air quotes, luxury to be apathetic. i think it is hugely important for audiences to experience this dialogue between two intelligent women. i think the points of view and just perspective from like experience, regardless of how much time it has been because age, obviously, is a factor but the experiences that a has n does not have. obviously, the life experience n has, a does not have. i think they rely on each other and right now, especially as a society, we could use that . that does it for us this hour. we will back here tomorrow to kick off a brand-new week of "morning joe". until then, enjoy the rest of your sunday. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ and is sunday, july 7. i am

alicia menendez with michael steele and symone sanders- townsend. team button tries to turn the pages democrats meet in the state of the arrays. you can run but you cannot hide. president biden calls out donald trump's attempts to distance himself from project 2025. the nato summit comes to washington. the secretary general, preview what's ahead in world politics. grab your coffee, settle and and welcome to the weekend. president biden has a message for those who think you should drop out of the race., quote, they're wrong and we have to keep going. this morning, the president will speak at a church in philadelphia for meeting with union members in harrisburg. the battleground comes is five

house democrats have called for him to step aside after last week's reiki debate performance. leader hakeem jeffries called a virtual meeting of ranking members to discuss the raise. you've got republicans who are in lockstep behind the candidate despite his conviction on 34 felony counts and a court ruling he was liable for sexual assault. a judgment of fraud against his company and upcoming criminal trial for trying to overturn an election and repeated incoherent displays at campaign rallies. joining us to discuss it is an but some bc political analyst. she served as communications director in the obama white house and on hillary clinton's presidential campaign and she's cohost of how to win 2024 podcast. stuart stevens is here, mitt romney strategist for the 2012 campaign and the senior adviser at the camp -- blinken project. let's get into it. >> it's get into it and let's stop the stage with the idea that i is pushing forward with

his campaign. he is at that point, i get the sense he's a little fed up with the noise. they have a new ad out this morning, ready to fight. let's take a quick listen at how they're coming at this. >> let me ask you, do you think i'm too old to restore roe v. wade, think i'm too old to ban assault weapons? too old to be donald trump? >> no! >> this is about our freedom. our democracy. the very soul of america. are you prepared to fight for that? i know i am and i will. >> that guy can't do the job? i mean, you tell me what democrats are saying about him that the rest of us have watched over the last three years. we know joe biden is old. i don't know why the political class and media have suddenly

come upon that idea. given his track record in this administration, what is it now that he has to do to convince democrats that he can do the job ? is he past the point of doing that? >> i want to know, michael is fed up. he is fed up and him and they have been having this conversation for the last 20 minutes. this is for america right now. >> we are on the steam page but will jennifer tell us, what joe biden has to do to convince democrats to support him. >> of had a good conversation with you and with paul wall is about republicans get behind their leader and that is it. particularly, as we were discussing, two months out from people starting to vote because they start to vote in

september. they seem bonkers to people like you who have done a good job and winning campaigns on the republican side. democrats are little different, built a little different, and there's a question going on whether he is up to be the guy to take trump on. with every passing day, it becomes more likely that he is the guy just because of every passing day it gets harder to get someone out. that was great and that add could rile people to his side, but, we have a different kind of bar than republicans. to truly reassure people, there are polls that are great for him and polls that are not great for him. it has only been a week since the debate. it's only been a week and we need more time to know how the public feels about this. in the meantime, he has to do a

good job of being on the stump and during press conferences and interviews people to see he's up for the fight. >> you had advice for democrats. you write, run a biden's record and don't run from one bed to be. show a little swagger not timidity. forget this by nonsense and seize the day. now is the worst time to flinch. your country needs flinch. you can crushed donald trump but only a few fight. we have been joking that being able to criticize democrats is bringing back warm memories of his former life and what he has missed. i do want -- given the developments of the past 24 hours where you have a few more members of the house democratic caucus coming forward and saying they think the president should drop out of this race. the factor of senator warner trying to convene senate democrats. for home does have light fog? institutionally? does of fall to jeffries?

does of fall to chuck schumer? who is it now who will fight that inside fight? >> well, i know less about -- the democratic party than hip- hop. >> this is not the show. you are fine. >> the presumption, underlying presumption is there is a better alternative. i don't understand this. i do not understand the logic of saying we are in a difficult situation so the way to get out of it is to do something that's never been done before. how will this work? i don't think these polls are at all frightening to democrats or to those of us who support

the president in order to defeat donald trump. michael and i remember when george bush at this point was 18 points behind. >> 18. >> 1988. how many people at this point knew who willie horton was? campaigns change. you have this honking, giant anchor around donald trump called project 2025. the reason they don't talk about it is that people who want to politicize the military is pretty small. the people who want to end the civil service is pretty small. that people that want to criminalize abortion on all levels is pretty small. that is the trump agenda. the republican party doesn't have any other agenda. i don't really see why it's complicated. get about the business of running against the other guy rather than this sort of dithering do we have the perfect candidate? no, you don't.

i never had the perfect candidate except when michael ran for lieutenant governor. it is a time to come together and stop this. >> you know, i mean, i agree. i do. i want to be clear. >> do you, symone? >> i do. i agree. people are like, i don't understand the democrats and why they are fretting? first of all, this is what democrats do. this is what they do. i have never in my short political life, when i was a little baby political strategist, i have never experienced anything whether working on state legislative races, mayoral races, presidential, where they were not summer, some democrats saying i don't really know?

we need to find something. that is what democrats do. one could argue maybe democrats need to buck up a little bit. i do think -- if after the debate on thursday, all the democrats said, yeah, it was great, we would've been sitting here like, okay, we need to speak reality into the situation because it was neck great. the vocal pushback, the vocal pushback initially, made the biden campaign say it made the president say all right, let me show them better than i can tell them. from saturday saying, i understand you can't turn on the television get on the internet addressing some pendant talking how i need to drop out of the race. they are wrong. forget the pundits. they wouldn't be coming after the abundance if it weren't the response.

some of the pushback is well -- from democrats is well-placed. the campaign did probably need a little kick. >> there is a difference between democrats saying, that was a lousy debate from that to you've got to go. >> that is a stretch. >> this is the part we have a problem with. >> can i lay out the alternative? am i supposed to look at you? i'm citibank with the two of you and i went to look at you. let me lay out the alternative to what you said. i'm still in the middle of that song? when you're in the middle? you are in the middle, we are in the middle of it. i think the alternative to what you said is, the reason why dad

you and stuart have spoken out of been cash against from. if democrats back there guy blindly, what are we propping up? if the president of the united states is not to run up against her because it's too taxing to do his job and that, and we are getting behind him and saying it's all fine, isn't that going to play into cynicism and people thinking the system is all rigged? >> when did you realize that? was it from that debate or did you realize that 18 months ago or did you realize that when you nominated a 77-year-old man that in four years would not be 73. >> laughing mac >> at what point did they understand they were nominating someone who was close to octogenarian age? >> when he did not do great at the debate stage. until that moment, it was always a risk.

you measure the risk and until that moment it seemed he was the best bet given his performance at the state of the union. that guy, that was march, that guy can fight through november. a couple months later so something different that made people, is he the right person? in terms of something -- the thing that got me and mike got in my head is saying three months out, two months when people start voting and it's wild and crazy. when susan glassman wrote, is this how democracy does with two old guys arguing about golf on a debate stage? you are like -- if that's what this moment is about and we can do something to change it and meet the moment and do something that's never been done because nothing is ever been done until it happens. >> it's a false equivalency

between trump and biden has got to stop. >> i want to be clear. i worked for joe biden last time. that man is ready to go. i was not one of the people that was like, maybe we need to change course. i think the onslaught of people, people who know joe biden who know him and coming up beating like, he might need to go. i think it's a little -- i don't know. it's slightly distasteful because joe biden is someone who back in 2020 said he would never ask someone to get out of the race. it would be a personal decision. now you have people ready to push the president on out. he is like, i an went. what do you want to do? stuart, speak for the people. >> i think the overarching danger and greatest problem donald trump is that he doesn't support democracy which is to

say he doesn't represent the will of the voters. the party had a primary. anybody could have entered the primary. millions of millions and millions of people voted for joe biden. now, a group of people will say, okay, but we don't like that choice so we will change. for the life of me, i don't understand the logic that the way to beat one autocrat is through a process that's more autocratic than democratic. it does not make sense. joe biden had a bad debate. i think in december 2020, it was a fair question to ask, joe biden up to being president? you could have asked it of anybody before they took office in january. that question has been answered, hasn't it? the most successful first term president since world war ii. you can't credibly argue that

joe biden is not qualified to be the president now because he is president, and it is -- then you're back to, will he always be that way? to me, and now you are into the theological questions. it has nothing to do with who you should vote for in november. this idea, step back from it, i think we can agree he has been a successful president. we all know that no party has held onto the white house since 1988. we know that no president has ever not been reelected with unemployment numbers and economic records like this. and the weight of all that evidence, we will say, but look? there were 20 minutes and that debate that really sucked. we have got to throw this other evidence we have out, and go to some unknown conclusion and the single greatest indicator of

the incumbent party happen to bush and 92 and have been to carter with kennedy. you need a unified party to defeat what's happening now. on the other side. look, i couldn't agree more that is good not to blindly follow someone. it is good to ask questions. i don't think it's productive to assume that some great unknown experiment is the right way to go at this point when you have someone who has proven they can be extraordinarily good president. >> well, stuart , agree. okay. you know what? we have to continue to have the conversation. can you stay. we want to discuss the moment that vice president kamala harris finds herself in ski

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understand what we all know

. and 122 days, we each have the power to decide what kind of country we want to live in. understand what we know. when there has been a full an intentional attack against hard- fought, hard won freedoms and rights. >> that was vice president kamala harris underlying the stakes for our democracy at the festival in new orleans. the scrutiny on the top of the ticket has put a fresh spotlight on the vp and, of course, made her a target for republicans. back with us, jennifer palmieri and stuart stevens. i would say democrats made her a target before republicans did. made our work easier over the first three years of her term. what say you, jennifer? how has this vice president positioned in light of the first part of our conversation? >> one thing i want to say,

public service announcement for people who want to have kamala harris's back. when the new york post had a terrible super racist column yesterday and some people retweeted the column and said this is racist. that is not helpful. that is what they hope you will do. they hope you will take the content and retreat it so it spreads. you can say, here is the thing, she -- trump is coming after her. whether she is -- continues to be in the vice presidential slot or the nominee, the president will be close to 82 on election day so she's a big part of the campaign. she is tough enough. that doesn't bother her. it is bothersome that that misogynistic content is out there. it's bad for young girls to see

that. you know what it will do? fire up a lot of women as well. you are not helping her when you share that stuff. call it out for what it is but everybody needs to know she's tough enough to handle this. it's not going to stop her. >> she's tough enough in tough enough to prosecute the case against donald trump. take a listen to what she had to say about the immunity decision at the festival in new orleans. >> the press has not been covering it as much as they should in proportion to what just happened. when the united states supreme court is essentially told this individual who had been convicted of 34 felonies that he will be immune from essentially the activity he has told us he is prepared to engage in if he gets back into the white house. >> someone will need to

prosecute the case against donald trump in the run-up to november and it seems its political malfeasance to not make that a centerpiece of the vice president on the trail. >> i agree. there is this thing out there that vice president harris is not a good politician. it's a head scratcher to me. the and, da, it's never an easy thing to do. she did a good job. she then got elected attorney general against the golden boy of politics. a guy who was a very popular republican da in l.a. county. democratic stronghold. she got elected to the u.s. senate and he -- she is vice president of the united states. if she was good helper which you have gone? the most successful female

politician in american history may be next to hillary clinton. she is extraordinarily capable. i would say absolutely, run as a ticket and team. put her out there. look at these clips at her in hearings when she was a senator . she was absolutely devastating , and she did it without anger or bitterness with a calm this. she completely destroyed mike pence. i don't know who he will pick as his vice president, probably he doesn't know. i will bet on harris doing good in that debate. it's hard to be incumbent president. the last time one lost he wasn't in the federal funding system before donald trump. this ticket defeated donald trump. for the life of me, -- the business of helping them defeat donald trump again.

>> to your point if she were good politician, how much farther she would've gone? it is what jen is talking about a what every woman knows, every woman of color. you prove it and they ask you to prove it again. stuart stevens, thank you so much. judge cannon shows she can work fast when she wants to. for saturday rolling a trubisky new request in the classified documents case. that is next on the weekend.

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democrats are calling for the supreme court to be expanded. to right the wrongs of the conservative majority. senator tina smith said expansion as a remedy for this, quote, broken court. joining us, msnbc political analysts and princeton professor. >> professor, we are going from one extreme to another this morning. i feel we find ourselves in a crossroads right here. i believe that 10, 20 years from now people will look that at what this supreme court, this roberts court has done, and it will be a damning indictment on our democracy. is that too lofty? is that hyperbole? >> i don't think so. i think it's helpful. it is great to be on the weekend. it presupposes that we will

survive at all. i think it's important to understand we are not simply at a crossroads. we are standing on a precipice. a democracy may not survive. that part of has to do with the course. the roberts court has made clear its objective, and that is it will undermine the achievements of the warren court. certain responsibilities that are made in so many ways an imperial court and it revealed for some republicans, the law applies to us people like me and you, and it bends for them. it is important to understand that. it's also important to understand the court's role in this undercurrent of undemocratic practices in the united states. think of their role in terms of undermining medical reconstruction and the court's role and solidifies saying slavery in our democracy.

this isn't that unusual in terms of the institution. i think you are right, it's not hyperbole. it might not be this way if we don't survive at all. >> it's interesting on a number of fronts of folks are consuming what is happening to them, and how their rights have been whittled away and dissipated the last several years. how the states have leveled up their game and that's been reinforced by the supreme court. the corruption at the supreme court, seemingly people like on the court, we will deal with it. in congress, we can't deal with -- we can do anything. you have this op-ed by ross rosenfeld in which he said expand the supreme court now. here's a secret for the democrats. if you want to inspire people

try standing for something. if you want to avoid not just trump but the next trump, dress the constitutional inadequacies that created the crisis in the first place like the electoral college. the supreme court. a dirty secret. as much as you heard republicans screaming against the expansion of the court from folks like aoc and others, part of this 2025 project, the back end is donald trump will expand the court to get a super majority in a second term. two justices will come off and he will book 2 40 year old sam and put a plate to expand the court by four to make it a 10-3 court. what should we be concerned about that seemingly we are missing in this scenario? that is the end play.

solidifying and locking in this court the way it is now for the future. >> i think we need to understand who our opponents are. they aren't just regular republican party. the party that you lead for so many years and you were part of. they are fundamentally committed to undermining democratic principles. they are going to do that by any means necessary. as we talk about expanding the court, we need to understand what that opens up. it hasn't been expanded since 1869 and that was a political gift to ulysses grant. the court was shrunken 1866 in response to andrew johnson and what he was trying to do, two radical reconstruction, undermining the efforts to bring the former slaves into the body politic. we understand what happens when politics intrudes. part of what we need to talk about, simply expanding the

court but we need to talk about term limits. talking about age limits. talking about impeachment. these folks who have violated ethics over and over. we need to talk about regulatory capture. what does it mean for corporate interest to capture the supreme court and the supreme court is delivering for those interests. understand who the opponents are and stop acting like feckless democrats. feckless people who don't have commitments, and start fighting at the same level of intensity for the principles that these people are fighting for the principles they hold. that is power that they hold. >> to your point, you had alexandria ocasio-cortez from new york posting, the supreme court has become consumed by a corruption crisis beyond its control. today's ruling represents an assault on american democracy.

it is up to congress to defend our nation from this authoritarian capture. antenna filing articles of impeachment -- some of what you are talking about. you can see the machinations of and it's about holding them accountable. it's also by signaling to the american people that are some semblance of checks and balances in play. >> i hope people don't read what aoc is trying to do as an example of the far left responding to the far right. we need people in the democratic party, and outside the democratic party, to understand this is not about left and right but democratic principles. this is about the future of our democracy. the court, the court has been captured. we know what they have done. we know with the federalist society has done. michael, you know this intimately, from the inside. you know the long gain consumer sales have been playing and that was been about undermining the regime that came out of the

1960s black revolution, the 1960s social revolution where we are relitigating voting rights. relitigating women's rights. lgbtq rights. it seems to me often times aoc's moves are often read as an example of the extremities of our politics when it is something that's very much needed in this moment, and the so-called centrist need to get on board, it seems to me. >> relitigating establish rights as a way to block progress. least take with us. we need to talk about changes republicans made of either crafting their party platform behind closed doors. choose advil liqui-gels for faster, stronger and longer-lasting relief than tylenol rapid release gels because advil targets pain at the source of inflammation. so for faster pain relief, advil the pain away.

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(♪♪) when life spells heartburn... how do you spell relief? r-o-l-a-i-d-s rolaids' dual-active formula begins to neutralize acid on contact. r-o-l-a-i-d-s spells relief. the leaders at donald trump's republican committee took an extraordinary step to cover the radical agenda. semaphore reports they will break from decades of precedent and practice platform behind closed doors. usually their broadcast on c- span but not this year. rnc committeeman from tennessee put it like this, the lack of transparency is unwelcome. when people operate behind closed doors you have to wonder what the outcome is going to be. that's the point of being behind closed doors, right? the democratic party was stream

as platform negotiations online. eddie glaude is back with his. >> it's as though that dictator on day one will look like. they won't be invited to sit down with the dictatorial info. set the stage for how unusual this actually is. >> it is incredibly unusual. i know if we did things like that when i was chairman, on top of the other i got, this would probably outsize most of it because the one thing the parties are very protective of is how they are perceived when they're doing things like this. they want it to be open. is a member from tennessee said, and i think i know who that is, i know that voice, it does not send the right signal

going into this convention. i think that's an important feature to this whole narrative that has emerged around the gop around being a dictator on day one. we will put those processes in place and we don't want you to see us do that. that's the take away at think a lot of people are going to have. a platform as a platform. no one will lose sleep over it, but at the end of the day the platform and its development is a statement of who you are, what you stand for, and how you will leak. what say you? >> some people might lose sleep if the platform says it's not for a federal ban on abortion. they're going to give it to the states. if you have a constituency within the gop that is your activist base that banks and the idea you will give them a federal ban and what you do is hide behind closed doors into naiad, we will see some

fireworks. you know republicans are disciplined in a lot of ways but not these maga folk. what we need to understand is there some folk that are die hard for the called . they are in for trump and some are using trump transactionally. to get the imperial presidency. they got it with the immunity decision. some of them are using trump to get deregulation. they got it with the chevron decision and others are using trump to get a ban on abortion. if he does not deliver, willie's activists show up? they think they have no other choice otherwise will come in. they do have a choice, they could stay home. >> the other thing i wanted to say to the initial question, one of the reasons why it's behind closed doors over the issue which is abortion. donald trump is backsliding off the position of the hard pro-

life members of the party. they don't want the fight to be public. that fight is starting to spill on the streets, and that's a big part where they don't. donald trump once a softer abortion plank as opposed to a total ban, et cetera, federal ban, et cetera. that's why it's behind the door. >> he has regularly talked, you have to go with your heart, but do what you need to do to get elected. the washington post is reporting there is a tumultuous split happening. there's escalating behind-the- scenes disagreement over the abortion language has become so tense and some social conservative leaders have issued public warnings of a coming split within the coalition. others have started to discuss and issued to issue a minority report. have never heard of a minority report to the platform at a

convention. it's not how it is done. ed martin, he is one of the individuals who is leading the republican party platform, crafting -- i think it's important that people hear what he said. he did this podcast, this pro- america report and said no abortion is ever performed to save the life of the mother. zero. he said in another episode, characterized stories of saving a life is planned parenthood propaganda. is at the protest after dobbs decision pushed a hoax that people care about abortion rights. it's like they are screaming it with a bullhorn and a billboard and people are still like, i don't know. >> there is this wonderful line and jim wallace 's book about what he calls the white gospel. he said there's some we have to persuade and there is some we have to defeat.

we need to understand the difference. ed martin is one of those folks we have to defeat. to my mind when i listen to his positions of what i read what he puts forward, it's a lack of decency. a lack of deep concern. let me be straight, he's not a decent dude. when he says what he believes, in the way he says it, and what it would mean for women and particularly for women and the most vulnerable women in this country, he has to be defeated. the people who support him have to be defeated as well. >> professor eddie glaude, thank you. we will continue the conversation and speak with senator alex padilla, member the judiciary committee. we will talk about countering the supreme court's conservative majority as well as everything happening on capitol hill. follow our show on social media, our handle everywhere, @theweekendmsnbc

you know, when i take the bike out like this, all my stresses just melt away. i hear that. this bad boy can fix anything. yep, tough day at work, nice cruise will sort you right out. when i'm riding, i'm not even thinking about my painful cavity. well, you shouldn't ignore that. and every time i get stressed about having to pay my bills, i just hop on the bike, man. oh, come on, man, you got to pay your bills. you don't have to worry about anything when you're protected by america's number-one motorcycle insurer. well, you definitely do. those things aren't related, so... ah, yee! oh, that is a vibrating pain. when we talk about the republican platform, what comes to mind for me is the reporting about a memo that the trim, they wanted to slash the platforms so there won't be too many details out there. that, that's what the entire campaign is based on so that joe biden goes on stage and

talks about how many infrastructure projects he is and he has to remember the numbers and trump is all vibes. it doesn't matter he's not on message with the policies because they don't exist on paper. >> there are no policies. >> except for project 2025, but he doesn't know about it. >> he thinks it's abysmal and he wishes them look. >> a love a guy who says i don't know something, i don't know what it is, but i wish you luck. how do you have an opinion on something you don't know anything about? >> let me hold that to myself. >> you touch on a couple of important aspects on this, alicia. the platform is a testimony to the country about what we are, what we believe, what we stand for. most especially the things we want to govern an. to your excellent point, when

it's all vibes and you want to wing it, you get the first four years of donald trump. hopefully, the only four years of donald trump. what the party finds itself, there's a reason why donald trump told them going into the 2020 election, we are not going to put out a platform. they figure now they have to just because the rules kind of require it. they will put out a peer minimalist approach to governing because it's going to be whatever donald trump feels on that particular day about the individuals around him and in front of him and how he wants to move the government. you are not going to put that on paper because it's a five thing. >> it's heart vibe and part heinous and coordinated policy. donald trump, when he does the rallies, he is all vibe and

they are dictatorial. they are dictator, strongman to be clear. they know what it is they would like to do. this -- i know donald trump does not percent organize, coordinator, but this is an organized campaign. what they will do, if in fact, he is elected in november, they have an organized 180 day plan. usually put out a 100 day plan. have worked during transition, as the president is putting together his cabinet, he has identified there 100 day plan. they put together a 100 day plan. they want to be really clear. they want to be a dictator on this until the american people. it is vibes, dictator vibes, and it's a very coordinated policy effort, is a heritage

foundation said, institutionalist trumpism. >> 179 days of follow. >> strong dictator vibes from the weakest link. >> stay with us. this another hour the weekend straight-ahead including alex padilla and eugene daniels and secretary-general john stoltenberg. to me, harlem is home. but home is also your body. i asked myself, why doesn't pilates exist in harlem? so i started my own studio. getting a brick and mortar in new york is not easy. chase ink has supported us from studio one to studio three. when you start small, you need some big help. and chase ink was that for me. earn up to 5% cash back on business essentials with the chase ink business cash card from chase for business. make more of what's yours. i have moderate to severe crohn's disease. now, there's skyrizi. ♪ things are looking up ♪

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