♪♪ ♪ ♪♪ ♪♪ it is good to be back with you on this second hour of "chris jansing reports." at this hour, high anxiety as high-level biden campaign staffers meet face to face with skeptical senate democrats. can that meeting which apparently just ended calm the fears about his candidacy or is the dam about to break for defections? plus, a republican-led committee going after white house aides accusing them of

covering up biden's health issues. the subpoenas they've now issued. jury deliberations are expected to begin today in the high-profile trial of senator bob menendez after his defense team argued that the corruption allegations against him are, quote, rotten to the core. and the surprisingly good new numbers for the battle against inflation. will it put pressure on the fed to finally cut interest rates? our nbc news reportes are following all of the latest developments and we start with the latest from capitol hill and the critical meeting between senate democrats and biden advisers that wrapped up moments ago. nbc's ali vitale is with us and what do we know about that meeting? anything yet? >> we are seeing the trickle of senators leave that meeting with the trio of top biden campaign aides sent to capitol hill to talk with senators and assuage their concerns effectively lay out a game plan and show hard data that could possibly get senators back onboard. there's been skittishness both

on the house and senate side of this building about the biden campaign and about president biden himself going forward. you've had people like senator michael bennett willing to say so far that he's been concerned that biden's drag on the ticket might not just cost them the white house, but could also cost them the senate and the house. i believe we have senator bennett talking about this meeting and the general stakes up here on capitol hill. watch. >> i don't want to pre-judge what they're going to say. we'll see. i think what's on everybody's mind is -- is -- is there a clear path to victory here, and can we honestly say that we're on a path to defeating donald trump and holding on to the senate and holding on to the house of representatives? >> obviously, that was bennett as he was going into the meeting and he has issued, chris, dire warnings about the loss, the trifecta loss as he's surmising it could be if biden remained at the top of the ticket.

bennett never called for biden to step down. only senator peter welch of vermont has done that, he even said he'd be in the meeting with biden campaign officials and there are senators who are facing tough re-election battles who were not present at that meeting including john test of montana. i know you and i are both looking at closely as well as senator sherrod brown of ohio and those are key marquee races that we've been looking at and looking closely at the senators that are playing defense in the home states on how they're going to contend with this current moment with the president and with the role that he's going to play in the party going forward. i do think, and as we heard senator hassen, as she was leaving the meeting after being briefed by these campaign officials, what she said is she still thinks that biden is the democrats' best chance to beat donald trump. certainly she's been consistent in having that opinion and there are several of her senate colleagues who agree, and at the

same time the griping continues and that's the problem. >> ali vitale, thank you for that. we also have breaking news on that front. what they're reporting is it involves the biden campaign and they are assessing the viability of a candidacy by the vice president. let me bring in monica alba. what can you tell us about how they're looking at kamala harris and why? >> nbc news is confirming this was first reported by "the new york times." i am told by sources familiar with this testing that is going on next week that this is being done in the context of how she would fare against the presumptive nominee and what we have seen donald trump do in the last couple of days which is to step up his attacks against her specifically given questions about whether joe biden will still be the democratic nominee in november. he insists that he will, but of course, we know as you were just discussing because of this pressure from other democrats

and lawmakers that there could be a change here if the president decides to step aside. so the biden campaign is doing this. i understand that this is being commissioned by the biden campaign's own analytics team and importantly, and what we should point out here and what a democratic operative told us is that essentially, this is something you would be doing if you're trying to give a message to president biden to sort of test how the vice president would do and whether she may fare better, worse or the same as he is doing in the current polling, but this would be a data point that you could maybe show to the president as he, in the weeks ahead, could potentially have difficult conversations about his candidacy. again, the biden campaign is saying that he is full steam ahead and that is what they're certainly insisting publicly, but i think this is a concession that there are larger conversations going on about if there would be a change at the top of the ticket and that the natural person as we've been

talking about, the mechanisms for how this would work would be vice president kamala harris. so that is the next sort of part of this story in terms of how she would do, and there has been some polling out there already where they've been trying to sort of test how she would do against donald trump, but obviously, the biden team for their own interests wants to have their own assessment and that is why they're going to be continuing with that polling. it sounds like at least this week we'll see the actual results of that, and according to a memo that we obtained today and the biden campaign and senior advisers are saying, yes, they're acknowledging there has been real movement since the disastrous debate performance two weeks ago, but they're insisting it doesn't amount to a sea change in the state of the race. so again, they're trying to argue that joe biden is still their candidate, still the nominee and still the person that they're going to go on this journey with, but it is notable

that they're zooming out and taking this larger picture should that change. >> monica alba with a lot of new information. thank you for that. senator bob menendez's future will soon be in the hands of 12 new york jurors in his corruption case. >> tom winter is with us. what more do we know, tom? >> we know federal prosecutors are expected to wrap up their rebuttal to what jurors have been hearing from defense attorneys not just for senator menendez, but for two other new jersey businessmen who have been charged alongside of him. all have pleaded not guilty in this case and now what the jury is being told is to basically focus on a couple of key things that the defense raised and why, in the words of prosecutors, it just can't be true. you and i talked over the last two months about the defense for menendez and it was nadine who knew about the cash and the gold bars and that the senator wasn't

involved in the quid pro quo and with the cash. to that extent, dan richenthal noted in his rebuttal that six tv bank envelopes that had fred davies who is one of those businessmen, the developer who has been charged alongside menendez, six td bank envelopes that contained crash had his fingerprints on it and it had men endes's fingerprints and it did not have nadine menendez's fingerprints on it. if menendez is not involved in the bribes how come his fingerprints are on some of these envelopes. that's some of the things that the prosecution is trying to attack. they raised the point that the senator in their words is basically flowing through sensitive information about the amount of diplomats that were at the egyptian embassy through his girlfriend at the time, nadine menendez and that information was being passed to the

egyptians, ultimately. very much going after the defenses that we've heard over the past several days. he's expected to -- i just jumped out of the courthouse five or ten minutes ago and he's expected to go with that rebuttal with maybe another hour, hour and a half and because there are three defendants, that will take a little bit longer. so of course, we expect that to go through it is end of the day. the jury will start deliberations this afternoon and certainly tomorrow morning remains something to be seen. a jury will soon decide the fate of new jersey's senior senator. >> tom winter, thank you. a positive new inflation report that could be just the point the fed was waiting for to approve an interest rate cut. nbc's christine romans is here to break things down, and the numbers are better than were projected, right? >> frankly, the lowest in three years. in may the inflation rate was 3.3%, and in june it was 3% and when you look at the trend which

is always so important, with all of these economic reports you can see this is the peak inflation about 9% and this is pretty steady progress here. 3% of the inflation rate and inside these numbers i see that you're paying less for today than you were in may. airfare down 5% in the month and gas prices, down 1% and a host of other different categories and you are paying less for today than you were at the beginning of the summer and that's real progress, right? because for so long inflation has been piling up every single month and adding to the overall cost of american families and this has been issue number one for families. i would say overall consumer prices are still 20 higher today than they were in february. so that's why you still see people say they feel lousy about the economy and in terms of the pain points, they are improving and the white house cheering these numbers and pointing out

they have more work to do on lowering prices and grocery inflation on average this year is pretty much flat. at least when you go to the grocery store you're not paying more. chris romans, thank you. chuck schumer says he is for joe, but a new report says behind the scenes that the top democrat could be open to change. s that the top democrat could be open to change

with his famous flip phone on fire with walls, axios is reporting today that senate majority leader chuck schumer is privately telling donors that he is open to dumping president biden. quote, schumer has been listening to donors' ideas and suggestions about the best way forward for the party according to three people familiar with the matter. nbc news has reached out to the majority leader, his office declines to comment on the report. he did, however, release this statement. as i have made clear repeated lead, publicly and privately, i support president biden and remain committed to ensuring donald trump is defeated in november. for schumer and hakeem jeffries, the two top democrats in office what they ultimately decide isn't just being watched by the white house and the party. it will be judged by history. joining us now former democratic senator barbara boxer who worked closely with the president during their shared time in the senate.

also with us presidential historian douglas brinkley. senator, i think you were in congress 25, 26 years, and you know a lot of the players still. what does leadership need to be doing right now both in terms of communicating to the members, to the caucus and also to the white house? >> leadership is doing what they have to do. they're telling everyone they're with president biden because they know as we all know, he is the one who will make this decision and all of this breathless reporting and piling on, and i hope -- i don't mean you, and i'm just saying by the media, by the elites and by people who want five minutes of fame by going to the microphones. all of this is only helping donald trump. this is an election like no other. everyone knows the stakes. only joe biden can make this decision. look, two weeks ago i said i'm going to watch him for two weeks

to see if what happened at the debate happens again. it did not. i see the joe biden i have known for years. is he a little softer spoken? yes. does he make a couple of more gaffes? yes, but i'll conclude with this. joe has never been slick. he's never been smooth. he's not like robert redford. he's not like, you know, actors who play presidents. he is who he is, a fighter for the middle class. the greatest record on jobs in history versus a guy who is the only one since records have been kept who left office with fewer jobs than when he came in so there you are. >> i think you're probably talking to a lot of your democratic friends, and i look, for example, at peter welch from vermont who said, listen, my state loves -- loves joe biden. they gave him a bigger margin of victory than anyone else, but he

said -- he saved us from donald trump once. he wants to do it again, but the question is whether he is the best candidate to do that, and in my view, he is not. i think for a lot of the people who have come out they're not necessarily looking, are they, for their 15 minutes of fame. they're looking at what they think the thread is of donald trump and who is the best person. can reasonable people disagree about that, senator? >> yes, but i was there as you point out, 10 years in the house and more than 20 in the senate. as an individual you go to the leadership. you don't go to the microphone. look, the last two weeks we've seen joe out there. we've also seen the stock market up, more people getting health care and we see donald trump who continues to think that the media is the enemy of the people that hangs around and loves

putin, and i'll tell you something, the press ought to be paying a little bit of attention to this guy who rambles on and sharks in the water or jump overboard or get eaten by a shark, he's losing it, but when he has it he is a danger. sheehy has said he wants to be a dictator on day one. he wants to take away a woman's right to choose and punish her. >> the press focuses on any syllable. she's never been look, and who is he going to pick my pence was almost killed in the insurrection and he's not supporting trump. how about that as a start? >> i will say we have played lots of donald trump on this program, but i want to ask you, doug, this process is going to

play out and you know, there will be a big press conference tonight and leaders will go home. members of congress made a pilgrimage to the white house told the president to hang things up because of his dire prospects. we should not draw, one was about enterprise and the other was about aging, right? but talk a little bit about if history informs us in any way about how senators and members of congress in general can and should be handling this situation which is fraught, emotional and incredibly consequential. >> i don't think any serious democrat would use the language of dumping of joe biden. he's a beloved figure and any serious person, columnist will say that somewhere in their piece. the question is what was the damage of those 90 minutes?

why did he tell george stephanopoulos that he never replayed the debate tape and he fumbled 50 times and should see what went wrong, and he flat out said i don't need to look at it. people say why not take a cognitive test and use it as a learning moment for americans and all americans at 80 should take a cognitive test and it will take little time and put it out there. i see the drip, drip. he is the nominee of the democratic party and only joe biden can decide to drop out, but i think if he can get on top of it and talk about it in a forthright way and there's been a cover, and that was when barry geldwater and others went to nixon and said you lied to us. you're gone. we won't support your action

anywhere, and it was a death knell to nixon who was mired in a scandal. joe biden is not in any scandal. it's a question of can he serve for four more years, and you picked the state of vermont. bernie sanders is wildly behind joe biden and senator welch isn't, and that's an honest, in my mind, disagreement, but they getter get on the same page, still. be seen with her. talk about here because it's odd for her to be doblging around an essence festival and constantly not seem like she wants joe biden's job. if it's not biden for some reason, and he decides to pull out it has to be kamala harris who would be the go-to person for all of the obvious reason, and if he did have to quit biden

could write a letter to the country saying i've done my best. i've done well. i did take a cognitive test and you have the first woman in american history in kamala harris. that certainly could happen and right now biden's dug in, and i don't know who will get him to say i'm not running. it would take a team of, like, 15 democratic senators to look him in the eyes, goldwater-like and say we will not back you and something like that is plausible, but everybody now seems to be hedging their bets. >> so let me ask you as somebody who has run more than a few campaigns, senator. the widespread reporting is what senate democrats were asking for today and what members of the house have asked for is data, right? if you're the campaign and you want to go and convince us that joe biden can win this, and this is really about defeating, every one of them will tell you donald trump. what's your best option for

defeating donald trump? that mean data on polling, that means data on fund-raising. can you address that and can you at this stage of the game, look dispassionately at data, and are we in the frigz frigsz people's's a month or two mocks down the road. >> look, i'm not an expert on data, but i ran four times and the data showed i would never do it, and i could never make it so that's important. i will say this, i've looked at the polls and they're still very close, and after two weeks of non-stop piling on by the press and individual members of congress, i think the grassroots, frankly, is going to rise up in this case because

they do love joe. if joe decides to stay in and he has decided to stay in, what's hurting uses and what could make the data bad is if we're not on the same page. doug brinkley is absolutely right. everyone has to work together. look at france. everyone predicted the press, the elite media, oh, the right wing is taking over. the right wing is taking oefrg. it doesn't happen, why? because everyone on the other side were unified and when i look at the threat of donald trump and this whole new 2025 project which really was written by 80% of their staff comes from trump, this is his thing. the first one is end no-fault divorce, punish women. take away everybody's rights, fire for all of the federal employees and put in your cronies and go after, you know, your enemies just like putin did with navalny and now mrs. navalny.

this is a serious moment. yes, i will look at the data, but for goodness sakes, i agree with the great historian you have on now. we need to unite and start, and that's what we need. >> government of our state said vice president has just arrived in greensboro, north carolina. someone who is under pressure and scrutiny and continuing to campaign and continuing to do her job, right, good, bad or indifferent and i wonder if there's any parallel for the stakes for joe biden tonight? >> it's just that the press can turn at times in a pack and they're going to turn and put him on the hot seat.

you remember when dan rather with richard nixon and challenged him in a very direct way. i remember when the class at large went after george w. bush and for a while it can intimidate reporters and everyone wants access to the white house and when the press starts to not worry about that access and they're going after a president with very hard and direct questions, there is a residual number that biden doesn't hold press conferences and doesn't make himself available and that's been an ongoing narrative. i do think he has to go through tonight and get a passing great and of course, with lester holt in austin on monday. meanwhile, biden is eating up the clock. the republican convention is

kicking in in milwaukee it's less likely of biden pulling out. kamala harris is part of any scenario here because he is in his 80s and you have to imagine iffed bien and harris win that the public wants to have confidence in her ability to lead and she's doing really well on the campaign trail right now. >> given the age and the real its of age for both of these men, the vice presidential choices are significant, maybe more so than we've seen in the past. former senator barbara boxer, doug brinkley, i really appreciate both of you having this conversation. good to see you both. still to come on "chris jansing reports" alec baldwin, and he could face the deadly armorer convicted in the shooting. morer convicted in the shooting.

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alec baldwin's involuntary manslaughter trial today getting into the critical details of how a live bullet got into the gun. a crime scene technician who examined evidence from the rust set testified that live rounds and dummy bullets were found mixed together on set and that someone could have mistaken one for the other. joining me now is nbc's dana griffin and defense attorney and msnbc legal analyst danny cevallos. >> marissa poppell, she has

still been on the stand and she is the one that took photographs inside that church including a document that had on it instructions for what was supposed to happen during one of the shooting scenes, and it said that baldwin's character was to, quote, cock the firearm. that helps to bolster the defense's narrative that baldwin, the actor, was just doing what he was told and during this morning, there have been tedious and heated motions with the prosecution to show potential bias by the crime scene technician. at one point he asked her if she was trying to get this over with so prosecutors could focus on baldwin. she said no. listen to what else he got her to say on the stand which will be important for the jury to understand that baldwin had no -- had no -- he was not responsible for the live rounds. listen to this. >> there is zero evidence in

this case that alec baldwin brought the live round on the set, correct? >> correct. >> there is zero evidence in this case that alec baldwin loaded that live round into that gun, right? >> correct. >> and we all know that alec baldwin was not responsible for loading those live rounds and that was the armorer hannah gutierrez-reed who was also convicteded -- excuse me, she was convicted of involuntary manslaughter and currently serving out her sentence and it was important to establish that for the jury for some members who may not have heard of this case they want to make sure that they make it clear that baldwin did not load that weapon, but the prosecution is going to try to call other witnesses who will testify that he pulled the trigger and that will be key testimony that we'll be looking forward to. chris? >> so what does the prosecution, danny, have to prove their case against him in there doesn't

seem to be any dispute and he was not the one who bought the bullets, brought the bullets, loaded the gun. we know that the weapon fired. what does the -- what does the prosecution have to prove here, then? >> the prosecution told us their theory of the case in the opening, and it's a flawed theory, in my view. their theory is that people should never point guns at other people, but the proproblem with that theory is what do you do in this situation where the person handling the item had no reason to think it was actually a gun and that was the defense's entire theory is actually, it's one of many and it's rare that we're in the prosecution's case in chief. it's supposed to feel that the prosecution is ahead and yet day by day we're getting evidence that helps the defense. we're getting thaefz the firearm was damaged in testing and we're getting evidence that is mostly good for the defense. it's not supposed to be this way

and it's supposed to be overwhelming and yet it feels like it's mostly the defense scoring victories. >> so let's look into tomorrow because hannah gutierrez-reed who is the armorer, she is serving an 18-month sentence, she is scheduled to take the stand. talk a little bit about how you think it could play into the prosecution's case. >> the prosecution will call for the purpose of saying that alex baldwin had the opportunity to look at the firearm, but again, this is going to be evidence that's good for the defense because on cross-examination, what they're going to do they'll say isn't it true that you were the one with primary responsibility for the safety of the firearm. isn't it true that dave hall was also responsible for the safety of the firearm? isn't it true that actors rely upon you when they hand you a gun to trust you that you're doing your job because the actor's job isn't that true. there will be some variation of that and it will be good for the defense.

the prosecution doesn't ng they need to call hannah gutierrez-reed, and look for the defense to elicit good testimony from this prosecution witness. danny cevallos and dana griffin, thank you so much. to breaking news, shelley duval the actress who played opposite in "the shining." she played iconec roles throughout the '70s, '80s and '90s including popeye eye, and annie hall which earned her an award in the cannes festival in 1977. it was "the shining" that left an impression on fans and on duval herself and had to shoot it 127 times and it took an incredible toll and said i don't know how i did it. she was living in texas where she died after suffering from

complications from diabetes. shelly duval was 77 years old. president biden prepares for the high-stakes press conference that could prove to voters and anxious nato allies whether he's up for the job. his political rival taking a meeting with one nato member who is also a putin ally. putin ally

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right now while the talk is about ukraine, the focus is on

joe biden hosting allies at the nato summit who are reported to be nervous and saddened by threats to his presidency. here's some analysis through the lens of the republican speaker of the house. >> all those nato leaders are here on the hill, as you know know. these foreign leaders are coming in, prime ministers and heads of state and they are telling us privately that they're deeply concerned. a weak america is bad for the whole world. >> joining us now is michael crawly diplomatic write are for "the new york times" i guess they're concerned about causing a weak america. tell us what you are hearing about the level of concern from the nato leaders who are here in d.c.. >> yeah, chris, you have it exactly right. that was my reaction to that quote from the speaker. what is the context? what are they referring to? look, i'm sure there's concern about president biden's condition. there's concern across america, everyone who is following the

campaign is trying to figure out how president biden is doing and whether there's anything that has changed that has made it difficult for him to be president of the united states, and i'm sure those concerns are shared overseas. i would be a little surprised if visiting dignitaries were sharing that with leaders of the opposition. it's typically not the kind of thing that you say foreign officials tend to be more discreet and cautious about that. i do think on a more substantive policy basis they would be quite willing to say that they are very concerned about america's long-term commitment to nato and the context there would be the potential that donald trump would be president of the united states and we know that trump has been extremely critical of the nato alliance to the point that he has intimated that he might not honor the nato treaty's mutual collective self-defense clause, article 5 so that if russia were to attack a nato member that was not

paying at least 2% of its defense budget -- i'm sorry, of its national budget on defense which was the agreed upon goal, trump was saying he might not come to their defense. i would say that's probably the bigger source of concern right now. >> yeah. i actually traveled with then-president trump to his first nato meeting where he made comments about article 5 that shook a lot of nato to its core, and i think that hasn't changed significantly in any way. in fact, let's talk a little bit about what i said the focus was, at least in terms of issues which is kyiv, ukraine, russia and the level of concern that donald trump may full funding altogether. the exact opposite of what obviously president biden has successfully done which is to show support. >> right, chris. these things are related. to the extent that a lot of these nato leaders might be concerned about president biden,

i think their concern is not, oh, you know, the american president is old and weak and there was america is weak. i think their concern is president biden may not run an effective campaign, and therefore is vulnerable to being defeated by donald trump and then who knows what happens? will trump try to yank america out of nato and will he not observe article 5? will he try to essentially cut off american aide to ukraine which will result in ukraine cutting a pretty bad piece deal with russia. >> michael crowley, always great to have you on the program. thank you so much. meantime, fresh off the nato summit and the man who has upset so many member of the alliance will head south to mar-a-lago. former president trump is ready to welcome hungarian prime minister viktor orban who recently visited vladimir putin and recently said that a biden

to trump presidency would be good for the world. nbc's vaughn hilliard reports on this. a source says there's no chance of secret dealings. >> let's be very clear, viktor orban, this is his second visit to mar-a-lago. viktor orban is someone who has promoted the idea of a liberal democracy and cutting off the expansion of nato and cutting off additional funding to ukraine. that is who donald trump is meeting with here today. viktor orban after his meeting with donald trump back in march said about their private conversations this quote, he said that donald trump said that he will not give a penny in the ukraine-russian war and that is why the war will end because it is obvious that ukraine cannot stand on its own feet. if the americans don't give money and weapons along with the europeans then the war is over and if the americans don't give money the europeans alone are unable to finance this war and then the war is over.

those were the words of orban about his private conversations with donald trump after their march conversation. we went to trump's campaign asking them to clarify the statements or affirm or reject the truthfulness of them and they did not do that at this time. donald trump touted at a private reception that he held at mar-a-lago the leadership of viktor orban in which he made it very clear, quote, nobody is a better, smarter or a better leader than viktor orban referring to him as "the boss." when you're looking at 2025 and beyond, what type of alliances and what type of partnerships will donald trump seek? he has made it very clear that viktor orban, the prime minister of hungary and someone he has a great admiration for. >> vaughn hilliard, not a simple job to cover this campaign, but we thank you for doing it. coming up, frustrations rising as temperatures soar in houston. more than a million people who still don't have power and it

could feel like 106 degrees today. we have a reporter standing by with all of the details. you're watching "chris jansing reports" only on msnbc. on msnbc

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nbc's is reporting from the area. what's happening now? >> reporter: the israeli military is ordering palestinians to evacuate from gaza city once again after a fresh two-week offensive again hamas. this is raising more questions about the israeli military's stated aim after october 7th of completely eradicating the militant group and its fighting force. we're seeing images coming to us from a district in gaza city revealing the extent of the destruction there with seemingly not a single building left standing. and this is happening against the back drop of renewed cease-fire talks in doha, in qatar, with the aim of releasing israeli hostages in exchange for palestinian prisoners. the national security spokesperson in the united states, john kirby, said he was, quote, cautiously hospital mystic that talks are moving in

the right direction, though we've heard him say that in the past. this is happening as palestinians in khan yunis are reeling after a fourth strike on or near a school in that part of gaza. the attack in ouda school killed 25 people and witnesses told our crews that some of the victims were watching a soccer match on television when the strike took place. nbc filmed victims and bloodied survivors, including children, in the school. the idf is claiming they hit the location because it was used as, quote, a hideout and operational infrastructure from which attacks were taking place. and there are as well continued fears that in addition to the violence, famine and starvation keeps spreading in large parts of gaza. >> thank you. let's come back here to the states because sweltering

temperatures are baking the country. from coast to coast, 53 million people under heat alerts right now. that heat has become deadly with at least 38 heat-related deaths in the u.s. just since the end of june. take a look at this. in washington, d.c., the absolutely sweatering heat actually melted a wax statue of the lincoln memorial. it basically fell apart, in half, making it nearly unrecognizable. meanwhile, dangerous heat in texas threatens the 1.1 million people still without power in the wake of hurricane beryl. today marks the fourth straight day without electricity for much of texas as houston's heat index is expected to hit 106 degrees today. all we can do is hope those folks that don't have air conditioning get it back very, very soon. that's a long time to be without air in that heat. that's going to do it for us this hour. make sure to join us for "chris jansing reports" every weekday from 1:00 to 3:00 p.m. eastern

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good to be with you. i'm katy tur. we are going to move fast this hour as the climate around president biden seems to be shifting rapidly. speaker hakeem jeffries, who said he was behind joe biden, told reporters today the conversation among house