before we leave you, we have a quick update for everyone at home. saturday, september 7, you can join me and the msnbc family at msnbc live, democracy 2024. that is our top-notch fan event happening right here in brooklyn, usa, well, across the river here. there will be riveting conversations about the most pressing issues of our time and there will be a sitdown dinner where you can get the inside scoop on this critical moment in our democracy and you can see whether chris hayes prefers

chicken or fish for dinner. so scan the qr code on your screen to buy your tickets. they are selling like hot cakes. now it is time for the last word with my buddy, jonathan capehart, in for lawrence. >> good evening, alex. you will be in brooklyn. i am here in aspen, where it is lovely. >> i think you pull the longer straw on that one. >> all right, alex, thanks very much. >> thank you, have a good show. in 47 hours, the earliest presidential debate in modern u.s. history will be underway and that debate will mark the first time a sitting president and former president have ever debated. of course president biden and donald trump have debated before, but this time one of the two candidates on that stage is now a convicted felon. in fact the two candidates will debate two weeks before donald trump is set to be sentenced on july 11. today the biden harris campaign

release to this ad. >> donald trump loves to attack joe biden, because he is focused on revenge and he has no plan to help the middle class. he just gives more tax cuts to the wealthy. joe biden is working every day to make your life more affordable. he capped the cost of insulin, lowered healthcare costs and made big corporations pay their fair share. here's the difference. donald trump is only out for himself. joe biden is fighting for your family. >> donald trump is and just focused on revenge, he's focused on spreading baseless lies that president biden will be under the influence of some kind of magical debate enhancing drug and spreading those lies seems to be the official and only trumped debate strategy. >> my strategy is very simple. make america great again, that's all, because we are going to turn it around fast. there's no strategy, we're

going to turn it around fast. >> donald trump was in philadelphia this weekend where he told nbc news that he knows who his running mate is and that running mate could be at thursday's debate. >> in my mind, yeah. >> do they know? >> nobody knows. >> nobody knows, but nbc news reported last week that ohio senator j.d. vance, north dakota governor doug burgum and florida senator marco rubio were among his top finalists for vice president. here is what each of them had to say about the man that they believe should run this country again. >> i am a never trumped guy. i never liked him. >> did you ever do business with donald trump? >> i don't think so. >> why? >> i just think that it is important that you are judged by the company you keep. >> there's no way we are going to allow a con artist to take

over the conservative movement and donald trump is a con artist. >> so, while donald trump continues to use the campaign trail to spread lies and let's not forget about the rants about sharks, the fact he forgot the name of his doctor or his love of the fictional serial killer, hannibal lecter. the biden/harris campaign is highlighting the very real stakes of this election. yesterday marks two years since trump appointed justices eliminated the constitutional right to an abortion. >> here's the thing, donald trump says he is probably responsible for what he has done. proudly responsible that our daughter has fewer right than my mother-in-law? proudly responsible that doctors can be imprisoned? proudly responsible that access to in vitro fertilization is now at risk? access to contraception is now at risk. >> that was vice president harris in battleground arizona yesterday, reminding everyone that donald trump and his

republican allies won't stop at abortion rights and more than 1600 miles away, senator elizabeth warren was in battleground wisconsin to rally on behalf of the biden harris campaign. >> i'm fighting for our sisters. for our cousins. for the women we went to school with. for our neighbors. i'm fighting for the 10-year- old girl who was raped. i'm fighting for the 46-year- old woman whose only chance to be a mom is going to be ivf. i'm fighting for the person who very much wanted this pregnancy and things went wrong. they went haywire, they went sideways. i am fighting for everyone who may be in a position of having to make a medical decision and

believes that that medical decision should be between the patient and the doctor and not a politician in washington. donald trump is despicable in so many ways. one way that is particularly despicable is the way he talks out of both sides of his mouth about abortion. he says what he thinks -- i will leave it up to the states. i don't want to do this. let's figure out what it will be. blob blob loblaw. but when he is in front of the people who are the extremists who are driving across this country, driving to make the healthcare decisions based on their ideology. driving to be the ones who

decide who gets to make what decisions in an examining room, in an operating room. well, i say donald trump wants to brag about this one. let's help him. let's make it clear to everybody in this country, the reason we lost roe versus wade is donald trump. >> joining us now, michael tyler, communications director for the biden/harris reelection campaign. michael, welcome back to the last word. good to see you again. your interpretation of donald trump's media tour of complaints and excuses? >> well, thank you so much for having me, jonathan. listen, this is what we have come to expect from donald

trump when it comes to debates. this is a guy with a history of complaining about debates, skipping out on debates, trying to use them as a spectacle for his advantage. the problem is people will see the choice in this election. they will see on one side of the stage president biden who is fighting for people, bringing people together to get things done. on the other side they will see donald trump who is waging a campaign of grievance. it was only in it for himself. he was making it clear every day on the stump just how extreme he would be in a second term, so that is the choice the american people will be confronted with when they tune in thursday night, regardless of what trump tries to do on the front end. >> speaking of the front end, ad of the debate the campaign is holding a black american business leaders barbershop roundtable. donald trump says he is making inroads with black voters and polls do show trump ahead in georgia, but i seem to recall when i traveled with you and the president down to atlanta after the state of the union

address on march 9, we went to a black-owned business. i'm wondering how does the biden/harris campaign see georgia? >> we see georgia as incredibly competitive. the president obviously won the state in 2020 and we expect to do so again. it will be close and competitive, but we know we have the right candidate and the right team in place to get the votes and when the state of georgia again. when we talk about black voters and black business for example, we don't know why donald trump would want to talk about black business. at the end of his term black businesses were fumbled because of the way he handled the covid response. he was telling us to inject bleach instead of doing his job and the result was black businesses shuttered. the only thing that went up was the unemployment rate and the uninsured rate, so we are happy to wage this campaign on that front. put that against the president's record of accomplishment for black

america. record low black unemployment in the first term. wealth growing by 60% since before the pandemic. the fastest rate of growth in a generation. historic investment in hbcus. that is a choice that will be easy for black americans to make in this election and we are confident if we continue to communicate that contrast, that contrast of values, that we will win this election both in georgia and across the country, of course. >> michael, let's look at another key state. in a recent interview the chair of the reelection campaign said, quote, what is happening in north carolina, the extreme laws moving through this date legislature, the restrictive abortion law that is worse than most other places in the country, beyond extreme candidate running for governor and mark robinson. if you put all of those pieces together, we really see that the state is in play. so, michael, north carolina will begin to mail absentee

ballots starting september 6, so this might be the only debate north carolina voters see. what would it take to flip north carolina? >> yeah, north carolina is absolutely in play. if you want to look at any indicator, look at where the president is going after he leaves atlanta. directly to raleigh, north carolina, to organize and rally our grassroots campaign in the tar heel state. given everything we described, the demographic makeup, the extremism on display in the state legislature. obviously the extreme maga candidate they have in the state of north carolina. in many ways it is a microcosm of what we are looking at across the country, so we know if we engage in the state of north carolina that we will come out on top. it's true in georgia, drew north carolina. it is of course true in the blue wall states as well. we know we have the resources, the candidate, the message, the vision and the values to win

across the country. we have 300 field offices open across the country. we have over 1000 staff on the ground across the battleground states. it is true in north carolina and georgia and stands in contrast to the lack of operation that the trump team has at this date of the race. we know that we have two candidates who are widely known and the operations you have in place matter that much more. there is only one campaign at this date that is doing the work to reach the voters deciding the election. every dollar that people chip in is fueling the grassroots army that we are building in the battlegrounds across the country. we are foot on the gas coming off of the debate. we will be in north carolina and the battleground states from here. >> you mentioned earlier, blue wall states, so let's talk about one of them. i want you to listen to what a pennsylvania voter told nbc news today. >> i'm looking to see that joe biden does, you know,

accentuates what he has already done and to really say this is what we will do to improve that. >> what will joe biden, president biden, say about his plan to build upon his record in the next four years? >> listen, i think you will hear a lot of that on thursday night. he will talk about the historic record, everything from 15 million jobs created from the day he took office. 800,000 manufacturing jobs. the work to lower costs for the american people, capping the cost of insulin for seniors for example. he will also talk about the work we will accomplish in a second term. he will talk about continuing to lower costs for americans, expanding that insulin cap to all americans. expanding the out-of-pocket prescription drug cap in his second term by continuing to add more medications to medicare negotiation for example. continuing the work that we

will do to make sure we live in a country with a fair tax code so a billionaire never pays less taxes than a schoolteacher and a nurse. and if donald trump is elected none of that will happen. we will only have a more dark, dangerous, and chaotic vision for where he will take the country. he will get on the stage and talk about the fact that he thinks the extreme abortion bans he is responsible or are playing out brilliantly. he will talk about more corporate handouts and tax giveaways to the ultra-wealthy off the back of the middle class if he gains power and he will wage his campaign of retribution from the debate stage, continuing to do attacks on democracy. that is the contrast people see on the debate stage and through the duration of this campaign moving forward. >> michael, trump often uses the phrases, by biden migrant crime. he will likely use that phrase on thursday. the question is, how will the

president respond? >> listen, donald trump, there is no tragedy that donald trump won't tried to exploit for his personal gain. every last one of these is a tragedy. we understand that, but we won't let donald trump misconstrue the facts. the fact is that crime went up under donald trump's presidency. crime is down under joe biden's presidency. donald trump doesn't care about crime. he doesn't care about border security. i think that is evident by the fact he blew up the border security deal when we had a deal in the senate. the president is actually trying to bring people together to fix our problems. that is true of border security. that's true of every challenge the american people face. that is a fundamental contrast the american people will see on the debate stage thursday night. >> one more question for you, michael. donald trump will try to exploit divisions over the war in gaza. how will president biden put the focus back on what trump's

policies will mean for palestinians? >> i think donald trump makes it very clear that he would not make life that are for palestinians or anybody for that matter. i think the president will do is make sure the american people understand that he does not view issues of security through the lens of politics. he views them as the commander- in-chief. that is what he has been doing in the middle east, that is why the american people elected him in the first place and why they will reelect him in november. he is doing his job and does not view these issues through the lens of what is best for himself. that is what donald trump does and it stands in stark contrast to the president the american people elected. >> michael, i lied. this is the last question. what will success look like thursday night? >> listen, i think success is the american people having a clear understanding of the choice in this election, because that is what they will see when these candidates take the stage. they will walk away seeing a

president and joe biden who was fighting relentlessly for the american people to get things done and across from that they will see donald trump, increasingly unhinged and running a campaign now as a convicted felon, convicted because he was willing to do and say anything to gain and hold onto power and is now promising revenge and retribution if he regains power. that is what the american people are going to walk away from after they watch the debate on thursday night. >> michael tyler, communications director for the biden/harris campaign, thank you. as always, for coming to the last word. >> ask for having me. coming up, the choice voters have in this year's presidential election. a sitting president who worked tirelessly to end gun violence or a convicted felon who has proudly done nothing. plus, a big victory today against alex jones who, never forget, was mainstreamed by donald trump. that is next.

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for 25 years, the now bankrupt businessman alex jones has used his notorious website, and for wars, to make millions by spewing right wing propaganda, fake news and conspiracy theories including lies that president obama and hillary clinton were the devil and, quote, smelled like sulfur and conspiracy theories like pizza gait and that the u.s. government had a hand in 9/11. and in an obscure corner of the

internet, if not for this. >> i'm so excited and he joins us from trump tower in new york city. he is the leading 2016 republican presidential contender. donald trump again joins us and i have so many westerns, but first off, donald, thank you for joining us. >> thank you, alex. great to be with you. >> trumpeted that well alex jones was lying about sandy hook. now the platform will be shut down. his personal assets have already been liquidated and now a u.s. bankruptcy court trustee says he intends to wind down operations of the parent company of infowars and liquidate his inventory. the business is being liquidated because alex jones owes the families of the sandy hook shooting nearly $1.5 billion because of the lies he told. lies that the murder of 20

first-graders and six educators by a gunman's ar-15 never happened. lies that led to the families of the victims being harassed and threatened. this is some justice for the families who wanted to see the media platform that spread this poison shuddered. there is another victory in the fight against gun violence today. in a landmark announcement surgeon general dr. vivek murthy declared gun violence a public health crisis in america. >> upset with parents who lost a child to firearm violence. i've listened to their stories and felt their pain as they described their holes in their hearts. as a father i know a parent's worst nightmare is to lose a child. if you like you can't protect a child from harm. firearms violence is a public health crisis. our failure to address it is a moral crisis. to protect the health and well- being of americans, especially

our children, we must now act with the clarity, courage, and urgency that this moment demands. >> guns are the leading cause of death for children and adolescents in u.s. ages 1 to 19, more than car accidents and drug overdoses combined. and ahead of the november election this is the choice. president biden and and administration working to end gun violence or former president trump, who proudly said he did nothing to restrict guns. earlier this month at a rally to end gun violence, vice president harris made this clear. >> whereas president biden and i stood up to the nra and the gun lobby, donald trump bowed down. after the horrors of el paso and dayton, the former president said he would take action and then he folded.

he failed to stand up to the gun lobby. >> joining us now, democratic congressman maxwell frost of florida. he is a member of the house oversight committee and a national advisory board member for the biden/harris campaign. welcome back to the last word. the surgeon general calls the gun epidemic, quote, a moral crisis and polling shows nearly six in 10 u.s. adults say that they worry sometimes, almost every day or every day about a loved one being a victim of firearm violence. that is a solid majority for an issue and the contrast could not be clearer between standing up and bowing down to the nra. >> of course the contrast could not be any clearer and 60% of americans say they worry about themselves or a family member dying due to firearms and even more, 90% of americans want

things like universal background checks and want action. an even larger percent of americans want something done. on the one hand you had president joe biden who signed the law. today is the two-year anniversary of it and i encourage people. go online. look at what the white house put out. they put out a progress report on how this law has saved lives. gun violence, homicides around the entire country has gone down. there is so much more work to do. that is on one hand. on the other hand you have donald trump who when asked about mass shootings that get over it. that is his response to the families of parkland, the families of uvalde, the families of children who were gunned down every day across this country. it over it. that is unacceptable. >> the surgeon general's advisory notes that black americans endure the highest rates of homicide, while suicide rates are highest among veterans, older white individuals and younger american indian or alaska

native people. as a national advisory board member for the campaign, how is the biden campaign prioritizing these groups when it comes to reducing violence? >> in a very large way the campaign is prioritizing in the way we communicate with voters. where we go and communicate with voters. on the other side it is the action the president has taken. the bipartisan saver communities act has a record amount of money going to what is called violence prevention. this is giving money to community groups that look at identifying who is more likely to shoot someone and who is more likely to be shot and funding these programs helps us into the violence before it happens. a lot of people, especially in congress, talk about how to react to gun violence. i want to be part of the conversation about how to make sure people don't buy in the first place and i want to impress how big of a deal this is. today the surgeon general of the united states declared gun violence as a public health

crisis, an emergency. this opens up a lot for us in terms of the politics of this on the hill and hopefully will allow us to get more done. similar announcements and reports were put out by the surgeon general before action was taken on hiv-aids. before action was taken on smoking and big-ticket health issues, so i think this is a turning point in the gun violence prevention movement and of course thanks to the biden harris administration. >> a time magazine op ed had the headline, guns are not just a public health problem, where he says, and i am quoting, gun laws by themselves will have little effect on changing the contours of the american gun debate if they don't go hand-in- hand with material investments that take seriously people's safety concerns and reward community cohesion over armed tribalism. gun laws have the greatest effective joined with

investments in lived environment. fixing streetlights, creating parks and green spaces, jobs programs and rebuilding civic infrastructure, public safety and community resiliency can reduce gun crime at rates that supersede those produced by gun laws alone. it is a twofold strategy, but congressman, how do we get the investment from elected officials? >> yeah and i am glad you brought that up. i always tell people there are three different ways we have to do at the same time. one, gun regulation to make sure guns don't get in the wrong hands. two, ensuring we invest in community violence intervention, that way community groups have the resources to break the cycle of violence. number three, creating a country where people don't feel the need to use a gun to solve their problems in the first place. so if you want to be a gun violence person you also have to be a healthcare person, jobs person, poverty person,

infrastructure person. oh wait, these are all big hills president biden signed into law over the past few years and that is what we need to look at. it is not just gun legislation, even though it is important. i agree with what the article said. it is the totality of how we create an environment and society where people don't need to turn to violence to feed the kids and feed their families and that is why our agenda, the democratic agenda, is when the gas will make sure guns don't get in the wrong hands, but will also make sure that you have a good paying union job. you have what you need in terms of infrastructure to make sure you can live the life you want to live. all of these issues are connected and it is part of what gives me so much hope for the future of this country, especially young voters. you ask them what they think about and they will not tell you one thing, they will tell you several things because they see how all of these issues are connected and how we will end gun violence. >> also he believes the national gun debate is rooted

in political identity and many in this country view guns not as a health risk, but as a form of protection. so how do we change this divide to reduce gun violence? >> to what i was just saying, people need to feel safe. look, i have had these very difficult conversations, especially during the black lives matter uprising. to be honest when i was on the streets there were several of my organizers i would be working with who said they would get a gun in a few days, because i was threatened by white supremacists, because i am scared for my life. the fact of the matter is there real safety concerns for many people, black folks, poor people, working people, indigenous folks across the country who have a fear. and want to arm themselves. to be clear this agenda is not trying to disarm every american. what we are fighting for is responsible, commonsense policy, coupled with preventative measures so we don't even get

to a point where a gun is fired in the first place. but making sure that we expand public safety is important. for too long when we think about public safety the only thing we think about is law enforcement, which plays a big role, but we also need to ensure the community is centered in the conversation of public safety and again, community violence intervention programs are evidence-based and if you look at the report from the surgeon general, he uses data and facts to show how if we put more money in these community- based programs, we can really help end gun violence and also help our communities feel safer, because that is a real concern and we've got to address it. >> congressman maxwell frost of florida, thank you as always for coming to the last word. >> thanks for having me on. coming up, convicted felon donald trump's gag order has been partially lifted by judge merchan ahead of the july 11 sentencing, just in time for the first presidential debate.

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complain about the witnesses that testified against him at trial and the jury that found him guilty of 34 felony counts of falsifying business records to hide hush money payments in an attempt to influence the 2016 election. but he is still gagged from attacking the prosecution team, courtroom staff and their families until his sentencing on july 11. donald trump's federal criminal trial in washington, d.c. is on hold while we wait for a decision from the supreme court, which could come in the next three days, on whether trump has immunity from prosecution for trying to overturn the 2020 election. and today in florida the federal judge donald trump appointed, aileen cannon, finished her third day of hearings without any rulings, further delaying donald trump's criminal trial on illegal retention of classified documents. jack smith sat in the courtroom as judge cannon considered a defense motion to exclude

evidence, claiming the search warrant was invalid. but judge cannon seemed inclined to reject the argument, telling donald trump's attorney that the search warrant appeared to be detailed enough to survive the challenge. saying, quote, it seems like it is based on the case law that has been submitted. joining us now, adam klasfeld, who was in the courtroom in florida today. he is a fellow at just security. also with us, joyce vance, former u.s. attorney and former chief of the appellate division in the 11th circuit. she is a professor at the university of alabama school of law and cohost of the sisters- in-law podcast. thank you both very much for coming back to the last word. adam, break down what happened in court for us. >> that quote is the key quote. very often in these arguments and pretrial hearings it is hard to tell one way or the

other where a judge is leaning. a quote like that pretty much says it all and i will give you a little bit of background. she had said moments before that that trumps attorney had brought a particularity challenge, meaning he challenged the level of detail in the warrant and she said it seems like it does have enough detail, based on the case law that has been submitted. we don't want to undercut this moment because for nearly two years now trump has complained about the fairness of the mar-a- lago raid and here he is before a court room that is known to give him a very differential venue to consider these matters. they brought their best case law and prosecutors brought their best case law and it seems just based on what you read and just the general tenor of the arguments this morning, that the prosecution will have succeeded in defeating this challenge to suppress the

evidence. now that was one half of the hearing today. there was a second-half that the press was not privy to. a sealed hearing to discuss attorney-client privilege issues and that goes to notes from trumps former attorney that were obtained by prosecutors by use of the crime fraud exception. they had obtained, through the crime fraud exception, access to these note from the d.c. grand jury. trump is challenging that. now what happened during that hearing? did trumps attorneys make any headway during that? we don't know and we won't know until judge cannon issues a public ruling. >> so joyce, abc news reports trump expressed concern that returning classified documents after a may, 2022 subpoena could result in criminal charges. i am reading, quote, he raised the question as to if we gave them additional documents now,

with a, with a, the department of justice, come back and say well, why did you withhold them and try to use that as a basis for criminal liability or to make him look bad in the press, according to corcoran's notes about what trump asked his attorneys. joyce, what you make of this? >> so jonathan, this is about the first hearing that adam was talking about. the sealed hearing about whether or not judge cannon let the prosecution use trump lawyer evan corcoran's note at trial and the argument that the government makes his shirt, normally this is privileged information protected by attorney-client privilege. we are not even entitled to see it in the usual case, but here there is a crime fraud exception. trump was trying to enlist his attorney to join him in a criminal conspiracy to obstruct the investigation, so we are entitled to have this evidence.

this abc reporting is dynamite evidence that that was the case. it enhances what is already a strong portfolio of evidence in the government's hands. the original ruling that lets them use this evidence was made by a different judge in the district of columbia. so what judge cannon is doing in effect is seeing whether or not she agrees with that judge and given the volume of evidence here, it would be very surprising, certainly a ruling that the special counsel would want to appeal if she disagreed. >> adam, talk to us about what it was right like being in the room? any notable interactions or observations? >> well, there were no interactions with most people. jack smith is very stoic, very solid individual. he is seated behind the prosecution table, so most of us seated in the gallery which is essentially two rows of seating in a very small courtroom in fort pierce are basically seeing the back of

his head. but he does not let on very much. he keeps a poker face and judge cannon, too, can be very soft- spoken. she can be very polite to the other side's, until she is frustrated and then she puts everything on her sleeve and she got frustrated at the prosecution multiple times, both yesterday in the moment when she told him that she did not appreciate his tone and there was a moment at the end of the hearing today when there was another tense moment. frustrated at trumps lawyers for impugning the fbi during the search and said that the defense was trying to hijack the hearing with matters that don't belong. that weren't even part of their case. judge cannon shut it down at that moment and said she was trying to wrap up the hearing

and no one is hijacking anything. so you know when you have run afoul of judge cannon and she has shown more flashes of anger of course at the prosecution then the defense. >> okay, so adam has frozen, so we will take that as an opportunity. and he is back and he is gone again. adam klasfeld, joyce vance, thank you both very much for coming back to the last word. sorry about the technical difficulties. coming up, our next guest says wall street wants nothing to do with another trump term. that is next. all in one. to those with migraine, i see you. for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment of episodic migraine in adults. don't take if allergic to nurtec odt. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain.

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sleep apnea innovation. learn more and view important safety information at inspiresleep.com. donald trump's entire identity is tied up in perpetuating the myth that the world greatest is this man. but it's just that, a myth. after relying on money from his daddy and years of alleged tax fraud, trump has left a trail behind him littered with litigation and bankruptcies. what about when he was president? take this headline just before trump left office. donald trump built a national debt sobek -- so big even before the pandemic that away down the economy for years. our next guest, professor jeffrey seinfeld, chairman and president of the yell leadership institute said wall

street has taken note and what's nothing to do with another trump term. >> we are looking at this for the last four months, we've been pointing out that there are no fortune 500 ceos who are supporting former president trump, and that is a historic break going back to, you know, william howard taft, and ronald reagan and the bushes and everything. it's been anywhere from 40 to 60%, public and financial support. it's zero now, and it was different in 2016. >> today, axios piled on with more bad news for trump, reporting, 16 nobel prize- winning economist are warning, former president trump's plans would be reigniting inflation and cause lasting harm to the global economy if he wins in november. we all agree that joe biden's

economic agenda is vastly superior to donald trump. the 16 economist write in a letter, first obtained by axios. joining us now is jeffrey seinfeld, he is also a cnbc contributor. in an op-ed you wrote, mr. trump and his team are doubling down on some of his most antibusiness instincts. these trump positions have more in common with karl marx then adam smith. so professor, what are the trump policies that the ceos are afraid of? >> the trump policy they don't like, some of the more style, some are substance. in short, most ceos are not xena phobic, they initiate -- appreciate that, they know half of fortune 500 companies are either created by immigrants or

first-generation descendents that have come to this country, or maybe a quarter of tech startups that are immigrants and they celebrate that, so they are not xena phobic, they are also not protectionist, they believe and selective use of some tariffs of this unfair competition the trump once off the board, you know, around the world, all tariffs, all the time, that would be highly inflationary. they hate that and they are also not isolationist, they look at a dangerous country like putin's russia, and the destruction, the cruelty, the human rights violations in the destabilization, they don't support that, so those are some things but they also believe in the rule of law instead of the law of rulers and that frames it more than anything. there are particular policies we could talk about but it's the overall philosophy, that they don't stand behind, and it's shocking because they are

65 to 70% republican. >> professor, we have less than a minute left but what is the one economic question you would like president biden and donald trump to be asked at the debate on thursday? >> to acknowledge that in fact, this is the first time in history, we have seen despite with all the economist, left right and center say, there such low unemployment that we have not seen that since bonanza with the number 1 show on tv at 3.8%, and have such falling inflation, it has fallen from 70% to 2.4%, that's remarkable. eggs are high because of an evian flu. inflation is coming down and we have incredible growth, this is a success story instead of apologizing for success, some of the biden cabinet people are too humble. they should be celebrating their success. this is great for pensioners, the average working person and

in 40 years, jonathan, we haven't seen the average waves, finally outpace inflation for the average worker. >> on that note, we will leave it there. professor, thank you for coming to the last word. and we will be right back. righ. i s to help you feel better. six digestive symptoms. the power of nature. iberogast. get rid of bugs as soon as you see them with zevo sprays. zevo uses essential oils to eliminate up to 20 household insects, plus it's safe for use around people and pets— - anywhere — anytime. - gotcha. zevo. people-friendly. bug-deadly. ♪ limu emu... ♪ and doug. (bell ringing) limu, someone needs to customize and save hundreds on car insurance with liberty mutual. let's fly! (inaudible sounds) chief! doug. (inaudible sounds) ooooo ah. (elevator doors opening) (inaudible sounds) i thought you were right behind me. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, ♪

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one programming know before we go, we are just two days away from the first presidential debate between president joe biden and donald trump. on thursday, rachel maddow and the team lead special coverage in the debate hosted by cnn. watch