the, the the harbor buddy. i'm rick sanchez. i've been doing news for 30 years and 2 languages all over the world. here in the us. i've interviewed for president's work that for the us is major television networks. i don't like what they do. see, i think new should be honest and direct and impactful, and this is direct impact. the i want to start by talking about history. you say history doesn't begin when we want it to. history begins when it begins ukraine, despite what my friends in the us corporate media report, for example, didn't become a story in just the last year. if i could probably happen closer to 20. 14 is

a just because you don't cover a story. doesn't mean it didn't happen. and so it is with this latest conflagration between israel and home us. now, don't get me wrong. there is no question that what her mazda did, and attacking israel and killing civilians, is on its face a barbaric act. something for which there is no place in civilized society, but that one act say those and follow the middle east conflict does not represent the totality of these railey palestinian relations. and without understanding the past. it's kind of impossible to truly assess or even criticize the here and now which is where we are here is palestinian ambassador to the united nations re um, i'm sure taking a shot at the media for that very thing whose duty for

some media and politicians started twin is riley's architect, a lot of people have endured one deadly after another. we came to the security council months of the month, warning over the consequences of his right helium community, an international match. now to be sure, israel is unimportant geopolitical ally for the united states for this country. it's also a country that both abundant advances in technology and science and business. very impressive. and if you're in, is wally jewish citizen and you live there, you'll enjoy the fruits of billions of dollars and usa given to a fully functioning democracy which rivals that of any country in the world.

however, if you're a palestinian living and gaza, or in the west bank, your life kind of sucks. a treatment of palestinians, according to human rights groups, is nothing short of awful. those human rights groups, right? as well as the united nations and reports that indicate the march of what israel does in gaza. and the west bank is illegal, their words, which is why they have been cited repeatedly for violating international law most pointedly. because palestinians live is they say occupied citizens. that's the word they use. and some of the you on reports, citizens are generally denied adequate access to water and food and fuel or even the freedom to travel. it is something some, if not most western reporters generally do not cover. it's not something you'll read in places like england or the united states media. the yet,

i ronald lee when russia during its incursion into ukraine, damage the flow of water and electricity in the key of western media headlines, waiting about it about how russia was denying those civilians essentials like their water, their food, their electricity, violating international law and how russia should be held to account for that. is it not fair then to ask the same question of israel. if the u. n is saying they're doing that? you tell me mentally, scholars call it a mile pick calculus one in which quote, israel is always the victim. but how did we get there? how do we get to this place? how does israel become so powerful and palestinian so weak? and how did the relationship become so dis, functional, and so dangerous comes down really?

historically, one word, deception and one country. the okay. the united kingdom. see, let me take it back after world war one. it was the british who essentially re drew the map of the middle east and did so by lying and cheating arrows. it was the arabs of the region who actually helped beat back the ottoman empire. and for doing so, the brits promise them as well as other countries that that land that includes historic power stein would be given to them, but they be able to live there and work it. but instead, something else up after the war world war one, the british broker promised and announced the balfour declaration establishing in palestine a national home for the jewish people. problem. the area was 90 percent era,

but the time none the less beginning. 1923 and lasting until about 1948. the british facilitated a mass, jewish immigration into that area exacerbated and eventually joined onto by the united states. see about the right thing to do for the jewish people of europe who had suffered historically from anti semitism. there is no denying that culminating in the mass killings the tortures and the displacement at the hands of the nazis. the palestinians were then led to ask this question. why us? why don't we have to give up our land? and soon afterward, they watched as their homes were confiscated by the british and turned over to jewish settlers. palestinians pushed back as best they could, with strikes and cods, some protests and peasant revolts. but the british wouldn't have it. they answered with curfews and mass arrest and demolition. and then they even said 30000 troops

in by 1947, the jewish population of the area that was originally just 10 percent had ballooned to 33 percent. but still that jewish population only owned 6 percent of alam. so once again in step the united nations with a resolution, it was a resolution $181.00 resolution $181.00. and what that resolution 181 called for was. busy as a partition of palestine into 2 states, one jewish and one there. but the jews got the majority of the land as well as the most coastal and fertile land. and then things got even worse for palestinians. they call it back by or the catastrophe. more than 70 percent of historic palestine had changed. hands as towns and villages were destroyed to make room for new jewish

settlers. and finally, all palestinians were left with was the west bank and the gaza strip. today. many of the descendants of those palestinians left are scattered throughout the country . is like loving on syria, jordan egypt, many of them living and squalid conditions in those countries as well. and finally, december 1948, the you and passed a resolution. it was resolution 194 resolution 194. that's a big one. it declared the palestinian refugees had the right to return to their ancestral homeland. imagine the un saying this and that sold every thing, right? i mean that's the, that's the biggie, right? that's the quinta essential call by the united nations right? wrong then work. see by then things have gotten so hostile,

neither side accepted the plan. egypt took over the administration of the gaza strip. jordan took over the administration of the west bank by 1964 palestinians began to run their own affairs with the establishment of the p l. o and their political party for pi. pensions just got worse. and in 671967 more. israel beat back a coalition of air of armies and they did so in only 6 days called 6 day war. feeling both threatened and confident is real, occupied the rest of historic palestine after that, including the gaza strip and the west bank and east jerusalem. and some of the things we see now happened as a result of that moment, really. and they brought in more jewish settlers who moved in most were foreigners . but they were immediately afford it all the rights and privileges of as rarely citizens, while palestinians argued that they were forced to live under military occupation.

in the 19 eighties and the 90s, out of palestinian anger was born. the intifada of the intifada, which an error means uprising and boy was it it brought about mass protests, riots, rock rolling strikes, regional boycotts. and it also led to the eventual formation of hamas. ah, yes, that's how we got to come us. this para military group responsible for the recent surprise attack on israel, the intifada years bloody as they were got the world's attention led to the oslo accords. the establishment of the palestinian authority granted palestinian self rule in the west bank and gaza. but a 951995 is real. started building electric fences. concrete walls splitting separating the palestinian territories into 2 distinct regions where people could not interact. rhodes were billed for jewish settlers to pass through, but palestinians were not allowed to use those roads. and eventually the

palestinians got even more angry. and they began fighting amongst themselves in a civil war between 5 pine moss that lasted several months. and in 2007, israel imposed the land and air and naval blockade of the gaza strip, accusing a mazda of terrorism. sounds familiar since then. israel has lodged for, for attracted military assaults on garza one and 2008. then in 2012 another in 20142021. and now this, this what we're seeing there now. but these pictures show and what is feared will become the most severe military assault of all. and by the time it's. busy a sudden done, it's to punish a moss for its most, according to israel. brazen attack to date. by the way,

with all that history and all that said, i'd like to continue this conversation. you probably have some thoughts yourself about this history that we just discussed. you can do it with me on twitter. in fact, by handled there is rick sanchez, tv. so i'll join you on x or twitter or whatever. it's called and i'll be looking for you there. but when we come back, we're going to be joined by 2 experts on the middle east pensions, and trust me there will be tension. this is a passion of debate. my guess have much to say, steve malls berg, and doctor norman finkelstein will respectfully, or at least as respectfully as possible, try to talk about this very passionate argument with their own perspectives. about this dire situation will be right back.

the russian states never as tight as i'm sort of the most sense community best most i'll send send up the keys 195 and speed. what else calls question about this? even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin media mission, the state on russia to day and split ortiz food, even our video agency, roughly all the band on youtube, the payment services question. did you say stephen twist, which is the, the, the,

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question of the money. i mean, you clear up, she was like, i do live most schools do. if you look on the initial, do 1 o'clock, significantly post on zillow, will it be almost getting used to put value or do you do origin? but you also as the was done, the newest frame on the belief systems to build a new do what i see these the buses, the little cute little dyson says this done both of the the and to talk about this, we're joined now by doctor norman the finkelstein, who is an american political scientist and active, is an expert on the error,

is really conflict. we're also joined by tv and radio personality, syndicated columnist and political commentator who has worked with me in the past. and you've seen us together sometimes agreeing and sometimes not agreeing. steve malls berg, the gentleman, i'd like to thank both of you for joining us. this is a, this is a heck of a thing that we're in right now. and one can't help but think. and i think we're making this point that it doesn't start with just what happened with him us. this has been taking place for some time now, dr. finkelstein, i'd like for you to start us on this discussion of how and when this thing got out of hand to the point wherever it is now being talked about in terms of a prelude to a potential world war 3. what, what, what does the genesis of this in your eyes, without, i mean being to descriptive of everything that's happened over the last 100 years,

where this thing really get away from us since 2006 when the election in the west bank and gaza, which almost won the selections were described by former us president jimmy carter, as quote, completely honest and fair. after the selections were held, is real. and then the united states and you european union slapped approval mark, stating on the other. no, i would like you listeners. these are the facts very closely. the overall population that consumers 70 percent of the refugees and the sundance house, and the children know got a lot of your listeners here closely. nobody with

rarest exception is allowed to go into gouter or is allowed to leave, does or according to matter. terry organizations, before october 7, half of the population of guy so was described as suffering from cindy or showed in security. let me stop you, is the professor i'm going to, i'm going to stop you there because i think that gets to in many ways. but the genesis of the problem, and that is you do have a people who are isolated and is that you have people who have been fine in the you're in a concentration camp for 20 years. so that is a strong word that, that, that is a strong word. so what, what, what, what the, and quality the, kimberly be i'm an engine stalled,

so you all are just the university who described god. so as quote, the largest concentration can ever and i have no, and i hold on, i have read those quotes, i understand them. i understand from once that feeling comes i want a good stephen here. so he has an opportunity to respond to the accusation. that essentially is real, is a pressing people and doing it on purpose and has been doing it for years and years now. how, how, what would be the response, steve, for, for that charge, which is not just being made by dr. finkelstein, we hear it all the time and the error world in scripture do, of course you do because the palestinians teach their kids to hate the jews to kill the june. that there is no way israel, and i'm not going back in history for that. i'm going to this year,

european union passed a resolution against the palestinian textbooks, which call for exactly what i said the us congress has taken that up this year as well. there's also in the palestinian authority, the moderates the good gods, but they pay for slaves. and the us congress has taken that up, they reward the families of the terrorist animals who go into israel and slaughter innocent civilian. but let's do the same. i'm not due to that but, but the that you don't want to hear. no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, don't please real repressing. no, no, no. okay, no, no. what you're saying is the arrows and pals, city and pages, and that's not a shot. no, no, no, no, no, i'm saying i'm the i'm telling you why. okay. reason why they teach their children this. yeah. on television shows in textbooks, what kind of civilization,

what other civilization does that, what other people do that? okay, world for the most part with the exception of b, u. n. america at times is silent. well, as actually, if you're not asking me that question, and i was going to answer at all, what dr. finkelstein answer it, but what kind of country does that actually the united states when it comes to a rom, russia, china, and that as well? but that's, that's another point that's not teaching children in school and on their sesame street. that's raising children to kill the jewel. okay. the media knew that shows that's a different story. okay. all right. i would argue it's not because essentially when you, every night on your newscasts, tell people that these countries are awful, that's all award start. and that's the reason the ridiculousness of a rock happened as well as afghanistan. but dr finkelstein,

i'd like for you to answer his legitimate charge that if your era or come from a palestinian community or any of these and cabinets in places like jordan, you really are being told to hate jews. that sort of undeniable, right? so i'm not going to address that right now. let me address the substance of his court. his comment, okay. i asked you now if you were hey, on, in to a concentration camp and you had no help whatsoever. seeing the light of the day except those 25 miles by far as miles, no hold of a job. no of a full stomach. no how old are realizing any of your poles and dreams. and then the, sorry that the,

sorry that every few years as are all the expert reading from is rarely 10 points most, i'm know, i've seen that know every few years is real. and it's so time language talks about, quote, mowing the lawn in god. so your order x word seems to believe that may need textbooks coincides the page is where least i got news for you, sir. my parents were in the concentration camps, did not need jewish textbooks to convince them to pay the germans. there was

no life i was really convinced the i'd like to i'd like to i'd like to pause for a moment and ask a question because it doesn't seem like in this moment as apoplectic as we all are discussing this from all sides. um, i can't help but not to go back to the history of this. and let me ask you this question. call me naive. is the way it was possible to go back in history and, and do or redo the way things were shaped during the battle for agreement. where we decided that this land would be essentially given to a people who were by the way, some of the most impressed people in the history of the world. not just due to the anti semitism that's always existed in europe, but what happened during world war 2 because of the nazis. we all understand that these are people who deserve to have a place and some dignity,

but in the process of giving them that place and that dignity another people say they lost their place and their dignity. steve, that is the u. m. and the brits to do this again, should they have done it differently? should there been a more accepting way of giving jews their place and their dignity without making the people who were there feel like they lost theirs? is that a fair question? i don't think anything. what a matter the jews were attacked from the 2nd, the whole concept of israel was attacked from the 2nd it was discussed. and i think the history that really is relevant, more relevant with all due respect to you. rick. of course. yeah. is, is, does a, i mean, 1st of all, you know, all this gives the land back. how many times have we heard over the course of many, many, many years, gave the land back to the palestinians. well, when israel fort moore's and told the sinai and the gods, or they took it from egypt, when they took jerusalem and they took the west bank,

they took it from jordan. and when they talk of course, the golan heights, they took it from syria. so when they say give it back to the palestinians and they didn't have it, when is real, talk it in these wars. so i guess the, our countries stolen from the palestinians. that's number one. yeah. why does not one country in the entire arab world not want to help their brothers and take them and spread them out? you don't want them in egypt, you don't want them in jordan, you don't want them in syria, you don't want them and savvy, right? what was a 1000000 tons, the right of that old body wants to help them, but why this is a difficult and i'll tell you what, let's. let's pause for a moment for a moment. thank you. turn on should be sentenced to make your point to make your point, but why we're going to the countries or the united states. warranty choose before

to not see how the cost maybe the jews were like the palestinians. they were so horrible. they were so vicious, they were so beast, joe, or if the current is really government calls them human animals, maybe that's why not of the european country. and the united states didn't work there. you're free. that's the reason. this is not easy. this is not easy, but we're going to have the gentleman in television just tomorrow before you've spoken. smart. won't change the fact that the very argument you was going to use or the you were the how much you buy it. and then use the gentleman in your argument was used by you were to just as far the experimentation of that use. nobody's my argument,

the student as the airable and so horrible your nazi speaking uh in those parts of argument. the funny, this has become very contentious. we're going to take a break. i want to back out of our doctor. i want to thank dr norman to go to i'm going about, as well as steve malls berg for this very passionate. and as you can see, very, very interesting discussion that we have at these times filled with lots of passion as we expected. so thank you so much gentlemen. before we go, i want to remind you of our mission, really it's well try and be silo. the world we've got to stop living in these boxes truths don't live in boxes, they live everywhere. i'm actually interest. i'll be looking for you again right here. but i hope to provide

a direct impact. the people vary in the environment. they grow up in some people gloating, very dizzy places and living very diseases, places other people live in areas that have less infectious diseases. and when you grow up in an area of high attraction, since each individual strategically go to the collector, this are conservative. 10 the

the ukranian shelling hate to a residential building in belgrade, the, in the south of russia. one person is killed and for injured. so africa takes legal action against israel at the u. n's international court of justice and they have. the keys is as well of violating the genocide convention during the war and gaza you and a q this is relevant, attacking a humanitarian, come void that are taking the root map del, like elevate the region faces a crisis of i'm thinking kibble, human suffering and pull on fads a russian to solve enter the