that will do it for me. thanks for watching. tune in tomorrow for the sunday show. the former hillary clinton spokesperson joins us to talk the upcoming presidential debate. he played donald trump in her 2016 debate prep. plus i will speak with senator tina smith of minnesota, who is looking to repeal an archaic 19th-century law that could be used to justify a national abortion ban. that is tomorrow right here on msnbc. follow us using the handle weekend k part and find clips

of the show on youtube. keep it here. ayman mohyeldin is up next. good evening tonight. motion by motion, the classified documents case appears paralyzed. is that because of an experience or intent? and what is up with the supreme court taking its sweet time with the trump claim of immunity case? based on history decisions only take this long if you want them to. and a new week brings public dissent over the war in gaza. you will hear from an air force engineer who is bowing out to take a stand. i am ayman mohyeldin. let's do it. we begin this evening with the conundrum that is u.s. district judge trent 42. the federal judge presiding over trump's classified documents case, friday in florida she heard challenges from trump's team and others and special

counsel jack smith, who brought charges against trump in florida and d.c. is somehow unlawfully appointed. the foundation of their claim is that smith should have been confirmed by the senate, not appointed by the attorney general and therefore the case smith brought against trump should be dismissed. trump's team went as far as saying garland's appointment of smith is akin to, quote, a shadow government. lawyers for the special counsel disputed the notion that smith's appointment violates the constitution and u.s. versus nixon settled this argument and the attorney general has the authority to appoint a special counsel with the power of opening investigative cases independently. during the hearing, cannon also asked about the history of the use of special councils, independent councils and special prosecutors, in some cases dating back to the 1800s. in her defense, cannon appeared

skeptical and did ask trump's team to clarify what she called their ominous claim, but i think that reveals the problem. the fact that judge cannon is entertaining motions like these to begin with, even allowing attorneys representing nonprofit groups and former government officials to file their own arguments and it all really begs a bigger question. his judge cannon slow rolling the case intentionally or is a doubt of incompetence and an experience? the questions of intent are pretty obvious. she was appointed in 2020 by then president donald trump. questions about her experience have been ongoing as well, starting with the fact that she has very little trial experience. in reporting this week by the new york times, it certainly does not help her case. based on two people briefed on the conversations, two of cannon's colleagues on the bench in florida approached her last year and actually urged

her to step aside. of course as we know, judge cannon kept the case. this revelation is the latest in a series of red flags. since taking the case last june, cannon exhibited hostility toward the prosecutors. handled pretrial motion slowly and indefinitely postponed the trial date. friday's hearing was the first of three. the other two are set for next week. trump's lawyers have also argued and urged her to delay any trial to after the election and then there is what trump's inner circle thinks. let's listen to what roger stone was caught on tape saying about judge cannon and marge. >> i think the judges on the verge of dismissing the charges against him in florida. they are delayed in new york city and they are now delayed in washington. so it's not clear that they can have a trial before the election, which is the absolute key to convince people that the reason we lost was because of the trial.

>> lots to unpack. kicking us off is our justice to correspondent. and columnist at the boston globe and cohost of the sisters- in-law podcast. it's great to have both of you with us. i will start with you. your response to what we heard from roger stone. what is your take away from that clip about cannon's role in the trump campaign strategy? >> they've got cannon in the bag and they've known at the entire time. you asked the question, is it incompetence or inexperience or intentional and i say why not all three? it is highly possible that aileen cannon is both an incompetent, corrupt tag, and an experienced judge with no business on the bench and openly pining and trying to get the case thrown out or delay the case as long as possible to help her sugar daddy, donald trump.

all three are in play at the same time and everybody knows it. i think that is the most frustrating thing about this experience. everybody knows what she is about. there is no artifice here. we all know what she thinks she was appointed to do. we should not have a system where presidents can pick their own judges and aileen cannon is exhibit number one of why we need a total reform of ethics throughout our judiciary from the supreme court all the way down to federal district court judges. >> kimberly, to that point, the writing has long been on the wall about aileen cannon. from the first days we learned her name and learned anything about her. this week you've learned a lot more from new york times reporting revealing how cannon rejected suggestions to step aside from the classified documents case for the sake of balance and neutrality. the fact she was appointed by trump was going to cast a

shadow over this from the get- go. what do you think of that? >> so that is a new data point in what we have been seeing in a lot of reporting, whether it is people who worked with her, attorneys who litigated before her. you can say, it can be any of these things. to the point that you said in these arguments today. you had friends of the court who were making their own arguments at the trial level. i cannot state enough how that is unheard of. usually you have that if you have an appeal of an issue of law that goes before a federal appellate court or the u.s. supreme court. trial motions don't have those and why she scheduled that is beyond me. it is almost a signal that she is not confident in her own ability to rule on this, especially since this issue has come up multiple times before with other special counsel and

they have been resolved and that there is no problem with the ability of the doj to appoint a special counsel. this has been asked and answered legally and certainly factually in this case. she should not need help and the fact she is even asking for it is a big problem. >> let's try to get into the details of what we saw on friday and this hearing where she heard a challenge from trump's lawyers on the constitutionality of special counsel jack smith's appointment. breakdown for us this argument that they brought that the attorney general's ability to appoint a special counsel is not unlike the power to appoint a shadow government. >> ayman, i can't break it down because it is stupid. there is no law. there is no argument they have. the special counsel law is well- established. as you said in your opening, this was asked and answered under nixon. the attorney general can appoint a special counsel. jeff sessions did it.

merrick garland has done it. janet reno. loretta lynch did it. this is what they do, so the argument that they suddenly cannot do it, it is just stupid on its face and i think that i do not want to do your viewers a disservice pretending that there is anything real here, because it is not. it is just a delay tactic to help donald trump not have to go to trial before the election. that is all. >> kimberly, what has the handling of the documents case exposed? is this a case of her being out of her depth as we suggested a little bit with some of the reasoning for why she is doing certain things or do you think she is calculating some benefit professionally because she is going to unabashedly protect trump and serve his interests? what does she get at this point

protecting trump, as opposed to why when she wanted the job she was loyal to trump? >> look, i'm not going to try to get in her head, but certainly if she handles this case in a way that is pleasing to trump and he returns to office, he is the person in charge of making other federal appointments and other goodies that are up for grabs, so is that a motivation? potentially, but she is also risking, just the way she is committing what i think is judicial misconduct in plain sight. if donald trump is not elected, i'm not sure. she has a lifetime appointment on this court, but i'm not sure what else it holds for her in terms of a career, because i would not, if i were a law firm or some other organization, not be looking to hire someone who doesn't even understand how to handle a simple motion during a trial that should be straightforward. you know, i guess it depends on who wins the election.

>> and i had something there? one of the problems is that she is not risking anything, because there has been no sense from the democratic party, from the opposition party, that they are going to do anything to stop her or punish her for this outrageous behavior. we don't have democrats running explicitly on we are going to impeach this incompetent judge if you return us to power in congress in the senate. we don't have that, so there is only upside for her. if trump wins, maybe she is up for a circuit court appointment, maybe a supreme court appointment. that is obviously the end goal in the maga world. if trump wins there is only upside and if trump loses there is no downside and again it is not just about cannon, it is about the entire federal judiciary. there is never consequence. there is never punishment for judges acting a fool out there, mingling the law, because

democrats never put the wood to them when they have the opportunity to do so. >> to that point, kimberly, is there any action jack smith could take right now in this case for a different judge? could he say enough is enough? it is clear that she is not following the rules of the law and is simply delaying? he seems to have some patience with how this is playing out. >> well she is also playing it too cute by half, because she has actually not ruled on anything. in order for jack smith to seek her removal, he would have to try to base it on her s, based on her rulings. but she has not issued any. there are several outstanding motions in this case that should've been cleared up long ago, so she is tying up the process and now she is putting it all on hold, so that ties his hands in terms of what he can do. >> let me pivot really quickly

to this final thought about the hush money case. some developments there. manhattan district attorney alvin bragg asked the judge to extend trump's gag order citing a deluge of threats. the new york police department has logged 56 actionable threats against bragg, his family, and employees since april. hardly a surprise that this would happen to the manhattan d.a. after trump's conviction. >> it is not a surprise, but it is a sad commentary. you can be black, you can't be a woman in public without taking some kind of heat and you can't be a black person or a woman going, doing your job in a way that displeases maga and his violent supporters. you can't do that without incurring some of these threats. i think pretty much every public, black public person, most women public people, have face to this kind of

ridiculousness. gretchen whitmer, obviously the target of some incredible, horrible threats of violence against her. bragg is another person. this is what happens to anybody who is perceived to be standing against the maga takeover in our country and it is a sad state of affairs, but it is also what about 50% of the country votes for. they want us to feel like this. they want us to be afraid and all we can do is not be afraid and keep on. >> and those who vote for trump are cosigning every part of this behavior. please stick around, we have a lot more to discuss. next up, the supreme court and how justices are sunday driving trump's claim of immunity. is this delayed decision also by design? what straps bold to a rocket and hurtles it into space? boring does. boring makes vacations happen,

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the supreme court's term is almost up. friday, in a rare win for gun safety, they upheld a ban on domestic abusers obtaining a firearm, but no decision on what is arguably the most vital case this term for our democracy. by next friday we hope to get a ruling on trump's claim of absolute immunity. the court accepted the case 115 days ago and the delay in dropping a decision is leading to fears that there is something more sinister going on. a contribution all -- a constitutional law professor spoke to the daily beast and said this is a sign that the supreme court is doing trump's bidding. the reality is that the longer it takes to get a decision, the less likely we will see a trial before the november election. elie mystal and kimberly atkins stohr are back with me. your take on the fact we did

not see a decision in the immunity case on friday. how unusual is it that something this black-and-white, and holding off on delivering such a controversial high- profile decision, seems to be dragged out as long as possible? >> it takes a long time for martha and alito to cross stitch or opinion that trump is above the law and disseminated to the rest of us. that takes time. i don't know why you are trying to rush things. look, this problem happened a long time ago. december 11, when jack smith went directly to the supreme court and said rule on this now, because we know it will get to you eventually and they were like no, absolutely not. we will not rule on it on december 11. we will not rule in april. we will let it go to the circuit of appeals. we will not affirm the circuit court of appeals. we have another ruling and then we won't release their decision until the very end of our term. that's the problem.

when people say every day, no, that deadline has already passed. they've already won. they already helped trump get through the election. it doesn't matter now with it came out yesterday or it comes out next week. they have already done the bidding. personally i think they will wait for the debate. the debate is on thursday. they scheduled an opinion day on wednesday. i think they will wait for the debate and give trump a debate present of declaring him at least partially immune from some of his crimes that he has allegedly committed. >> kimberly, why do you think the justices are holding off on issuing this decision? is it political posturing? do you agree it is aimed at benefiting donald trump and that he has already won by having this delayed indefinitely or is there something else that we should be concerned about in their genuine understanding of the law, that yes maybe they believe the president has absolute power and immunity? >> i associate myself with much

of what my friend said about all of the opportunities that the supreme court had to decide this issue if they really wanted to decide it quickly, but i differ on one thing. what i believe is that this is a fragmented court. this is a court of nine individuals. it is not nine people working together and the ideological differences, the lack of trust some of the justices have spoken about, especially since the leak of the dobbs decision and look at the gun rights case that you talked about that was released. it was 8-1, but it wasn't really. almost everybody wrote their own and did not engage with everyone else. it was like nine justices each issuing their own opinion and when that happens, they can't work together. it is very difficult to circulate opinions and get that process done. the court can't wait until after the debate and then suddenly issue an opinion,

because the process of getting it to print and collated and all that takes some time, so the opinion is already decided. it is just everybody getting all the pieces together and they have to work together to do this. this is a sign that this court is not working together at all. it is not just the immunity decision. except for this gun case the other day. every consequential decision still has to be decided before next week or july 1 if it hangs over. they are not getting anything done at this court and that is a big, big problem and that screams out for reform, whether or not you believe they are in the bag for donald trump or not. >> are you surprised given that the dobbs decision was leaked, because of how monumental that was and how it upended so much in america, that a decision like this, if it is granting donald trump absolute immunity, could have also been leaked, would have been leaked because it would upend so much of our

political norms? >> no, supreme court leaks are rare. the dobbs decision leaking was crazy, was a shock. i think alito did it. now that we know what kind of person martha and is, i would pin it on them. do they have a reason to leak this as opposed to leaking dobbs? probably not, that is probably why it has not leaked. i do not expect a supreme court leak. i expect the supreme court to do its job. it has one job and as kimberly is explaining, they can't really do it. they are not working enough to do it. one of the things because i read a lot of supreme court opinions, one of the things you realize over time is how long they take to write and how many words, just straight up they write on the page compared to courts 20 years ago, 30 years ago, 40 years ago. they are in their own naples right now about how important they are and it goes to this issue where the supreme court truly does see itself as rulers.

like it sees itself as kings. if you listen to the oral arguments from the immunity case, they are making grand pronouncements like we have to make a decision for all time that will set history right. not the case. not the actual case. they were not dealing with the facts of a case like a judge is supposed to. they were thinking about pronouncements for history. like they are so in their own naples at this point. they are drinking their own kool-aid and i think kimberly is probably right. when it does come out it will be a majority opinion, that i agree in part. and then it will be seven or eight different occurrences and one unified dissent like you guys are ridiculous, from the women. that is how they operate at this point. >> kimberly, this immunity ruling is obviously not the only major decision we are expecting. you mentioned several more before july 1. major rulings on social media, emergency abortion, homelessness. what other cases are you

looking for that also can be defining to broader ways of life in this country at this moment? >> you can't overstate the one about emergency abortion care. a federal law that requires doctors and medical facilities to provide emergency care to everyone, regardless of what is threatening their life or health, and the need for an emergency abortion. in states where abortion is banned. they are trying to keep that from happening, which literally is a matter of life and death. i am also worried about this case about the january 6 defendants. some of the charges that they are charged with that came out of the enron statute that are meant to criminalize interfering with an official proceeding, which is exactly what they did. donald trump is also charged with that and if the supreme court tosses those charges out, i'm worried not just about those individual cases, but it will give the folks on the maga

side this megaphone to say see, these cases were all bogus. these january 6 defendants are, as donald trump calls them, hostages, and it can throw a lot of messy disinformation into this presidential race that we can't afford right now. >> hostages and patriots as he has often referred to them. elie mystal and kimberly atkins stohr, thank you both. really appreciated as always. coming up, riley livermore went through a profound shift in beliefs after october 7 and has now resigned from the u.s. air force. find out why, next. with libe. let's fly! (inaudible sounds) chief! doug. (inaudible sounds) ooooo ah. (elevator doors opening) (inaudible sounds) i thought you were right behind me. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, ♪ ♪ liberty. ♪

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>> very early on, even in the first month after october 7, as we saw the israeli air campaign before the ground incursion, it was really clear that they had an immense appetite or tolerance for civilian casualties and despite that really u.s. support was going to be unqualified and unlimited. from where i work, the defense intelligence agency, it was very clear that it would be all hands on deck in terms of supporting israel regardless of how they conducted the war. >> for some within the armed forces, the resignation was a source of comfort and validation. we recently spoke to several members of the military including riley livermore, an air force engineer raised as an evangelical christian. he was chosen to go to israel for an engineering exchange program and it was there that he immersed himself in the culture for two years, making

friends in the country and learning how to speak hebrew. he said israel had a special place in my heart and even rethought his faith, but things took a dramatic turn for him after october 7 and now he is undergoing a month-long process to leave the u.s. air force. saying, quote, i don't want to be working on something that can turn around and be used to slaughter innocent people. livermore had already become disenchanted with the u.s. military due to the wars in iraq and afghanistan and he knew things would only get worse as israel began military operations in gaza. during his time in israel he remembered hearing rhetoric like demolish gaza and wipe it off the face of the earth. the types of statements we have been hearing from some israeli officials. livermore was concerned by the israeli military's use of artificial intelligence systems and their bombing campaigns, such as gospel and lavender, which we have talked about extensively on the show.

he wasn't alone in feeling complicit. last february aaron bushnell made national headlines by setting himself on fire in protest outside the embassy in washington, d.c. he died hours later. his last words as he live- streamed his self immolation work, quote, i am about to engage in an extreme act of protest, but compared to what people have been experiencing in palestine at the hands of their colonizers, it is not extreme at all. this is what the ruling class has decided would be normal. he then yelled out free palestine until his words became indistinguishable from his screams. for u.s. airmen it was a turning point. courtney kube he recently spoke with betancourt and a fellow active-duty airmen who are both seeking conscientious object or status over the war with gaza. >> i began to question my

participation in the military and it emboldened me to speak out against the atrocities that were taking place in palestine. >> reporter: larry says the turning point was the death of a 6-year-old palestinian girl. >> she was almost just like my daughter. seeing some of those images and seeing these families suffer as a result of u.s. weapons. >> after the break i will speak with riley livermore, who says he will never again work in the military-industrial complex. stay with us. . [introspective music] recipes.

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this week, another high- profile resignation from the biden administration over its handling of the war. andrew miller left his position, citing family obligations, but sources tell the washington post miller was also skeptical of the bearhug approach to the government of israel. before the break i introduced you to air force engineer riley livermore, in the process of leaving the military over concerns of u.s. involvement in the war. he joins me now. it's great to have you on the show. thank you for making time for us. you told the intercept that before october 7 you would've been little more than an israeli apologist were willing to look at both sides. walk us through how you evolved to where you are today. what changed for you and how did you say enough is enough? >> thanks for the opportunity, ayman. i'm happy to be heard.

i was in charge of running a multimillion dollar operation looking at rapidly testing autonomous a.i. capabilities. part of our role was to do this as safely as possible. during the day i would show up at work and we would want to go fast, but it was paramount that we did not hurt any people or destroy property. but i would go at home at night and i would see israel's destruction to people and property. then when it came out how israel was accelerating the genocide of the palestinian people using autonomous drones and a.i. systems like lavender and gospel, like you mentioned, it really scared me. because it wasn't, the technology they were using was not dissimilar to the things we were testing, myself or my team. and furthermore the fact that

the united states government, the biden administration not only did not condemn what they were doing, but was bankrolling the whole endeavor. it made me scared that what i was doing could end up being used in a similar manner. >> as i mentioned we just saw another state department official resigned this week, the most senior to date. we've highlighted others that have resigned over the course of the last eight months. in your two decades at the air force inside the u.s. military, have you ever seen this level of dissent before and for those who have not resigned, is there growing dissent or frustration among colleagues in the military who have not yet taken the steps that you have? >> this is completely different from anything i have seen. i think, yes, i think the problem, a lot of people who know what is going on are obviously upset. i think there is a big trouble with our media, because people just don't realize.

even aaron bushnell, there are a lot of my colleagues who don't know who he is. i think there is an information challenge. once you see you can't un-see this stuff and it wrecked me going to work every day knowing what was going on, knowing what my government was supporting and people just were not aware. >> did it ever occur to you or did you try to take your concerns about what was happening inside gaza to higher- ups in the chain of command and if you did, what did they say back to you? do you think this momentum in resignations and people speaking out is worrying to those that are higher up in the department of defense and perhaps the biden administration? >> for me personally, because it was about three weeks after october 7. shortly after the bombing of a hospital in northern gaza. i talked to my commander and said this is something i'm not okay with. i think we are watching an

unfolding genocide based on my background and understanding how israel operates. is there anything else i can do? any official channels where i can say i'm not okay with this as an active duty member? he said you are not -- you don't have to follow an unlawful order, but if you are not directly doing that, work through your congressman and senator. so short of calling everyday for the last six months, i did not feel like there was any other recourse for me until the bravery really opened up that there are other options to make sure my voice is heard, because what i was doing was not working. >> you said you want nothing to do with the u.s. military after your exit is made official. have you thought about what is next for you and how has your family responded? your family, your friends, people you care about, how have they responded to your decision to leave the military over the

handling of the war? are they supportive of you? have you felt opposition to that decision? >> my family and my wife has been incredible. my parents are supportive of me as well. unfortunately i did find an opportunity more in line with my beliefs. i turned down a number of lucrative opportunities to get involved with autonomous systems, working with contractors and other places in the department of defense. that is hard because i am passionate. i think it is important that we use these tools more broadly and very responsible ways and it was something we talked about in the department of defense. it is something that i was doing and there is nothing responsible about aiding and abetting a genocide. >> let me ask you quickly, do you believe the u.s. is complicit in what israel is doing and if you had a message to say to the white house, what would it be? >> yes, the sheer volume of

weapons we are providing. billions and billions of dollars of aid. just being in israel, a first- hand experience of how pivotal the u.s. influence is in that region, both diplomatically and obviously just funding this whole thing. president biden, i believe this with all my heart, could pick up the phone and make this stop right now and the fact he doesn't, to me, i've been hoping for the last nine months that the red line, the next bombing, the next child dying would be a breaking point and it hasn't happened and it has been utterly frustrating for me. >> i can see it is a difficult subject for a lot of people as well. riley livermore, thank you so much for speaking up and joining us. >> i appreciate the time, thank you. next up, a palestinian poet shares his story of survival. stay with us.

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of cancer keytruda is known for at keytruda.com, and ask your doctor if keytruda could be right for you. new herbal essences is packed with naturally derived plant based ingredients your hair will love and none of the stuff it won't. our sulfate free collections smell incredible and leave your hair touchably soft and smooth. new herbal essences. the palestinian people have a long tradition of producing poets. it has played an important role in preserving history, but also a tool of resistance and survival. those in the literary and education fields have not been spared the brutality of the past eight months. in december the literary hub posted a remembrance of 14 poets and writers killed since october 7, though that list is not been updated in months.

in april, u.n. experts decried the obliteration of gaza's education system and used a term to describe it. one survivor is a poet, scholar, and founder of gaza's first english language library named after the celebrated palestinian american scholar. on november 19, he was detained by israeli forces on his way to the border as he tried to evacuate with his family. he recounted his brutal detention in the new yorker magazine, where his writing has been featured. it was this notoriety in western intellectual circles that prompted international outrage and spurred israel to finally release him. most palestinians, though, don't have that benefit. since his release he has been documenting what has been happening in his native land from afar with painful stories of dead family members and friends and the destruction of his home. he has a new book coming out in october. it is a collection of poems called forest of noise.

he joins me now. thank you so much for joining us on the show. i want to start by asking about the constant documentation of israel's bombardment and war on gaza and the intense deteriorating conditions the palestinian people are still enduring in gaza. over the past few days you have shared posts about an enormous massacre at the refugee camp where you were born and you wrote hours ago, our souls are not heavy, they are very light. please stop turning off the lights. elaborate on what you mean and what has been going through your mind over the last day alone. >> thank you so much for having me. it is so very devastating to me that this massacre is happening while right now i am in syracuse, in new york state. it is very devastating to be outside of gaza, to watch my people being killed, because i was nearly killed. i was detained. in fact i was kidnapped and

detained, because i was clear to leave gaza with my wife and three children. it is devastating to me to watch my family looking for food, walking out in the street. it is so difficult and very dangerous for people to go out in the street to look for food. one time my mother and siblings and children just went out to dig through the rubble and see if they could find food in my apartment and the only thing they could find were some books. to that extent i wish i had food on my bookshelves instead of books. today's massacre happened in the refugee camp, one of seven refugee camps in the gaza strip. there are hundreds of thousands of people in a very tiny place. it is a beach camp. so this city, it is on the shore, on the beach and people are just looking outside of

their bombed houses, into the sea. they wish they could go and fish for food, but israel has been maintaining a blockade on the sea, the sky, and on land and fishermen are unable to go and fish. it has been going on since 2007. no fisherman could fish as far as seven nautical miles and now it is very difficult even to go to the beach itself. it is very devastating to see my people starve. to see my neighborhood in rubble and now to see the refugee camp where i once lived to be bombed and see some of the faces i could recognize when i was a child. >> let me ask you about one of the poems you have written and certainly you have written many over the last eight months, including this one called we deserve a better death. can you talk about this particular poem? the feelings you had writing it and hope you have about how it

resonates for people. are you writing these poems to help yourself process and grieve what is happening or are these more intended for the world to lead to some kind of action or reaction? >> i write poems in english and arabic. this i wrote in the english language in 2022. when i come back, which is part of the book that was published two years ago, when i look at this poem i feel like i have written it yesterday. this in itself tells us that the misery and disaster that palestinians have been going through his decades long. occupation. when i wrote that poem, when i write poems in english, it is like i am talking to someone who doesn't know how i live as a refugee, as a father. i will stressed you right now, i had to leave gaza, because i wanted to save my own life and save the lives of my wife and three children and i had the

opportunity to leave. when i wrote this poem about us deserving a better death, not even a better life, because living under occupation, at least we need to die, you know, a natural death, you know? we don't have to have our heads cut off. yesterday i posted something and unfortunately mehta continues to remove my posts when i try to show the people in the world what israel is doing to us. they are not bombing only houses. not killing a family. they are killing people who live in the same neighborhood, so there was a photo of a young girl and i could see there was only the head, even part of the head and on that same blanket, what remained of one of her feet and mehta removed it. so we deserve a better death, okay, if we are going to be

killed, let us be killed by a bullet or something, but not for our bodies to be thrown around. israel is not only killing hamas, they are killing whoever is inside, as if these flesh and blood and bones were part of it. this is brutal and unbearable and this should stop today, now. >> we are almost out of time and don't have a lot of time left, but i want to ask since you brought up the censorship of things you are posting, you are able to consume western news and you live in new york. what do you think the western world or american media, social media is getting wrong or does not know ougaza? >> i think most people when they think about palestine and especially gaza, they think -- it has strawberry farms, beautiful buildings. they say how do you say you are

under c? we see how healthy you looked in the past as if they were feeding us. we created gaza to be a beautiful place although we have been under siege and live under occupation. the whole world needs to know that gaza is like any other city and people want to live and they don't want anyone to control them. you know, they want to be free people of the world. they do not want this but they need freedom. they need a state to live in and freedom, just like any other people in the world. >> thank you so much for joining us, thank you so much for your poetry. always a pleasure. thank you so much. >> thank you, ayman. appreciate the time. >> another hour of ayman starts after a quick break. break.

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