this is for palestine, gaza, this is for the child that is searching for renance, this is not just the world over. why do you think little boys are going stones at tanks and we'll never really know how many people are dead? they drop bombs on innocent girls while they sleep in their bed. israel is a terror state the terrorists that terrorize i'll testify my television televise i'm telling lies how many more resolutions have to be violated how many more children have to be annihilated this is not a war it is systematic genocide but whatever they try palestine will never die freak free palestine free palestine free palestine. hello, i'm

chris williamson and you're watching palestine declassified with the only weekly tv show that's dedicated to investigating and exposing the israely regime's global war against solidarity with the illegally occupied people of palestine. in this week's of show we'll be asking why the archbishop of canterbury seems to be in throll design extremists. the church of england used to be referred to as the british. conservative party at prayer, but justin welby's leadership of the church has gone even further. he's positioned it as an adjunct to the genocidal zionist regime. welby is effectively putting the church at the service of benjamin netanyahu, as latifer will explain in this report. the archbishop of canterbury, justin welby recently cancelled plans to meet lutheran pastor munder ishak from the illegally occupied west bank town of bethlehem. he reportedly said he could not

meet him if he shared a platform with the former labor leader jeremy corbin a pro-palestinian rally. ishaq, the pastor of the christmas evangelical lutheran church in bethlehem, in his christmas sermon said that if jesus christ was born today, it would have been under the rubble. recordings of this speech and nativity display were seen all of over the world on social and conventional media. is hark said, it's shameful. "it's not my type of christianity, not to be willing to meet another pastor because you do not want to explain why you met him. the archbishop is said to have been concerned about the alleged huge increase in anti-semitism since october in the uk, reportedly, fearing it would have caused huge problems for the jewish community if the two met. mention of corbin and the alleged rise of antisemitism are clues that welby is paroting zionist talking points. it comes as little surprised. to learn he is

involved with lobby group with close relationships with the zionist regime itself. he is president of the council of christians and jews, an organization set up in the 1940s. according to its own reports, the council takes people tours of occupied palestine to illegal israeli settlements and meeting with israeli government officials. the group has been asignist front since the 1980s, at least. it was then that veteran zionist activist sir. starnberg, who died in 2016, got involved. starenberg was also involved in creating the three faiths forum in 1997, in order to include muslims in interfaith dialogue. in reality, this was about penetrating muslim communities and turning them away from criticism of zionism. as the official biographer of the ccj and the co-founder of the three fais forum, reverend marcus baby brook candidly admitted. with the of growing importance of the muslim community.

the festering wounds in israel and palestine and the growth of extremism. muslim, jewish and christian dialogue has a special importance. today, the ccj also works with the united jewish israel appeal, which also involves itself in taking students on trips to illegal israeli settlements as a part of the racist so-called birthright program. the head of israel engagement at the ugia, robin moss, described the ccj as... caring out pioneering work. the director of the well be group was until recently elizabeth harris swazenko, worked for the israeli government funded abraham initiatives at the same time. the abraham initiatives claim to exist to increase synergy between uk and israeli bodies and agencies. justin welby is, in other word, deeply embedded in the promotion of the genocidal ideology of zionism. joining

me in the studio as usual is our resident expert david miller. david's an academic and a former professor at bristol university and is now a non-resident senior research fellow at the center of islam and global. affairs at istanbul zaham university. he's also a co-director of the lobbying watch dog spinwatch and is a leading british scholarly critic of israel. and i'm pleased to welcome back the reverend dr. stephen seiser again as our guest contributor today. who joins us via skype. stephen is a longstanding human rights campaigner and an outspoken supporter of the palestinian people. he's been targeted by the israel lobby who waged vicious and vicuperative campaign against him over many years. indeed the archbishop of cantery who's one of the subjects of today's show, even joined in the attacks with an entirely unwarranted and gratuitous statement about reverend cesar. stephen is member of various pro-palestinian groups and he's the founder and director of the peacemaker trust. he's also written several books including in the footsteps of jesus and the apostles, christian zionism road map to armgeddon and

zion's christian soldiers. welcome to the show. stephen, you wrote a phd thesis and indeed a book on christian zionism. i mean? i wonder whether you could explain what it is and why it existed before the creation of the jewish zianist movement. indeed, thank you for inviting me on the show. christian zionism as a movement preceded jewish zionist about at least 50 years. it was actually 1799 when napoleon became the first world ruler who promised the jews are homeland because he wanted um the jewish bankers for example to support. his campaign, his colonial experiments and and help him defeat the british. he was unable to do that, but his um failed attempt uh caught the attention of political and religious leaders in britain who between them began to speculate about

britain's role in in bringing the jews back to the land of palestine in fulfillment of prophecy and and and this... coincided with britain's strategic interest in controlling the bridge between its colonies and africa, asia and and so on. so it preceded jewish sianism and it underwrote jewish sionism. the early christian zionists, um, people like lord shaffsbery, and and others, william heshler and others, facilitated the early zionists like theodor hutzel to get hearing uh... among political and religious leaders right across europe, so in a sense um netanyahu was not wrong when he said recently um that um zionism would not have existed without christian zionists support yeah well

david, i mean the uh council of christians and jews appears to be mr. zianist supporting interfith organization doesn't it? well yes it is and we've of course uh obviously discussed her zionist role in into faith organizations, this is an organization that's been there since the 1940s, and as you saw in the the film there, one of the things that's interesting about it is that it was reinvigorated in the 1980s by guy called sir sigmund sternberg who is key zienist lobbyist, creator of number of different lobby groups and he also of course set up the the three faiths forum and the forum for the discussion of israel and palestine which we might talk. about more later, so this is aasionist lobby group, but it you poses is being an organization which brings together christians and jews to think about how they might have a cooperation etc, but of course the real agenda is to make sure uh that they push back against anti-zionism and criticism of israel, well steven, the the lutheran

pastor from bethlehem was responsible for that famous scene of jesus in the rubble at christmas last year, wasn't he? i wonder whether you could uh tell us about the christian churches in palestine and their relationship with the occupation, the christian churches have been in palestine from 2000 years ago, the early followers of jesus were jews and they welcomed in gentile believers and follows of jesus, so the church has been there um initially persecuted by the romans and by the jewish leaders, but then under constantine 325, the roman empire. gets converted to christianity nominally, and so you find churches in gaza, in jerusalem, bethlehem, all of the important sites associated with the life of jesus, um, trace their origins to to churches that have existed there for at least 15, 1600 years,

and they survived the um, the crusades and the the islamic rule as much as the ottoman. so they've been there a very long time, they are indigenous, they are palestinians and and they have had a strategic role in being a bridge between jews and muslims for centuries. yes, well david, the um the uh uh council for um christians and jews has been involved in setting up um other apparent zinanis fronts hasn't it, i mean like the what is it the the three faiths forum and the uh forum for discussion of israel and palestine? yes, so the three faith forums now called the faith and belief forum, it's we set up in order to bring muslims into the the inter faith conversation, but of course the the founder of as we saw in the film there. uh it's pretty clear that uh it was about tackling the growth of extremism, by which of course they mean muslim extremism, so it's

about tackling muslims being involved in criticizing israel and criticizing british foreign policy, that's perfectly clear what what is about, same with the forum for discussion of israel and palestine, it's there to have dialogue and mutual understanding by which of course it means a systematically undermining the idea that is racism, which of course as everybody now knows it is, so that that's the function of these organizations, he was also involved in a number of other uh z related organizations which is purely zionist organizations, so this is a series of organizations that were set up in order to undermine the possibility of criticism of israel, as of course with all cinist organizations. well stepen, mean what's your view on the on the council of christians and jews then? well really they are the council of christians for jews, you never hear them criticize israel, but they are um they... exists to monitor and criticize christians who advocate for justice

and peace for palestinians. it's ironic that even the board of deputies was anti-signus till the 1940s, but today along with the council of christians for jews and many other organizations which on the surface ostensibly claim they exist to further good relationships between jews and christians. in reality, as david has said, agenda is to be apologes for zionism and the expansion of uh israel's control of the palestinian territories. well david, mean amina referred to this character, sir sigmund sternberg in her report, didn't she? mean, just say a bit more about him, will you? so mean he he's one these characters who who performs a role in the british elite, jewish zienist uh... guy who's a kind of a policy entrepreneur and and kind of cultural entrepreneur and they they

create all these different organizations we've mentioned some of the the ones they've created of course already and and part of the this this agenda especially the inter faith agenda is not just about pursuing zionism is also about becoming part of the british establishment so for example the the faith and belief forum is funded by the british government by the british state as are many other into faith and prozionist organizations i think people would be surprised to hear that millions. millions of pounds over the last 10 or so years have gone to zionist organizations under the guise of doing counter extremism work or interfaith work or or trying to get people to get on more and of course of course what that means what that's code for is trying to undermine the role of muslims and indeed other pro- palestine campaigners in criticizing british foreign policy and being anti-war and of insisting on solidarity with the palestinians yes. and i guess sort of drawing veil over or or or creating excuse for you israeli oppression of

the palestinian people it seems well of course that i mean that's the the agenda, but what's i think what's most interesting about it is the role of the british state in directly contributing to science organizations which i think people wouldn't really understand if they didn't know no indeed well we'll come back to the discussion after second report that looks at the failure the anti-war movement and the palestine solidarity campaign to properly. scrutinize the impact of the zionist lobby in britain and america. the conduct of justin wellby is obviously explained best in terms of his connections to the zionist movement, but some key elements in the anti-war movement and the palestine solidarity movement want us to turn our attention away from the zionists currently committing the worst genocide since that of the nazis. instead, we should look at us imperialism or the british establishment. the result of this, whatever the intentions, will be demobilization, demoralization and

defeat. for these forces, the most important analytical tool for understanding palestine is not zionism, but imperialism. wellby, says kevin ovendon, in response to post on x by the rapper loki, is tory, a former oil industry executive, a right-winger in theology and politics. according to ovendon, i think... you're making a mistake by trying to advance these conjectures, wellby is a tool of the british establishment, not of tel aviv, and those are not the same things. wellby's motivations are read off from theoretical proposition that the tail does not wag the dog, if the evidence contradicts this, it becomes conjecture. in a very telling comment, ovendon even dismisses the evidence cited by loki as primitive, a substitution for analysis. analysis here takes on the magisterial garb of the civilized intellectual, looking down on the

uncooth, primitive evidence-based activist. this is done, let us be clear. on the basis of prior theory alone, and it will no longer do, but if theories are not open to empirical critique or refutation, their ability to understand the world declines precipitously, and what are the strategic implications of this theoreticism for the movement? presumably that we campaign against the conservative party and oil industry and imperialism, and we ignore the designist, certainly much of the leadership of stopped the war, uses the term zinanism now and again, but it has been actively discouraged by them, and they certainly don't analyze the dynamics of the zionist movement in the uk and the us, and its manifestly hugely damaging penetration of british and american political life, they prefer to see the power the israel lobby as a myth. yes, we must

intensify pressure on the us and the uk government, and useful research is being done on spy. flights, training of israel military, israeli arms firms and more, but in order to be effective, we also need to strike at the heart of the zionist movement, its supply lines, its financial and ideological support mechanisms, we need to cut off its life support given by the zionist movement and its agents, assets and front groups. this is why we need to talk about zionism, disrupt it now and move to a thorough process of designization, as soon as possible. david, there seems to be a marked reluctance in in sections of the left to use the z word (ie) zionism. i mean, what's that all about, do you think? well, if you recall uh, during the corebron leadership, there was a moment where john landsman, who was who was sort of seen

as an anti-zianist in the in the past at least, the leader of momentum of momentum, of course, he since of course joined the jlm, which makes him asign jewish labor. yeah, and he was saying we shouldn't use zionism, it's a complicated word, people don't understand it, it's used badly, it's means that you you sometimes trip over into anti-semitism by mistake, and and and that that's that was something that that that section of the left uh was promoting the idea that we shouldn't talk abonism, but you wouldn't really necessarily expect other sections of the left associated with stop the war or with the palestine solidarity campaign to do the same, but actually the they have the same position, actually you can mention z. "you shouldn't talk about it too much, you shouldn't certainly say that zionism has power or any significant power or or you shouldn't really even investigatesm directly as a subject of inquiry, and that's um common to many of the leaders of stop the war coming from revolutionary socialist background, not from the labor left, but from from much further to left, and so that that's a real problem on the left, instead what they do is they say,

oh, this is, this isted with imperialism, yes, and and and you say, how do you no, and they say, well, that that's that's ob'. that's the case, the tail doesn't like the dog, us imperialism is in charge, there cannot be any power for this, which is of any significance, turn your gays away, and of course that means that they don't have any analysis, there's no analysis of roll, and instead what they say is it's a myth and that's not good enough, yes, mean even the chakrabati shami chakrabati review that jeremy corbin set up talked about sort of avoiding that term, didn't it, that's right, well sham of course is is a bit of liberal, but these are people who are who are ava revolutionary socialists and come from revolutionary socialist tradition, nevertheless they themselves talk about talking a different person, yeah well, well steven, i wonder whether you could uh tell us about the british christian zinist group known as the christian friends of israel then? yes, cfi is one of number of christian organizations who believe that the bible

mandates, the return of the jews to the land, therefore the land is theres, jerusalem is the capital uh and temple it's going to be rebuilt and so they in a sense are part of the zionist, they are in fact part of the zionist lobby attempting to influence christians to support israel and and the zionius agenda, they have in a sense substituted jesus, israel for jesus, and because of their theological convictions, they actively lobby politicians, church leaders on behalf of israel, supporting the settlement program, the ali are returning jews to the land uh campaigning for the embassies to be moved to jerusalem, um, challenging attempts to... to introduce two state solution, demonizing the palestinians, they're really at the forefront along with bridges for peace, the international christian embassy, christians united for

israel, there are a coalition of christian organizations, which means that zionism today is primarily a christian heresy. nine out of 10 zionists are christians, they are naive, they are ignorant of what the bible actually says, um, but they are causing immense damage to... not only the indigenous church, but our about hopes for justice and peace and reconciliation in palestine. yeah, so david, i mean this this and reluctance to uh, discuss zionism, i mean, i mean, that leads to an avoidance, doesn't of looking at the at the activities of of zinis, i mean, i mean, you were talking your previous answer there this over concentration on - the crimes of imperialism, do you think that explains it, or is there something else going on? i think that's right, i mean, 'if you look at the um the analysis that that that comes out from from many people uh from the leadership of stock the war, it's always about saying look imperialisms the way you have to look and

they say you the the the main enemies at home and of course that's a brilliant uh dictim for uh for for for understanding what people in britain can do about things and yeah the main enemy is at home and of course that means our government and our government is complicit and we should be uh holding it to account but the'. "the other part of the enemy that's a home, which there's never mentioned is is of course sionism, the zionist movement is in this country, it's directly supporting uh genocide by sending funds to the idf and by promoting ideologically the the whole genocide, and and there's no discussion of that, of course, if if we are to defeat zionism and to defeat the genocide, we have to directly take on the zionists in addition to directly taking on the british government, and that's a real problem, i think for the left, for the for the strategy." of of the anti-walt, and it means that what happens is you get diluted and diluted into simply calling for a ceasefire rather than focusing on the real problem which we face, which is a which is

the the genocide. do you think it's a fear of being labeled an anticeemide? it is, but there's something deeper than that, i think and that and that is that actually that for the for the whole of the last 75 years really there's been significant zinest influence on the anti-racist movement, the anti-fascist movement and indeed the... war movement and about if you say what ooh i'm not sure we're that that's been the the influence which is which has meant that they take positions where they they start they start to worry going with that and that is a mistake and and we need to be exposing that mistake and moving past it yeah well um stepen i wonder whether you might say what you think about justin wellby's association with the council of christians and jews mean is a relevant issue do you think in this controversy it is and i'm deeply sadden by the archbishop's track record with with regard to israel and zionism. there was a time when he thought he had jewish roots that his father was jewish,

so um, perhaps that was part of the romantic notion at some how he was linked to the jewish people. um, the clearly the board of deputies and the chief rabbi have nurtured a close relationship with him and put pressure on him. um, the adoption of the hra definition of anti-semitism by the archbishops and bishops without any consultation at general sinod is clearly imposed on the church and and that's why we've seen a conflation between anti-sianism and anti-semitism and the dilution of of antisemitism which is racism and it must be opposed, but criticizing israel for racism and apartite is not anti-semitic. his track record. is is lamentable, you'll be well aware of his intervention a week before the last general election when he sided with the chief rabi condemming jeremy corbin, that was

conduct unbecoming, clergyman um should stay out of party politics, um every general election, local election, i used to urge my congregation to vote, but never told them what to vote, and never told them what i voted, but um, justin welby in that was appalling and then more recently is refused to meet with jeff halper from the israely committee against house demonitions clearly the wrong kind of jew and then he wouldn't meet with monther isaac the palestinian the wrong kind of christian he's clearly coming under lot of influence from designer lobby and he seems to be content with being part of that lobby he refuses to use the word apartite genocide ethnic and therefore he is complicit with the appalling events we've seen in gaza recently. yeah, it's a very sad

state of affairs for the most. senior uh churchman in the church of england, the established church to be taking the positions that he has, but thank you stephen, for your contributions, i'm afraid we are out of time again today, so let me thank the reverend dr. stephen seiser for joining us today, and of course our resident expert professor david miller. classified, we'll be back next week with more forensic investigations and analysis, and in the meantime, please share today's program on your social media platforms to help us continue. growing our audience and countering the disinformation turned out by the corporate media and remember you can follow the show on facebook, twitter and telegram where we post regular clips and updates, so until next time, this is chris williamson, saying bye for now.

sheikh talal abdurrahman shirim, a former prisoner in israeli regime prisons. dealing with the situation in palestine and talking to someone who understands and knows... the zionist regime very well. freedom is priceless and must. the palestinian detainee suffers two pains. the first pain when his house is rated by the occupations army. the second suffering that the prisoner will endure begins when he is placed in the army troops vehicle. we hope that the blood that was shed in gaza was not in vain and that they will achieve the freedom and preserve

the dignity. you press headlines, israeli forces once again kill godsons waiting for a trucks as regimes indiscriminated attacks claim more civilian lives across a blockaded territory. a un expert says israel launched a starvation campaign against palestinians in gaza by destroying the territory's food system, the islamic resistance in iraq targets israel's military barracks a rushpina airport in the north of occupied territories in support of gaza.