will be buying your jersey. i believe the wnba is going to have its greatest season ever and i think you are a big part of that. is aerobic he stood up for yourself and other people in the time of your greatest trauma. i want to thank you for writing this book, i want to thank you for coming in and sitting down with me. when the baby boy comes, tell him he's got an extra godmother. >> i will definitely do that. t the readout. good evening, and welcome to a special two hour edition of alex wagner tonight. happy memorial day weekend. nothing says three-day weekend, like barbecuing, summer jams, and rigorous analysis of the first-ever criminal trial of a u.s. president. so, we are all in lock.

we know that closing arguments in donald trump's you are new york hush money trial begin tuesday. they are expected to take y us the day, and then it is just a matter of how long it takes the jury to reach a verdict. that is, if they are able to reach a verdict at all. we will get back to that. first, let's not forget that this hush money trial is just ne one of donald trump's many indictments. it was bad news for him this s week in one of the other cases. intro's classified documents case, one in which he is accused by federal prosecutors of illegally hoarding classified documents in mar-a- lago and trying to hide them from the federal government, newly unsealed documents this week revealed new evidence with obstruction of justice for the former president. quote, once trump realized that security cameras at mar-a-lago could capture his employees moving classified government information that officials were attempting ntto retrieve, as th government issued a subpoena for the camera footage. trump allegedly ensured that he

would avoid the campus on n moving boxes. that is not what donald trump and his allies chose to focus on in these documents. instead, they chose to focus on some random, out of context language they pulled from the la fbi's search warrant from mar-a- lago and protected that the fbi search, which as you recall, was arranged in advance with the secret service, while donald trump was not at home. was actually a secret attempt by president biden by the fbi to kill donald trump. this is so bonkers, even by trump standards. that the fbi took the highly unusual step of issuing a direct response, debunking trump's claim, even attorney general, merrick garland, who is allergic to stepping into anything that might be construed as political, even hes could not let this one slide. >> that allegation is false, and it is extremely dangerous.

the document that has been referred to in the allegation is the justice department's standard policy limiting the use of force. as the fbi advises, it is part of the standard operations plan for searches and, in fact, it a was even use in the consensual search of president biden's home. >> but you can see what trump and his allies would want to distract from the substance of t the classified documents case. of all of the cases against trump, legal experts generally seem to consider the mar-a-lago allegations to be the closest to a slamdunk in prosecutorial a terms. have the documents, he lied about having them. then, he tried to hide them. then, he tried to hide the evidence that he was hiding them. and of course, it doesn't matter how strong a case is that never goes to trial, the trump appointed florida federal judge in this case, judge cannon, has pope postponed this trial indefinitely, as you will

hearing after hearing on increasingly absurd motion fromo trump's legal team. trump's other federal trial on charges that he tried to ar overturn the 2020 election is also indefinitely postponed, as the supreme court ways as long as humanly possible to deliver its ruling on whether armor president is completely immune from criminal charges. the argument that trump has full immunity for any criminal act seemed like a stretch, even for this supreme court, but now that we know that one of the justices flew pro insurrection flags at two of his homes, while the court considered 2020 election cases, well, now that we know that it seemed as possible. now, one reason the new york hush money case has been able as to move ahead is because it is a state case, which means it is out of reach of trump's allies h in the federal judiciary. but donald trump has a plan for that. sources tell rolling stone this week that trump has been speaking to several republicans in congress about passing

legislation that would shield former presidents from state prosecutions. trump has even hinted, publicly, at the strategy, right outside of his new york court room. >> because they chose to show up , they view this as a scam. they think it is a terrible thing that is happening to democracy in this country. and we have a lot on them, they wanted to come and stay back and pass a lot of laws to stop things like this. >> that is trump there, saying the republican lawmakers making the pilgrimage to his trial should, instead stay in washington and pass lots of laws like this to stop things like this, meaning the case against donald trump. of course, in order for legislation like that's to be passed, and signed into law, donald trump would need to be president, with a republican house and a republican senate. and it goes without saying that the federal case against him,

all of them, which disappear if he returns to the white house. so, trump's legal fate and his e political fate are inextricably intertwined. which is why so much hangs on what happens next week, when this hush money trial goes to the jury. no one knows what effect a conviction might have on his co presidential bid. but if he is not convicted, trump will obviously treat that as a massive legal and political victory. writing today and political, former federal prosecutor, lays out how juries could get to a guilty verdict, even if they find michael cohen's testimony credible or not, but as car door he points out, the defenses only has to convince winter that there is reasonable doubt on some element of the charges for this case to end in a hung jury. just a defective acquittal for trump.tt

writes quote, it is rare-- the stuff of movies-- for a case to possibly turn on the quality of each side's closing argument, but this could be one of those cases. so, buckle up for next week. joining me now are george conway, board president for the society for the rule of law, e and a contributor to the atlantic, charles coleman, bernie your prosecutor and now a civil rights attorney, and anna bauer, legal following course correspondent for l'affaire, focused on the four criminal cases for donald trump. the for being here tonight. carl, let me just start first on the strength of the case as it stands right now. i mean, the missed misdemeanor charge, falsification of records, seems pretty provable, based on what has been extended . i feel like there is a lot of concern about the felony chargeo and how tight you think the prosecution's cases. >> so, there is k one very key element to the misdemeanor charge that i think prosecutorsr should be slightly concerned about, and that is the word cause, when you are talking about to cause someone to falsify business records, we

know that donald trump himself was not going into the computer and making the records that ultimately appears that were falsified. the notion is-- or the question becomes-- did he instruct, did he direct, did he advise someone to do that, whether it was russell berg or someone else? we know his handwriting is all over different things and different pieces of evidence. that is something the prosecution should be concerned about, with regards to the misdemeanor. in regards of the felony, there is the issue of intent. i think that you get there because of the notion of hope hicks testimony, david testimony, they talked about this was all in donald trump's mind in relation to the election. so, you get to establish intent there. however, that cause issue, with respect to the misdemeanor, is something that i think the prosecutor should be concerned about. the other thing i think about is that, this is somewhat of a novel and convoluted legal theory, and i think that the jury instructions are going to u be pivotal in terms of how

straightforward this becomes laid out for all of the jurors so that no one gets confused. >> yeah. george, when we hear about the first criminal trial of a u.s. president, does it concern you that the legal strategy here, th in terms of the prosecution, is not fooled, does that for you? >> i don't think it's actually that novel. the manhattan district attorney's office uses this statute a lot, and uses it in combination with the requirement that there be a cover-up of another crime to establish felonies. is and, i mean, as i understand n, it, it happens in many, many contexts. now, hasn't happened in this particular conflict? how many presidents have we had that have paid off born stars and covered the hush money payments up using their own private business? not many, but that is just a factual distinction. the fact of the matter is this statute is used all the time in this way in different situations. >> well then, let me istake another bite at the apple. ap does any part of it concern

you? i mean, there does seem to be-- i mean, bragg doesn't need to stay up layout that step up charge, the judge seems on board a with that, but does any part of it going from a misdemeanor to a felony concern you, legally speaking? >> no, not really. i think it is pretty clear that they were covering up a campaign finance violation at the minimum. to advance money for the purposes of running a political campaign, and that is what this was about. there was no evidence that he had any other motive than to keep this stormy daniels affair or whatever you want to call this, stormy daniels sex quiet, before the election. i think the evidence is overwhelming on that. and to go back to the basic charge of whether they caused it, well, he did cause it. it was all run by him. he signed some of these checks, i don't-- i don't think there really is a weak spot in the government's case, and, you know, i do think it is possible that they could get a hung

jury. i don't think you are going to get an acquittal in a hung jury, which requires one person to basically disregard the evidence and disbelieve michael cohen, i guess, but the problem with that is that michael cohen was corroborated by the documents. essentially, his direct examination was walking through the documents and explaining the documents, supporting them in context and there is really d no other alternative explanation for what those documents show. >> anna, to george's point with michael cohen, a lot of the prosecution's case would seem to rest on cohen's testimony, but there is a scaffolding they built around him. i do wonder though, if you talk about three points of, let's say vulnerability in cohen's testimony it would seem to be, one, the fact that we did not know that he had stolen money from the trump organization, two, there seems to be some om discrepancy about whether the calls he imagined with trump ll were in fact calls with trump, they were through his body man, keith schiller, and then three, the sort of corroborating

witness here is alan weisel berg, and we didn't hear from him, so we are reliant on michael cohen's testimony about his conversations with donald trump.s you see those as kind of the points that the defense might best exploit in closing arguments? >> yeah. i certainly think that those are some of the points that they are going to try to exploit in the closing arguments, in terms of michael cohen's credibility. i also would note that we heard a recurring theme of the defense trying to portray michael cohen as someone who has made a career off of talking about donald trump. they portrayed him as someone who has kind of out for revenge or has a vendetta against his former boss, but going to those points, i still-- the ones you just mentioned, alex, i am still not convinced that those will be entirely effective. although, as you all have mentioned, it only does take ta one juror. one reason being that, first, f going to the questions around michael cohen's stealing from

thest trump organization, he already admitted that on direct examination. it wasn't much of a gotcha moment, whenever it came to the cross-examination, and when he actually fessed up to that. and also, i will say that michael cohen, we have heard again and again throughout this trial, that the prosecution presented its case that michael cohen is someone who, you know, maybe was a little bit sleazy, someone who people didn't like very much, and so i think that the jurors came into his testimony kind of expecting to,m maybe not see michael cohen as the most credible witness, but their expectations were low and the prosecution already has so much corroborating evidence, with respect to the documents, the phone calls, the other testimony of people, like davido pecker and hope hicks and so i think what we will see in the

prosecution's closing arguments, when they are trying to bolster michael cohen's credibility even though he is at key witness is that they will is be painting meticulous timeline that really works through all ll of this corroborating evidence, so that they can say, and look,o yes, you have michael cohen, you have heard from, he is a guy who has made mistakes, but look to all of this other l corroborating evidence when you are making your decision. >> yeah, charles, the closing arguments, here what anna is saying there. it feels like they are going to kill him with details. an excess of evidence, a real tiktok how this time unfolded. >> yes, as anna was talking, i have to think to myself they have to be careful not to get too deeply into the weeds, and what i mean by this is the details necessary to establish this case are not necessarily so voluminous that you have to point on every single thing. the key is you want to tell a t coherent story that has a believable theme, and that

satisfies the elements of the crime that need to be proven. so, for me, as a former prosecutor, one things at some point, i am lining up the elements, i am going to say, you're going to hear from the judge and the judge is to e instruct you on the law, but i want you to listen for the following things. one, two, three, four. i want to say, if you think about one, think about a, i'm putting out a particular factor detail. b, two. you don't want to spend so much time on details that you confuse the jury. you want to do enough, where you tell a story that is coherent, and that aligns and reconciles beyond a reasonable doubt. >> george, you have an expectation of the story, if there is one, that the defense will tell. because out throughout this trial it is hard to understand if they are presenting a narrative at all. >> that-- that is their problem is that they don't have a narrative and that is going to be the most effective part of the prosecution presentation ata the end is that they have a narrative. they have a story. st it coheres all of the documents, confirming the story, and michael cohen's

testimony fills in the gaps and even alan weisel berg is present. 's testimony comes in the form of a handwritten document that, in no uncertain terms, was a fraud. so, the problem that the defense has always had is they a do not have an alternative explanation for the fact that are really, fundamentally uncontested. yes, they can attack cohen's testimony, they can attack-- they can argue that maybe cohen misremembered one phone call, although the prosecution did back with evidence that, in fact, donald trump was standinga right next to him, when michael cohen called him on october 4th 2016. and there's-- they don't have an alternative explanation for what alan weisel berg was n writing on that sheet of paper. they have no alternative explanation and all they can do is nitpick and quite frankly, that is what we saw in their cross-examination, which were

completely meandering and not cohesive, and the reason they weren't cohesive in that way and didn't tell a counter narrative is because there is none >> charles. >> important to remember, before everything that joyce said, the defense doesn't have to have a story if the people y don't want to remember it. that is critical to understand t and remember. don't go anywhere, charles coleman, we have a lot more coming up. democratic senators want to meet with chief justice, john robbers, to discuss the controversial flag flown by his colleague, justice alito. but first, trump would like his mega friends in congress to pass a law to make all of his legal headaches disappear. we are going to ask plane that, coming up next. coming up next.

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this is the fifth week that president trump has been in court, with a sham of a trial. they are doing this intentionally to keep him here and keep him off of the campaign trail. and i think everybody in the country can see that for what it is. >> that was speaker of the house, republican, mike johnson, talking to reporters outside of the manhattan criminal courthouse this last week repeating donald trump's favorite limes. the hush money trial is a sham and everyone knows it. reality suggests otherwise. according to a new cbs poll, 56% of americans believe trump is definitely, or probably guilty of a crime in this case.

what is true though is that the speaker's decision to appear outside of the manhattan courtroom and attack the judicial branch is emblematic of the complete capitulation of republican leadership to donald trump. as the washington post editorial board notes, in hindsight, stormy daniels and the access hollywood tape was the beginning of mr. trump's unconditional hold on the republican race. the beginning of the end for what was left of the conditional gop. i am back with george conway, charles coleman, and anna bauer. george, i butchered the quote, but i do wonder what you think of it. is this-- i mean, in some ways represents bookends of the trupification of the republican party in the speaker of the house coming to the aid of a potential felon outside of the republican courtroom. >> they always managed to sink lower.

you have the speaker of the house of the united states of america, who is a conservative, evangelical christian, telling- - telling outright lies about a trial, in defense of a-- an adjudicated rapist, who he knows lies in almost everything he does. and is-- no, this isn't a sham trial. the evidence is there. the grand jury indicted him. what does he have to say about the evidence that involves, not really in dispute. the person he is lying for, this conservative christian evangelical, who paid off a porn star that he had sex with very briefly and covered it up with a payoff. i mean what-- what is he saying is the library? he is lying. and he is lying in defense of a pathological liar and criminal, as i mentioned, an adjudicated rapist.

you just can't sink any lower than that. and this is-- i mean, the entire right has succumbed to this level of degeneracy and treated-- treated as normal, and just pretend it doesn't exist. it is absolutely appalling. >> yeah. it is not normal. i think it bears repeating, and i do wonder, anna, i know you spent time in the courtroom, you have been following this. religiously almost. the effect that all of this is having on the jury, i mean, they are obviously not outside the courtroom, there has been this parade of trump allies through the courtroom and this- - you know, the trump of it all. can you give us a sense of how the jury has been processing this, from what you have been able to see inside the courtroom and in the overflow room? >> well, look, i can't get inside the juror's mites, but i can tell you, whenever the parade of trump's entourage comes in it can be disruptive.

there was a moment even, at a sidebar that we learned from the transcript later on, in which prosecutors asked justice marchand to ensure that, perhaps people who are coming into the courtroom, during trial proceedings could, you know, do so more quietly, because their security services were following them. all of that. so, there is that element to it, where it is a little bit distracting. i am sure it is not lost on the jurors, who are watching these political figures come into the courtroom every day, and then, what also is likely not lost on the jurors is the fact that, there are some notable absences from that courtroom, particularly melania trump, as well as trump's daughters, ivanka, tiffany. none of those people have been there while trump's sons have attended the trial on some days. you know? this is a case, in which the defense is arguing that trump cares about his family, that he cared about his reputation, and

his relationship with his wife, and they are arguing that, through their cross-examination and their case to the jurors, and yet all the while melania trump is not there. so, it really is a striking absence sitting there the courtroom. and i am sure that is not lost on the jurors. >> anna, let me just ask you one more question. the jurors have not been talking a month themselves, is that right? we haven't seen any interaction there, which is, i assume making it harder to understand what the dynamics are. >> that is right. and i will say, there are few jurors, where i have noticed that maybe one or two will kind of smile at each other at certain moments, but there is-- especially during a trial proceedings, they are very engaged, they are paying attention and looking at just a witness on the prosecutor or the defense counsel during the questioning. they are not talking amongst themselves, so we really don't have much of an idea of what the dynamic there is, and they are also not supposed to be,

you know, speaking about the case to each other, or two other people. the judge, every day, when we leave, give them instructions to that effect. so, we don't have much insight into the dynamics, although, we do know a few things. for example, there are two lawyers on this jury. so, you have to wonder exactly how that could affect the dynamic within the deliberation room, when they eventually do get there. are these two lawyers people who will kind of be natural leaders among the jury, in terms of explaining this very complicated legal theory? >> no matter what the outcome is, charles, it is very clear that donald trump doesn't want to have to go through this again. i mean, to some degree i understand. but the remedies he is seeking are unprecedented, right? rolling stone is reporting that trump once lawmakers to pass legislation to keep him out of jail forever. it is a twofold strategy. one, asking them to pass a law to shield former presidents from prosecution forever.

and two, give for presidents option for the state and federal prosecution sentence, i think he tried to do in georgia. what is your reaction to that strategy. >> i find it interesting, for as many people said that donald trump did not understand government during his first term in office, it is very clear that since this time, he has learned how to use the legislature as a sword and a shield, and he tends to do so going forward. we all know that part of the reason donald trump has run for the white house is people are landing in the big house. but at the end of the day, even if that is not something that he has direct control over, what he knows he can do is apply pressure to not only the legislature, but also the judiciary. we, as a simple majority on the supreme court, that will do hopefully some of the things, if not all of the things that he wants them to do. it is very interesting, and your lead-in, you talked about the fact that mar-a-lago, the federal case of florida, the documents, it is the most

straightforward case to federal prosecutors have in perhaps any of the cases he is facing. and simultaneously, it is the case where he is getting the most help from the bench, in terms of eileen cannon, a trump appointed judge, who has basically put that trial on hold. so, when i look at all of this, alex, what i see is someone who really understands, i need to attack this problem on multiple fronts, we no stone unturned, and create every opportunity for myself to stay out of court any further. >> well, and his he is banking, george, on the fact that you have the speaker of the house and enough republicans standing on the courthouse steps that they had to push off a vote on a bill to hold merrick garland in contempt on washington, d.c. he has the support of the republican conference in the house. and is it so far-fetched to imagine that they would pass a law that is, by the way, already been looks is a bill that has already been drafted to make sure he is immune from prosecution forever? >> yeah. i mean, i think the house would probably pass it. i mean, the house is completely

in the fall of donald trump. and probably passed by one or two votes, the margin that they have, but i don't think it would pass the senate. i don't think they would have all of the republican-- even republican senators to sign onto that bill. i think there are plenty of republican senators, who would find it completely repulsive, and, so, but i think i agree with charles. he will use any-- look, this is all about trump. trump is running for president to stay out of the big house, as charles said. he is going to use every lever of government or politics, anything, the media, to stay out of jail. and then, if he manages to become president and stay out of jail, to wreak vengeance upon everyone who crossed him. and that is what donald trump is about, because donald trump is just about himself, he is a narcissistic sociopath. he has no morals, no conscience, no remorse and he simply-- he

is the only one in his own world , and he is the only one he cares about. and, you know, the government be , soldiers who died for their country, they are suckers and losers, everyone else doesn't count in the mind of donald trump, and certainly the rule of law doesn't. >> here we are. george conway,-- george conway, charles coleman, and anna bauer, thank you for all spending your friday memorial weekend evening with you, and giving us the goods on what you think is going to happen, i really appreciate your time. enjoy your weekends, friends. still ahead this evening, we know that the number of abortions rose in the year 2023, despite the proliferation of state fans, but tonight louisiana has become the first date to figure out a brand-new way to stop people from accessing reproductive choice. that is coming up next. next.

it has been less than a month, since the law went into effect important, bending those portions command already we are seeing the ripple effect of them. the washington post reports on a new study today, showing that wait times for abortions in

nearby states across the east coast are up nearly 30%, since that law went into effect. they will be suffering the most from the increased patient load and half of the clinics in that state. now, it is not a surprise that neighboring states, once not as hostile to abortion are feeling the effects of florida's abortion ban. what is surprising is the effect on those states is, perhaps not as quite severe as expected. according to a abortion clinic suffers and lord, fewer women appear to be leaving the state for abortion care than was widely expected to finding largely attributed to the increasing availability of telemedicine and abortion pills. it is a good reminder that, in a post-roe v wade world, abortion access has changed dramatically to the medications for pretzel and but that has made medication abortion the next target for the antiabortion move it with a case that could severely curtail nationwide act is to

press down that is currently pending before the supreme court. just today, louisiana became the first state in the nation to criminalize, not the use of abortion pills, but the possession of the medications without a prescription. that law was passed yesterday, by the louisiana senate, and tonight it was signed into law, by the state's republican opener. once the law takes effect, people in louisiana could be thrown in prison for up to five years, just for having abortion pills. in their possession. joining me now is amanda, she nearly died in 22 when she nearly died of a medically necessary abortion in the state of texas, which has nearly banned all abortions. she is now suing the state, trying to challenge its bands. amanda, thank you for being here in thank you, as always, for sharing your story. i wonder what your reaction is to the news out of louisiana tonight, which is, republicans acting to take one of the last remaining tools out of the

hands of women seeking to assert control over their own bodies. >> well, first of all, thank you so much for having me. it is a pleasure to be back. in regards to louisiana, i-- first and foremost my heart just chatters for all of the people in louisiana who are now going to suffer under this new law, and frankly, it is terrifying. as you mentioned, very similar consideration is in front of the texas supreme court, where i live, and it is just absolutely terrifying. i truly can't believe that we are living in this dystopian reality, where we can be punished, we can be criminalized, we can be jailed for accessing basic healthcare, and make no mistake, this is a direct result of donald trump and his overturning of roe v wade, which, by the way, he continues to brag about. and if he is reelected, we know that he will make this an issue across the country and it is absolutely terrifying.

>> you know, you, you, you mentioned the word criminalization, which is so important in all of this. it is the idea of the punitive nature of all of this, women being criminalized for abortion medication, which is, you know, entirely safe, has been for decades, has been approved by the fda, women criminalized for trying to cross the border to seek abortions in other states, but it is this notion that the law is cracking down on people who seek to control their own bodies. and i wonder, as a woman who was in that situation, what it feels like to be told and to be positioned by the state, as someone who is doing something criminally wrong. >> it is unbelievable, it is unthinkable that there are politicians, like donald trump, who are trying to criminalize us for making decisions for our own bodies. these are decisions that should be between a woman and her health care provider. this is not something that politicians need to have their hands in, i don't think donald trump or his mag allies know better than my doctors, and so

why do they think they have any business telling me how to to make my own health care decisions? >> you know. it feels like, the first front was abortion, then we are talking about ivf and embryos, we are not talking about abortion medication, contraception is on the table. i wonder if we could talk a little bit about your personal struggle with ivf, given what happened to you and your body as a result of the texas law and what you are doing to, sort of manage the increasingly dim landscape for women, seeking any kind of reproductive assistance. >> it is interesting for me, because on the one hand i fall under the category of being unable to receive an abortion when i needed one, and maga republicans and donald trump are saying that is pro-life. now, the other hand, because of what i went through, because of the been in texas, that is the

result of donald trump, i have to pursue ivf to try and build my family, and now maga republicans are trying to tell us if, and when, and how we can access ivf. so, to me it feels very much about control and again, i don't think politicians have any business having their hands in my family planning journey or telling me when or where or how i can build a family, and so, it is really disheartening, but it is also motivating to fight back, because we can change this and we can fix this. as long as we make sure that donald trump is not reelected. >> i know that you have spoken publicly about your decision to move your embryo. can you-- i don't want to put words in your mouth, but can you tell us a little bit about how you have made family planning decisions, it truly feels like in this journey you have been treated like a criminal on the run command every time you see a path towards having a family it is like there is someone who comes out of the corner with any regulation. >> that is exactly right. and that is what i mean, when i

say this feels like it is about control. you are-- you are exactly right, my husband and i are very happy to have a number of embryos that we are hoping will one day become children, but when the alabama supreme court ruling came out earlier this year, we were absolutely terrified, and so we instantly made the decision to move our embryos out of texas, because we know the political landscape in texas is very similar to alabama and so, we move them somewhere that we felt they would be safer, but there is still a great deal of fear, because again, if donald trump is reelected it won't matter what state our embryos are in, because they won't be safe anywhere. >> yeah. well, he is looking-- whether the comstock act or the national abortion ban, there are options that are very much on the table should he win the presidency again, 2024. amanda zurawski, thank you for telling us intimately about the struggles you have been going through, just as a woman, trying to deal with her own

body and the 21st century. i appreciate your time tonight. >> thank you, thanks for having me. coming up, will justice samuel alito held be held accountable for his january 6th lawn ornaments? those two flags and the insurrection. two powerful democrats who helped oversee the supreme court are trying to do something about it. we are going to tell you, coming up next. ming up next. it's time. yes, the time has come for a fresh approach to dog food. everyday, more dog people are deciding it's time to quit the kibble and feed their dogs fresh food from the farmer's dog. made by vets and delivered right to your door precisely portioned for your dog's needs. it's an idea whose time has come. ♪♪

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justice alito is not paying attention to his responsibility to the court he can't play fast on these political without jeopardizing his own integrity. >> i think the question is how many battle flags as a supreme court justice have to fly until the rest of the court takes it seriously. >> should he recuse himself? >> absolutely, of course he should. >> senator, 34 chair of the judiciary committee. have joined the group of democratic lawmakers expressing concern over flags flown by two of justice samuel alito's properties, flags that were carried by insurrectionist that the capitol of january 6th. the senators have requested a meeting with chief justice john roberts as soon as possible, to urge him to take steps to make sure justice alito recuses himself, in cases involving the 2020 presidential election and january 6th. joining me now is leah,

university law professor and one of the cohosts of the essential strict scrutiny podcast. leah, thank you for joining me. i do wonder, i mean, you know, the idea that samuel alito would recuse himself, what is your over under on that? >> 0%. i mean, this is a man who has faced no accountability whatsoever about anything he has done. this time last year we were all talking about how if he had taken some luxury alaskan fishing vacation with the republican mega donor on whose private jet he flew, that republican mega donor had business before the court, justice alito never recused himself, and alito explained that, by saying, well, otherwise that private jet seat would have been unoccupied and if there was wine served at that luxury alaskan fishing vacation it certainly wasn't 1000 dollar wine. so, this is someone who thinks they can basically do whatever they want, while they are an unaccountable justice of the supreme court, flying a maga

flag that, you know, aligns the justice with the january 6th insurrection is, while sitting on cases that decide whether people will face criminal accountability and political accountability for their participation in january 6th is a slap in the face to the american public and the rule of law, and he is only doing it because he thinks he can get away with it. >> yeah. and then the question is, chief justice roberts, one of you? i will read an expert from the great dolly, in her assessment of robert's rolling all of this. roberts, respectfully, has long ago made the decision that he is amply one coequal vote among nine. neither he wants nor possesses the authority to rain in the maga justices. he may vote as though he cares about court legitimacy, but the chief justices, like the harassed mother of a kid throwing a tantrum at safeway, all shrugs and eye rolls. first of all, i know well that role of a harassed mother at safeway with a tantrum having 5-

year-old, but i am not the chief justice of the supreme court, leah, and i wonder if your assessment of robert's ability to do anything here is as dim as dahlias? >> i think that the harassed mother of a 2-year-old who is throwing a tantrum temper tantrum at least give that to- year-old a timeout, the chief justice, by contrast has decided just to enable justice alito. the same week that it came out that justice alito has thrown not one, but two pro insurrectionist flags, justice alito released incredibly important voting rights voter discrimination case out of south carolina that the chief justice assigned to him, and in that opinion, justice alito wrote for all of his republican colleagues, including the chief justice that republicans were entitled to draw districts to secure themselves a partisan advantage, to gain political power for white republicans at the expense of black voters. that is the same message the pro insurrection message that

justice alito was flying flags to display. and when it comes to the law, the chief justice is just unwilling-- if not unable, to do anything to rain him and get >> yeah. i marvel at the way in which this political-- this embrace of partisan politics, of insurrection, of antidemocratic norms, by one of the justices on the court is tacitly approved, by the chief justice, and yet, on the flipside, i wonder what you think of the white house strategy here on all of this, and the fact that president biden is not going to, according to politico, touch the alito controversy with a 10 foot pole. this is what they are reporting. biden has publicly warned that republicans are underway undermining democratic norms and threatening its institutions, but he is reluctant to extend that argument to the judicial branch, aides say, fearful it could be cast as politically motivated and undermine his broader efforts to portray himself as a champion for those strengthening democratic and intrusions. is that-- i mean, is that the right posture in your opinion?

>> i think that position is becoming increasingly untenable. you know, after the "new york times" reported one flag at justice alito's house, senator durbin was not quick to condemn justice alito, it was only after the second flight that dick durbin joined the white house to say that no, this justice actually needs to recuse himself, this is a serious problem, and i think as a defender of democratic and intrusions, president biden needs to do something about this supreme court, because the supreme court, with the maga justices, chief justice alito, they are undermining democracy and democratic and intrusions left and right, whether it is insulating with participants on january 6th, from any accountability, criminal or political whatsoever, whether it is allowing republican politicians to gerrymander legislatures to secure political advantage for white republicans at the expense of black voters. the court is undermining democracy. the court is behaving like an antidemocratic institution. so, as a defender of those in intrusions, the president needs

to stand up for the integrity of the institutions and not allow the people on them to just destroy the base principles of the role of while they are supposed to be guiding under this country get >> america in reverse in the name of tolerating white grievance. leah littman, it is always great to hear from you, thank you for your wise perspective this hour, i appreciate it. coming up, in the next doubleheader of the show, trump hunts for votes in the bronx, as president, joe biden workshops his response to a verdict in trump off the manhattan criminal trial. i will be joined by a great big political panel to break all of this done. that is coming up next. next. comfort, and electricity... are forever in bloom. welcome to beyond. the mercedes-maybach eqs suv.

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with several different impressions. it may have looked packed. but if you zoomed out a bit, you can see the crowds are not all that big. now, trump's campaign claims he drew a crowd of 25,000 people yesterday. the reality is reportedly more like 8,000 to 10,000 which for most people would be a huge turnout but for a presidential front runner in the highest population city in the country, it is pretty low. another way to look another this would be to focus on the people in the crowd who were attracting the most attention. people like this man. >> we want trump. we want trump. we want trump. >> one conservative influencer posted a picture of this guy rapping at him saying this ain't your granddaddy's gop. but turns out this man is not from the bronx at all.

his name is forgiato blow and he is a rapper from florida. his whole schtich is following donald trump around the country and claiming how maga he is. there is marjorie taylor greene sitting there on the car. dance move ifs people like michael flynn and roger stone. dance moves i challenge you to unsee. he is about as far from being from the bronx as one can be. his album shows a cover of his face, the state of florida and an orange. none of that is new york stuff. and among the crowd at trump's rally yesterday, there were plenty of folks like him. people who likely traveled to get there and were more representative of his fan base than the bronx. this is not to say there

weren't any actual residents of the bronx there. and as much as trump's crowds were not as large as he wanted them to be nor for the stars of the show bronx born and bred, there were still plenty of real voters there. who pose a real question for joe biden come november. >> what brings you out? >> well, i came to support donald trump. i think he is the best leader that we're going to have. just to show my support. >> he's the man that can save this country. period. >> you voted for trump in past election ins. >> no. i voted for biden. but i regret it. >> you regret it? why? >> well, it is too much crime. everything is going downhill. the economy is going downhill. the food is expensive. affording housing is not for everybody. it is just horrible. >> among the actual pro trump bronx residents she spoke to, the biggest issue that came up again and again was the economy. and again, there are a lot of

different anecdotes you can take from this rally to paint whatever narrative you wanted but pro trump voters saying they want to vote for trump because of how they perceive the economy under biden is not just an anecdotal thing. it is something biden will have to tackle to win. voters say their top concern is the economy. that matches with what we have seen in poll after poll. the same polls that have for months shown trump a few points ahead of biden. now for a long time the concern about the economy and trump's lead in the polls has been a confusing pairing, by most metrics, the economy is doing really well under president biden. so why is he behind? today the chief political analyst of the new york times published a big analysis of the poling we have seen this election cycle. analysis that might answer that question. here is a quote. polls have shown donald trump with an edge for eight straight months but there is a sign his

advantage might not be quite as stable as it looks. his lead is built on gains among voters who aren't paying close attention to politics. who don't follow traditional news and who don't regularly vote. so how does joe biden win over that group? how does biden sway voters who aren't really following the news? nbc news got the scoop that the biden campaign plans to shift to a more aggressive strategy once trump's new york hush money trial is complete. the most part, biden has been steering clear of that trial so far. he doesn't want to play into trump's false premise that the criminal trial is politically motivated and was somehow orchestrated by president biden. but once the trial is over, the biden campaign plans to take the gloves off. if trump is found guilty, the biden campaign will consider whether to brand him as a convicted felon. if trump is akuwaited or there is a hung jury, they expect to say they shouldn't wait for the

outcome of his other issues to be determined. donald trump's legal troubles are not going to keep him out of the white house. only one thing will do that. voting this november for joe biden. will that message work? >> if he gets convicted will that change your mind? >> no. i doubt it. because he is trying to help people and he is trying to make the economy better. and i feel like that is what is most important. >> joining me now are susan glasser, staff writer at the new yorker. brendan buck, former press secretary to john boehner and julian castro. secretary castro, let me start with you in terms of how biden tackles his problem. the first is the shakiness of trump. good news to the biden campaign i guess if you are looking at these numbers but it is hard, right?

how do you reach voters who are largely disengaged from the political process and don't follow traditional news media? do you have an answer? >> well i mean, it means you have to pursue this kitchen sink outreach strategy. you can't just be traditional tv or direct mail. it has to be a lot of digital getting on social media. in so many ways, alex, this is deja vu all over again. the best thing joe biden had going for him in the 2020 hen jury 2020 general election is he was going up against donald trump. and people wanted an adult in the room. they were tired of the chaos and lies and failures of so many ways of trump especially covid. and they felt like joe biden would be a steady hand. and everything joe biden can do to reach the lower income voters and get them amped up into the campaign is going to help him. it helps that they will have the first debate relatively

early on june 27th. it helps you will go through the convention. and it helps that biden has a significant cash on hand advantage because that helps him to better reach these voters. >> i want to read another excerpt. about media consumption. while mr. biden holds all of his support from voters who consume traditional mainstream media, television networks and the like. the disengaged are far likelier to report getting their news from social media. it may not be so easy for mr. biden to win these voters back. even if their demographic traits and traditional partisan allegiances suggest paths for the biden campaign to do so. it is why mr. blow, the rapper, can pretend to be from the bronx and carry some resonance though he is clearly a florida guy out there stumping for donald trump.

the question is how do you reach them? can they be reached? there is the whole thing of yeah, they don't know about biden yet. they are not understanding the dynamics of this campaign yet. but it is an open question whether yet turns to anything other than yet. >> this is exactly the point. campaigns don't pay too much attention to those voters because oftentimes those people don't vote. campaigns spend significantly more attention to people you know show up election after election and you have voting record that's show they do that. this is what makes this campaign or this election difficult to sort of pin down. we don't know who is going to be showing up this year. donald trump is doing far better with people who didn't vote in 2020. and if those people are people who don't typically show up, maybe that is not a big concern for joe biden. but we have a different

electorate every four years. and, the problem for the biden folks is if the people who are traditionally your core voters are not showing up in large proportions, that's the problem. look, i don't think donald trump is going to get 20% of the black vote like he is getting in a lot of polls. but even if that number, for democrats, is better, if a lot of black voters are not showing up at all, that's a big problem. and i think what they are going to need to do is focus on turnout for people who you can consistently expect to vote democrat in elections and not worry so much about the people who may in the end not vote at all. >> susan, you know, you have written about just the degree to which trump has gotten a pass on so many things. biden is not getting credit for the outstanding work he has done on the american economy. and trump is getting a pass on literally every level. i think people might admit,

they are largely incoherent. this is from your story in the new yorker this week. this is trump talking about i'm not sure what. it is him railing against the trial outside of the new york city courthouse. here is what he said. this is why he said he did not testify. i'm doing my best donald trump. yeah, because he, the judge, made rulings that made it very difficult to testify. anything i did, anything i did in the best, they could bring everything up then. you know what? i have had a great past, but anything but the other thing is, and the main reason, and i don't even mind that in fact i like talking about it because we had rigged cases. new york is out of control. and they can solve it with a good appellate. what? susan. how? >> a good appellate. it just rolls off the tongue doesn't it? you know, donald trump benefits actually from the expectation of his craziness. at this point, pollster said

the crazy is baked into the cake with donald trump. one of the results of course is that eight years into this political phenomenon that is donald trump, he can say the most outrageous over the top things and people shrug their shoulders. his supporters basically continue to support him. they are essentially almost immune to anything that trump could do or say. basically, look at the case of nikki haley this week. the very same week that his only major remaining kind of figure in the republican party who had not kissed the ring, she called him in february, unhinged. out of control. diminished. said she wasn't going to kiss the ring. two months later, nothing has changed. i don't think he is more hinged now than he was two months ago for that quote you just read.

and yet, they are immune to everything he says. just this week alone, it is friday night. you might not remember last weekend he was openly musing about staying a third term in office despite the two term limit. i could go on bragging about his relationship with vladimir putin. in the same speech that nikki haley said she would vote for donald trump, she also was excoriating both trump and joe biden for in her view being too weak on vladimir putin. and not sufficiently supporting ukraine. well, donald trump doesn't believe ukraine is a real country so why are you voting for him? >> yeah, the baked in the cake part of this is infuriating. the biden campaign is not giving up on telling the story of donald trump's crazy over and over again.

there is a new ad out narrated by robert deniro and i would like to take a listen to this ad for people who haven't seen it. this is out i think the last 24 hours. as a means by which the biden campaign can refocus our attention on the things donald trump has done and said since he has been president. >> from midnight tweets to drinking bleach. to tear gassing citizens and staging a photo op. we knew trump was out of control when he was president. then he lost the 2020 election. and snapped. desperately trying to hold onto power. now he is running again. this time, threatening to be a dictator, to terminate the constitution. trump wants revenge. and he will stop at nothing to get it. >> i'm joe biden and i approve this message. >> what do you make of the ad? >> i think it's a good ad. look at the different elements of it. it reminds people of why they

rejected donald trump last time from the bleach comment. to his failures in covid. january 6th which turned off a lot of people. even though his base seem to support it. but i don't think that commands the majority of the american voters. it also reaches into popular culture with robert deniro. you have the different elements coming together. you see as part of the biden blueprint to drive down donald trump's numbers and particularly i think, not only amp up the base, which is one part and make the most important, but also, to get to those lower propensity voters as they start to tune in. you got to use popular culture. you got to use the broad strokes. so i bet you will see a lot more of that now. >> are they going to be moved by that ad in your opinion? >> i got to be honest. i'm not sure what they are trying to do with that ad. we know everything that they just showed. is there anybody in america who

doesn't know that donald trump says crazy things and was a crazy president? the economy and immigration. do they not have a message they think on the people right now, joe biden is at risk of losing the presidency to donald trump who did all of those things because people don't like the direction the country is heading and they want change. and it is largely built around the economy. if they don't have a message on how donald trump will make the economy worse for you, that will not help anything. i know they will probably have other ads. until they can figure out an economic message, that is not encouraging. >> we'll have more on what joe biden is doing. so please stay with us. susan, brendan, and julian. we have much more to discuss including a new name that is popping up on donald trump's vice presidential short list. you'll never guess. but oh look, there's a picture of him. and later while donald trump courts oil barons, the biden

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we have some breaking news this hour. jack smith, is special counsel, has new filing in the mar-a- lago documents case. in it, special council smith asks the federal judge overseeing this case, that is judge aileen cannon, to bar former president trump from making statements that endanger

law enforcement. this filing is in response to trump complaining that standard boilerplate language contained in the fbi search warrant which was used to search mar-a-lago in the summer of 2022, trump is complaining that it was actually a secret attempt by joe biden to use the fbi to kill donald trump. an excerpt from that filing. quote trump's repeated mischaracterization of these facts and widely disrupted messages has endangered law enforcement officers. trump's conditions of release should be modified to prohibit similar communications going forward. back with me now are susan, brendan, and julian. susan, i go to you first on this. this is a song we have heard before. trump saying wild implausible and dangerous things that then put people in harm's way. however, the judge in this case

thus far has been very sympathetic to donald trump and has not been in much of a position to rule in favor of the special counsel. do you have thoughts on this? do you have a reaction to this? >> well, it is really notable that the special counsel has actually taken this to court. this was one of the wilder subplots of the week. donald trump embracing a new conspiracy theory promoted by some of his far right allies like marjorie taylor greene basically distorting this into some sort of an effort to put him in the cross hairs of federal law enforcements, guns, it even prompted a very unusual statement from merrick garland himself the attorney general saying this wasn't true. donald trump nonetheless not only promoting it on truth social, but raising money off of it. if you get the emails in your inbox that says joe biden tried to kill me. and it is a good example of where trump is used to never

having any accountability for the wild false allegations he is used to spreading. so you know, we'll see, i think you rightly pointed out the judge here has been quite sympathetic to donald trump and has effectively in her rulings made it impossible for this case to go to court before the election. so the american people won't have the benefit of knowing whether trump will be found guilty of very serious set of charges that involve him illegally taking scores of very classified top secret documents with him and misusing or certainly keeping that information unsafe in his bathroom. it is a remarkable case all around. but i don't know if she will sanction hymn or not. >> even if trump stops saying it that doesn't mean people in the republican party will. this week, the narrative joe biden tried to assassinate donald trump is one of the weeds left untended in the

garden. you have steve bannon saying it. the republican conference. i do wonder, you know, not on this network. not in traditional mainstream media. not on earth one. but in other parts of the internet. right wing echo chambers whether this thing has legs. >> yeah, that was my first reaction. i don't know what the judge will do but it reminds me how scary politics can be. if you take at face value what he is saying, he is endangering the lives of law enforcement. to me, that says there are a bunch of people in the fbi who are probably being tracked down on the internet and threatened by crazy people who are hearing crazy stuff on the internet. that's the reality that we don't hear a lot about in politics today. but it affects elected officials. it affects all kinds of places. we saw it down in georgia. the woman who was pestered based on what rudy giuliani

said. this is a scary place. and the way that information flows around can really be disturbing. i expect this is probably something from a very practical or something that actually took place that triggered it and that is scary. >> secretary castro, it is also the way trump demands fealty from all those who serve him. the notion that. it is similar to the 2020 big lie. right? once he has a theory in his mind, he is like a dog with a bone. and he won't let go of it and he won't get anyone around him let go of it. which is why the republican party is in the position it is. election interference. and the stolen 2020 election. i just wonder you know, we are talking about who trump will get to be his running mate. the veep stakes has been the topic of much discussion. there is a new entrant to the race. tom cotton, the senator. and i wonder of the selection

of people who have been names bandied about. doug burgham, tim scott, tom cotton, marco rubio. are those the kind of people willing to lay their conscience at the door in the way that being donald trump's running mate would demand? >> gosh, alex. you had a great line last week with it being a swim suit competition. all the folks marching up to testify and defend him in new york. but yeah. it seems so. as shocking as it is, they went up there to the well of the senate chamber, the house chamber. they condemned what had happened on january 6th. some of them even condemned or blamed donald trump for it. and here we are getting ready for the 2024 election after they had put the blame on him. after they had written him off. and now, they are marching to

his defense. they are all scurrying to try to figure out how they can get to number one on his vp list. and politicians when they do this, they do that because they think that there's a direct reward. for these guys, it is either the reward is they will become vice president selection. or they will keep their position. they are so scared of what would happen to them politically if hay angered his base. that primary challenge might be able to beat him. that they just think it is easier to give in and show that fealty publicly. they have to do it and show i was with donald trump no matter what happens to him. that's where we are at. we are at this very weird twisted echo chamber. all of donald trump's creation that has turned the republican party from a party that arguably under reagan, though i didn't like the principles, actually stood for some principles to now as many

people have pointed out. really more like a cult. >> yeah. well, can i ask you, susan? you were talking about nikki haley earlier in the hour. and i just wonder what you think she is getting out of this. her endorsement of donald trump. she didn't say her supporters should and must follow him at the ballot box. but she said she was going to support trump being biden had been such a catastrophe. what does she actually get out of this? >> you know, nikki haley is one of the serial flip-floppers on donald trump and the republican party. she is not the only one. but remember, she was against him. then for him. and then she was against him again. then she was against him too early so she was for him again. then she was against him. then she was more against him. now she is back to being for him. so it is pretty exhausting. she is relying on the template that has become the started template this year. if people like mitch mcconnell who has not spoken with donald trump since after the 2020 election, mitch mcconnell who blamed donald trump for

personally inciting that january 6th insurrection at the capitol, and yet, is willing to say that he is endorsing and voting for him, chris sununu, the governor of new hampshire, a scathing critic. i know for sure that marco rubio and tom cotton are under no illusions about donald trump. it is not like he is converted them to the religion of donald trump. and so, it speaks much more to the incentive structure in the republican party today for the secretaries observations which i think is right on the mark. it is about ambition. it is about what the definition of what it mean to be a republican is. but for donald trump, we haven't talked about that much. i would just throw out there in this veep stakes that donald trump believes that he was betrayed by mike pence on january 6th. the one thing he is really looking for in a vice president is the most servile person

without principles. i don't think he is looking for very much political help from a vice presidential candidate. he believes it is all about him in the end. and i just think loyalty is the thing we should be looking at. >> right. he is not looking to carry arkansas. he already has that one. he just need it is most spineless person among them. susan glasser, brendan buck, julian castro. thank you for spending your friday night with me. i really appreciate it. still ahead tonight, have you ever played monopoly? the game with the slogan? well live nation has taken that slogan seriously. and there are plan to make them pay the price. that's next. pay the price. that's next. new dove 10-in-1 serum hair mask with peptide complex. fortifies hair bonds at a molecular level. helps reverse ten signs of damage in one minute. keep living. we'll keep repairing.

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have you ever heard of swift-o-nomics? i majored in them. no i didn't. or the beyonce bump? these are used to describe the economic boon from the record breaking worldwide tours last year of taylor swift and beyonce. they injected roughly $10 billion into the american economy. fans who had the funds and were eager for a full on concert experience after suffering through a pandemic lockdown. they were willing to dole out a ton of cash on concert tickets, hotel rooms, plane tickets, and

bedazzled cowboy hats. but if you were among those that couldn't get your hands on a ticket, you were not alone. in the case of taylor swift's eras tour. ticket master notoriously botched the presale. the website crashed and hundreds of thousands of tickets ended up on the resale market selling for tens of thousands of dollars. if you managed to get tickets, you probably would have paided exorbitant fees. for the taylor swift concert, they would have been upwards of 28% of the ticket's face value. the real winner in all of this was ticket master's parent company live nation entertainment which earned record profits and stronger control over the concert industry at large. control that did not go unnoticed. last year, in a senate judiciary committee hearing, lawmakers grilled live nation's cfo accusing the company of consolidating power, harming the consumer and acting as a monopoly. >> live nation doesn't just

dominate the ticketing. it is about 70% of the big concert market. but also they own many of the major venue. >> a lot of people seem to think that is somehow a solution. it's a nightmare for us like a daydream. >> look in the mirror and say, i'm the problem. it is me. >> richard blumenthol quoting taylor swift lyrics aside, seem to be bipartisan agreement. a morning consult poll conducted last year shows 75% of american adults support legislation aimed at combating junk fees includeing the fees live nation's ticket master charges you to attend the concert venues it owns. americans overwhelmingly want to stop paying extra for live nation's monopoly. and yesterday, president biden's department of justice along with 30 state and district attorneys general

announced they are suing live nation in the hopes the court can break up the company. the biden administration is using its executive power to start another fight with a big corporation accused of exploiting american pocketbooks. meanwhile, this is how the other person running for president spent his week. trump just made more promises to oil industry campaign donors. donald trump who is also accused of engaging in a quid pro quo with oil executives is promising more drilling and less regulation in exchange for high dollar campaign donations. we'll have more on that political split screen coming up next. political split screen up next. hi classy- clem's not a morning person. i'm tasting it- or a night person. or a... people person. but he is an “i can solve this in 4 different ways” person.

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if you wanted to attend donald trump's fundraiser, a ticket would have cost you a whopping $250,000. this is obviously not an event that was marketed to working class or ordinary americans. but specifically to oil tycoons. at that very fundraiser, trump promised the big oil executives in the room more drilling and even fewer regulations. all they had to do, trump said, was to be generous, please. well. they complied. trump's bill oil fundraiser raked in $25 million from his

campaign in just one day. joining me now is former campaign manager of bernie sanders and founder of a more perfect union. what a study in contrast. biden's war against junk fees. >> that's not the only fundraiser. it has been a pattern with trump. he held a fundraiser at john paulson, a hedge fund billionaire's house. said we will lower your taxes, just make sure you give money to us. and by the way, we are speaking on a day when today, he secured the endorsement of the guy named steven schwartzman. one of new york's wealthiest people. one of the richest persons in the world who controls so much of the housing market, he says i endorse donald trump because his director for the the economy would be better. what is it that the billionaire class loves on donald trump? >> what is it? what do they like so much about donald trump? >> right now, you have the chamber of commerce, you have major credit card companies. you have ticket masters, you

have big oil companies all fighting joe biden in court. they are fighting an agenda that is working on behalf of the people. the billionaire cause is pretty upset. why would you dare to challenge our business practices that give us so much wealth? when you go in and challenge ticket master? when you challenge a kroger and albertson's merger? and apple's monopoly over the iphone market? why are you guys doing that? get out of our way. and the biden administration is fighting the people's fight. this is a basic fight. people versus the powerful. we will enact a government that is going to take the the side of the working class. that story is what is going on. you see the billionaire class revolt against it and i hope more people know people are taking on these fights on their behalf. >> yeah. well, i mean, let's talk about that for a minute. it is clear that the biden administration is doing this because of a sort of ethical drive. right? that is a wrong thing that is happening. this is, the american worker is

being screwed over. at the hand of big corporate profits and it is very clearly a proxy war against inflation. is it not? the biden administration gets hit on the economy for reasons that have a lot to do with the economy. more than the economy. they care hutch money people are having to shell out on a daily basis. >> inflation in general, one of the most important things we learned in the past few weeks was brought to us by the federal trade commission. in which they said that there was oil, there was collusion going on in which domestic oil producers. namely a guy who heads one of the most important oil industries here in america. was colluding with opec across the seas. saying let's keep prices high. they say let's keep prices

high. and, when you think when oil is kept high, what happens to the rest of the economy? here after you refer to the case for criminal prosecution. you have the biden administration going after criminally illegal price fixing. is it going to solve the problem immediately? no. but there will be accountability. as much as you can ask at this moment, the structural problem, it is not easy to fix. but joe biden is doing a good job of it and obviously donald trump is promising a different course of action which is hey, let's side with big business and let them do whatever the hell they want. >> honestly, rerig the economy. >> refill the swamp. >> biden is canceling a lot of student loan debt which is something that does not get covered as much as it should.

but i wonder if you think these measures are reaching the people. student loan debt. is this reaching the number of people who are not already on the side of joe biden? not yet, but five or six months to go. there are people in the working class coming out of the pandemic. pretty frustrated. feeling economically precarious. that doesn't mean they are doing poorly economically. but feeling uncertain. unsure. a malaise of a kind affecting the behavior and the mood. you have to meet people where they are at. you level with them about the fact there is a fight to be had about whether and who to trust to try to fix this economy on your behalf. who has the credibility to lower prescription drug prices? to go after big oil companies

when they collude? to go after major food producers and meatpackers when they are gouging prices on you? we haven't heard donald trump talk about any of this stuff. and i hope once joe biden is able to present, here is a course on the economy i'm taking that i am on a certain track and asking you for more time to work on this. versus that guy who wants to lower taxes for billionaires and give them the rule of the roost again. that choice has not been clarified because they haven't engaged each other on their respective plans that i'm hoping that happens very soon. >> june 27th, we are looking at you. maybe once cats tickets go on sale on ticket master donald trump will have an opinion. his favorite musical. thank you again for your time this friday night. and your general enthusiasm about what is possible. thank you, my friend. >> thank you alex. we will be right back. > we.

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breaking new this hour, special counsel jack smith is seeking a gag order in the mar- a-lago classified documents case. smith made the request of federal judge aaileen cannon after donald trump falsely suggested that language in the fbi search warrant of mar-a- lago, the one that was used to search his florida property in the summer of 2022, that language was a secret attempt by president biden to use the fbi to assassinate trump. this is from the motion this evening from special counsel's office. the law enforcement agents participating in this case conducted the search in an appropriate and professional manner subject to the department's standard use of force policy. trump's repeated mischaracterization of the

facts and widely distributed messages as an attempt to kill him has endangered law enforcement officers involved in the investigation and prosecution of this case and threatened the integrity of these proceedings. a restriction prohibiting future similar statements does not restrict legitimate speech. trump's conditions of release should be modified to prohibit similar communications going forward. joining me now on the phone is lisa rubin, our msnbc legal correspondent. lisa, what is your reaction to this filing? >> i'm surprised to see the filing. only because they have generally been thwarted at most turns by judge aileen cannon when they have gone on the offensive with respect to donald trump. as you have heard, judge cannon was very harsh with the special counsel's office just in terms of their rebutting. the characterization of a

meeting between the lawyers. he said it is just not right. if there was a situation to justify a gag order, this week's comments about the fbi and the attachment to that search warrant definitely warrant it. you will note that same fbi policy was attach today the search with respect to president biden's only delaware residence. this is not a situation where the former president was treated any differently than anyone else would be with respect to a search. >> and lisa, this week, we haven't actually a chance to play at this hour, but merrick garland, the attorney general, who is allergic to confrontation, lest it be seen as political, came out and said publicly, these kinds of comments are dangerous and up acceptable. that was a very unusual step.

and by the way, on behalf of other trump allies. >> yeah. the attorney general has been very circumspect. with respect to investigations run by various special counsel. so for him to come forward and say that, you're right. it is a deviation from how merrick garland has conducted himself. without having been said, you will remember in the wake of the initial mar-a-lago search, there were violent actions taken against at least one fbi office. i can remember in the middle of the country. certainly there have been other actions in recent months taken against various actors who have played some part in the various legal dramas, concerning and surrounding former president trump. that is everyone from new york attorney general letitia james to the state court judge who presided over the civil fraud trial. there have been multiple threats and escalating rhetoric against judge juan merchan who

is overseeing the ongoing criminal trial against donald trump right now. president trump has been attacking him tonight on his truth social. that includes alvin bragg, the manhattan district attorney as well. i imagine the special council's office is particularly mindful of the ways in which former president trump's rhetoric has endangered law enforcement officials throughout the country. and culminating in this most recent attack on the fbi and president biden. >> yeah. i do wonder though, lisa, as we sit at the end of the new york city hush money trial where there was a gag order and one that was highly contested by president trump, whether we think gag orders work. if we can't say it, he can get his minions to do it. speaker johnson has no problem impugning the entire judiciary if it serving donald trump's interests and i just wonder how effective you think a gag order can be politically.

>> look. there is no question that the gag order as much as former president trump says that it is unconstitutional, absolutely his own talk on certain individuals. that said, when you have folks like senator tuberville admit they are deliberately taking action to help former president trump overcome that gag order, you're right. there is only so much a gag order can do when a former president's ally and beyond that, want to go and help him do that. do that. order can necessarily d control >> thank you for springing into action tonight. that's our show for this evening. hello, i'm craig melvin, and this is dateline. >> he said he wouldn't handle talking about it. i was angry at him. if you're not going to tell me what happened and you're doing to dance around