right, because a organization window or, and this would be devastating for the overall is earnings parking the size of the home western civilization and receiving innovation and keep trying to still exist need to support as well in women have your own space. i see. so the vision, you know, in the, in a decisive way. now, because this 5 is really feels and it's varying really high. there's some us to build a huge structure. defy these fears. now you started doing everything. come to now remember that from us view, all of this in capabilities, even though you want sites, we have schools in the hospitals and they're also holding their own people as human shields. and also the sealing the floor. and you'll see more know guys as you can see it on television, got them saying they're all the money i'm

a is stolen by from us. so instead of talking about is when i seem to want to be focused on constraints talking about from making sure that to you to open the board and let people out. so the mode of thinking is how that needs to be destroyed. even if it's at the expense of the goals and people, or how much needs to be discharged, it doesn't have to be at the expense. and it's not that expensive because some people end up a bunch analogy and i, and i can schedule a habit for so when this will only finish. and we'll see actually, how many tvs work jims, compared to the 40000. why is a from us? those will see compared to any of the big more one surgeon is where i will be the most more in the world. thank you so much for speaking to us today. i really appreciate your time and do with those,

but you did general m e a v, the director as well as defense on security for and appreciate your time. thank you . thank you very much and thank you for joining us today on nazi international. we thought was more at the top of the yeah. the the, [000:00:00;00] the, [000:00:00;00] the

hello and welcome to cross talk. we're all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle, the president of united states cause to real stir when speaking to congress, joe, by who brought up the possibility of american troops fighting russian troops. this is the state of the fail due crane project facing failure on all fronts. biden's only option is to expand the complex, really the cross option ukraine. i'm joined by my guess, scott ritter in delmark. steve is a former intelligence officer in the united nations weapons inspector, and in nashville. we have steve gill. he is an attorney and political commentator. hard gentleman, cross talk roads, and i think that means he can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciate it. let me go to you 1st. got um, zalinski the president of ukraine and a supplicant of the united states. and this affair here he's visiting, i guess, but as we're speaking now, joe biden,

what do you think that conversation is going to be about scott? hello, this is about joe barton using zalinski is a prob, um to try and put pressure on the republicans in congress to pass a supplemental. um, you know, a budget that includes money for ukraine, for israel, and a little bit of money for the southern border. he's going to make the case that it is the lensky, the president of this wonderful democracy called ukraine, and cannot survive without american assistance. american assistance that he joe biden promised american assistance that united states congress has regularly voted in favor of and the failure of the republicans to follow through on the obligations of the nation. it will represent a betrayal. so this is

a grand act of theater. 12 esteem, but the same question to you because i, i can't really, i surmise what exactly the united states is supposed to do, keep funding this money. obviously it looks like they, they, they've all, all been accepted failure, but they want to keep it going until the election. so it doesn't dog, isn't there a wait around biting shoulders, but that's a kind of a very cynical thing to do. so another $100000.00 ukranian troops will die because of jo biden's, political ambitions and ego. go ahead, steve. or like you said about, you know, 3 or $400000.00 for that. i just really feel sorry for zaleski is interpreter. could you imagine it tried to interpret the mumblings of joe biden, in some sort of incoherent sense? i, speaking of that, i can't understand him, but the problem is, he says he wanted to be a wartime president. that's what a strategist does that come up with is you can't be an economic president because by nomics is failing miserably. you can't be the border secure a present because that failed miserably. the energy presence. so now he's left to

try and become the wartime president, and he is devoted to getting america into a war. and, and i will say this, the american people are about set up. we've given you any money to you. great. i know they're more than set up with any, any boots on the ground. what do you great at this point or any point in the near foreseeable future? well, i'm speaking about troops here. scott biden's mentioned the possibility, quote, american troops fighting russian troops. now, that seems to me or go, he but he assumes that russia will attack nato if ukraine fails. why? that's a flawed logic here. it sounds like he wants that to happen to legitimize. he's failed to crane project. scott, i don't know if he wants to happen because 1st of all, if it happened, we would go nuclear immediately because un, nato and united states lack the military capability of prevailing in ground

combat, large scale ground combat against russia. but it's a, it's as you know, that is absolutely false. apprentice, russia, a has no intention of attacking nato attacking poland, attacking the politics. the russians historically have always had a defensive posture. they were compelled to act and ukraine because of years of nato expansion in efforts by the collective west, to turn ukraine into a weapon against russia. so russia acted, you know, preemptively, as a preemptive self defense was the, um, you know, the justification to blood report use on article 51 in the united nations charter. but the other thing is the russian military, while it's very successful on the battlefield today. um, you has limited capacity, limited capability. we learned this in the 1st phases of this conflict where they tried to do too much with too little 200000 troops. there's

a limit to what they can do. well, there's a limit to what 60700000 troops can do. meaning that they are capable of defeating the ukrainian military. they are capable of seizing additional territory if tasks with that job, but they're not capable for as they currently stand to occupy ukraine. let alone launch a massive military invasion of poland or the baltic. so joe biden has created a fantasy world that he has populated with fantasy figures. the good news is that this will never happen because as this is a joe said, i want to send american troops in the ukraine. this is joe said russia will attack poland. russia won't attack bone. so this is just politics as usual. yeah, steve, it's really interesting also in the same conversation in john kirby, not the smartest guy in the room. we know he's invoking article 5 as if you know, this is again something that the, you know, is a, is a trip wire,

a threat directed at russia that there is his article 5. i would be very, very cautious if i were john kirby or the president, the united states and his useless secretaries. they blinking is that article 5 is much more of a mythology than reality here. and i would advise them not to test it, because i don't think fortunate goal is good to go to war overbuild this. okay, and i think big the war and ukraine is actually proven that. go ahead, steve. but scott is exactly right. and the democrats and the volume estrace, even pages boogeyman of, of russia, and prove that if we don't stop them in john best, they'll roll across you. great. occupied grains invade sweden and finland in poland and adult dominated europe. militarily, like ukraine is the size of the texas occupying a country. that size is not going to be possible with the rest of the military's. it is particularly when you get into the other side of ukraine,

and you have folks that would be willing to fight for their home to have guerrilla warfare and the idea that they would be in bathing your western europe is just again, the book, the man that's and by the administration is trying to create so that that members of congress will look under their beds afraid they'll find to me when you, when you look at the capacity of the us, as scott mentioned, to engage in any kind of large scale round more. we've given most of our munitions to ukraine that have been lost or wasted, or we left to buy that afghanistan, or we've got the u. s. department of defense. we can't account for them. and yet you've got the secretary of defense. so in the congress, demanding more money into ukraine, say, if you don't give us money, we're going to send your sons and daughters and uncles and brothers to die, that kind of threat. i don't think it's gonna play well with members of congress. and again, i don't think it plays well with the american people. well, you know, it's got, you know, this whole sabre rattling about, you know, attacking a nato country and all that. you know, um, i know it's a lot of work for some people, but just look at the words that russian officials have said. that's actually go to

the very beginning. demilitarization and d knots vacation. that means destroying the ukrainian military that has been supported by nato. and regime change in to those conditions cover and really change scott, i know you're a 100 percent. correct. look, the, the thing here though is that there have been some voices and the russian media, you know, russia has some very, uh, uh, inflammatory um, tv shows where you have right now these come on and, and say things, they're not official policy makers. they're speaking their own opinion in you. so when you have people say we're gonna come see this through on the warsaw on the berlin. all that does is feed the, you know, the, the propaganda mills here and american allow people to say of the russians and tend to come to data. but the reality is, there's the russian government speech for russia. not sometimes well,

but i'm glad you brought it up. scott, everybody listening to everyone watching the program here? yes, russia has its own. sean hannity's. the surprise it does. it has it's jo, scholar burrows. are you surprised? ok. they did this. joe scarborough and todd henry represent the us government hardly. um they may want to appeal to elements of the government, but they don't represent it. and i'm glad scott brought that up. i see the same shows, same kind of hotheads and some of our very jingo istic. absolutely, they are okay, but it's part of the entertainment landscape unfortunately. steve, let me go back to you again. you know, we have um, um, nato, uh, defining russia as an enemy. since this conflict is started and much, much, much more, but unofficially, now it's official here. russia is going to react to that. i don't understand why people don't. if you called anatomy, you're going to react to it,

go ahead. see as well. and the fact that this, this was a conflict, it could have been completely avoid is had uh, uh, victoria new and uh, from the state department in boris jobs and not swooped in to keep the wednesday from striking a deal on the front end. and then you had your restroom, making it clear that the expansion of nato, to their border was, was intolerable. it was something that the us, the breed, not to do it yet, decade or so ago. and yet tamala, here as they are kind of, again working us into this conflict by announcing how yeah, we're going to expand that, you know, into ukraine. and the russians don't know. she's an idiot. the russians don't know . she's clueless. and they walked in the back. but then there every action since then has been underlining, we're going to expand, you really expand nato into is ukraine, which is again, a branch of the problem is that the us is made in the past. it that absolutely words don't really mean very much. and unfortunately, that's what the russians have learned from all this, the men's process and all that. it's got a k it a,

we both watch the media and the, the failed piece process that the us and the u. k. a torpedo in early parts of the conflict here. how often is that mentioned in the main stream media you and i talked about it in real time. i remember it in real time. okay. it's never got an airing on the main stream media. the public simply doesn't know that this conflict or 1st ball could have been avoided. second of all, it could have been shut down relatively quickly. scott, i know you're a 100 percent correct? because 1st of all, a to, to discuss what happened in march and april, requires people to re think the, the entire narrative. it's been portrayed in the west of an aggressive russia. she can territorial acquisition, seeking to destroy q. but when you look at the terms that russia had agreed to, they were extraordinary. really? mean it, it, almost some people say it almost was like russia lost in was conceding things to

ukraine. that's helped lenient scholars got. i, i remember at the time i remember at the time and, and probably was talking you about it. i, i said that would be defined as a strategic to feed it. it did it in retrospect, yes, but it shows how much rush i wanted to avoid. what's happening today have a little appetite brush i had at the time for war and believe me why she doesn't have an appetite for war today either. i'm sorry, no, it's got hold that thought gentlemen, i have to go to a hard break. and after that hard break will continue our discussion on ukraine space with our team

the, in the same rom, just don't you have to safe house and engagement because the trails when so many find themselves will support, we choose to look so common ground the the welcome back across stock were all things are considered. i'm peter will true mind you were discussing ukraine. the . okay, let me just go back to scott scott, it's the rumor mill. there's a lot of whispers going on, but you know more and more often you hear zalinski is no longer the guy. and of

course, has been in a more enormous amount of reporting and alternative media about the machinations going on in to if you have zelinski is immediate lieutenant's calling him delusional. that time magazine article, the economist article, those things don't happen by accident. ok. so there's a whole swirl going on around zalinski and, and then there were there his competitors in the military. they'd have more popularity than he does. after all, as you pointed out, you know, there are no elections going on right now. so we have basically the little m for as a landscape. what are your thoughts about the stability of the regime? well, 1st of all, we just have to be honest and noted zelinski is 100 percent. the construct of the collective west of the united states of great britain, of nato, of the european union. he is a tool, a tool of the west, but he serves

a task that is just to be the public face of ukraine that allows western governments to justify the flow of hundreds of billions of dollars of money and resources into ukraine. he is the propaganda element that we, the west put out there to say, this is the man, this is the face of ukraine, the face of freedom, the face of democracy, the man who was standing up to the evil russian autocracy. and as long as you know, they can sell zalinski that way. they can justify sending this money, but they can no longer is wednesday and he's well past is used by data. he doesn't serve that function anymore. and therefore, he's lost his utility not only in the west, but in ukraine because he's not an effective leader, is an artificial construct. and if he's not bringing in the money that fuels this corrupt regime and is corrupt nation and this in effective military,

if he's not bringing in the money, the pad, the bank accounts of these other corrupt ukrainian officials. what use does he have in the military is growing increasingly frustrating, frustrated about so let's get because of this insistence on cal, calling to the west to carry out counter offensive that never had a chance of success. always, we're going to sacrifice thousands, tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of ukrainian lives just to continue the money flowing. now, the spigot you bring turned off. the lensky i think, is on his final legs there. he can't last much longer. as the leader, we see a lot of with inside you crane and outside you crane to replace it. man i sadly, i think this of this trip to washington dc might be one of his last guests as president of your trade. yeah, yes. me think, you know, the sullens case like the perfect western liberal u. e. he, he,

he likes to support ideas that have no impact on him. personally. i'm sure there's a private jet all sealed up ready to take about and, you know, like gummy out of afghanistan. okay, but we're way ahead of ourselves, but that is one option here. you know, is this, steve, it's really interesting. is that one of the, there's been many, many different marketing attempts of this conflict in ukraine. the most recent one is corporate uh, welfare, the trickle down, you know, like 95 percent of the money comes back to arms manufacturers is if that's a good thing. okay. but they, they keep reinventing their marketing to keep this going on. and you know, i don't feel sorry for arms makers are they always have a boon when there's a conflict going on. they like wars, ok and, and, and biden likes to serve their interests. go ahead, steve, as well. and, and perhaps the most ridiculous assertion that be on the is just alone. it's going to get paid back. so yeah, like all the money that we loaned into europe after world war 2. but tim scott said

it even better when he claimed is that the business, the business alone is going to get paid back. it's not just to supplement the arms dealers and there's that money, as you pointed out, flows back to us with these the ridiculous assertions of why it's good for america just to promote a war in, in ukraine. the best way you can tell that you frame purse is last traction is you're not saying the ukraine pans worn on politicians and people around the country anymore. they've been replaced by these really flags and, and perhaps the best education of, of the wednesdays was power. i think it was time magazine versus the year last year . this year is taylor swift? that's how much things have shifted away from ukraine. and i really don't even know who that is. okay. but anyway, i'm, i'm sorry, i don't follow that stuff. i the academy awards me, i'm an interested in that kind of stuff. a scott is what is the plan now just live

support just to get through the election cycle. i think you hit the nail on the head there. this is not about the security of the west or the west is already adjusting to the inevitability of ukrainian defeat. you see, nato, you see the, you, you see the united states started to move things behind the scenes to prepare themselves for a russian victory. but politically biden can't concede that the 1st of all, he's looking for a scape goat netscape, god's going to be the republican party. oh yeah. he is going to, uh, you know, say, i did everything. i could, it was the republicans are denied the funding. therefore, the republicans are responsible for the defeat of your trade. now if the republicans happened to cough up the money, then what you're going to see is what we've already seen. well, it's ukrainians fault. we gave them every resource they needed, but their military, it wasn't good enough. they just, they didn't have what it takes, of anything to push the blame away from buying because we are in to the silly season we are less than a year away from

a presidential election. which means america has gone, bring dead. we're now only about politics and politics is all about shifting blame on to other people taking credit where you can and this is what bite is going to be doing with your craig. we've lost this war. ukraine is lost as war right now. it's about ensuring that the consequences of this defeat don't blow back on joe biden, politically, that he pushes as much of the blame for this ukrainian debacle on to other people. well, and i'll also to the scott and steve here we have to keep in mind. there was somebody responsible stay crafted road to a couple weeks into the conflict. the ukraine has already one very interesting title, because i would say then once a settlement and it will be defeat, then there's going to be the, the blame game in side of you. crane who took the money. where is the money? where is this guy?

it's going to be k arctic. very, very chaotic. c i, i'm and you've already had go ahead. you get a body, have senior officials get fired for corruption by the wednesday. first of all, it has various ministers and then talk folks in the defense ministry getting fired for corruption. they've taken the money, the us can account for the money, but you can't account for the money is as billions of dollars have been misplaced. do you? and i think the other, the other critical thing is that you can, i think, blame ukraine for this last because we were told about all the patriarch we're going to defend our country. and yet there are hundreds of thousands of young ukrainian manhood fled the country to avoid the draft that recognizing they'd rather go to jail afterwards, rather than go to the front lines and died now. and with all this patriotic push that we got the propaganda that, that ukraine is fighting for itself. why are they having to drag 16 year old boys out of malls? why they haven't put 7 year old man on the front minds? because the prey,

new people are wanting to fight for don bass and domestic and mary ogles, they, they don't see any reason to fight for it. why are we fighting for it? and again, i don't think americans want our kids to fight for places that don't even matter to the ukrainians. yes. got into the demographic crisis is horrific for ukraine. i mean, depending on who you asking ukrainians, who always have been notorious of a bad with their statistics here. but there are some estimates that the population of ukraine now is approximately half. it was when they got its independence, that it happens very rarely, very rarely. scott as well, what we're looking at is a, is a failed states. i mean, there are been many people in russia including blood and report and we have our tissue lated. ukraine is an artificial state of but what we're looking at right now is a failed state. uh, you know, you talked about, you know, the chaos that,

that will break out. and ukraine is people who are looking to blame that. but that assumes that there's going to be a, a ukrainian government that, um, a good point operates independently. and sorry, d notification means the end of the zalinski really means the end of the ukrainian or rather the power. but the means the end of the constitution as it's currently configured, it means the end of ukraine is, it's currently governed. there will be a new government in ukraine. there has to be and i believe this government will be hand picked by the russians. and so there won't be as much chaos as you think. i think there will be a lot of retribution. i think there will be a lot of accountability. but the bottom line is ukraine as it existed in 2014 will never exist again. and i think back, i had an interesting conversation with a senior russian official just last week. and he basically said that you crane as

a very limited window of opportunity right now to strike a deal that won't allow you trained to have the maximum territory and sovereignty that the longer this goes on that offer will be off the table. and you'll be looking at a completely different outcome then the one that could be offered today. but either way, you train a strategically defeated and the terms of ukraine future will be dictated by russia not by some sort of negotiation between ukraine in the west. yeah, and steve, you know, again, auto kind of work with me, right. go ahead and let me ask you got it. this guy does exactly right. that's what happens to ukraine going forward. what happens to russia going forward? i mean that the demon is ation to use in russia, in the west and in america. how do you have a great rest of the back to the table and say okay, all is, well, all is forgiven up, you know, sections are off there. they're going to be a buddy again, how do you move that machinery back into bringing russia into the world of nations? well, well, you know, scott mc my place i, i want to be kind all 3 of us,

but we will see that in our lifetime this is a generational breach that will not be mended for a very long time. those sanctions will not come to an end because the west nato land cannot accept that it was wrong. okay. because of their it with their, their virtuous russians. are they, they, uh they, they're the rule of law, the rules based or big. they can't change slightly. the only way, the only way to both the due date when it was almost out of time here, but i do have a way out for them. at least putting didn't make it to pair us. we won steve. that's exactly right. yeah. i was in the ukraine, and don bass area is asking and they all go for the elections. and here we keep hearing from again the, by the ministrations this occupied territories. look, i have better to interact a couple of times. scott is as been an actual occupied territories, don't ask him very helpful or not occupied. you're not to the rest of the soldiers on every corner of the lives from the beginning of this need to be dealt with. and

the media in the western got your for you and america have blood on their hands. well with, it's all because about an occupied washington. that's why we've gotten here, gentlemen, that's all the time we have a one. i think my gets in nashville and, and delmore, and of course i want to thank our viewers for watching us c r t. see you next time . remember crossed up the, [000:00:00;00]

the, the malware. but the old rules of will have been broken enough according to the un relief and works agency as it can funds to also use it this way. the polls is, have destroyed the un school in north dawn. so i think that is a 146 of its facilities have been demolished since school began. the 20 palestinians are killed and dozens more wounded,