is by the west. what the specific details were. all thanks. i don't think she would have said something like that. so what, what we're, what we're left with is the west people in washington, people in london, clearly knew something was afoot. and apparently they did not share the specifics with the russians. and so as this investigation goes, and i think uh your, your previous speaker, the professor is cool. that is the assuming investigation. it's established that the people who carry this out were enabled in any way facilitated in any way by the west. this is going to rouse, represent a dramatic escalation in this war because all ready, the west has been implicated. and what would amount to terrorist attacks in places like gold going on low to brussels. now, elijah, you're welcome onto the program. we've just had the presidential elections here at

plumber putting at winning on will be present for a 5th time. do you think the coincidence that this attack is happening immediately after that it's it's just too much of a coincidence. the timing of the shooting. elijah, if you can hear me. okay, we've got a connection issue there with the election like me. i am laurie. yeah, that points about the time, even though you'll do do, do you think just after the elections? it's just, it's too much of a coincidence. yeah. well, i don't believe in coincidence, cnn luck of that. what this kind of attack though illustrates and in, you know, the rush has been through it before, you know, met in october 2002, the attack at the do. and it was at the do but off the theater, the mos gale and there were over

a $170.00 people killed. and that incident which is carried out by then a chechen terrace. and then the 2 years later, the attack on the school and, and a slot that, you know, getting killed well over $400.00 plus kids. those, those kinds of terrorist attacks in rage, the country, they don't, that, you know, a lot of times these people carry these incidents out. think that this is going to weaken the political leadership create a politic crisis or a military crisis. instead, it has, it has the exact opposite effect. it, it actually drives rally support around the president, around the military leadership around the security services with demands to go after those responsible for this. so, you know, the united states and the united kingdom, they were actively involved with ukraine before the election, the planning,

those attached to the work it out. and they'll go to the, to the attempted invasion. and those were toward it. but again, i don't believe in coincidence, and we've had, we've had numerous reports over the years of active c, i a participation with these groups. now, there are investor and sources today being reported that washington and london are starting to distance themselves from ukraine, claiming that they reject that they accuse into ukrainians of doing crazy stuff that the west wants to have no part of. well, that's not good enough because when you're sending western weapons and providing western intelligence and western military advice, you're a facilitator of that crime, that's what we have going on here. thanks, laurie. we also, i think, can the speak to war zone corresponding veteran words. the one corresponding political analyst elijah, might be a in brussels. and your immediate reaction to the shooting, sir?

oh, well i think it is. uh the um, any period, 1st of all is roxy will. because when there is a company involved in it, possibly uh, its a full service. and there was groups as proxy. again, the opponent providing them with resources, a safe haven training them. because if that be a security focus and strain the resources of russia, in this case, because russia prioritize its military efforts on the front line with you to the resources devoted for security. that said, expose civilian more to that. it was said that it also creates a, a c, a m, on the civilians. because that is the job of the better is because the aim is to undermine the confidence and the government and the sub largest society. so there

was me frame that as far as why the role to attract media recruits and patches are and say, why this country really is no winning the war because it's domestic from east fred guy. and also the last point i would like to make a invite rock. so for example, to increase h to aggressiveness against, to the country that are involved in this war, can be behind the, not necessarily if they all neighbors as alice's or is that mean too hot or whatever. because these are the tools use enough guns done in syria, any new rock for the benefit, particularly of nature. so it is also a way for um, for the country involved in the mall with russia to show that they can strike in

the office most go. and the victory is not really complete. of the just staying with you. um, for a moment, elijah, the your, the ukrainian intelligent services they call the attack a deliberate provocation by quote, puts in special services essentially saying that this was targeted by russia itself, adding that the international community had warned russia. what do you think of, of that for diplomacy? and that's a normal behavior to divert the attention and to confuse more the investigation. because this is something that is vision. and the other was in iraq and the syria that was done. and the use of stairs is something that these they come in as the natal has used the stairs in many places, is still using them in syria to kind of out. it starts in different other places in iraq. and in i've gotten this done because it is important for them to show there

is a lot for stability for the great to come up already is not direct. what is not to a really expert in this kind of service to the front too that the americans are expert in conduct the now i'm not saying that the, these are the american behind it. but that is a, it's not really far from a direct response to the russian people who voted eh, as an astonishing, a percentage for that president said when you being putting your confidence in the president, what you should know because you don't have to stay the country and we showing how it is unstable today, but to get the action some way that is also profitable for what possibility is already em. just on what's unfolding, what's actually happening. we know that

a special forces reportedly entered at the building around 45 minutes ago. and shooting was heard at what we do not know about the fates of the actual attackers. and there are reports that some suspects could have flayed the scene because they were able to mix in with the sheer amount of people leaving the venue at the time. going into a sub way, etc. and is there a risk further attacks elsewhere in the city? do you think there's always that risk happening? you can't eliminate it all, but i think it is unlikely at this point that you'll see additional attacks this. when these happen in the list, it's a reaction, sometimes even an over reaction by security forces. if they apprehend any of the people responsible for this attack, the interrogations are going to be immediate head thorough. and once they identify

where they got their weapons, who provided support, who was peripherally connected, then you know, as the, the appropriate actions will be taken after that to. so i think this was again, this is sort of one of these short sighted acts of almost as motion as opposed to as really a thought out strategy. if you just, uh, i that i pulled up the document that there was report circulating today on a x. right. and formerly twitter, it's, it's, it's a, it's a clear western propaganda source called o. s i n t defender has always been very, very pro ukrainian. and he reports today that the us national security council in white house have reportedly become increasingly frustrated by quote, on authorized brazen actions taken by you create against russia. now i,

i think part of that is a us span to get out in front. i think they knew that this attack was coming. i think that is highly likely that this attack originated from elements connected to the s b. you particularly to the neo nazi groups, the ass off battalions. but we have to wait for the actual facts to come out from the investigation. so understood at thank you both for coming on the program a short notice as well. former c i. analysts on see you a burg associates, laurie johnson, and also veterans voice own correspondent on political, almost, elijah, my dear, thank you both gentlemen, i think is thank you, and then bye bye. okay, well, let's recap this situation. as it stands, media reports say there are no 130 casualties at the intelligence services. the f. s be here in russia. it say that 40 people are now confirmed dead in this mass

shooting attack in north west moscow. and we know that to, by the way, these are life pictures right now. i've just side side, the car park as and the special forces at keep a i over. and people going in a nice and that is one of the issues here. whether or whether or not there are still at people still shooters active inside or outside the building. well frontage all that the crocus, cities, visitors flying over a bridge up to the attack has emerged as well. we'll try and bring that to you. at least one explosion was reportedly heard in the building. the roof could be seen a place, a media report say it has begun to collapse. at least the 3rd of it is don. emergency services said that a 100 people had been cropped in the basement of the building at for round an hour after the shooting at they've not been evacuated. there may though we need to say

this. there may still be people trapped inside the whole capacity. this is a massive area of this site. we're talking about over $7000.00 at peak full capacity. the concert venue itself at look to have been very busy this friday evening at all. tickets we believe are at least most all of them were reportedly sold at the fire has been given top priority status by firefighters who are now inside the building, alongside police special forces. they had waited for a little while before going in and waiting for special services to get at their to okay. uh, let's take a look at some of the, uh, the reaction from people who have been there, who were in the actual building. when this terrorism attack took place,

yes it does, it doesn't mean it's made it what you're looking for. now i look to wear many empty seats. i was surprised, then there was a noise. i didn't realize what it was. then i'm looking people in the stalls and you know, i thought that there were some of these available caesar that i could move closer to the stage. a lot of that to go forward to them. and so people are running behind the stage. we look down in an ios that issue is that it's and then to where people are rushing in. then we lay down again in the seats that were left in the room about them and went, that's just uh, trying to get outside, but we hit the i'm supposed to use the name pass. and then this thing is somebody told us to go to the ground floor that's not usually an escalate to us. so we started running the shooting. this is especially it was scary. we didn't know what

to do with the so we kept running as a new as some of the people who directed us then we ended and you're going outside as we were running these. thankfully we didn't see any people down of the. okay. for more on the unfolding tragedy in the most of the music hallways across live to so that african speak to a journalist on political commentator. moved a bit with dba. ad would be about an up to the tragic day here in the, at russian capital. give us your sense of the offense and is it too early to say who could be behind the attack? so thank you very much for having me on the show and would like to send a heartfelt condolences to the people who question in charleston, deputy with the people of us. i look, as i said, the it's not a coincidence. i think such is says such incidents as,

as the series of text and they have a clue to this. you know, you kind of have an election a few days ago, visiting sheets and was hated by the risk is hated by was the media interest in forces with that election to lance that in majority, but 77 percent of people with less than people living at board voting for you to, you know, and then a few days later, there's a service that takes to get ahold of with the rushing people. i don't believe these are 4 incidents to this i takes, i think it's well planned by those people is wanted to see your actual, unstable. what is one to to see the russian people poor and disadvantage of what he was wanting to see. and here's an inveterate teaching. oh, do you know um, for example, you, you saw what america issuing a service that lets you know, why didn't they get that information to us? and i started to, to know you can come up with is going to be shooting next bill, but you're doing your knowledge in a but say the, but it's going to be something please sort out there. ms. pickett, you know, to show you that there was some form of involvement by wisdom pauses up to trying to stabilize the country to also try to send

a message to us. and people to be like, this is what happens when you both were presented, read or like, you know, um, so uh, this is for me, this is very tragic. um, and also it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's not a coincidence that such an attack has happened. and we're just being hearing some introductory reaction ladiva including from the white house, the view there being that it's a tragic incident, but ukraine or ukrainians were not at behind it. and incredibly fast analysis of the events taking place in moscow by the us. 2 look, if you kind of us, i started to think there's going to be a tourist that take at this place and then come out of the tech and say, what is drugs into your trade in? how did they do? you know, that means america themselves. no was behind tech because they knew that that was going to happen. and now what of a sudden they say don't you credit wasn't your fault if it's not them that they must know, come out, opened the as, as, as, as, as like those champions of the bulk of the and told the public and told the world

was involved with this i text because they knew they knew a lot of the 1st ones to go about this i take so they must come on and tell the public and take the public into confidence about who was behind this effect. and the investigation is that very much fresh, of course into this at mode a bit. but the, the not even the investigation, the actual events of how this is on the folding. we've got at people at possibly on the run the killers at us. this is on folding, your sense as a, as a non little list of events like this and do you, do you shop down the entire area? how, how does this work? look, i think move as, wait for the investigation to unfold. but you know, nogales interests as 3 weeks ago, i think a week ago for the royalties festival o, as in the show for the, for the advocate summit. last the i think for it in st. petersburg,

they receive countries, you know, looking at the whole country at night, have your goods, everything and nice type. we never felt any trouble is come, put any form of hatred towards us, or a new form of security through its universe as a very safe country. and um, so it's very open, right, isn't it? i, i'm here is that far hunter as well. you know, in this country on the, find it incredibly open on us. you say, walking around at night. there's no overt sense of a, of a security presence. but there's not, no change in the capital is this is, this is see change moment with so many people killed. but there has to be more of a lot going look i, i definitely agree because the point not, we're going to do the same thing that happens to libya. happened to teachers. so what we're going to see worse than forces coming to the country, to stabilize the country and then printing it with the president that the, this is your lead, you know, and then to put supplemented open uprising revolution against prison to team. you

know, so i think lesson for the, you know, um for my own um, my own personal experience is dealing with the russian police and, and then i do the very professional and that very quickly, especially intelligent to 0 creek. i think they will, they will get to the, to the bottom of this very quickly. but ultimately, the russian authorities should not take the site. they should the info that shouldn't be very aggressive and how they did that push the issue. and also that should protect the citizens, you know i, i just heard some, some worse than sort of thing that's um, well it might be rested in forces in i don't believe it was. would be the soonest. pickup date election. you know, we've seen made it, we've seen many presidents across the world to the old people when they do support, why do we so as they're actually in the us and i mean because it, in very repeating but more support this election, you know, so there's no need for us and for us to know, going to its own people because the russian people have voted in the overall

majority for the only you know, so it's kinda not what are you just saving, hosted by ukrainian intelligence that it can i just finally get dix you know, right here you've been in russia, you've talked to russians, whoever tarry this, i'd wanted to perpetrate absolute terror. do you think the russian people will be coward? will they be fearful after this, or is the russian soul? is it, is it too strong to be afraid? the thing, one thing of the, one thing i go about russian people is how disciplined. uh huh. is how precise though is how they spice to their own country. you know, they're not weak people, middle, so they, they, they, they, they don't um, for easily risdon trips to wisdom propaganda. i like middle of our own country. it's, you know, applicant countries, you know, i mean menu of, oh and if it can catch a fault, big some tourist then propaganda killing all you just look what happened in libya. you know, a forced narrative was advised by games, got duffy,

and re so live in people with some of them, no activity participating in the destruction of their own country. you know, so i don't think question people for the trip. you know, they've got a beautiful country, they know what's at stake. so it's a very difficult period for the russian people, you know, but the russian people are known for, which is a very and don't know if we're getting through hard times. so for the other thing, this would be an issue, i just finally finally do um the, the, at the condolences coming in from around the world do, there seems to be a hint. and of course the condolences are coming from the west. but there almost seems to be a hint of, well, you know, it was deserved in kind of way because of what's happening in ukraine. it's, it's dreadful that, that kind of thinking has to be perpetrated. it has to be at spoken to, isn't it that you can't just wish your condolences to the families of 40 people who were killed today with i had some kind of political statement and being altered

. i think it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it goes again. so i, the america speaks to a p as it goes against a large risk and forces, or to speak about democracy and freedom of speech and secure it's, but they don't test is what they preach, you know, should read. now come out of this, it will the school she things in america, i there, which is valid of what they've been doing in the house, you know, gotten to spend the libya in africa. you know, should we now say that text an was the people inside and that texted the bedroom suite over the years and fine side direct results of the abusing expectation. they've been doing it big enough also in the job, we kind of come up and say that because we have to, we have to ref, to show some form of humanity. you know, some of the drum is, you know, you kind of a nation come out and speak like that. it just shows the kind of level that the, with russia, i mean, worse than people missed some formal hatred towards russia. but finding enough, what else in the world, the festival we so american, you'd say, well,

we don't stand with the government, we stand with, with the russian people. and we understand what you agree to. i know a shot know of what is it the image that america's americans that are like russia, you know, but you come up into american youth, come out, you know, and, and you can print and come out and say, well, we know what's happening. we started with you to see a bit of an eye opener for me. you know, so as i said, advocates those with the west side of the coast ends with russia. and i don't know if we expect that the prison to, to will come to the bottom of this. we have city right. there is a difference reading the people on the elite says there usually is journalist on political commented on host of the inside factor show with the button with the about live from johannesburg. good to see you. thank you. under the circumstances, thank you very much. at terrible at okay, this is the situation we are looking at right now. that's fire. that place still at very much going in to the night sky. it's been spreading and at,

for the last number of hours, despite firefighters trying to put it, it's about a situation up. the croup is a city hall and city concert hall at right now at while we get information of what was happening, both inside and outside. there are just 5 minutes to 11 o clock. let's hear indeed what we're talking to a d b a bite from the white house, expressing it's condolences for victims of the attack, but also some interesting remarks within the up to we've all seen the reports in the video coming out of moscow is a violent shooting at a looks like a shopping mall. i can't speak much to the details of it. i mean, this was all just break. and before i came on out here, so we're trying to get more information, but really wouldn't prefer the russian authorities to,

to speak to it. of the images are just horrible. and just hard to watch in our thoughts obviously are going to be with the victims of this terrible, terrible shooting attack. and i think, you know, when you look at that video, if you haven't, you got to recognize that there's a moms and dads and brothers and sisters and sons and daughters that haven't gotten the news yet. and this is going to be a tough day. so our thoughts are with them. you might have also seen, hopefully is our state state department or embassy there. put out a notice to all americans in moscow to avoid any large gathering concerts, obviously, shopping malls, anything like that uh, just for their own safety. they should, they should stay put where they are and stay plugged into the state department for any additional updates and information. john kirby. okay, at some news lines coming in. uh, this is on verified. it comes in from a notable telegram channel, stating that

a suspect in the mall attack has been detained by law enforcement. so that's quite significant because we did not know whether they had escaped the building after their deadly run page 5 shooters at. we believe them at to be at this stage. so now we're hearing at least one suspect has been apprehended by law enforcement in that i would suspect north west moscow where this site what we're looking at right now at live from there. that's fire still, but it looks to have been polite, some want a lot of water being used behind the building. we know to try and put it as the roof have partially collapsed in on at the concert venue at ok. the russian foreign ministry spokeswoman has expressed outrage that the west is making fremont sure conclusions about the cranes non involvement. remember that is

what the wi fi said in the terrorist attack. the white house said it sees no signs that you crane or ukrainians are involved in the terrorist attack in moscow. on what basis? 2 officials in washington draw any conclusions about someone's innocence in the midst of a tragedy. if the united states has or had reliable data on this matter, then they must be immediately transferred to the russian side. and if there is no such data, then the white house has no right to issue condolences to anyone. all those involved, as stated by the russian leadership, will be identified by the competent authorities. okay, let's that cross live now to our to correspond and donal quarter who has made his way. there in the past hour or so at to the crocus city hall at dawn, can you give us a sense of what is happening? what's on folding? of the yeah. well, uh, as, as you said, unit, i'm right in front of the city hall where it looks like the fire has died down

a bit. but i mean, it was so massive that parts of the facade of the building came off. we uh now in terms of the casual casualty, statistics are looking at 40 people, if, if i'm not mistaken, you have 40 people killed in this terrorist attack and over 100 injured according to the governor of the, of the region. and we also got word according to reports, a d, dimitri pest. bob said the sports person of the kremlin that pollutant has been informed of the terrorist attack that has taken place here before we were closer to the area, but it's been completely closed off like the security. so big security forces there the, the military, the, especially the special forces have already started the building. we've got reports that one of the attackers has been taken into custody. as you can hear helicopters are still flying overhead. they're bringing huge buckets of water to drop from above to help fight the fire, help the firefighters and the emergency services that are still working hard to

make sure that everyone has been evacuated from the building of, of course evacuated. since i've already been underway and many people have been evacuated already earlier, the governor, the mayor of mos scouts have gotten and said that over 50 for gates of emergency services were deployed here to get the situation under control. that right now you take care of like, why is one of those helicopters i was talking about buckets of water sources even falling down on us. but i mean, this was a massive buyer that has taken place at this at the city hall. i mean that wherever the smoke was going into actually different parts of the, of the city, there was so much of it had this comes after, there were reports from eye witnesses that there were flows at this center. so this is a, you know, we've got these reports of at least 5 mast arms band and explosions, one of which,

according to the authorities, have been detained. and this is something that's obviously being investigated as a terrorist attack. after all, i mean, we just heard in the broadcast that russian officials already started the response to the st. strange coincidence that just about a week or a week and a half ago, the american embassy in the british embassy had set out a warning that a terrorist attack was going to take place here, warning, great britain and the united states. and of course, we haven't done the official confirmation really behind that this terrorist attack was the investigative committee. russian investigative committee is hard at work, trying to get to the bottom of the details. don't timeframe much for the updates from there, giving us that very latest. don't little quarter from just outside the crocus at city at whole concert or rena. okay. we have been getting i with.