hello and welcome to cross the full doors here. we discussed some real in the patrick sanchez. i've been doing news now for 30 years and 2 languages all over the world. here in the united states have interviewed for presidents and i'm also working for the united states as major television networks. i'm not crazy about what they do. you see, i do think news should be impactful, but more importantly, it needs to be honest and direct. and this is direct impact the for, right, i want to start with something really cool. so there's this image that's part of american history. it's not our best image, but it's perhaps the most iconic visual of the war in vietnam. and, and it, and it's in the news again because of something that some politicians are trying to

push through, which i am going to eventually explain to you. but 1st, so let's talk about the image here. it is. that is what the end of the vietnam war looked like. a war that by the way, as you're looking at that image, a war that we lost. and that's important. i think it's important to admit that we lost that bore, you know, why 1st? because despite what defense contractors are politicians and the media who serve them, want us to believe it's the truth. and that's important. and 2nd, because that war was very on democratic, it wasn't a war that americans chose, in fact, it wasn't even a war that our elected officials chose. no, it was a war chosen by and for c, i a. so let's do this. now. let's go back to that image of the helicopter at the us embassy. and so i got, because i want to show you something there,

you see that see that image. what's happening in that image is that the via con, who us troops spent more than a decade battling or about to take over their country and us soldiers, their friends and their families were scurrying to get out of the country. get out of sight gone. but there's something about that image that you need to know about. like most things having to do with the war. i think the over whelming number of american people think that this was an air force helicopter on top of the u. s. embassy. it wasn't then does ended one of the most tragic and controversial chapters in us history and their america had been there every step of the way? no, it wasn't. it was an air america helicopter, and the man to the right is a c. i. a agent which is befitting because if there's such a thing is the beginning of the big state, it probably happened around the time of the vietnam more, you know, why?

because we now know that the bulk of that war and southeast asia was started and conducted by an intelligent community made of elected. busy should i say, audit elected officials, who had absolutely no accountability of the us congress, or even the u. s. military? so if you're asking, what is this error american thing you're talking about, rick sanchez? let me explain. this is fascinating. you're gonna love this. they were a secret air force made up of civilian pilots, recruited by the c i a who reported only to them because they owned c. i a did the entire operation. almost everybody at one time and other headphone special project mentions of some type or another where they were briefed and, and told him, maintain secrecy. and a lot of time, he really didn't even know what the project was. you were told to go to a certain place and accomplish a certain thing. and if you didn't have a need to know, he didn't ask any questions. but you know who was asking questions at the time. the

vietnamese, they were sick and tired of the french who had invaded them, occupied them, and seemed to want to tell them what type of government they should choose. the fall of the indian food brought an end to a century, a french colonial presents an indo china. essentially it became the end of the frontier and the beginning of an american here. and so when the french were finally beaten back and they gave up and surrendered, somebody else stepped up to once again and tell the vietnamese what to do and how to jews and run their government. and who do you think that was? if you guess, see, i would be right and they get it with the help of none other than air america who executed their heavy work from a secret mountain hideout and allows a country that borders vietnam in a huge air,

american c. i a complex this dirt strip quickly became one of the world's busiest airport. that place that you're looking at right there. that's a long chang. they are the see. i recruited and exploited a minority population of people who were called mon. and so they paid by the way and they outfitted and they trained to fight the north vietnamese, the united states. so all the mom is being able to act as surrogates in terms of not having to introduce american troops into the area. so the central intelligence agency gave the long training and modern arms. so error america, pilots, and other employees were said to be or pretended to be working for a private transportation company. but their transmission was pretty simple. beat back and destroy the new government of vietnam because c, i officials believed it was simply too cozy to friendly with china from the

beginning files, particularly those were involved in the covert operations side of the flying that were aware that they were at least working for the central intelligence agency, there was no attempt ever to disguise this at the secrets that was the ownership of the company. and there was only a handful, doesn't fit, perhaps out of several 100. that would know that the company was in fact, owned by the central intelligence agency, with practically nonexistent oversight. arrow america under the direction of the c . i did what i wanted to do when ever it wanted to do it. and they also seemed the answer directly to only one person who was also not an elected official. and happen to have the name, henry kissinger. and every night this information was coated and shut down to just mag in bangkok, back to washington and kissinger. yes. the vietnam war ended

in failure for the u. s. military. it brought about the death of almost $60000.00 us troops and disastrous consequences for many of the people to be at mom and cambodia. and especially for the la ocean monk who were almost wiped out, as even their children were recruited in force to fight. and what was by then a lost cause. towards the end, there were very few young man. we did our best to keep the 13 and 14 year olds out of the out of the line. but the they did show up and there was just the terrible and tragic loss of the young man in the nation. for all practical purposes, most of the generation among was destroyed. one would think that us politicians, members of the intelligence community,

the military by brass and others, would have learned something from the horrors and the failures that we all suffered as a country from the vietnam war. we did, in fact, that model that was ushered in with arrow america, the secret air force accountable to no one but the c i a continued operating even expanded similar emissions in parts of africa. iran, latin america. in fact, someone say that it became even more brazen with attempted political assassinations fomented clothes and secret or proxy armies. but finally, finally in 1976, one lone us senator stood up to the c. i a and said by stuff enough. and as a result, the us select committee, led by frank church, determine that what they were doing with just on democratic and it was wrong and it was cruel. and it's sense. so in a report detailing what they had done 6 link, 3 bits of information, they put up. now you want to stop, right?

you would have thought that that would have put an end to it. but did it? did it stop the so called deep state as it is often called the answer to that question, arrived in the 1980s the border between nicaragua and its neighbour honduras, where the contracts are based becomes a war. so the sandinista is declare a state of emergency and begin to remove peasants from villages in the area that includes the brutal relocation of the mosquito in use. that is one, many of the same error america. pilots who flew in vietnam were tied to another c. i a lead scandal which this time included elaborate arms deals with a ron and a drug running operation in central america that became known as the iran contra affair. american pilots law interesting projects all over the world. they flew and a half of the middle east. we had a lot of helicopter pilots around up and i ran right up until the shawl left in the

tow. it showed up. so there you have that is how many argue it all again, call it the state, colorado on democratic policies, or maybe it's just foreign policy, run a mark, whatever it is, whatever you want to call it. we can say that it likely began with something called air america, which is once again and then is why? well, let me explain their americans in the news because of something being called the arrow america act offered by none other than republican senator marker rubio, who wants to guarantee the retirement benefits of the especially milledge and official military recognition to those 1000 or so us citizens, there may be more to work for the company who worked the for air america. right. when we come back, we're going to be joined by none other than john kerry ok. now he works for the c i

. he wants to have a conversation about this, and i guarantee you, it's going to be a good one. the of the, in the year of 1954, the united states of america engaged in warfare against the people of vietnam. the

white house supported the corrupt but governments of southern vietnam. in 1965 americans began their invasion following the aim to defeat the forces of vietnamese patriots. the pentagon was confident that the victory would be on the american side, due to its military superiority. however, the vietnamese, during this war into total health for the occupants. unable to cope with a guerrillas, the american army started blanket bombing alongside using chemical weapons and naples, which burnt all alive. the village of my lay, where he 1969 american soldiers killed 504 civilians, including 210 children, became a tragic symbol of this war. all and all. during the whole period of this conflict, the usa dropped on vietnam more than $6000000.00 tons of bonds, which is due and

a half times as much as on germany during the 2nd world war. in 1973, the american army under the pressure of the rebels, withdrew from vietnam. and only 2 years later did the puppet regime inside on file . however, the vietnamese paid a high price for their freedom. more than 1000000 vietnamese people became the victims of american aggressors in the late 18 ninety's french soldiers led by general paul who like arrived in asia with the goal of expanding french control and west africa to the territory of more than shot. the sonia, i mean, he's stuck up some issues around the cars and just showing this to the tent, the food i on the east one of the most terrific campaigns of atrocities to have ever taken place in the history of the continent. or somebody. i know

the question, richard dental, hey i'm philosophy followed there to do so. they put the lecture on socrates multiple villages with devastated a numerous members of resistance groups with the headed home for us to get the movie class. and i moved to a young investigator in search of his own identity and box on the journey. so africa, the traces general good ice, blood drenched roots in an effort to establish how your legacy still echoes throughout the confidence. so my name is center and i come from england and i've come ready to find out more about the, the mission of lake and the history in the region the . all right, let's get through it before we run out of time. very is john kerry echo let's have

a conversation about this. yes. aspect store it is and, and the fact most people don't even know about this. i didn't know whatever america was. well, the see, i never even came out with an acknowledgment that error america was a part of the c i until well into the 19 ninety's, maybe after 2000. that's amazing. they just went around america picking out civilian pilots and they created a company that wasn't really a company. it was. busy run by that, that's right, and that's kind of how we got into the vietnam war before the soldiers got there. and you know, an interesting part of the story. what has come out just in the last couple of weeks as part of the story is that it wasn't just weapons and, and rockets and mortars and things like that. they were carrying water, buffalo and chicken, and drugs and drugs. and you know, this is how and i'm not saying no, i just, i've, i've read the, i've done my research on this and i've heard some of the pilots who said, look, it's unfair to say we're a drug running operate. yeah. but it's also unfair to refute the fact that we have

drugs as part of our car, and that was it. and that was it. and that's how we know this from, from convicted drug. uh. can you paint? yeah, in new york city, for example, who said that they got most of their drugs from southeast asia, thanks to air america. pilots who were moonlighting and then they did the same thing. remember the house and from the front. they did the same things in the uh like a rod. what else, salvador and home doors? that's right, right? that's right. that's the interesting thing about this is and this important question, cuz i've, i've got friends of mine who were in the military and we had an argument about this . the other day. i said, do these guys deserve a pension and do they deserve military recognition? and they were adamantly saying, absolutely not, i agree, you know, a contractor is not a soldier, that's it, that's it. these were, but there were more can to mercenaries, then they were to soldiers. everything they did was off the books and you asked a very good question. i know it was a rhetorical one, big left, a good question in your intro, and that is where it was the oversight. there was no oversight. these guys were

free to do literally anything they wanted. they were breaking the law every single day that they had those contracts. do you think it's the be the way i wrote this story? cuz the more i looked into it, the more fascinated i was, it seemed to me that this was the origins of what later became the div state or whatever we call today that the state, whatever they have about it, right. but that there's some, the various outfit out there often times the and the c i a has, it's a, it's technicals involved in that. me that makes decisions that don't go through congress, don't go through the president and somehow affect all of us any right. that's right . i think, i think you've hit the nail on the head and it's continued until today. you know, when there's no oversight, when there is no rule of law, when there's nobody to say, no, you can't do that. then that is a deep state. you don't just just this week we learned that and

a say rather than to go to court and to get a, a warrant, for example, is just going to i s p as in big tech companies in buying meta data on american citizens. it's the same thing, it's all an extension of this deep states that began with an organization like air mass. so you, you, you can uh, fill us in on how this thing can work. i understand there are things, the c i a must do because they are important and they must be done in such a way so that they don't become public. sure. is that fair? the way i just phrase has to look. and so i'm not saying everything has to be told right after they do it. however, if something reaches the point where people are dying and soldiers are being given, missions, bombing runs are being executed. um, i think somebody who is an elected official, at least, if not the entire population needs to know. absolutely right and listen, lowe's,

you talked about louse being the base of air america, allow us with a neutral country at the time. we pulled those poor people into a conflict that they didn't need to be. and we, we talked about 60000, almost 60000 americans being killed in vietnam, maybe as many as 2000000 vietnamese. what about the people of laos? yeah. their country is still completely up to the city. we built one check with an airport. that's what we used to do military operations, including the la la oceans, to attack the v at the me as well. i don't like the fact that the vietnamese chose communism. i don't what communism? sure. but if you want to choose communism in your an independent country, that's your damn business. that's it. i don't understand. i've never understood what i hear. he was there. all the comment is again, i don't. what kind of is it? that's like a huge too much walk right back. gonna kill him, you know, like so. so this whole idea that we had back then, which i think still sort of exist today is i don't like the form of government that

they've chosen. i don't like the guy that they elected. i don't like their prime minister, the damn business. i mean, you can change it, but you can't attack them. you're exactly right. you know, so many of us who have been in washington for a long time and have been in the circles for a long time. are now using the taliban as an example. everybody's a terrorist. now what does it tell us what the thing is? we can do, he can who, who are the tell up on they are the high spins and fathers and sons and brothers of ask and people, they didn't come down from the moon, from outer space and impose themselves on us. can they happen now to be the government and they're the governmental one to find a way to change them internally by not killing them. that's it. because when you killed them, you're just going to make more of them that i say, call me crazy. yes, no, you're 100 percent, correct. and that is exactly what our mistake was in southeast asia. the question that i raised, i think at the beginning, i don't know if you agree with this, but i've grown up. i'm a child of the vietnam war. i think you've sure to we all are who are over

a certain age we, when i watch the media cover, vietnam and iraq at a lot of our conflagrations, i get the sense they're afraid to admit what happened there. such a gloss over it, like it was like, you know, oh yeah. rock no, we evaded the country. we shouldn't even be vietnam barber as actions that we did there. and we should explain these things so we don't do them again. we don't do that now and rick, you know, i've said a number of times in interviews and i think it bears repeating. i remember sitting in on a secure video teleconference chaired by vice president dick cheney the day before we invaded iraq. and i remember one of the senior directors at the national security council saying, as soon as we cross that border, they're going to throw flowers at us. mm hm. and i went back to my office and i said to my boss, to these people know nothing about history. and the answer unfortunately is yes, they know nothing about history. we have learned since that many of our soldiers,

many of our diplomats, many of the c i, a guys that we had in those countries did not speak the language. and they did not understand the culture. and basically lived so far apart from the rest of the population, they never got a chance to understand what true rockies are instead of what they call them, rocky by rack. and yeah, by the way, it's not even pronounced that way. you more on like, you know, pardon me for saying that, but you're, you're right when we were so distant from something we should at least have some a kind of sense of cultural way. yeah. and we don't, we don't, and we don't make any effort to, you know, meet these wars happen all the time. i hate to say. but just, you know, in, in our adult lives we can, we can start with a grenade, for example. i was there and go all the way through the what we're doing now in, in the red sea, with uh, with the amenities and we never learn the lesson. we never learn languages, we never learn culture and we don't immerse ourselves in,

in the foreign cultures that we're supposed to be. you're studying. what's really cool about you is you're one of the few people and you know, you're a courageous guy because you are a whistle blower. you actually still have to say, no, we, we know guys, we can't do that and that's wrong. why isn't there more of that or is there and what's the culture like in that building? now there are more the best explanation is something that a new york times reporter told me. he told me 2 things. number one, he said, the day of my arrest, every one of the new york times national security sources went silent, and they stayed silent for 6 months. and 2nd was something that both a reporter and one of my attorneys told me, they said, this case isn't about you. this case is about frightening everybody else in the intelligence community to make sure that they keep their mouth shot. that's what it's about. it's gotta be tougher now for someone to want to be honest because of the technology though. yes. you know, in the old days i could like pick up the phone. i didn't think it would be tapped,

or i could just have somebody contact somebody and say, let's meet at a bar or restaurant. man, there's cameras everywhere. it's everywhere. yeah, it's every week just me and pop. it must be very difficult to be a truth teller and your phone contract. you even if the phone is off. yeah. so it's almost impossible you, you have to go light in order to prevent of having to light in the, in the 17th century, a group of british called lights were angry at the industrial revolution because they were new machines that were taking their jobs. so they went into the factories in the middle of the night and they destroyed all the machine. yeah. and, and they want to be like living and some little place in the pennsylvania or something. yeah, exactly. it's the only way to protect yourself, you know, during the watergate scandal or in the events leading up to the watergate scandal deep through the source, the, the ice or yes would only meet with a, with bob woodward in a parking garage. it was the only sunday last village,

flowers on the balconies and stuff. i don't question to you since you said the deep throat. let me give you another deep it is. so is there a deep state and how would you define it? oh yeah, there is a deep state, you don't have to call it a deep state, you can call it the state. you can call it the federal bureaucracy. but any group of powerful and elected people who know that they can out weight a president, powerful and elected people who know they could outweigh the present. that's a deep state. that's actually a good description of what i think is happening too often in this country. and it goes beyond trump and beyond democrats and beyond republicans and beyond bite. and then beyond titans and beyond obama. it's bigger than all of them. and it ain't good. it's not john, it's a pleasure to talk to you. a great life is all mine. thanks for the that's really, really good and you thanks so much for joining us today. you know, you hear it when you listen to john, his experiences,

what he's been to and it's so important to be able to get that perspective before i go, i do want to remind you of our mission here. and it's simple really, to the side of the world to have conversations like this. we tend to live in these little boxes where we think the truth flip proof don't live in boxes, troops everywhere, summer chapters and i'll be looking for you again, right here we have provide a direct him the,

the, the hello and welcome to cross the full board here we discussed some real in the loop operation, the initial issue and what is patient's eligibility of legislation within a younger civilian motor pulse. show me petition to the and chatting region of the bus on the hands of show and shootings on our to them. we have some sort of for one and i want to, there's only one that's good. i don't sweat actually show level patiently me know

to the most. if the use of that opinion, good, good. i'm here. so by no means the expect the smoke, but i'm gonna use the isn't boy more. but yet gramma and the bodies easy the way to somebody alone that's the money need be need. and then assuming anthony is from a key within the united states and then you know, wayne continues and just as long as that video for that or can you but the looks of junior, you're still showing the sort of the southern using the

a was a major issue a pretty junior sally by giving me a good condition initially little of finding a push at the goals and because of the issues simply whitley could see them get to the city because of the consortia, the cases i chose coast mcadams, that interest of the nation and you guys to pretty much come with the folks on the road and i'm leaving you a little bit early as far as the most important thing to the 1st one of the risk adjust it is the is this wasn't able to sell any successful wants to build some of the chairs are still good, i still don't know if i'm forward to for so or from the,

from my getting the business to these kinds of information or the tutoring is waging justifies the kinds of welfare is ways in information. more games is ation paid comes i made an order of high ranking methods, you solve it, but then funding, same cube in just going to quote me bridge. other asa involves as ukraine's to present to the mazda more money by his lesson. we paid for claiming them for the bottle filled gloves of cold blooded masses of glass. how proud of seeing officials of binding the can is more than 100 people off is ready to pull the open flat on crowds noon. a convoy from gauze.