[000:00:00;00] the, the push the binds key of the rest of the crating and security chief over allegedly, to the crocuses city, hold cetera. it's ok plus thing, you know, so upon the deadly crime in richard tag fucking 2022 is rarely pm. benjamin netanyahu says there will be no snuff collection as thousands of protesters got outside his residence and surrender haldeman in jerusalem. also, the issue is simply because lawmakers suggest a vertical solution to ending the war in gaza as washington approved another 2 and a half $1000000000.00 worth of weapons to israel plus

the people that reported killed and dozens more interested in the latest is very striking on a central jobs, a hospital with thousands of civilians have been shouting stock or was it headlines? it's a i'm must go time this monday morning. my name's peter scott, and i'll be fucked with the we played interest in the the action or sense you're welcome back to going underground bulk of single around the world from the you a, it's april fools day and i'll give the on the a full with his end a conference scheduled for today with us on basset to view and then to to him is green field and don't wonder how she felt un security council resolution to 7 to

a demo ending a garza seats. why was not binding all countries voted for it, except the usa that is funded, and i'm the genocide critical to the propaganda narrative to enable us u. k. u nation weapons transfer to israel had been raped claims and been headed babies. i mean, it's the october 7th resistance attacks by him. us joining me now again on going underground is this on the political survivors progressing. open finkelstein known all around the world, the scholarly work on the effects of zionism. his books include image in reality, all of the israel palestine conflict, the whole of course, the industry and gaza, an inquest into each month of them. he joins me now from you. thank you so much. progressive angle stuff going back on the show. it's been too too long, arguably, i mean, as, as goals or phases that from in your latest piece is about october. the 7th or an analysis of october,

the 7th by one of antonio gutierrez's officials. how important it has been the propaganda about october 7th, the the use of sexual violence and beheaded babies to allow the populations of the countries of germany, prominence, britain, the united states in arming the genocide as the sex of the what happened in october 7th, which remain murky and there are aspects which are fairly clear until there is an official investigation, which is the normal procedure, an international investigation which the one points to carry out, but which is what refuses to allow it to carry out. we won't have any kind of authoritative in this. the details on what happened. oh, some things to me are crystal clear or beyond dispute about 400 combatants were killed about 800 or more civilians were killed. i don't see. there's any point in

arguing that is uh from us and it's all organizations are committed now since trots of these atrocities and the update. i think it's silly to argue exactly how much of the, how many of those 800 and some odd of civilians killed. how many were killed by the milton suddenly were killed by and cross, sire, and so forth. we don't know the exact numbers that this guy that the, you know, they've got to be significant that were killed by how much. so i don't want to argue that i think it's stupid. i don't think because particularly important into debate i had. oh, you mentioned earlier before we came on there, the debate i had with them in mars? mars. i said, i can't tell you the numbers because i'm a stickler for figures. that's what i do in life. i'm a forensic scholar. i look for numbers or look for evidence and i'm as you give me a credible figure, i, i'm not going to give a number in the debate. my partner moreno, barney, you said

a clear majority were killed by home us. then the maurice wanted him to say over whelming majority, well, i don't know how you can discriminate between those 2 of uh, locations. clear majority versus overwhelming majority. if we don't know the numbers by the name of the fan that's progressive it's, i'm not, you know, given the scale all scaling multiples. since october 7 it's, it's the use of what we don't know is it wherever october 7th, to enable the genocide that i'm more interested in you called at the rates than to see the formula pad your are i'm going to get to the half moment. i sort of will establish what we know what we don't know. um, so uh i said that unless you give me forensic evidence digital evidence, i can't give you a figure. i wouldn't give a figure for anything without forensic or digital evidence because i'm

a forensic stop are one to see the concrete evidence. and i never thought it was important you know, in about see how the costs. so the official figure put off i o institution, 6000000 jews were killed, no ro, hilbert. the best scholar in the topic, he said 5100000. does it make a difference? do we really say, oh, who's only $5.00? millions, of course not. it's completely irrelevant from the point of view of the yellow judgment from the point of view of the style or factual judge. numbers come from the judgement. i said massive atrocities occur, and that's as far as i could go without forensic evidence. no. ready types of things that were how to immediately after october, 7th, for the claims of the headings and rates. those were the 2 talking points if you will, about october 7th, beyond, beyond the, the mastercard. so the be heading,

so it seems israel has dropped because if you look at the oral proceedings for the i c j on the genocide case, when they listed these readings and oral proceedings when they listed the atrocities occurred on october 7th, they did not include the headaches, i should just say your old squire in 5 years upon their island judgements of yale, apparently, uh, picked up by his rent benjamin netanyahu to defend israel at the well cool said on this program, people who i seem to be on rumble, that not only was it skepticism was as bad as denying the whole of course, but that he saw photographs of uh, headed headed babies, i think. yeah, well that may be what he looks at after hours at home and may have been from october 7th, so that's side up. and then with the questions of the rates. now, i will admit,

i was skeptical at the beginning about the rate the systematic rates claim. i won't go with my reason. they have more to do in my reason for me has more to do with if you will forgive me, have more to do with my understanding of the not just of muslim culture in general . they have a lot of your lives and friends. a lot of my students, i know them quite well and for reasons which i don't want to go into now because it 1st know i found a chart. i was skeptical of the charge except this movie, an isolated incidents here in isolated system there. and the whole controversy as you, as you know, unfolded about this right discharge. and the people who are very knowledgeable in the topic they were going back and forth. maybe the new york times story was fraudulent on the case. it was not just send you your cards, nobody was the guardian as my friend, judy stern minor, pointed out to me yesterday. it wasn't the only the new york times which was with that systematic rates or reuse,

also the british guardians. and right now the british car has to have low, they don't want to be reminded of what they did when the times posted that story. and then turn the upper middle of packed in paper and i read it. i'm always, as i said, i'm a forensic scholar, i'm curious about governance and it was a very strange thing. first of all, i call the say because it's all what it was. she says, i'm not an investigator. this is not an investigative body, but there she says, i'm analyzing evidence on verifying evidence and i'm reaching not just if you know, um, uh if you know, human rights supports. yeah, right supports are supposed to be preliminary tool, full fledged investigation. and so the why would you always use is

reasonable grounds to believe that's the maximum? typically a human rights report because we have reasonable grounds to believe this that and that, but they never make state anything more because they haven't carried out a full fledged legal investigation for mil up have she not only plays reasonable rounds to believe she also claim clear and convincing evidence that so much fire spencer. and so now i'm shaking my head. you said you're not even, you're not even an investigative body like human rights watch amnesty international or commissions mandated by the un human rights council. you say you're not even that, but you're not claiming that you have a higher standard of evidence. you claim you are clear and convincing evidence, i mean to she is, is blurry,

is actually your cameras going in and out of focus. but in all the decades you being a forensically analyzing statements out of the u. n. officials, have you ever seen anything like it in terms of where the top line at a press conference could just go out tool and use agency as, as there was raped? actually, there was one example, it was with the mob, the mormon rook. i asked even bobby munger incident. there was a big to do between turkey and israel because the vessels were, or the for my, remember about best for your listeners. that was the humanitarian con voice. that was going to die. so in may 2010 to break simple. okay. yeah, the break the block, a humanitarian goods. and there are 3 o clock the vessel and then killed 9 the later transfer. so you were killed, died from the attack, and

a secretary general donkey moved. it was trying to figure out a way to reckon to bring about conciliation between turkey as is real. and the a point to this absolutely disgraceful commission called the palmer commission, had on it the columbia and war criminal. what are you really big was on it? and they produced a completely ridiculous report. i am a lives in great detail and one of my books to point being when the secretary general up points a condition, a red light should go off your head. this is not a valid instigation. this is about politics. as good here as a point to this committee, it's not even a commission. i don't know what it is as a saw to united states and is real to show these being ballots because you will notice good terrorist suspect. it's

a pretty strong statement after october 7th. i was very surprised. i thought okay, this guy is going to be gone by christmas. it's the dry. when you mean gone, you don't mean like damage. sho. oh no, not that way. oh, but it was being pretty tall and i didn't think i, i didn't see how he would less. but now i see how we less you use the un surgery general. you suspect is the subject of a quick bro quote to allow him to continue talking about the genocide and caring anything about this i, i would say that it was a political move by the secretary general in order to show he was valid. but it was a very strange political move and you know, why here is the paradox. the paradox is the, the familial hacked and report ended up being the most

compelling evidence that there was widespread rate and sexual violence on october 7th. now you might be wondering how can that be all the media were saying, here's the post. we have to prove, we have a smoking going, the premier of a 1000 report. but what does the print bill of the copy reports show this enough carefully? number one, they were supplied overwhelmingly with the evidence sunday as well the government. so you conclude not just in for you can clue is one they, it's best case to that, correct? what was their, israel's best case? they look at not less than $5000.00 photographs and they looked at 50

full hours. oh, did you tow footage? okay. 54 hours. it's not a little. that would be if you at max they could have looked at it for 8 hours a day. that's i can see how beyond that, that's 6 full days that we're looking at his digital footage. they told us were passing, told us before they came from webcams, dash turns cctv. a traffic monitors which is to say the footage taken from every conceivable angle. okay. i'm on, i'm on providing. if i goes time, we'll just go to a break. now, more from one of the world's greatest really scroll is up to this break.

the look forward to talking to you all. that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, except we're so shorter is that conflict with the 1st law show alignment of the patient. we should be very careful about visual intelligence. the point obviously, is to create a trust rather than to the various jobs. i mean, with the artificial intelligence, we have somebody with the man, the robot most protects his phone, existence was alexis the, what is part of the,

the employee would post that isn't the defense you of us and bidding the word or is it something deeper, more complex might be present. good. let's stop without cases. let's go out of or the welcome back to going underground. i'm still here with professor goldman finkelstein or through the holocaust industry and got us an inquest into it tomorrow to do progressive finkelstein before i interrupted you were talking about this uh, well, effectively rape fantasy of the un official in the budget. the proving that the, the whole of a to approve again to meet you got it wrong about what happened on a very very exam and floated from every conceivable and go by

every cigarette consumable technological device. and you have to remember that area was a but to gossip, which means it must have been among the most heavily surveilled areas and go over this through. and here's the, here's the upshot, the character day. so i can never afford the claim for one single image or frame of sexual violence, no one. and this is israel's best case number to people is that it has yet sunk in because it was a complete shock to me when i was ready to get it because this is supposed to be the smoking gun clothing search for violence number to they said they couldn't find a single scrap of what they call medical legal evidence,

meaning forensic evidence on sexual violence, not a single strep. and then number 3, they said none of the victims had strep for, you know, the argument is because most of them are killed. the victims, that's the how the argument goes. that's not what the to happen. the board said, go look at it and then say, because there was an absence of direct victims. they gave the claim they gave way kinds of claim. number one, they said the people in that area have now been to why can be dispersed throughout israel? number 2, they claim that they, these people have been trust you when commission and number 3, they said they were to trauma tides. well, that's just not credible. how important, how important is it for uh, this oriental ism,

this arguable racism against palestinians to justify genocide in the continuing billions of dollars of weapons being sent to murder more palestinian. uh well, what does it 13000 a children, go into the home us link ministry, 30000, mostly women, and children killed. what, why, why have you written this piece about the rate fantasies of upper middle above them and why every other day you'll hear on mainstream the public and the media in nature of countries. sexual violence has the excuse. so i haven't looked at it myself, but other people have cited this us of this repair that was done by frank long since a very influential analyzer of public opinion in the us, the us. and what the study showed was,

were pertaining to the events of october 7. when he, when there was asked to list which kinds of evidence of most influenced you in your support of israel. they said number one was right. so it was from the point of view of public relations and galvanizing public support. it was known by them the proper gators of this claim that it was we can use the words, it was the most potent weapon in their propaganda arsenal. to propagate this claim. so that's to me, the tribes tyrant, reason why every time israel face is other p r crisis in new york times as

a new headline about the accusations of race and sexual violence on october 7th. well, let's move on then to this. suppose it, the more maybe is propaganda mainstream media of the paper. here netanyahu faces crisis and us relations of to picking public fights with bible. you went to school, i understand with chuck schumer, the highest ranking. that was, he was us 3 years ahead of me and my high school. oh, what did you make of either he's previously said in 2010 that the people of god must collectively be strangled. so you wouldn't take as much difference between chuck schumer and that you know, when it comes to supporting genocide. and yet, if you were to read the new york times or any of these cnn and bbc and sky news, you'd think there's this big split between blinking is being here in the middle

east. is this the manufactured given that the arms continue to be sent to to netanyahu or? or are they preparing something different had, once they've killed all the palest palestinians of gaza? well, let's be clear, said, said majority leader, chuck schumer likes to be senate majority leader. and election is coming up as president biden once the, when the election and the whole democratic party once the window election. and they have 2 problems. i should say they had their court between 2 conflicting forces. on the one hand, there is a jewish billy in their class and by the once their money he needs their money in

our country. the way you calculate the success of the campaign is how much money and cost campaign contributions comes in each week. they keep very close tracking that number as he needs the money. in general, i rotate every case in general. there's been good social scientific research on it . there's a direct correlation between which side gets the most money and campaign contributions and who wins the election. that's the way our system works. so he needs that money and that was the judge billionaire class has since october 7th. it's become utterly and totally roofless in its support of israel. there is no power low in american history. i'm not just talking about modern american history of outside individuals happily probably not one but 2

presidents of id the universities. they can. 7 be at the top of core being gay, and then they toppled mcgill and university of pennsylvania. they are worthless now . gary and mcgill, we're talking because they were insufficiently repressed, suppresses of this on their campuses. and why didn't those one false move? and they will just give their money to try and we'll just switch or so he has to keep sending the word. so what if they then ask him to go like a israel? i tried to get the united states and its allies to go to war in iraq of the 911. i mean, does that mean they could persuade them for an attack on their run? because it to the with that i know how to defend the i've studied that quite closely. that was

a decision made by rumsfeld cheney that was not in this valley. this isn't actually the as well. he's one of the last back them to go after a rat and not erect. so i don't think they play the good they could they do at this time. well, however, there is a critical point here. what you're saying, senator sure. robert, none of that is. were the only 2 democrats for the main senators, because they are ready to deal out of loyalty to israel. and now it's sure that se schumer who oppose be around the view and the same schumer who as you correctly quoted in 2006, 10, said we should economically strain, go die. so that's what he said. it's the same schumer who gave that speech, and that's why i've said there are 2 forces,

the court between the judge really in their class and the democratic party base. and there's a lot of turbulence, not to mention outrage in the democratic party base as the support of the, by the administration for the fact of support of dividing ministration for israel enabling you talk to supports. and natalie is really as so sure it was a very interesting speech. was very interesting. first of all, named for ops because the piece, one time us to the posted in a 33 that's in yahoo and for the for right israel, the balance you balanced the responsibility. very unusual. especially he's the guy who pose the around you use like way out in right field dollars. and then the

most interesting part of the speech was he didn't say supporting one state was at the semitic, as he actually said, if you read the speech, he said, i understand the idealism of young people to what one state and don't see what's wrong with one state, he then tried proceeds to try to rationally refute the demand for one state, but he did not dismiss it out of hand. okay. i'm sorry. progressive of we're just running out of time, but as you say, that's the 1st time i think one state is back on the agenda in the last 2 minutes. blink and of course has been in this region talking about the some sort appear. uh, it was previously mooted by and his rarely transport secretary could the u. s. military be involved in this region off the coast of gauze or with

a peer peer. so that's how this whole thing searches disgraceful public. right? you know, every precedent, right, you know, running for office of course are going to get gay g p r. but to encourage and p r, when children are starving to death in the most literal sense. everybody with an ounce, i ounce of knowledge. it's value. there is no need for a p are good hundreds of trucks outside garza which are waiting to enter. the problem is not material cop has to be. the problem is not even load. just fix the problem is exactly as the your foreign policy cheese said, well, as well as using starvation as what been let's

not please send us the new york times that says this is a no cool question of how to get the people, excuse me, the food and medicine to the people in gaza. this is not a nicole question. this is a political question. there is a see. impose on garza coast star population to the west, palm us cylinders. that's the problem. professor norman vehicles, 9. thank you. and that's for the show. i'll continue condolences it as bereaved by u. k. u. s. u. i'm bombing in palestine, lebanon, yum, and syria and iraq. we'll be back with the brand new episode on saturday, and you will then keep in touch my role as social media. if it's an odd sense of your country and have to have channel going on, the run tv on rumble,