all these other things and they will. they absolutely will. >> thank you. >> we are talking contraception. g contraception. [ inaudible ] we're talking about ivf, and we are also talking about planned and unwanted-- wanted pregnancies, when people are experiencing pregnancy, they are being turned away because of these laws. >> your references, and we don't have any time to get to it today, but we will keep digging into it, how this extends to contraception and 1 million of these, i will not say millions, but dozens of these examples we have seen from women suffering because they can't get treatment are planned and wanted pregnancies because pregnancies actually complicated in this country, more so than any other er developed nature. my rubric, host of power brick or subsecond review series and the podcast when we went with my rubric. new articles of impeachment thing to supreme court justices to accounts of alleged actions

of corruption. now, new ideas to reform the court and revive its reputation. rich has the best chance of bringing change and get through congress? i will call through this week's meeting on the banned book club. another hour starts right now. saturday, july 13th. i am ali velshi. four years ago, as trump was preparing to nominate a third person to the supreme court, then house speaker nancy pelosi said in a statement quote, everything hangs in the balance with the nomination. in the years since, the super majority have handed down a decision that has led to the curtailing of america's personal rights and the remaking of the federal government. as all of that was happening, an ethical crisis was unfolding involving members of that super majority which is has doubts about some of the

judge's impartiality and some of the most high profile confidential cases that have ever reached the supreme court. both have led to an erosion of confidence in the supreme court and efforts to reform the constitution and hold justices accountable for their actions have called, in part due to hyper partisanship in congress. not for lack of trying. lawmakers have proposed numerous ideas for reform, imposing term limits, forcing the justices to adopt a binding code of a first, taskforces and commissions have been formed to explore those and more. none of those ideas have gained real traction, because it simply cannot be the case that members of the highest court in the land are held to the lowest ethical standards. that is the important concept to consider revolving a pair of actions taken the hill this week. we learned that ron wyden asked attorney general merrick garland to appoint a special

prosecutor to criminally investigate supreme court justice terrance glamis-- clarence thomas for fraud. citing their failures to publicly disclose financial income, gifts, and other transactions, as well as their refusal to recuse themselves from cases in which they had a conflict of interest. >> in january 2021, after the former president of the united states and cited an insurrection on the capitol, in this chamber, to interfere with the results of the u.s. election, justice samuel alito and his wife flew an upside down american flag, a symbol of solidarity with the attack outside their home. justice thomas, who is married to virginia thomas, a financial and personally involved operative in the stop the steel movement and capitol attack, also joined opinions in these cases, even as clear evidence

mounted that not only was his wife fully committed to overthrowing the results of a fair election, but she was actively lobbying members of the trump administration attempting to do just that. these efforts are not likely to continue. these sorts of actions, not likely to succeed in this house of representatives, but they are arguably necessary in order to keep pressure on the justices and shows the public that there are paths for the, even though they might not be politically viable now. the senate judiciary committee announced this week it will hold a hearing in september to explore the effects of the supreme court's broad decision involving presidential immunity and decide if congress needs to pass legislation to counteract legislations of that decision. for much of history, the justices have been expected to police themselves and the current court has remained

reluctantly defiant about the need for change. in an interview earlier this year, justice alito said quote, no provision in the constitution gives them the authority to regulate supreme court, period. should probably give everyone pause when one of the people entrusted to protect the, duchenne-- constitution says something like that. joining me now is jeffrey rosen, ceo of national constitution center, author of many books, including the pursuit of happiness, how classical writers on virtually inspire the life of the founders and defined america. matthew sullivan also joins us, a fellow at the constitutional law center at stanford law school and co-author of the new book, quote, how to still a presidential election. good morning to both of you. jeff rosen, i want to address something at the heart of this issue, that is, there may be various and numerous calls for supreme court reform, but i am imagining none of them should or will involve anything that will affect the judiciary's

independence. these are all procedural, or tactical ways that the court can be organized and carry out its work, not influence how they make their decisions. >> that is right, but the difficulty of distinguishing between goes back to the founding. really, we have got to mention here the 1804 impeachment effort of justice samuel chase, the only supreme court justice to have been impeached. he was absolutely a wild campaign for adams, thomas jefferson wants him impeached that even though he is completely biased, and impeached for partisanship, use acquittal and his acquittal comes to stand for prosecution that you can't impeach supreme court justices because you disagree with their rulings or they are extremely partisan. the senate could re-examine that, but as you say, in practice, those are unlikely to succeed. basically, the only

effective way of checking the core of american history is for congress to change the size of the jefferson, jackson, lincoln, fdr, grant errors and if it had the votes, he could do that now, but even president biden has walked away from that. i have to say one more thing. it is so interesting that there are claims justice thomas should be subject to special prosecutor. he said in a trump immunity decision the special prosecutor law is up was unconstitutional. as you suggested, so many of these things congress is considering, including forcing the court to adopt at the form, the court itself might strike down in practice. this means that it is very hard to think of an effective way to check the court and without people in congress, there is no clear path forward. >> jeffrey has a really important point for us to conceptualize. that is, you can't fix things just because you don't agree

with the justices. there have got to be specific matters that are addressable, because something will have to pass congress, something will have to pass the senate, and if that happens, it has got to be legal, something that stands up to proper judicial scrutiny. of the things suggested, all the various, jeff seems to think making the court bigger and imposing other basic rules might be the answer, what is your sense of the best way to this court? >> i think there is certainly the most historical precedents, the question of it being unconstitutional for congress to add to supreme court's. the concern, however, once republicans take control of the congress and presidency again, they too can expand the size of the supreme court. this could lead to a cycle of repeated expansions of the supreme court. you have 13, 27, and so on numbers of justices on the supreme court. that in turn could grade the independence of supreme court

whenever a party takes control of congress, they can add to the size of the supreme court. in addition to adding justices to me it is often proposed that justices be subjected to term limits, usually 18 years. there will always be nine justices on the supreme court, but the turnover would be regularized. the challenge is, it is not clear that could happen without the constitutional amendment. those are again subject to the supreme court's own review about the constitutionality of that statute. the expansion of the supreme court is a viable option. it is not clear whether or not it can be achieved politically. even if it could, whether it would complete the expansion. jeff, you made that point in the past as well. how do you know it goes from nine, 13, 127, whatever the case is. you know a lot about other places and how they work. if we were to just say, how are supreme court, what should it look like, whether composition, term limits, at the guidelines

compared to best practices around the world, is that a fair question? point to it and say, here is how other countries do and there are very obvious things we can do to pick up on that. >> we have tended to leave the world in terms of having a strong supreme court and other countries are coming around to our models, and additionally enforceable bills of rights and constitution. however, their success days i think does not have life. the idea of term limits is getting my attraction. as matthew sullivan suggests, it really could get political support too . you know the national constitution center grant a constitutional laughing project and little team [ inaudible ] there really is widespread support bipartisan across the country for the only thing it would take the constitutional amendment. that is the bottom

line with our system, it is so hard to amend the constitution, even the best practices do seem to favor term limits, they will be very hard to actually embrace. >> obviously, and this is why we keep going back to expansion of the court, which both of you warn, mike is a problem now, might create a problem later. is there some middle ground? constitutional amendments are a great topical question to have, they are really hard to do, which is why we have not seen one in a very long time. >> i think the bare minimum we could look at is a binding code of ethics on the supreme court. the same ethical rules that apply to every federal judge and indeed apply to members of congress as well. it is important to recognize that the articles of impeachment that we introduced my representative of cardio carcass are not of a decision she disagreed with. they weren't introduced after dobbs. it is hard to under eight the level of disagreement that democrats in congress have with that decision. the

articles of impeachment were not about the subsequent decision, but rather about allegations of ethical improprieties, failure to recuse when there is a financial or other conflict of interest. now, the supreme court is not subject to a binding code of ethics. that could change. it is also true that justice alito has set that congress does not have the power to impose binding codes of ethics about refusal, the disclosure of financial involvement with a party before the court. justice alito's view i think is a minority on the supreme court . it highlights, as you mentioned, the supreme court would have the power to determine whether a code of ethics on it self is cost national-- constitutional. >> to those of us that are not trained lawyers, this is a circular discussion. if the court says, you can give them a code of ethics and give them a code of ethics and they said, you can't give us a code of ethics, would have us in

discussion for years. jeffrey rosen is the president and ceo of the national constitution center, author of several books including "the pursuit of happiness. close matthews effort, co- author of the book "how to steal a presidential election." tragic raking news. the legendary six there is dr. ruth has died. the 96-year-old past away yesterday at home surrounded by family. dr. ruth westheimer have a conflict identity. she was a holocaust survivor, a sex therapist, a professor and author. she is also most well known for being a radio and tv host, in which her shows discussed six, romantic relationships, and offered callers and viewers candid tips on how to better their love lives, which was deeply taboo at the time. dr. ruth was way ahead of her time and she will be missed. again, dr. ruth westheimer has passed away at the age of 96. claimant

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with ongoing calls for joe biden to step aside, members of the congressional black caucus have remained steadfast in their support for the president. it is notable that not a single member of the congressional black caucus has called on the president to drop out of the 2024 race. according to nbc news reporting, there is some concern with the caucus. the congressional hispanic caucus have continued to show support for the president with the exception of one member calling on biden to drop his reelection bid. as other mostly white lawmakers continue to fixate on biden's fitness, other than addressing the existential threat posed by donald trump, lawmakers representing these vulnerable communities are increasingly worried that the treasure will cripple biden's chances in november, endangering minority communities who have the most to lose if donald trump wins. policies pushed by meghan

mccool officials and judges nationwide have just personally affected minorities and women, including bans on critical race , di policies, and the overturning of roe v. wade, assaults on voting rights, and anti-lgbtq plus initiatives. pundits accused biden supporters of lacking guts, or throwing line loyalty. many voters argue that those critics are failing to grasp the existential stakes. amid the threat of christian nationalism and project 2025, randall woodfin, the mayor of birmingham, alabama recently cautioned them correctly continue to question biden's fitness. quote, the bases with the president. everyone else needs to stay on board. you want to abandon ship, you don't take everyone else with. representative joyce beatty of ohio underscored why black voters in particular can afford to falter in their support of the biden/harris ticket. in an important piece for msnbc she said quote, we fear our

democracy is dangerously close to collapsing under the weight of countless challenges to its constitution and norms. should our democracy falter, black americans know we would be the first to suffer the impact. we cannot succumb to disillusionment, or nothing will change mentality. while so many competing to fight for their risks, the stakes are high and are resolved must be equally high. we must both like our lives depend on it, because they do. after break, i will be joined by my good friend sir lena maxwell, host of mornings with sir lena maxwell on sirius xm radio. xm radio. . chase freedom unlimited. so, if you're off the racking... ...or crab cracking, you're cashbacking. cashback on flapjacks, baby backs, or tacos at the taco shack. nah, i'm working on my six pack. switch to a king suite- or book a silent retreat. silent retreat? hold up - yeeerp? i can't talk right now, i'm at a silent retreat. cashback on everything you buy with chase freedom unlimited

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she is the host of "mornings with zerlina ." i join her there sometimes and she is author of "the end, how to heal the divide. " let's talk about this, whether you are white or black and you are sensibly afraid of what they second donald trump term might look like, everybody seems to want the same thing. this is a very messy argument, but everybody kind of what's not to win. tell me how this works down, based on what you're stakes in the game are. >> look, i feel like i have been listening so intently to the radio callers and i have not taken a strong position either way about what should happen or what president biden should do. one of the messages i have been really marinating on and talking to voters all over the country, a lot of black voters all over the country, is that they do not want because of the harm to communities of color. so, if folks are going to call for joe biden to step aside,

they also must say,, layers is the alternative. she is the city vice president. if they are not willing to do that, then the entire debate over what to do is counterproductive to the mission that democrats should they focus on, which is the feeding donald trump. the feeding donald trump happens when you are focused on mobilizing the communities of color and that multiracial coalition of voters that led to president biden's victory in 2020 in the first place. >> let talk about that, mobilizing a coalition. it is really important. 81 million roughly people voted for joe biden, 70 million voted to donald trump. more than that number did not vote for anybody. there were people in the last election, 2020, that's still set it out. kind of amazing. now we have got problems with people who still want to sit it out for lots of valid reasons. the work here is mobilization. if the democratic were republicans, everybody would have a red tie on standing in

front of the court and they would be moving forward full speed ahead. that is right. the work is always mobilization. in order to mobilize evil, you need to make sure they are registered and enthusiastic about voting for your party. and you do that through the message. i think that the problem democrats have right now is that they are not making the message about donald trump. they are fighting amongst themselves about what is the best strategy, as opposed to focusing on the harm caused to communities and the issues and policies that they want to implement. a positive visit to help those communities. whether or not you are talking about student debt relief, or the fact that a republican in charge overturn roe versus wade, or when trump was in charge, implemented the muslim ban, or attempted to implement the muslim ban, and block latino children in cages and separate them from their parents

. you need to talk about both your positive vision, along with the harm caused to communities of color and encourage them to vote. at the end of the day, this is all about the fact that america is evolving into a multiracial democracy. and i have not heard much conversation to date about how trump's roger 2025 is a response to the fact that america is evolving into a multiracial democracy. that is why this exist. talks about it, right. project 2025 talks about the ei, these initiatives. it is very specific that that is not the direction we want to go in. if you vote for donald trump, roger 2025 will be implemented. affirmative action is never coming back. they are very clear about that. >> they are not mincing their words. they are very clear about the fact that they are afraid of what america is evolving it to. i wrote a whole book about it, allie.

democrats can exploit the fact that america's revolution into this multiracial democracy includes the demographic groups that agree with their policies, that are helped by their policies. so, they need to talk more about the ways in which they will make people's lives better, while also warning them about this threat of autocracy that is going to make their lives tangibly worse. >> zerlina, good to see you . as always, thank you this morning. former director of progressive media for garrett clinton's 2020 campaign. host of mornings with zerlina , author of "the end of white politics how to heal are liberal divide." it is an important and relevant book now. treatment this monday, lester holt down with joe biden for an exclusive one on one interview. watch the full unedited interview in a primetime special at 9:00 p.m. eastern on nbc and nbc news now. still ahead, today's meeting of the "velshi" banned

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it has been an eventful july for the authoritarian leader of hungry, orban. on the first of the month, gary took on the council of the european union. it holds little power, but the sexy little agenda and messaging. during the time at the top, orban has vowed her to, make europe great again. the very next day, orban met with ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy in keene, which is netanyahu's first trip to ukraine since the full-scale

invasion in 2022, despite the fact that gary shares a border with ukraine. orban has frustrated leaders for his dance on ukraine, holding up blocking assistance efforts while maintaining their close ties to russia's vladimir putin. days after that, orban traveled to moscow for limits with putin on what orban is calling a quote, the mission. after that, orban to try to, meeting with chinese leader xi jinping, tweeting, quote, peace mission 3.0, hashtag beijing. the german newspaper published a newspaper in which orban praised china's position on the war, chastised the u.s. and the eu's positions, and argued that quote, putin cannot lose. defeating russia is a thought difficult to imagine. on monday, russia fired a barrage of missiles at ukraine, one of the biggest attacks of the war, striking the capitol of keith and other cities.

at least 41 civilians were killed, including at least three children at a children's hospital in kyiv. the very next day, orban was in washington for the start of the annual nato summit , marking the historic 80 75th-- 75th anniversary of the alliance. orban jetted off to florida to meet personally with his friend, the former president donald trump, who continues to criticize nato and continues to draw the united states from it. orban will endorse donald trump's pointing to--, peace mission 5.0. trump is going to solve it. end quote. joined me now is former u.s. ambassador to russia, director for institutional national professor of studies, international affairs analyst at arthur of "from cold war to hot piece, an american ambassador in putin's russia." i don't know where to start.

viktor orban 's so-called peace mission has been lightened by donald trump and president biden , and it all seems surround donald trump in the upcoming election. tell arguers who do not necessarily vote on the matter of foreign affairs, why this is so important. >> it is important because the peace plan, i did not realize it got up 5.0 by the end of his travels, basically a capitulation plan for ukraine. ukraine is supposed to give the territory russia art guys now, they are supposed to declare neutrality. never join nato. basically, to give putin everything he wants. he was floating it at the nato summit. i was in washington yes they call last week, listen to officials talk about it, including ukrainian officials. it is a complete nonstarter from the point of your president zelenskyy and his team. the tragic truth is that there

is a presidential candidate in the united states of america today that endorses it. you just saw them together. what you have today is putin, orban, and trump, who are ideologically more aligned than i am with mr. trump, or that president zelenskyy is with mr. trump, or that president biden is with mr. trump. i think american voters have a stark choice in november . they don't want to vote for a president that admires and reports dictators, or do they want to support a president that admires and supports democrats? >> i think you would agree with this, generally speaking, unless we are in the middle of our own war, american don't tend to make foreign-policy issues a priority. before this nato summit, a very big deal. the 75th anniversary of the most successful military alliance in the world. you wrote in foreign policy about how nato's research is an additional of two new members is one of president biden's signature achievements.

i have to ask, what are your thoughts post summit what are you hearing from allies abroad? they have been very worried about a trump victory at this conversation about joe biden is giving them pause. >> i think president biden, summit was a fantastic success. it shows why we are better off with allies then not. when nato marched in, i was at the opening ceremony. all of our allies marched in, i was taking about what you just talked about. xi, orban, iran, we have a much stronger allies. if you at our allies in asia. i think american voters need to think about, do you want to go along against our enemies, or do you want to have allies? president biden i think that is okay while we are better than everybody on our side. second, mr. trump talks a lot about paying up, right even after all of these years, i don't really understand that

nato is not a protection. they do not pay us protect them. they spent money on our own defenses. he is talking about burden sharing rightly. president biden and the nato allows enough this week 23 members happy at that 2% of gdp target. that was at nine under mr. trump. if you care about burden sharing , president biden is delivering on that. the third thing i would say, you are right, americans don't generally vote on foreign-policy. that is what the polls say. i have worked on some campaigns, including president obama's campaign. there is a constituency that really cares about these issues. polish americans, ukrainian americans, lithuanian americans , and you know where they live? pennsylvania, michigan, ohio. i have met with some of those groups on the sidelines of the nato summit. i can tell you, they pay a great deal about four foreign-policy, especially

national security policy, related to that part of europe. >> i need to ask you about widow of russian opposition leader alexis vivaldi on the alleges of terrorist extremists now, they ordered her arrest. she currently lives abroad. if she were to return, like her late husband did, she would be detained, like her late husband was. also, russian opposition politician has apparently been transferred from a russian penal colony to a russian penal hospital. his legal team has not talked to him since early july. look, not surprising, but that development. >> horrific developments. i am really worried about her, you just mentioned. thank you everyone for reminding about the condition. he is in very bad health. julia is not on this list, she's not going back to russia. i saw her here at hanford because her daughter graduated

from stanford a few weeks ago. she was off to that graduation ceremony. you know what does happen when you are on this list? russia can try to use it to pull to try and attain her in various countries. and it is difficult and challenging. i think also, just as a good reminder for people that we hear people like trump talk about putin being tough and smart. if he is so tough and smart and so popular, why is he arresting all of the opposition leaders? why is he chasing them around the world? to me, that is a sign of weakness, not a sign of strength, just like thankfully that you showed again, if you are bombing a hospital with children, cancer patients, that is not a fine of strength. i don't like the word strongman when we talk about orban and putin . these are weak men that we should not support. we should repel, contain, and support that the democrats, including the russian democrats that you just mentioned.

>> these are weak. >> always good to see. a former ambassador to russia. an analyst and the author of the book "from cold war to hot piece, an american ambassador in putin's russia. today's feature is national book award winner and at times best seller, "the poet x." it is a coming of age story that grapples with religion, self acceptance, and the cultural rifts that separate generations of families. of families. how do you spell relief? r-o-l-a-i-d-s rolaids' dual-active formula begins to neutralize acid on contact. r-o-l-a-i-d-s spells relief. we really don't want people to think of feeding food like ours is spoiling their dogs. good, real food is simple. it looks like food, it smells like food, it's what dogs are supposed to be eating. no living being should ever eat processed food

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is about to start the 10th grade and everything is changing. her relationships with her devoutly catholic mother and her beloved twin mother, her feelings and the way that the young man in her class in her harlem neighborhood treat her. quote, when your body takes up more room than your voice, you

are always the target of well aimed rumors, which is why i let my knuckles talk for me. which is why i learned to shrug when my name was replaced by insults. "the poet x," "new york times" bestseller by elizabeth acevedo is today's velshi blue cobra band feature. and to mirror our protagonist feelings, the "poet x" feels familiar and entirely fresh. it exposed the beautiful and ugly realities of female adolescence and what it means for faith, family, sexuality, self- preservation, self-love and self-expression. " poet x is also why telling such a story is important. as she find self actualization and self acceptance through writing or treat, so do we from reading the points. this remarkable meals is between writer and reader is at

the symbol of what makes "the poet x" is successful and what makes poetry so powerful. quote, i only know that learning to believe in the power of my own words has been the most freeing experience of my life. it has brought me the most light. isn't that what a point is? a lantern glowing in the dark? in a few short lines of vivid imagery, pointed dialogue is the thing self reflection, a form can make the most private moments feel universal. you don't need to be a 15-year-old catholic dominican girl from harlem for "poet x" to resume. elizabeth acevedo, a longtime poet herself, proves that through "poet x ," at the core of the book there is exploration of what the traditional catholicism can exist in a modern american girl's life. this is not a question of belief, rather a question of community, culture, and at modernity. we see this push pull in poem after poem, specifically in xiomara's relationship with her

mother, but also in the way the "poet x" is structured. the book is broken down into three sections with short biblical excerpts as titles. "in the beginning is the word." "the voice of one in the wilderness." it is worth noting those experts are taken from gospel of john, the fourth book of the new testament which illustrates the nature of faith and catholic theology. this multifaceted look at god, religion, and catholicism, some of the strongest writing in the book, is the primary reason that "poet x" has been targeted for removal since its initial publication in 2018. in 2020, two parents in the northern public school in north carolina set the book was quote, anti-christian and its hostility of the word christianity was unconstitutional. wow. ""poet x" grapples with religion, faith, and interpretation of the bible in

a nation built on the rejection of religious totality, this critical thought an evaluation actually feels very american. true belief in anything, including god and country, cannot come without question. that is the most universal truth explained in the verses in the "poet x". after the break, i will be joined by elizabeth acevedo, current young people's poet, and author of today's "velshi" band blue club feature, "the poet x. was quote day lakesha: childhood cancer is it's hard. but st. jude has gotten us through it. st. jude is hope for every child diagnosed with cancer because the research is being shared all over the world.

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today's meeting of the "velshi" band book club is officially underway. i am joined by elizabeth acevedo , the current u.s. young people's poet laureate and the author of the book, "poet x" a national book award winner antedates "velshi" book club feature. welcome to the banned book low, thank you for joining us. >> i would say i am glad to be here, but the reason is a little-- >> well, we are in the fight and we are glad to have you here. something i mentioned in the introduction, the religious component of "poet x" for one, xiomara examines the theatrics at play in her catholicism. it is more than theology to believe, it is cultural as well. when we are talking about religion or being critical of religion, it can be very hard to disentangle faith and culture. >> it really can be.

the dominican republic is a place that is almost 90% catholic. as we know, a lot of latin american nations were colonized by spain, which was a part of its mission, to promote catholicism or catholic. culture and religion becomes very, very intertwined. the main character is questioning god, but also questioning what it means to come from a community where some of the ideas of agency, and freedom, and advancement can be really rocks, can be really difficult to communicate with families that use the bible as a way to defend why a woman can't own their own body or their own power. >> xiomara's treatment by men is a major theme throughout the entire book. one point called "by my locker," xiomara describes

being sexually harassed by a group of male classmates and she went on her quest to defend her. i will quote from the book. he's not going to throw a punch. he's not going to curse or throw a fit . he is not going to do a thing because no one will ever take care of me but me. she goes on to confront both her assailants and her crush. this particular poem is both heartbreaking and at the same time empowering. talk to me a little about it. >> entirety. this is one of the moments where i do a lot of events for young people and it comes up often. either people are really upset at the crush for not stepping in or they feel like xiomara overreacted . i feel like these moments of how do young men and young women learn how to communicate with each other and what it means to ask for consent, to respect one another's body and space, and that she really thinks the only way to get men to respect her is physically to use her face. she acknowledges very early on that that is no longer working, that she is not a child anymore , where she can always kind of fight her way through things.

i think these emotions seem to really bring a lot in the young women that i speak to. they get that conflict of, i think i am the only one who can defend myself, and also, it is exhausting and had that it feels that way. >> exhausting and empowering at the same moment. i want to go back to your first answer where we talk about religion and culture and how difficult it may be for someone like netanyahu for two happy conversations about agency and freedom in the context of her culture. xiomara's relationship with her mother is central to the book. at its core, a massive cultural difference between the two of them. netanyahu for's mother a dominican immigrant and trying to reconcile. tell me more about that theme. >> i did not go in thinking this would be a story about mothers and daughters. this was my debut and i thought i would talk about the power of poetry. i realize very quickly that in order for someone to do something like performance poetry, like take up three

minutes on a stage, they had to practice at home. they had to read work out loud and can't really be writing. of course, an interested parents do begin asking questions. the mom as the antagonist begins to develop. she is someone so devout, she thinks her child should be seen, not heard, and her child is saying, not only do i want to be heard, i want to be heard by the world. i think that silence is a problem and a part of why we are in conflict. this relationship, and this how do you get someone to understand where you are coming from when they want to protect you so badly, they silence you can be the overarching theme between mother and daughter. >> one of the poems particularly struck out-- struck me, and i want to read a part of it, if medusa was

dominican and had a daughter, i think i would be her. i look and feel like a misfit, a story distorted, waiting for others to stop and stare. if i was hurt, medusa would tell me her secrets. how is it that looks stop me in their tracks? how would they still keep coming? why does she outmaneuver them when they do? talk to me about how you chose to include the myth of medusa and how it plays throughout the book. >> i am a little obsessed with medusa. a lot of my work has her throughout. we all know the monster is being with the gore and the snakes. the myth behind that is actually really interesting. she ovens of the note to the point that athena turns her into a monster because supposedly medusa defiled her temple by being sexually assaulted. we have this mythological being who is punished for what is done to her. i think that is the story of many women, and particularly women of color whose agency of their body, whose ability to

push back against power often has backlash. >> so, with this character, talks about medusa particularly because of her wild curls and her hair physically, what her looks due to people, how they stop them in their tracks, also this back story. this historical part of the myth that a lot of people don't know that medusa was turned into a monster, but in many ways, she was a victim. she was a victim who was not protected and was not loved enough to be written about with the tenderness that was required to tell her story. >> you know, we don't do a ton of portrait books. they get banned at a different rate and a lot of other things. some people can perceive a barrier of entry to reading poetry, or at least they think there is one. what do you say to readers who might not typically be interested in reading a book of free verse?

>> i am stunned all the time by the people who come up to me like, i did not want to like your book and i did not think i was going to. i think a good collection of poetry will teach you how to read it. if you surrender to the first couple of pages, you will get into the rhythm, get into the music. there is a character, there is a narrative. you will be grounded. i think it is taking a chance. poetry is in many ways our first languages. our parent think us lullabies, tell us rhymes all the time. we grow up listening to poetry and we lose that. someways, i would tell you, there's nothing wrong with returning to poetry, because it is in us and it has been there since the beginning. you are welcome. come in, hang out with us. >> i love that. there's nothing wrong with returning to poetry. elizabeth acevedo, the u.s. young people's poet. she's the author of "poet x."

to check on more of our banned books, head to msnbc.com and check out "velshi" banned book low. for those of you in chicago, i am here now. join me tomorrow for a public discussion about my new book, small acts of courage, the fight for democracy. it will be held at the washington library center at the chicago public library at 2:00 p.m. central. the event is free, but you need to rsvp at looking glass theater not a word. i hope we get a chance to meet while i am in chicago. thanks for watching. catch you back here tomorrow at noon p.m. eastern. and tomorrow night i will be hosting the msnbc "velshi" cast of the rnc. i will be giving live commentary with your favorite analysts. head to youtube.com/msnbc at tuesday, wednesday, and thursday.