the bluff of donald trump who said any time, any place. joe biden said here are the times and the places. let's do it.

we'll see what donald trump says. >> i've been refreshing the truth social feed. trump has not yet responded. there have been doubts throughout this process whether each man would debate and we said joe biden, and both men have now publicly committed to it. trump has backed out of such things before and we'll see if he'll follow through. june and september. we also should note that the biden team is proposing a vice presidential debate in july. so it would be between the republican convention mid-july in milwaukee and the democrats in the end of august and chicago, and there will be a total of three, two presidential and one v.p. >> he talks tough and then he always backs out. i'm going to do this in three weeks and backs out. he backed out of every debate and refused to debate republicans and refused to debate nikki haley. so i wonder whether his people who understand the less people hear of trump the better the campaign does. i wonder if he's going to find an excuse to back out of these

debates, too. >> i think he will definitely try to. i mean, the reality is to use -- i come from brownsville, brooklyn. donald trump is a political punk. he does not want to go on stage without a cheering squad, without all of the things that he needs. >> yeah. >> to make him feel all charged up. one-on-one. >> you know this because you grew up around james brown, when you say something stupid and there's dead silence. >> right. >> it lands with a thud and donald trump speaks so much nonsense, there will be no crowd. >> there's no crowd. >> to hoot, holler and laugh, and those stupid words will just hang in the air. >> and look stupid. and he needs all of that to do the donald trump act. to have to stand there and really deal with serious policies and answer serious questions with no way of trying to deviate and distract, he is not going to agree to this. i don't -- he can look at the

feed all he wants, donald trump will try any way he can not to have to deal with one-on-one with a real blue collar guy who didn't -- who was not raised as an elitist like donald trump was that needs props to try to get through. >> if you are just tuning in on the west coast -- >> we should play it. >> we'll say it again. joe biden has said he will debate donald trump in june, the vice presidential debate in july, and the second debate in september. said no to the presidential commission because they're still rangeled that they couldn't enforce the rules against donald trump and they allowed him to go on stage with covid and were too scared to test him and constant eruptions and trump canceled the second debate and we can go on and on and on and this is what joe biden said and it was released at 8:00 a.m. >> donald trump lost two debates to me in 2020. since then he hasn't shown up

for a debate. now he's acting like he wants to debate me again. make my day, pal. i'll do it twice. let's pick the dates, donald. i hear you're free on wednesdays. >> plug in to the day's news. today's a wednesday. john, if you're -- this is not a partisan or political point, if you actually are interested in watching two people debate substance and issues, this is the way to go. if you don't want the spectacle of the crowds cheering and the performative stuff then make these debates so painful to watch. the best debates are the ones where two state senators are standing in a tiny local news studio at podiums with the local news anchor and you actually get something out of them. >> it brings into focus how important the question of a moderator is going to be. it is always important and the moderators in these situations have to deal with donald trump and the way in which -- that we saw when he went one-on-one with biden in 2020. i also think it's a very modern acknowledgement of the way elections are conducted now.

this goes to the voting point and worth pausing on to say it. people will say this is -- america will start to focus on this until after labor day or the biden campaign to take it out of the biden campaign's mouth. what's the virtue of this? election day is no longer the day when people vote. many people vote on election day, but tens of millions of people -- tens of millions of people in america are going to vote in october and in september, stretching -- >> right. >> this is a proposal that says we are ready to do away with the fiction that there's only one day. there's election day. there are many election days and to give people an ability to see these candidates at a time when they can have a discussion that is about ostensibly of matters of grave national importance and substantive policies and they can have it outside the circus-like, potentially very charged atmosphere that will inevitably happen given the

stakes in this election. the closer we get to election day the more crazy things will get. this gives you a chance to have a more -- >> debate. >> if donald trump will do it. a more nuanced, substantive debate before anyone has the chance to go to the polls before they see them on stage together. >> donald trump doesn't want that. he doesn't want a substantive debate. i remember back in 2016 i read donald trump's editorial board interview with "the washington post" editorial board and he went on talking about his hands -- and i'm serious about half the time, and i read it to mika, i said this guy, he's out of his mind. he's crazy. mika goes, crazy like a fox. as long as he's talking about his hands he doesn't have to talk about policy and he is so ignorant on policy that that's a loser for him. you talk to the people who served with him, who donald trump appointed, who donald trump said were the best and the brightest and the most gifted

and the most this and that, they will tell you now the guy was completely ignorant on policy. it was frightening. it was scary. it was depressing. if you just -- if you have a real debate, if you don't have a pep rally, but you have a real debate with real questions, when donald trump confuses joe biden for barack obama, when donald trump confuses -- and i'm serious, jimmy carter for jimmy connors, when donald trump suggests that joe biden can lead us into world war ii, i'm dead serious here, if there are people cheering and yelling and this and that, that gets kind of papered over. in this case, this is pure political death for donald trump because he will be judged on the merits, and when he is judged on the merits he always loses. >> you're absolutely right in every aspect of what you just said about donald trump, and let's simplify this.

the tape that we showed coming into this and we just showed it again, the president of the united states speaking very briefly, succinctly and toughly about this proposal that is on the table for two debates, just one-on-one, this gives the president of the united states the opportunity to take the bully into the ring and take his lunch from him because joe biden is the tough guy here, not donald trump. joe biden's life has been one of toughness. look at the things that he has come back from. look at the things that he has walked through with hunched shoulders, certainly, losing children, things like that, never asking for sympathy, just keep moving on. that's the joe biden that people are going to see in this debate. that's the joe biden that would scare the you know what out of donald trump. >> all right. let's bring in michael tyler with the biden-harris campaign. michael, if you can tell us what the thinking was here in terms of the campaign or did this come direct from joe biden and have you heard anything from the trump campaign?

>> yeah, well, good morning. thank you for having me. listen, the president himself did not mince word, right? he said he beat donald trump twice in 2020. donald trump hasn't debated since. the president is happy to debate. he's happy to do it twice, and he thinks we should do this sooner rather than later so the american people can see the stark choice that's in front of them in this election. we should do it in june after donald trump's criminal trial's likely to conclude and after the president returns from the g7 summit and then we should have a second debate in september well ahead of early voting, so the american people can hear from both candidates before they go cast their ballots and that's what we should be doing in a 21st century presidential election. the president is ready to do so. the question now becomes will donald trump keep his word? will he step up to the plate here? we haven't heard from him yet, but we'll be waiting all day. >> good morning. talk to us about the thinking about cutting out the commission here and dealing with the networks. trump has been highly critical of them in previous cycles and

said he might be open to working with them again and walk us through how this will happen? >> it goes back to what i was just saying, the 21st century presidential campaign. there are a couple of things that matter. number one, we have to make sure that the american people can actually see the candidates debate before they go cast their ballots. the commission's proposal did not allow for that and they were having debates well into october when early voting begins in september, but secondly now we've seen in years past two issues, right? they've been treating these debates more like spectacles rather than substantive conversations between two candidates that want to become president and they should be. we saw the inability of the commission to force the candidates to adhere to the rules. you had donald trump repeatedly breaking the rules and skipping out on debates and we can do it in a manner where the rules are enforceable and that the american people have the opportunity to actually hear from the candidate before they cast their ballots and that's what we're doing and that's what

we'll be able on do. >> michael, you used the term spectacle and the way this is outlined would not have a spectacle. if we are able to get the debate, if donald trump will agree to this, assuming that he is not convicted before that and has to get permission from his parole officer to show up, would you talk about how removing the audiences, removing all of the games that you play on the side, but one-on-one debate with a moderator would really give the issues and policies to the american people from each candidate? >> that's exactly right, rev. listen, the president said this morning he has a couple of questions he wants to ask donald trump. he wants to ask him why he's proudly bragging about the role he played in overturning roe v. wade. he wants to ask him about the threat he posses to our democracy and he wants to ask

him why he wants to return us to an economy that benefits rich people like donald trump and those are the substantive conversations that we'll have in a one-on-one format free from the spectacle and free from the distractions and it should be yen and donald trump talking it out on the issues that the american people care about and that's what we're hoping to achieve with this proposal. >> michael, it's holland here, you made a lot of news here and i'll ask you to make a little bit more. there will be a big debate if trump accepts the proposal over who the moderators are and there is negotiation over that even when the commission has run things and put that aside for a second. do you have any thoughts about format? are these -- are you thinking one should be town hall, one should be standing or one-on-one or should they both be the same? and the second is what about substance? are you thinking for domestic issues for one and foreign policy issues for the other or

ideas how you want to divide up the topics over the first two debates that you're proposing? >> yeah, there are still details that we have to work out, no doubt about that and the top line here is we want one-on-one debates between joe biden and donald trump on the issues, free of distraction, right? and so, that's what we are advocating for. insofar as moderators, we want to make sure that the networks themselves are choosing from among the their normal roster of candidates -- or talent pool so there's no question over who is in control here. we want to make sure we have a conversation that is structured and on the issues that the american people care about. we want to talk about abortion. we want to talk about the economy. we want to talk about our fundamental rights and freedoms. we want to talk about the threat that donald trump poses to our democracy and make sure that the american people can hear the full-throated arguments between the two candidates because we are confident in the joe biden campaign that when they hear the candidates talk about the issues of freedom and issues of democracy and who is fighting

for you on the economy and they'll side with joe biden and not quite sure joe biden and his team feel the same way and we'll have to hear what they say. >> the director for the biden-harris campaign. >> thank you, michael. the other question is who's going to air these debates? the commission in the past has decided which network will get which debate and that will be another item on the table. does fox news get the debate? do they not? >> so willie, let me read this from from "the new york times" story by jonathan swan and maggie haberman. the biden campaign has proposed rules -- i love this, automatic cutting off of microphones to make sure donald trump does not blow over his time limits as he did so relentlessly during the debate in 2020. quote, there should be time limits for answers and alternate turns to speak. we have an exchange of views and not a spectacle and not mutual

interruption miss o'malley writes. a candidate should only be active when it is his turn to speak to proceed with orderly proceedings. >> i would say who in the world would be against that other than donald trump? >> he'll call it a gag order. >> let's play by the rules. everybody gets an equal amount of time and nobody gets to interrupt the other. we get to actually have people talking about ideas. >> and on paper that is what the debates are supposed to be and absolutely never are. >> never happen. >> that spectacle you're describing there. donald trump cannot agree to these terms because he will be steam rolled in that format. he can't carry on with no audience cheering him on, without a friendly moderator. he cannot win that debate on the merits and the issues. he also doesn't like having the terms of a debate dictated to him and he'll say sure, i'll agree to that even though he said even though, any place. it will be interesting to see

what his counteroffer is if he want tos debate joe biden. >> the guy who dodged so many debates. he hasn't debated anybody since 2020 because he lost those two debates, i guess, and he didn't want to debate the republicans. >> well, we'll see if the trump campaign has a response any time soon about this, but i agree with the table. i don't think he's going to let this happen to himself because it's too scary for him. it's too fair. it's actually a debate. he can't win that, but he could loud mouth his way through a situation. >> he's never done that before. >> no. except for every morning and every afternoon when he comes in and out of court. coming up, as the president alluded to in his campaign announcement, today is one of the rare weekdays when donald trump is not in a new york courtroom. we'll recap michael cohen's testimony there yesterday and what's ahead for tomorrow when "morning joe" comes right back. we are back in 90 seconds. >> donald trump lost two debates to me in 2020.

since then he has not shown up for a debate and now he's acting like he wants to debate me again. make my day, pal. i'll do it twice. i hear you're free on wednesdays. i hear you're free on wednesdays kayak. i like to do things myself. i do my own searching. it isn't efficient. use kayak. i can't trust anything else to do the job right. aaaaaaaahhhh! kayak. search one and done. my fear of recurrence could've held me back. but i'm staying focused. and doing more to prevent recurrence. verzenio is specifically for hr-positive, her2-negative, node-positive early breast cancer with a high chance of returning, as determined by your doctor

when added to hormone therapy. verzenio reduces the risk of recurrence versus hormone therapy alone. diarrhea is common, may be severe, or cause dehydration or infection. at the first sign, call your doctor, start an antidiarrheal, and drink fluids. before taking verzenio, tell your doctor about any fever, chills, or other signs of infection. verzenio may cause low white blood cell counts, which may cause serious infection that can lead to death. life-threatening lung inflammation can occur. tell your doctor about any new or worsening trouble breathing, cough, or chest pain. serious liver problems can happen. symptoms include fatigue, appetite loss, stomach pain, and bleeding or bruising. blood clots that can lead to death have occurred. tell your doctor if you have pain or swelling in your arms or legs, shortness of breath, chest pain and rapid breathing or heart rate, or if you are nursing, pregnant, or plan to be. i'm focusing on what counts. talk to your doctor about reducing your risk. ♪ we'll talk about the politics of this in a moment, but first, let's talk about the testimony, joyce. michael cohen was back on the

strand and we turn from from direct to cross-examination. >> there is another full day of cross-examination coming and michael cohen exceeded expectations. he kept a calm demeanor and a big part of this is less evidence that's coming out and more the way the jury perceives michael cohen. they have to believe him in order to convict. there's just too much in his testimony. if he continues on this path he may just pull it out. >> it seemed to be that todd blanche, the attorney for donald trump was pushing the idea that michael cohen was sort of a jilted former employee of donald trump, and he brought up the social media post about the cheeto dust and all of that and said this is program for you, effectively and you've been a proven liar before and not to be trusted. did he make a convincing argument about those yesterday? >> he may have more, but what we saw yesterday -- i've had a lot

of cases where that's the strategy on cross-examination, and where the defense lawyer tries to imply that the witness is biassed against the defendant. well, look, these witnesses, they're always biassed against the defendant and the prosecution handles that. >> the prosecution also suggested that cohen would be their last witness and we don't know if the defense is going to call any -- i mean, trump still toys that he might take the stand and we're skeptical of that. >> can we move into sum magdzs and next week. >> that's a possibility. i'm surprised we're not hearing expert testimony on the finance violations that have to be proven. it's possible the defense could put on a witness that will talk about that, but closing argument? that's not going to take a full day, i wouldn't think, and then the jury is off to the races once they're instructed by the judge on the law. >> and how do you think from -- from the beginning to this point

how do you think it's going for the prosecution? >> you know, it is tough to say. what we're doing right now is we're listening to the story of all the evidence. i mean, america's obsessing line by line over the questions, but the judge is about to tell the jury you have to find two things. you have to find that donald trump created or caused to be created false business records and you have to find that he did that with an intent to defraud, an intent to commit or conceal another crime. we haven't really been looking at the evidence in that legal framework so far, but that's what the judge will tell the jury they have to do and that's a little bit different from listening to the story and saying, oh, i really think donald trump did this which is more -- >> on those two questions is the prosecution carrying its burden? >> you know, that is up to the jury, joe. >> from what you've seen? >> i think on the first one, the issue is have they successfully put donald trump in the mix? there is no doubt that false

business records were created. we've seen 34 of them. michael cohen, his testimony is corroborated to the extent that there are people who say meetings took place. there are phone records of calls, and then it comes down to do you believe him based on all of the other evidence that's out there, rid? alan weisselberg's handwritten notes on an invoice, there is a lot of cor cob rating evidence. the jury doesn't have to take a huge leap of faith to believe michael cohen and it's more taking steps on the straight line. >> in a nation where 77 million americans voted for donald trump, what's the possibility that the prosecution's going to get 12 people finding him guilty? >> you know, juries are very different than public opinion and i'll just say as pollyannaish as i think it sometimes sounds, as a prosecutor you are used to looking at 12 american citizens and asking them to do their job, to listen to the evidence, to understand the law, to set aside

any external noise. >> and you've seen, they take it seriously. >> they do it and they do it in public corruption cases, and i think the question that we're struggling with is whether there's something about donald trump that's different even in this context of a jury. >> can i ask you two quick questions? one, do you think in the end that michael cohen is crucial to this or the counter argument, why did they put michael cohen on? do you think he's important or not important? >> i'm firmly in the camp that believes michael cohen's testimony is essential. i don't think the prosecution could have tried this case without putting him on simply because the defense would have asked for an adverse inference, right? if the government has michael cohen available and they don't put him on, you should assume, ladies and gentlemen of the jury that something he would say would be harmful to them. >> is there a path to reasonable doubt for one juror? >> there is always a path to reasonable doubt for one juror. >> joyce vance, so good to see

you. still ahead on "morning joe," we're going to get the political side of trump's trial and how some of the former president's sycophants -- >> oh, my gosh! >> oh, my god! >> the matching ties! >> look at this! >> i think we should all -- >> they're wearing matching underwear. >> who is coordinating their wardrobe? that's what i want to know. >> that hurts me. >> especially when this guy, the governor, burgum said he would never do business with donald trump several months ago because you are judged by the company you keep. >> right. and yesterday he said i'm here voluntarily. >> "morning joe" will be right back. >> "morning joe" will be right back oh, yeah, man. take it from your inner child. what you really need in life is some freakin' torque.

what? the dodge hornet r/t... the totally torqued-out crossover. (psst! psst!) ahhh! with flonase, allergies don't have to be scary. spray flonase sensimist daily for non-drowsy long lasting relief in a scent free, gentle mist. flonase all good. also, try our allergy headache and nighttime pills.

republican senator tommy tuberville -- >> i like purple. >> oh, man. >> donald trump to court this week. to, quote, overcome the gag order imposed on the former president is president. he interviewed yesterday with newsmax. the alabama senator spoke outside the courthouse on monday where among other things he called it a question to citizenship -- >> come on, man. >> of the jurors serving on the trial. >> mental anguish is trying to be pushed on the republican candidate for the president of the united states. that's all this is. he's been here a month. he's been here a month. i am disappointed in looking at the supposed american citizens in that courtroom. >> this judge is pretty much got everybody hog tied, i would call from president trump on down, anybody on his side. hopefully we have more and more senators in congressmen to go out and overcome this gag order and that's one of the reasons we

went is to be able to speak our peace for president trump. >> supposed lead american citizens says senator tuberville. he was in court with more of his allies helping to get around the gag order. among them house speaker mike johnson who repeated many of donald trump's false claims about the cases against him. the man second in line criticized michael cohen's testimony and attacked the judge's taught or behalf of the former president. >> what would happen if nancy pelosi went to hunter biden's trial and attacked the key witness against hunter biden and then attacked the judge's daughter? let's just play that game out for a second. >> wall to wall coverage, full meltdown. >> full meltdown. >> it's something she wouldn't do -- >> of course she wouldn't. >> alex, do we have suits, the matching outfits that -- do we have that? >> that's the picture of the day. >> cyborg from the multiverse. >> so this is all the men who

showed up to support donald trump yesterday, republican congressman, governor of north dakota doing the people's business of north dakota in lower manhattan and vivek ramaswamy all wearing the same suit and the red tie, the red tie favored by donald trump. charlie sykes, what do you see in these images? >> i see politicians running toward the sound of the sleaze because that's what their master is demanding them. i suppose at this point we shouldn't be surprised, but it's still shocking. it's still amazing that you have these politicians embracing donald trump in the middle of a hush money trial, he can walk out of that courtroom as a convicted felon. look, it's one thing for republicans to say, okay, we like donald trump because of his policies on taxes or on the border or on education, but what's happening now is that it's become the new litmus test and you have to embrace it all.

you have to embrace the validity and the election denial and the lies and you have to embrace the insurrection. you have to embrace the hush money to the porn star and the multiple affairs and you have tome brace the obstruction of justice and you have to be part of the obstruction of justice and that's the moment when you say we need to remind everybody that this is not normal that the speaker of the house house of representatives would show up at the felony trial supporting donald trump, not in spite of his character, but embracing all of it and then basically using his position to -- to violate the gag order and to say things that the judge says this would affect the trial. now, whether this is going to have any effect on the jury, we don't know, whether it is going to intimidate the jury and whether it will impress the jury, but again, we're seeing an american politics that we have

never seen before which was unimaginable until the last two days and by the way, as you guys have pointed out. so much for the party of morality and the party of law and order. >> we'll pick up on this after a short break. coming up, how liz cheney reacted to mike johnson's appearance at donald trump's hush money trial. that's next on "morning joe." e. oh, yeah, man. take it from your inner child. what you really need in life is some freakin' torque. what? the dodge hornet r/t... the totally torqued-out crossover.

hi, i'm jason. i've lost 228 pounds on golo. ♪ i don't ever want to go back to wearing a 4xl shirt or not being able to climb up stairs without taking a break. so i'm committed to golo for life. i've struggled with generalized myasthenia gravis. but the picture started changing when i started on vyvgart. ♪♪ vyvgart is for adults with generalized myasthenia gravis who are anti-achr antibody positive. ♪♪ in a clinical trial, vyvgart significantly improved most participants' ability to do daily activities when added to their current gmg treatment. most participants taking vyvgart also had less muscle weakness. and your vyvgart treatment schedule is designed just for you. in a clinical study, the most common side effects included urinary and respiratory tract infections, and headache. vyvgart may increase the risk of infection. tell your doctor if you have a history of infections or symptoms of an infection.

vyvgart can cause allergic reactions. available as vyvgart for iv infusion and also as vyvgart hytrulo for subcutaneous injection. additional side effects for vyvgart hytrulo may include injection site reactions. talk to your neurologist about vyvgart. ♪♪

♪♪ ♪♪ former republican congresswoman liz cheney mocked mike johnson for his appearance at the trial. she posted on social media, quote, i have to admit i'm surprised that speaker johnson wants to be in the "i cheated on my wife with a porn star club." i guess he's not that concerned

with teaching morality to our young people after all. democratic congressman jamie raskin of maryland also called out the speaker sarcastically telling "the daily beast," i don't understand find anything, fundamental who thinks -- and con man for cooking the books to cover up hush money payments he made to a porn star to conceal his adulterous affair. do you? raskin making a reference to johnson telling fox news about his world view shortly after he was elected speaker last fall. >> i am a bible-believing christian. someone asked me. it's curious, what did mike johnson think of any issue under the sun. go pick up a bible and read it.

that's my world view. that's what i believe. >> joe, i know you're a bible scholar. i remember when mike johnson said that thing about how i'm -- if you want to know who i am and just look at that. it's an incredible spectacle. of the two things that are incredible about this, one is the speaker of the house is doing this and the other thing is that it's this speaker of the house that's willing to stand up for donald trump. it's like he has no memory of things that he said just apparently -- just a few months ago. >> not a bible scholar, but my parents did drag me to church four times a week. >> that makes you a bible scholar. >> i loved it and loved every second of it, but charlie sykes, here's a guy, you go back to the very beginning and we criticized mike johnson for saying just look at the bible. when mike johnson's speakership was built on the biggest lie in american politics. >> right. >> specifically, the big lie.

he was the guy that went around with -- with the sign-up sheet to support kim paxton's big lie out of texas trying to overthrow american democracy. so you can start there and go all of the way to what happened yesterday, unfortunately, and you know, like i said yesterday, charlie, and i'm sure you're the same way. i'm cheering for speaker mike johnson just like i would cheer for speaker hakeem jeffries and any speaker. i want them to succeed because i want america to succeed and yesterday was a very, very sad spectacle for america and for an institution i love. >> it was a bizarre spectacle. no, it's worth remembering that mike johnson became the speaker because he had a coup on his resume, because he did play the role in the big lie, but you know, i mean, the reality is that -- that mike johnson, that

mike johnson's speakership hangs by a thread, that he depends upon the favor of mar-a-lago, that all donald trump has to do is turn on him and he's out. so here you have mike johnson who survived that vacate the speaker vote with democratic support basically showing where the real power in the republican party is, and by the way, also not a surprise that he was fund-raising off of it. we know with the picture with he and donald trump, live from donald trump's trial for the various frauds to try to raise money, but this is who mike johnson is and the hypocrisy is almost too obvious to have to mention that here is someone who has built his entire identity on his christian morality and apparently, he and his son have a deal with a monitor one another's porn use, whatever, this is a trial about donald trump having an affair -- i

mean, having a fling with a porn star and a playboy model and then lying about it and there's mike johnson, i am there with you. i am with you on this. not just with you on taxes. not just with you on the border. i am with you on this, and i'm willing to help you obstruct justice by violating the gag order. >> i'm still thrown off by the whole thing. a little too deep in the shag carpet from the 1970s. nothing after that. charlie sykes, please. figure out what those young 'uns are doing in wisconsin and why there's a 50-point swing between the two, according to "the new york times"-sienna poll there will be an article coming up in a couple of days. thank you, charlie. i appreciate it. i said i was very grateful for mike johnson for finally approving aid to ukraine, but "the new york times," right next to this poll story right here

which one of 800, but a very important story here about russia starting to make really rapid gains in ukraine. the reason why? because donald trump wanted to help vladimir putin and he froze the house of representatives and mike johnson was obsequious for far too long. when johnson finally changed his mind and i'll give him the benefit of the doubt, just because, but you know, i think by that point i think the responsible people in the party came to him and said listen, we'll get this through with or without you. but i just want to say, even while we thank him for what he did, the cost of his delay, devastating to ukraine and -- and a gift that keeps on giving to vladimir putin. >> yeah. two quick things here as charlie said, speaker johnson paying a debt to donald trump.

donald trump pushed off ntg's motion to vacate. this is johnson saying thank you for keeping me in my post. as he noted, he stayed in the post because democrats came to his aid. a number of democrats saying, some i spoke to and others giving interviews to other media outlets saying that's not happening again. he just burned that bridge. we will not bail him out if there's another effort to push him out and that's a consequence of what johnson said yesterday and to a larger point, yes, joe. i talked to the last couple of days watching russia and the progress. the delay was costly and we're seeing russia take over a number of villages near kharkiv. they think that advances gains battlefield and the efforts to undermine american elections when the chairman of the senate intelligence committee mark warner is our guest. straight ahead on "morning joe." . straight ahead on "morning joe."

♪ before planning the wedding your bad hip was really acting up. then, you heard about mako robotic-assisted hip replacement. it starts with a ct scan to pinpoint the problem. that becomes a personalized, 3d plan to guide your doctor during surgery. mako can help lead to better outcomes, like less pain and shorter recovery times. the lifetime of a hip implant is limited, and revision surgery may be required. individual results and recovery times vary. risks of surgery include pain, infection, heart attack, stroke, death, and other serious risks.

ask your doctor for important safety information. to find a doctor who uses mako visit makocan.com

it's time to get away and cache in, at cache creek casino resort, to rock and to roll. to go all out or... go all in. with four stars and rising stars, northern california's premier casino resort is the perfect place... ...to do as much -or as little- as you want. make your get away now and cache in at cache creek casino resort.

it's a beautiful... ...day to fly. wooooo!

it's exactly one month into donald trump's trial, there is new polling that finds for the first time the majority of americans believe the former president is guilty. in the latest yahoo news yougov national poll, 52% of adults say trump did indeed falsify business records to conceal hush money payments to a porn star, that is up four points from last month and up seven points from when the charges were filed last year. if convicted, 51% would approve of trump serving prison time, while 36% would be against putting him behind wars. >> willie, look at that. 51% would support donald trump -- so i guess this isn't a far left wing conspiracy. >> no, that's the majority of americans. >> that would be -- wait, again, i went to alabama -- that's a majority, right? >> once you get to 51. >> joyce confirms. >> fantastic.

>> as for the political ramifications, the poll shows trump and president joe biden tied at 45% in this year's election among registered voters. but when asked who they would support if convicted, if trump is convicted -- >> well, that's not close. >> -- in the hush money case biden takes a seven-point lead 46 to 39%. "morning joe" is coming right back. o 39%. "morning joe" is coming right back

[coughing] copd isn't pretty. i'm out of breath, and often out of the picture. but this is my story. ( ♪♪ ) and with once-daily trelegy, it can still be beautiful. because with 3 medicines in 1 inhaler, trelegy keeps my airways open for a full 24 hours and prevents future flare-ups. trelegy also improves lung function, so i can breathe more freely all day and night. trelegy won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. do not take trelegy more than prescribed. trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. ♪ what a wonderful world ♪

[laughing] ask your doctor about once-daily trelegy for copd because breathing should be beautiful, all day and night.

former president trump appeared to fall asleep yesterday during michael cohen's testimony for a full half hour. again? you know, i was excited for this trial but it seems like the only thing we're accomplishing is making sure trump is well-rested before the election. and welcome to the fourth

hour of "morning joe." it is 6:00 a.m. on the west coast, 9:00 a.m. in the east. let's get right to this morning's breaking political news. president biden is laying out his terms for participating in the presidential debates this fall, agreeing to debate at least twice before the general election. take a look. >> donald trump lost two debates to me in 2020, since then he hasn't shown up for a debate, now he's acting like he wants to debate me again. well, make my day, pal. i will even do it twice. so let's pick the dates, donald. i hear you're free on wednesdays. >> wow. the biden campaign is rejecting the nonpartisan organization that has managed presidential debates from 1988 and wants the debates to start sooner than the fall. the fall dates on the commission on presidential debates proposed "the new york times" reports they want the debate to occur inside a tv studio with microphones that automatically

cut off when a speaker's time limit elapses and they want it to be just the two candidates and the moderator, without the raucous in-person audiences that mr. trump feeds on, and without the participation of robert f. kennedy jr. or other independent or third-party candidates. the campaign is also proposing one vice presidential debate to be held in late july. we are waiting to see if there would be a response. >> we were waiting to see what the response it is. moments ago donald trump responded writing in part, ready and willing to debate biden at the two proposed times in june and september. i would strongly recommend more than two debates and for excitement purposes a very large venue, although biden is supposedly afraid of crowds, i'm not sure what that means. that's only because he doesn't get them. just tell me when, i will be there. let's get ready to rumble. >> oh, okay.

>> writes the former president. so he says in in moment today, doesn't want to be seen as backing down that he would agree to these two debates, perhaps with some negotiating, some sticking points in there. >> we have been using catch phrases as part of their debate rhetoric. trump says he's in, but the devil is in the details here. there's a lot that has to be worked out. trump of course is going to need to say today that he's in, he doesn't want to project cowardly -- that he is cowardly, rev, but there is a lot. venue, moderator, whether or not they do make a choice about crowds. trump wants it, biden doesn't. the microphones will be a big issue, we highlighted that last hour. will trump dare -- will trump agree to a system where he could be cut off at any time. so i don't think we should count on these debates happening, but a few weeks ago i think you would have taken a bet said there would probably be no debates, at least today there is a chance. what do you think? >> i think there is a chance, but i think that donald trump will try to use every trick he can to avoid debating,

particularly on a one-on-one without an audience, because he does not know policy, he does not know really what his presidency would mean in terms of a reelect, and he does not need to be one-on-one where he cannot feed off of making audiences clap or laugh. as joe said earlier, where he gives his lines that would fall flat if it's just in a studio with joe biden and a moderator. so he is not going to try in any way, shape or form to cooperate with that kind of setup. >> mika, as we know, donald trump needs a crowd. he is most comfortable at his rallies, it's all he does, where he has a friendly audience that echos and doesn't call or respond and he can say whatever comes to his mind. in a controlled setting where there is no crowd, a well-informed moderator with good questions and it's about policy and it's about answering questions about perhaps some of his trials that are sitting in front of him, that's not a good

setup for donald trump. he's saying like john said he has to say today, of course, anytime, anyplace, let's get ready to rumble, but we will see when the negotiation starts. >> court proceeding is a pretty serious proceeding and he can't even go to that without bringing in little crowds here and there. >> at mar-a-lago he comes out and addresses the dinner audience most nights. we should note i'm told now there's yet to be any direct contact between the trump and biden campaigns. >> no, just -- >> just social media posts. >> just a truth post. truth in quotes. >> we are waiting to see when he gets a verdict in manhattan because if the verdict doesn't come into june, if he's convicted he will need the permission of his parole officer to travel to any debate. >> right. there's that. there's a long way to go. we have no idea how that's going to turn out, but that is -- that is the possible outcome there. >> never thought you would say that, did you, rev, a presidential candidate needs his

parole officer to have to go to a debate. >> and have to get permission, have to show proof that your parole officer approved you going to that city. if he's talking like he's one of the guys, if he gets convicted, he is in new york, a parole officer has to approve you leaving the state. you certainly can't leave the country. let's be real here now. he is potentially a convicted felon. >> okay. >> they have tv studios in manhattan. we will do it here. you heard president biden reference donald trump's schedule being free on wednesdays because those are the days off in his criminal hush money trial. so today no court in session. yesterday prosecutors wrapped up their questioning of michael cohen and the defense began cross-examination. nbc news senior legal correspondent laura jarrett has the latest. >> reporter: this morning signs donald trump's criminal trial is coming to a close, after his defense team took a sprawling first crack at michael cohen.

mr. trump's lead attorney offering jurors a grab bag of reasons to question cohen's motives from money, fame and media attention to jealousy and a lighter prison sentence. all an attempt to argue cohen, the only witness who directly ties the former president to the prosecution's charges, can't be trusted. >> can you believe i've been in here for five weeks instead of campaigning. >> reporter: trump attorney todd blanche first launching into cohen's videos on tiktok that had criticized blanche but the judge quickly warning don't make it about yourself. cohen depicted as a jilted former fixer now out for revenge. blanche asserting you were actually obsessed with president trump, weren't you? citing cohen's own words in his book. cohen also admitting he made more than $3 million off his books. tuesday's cross-examination highly anticipated but only a small portion was spent on cohen's criminal history and admitted lies under oath, and nothing on the critical testimony cohen had provided

just hours before. a tedious but legally significant play by play of invoices he sent and checks he received from mr. trump, all littered, cohen says, with false statements so that the former president could paper over how he reimbursed cohen for having silenced stormy daniels on his behalf to protect his 2016 campaign. the heart of the state's case. cohen going on to describe how his once tight bond with the former president frayed and ultimately imploded after the fbi raided his home and office in 2018. testifying mr. trump tried to reassure him, saying, don't worry, i am the president of the united states. stay tough. which cohen understood was code for, don't flip. >> nbc's laura jarrett reporting. again, day off today, the cross-examination of michael cohen continues tomorrow morning. meanwhile, the white house is expected to send more than a billion dollars in additional arms and ammunition now to israel. the "wall street journal" was the first to report the biden

administration notified congress it would move forward with the weapons deal yesterday. according to congressional aides the package includes tank ammunition, tactical vehicles and mortar rounds. this is not a part of the foreign aid package congress passed last month. not known specifically when or exactly the aid will be sent to israel. the move comes less than a week after the president paused a shipment of 2,000-pound bombs over concerns about israel's planned invasion of rafah. the white house believes a full-scale attack there will worsen an already dire humanitarian crisis. secretary of state antony blinken was in kyiv yesterday for an unannounced visit, meant to reassure ukraine that the united states remains committed to helping them fend off russia's advance. blinken met with ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy and discussed the importance of u.s. security assistance. congress recently approved a

long delayed aid package that set aside $60 billion for ukraine. blinken later gave a speech at a ukrainian university about the future of the country. >> the coming weeks and months will demand a great deal of ukrainians who have already sacrificed so much, but i have come to ukraine with a message. you are not alone. the united states has been by your side from day one. we are with you today and we will stay by your side until ukraine's security, its sovereignty, its ability to choose its own path is guaranteed. >> meanwhile, the white house is reportedly worried that russia's troops are gaining an edge in the war in ukraine. "the new york times" reports just 18 months ago white house and pentagon officials debated whether russia's forces in ukraine might collapse and be pushed out of the country entirely.

now, after months of slow russian ground advances and technological leaps in countering american-provided arms, the biden administration is increasingly concerned that president putin is gathering enough momentum to change the trajectory of the war and perhaps reverse his once bleak prospects. in interviews american officials expressed confidence that many of these russian gains are reversible once the spigot of new arms is fully opened, most likely sometime in july. but they are hesitant to offer predictions of where the battle lines may stand even a few months from now or whether zelenskyy will be able to mount his long delayed counteroffensive next year after the one last spring failed. of course, there was this huge delay that doesn't help the situation at all. >> of course. >> they needed the weapons. >> let's bring into the conversation democratic senator mark warner of virginia, he's chairman of the senate intel

committee which in just a few hours will hold a hearing to discuss foreign threats to the 2024 election. mr. chairman, we will get to that in just a moment, but let's start with russia. even just this morning vladimir putin saying that things are improving, positions and directions every day and that things now are back going to plan for his military that may be propaganda, that may just be rhetoric, but as the chair of the intel committee, what's your sense of the way things are going for ukraine right now? >> well, you guys already mentioned, you know, the six-month delay in us getting these arms approved was a huge mistake and thank god they are now flowing. they fully won't be all there until probably middle of the summer. the only thing -- the one thing that gives me heart, though, is that russians are throwing huge amounts of troops, their casualties are very high and as we saw last year when the ukrainians tried to go on offensive, the way that war is

being waged, with massive mine fields and the use of drones, it's a heck of a lot easier to be on defense than it is to be on offense. so if we can rush those munitions to the ukrainians, give them so they are not outgunned 10 to 1 and can respond in kind, i think they will be able to hold the line. i don't think -- i'm not optimistic at least in the coming months that you're going to see another ukrainian offensive. i think there will probably be a bit of a stabilization of the lines, but the sooner we get those bullets, bombs and air defense systems to ukraine, the better. >> and as you say, all that aid isn't approved and suddenly show up on the battlefield overnight, it takes some time to get it out there and russia is moving in toward kharkiv, the second largest city in ukraine. switching briefly, mr. chairman, to israel, that $1 billion aid package proposed by the biden administration, separate from the $14 billion

that congress approved just last month, comes a week after the president took a lot of heat for saying he was going to withhold some of those 2,000-pound heavy bombs if, in fact, prime minister netanyahu decided to go into rafah. is the white house getting this balance right of continuing to support israel, while being critical of some of its decisions in prosecuting the war? >> i think they're trying to thread the needle and i do think we need to continue to support israel's right to defend itself, but what frustrates me is a friend, an ally of israel, is that we hear nothing from the israeli government about what is going to happen the day after any offensive takes place. we've already seen, you know, the idf thought they had taken control of the north, yet because there is no governance structure hamas has reconstituted itself a little bit in gaza city. on a broader basis we're seeing huge moves in the middle east in terms of saudi arabia in

particular being interested in a defense treaty with the united states and potentially an alliance with israel. that would be game changing. but that's not going to happen as long as the war is going on in gaza. we're going to need after the war is over for saudi, the emirates and other nation states to help rebuild gaza. that gets tougher and tougher if the israeli government doesn't heed some of the warnings. yes, eliminate hamas but we have to consider also literally the tens of thousands of civilians that have been killed. >> senator, let's move to today's hearing about threats towards the 2024 election. what's your sense as to where these threats are coming from and is the united states compared to previous cycles, are we ready for them? >> i'm afraid we're not as ready, strange as it seems, as we were in 2020. in 2020 there was active communication between the social

media companies and the government, people i think had fresh memories of what happened in 2016. fast forward to today, less than six months out, we've got three problems, one, it's not just russia, it will be china, it will be iran. our adversaries realize it's relatively cheap to either try to cyber attack our infrastructure or, more likely, use disinformation to try to pit americans against americans. we see russia doing that realtime in many european countries as the european parliamentary elections go along. second, unfortunately and you guys talk about this on the show on a regular basis, americans are a lot more willing to believe crazy conspiracy theories. things that pop up on the internet get attraction level that they never got before. crazy things amplified by a foreign power is a problem. and then third, artificial intelligence. the ability for ai to use deepfakes where your image, my image, our voices can be

completely altered is really, really challenging and we have no guardrails in place. 20 of the tech companies i worked with on an international basis to say they would work to try to take down deepfakes and identify those, we've got a big announcement about that in february in munich. so far i have not seen a lot of action from those 20 tech companies. as i said, the european elections are taking place in june, we're seeing major russian interference there already. so i am worried. my hope is today will be the start of a series of public hearings to try to make just basically educate americans and say if you're hearing stuff that seems a little too wacky, maybe it's not actually that candidate or that campaign's real position. >> all right. chairman of the senate intelligence committee, democratic senator mark warner of virginia, thank you very much. >> thank you, mika. >> for coming on this morning. and president biden has announced a new sweeping package of tariffs against china in an effort to protect american

industries that are being hurt by beijing. biden says the tariffs which include a 100% increase rate on electric vehicles will ensure u.s. workers are put first and that the electric vehicle market is not dominated by china. after the announcement biden was asked about former president trump's comments regarding his actions. take a listen. >> mr. president, trump said today china is eating our lunch. what do you say in response? he said china is eating our lunch, that's what trump said today. >> he's been feeding them a long time. >> he's been feeding them a long side says president biden about donald trump and china. now to this morning's new economic reading, the consumer price index rose 0.3% last month, slightly lower than economists expectations. let's bring in the co-anchor of cnbc's "squawk box," andrew ross sorkin, he's also a columnist for "the new york times." andrew, what do you make of this

number and also where things stand on interest rates, which apparently will stay the same for a bit. >> yeah, this is probably the best news, actually, that we've gotten on inflation in quite some time, at least the past couple of quarters, and at least is hinting that at least directionally we will be going in the right direction. things are -- you know, prices didn't increase as much as expected. having said that, it's -- you know, it's one -- it's one month, it's one snapshot. i don't think we should get overly excited about it and the truth is in terms of how the federal reserve thinks about increasing or in this case lowering interest rates, i think they're going to want to see several more months of this to feel comfortable doing anything like that. we heard from jay powell just yesterday, the chairman of the fed, indicating that he wasn't necessarily going to be lowering interest rates anytime soon. i should say for better or worse the stock market taking this very well. i think the expectation now is that maybe the fed will lower interest rates in september,

though i will tell you some of i think the people who are closest to the fed and the close fed watchers still think that there's going to be some more time before we see lower interest rates, which then you talked about mortgage rates and everything else, it's going to take some time for those to come down as well. but, again, moving in the right direction and i imagine you may hear something from the white house about it. >> no cuts yet, but ticking down slightly, inflation. good news, food prices, food inflation, has been at 0% for several months now. gas is still too expensive. rent is too expensive as well. >> rent is too expensive. i will say one of the things -- i don't want to say you should worry about it, but retail sales, that's -- you're starting to see that's coming in weaker than expected and so that's something that, you know, is indicative of what happens when things are priced too highly. >> so let me ask you about the story mika reported just a minute ago on the tariffs on electric vehicles to china. "wall street journal" this morning saying that president

biden has started effectively a green trade war with china. what's the reaction in the business community to the announcement from the president? >> i think for the most part, actually, the business community is actually quite supportive of this. i think there's a view that china has been dumping products in the united states or wants to dump products in the united states given all of the incentives and other subsidies that take place in china for so many of these products that there's a genuine concern about those products in the u.s. and so the tariffs are important to protect american businesses. you know, we heard from elon musk even about this several months ago where he said, look, you look at the evs that are coming out of china and all the subsidies to them and frankly how good they are, that they would be eating the lunch, if you will, of u.s. auto makers if there weren't tariffs in place. so i think it's important. having said that, it's not a, quote, free market, if you will, but we're now -- we have our own industrial policy around some of these issues.

i would also say politically it's very interesting because former president trump has been talking a lot about his intention to slap really big tariffs on china and i think that this -- what biden is doing from a political standpoint is going to take some of the thunder out of that and maybe put them actually oddly in the same place when you think about some of these types of tariffs. >> cnbc's andrew ross sorkin, thank you very much. once again, always good to see you. coming up on "morning joe," a new initiative is hoping to ease political tensions ahead of november's election. we will be joined by two of its founding partners, including the wife of the late muhammad ali. that's next. mad ali. that's next.

it's hard to run a business on your own. make it easier on yourself. with shopify, you have everything you need to sell online and in person. you can have your inventory, payments, and customers in sync across all the places you sell. it doesn't have to be lonely at the top. join the millions to finding success on their own terms. start your journey with a free trial today. why choose a sleep number smart bed? can it keep me warm when i'm cold?

wait, no, i'm always hot. sleep number does that. can i make my side softer? i like my side firmer. sleep number does that. can it help us sleep better and better? please? sleep number does that. 94 percent of smart sleepers report better sleep. now, save 50% on the sleep number limited edition smart bed. plus, 0% interest for 36 months. shop now at sleepnumber.com awkward question... is there going to be anything left... —left over? —yeah. oh, absolutely. (inner monologue) my kids don't know what they want. you know who knows what she wants? me! i want a massage, in amalfi, from someone named giancarlo. and i didn't live in that shoebox for years. not just— with empower, we get all of our financial questions answered. so you don't have to worry. i guess i'll get the caviar... just kidding. join 18 million americans and take control of your financial future with a real time dashboard and real live conversations. empower. what's next.

norman, bad news... i never graduated from med school. what? but the good news is... xfinity mobile just got even better! now, you can automatically connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go. plus, buy one unlimited line and get one free for a year. i gotta get this deal... that's like $20 a month per unlimited line... i don't want to miss that. that's amazing doc. mobile savings are calling. visit xfinitymobile.com to learn more. doc?

i love it. that's okay, we are on air, you can invite us. i will go. >> i will invite you. >> okay. as the united states enters another bitterly divisive campaign season a new initiative is looking to lower the temperature and bring people together. the builders movement is a new nonprofit taking a multipronged approach to tackling political polarization and seeking consensus on hot button policy issues. joining us now founding partners of the builders movement, daniel lubetzky, who is also founder of kind snacks, and lonnie ali, the co-founder of the muhammad ali center and the wife of the late great boxing champ and humanitarian, muhammad ali. it's good to have you both with us, daniel, i will start with you. we were talking off break, this started yesterday, launch was yesterday, but you went from just here in the u.s. to global as well.

so you all are thinking big. what's the strategy and the goal behind the builders movement? >> the goal is to overcome all this us versus them toxic polarization and the humanization and replace it with a problem solving tool kit to try to help equip college students, young people, people in the workplace to build bridges, to build companies, to learn how to solve problems, overcome differences rather than turn us into a victim versus oppressor, hateful-filled divide which our foreign enemies, your earlier coverage was talking about, they are having fun funding all of this division and we need to overcome that. >> lonnie, where do you begin? how does it work and how can you help sort of bridge this divide that is multipronged and global? >> well, i always say that it starts with us and it really is -- the builders is sort of an extension of the it starts with us initiative that daniel started many years ago to have

people think with courage and compassion and try to overcome those differences. where we go is we try to in builders to bring people together from diverse backgrounds with attitudes, different attitudes, but with the common goal of working together, overcoming differences to find pragmatic solutions to some of the most challenging problems we have in our society today. we have equipped that with a builders tool kit and skill set and support to help people achieve those goals. >> daniel, i would argue and we talk about this on the show, this is where most people live. this is what most people want. they want to work together, they want some real solutions, they don't want to be screaming at each other on social media or on tv or anywhere else and sometimes that extremism is amplified in a way that's not representative of what it really is. so what's an example of an issue that you two looked at and said,

it's really time for us to come together and try to change the dialogue a little bit? did you see something in the culture that brought you here. >> i will give you an example in a second but i want to build on what you guys just said. almost everybody feels that we are people that want to become builders but we're too silent, we are not taking action, what we're doing with lonnie and over 250 movement partners across a spectrum of politics is building a tool kit so everybody can take it to their communities and then start practicing those things because social media, cable news with truly one of the small exceptions being you guys, they are all just about division and hate and you have foreign governments leading to these rigid ideologies, political stagnation, special interest, all of these -- >> disinformation. >> tons of disinformation. so we have a strategy to counteract all of these leading forces with five platforms, builders media to try to counteract all of the disinformation on social media and to help keep people -- equip

them with a way to be more critical thinkers, the builders tool kit to provide to universities. builders network to try to help get everybody listening today with the understanding that every single day in how we treat one another and how we act in our communities and how we deploy a problem-solving tool kit we can actually be builders so we can be destroyers. >> lonnie, you and i are old friends and i knew the champ very well, in fact, one of the proud moments of my life was when he called me once i started this show near at "politics nation" and told me i'm watching you, and he would watch the show. i bring him up because in many ways when i heard about this, you're continuing the work the champ really wanted. people don't talk a lot about how he traveled to foreign countries to negotiate for peace and to try to help hostages. that part of muhammad ali is not remembered and i think you in

the center of continuing his work is really continuing the legacy of muhammad ali working along with this project. >> that's very true, reverend. in fact, many years ago daniel approached muhammad with a one voice movement with his work in the middle east and trying to build bridges there and muhammad of course immediately signed on. but when you think about what starts with us is, it's about courage, compassion and curiosity. the first thing muhammad had, he was curious, he was curious about other people, he wanted to listen and find out what their journeys were and what they were doing. of course, he always approached everybody with compassion, but he always had the courage to speak up and to build those bridges and talk to people who, you know, others might wonder why are you associating with them, you know, that kind of thing. so unless we start to listen to one another, show that empathy and compassion for people who are experiencing pain as well, just like we are, we're never

going to get anywhere. and i feel that as a steward of his legacy, he would want me to be right here with daniel doing this work. if he were here and well, he would be doing it, you know, as well. so this is an extension of his legacy, you know, muhammad was always -- he always saw the humanity in everyone. he approached people with that compassion and realizing that we are part of the human race and he loved people. so that is one of the things that we are trying to advance here with builders is to build those bridges and find that common ground and approach these issues with compassion, courage and curiosity. >> will, when you were asking earlier, i don't mean to evade your question, we've done the work in tennessee with citizens, within six months they had come up with eight proposals on how to overcome issues on gun safety and gun rights.

we did this in wisconsin, helped equip citizens with a tool kit for how to navigate issues about abortion. almost all of these issues they seem intractable. when you actually look at the data there's enormous hidden common ground. it's about us having the curiosity that lonnie is talking about to try to learn about it. >> how do people if they're watching this, like what they hear, how do they access these tools. >> first thing is join the builders movement.org and we will send you every week a tool kit and information. but everyone needs to understand they need to become part of the solution. >> you actually have to be curious. i think that's a beautiful point to all of this. there's a lack of curiosity that leads to the divide as well. founding partners of the builders movement, daniel lubetzky and lonnie ali, thank you both very much for coming on the show this morning. this is great. we appreciate it. and coming up, it was a big night in the wnba as caitlin clark made her regular season

debut with her new team. we will have the insights for you straight ahead on "morning joe." joe. here's to getting better with age. here's to beating these two every thursday. help fuel today with boost high protein, complete nutrition you need... ...without the stuff you don't. so, here's to now. boost. ♪♪ innovation in health care means nothing if no one can afford it. ♪♪

at evernorth, we're helping to unlock barriers. ♪♪ using our 35 plus years of pharmacy benefits management experience to save businesses billions while boosting medication adherence. helping plan sponsors and their members be at their best. that's wonder made possible. evernorth health services. tamra, izzy, and emma... no one puts more love into logistics than these three. you need them. they need a retirement plan. work with principal so we can help you

with a plan that's right for your team. let our expertise round out yours. it's time to get away and cache in, at cache creek casino resort, to rock and to roll. to go all out or... go all in. with four stars and rising stars, northern california's premier casino resort is the perfect place... ...to do as much -or as little- as you want. make your get away now and cache in at cache creek casino resort.

looks like a beautiful day in dallas, 8:38 in the morning. the mavs playing oklahoma city, big one tonight. meanwhile, the wnba tipped off its new season last night and that meant the debut of caitlin clark. nbc news correspondent stephanie gosk shows us how the rookie is already having a big impact on the league. >> reporter: with that layup caitlin clark made the first basket of her wnba career. her debut with the fever a tough loss to the connecticut sun. >> clark, a good look from three. >> reporter: clark shook off early nerves and ultimately ended the game with 20 points. >> clark will fire. hits the three.

>> reporter: including four three-pointers as her parents watched from the stands. >> just getting more comfortable and that's just going to come with experience and getting to play with these girls. >> reporter: despite the somewhat rough start to clark's rookie tour it's clear how much her popularity is already impacting the game. >> how exciting is that? >> really exciting. >> it's so exciting. >> reporter: ticket sales are surging, with some teams moving their matchups against clark and the fever to larger arenas this season to meet the unprecedented demand. according to seat geek the average resale price to see the fever play on the road is $240, a staggering 133% increase from last year. >> here is clark off a screen. gets a look. >> reporter: fans wearing iowa and fever gear spotted throughout the sold-out crowd inside connecticut's arena. ahead of the game clark told me she was embracing the moment. >> what does it feel like to be in this sold-out crowd tonight? >> i'm sure there will be a lot of basketball fans here that

appreciate the game, that's fun to play in front of. >> reporter: weeks after going first in the wnba draft clark's welcome to the pros included the premiere of her gatorade commercial. part of an electric tip-off to an wnba season which also featured the announcement of the league's newest team, the golden state valkaries. >> it is insane, the difference a year can make. >> the talent that's coming in is really, really great. >> stephanie gosk reporting. jonathan lemire, ten turnovers, she said right out of the gate not her best night, still scored 20 points on and off night, game high. one other thing to note, we looked for the game last night to put it on, it was on disney plus. now disney plus and other streamers are thinking how can i get people to subscribe? input caitlin clark on disney plus and get people to sign up. she's having a massive impact, sold-out arena, had a final four feel to the pregame and

everything. she's changed the game. >> we watched a little bit last night, too. she struggled out of the gate. she will be fine. she still scored 20 last night. remarkable, some cities are moving to larger venues when she comes to town, playing in nba-sized arenas because of the phenomenon that is caitlin clark. she's going to put up terrific numbers, also coming to the last place team. again, she will be fine. >> she will be fine. also showcases some of the other amazing talent in the wnba, you tune in and see great players. meanwhile, tom brady is expressing some regret this morning over his three-hour roast on netflix. specifically about the impact it had on his children. nbc news correspondent emilie ikeda has the story. >> reporter: netflix's greatest roast of all time with nfl legend tom brady may have been a big success. >> he is a three-time super bowl loser. please welcome, tom brady. >> reporter: but this morning the seven-time super bowl champ says he will never do it again.

>> i loved when the jokes were about me. i thought they were so fun. i didn't like the way it affected my kids. >> reporter: brady the 46-year-old father of three speaking candidly on the pivot podcast, saying he's a fan of comedy shows but didn't see the full picture when he first agreed to participate. >> all of a sudden you realize i wouldn't do that again because of the way it affected -- actually the people that i care about the most in the world. >> reporter: the comedy special airing live on the streaming platform earlier this month featuring high profile guests including former teammates, stand up comedians and celebrities who didn't hold back against the former quarterback. >> when you got a chance to go 8-9 and all it will cost you is your wife and your kids, you have to do what the [ bleep ] you have to do. >> you guys know about his diet program, it is so strict but if you follow it exactly as he does you, too, can lose your family. >> reporter: after the roast

brady's ex-wife gisele bundchen posting on instagram this mother's day about advice she learned from her own mom, writing, children are forever, you will always be concerned and want to go protect them, it doesn't matter their age. bundchen and brady filed for divorce in 2022 after 13 years of marriage. their split, a repeated punch line throughout the night. >> hey, tom. this is great. nice shoes [ bleep ] did you win those in the divorce? >> reporter: for some comedians who participated in the roast jokes about brady's children were off the table. >> we all just agreed like let's not throw the kids under the bus. >> the way i look at these things is gisele is a public figure outside of him. >> yeah. >> so, yeah, we could talk about that. >> reporter: brady says he learned an important lesson from the experience. >> i'm going to be a better parent as i go forward because of it. >> nbc's emilie ikeda reporting for us there. so, mika, he went on to say if you listen to morph that interview he is in this sort of

post nfl life, not an excuse, but where he's sort of like trying to find himself and reach -- oh, that sounds fun, i'm going to do that commercial, i will do that tv show, this netflix roast sounds like a lot of fun, he knew steph curry jeffrey ross that phi who puts it together and perhaps didn't think it all the way through. >> i think that everybody who went after his ex-wife, they're hurting the kids, too. i mean -- >> but that's what those are. somebody should have warned him. that's what they are. >> not necessary. coming up on "morning joe" -- >> you've been enjoying life outside the white house? >> absolutely. it is so good to get away from washington and get back to normal life, spending time with my family, enjoying roped off brunches at my live-in golf prison, and disposing of top secret documents. >> oh, my god, that was tony award winner laura banonti as former first lady melania trump

in a recurring bit for the late show. laura joins us next to discuss her new autobiographical one-woman show titled "nobody cares." we do. we will be right back. led "nodo cares. we do. we will be right back. why choose a sleep number smart bed? can it keep me warm when i'm cold? wait, no, i'm always hot. sleep number does that. can i make my side softer? i like my side firmer. sleep number does that. can it help us sleep better and better? please? sleep number does that. 94 percent of smart sleepers report better sleep.

now, save 50% on the sleep number limited edition smart bed. plus, 0% interest for 36 months. shop now at sleepnumber.com (vo) in two seconds, eric will realize they're gonna need more space... (man) gotta sell the house. (vo) oh...open houses. or, skip the hassles and sell directly to opendoor. (man) wow. (vo) when life's doors open, we'll handle the house. generalized myasthenia gravis made my life a lot harder. but the picture started changing

when i started on vyvgart. ♪♪ vyvgart is for adults with generalized myasthenia gravis who are anti-achr antibody positive. in a clinical trial, vyvgart significantly improved most participants' ability to do daily activities when added to their current gmg treatment. ♪♪ most participants taking vyvgart also had less muscle weakness. and your vyvgart treatment schedule is designed just for you. in a clinical study, the most common side effects included urinary and respiratory tract infections, and headache. vyvgart may increase the risk of infection. tell your doctor if you have a history of infections or symptoms of an infection. vyvgart can cause allergic reactions. available as vyvgart for iv infusion and also as vyvgart hytrulo for subcutaneous injection. additional side effects for vyvgart hytrulo may include injection site reactions. talk to your neurologist about vyvgart.

a slow network is no network for business. may include injection site reactions. that's why more choose comcast business. and now we're introducing ultimate speed for business, our fastest plans yet. we're up to 12 times faster than verizon, at&t, and t-mobile. and existing customers could even get up to triple the speeds at no additional cost. from the company with 99.9% network reliability and

advanced cyber security, it's ultimate speed for ultimate business. and it's all from comcast business. ♪ what do they do ♪ ♪ when she gets older ♪ ♪ they send her away to sing glitter and be gay ♪ ♪ down in florida ♪ ♪ she used to be simple ♪ ♪ and oh so demur ♪ ♪ but now she thinks what was i doing that for ♪ ♪ and so she'll stand proudly as they slam the door ♪ ♪ on a recovering door on a recovering ♪ >> beautiful, that was a look at the new off broadway show entitled laura benanti, nobody cares. >> you did it. >> i got it. >> the autobiographical solo

comedy show covers topics such as motherhood, relationships, and even how to handle life as a recovering aunjanue. you're recovering from this? >> i'm recovering. i think so many women are. >> the tony award winning actress joins us now. congratulations on this. >> thank you, i appreciate it. >> it's such a huge, huge effort to be doing a one-woman show. >> it's a comedy show that i wrote and then my friend todd amand and i co-wrote the songs. >> incredible. >> thank you. >> so give us the concept of nobody cares. we do care. >> we care. >> thanks, guys, that's why i came here. so audible actually approached me asking me if i wanted to write a show, and then they record them live and put them on their platform. there's some things inherently narcissistic about a one-person show, and there's so much going on in the world that every time i started to write it, i was like nobody cares. this feels insane to me, and then as i started writing it, i

was like, okay, i've lived a lot of life and some people might care. >> yeah. >> so how do you decide what to share and what not to share? >> i threw open the book, and now that it's out there, i'm like ooh, maybe i should have had some of those pages removed. it's too late, but no, i'm really proud of it. that is or the of a thing i talk about it is going from a pathological people pleaser to somebody who can stand in my own space. i did these things, it's very self-deprecated. i never punch down. i punch this way. so many young women have come up to me i feel like you wrote this for me and women my age. and then the husbands, i hear men laughing so hard and i did not think that was going to be the case because i didn't write it for you all. >> we're invited. >> no, you're invited. >> yeah, yeah. >> let's take a look at another clip from the show where you confess you don't always tell

the truth to your children. take a look ♪ lord may i be forgiven ♪ ♪ i look you straight in the eye ♪ ♪ and i lie ♪ ♪ momma's a liar, momma says stuff that's just not true ♪ ♪ momma looks you in the eye and lies to you ♪ ♪ i say nuggets aren't chicken, santa's real and bugs don't die when i squish them ♪ ♪ it's just how i carry them outside to live forever ♪ ♪ where they're wild and free because in america ♪ ♪ everyone is so happy ♪ ♪ momma's a liar, it doesn't mean i'm not sincere ♪ ♪ i'm just feeling kind of stressed because i brought you here ♪ >> that's a great point. >> very, very funny, and

relatable for any parent. how did you -- as you said, open book. did you have any pause about involving your children? what was -- what has that moment been like and what's reaction been like for other parents in the audience? >> i think other parents in the audience really relate. they talk to me about that a lot, especially the song momma's a liar because how do we -- like one of the lines how do i say the world is broken to a little kid. >> yeah. >> so my children are 2 and 7, and you know, i want them to still believe in fairies and that people are good. >> i love that line, i'm feeling stressed because i brought you here. >> yeah. >> and i am. >> i am actually. >> that's a picture of me when i'm 11 years old, and apparently awaiting my husband's return from the first world war. but yeah, i've considered a lot, my daughter is 7, and the only stories i tell are the ones i asked her if i could tell, and i really tried to explain, i was like many people will see this, and she was like how many, and i was like thousands. and she was like great. >> does she want a cut of the

action? >> don't worry, she gets it. it's all trickle down to her. >> you've been in -- we were talking about it, 18 years old. you were in the sound of music with richard chamberlain. you have this incredible career, you've won a tony award, in ensembles for the most part. >> no, i was the star but continue. >> well, you know what i mean. there were other cast members. >> yes, other people were on stage. >> other people were on stage. even for someone like you who knows how to own a stage, is it something else entirely to be alone up there for a show? >> i don't feel alone. i don't feel alone because i have the audience. you know, i break the fourth wall, which you don't get to do on broadway. and you know, it's interesting when i was 18 years old, i never could have done that because i didn't know how to be myself. i didn't know who myself was. and now i've grown into a woman who is increasingly every single day learning more and more about myself. i think to be able to share that on stage feels like a gift, and hearing the audience reaction. i mean, they are with me. they're like, ooh, no. >> really? >> it's amazing.

i feel like it's like elizabethean england. >> so you get the feedback live. >> it's incredible. it is audience participation. please don't yell out at me -- >> no heckling. >> no heckling. i've been heckled from melania actually. >> i did a show, i won't say where las vegas, and i got like heckled by a man for like a solid five minutes and i was proud of myself for how i handled it. i was like i feel -- i really regret that you feel so bad about this. that's not my intention, and we -- i tried to have a dialogue, but guess what, it didn't work. >> sometimes it doesn't work. >> but this does. the show laura benanti nobody cares is playing for a limited time now through june 2nd in manhattan. a recording of the show will be released exclusively on audible on june 6th. my daughter's birthday. it's available for preorder now. tony award winner laura benanti,

thank you so much. congratulations. >> thank you so much. >> you're incredibly talented. >> i really appreciate you, thank you. >> enjoy. that does it for us this morning. ana cabrera picks up the coverage after a short break. pie coverage after a short break

some people just know there's a better way to do things. and some people... don't. bundle your home and auto with allstate and save. you're in good hands with allstate. if advanced lung cancer has you searching for possibilities, discover a different first treatment. immunotherapies work with your immune system to attack cancer. but opdivo plus yervoy is the first combination of 2 immunotherapies for adults newly diagnosed with non-small cell lung cancer that has spread, tests positive for pd-l1, and does not have an abnormal egfr or alk gene. opdivo plus yervoy is not chemotherapy, it works differently. it helps your immune system fight cancer in 2 different ways. opdivo and yervoy can cause your immune system to harm healthy parts of your body during and after treatment. these problems can be severe and lead to death. see your doctor right away if you have a cough; chest pain; shortness of breath; irregular heartbeat; diarrhea; constipation; severe stomach pain; severe nausea or vomiting; dizziness;

fainting; eye problems; extreme tiredness; changes in appetite, thirst or urine; rash; itching; confusion; memory problems; muscle pain or weakness; joint pain; flushing; or fever. these are not all the possible side effects. problems can occur together and more often when opdivo is used with yervoy. tell your doctor about all medical conditions including immune or nervous system problems, if you've had or plan to have an organ or stem cell transplant, or received chest radiation. your search for 2 immunotherapies starts here. ask your doctor about opdivo plus yervoy. a chance to live longer. all—new subway wraps are packed with delicious ingredients in a pillowy lavash wrap. finally a refreshing lunch that tastes deli— perfect for pro athletes like me, right? can i finish? try all—new wraps from subway today.

right now on ana cabrera reports, make my day, pal. it is breaking news this morning, president biden challenging donald trump to two debates, but this time won't be like 2020. what he's proposing and trump's response. plus, michael cohen's contentious cross examination,