recession, while we have millions, and millions, and millions of people lose their jobs and billions of dollars coming out of workers 'pockets, they were much more stable. they were much, much more stable because of those institutions. >> in fact, they have unions involved at the corporate level in germany unheard of in america . what we do find, including the last year and a half for me is that when unions and management are caused to have discussions in the right context, generally, things happen that are positive for both sides. >> we have seen the success of collective bargaining. that has been one of the things the last couple of years, it has been some conflict, but we have also seen a huge number of big, complicated issues addressed through the collective bargaining process where labor and management is saying to one

another, we want to solve a problem, we do not want to beat the hell out of one another. you saw the question of artificial intelligence in the workplace, being addressed by the hollywood unions and hollywood studios. you saw issues of climate change being addressed by teamsters and ups. that is the kind of partnership we want to see at the labor-management level. unsold workers have unions, so they have power, voice, the ability to stand up to their employers, we are not going to have that kind of successful problem-solving in the workplace. >> in a moment, i will do a segment about how donald trump accused the biden/harris administration of budgeting unemployment numbers, because the revisions came out and show there were fewer jobs created by about 800,000 in 2023, than expected. i just want you to give us the short version of this, the president has no role in those numbers whatsoever, and they are revised 100% of the time. as i like to say, it is not a baseball score. that is not how jobs work. >> this is the line donald trump has told so many times it

is boring and stale. the people who put these numbers out are professionals who are deeply dedicated to their job at the bureau of labor statistics. with this revision, which was a large revision compared to those we have seen, the largest since 2009, still, what it tells us is, they got the numbers monthly correct 99.5%, if donald trump spoke the truth 99.5% of the time, how different would this country be? >> that would be a different place. seth harris, former acting labor secretary in the obama administration. olivia jointly days after delivering a pointed speech at this year's democratic national convention. stay right where you are, because another hour of "velshi" begins now. good morning. saturday, august 24th. there

are 73 days left until election day and democrats are fired up after four celebratory days at their convention in chicago this week. this race is far from over. in a little over a month, kamala harris has money managed to close the gap with donald trump, but now that robert. kennedy junior has suspended his campaign, the dynamics could change. he endorsed donald trump yesterday and appeared with him in a rally in glendale, arizona, where the former president made a plea to kennedy supporters. >> we are leading now, but i think he will have a huge influence on this campaign. bobby and i will fight together , to defeat the corrupt, political establishment and return control of this country to the people, and all who supported bobby's campaign, i very simply ask you, join us in building this coalition. it is a beautiful quality coalition.

>> this is another example of how fluid this race is. the independents have been slipping in the polls for months, but he remained the top third party candidate in the race and had been receiving between 5 and 10% support from the national polls released this summer. that could be enough to move the election in september that is expected to be close. trump has lobbied hard to get kennedy to drop out of the race after it became apparent that he was pulling more votes from trump, rather than biden and harris. that is surprising, given that anti-vaxxed conspiracy theorist has morphed into a trump clone. the absurd claim that harris replacing biden at the top of the ticket was a cool. it is only fitting you should now jump in with the republicans , a party intolerant of views that darken trump's dark and fearsome view of america. that is a vision the democrats soundly rejected this week, where joy, hope, and freedom

were overriding themes. former president bill clinton were received just as warmly as elizabeth warren, the progressive senator from massachusetts, the former presidential candidate herself, received a warm ruckus from the audience as she took the stage thursday night and it nearly moved her to tears. throughout the week, democrats showed off their beach of future leaders from the first member of gen z elected to congress, to kentucky's andy beshear, one of the few democratic governors of a red state, to alexandria ocasio- cortez, remember a part of the squad, gave a speech is a part of the primetime lineup. the dnc even made room for current and former republicans who say, they no longer feel like they have got a place in the gop. oprah, technically a registered independent, gave a speech to

other registered independents and those undecided to not sit out this election. it was not just about who appeared on the stage in the chicago united center, it was all a package. that was probably best exemplified during the ceremonial rollcall tuesday night. typically, a state event which works showcases the democratic coalition across the country. this was a rousing success in terms of metrics that matter most to donald trump, tv ratings. 26 2 million viewers tuned into the final night of the dnc. more than the number that watched the rnc. more importantly, democrats used their convention to make clear, they are creating a big tent this year and practically anybody that does not subscribe to trumpism is ready to join coming into this tent. they are seeking a coalition that expands multiple generations that includes people from across the ideological spectrum who recognize that in this precarious moment of their policy disagreements are less important than defending democracy from an existential threat posed by donald trump. they hope that this broad coalition will be the key to victory in november. joining me now, olivia

troye, for your former senior advisor to mike pence. she spoke at the democratic national convention as a proud member of republicans for harris. great to see you. thank you for being with us. i have been going back and forth with folks about who republicans speaking at the convention influenced? i would like to ask you, a republican. who are you speaking to at that convention. when you are telling people, if you vote for kamala harris, does not make you a democrat, it makes you-- you are not putting democrats first, you are putting your country first. hootie you want to listen and we do you think changed their minds? >> when i took that stage, i had one goal, to speak from the heart and to talk to my fellow republicans, and to moderate center, independent voters who are still undecided in this election. i will tell you this, ali, i've

been getting a lot of messages from people, via my social media or linkedin contacting me from republicans who are saying, i watched you speak, i watched the others speak, i was shocked to see republicans speaking at the democratic national convention. what was it like? maybe you are right. maybe this one time we switched parties, because the party identity is real. i wanted to share that and say, those values that made me a republican, those are the same values that are leading me to vote and support kamala harris, because my values haven't changed. when i tell people, i did not leave the republican party, the republican party technically left me and became unrecognizable party that does not stand for traditional conservative values i grew up with. i know this is weird, i know this is hard and i know it is hard to leave the party for this moment, but we can all make a difference here and find

a better future forward for our country if we stand together against what maga and trumpism really is. >> i know it is hard to leave the party for this moment. there are people who grew up with conservative values, grew up as republicans. it might just be ideology, who knows? just have difficulty with the idea that i am going over to another side, the side in which i fought politically all these years. if the argument that, do this now, save the country and we will rebuild our department can party, or something that builds conservatives down the road that is a viable, healthy party. does that help with people who say, i am not becoming a democrat, i don't want to become a democrat, but i understand the problem in this moment? >> i think it does. we are not asking you to give up who you are or you are conservative values, but we are asking you for, is in this moment, stand up for your values so we can get back to figuring out how we fix the republican party, or a better path forward. the only way the

party really changes and becomes the functional, actual, political party that does will parties, and is bipartisan, comes to the table in a fair way, is to defeat donald trump, defeat this moment. now, this is a critical one, if we don't defeat donald trump, we will be back to where we were, where the trump administration was before, and back undermining our democracy once again, which he is doing right now, right, ali? he is laying the groundwork now saying, if he doesn't win, the election was stolen, and we already saw what happens when he does that like january 6. >> we have seen a lot, some of them like you, or a senior, whatever the given case is. what is that like for you? on one hand, you're getting probably a great deal of affirmation for being the hero you are, on the other hand, must be a lot of hate mail, tweets, stuff like that. >> it is very ugly. several of our how this got swatted this week. republicans for harris is a

very real thing. i just wanted to give you the human aspect of it. when i was on that stage, i was talking to the largest audience i have ever spoken to in my life, knowing it was on tv and live in that building. the support is tremendous, but the one thing in the back of my mind was my mom sitting at home, who is elderly, wondering if that is the night my house would be swatted, and if that was going to happen to her in that moment. i say that because, it is a very real thing we are all thinking about and all living together. i sat next to adam kessinger's wife, who actually worked on mike pence's staff with me. i got to know her very well, we work very closely together. we were talking about what it is to live through this, but how much it matters. >> it does matter. you are all very brave to do that and you have been showing bravery on the show a long time. olivia, thank you for what you have done.

thank you for being who you are. and for joining us this morning. olivia troye, former senior white house advisor for mike pence. donald trump up to his old tricks again, lying for sport. he is lying about newly released economic data from the labor department. we will set the record straight on that one. plus, the democratic national convention facing for not inviting any palestinian americans on stage. i will speak with ruwa romman about the speech she wanted to give at the democratic national convention. nal convention. for all-day freshness. frustrated by skin tags? dr. scholl's has the breakthrough you've been waiting for. now there's an easier-to-use at home skin tag remover, clinically proven to remove skin tags safely in as little as one treatment. what the biggest companies deliver

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one of the challenges of this moment is that we are at a time where donald trump lies so frequently, we try not to give credence to his claims by giving them a platform, but some of them are worth the booking, even if so you can quickly debunk them yourselves while in the company of those you know who believe them.

now, there is this new trump like, we feel is important to take done because it has got the potential to take down and purposely mislead voters. if you know someone who was buying it, this is for you. the labor department issued revised job growth numbers this week, showing our weaker job growth than previously reported for the 12 month period that ended in march. that is the period from april 2023 through march 2024. the revised job numbers are still preliminary. these are not the final numbers. they show the monthly surveys actually overstated job growth in america in 2023 by 818,000 jobs. these revisions are part of a routine, yearly process, where monthly job estimates are reconciled with actual state records from the unemployment officers offices. the last time jobs were revised by this much was in 2009 following a recession, when 824,000 jobs were overstated. to be clear, this is a normal

process, working correctly to give us the most accurate picture of job growth in this country. here is the lie that donald trump is spewing about this news on his social media platform, truth social. quote, massive scandal, the harris/bided administration has been caught fraudulently manipulating the jobs numbers to hide the room and they have inflicted on america. new data from the barrel of labor statistics show that the department of labor patted the numbers, with an estimated 118,000 jobs that do not exist and never did, all caps. the new numbers are worse than that. if conrad high kamala harris gets another four years, your life savings will be wiped out with a trump victory, we will once again have the greatest country in history. for tax 'sake, that is not how revisions work. nothing fraudulent, no one was

caught, there is no padding of the numbers. the u.s. president cannot mess with the numbers and none of this have anything to do with inflation, or your savings. the monthly jobs numbers are always 100% of the time revised later. in fact, it starts as early as the following month. that is just the nature of big economic measurements like gdp or job numbers. they are political calculations, not baseball scores where you know the final number at the end of the game. the initial figures are estimates, always revised either up or down later when more accurate data becomes available. they cannot become fiddled with by the president ever bite any circumstances. on the first friday of each month, the bureau of labor statistics, part of the department of labor, publishes a jobs report that includes the estimated total number of jobs added or lost in the united states. that monthly number is based on a survey. the labor department

conducts a survey of employers to come up with an estimated count of how may people receive a paycheck in each given month we get estimates based on the surveys, because that is the best way to gather data must write month. think about it, small businesses do not keep records in a way that estimates on a monthly basis. the hard numbers always take longer. that is why revisions happen later. once a year, with a years worth of labor from state offices becomes available, those numbers are reconciled with monthly surveys to create the revised numbers. the revised numbers we got this week, while not good news, are a part of a normal, yearly routine process that helps us get the most accurate data possible for me not some nefarious economic plot by democrats. certainly aren't evidence the monthly numbers were tampered with. donald trump knows that because this is how the process has always worked, just as he did in early 2019, when he was president, and the revised numbers came down by 500,000 jobs. there you go.

coming up, after lengthy discussions, the dnc declined to let a palestinian americans speak at this week's convention. one of the proposed speakers joins me with what she would have said, next. said, next.

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let's commit to each other, to electing vice president harris and defeating donald trump, who uses my identity as a palestinian as a slur. let's fight for the policies long- overdue from restoring access to abortions, to ensuring a living wage, to demanding an end to a reckless war and cease- fire in gaza. to those who doubt us, to the cynics and naysayers, i say, yes we can. yes we can be a democratic party that prioritizes funding our schools and hospitals, not for endless wars. that fights for an america that belongs to all of us, black , brown, and white, jews and

palestinians. all of us, like my grandfather, taught me together. [ applause ] that was ruwa romman, a palestinian american and democratic member of the georgia state house of representatives, giving a speech intended for the main stage of the dnc. instead, she gave the speech on a sidewalk outside the convention center. as an elected official of palestinian descent, ruwa romman was one name on a list of potential speakers the uncommitted movement submitted to the dnc in hopes of securing a speaker slot at the convention. she was not selected as a speaker, in fact, despite the dnc's very diverse, very big tent we have been plotting this morning, and longest of appearances, no palestinian american was given the chance to speak, nor a member of the movement, which actually had delegates at the coming movement. the uncommitted movement represents 700,000 people voted

uncommitted during the presidential primaries in the democratic primaries, by the way, in protest of president biden's continued support on israel's assault on gaza. the movement aims to support palestine to demand a cease- fire and the end to american armed shipments to israel. more than 100,000 of those uncommitted voters were in michigan, an ever critical swing state that went for donald trump in 2016 and biden narrowly in 2020. roman says, this speech was written in good faith and was a compromise. what she had the uncommitted movement wanted to meet at the dnc was a message of unity. ruwa romman said, as a palestinian, the last 327 days since october 7th have been deeply painful . >> in this pain, i've also witnessed something profound, a beautiful, multifaith, multiracial, multigenerational coalition rising from despair within our democratic party. for 320 days, we have stood

together, demanding to enforce our laws on friend and foe alike to reach a cease-fire come and the killing of palestinians, free all of the israeli and palestinian hostages, and begin the difficult work of building a path to collective peace and safety. that is why we are here. members of this democratic party, committed to equal rights and dignity for all. what we do here echoes around the world. >> the georgia state representative ruwa romman joins me now. representative romman, thank you for joining me today. before you deliver that speech outside, you added a note about what the speech was intended to do, and you are talking about the fact that you fully understand, as do, i don't know, i don't want to over represent people and commit on what they think, you certainly are of the belief that electing kamala harris is an imperative, but you wanted your message out there. tell me a little bit about that. >> yeah, so, first and foremost

thank you for having me. to be clear, i was not a delegate. i went to chicago for a panel with american institute and a couple of other events, and was supposed to actually, i think either thursday or wednesday. but i loved what uncommitted has been doing since december. what they have done is kept our community, that has been full of so much despair, engaged in the process and teaching them how to use these lovers to get the policy decisions they wanted. that is why i support them. that is why i have been working with them. we all wanted to come to a place of unity and a place of yes. we were into working good faith and we wanted to say, yes, we showed how people care about this and we told you this would be a problem in november, please listen to us and we are willing to accept even a symbolic gesture of a singular palestinian, does not matter who it is, a single palestinian, a couple of units on the stage and it would go

such a long way for our communities. >> you are somebody, you are a democrat, because i have gotten tweets from people saying, they were representatives because they are not democrats. you are a democrat. you were involved in getting people to come out and vote. you are an example of someone not deeply involved in american politics. he went to get involved, as i recall, the story was great about somebody misunderstood you to say you were running for office, published the story, all of a sudden, you're off to the races and now you are a state representative. you are not looking to rip down the democratic party. >> know. i have been an organizer for 10 years. i've only been an elected official for barely a term. the thing i care most about truly and sincerely is civic engagement. i want to teach average, everyday people they can have political influence. you don't have to be somebody who is fancy, or with a specific pedigree to be able to make

sure your voice is heard in our political system. frankly, the nihilism is allowing this awful, self fulfilling prophecy, and has more people disengage the worst policies we are seeing get. i've been passionate about that for 10 years and i've been doing this for 10 years. that is why i care so much about bridging this divide me because i do not want to keep losing people that keep losing so much faith and despair about everything happening, including our elections. >> and yet, when kamala harris sort of became the heir apparent, the nominee, she did say things that were not a departure from biden-harris policy, but they seemed to be empathetic toward the needs of those people who continue to suffer in gaza. tell me whether that offsets things at all. was there a sense among people in the uncommitted movement that kamala harris does hear and understand the complaint? >> yeah, so i was incredibly honored to get an opportunity to speak with her briefly when she came to atlanta. i relayed to her, our

community, as soon as they heard she would be a representative nominee, was cautiously optimistic. they appreciate how much more empathetic she had been in her speech, talking about the people, palestinians overall. it was incredibly powerful to be able to use that and say, we can do that hope a little bit. the problem is, people still needed some form of assurance that the bombs will stop that our mask slaughtering their family members. to be clear, the uncommitted had multiple asks. a speaker was one of those asked, but it was the bare minimum, symbolic one, and it was meant to continue that spark of hope we had seen. we are trying to not just keep it going, but grow it a bit. to be quite honest, i'm not sure where we go from here. there's a lot of anger and disappointment there was not a single palestinian speaker that got even a couple of minutes on that stage. frankly, personally for me, i am from georgia. i saw a republican from georgia on that stage was anti-choice, past an anti-trans bill, and i get the

importance of building a large head, i want to include as many people in our party, but when that comes at the expense of other people who have been in this party way longer and way more supportive, i don't know what to do with that. i really don't know how to work and bridge the gap that we have seen. so, you know, i don't even know where to go from here to be quite honest. >> personally, does it change what you do? i know you have been involved in trying to get people to make sure they are registering to vote and show up on october 5th, something many people have articulated, donald trump is a danger to everybody in this country on many levels. does it change your plan? >> i mean, to be clear, i am running for reelection. i have an opponent this year, we are working really hard. i launched a canvas before this to knock on doors. the reality is, things do not change on a federal level and while we can't win on issues at the ballot box, we can at least

make sure we don't lose and between elections, apply pressure and particularly down ballot. candidates like me who are state representatives are closer to your front door. my commitment to that has not changed. i recognize as we build infrastructure, we become a force to be reckoned with, a coalition that cannot be ignored, but it does require both short-term and long-term planning. in terms of what will happen with the harris campaign, i originally had a plan to look indoors after the convention. i even saved a little form to become a surrogate. i don't know if they want that endorsement. i really do not know sort of what is going to happen next. all i know is that right now, i need to take some time to make sure my community is okay, because understandably, they are upset. when i say my community, i'm not just talking about arabs and palestinians. the reason this woman is so profound, like i said in my

speech, it is a beautiful multifaith, multigenerational coalition that emerged on this, it is the base of our party. i was not supposed to be at the convention, but when i walked around, people were wearing these souls that said democrats for palestinian rights, they were wearing palestinian pins, little palestinian legs. the base was growing on this and for me personally, i'm not giving up on that. >> representative romman, grateful to you that, because that is what you are, elected state representative. thank you for being on the show. >> thanks for having me. coming up, republican mike lindell, the foam pillow salesman, went undercover at the dnc, winds up getting owned by a 12-year-old. in order to tell the tale, i will have to go a little incognito myself, and you will see what i mean in just a moment. moment. call 833.leaf.filter today, or visit leaffilter.com. power outages can be unpredictable, inconvenient,

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why i grew a mustache during the commercial break will become clear in just a moment. we are new with the props thing here. if you watch my show often, you know that mike lindell, the foam salesman, is a unique election denier, whose brand of politics is both to democracy and generally buffoonery. he also implores giuliani and bankrolled juliano's trip to the convention last month, the rnc. despite helping juliano attend

the dnc, he decided to be less forthcoming about his own attendance. for some odd reason, the foam pillow salesman, who normally has a crazy mustache, decided to don a mustache. what better way to be incognito than by announcing that days prior. >> i'm going to actually peter, the shaving my mother stage mustache, going into the dnc. [ laughter ] i am here with rudy giuliani and others. >> all right, nothing says secretive like revealing your plans and who you will be with ahead of time. evidently, the foam pillow salesman was unconvinced that looking like this was going to work. let's try something else. and having rudy giuliani next to him would fool anyone, so he decided to wear a hat and sunglasses. as you can imagine, the foam pillow salesman's disguise did not work. when he got to the dnc, spent time like

investigating unisex bathrooms and fencing. he took his connection to nihilism directly to the people and made a 12-year-old child. spoiler alert, he did not win, but it was all caught on camera. >> no, no. there was one georgian and three democrats. >> i am from georgia. >> a good friend of mine, she got zero votes. >> who is it? >> i'm not telling you her last name. >> where is the proof? you want me to take your word for it, right? so what is her last name? she is an elected official. >> let me tell you. if you see this in the news, maybe you're not up on it. >> all, i am. >> this just came out behind you. >> know your source is, trust me, bro? >> after that, the pillow salesman may need to take a nap on one of his own pillows.

coming up on the velshi banned book club, for suitors students at cutter high school, there is only one way to fit in, to be an athlete. for t.j. jones, refusing to join a sports team, despite his athleticism, was always a way to challenge power and high school norms, but the opportunity to join a new something forced him to force look at identity, belonging, and have someone understand you. that is the preface of today's feature, "whale talk" by chris crutcher, a must read for people of all ages, but especially for young men. that is straight ahead. ht ahea wait, there's an elevator? only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, ♪ ♪ liberty. ♪

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t.j. jones is a little of an outcast at cutter high school. he is adopted, one of the few multiracial students in that school. he has a quick temper, especially when it comes to defending one of his friends or anyone bullied by mike barber. there's one thing valued above all else at cutter school, and that is, for years, tj, a naturally gifted athlete, refused to participate in football or basketball, much to the coaching staff's frustration. an opportunity to lead a brand- new swim team has now changed his mind. quote, up until i started swimming in my grade school, half my teachers wanted me medicated, and the other half

wanted me in reform school. it helped me focus, beveled the edges on my boundless, uncontrolled energy, dulled my rage. end quote. after tj gathers a collection of swimmers who are outcast, cast aside students, students who had never been given a chance, students fighting for respect and dignity, it became clear that what they are doing is not chasing letterman's jackets or winning a few swim meets, they are building a community. the bus ride home from swim competitions became a safe haven, the only place for this group of young men to share who they really were. that is the premise of today's velshi banned book club feature, "whale talk", written by the award-winning author, chris crutcher. told by struggling protagonists t.j. jones. walz six joints plot lines. it is true, "whale talk" is a coming-of-age story that proves how unnecessary friendship is to developing who you are as an individual. written utilizing short, point high-energy sentences, "whale talk" is a study on balance. crutcher masterfully balances humor and pitch, perfect now like dialogue with topics

including abuse, suicide, bullying, elitism, and racism. these characters balance societal obligations with true identity, masculinity, vulnerability and working through their own experiences and trauma with supporting one another. no character is spared in "whale talk" and the results feel almost abruptly real , but not heavy and not overdone. it is clear from a careful and nuanced way "whale talk" is written, that crutcher respect the character he has created any fraudulent critical time of life that needed fixed on the pages of his book. despite an original publication date of well over 20 years ago, "whale talk" feels entirely fresh . the book has been targeted for ban in numerous states across the country because of its profane language, including racial slurs, and so-called adult themes. discussions around whether or not racial slurs should be included in novels assigned in classrooms is a conversation worth having, a valid conversation. the discussion revolving around

whether a book because of racial slurs should be removed from the library entirely should not. after the break, i will be joined with the author of "whale talk" chris crutcher . velshi banned book club begins right after this. .

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need one of those things to call the meeting to order. today, the velshi banned book club is now underway. i am joined by chris crutcher, the author of 15 works, including a autobiography, two collections of short stories and today's velshi banned book club feature, "well talk." welcome to the velshi banned book club. i want to talk about your protagonist, tj, his character is defined by having a remarkably strong moral compass, a few chapters into "whale talk", there's a scene where tj attempts to save a

baby deer from being shot by his classmates, by physically laying on the deer's body. for those of my viewers who have yet to read the book, tell us about who tj is. >> tj is one of my all-time favorite characters out of all of those books. he has gotten me banned in wonderful ways. he is a kid who was born, he is mixed race, part asian amma part white, part black, adopted at 2 years old. so, he has gone through the first few years of his life with his needs just not taken care of. i worked a number of years as a child and family specialist, working with a lot of teenagers and abusive adults. so much of what is in "whale talk" in particular , reflects what i saw in that time. i know him. i know him really well. i know him to be a kid who is just in his heart and

soul, mistrustful of being cared for. he has had the look that a whole lot of kids born like that don't have, those who have been born into incredible foster parents. >> in fact, you worked as a teacher in oakland, california for years, and you were a therapist as well, as you mentioned, specializing in child abuse and neglect. your uniquely positioned to talk about something that comes up with a lot of authors in the velshi banned book club, that is how critical literature like this is to young adults, because sometimes it is a mirror, sometimes it is a window . sometimes, it is these kids being seen for the first time in a book like you have written. >> yes. i have watched this segment every week and i know a lot of the people who have been on. i am echoing some of the things that they have said. what was so clear to me, i grew up in a town of 900 something people, almost all white. i probably

did not run into an african american human being until i was 11 or 12 years old, but i heard the n-word every day. and i went to a pretty white college in eastern washington. i was in oakland, california, one of the most diverse cities in the country. it was a steep learning curve. one of the things i realized, if i was going to make this alternative school work, because i became the director, i had to go to those kids and find out how i could teach them , because all the good stuff had been tried. i started changing my idea of what a hero is. i mean, i was watching survival skills. kids in situations would have crushed me growing up. then, i came back to spokane in the early 80s, and started working as a therapist. so, now i am hearing the adults and the kids who are just

embroiled in violence, just kids who are being thrown away, and the stories just started to come. you can't take a story out of a therapy session and put it in a book, unless you have a really good attorney and no ethics, but you hear one story, five stories, 50 stories, and the truth floats. and you throw those truths into the lives of your characters. like i say, i was starting to change my idea of a hero, because like i said, people were standing up, and included in some cases adults, were standing up under pressure that would have crushed me. so much of this story is real. the little girl, the 5 year old girl, who blurts out all of those racial epithets, those are names that she is called. and i watched a kid do that, show us with her play what her

life was like. she did not give us any specifics, but boy, you watched her a little bit, and you have no question in your mind what her life is like. and then, i would start going to schools. since 1983, when i was first band, i got almost 3 million air miles that i have been in every state in and i think 15 countries. i almost never, i will say this real quick, almost never do i have some kid come up to me and catch me alone, and tell me who they connect to in a book. >> that is the magic of the whole operation. let's talk about the language thing. i am of the belief that words, racial epithets taught in context, appropriate for the age range, certainly at university, make sense. we have people that we have members of our book club, people of color who object to

teaching of "to kill a mockingbird," or even some shakespeare stuff because of language. these to be bad for a library or a bookstore, but if you were writing this book today, is your view of using racial epithets the same? >> my view of using racial epithets is the same. i mean, and i still do it, and it causes me-- i read it back over and i think about it and i say, are you-- can you use this, can you make it real? and the answer is, i mean, the n-word is will be the ugliest word we have in our vocabulary, but you can't portray the kind of hate and bigotry that those people use without using that word. it is ugly. now, i would not use the word with two young

black guys talking to each other, i would not use that word, because that is beyond, i think that is beyond what is credible for me. you know, i am an old white guy. but i know the hate. and i know what it feels like. this little girl used to scrub her arm to get the color off, thinking that if she could get it off, her stepdad would love her. >> chris, thanks 1 million. >> you're welcome. >> thank you for this. what a great book. chris crutcher, author of a great book for the velshi banned book club called "whale talk". trip next day right where you are. the katie phang shall begins right now. and here is the week that was. >> george santos pleads guilty to felony fraud charges. >> i made the heart-wrenching decision to suspend my campaign and to support president