[000:00:00;00] the the i'm action or times the welcome back to going undergrad, broadcasting all around the world, from the u. a. in a week of the 5th anniversary of the beginning of britain's torture and incarceration of julian assad's, we don't even need wiki likes to tell us that the us has lost its proxy war on russia through ukraine. even us deputy secretary of state. good campbell is acknowledgements because military success with nothing to stop the war of attrition . ukraine is down to using homemade drones to attack russia. and according to moscow, a key of hatched plan with the hunter binding link company to carry out launch is

most good conceptual atrocity. even the amazon washington post revolt, ukrainian presidency. lensky was abolished. elections is quickly running out of options. the international community. rather, the trading with russia is meanwhile, a gust of nature, nation military support for genocide in gaza in this region. former nato handle, this kind of jack bo was in ukraine after the us back crew that kicked off the war in europe. in 2014, he left the peace policy and doctrine division of the u. s. department of peacekeeping operations and is just published. operational acts of flowed the defeat of the vanquished and the russian off of war. how the west that ukraine to defeat the joins be from the home of nato headquarters, brussels in belgium, con, no, thank you so much for coming on. as i was saying, the international community, a more concerned with how they have a the nation economic sanctions when it comes to ukraine. if they're going to think about ukraine, because clearly, genocide and gaza is the big story internationally. but just take us back to what you saw off to the us back, who in cabin 2014 has a name to a worker,

someone who's on the nato payroll a. well, that's a special lead the matter even 5, because as you know, i'm a swiss cousin. switzerland doesn't belong to nato. and i was in nato in the framework of the partnership for peace. but i had a position as head of a small unit dedicated students, struggle against a prey for ration of support arms, and i in to in 2014 as natal, a suspect to that the don't bus rebuttal is received. what happens from the russia, from russia? i was in charge of money training and conflict, and in fact i had uh, 2 different i, i went to to ukraine under different hats. the 1st one was under the hat of this. a good start going to get. it's pretty for ration of someone on site. it just said i don't have to was that because i most

o u n experts on the rule of role and reform of security change institutions. and what happened in the, the, the 20142015 is that the ukranian army which was in charge of the repression of the, the rebellion, not just in the done best, but in the whole south of, of u. k. we have forgotten that after they abolition of the law on the language in the ukraine, the whole south of ukraine. in fact, i started big protests from what they saw to up to, to done yet, or what, but the costs are given. and therefore, they, the ukrainian army was involved. but the problem is that the ukraine army was composed both by ukrainian speakers and russian speakers and very soon, the ukraine, the russian speakers in the ukraine. now, i mean, just the effect of the rebels and that's, that's, that explains,

in fact why the red bows got so, so much, oh weapons. and so fast, because complete regiments and battalions from the ukraine unami just defective pseudo rabbits. and based on that, do you create a new government austin, a to, to assist in a kind of a restructuring of the armed forces and improve the goal? so or the mattress of it turned out displaying and all that. and i was involved in that, and therefore i had the opportunity to watch the, the conflict from within the ukraine at that stage. and what, what the, what a dot point, what, what surprised me was the difference. we good notice between what i could see in the field and what the western media are reported. and in fact, we have a, we had a totally different picture as the what, what was happening in, in ukraine, by the way, oh,

the protests that happened off the 23rd of february 2014. nobody talked about this in the west. uh, and, and in factories directed strongly, the whole security within ukraine and the whole relationship between ukraine and the, the, the, i mean, the, you're creating the funding t f and the difference of loss of, of, of, of ukraine. and you will have the dying crypto naziism, uh, in terms of uh, anti russian culture that was occurring even back. then, of course, we saw a much more under the lensky. as you know, the go in 2014 was in fact engineered by a very small full amount of individuals. that's where is each of those. in fact, those extreme right, we could try nationalist groups which some have named neo nazi, some well known as the older or the recipient. we tradition noticed,

but in any case this was a very small group. the, the majority of the, especially government forces you had a lot of people were just consecrating, fucking, there was a conscription army at the time. and a lot of individuals, in fact, were not so keen in supporting the government, because this was the, the new government that emerged from the euro. my done as you, as it became known i did, did this new govern trust has was not elected. and, and all the, this the, the russian part or direct. yes, the russian part of ukraine didn't accept the, the changes that were led to by this, this new got under the government. and in fact you had, when i was there in, uh, september 2014. that's the time when the rebels is declared to date your director because nobody to see. and in fact, you had popular republics, not just in the don't boss, but also, you know,

they saw it nipple with drugs. it had a son. you had popular republican that where in fact i created, well they, they didn't stay very long because the oppression was very hard. and because the ukraine army couldn't manage that because of the presence of russian speaking soldiers. that's the reason why the government started to recruit are military forces and those for me to free forces where in fact of connection i used to at the same guys who did the, the, the might on a price, i think in fact, mean the 2nd stage of that the uprising and those guys were sent to meet the repression in the south of the country and that became extremely violent. and at, uh, in fact, you had the, in the south, i mean, they saw that a saw a neighbor,

but drugs could this, you had really mess checkers. and, and kind of of, of the trade union building name is a, but just the, actually, the, to exactly do a quick jump to today. because i mean to your contention is that as a lensky is facing, if we just leave aside be 61000000000 dollar number that's being thrown around. they do a nation valuable propaganda media at that. so let's get in terms of getting the soldiers together. people in the south, as well as the still want to serve on people in the west of ukraine, even well, even around you wouldn't as of as it lensky led to the army for the next. what happened next to the us proxy has in school. well, in fact, what happens is that since last year, i mean especially off to the failure of the costs are offensive in $20.00 to $23.00 . what's you had is that you had a division within the of it forces. you had

a navy, you had the materials allusion, a who became a investigator in the, in the u. k. by the way. and you had the general serious, serious key who became the, were replaced in fact, that lose me as head of government forces. and between the 2 have a fundamental difference in the, in the approach of the defense of the country in general, is that those me, here's a little bit more russian, if you want a nice way of waging war, he's probably more interested in having more, more by the welfare and using operation art in the, in the, in the wait in defending it was sumo, by the operations was, this is on the same line as zalinski. and he holds to defend every single square inch of the country. and this is, this is where you'll have the, the big problem either into ukrainian army because the russians never strive to try

to get terry 3. the purpose of the, the, the russians in, in the intervening in, in your claim is basically to destroy the threats to the population on don't boss. that's exactly what led to get put in said the 24th of february 2022. and in fact, that's exactly what the russians are doing. so the russians are not trying to gain territory. they are just trying to destroy a potential. and therefore, the id of defending every square inch of the territory inside plays into the strategy of the, of the russians. because the russians, they just, they, they just destroyed but, and show these are the visuals. they the story equipment, the destroyed a weaponry, they destroyed everything. they don't, the don't needs to have be advanced and big arose on the map. this is not the, the idea, but just to hear his actions, you know, things and i ask, is

a russian spy? presumably, but then on the, on developments right now though, there have been a tax on is that for each or reactor in the past few days? the i yeah. so even that, to make us arrest statement saying that all of west and europe wasn't about to be destroyed by boys and this radioactive gas. presumably, i'm not sure what the he meant. but you know, you make the terrifying observation in your new booklet. these high mas, kamikaze drones from the united states, the britain stones from britain, and the firing is monitored by these native nations. does that mean that they know the targets like that for reason, the targets in elder, all the civilians, it'd been happening in the past few days. well that's, that's exactly what to this is that to my observation effects off shots the, the phil said that that's the, the rates and the french to where in fact, assisting ukrainians in targeting and, and, and making those uh,

the cruise me sizes, especially the sort of try those and the scholar for me, so i'm, besides which are in fact the same me so i but 20 to read this one, the french one. but in fact, the, the western western military is assisting in targeting a for the, those besides the russia to 5 and the responding given that we heard from boots in the if the nato troops and said you in ukraine they would be a response. we know that well from the leaks phone cool in germany that the british troops that i'm not sure we will talk about is illusion the what his role is. we have with the intelligent services in m, i 6 in london as russia, just too frightening, of attacking the source of those who are talking weapons of belgrade and in moscow i don't think so. i think you're a very small groups of individuals who are not talking about huge but timelines and things like that. you have just a few experts. so that's that, that's just the so it's probably,

i have no idea. i don't know if the russians know where those guys are and where they are able to do. in fact, the target them. but if, if they would, they would be able to do so the, the russian would certainly do so. in fact, in january or early february 5, you're not wrong. the, the russians targeted hot the, you know, how to cough, which was a full of, of french soldiers. and in fact, probably even personnel was sisters for the, the handling gun maintenance of the anterior across 3 sides. that's why delivered by france to ukraine. so in fact, the versus i looked afraid at all as soon as they was detect them, that will destroy them. so that's, that's what, that's for sure. now the issue of that footage, as you mentioned, the problem is that, okay, the kind of will have to get back to the nuclear reactor. i'll stop you. the more from the author of operational acts of flooded the defeat of the vanquished and the russian, not a war. how the westland ukraine's you to feed off to this break,

the

the, the, we'll get back to going, undergoing i'm still here with resides with. so let me go home and they to atlas jack bo kindle, i rudely interrupted at the end of one, as you were talking about, you know, what could be the, in the west in your a bug be this week? it could have happened this upper region, nuclear plant and the nato and weaponry that went to attack it in the past few days . well if frank, this is not the 1st time to recreate and try to, to attack this uh, this power plant. and the purpose of that is just to, to, to provoke, they do your opinions to intervene in the conflict. in fact, this has been a constant type of policy or strategy of the ukraine. and since the beginning of

the, of the war, in fact, trying to have a kind of a no fly zone or some kind of intervention from nato eden. ukraine. and, and now this is exactly what the repeating, what have done last year and the year before, the just trying to provoke the intervention of the, of the western armies. the idea would be to create some kind of, uh, a do me to try zone around the, the, around the power plant or something like that. that would, in fact, present a movement from the, from the ukraine side. that's the idea. and they, they have done that, as i said in the past, so they would probably try again this year, this year. i'm the, that's the, don't the study of and it's clear from, you know, lloyd austin, the boss of the pentagon. so it's cancer who, when they will from the pentagon, recently he was testifying, begging for money and congress this week. clear that it isn't even about ukraine.

he's honestly talking about how the $61000000000.00 is more about the rejuvenation of the weapons industry in the united states and the industrial base that is about anything to do with ukraine. why do you think the john, let's don't ask about if it really is so important for us security, boring the money into ukraine or weaponry into grain? the, the why is it, why are they outlawed us troops going to help the ukrainians as well? i think it has never been about to crane, and in fact, the 1st strategy regarding you created a new fact. let's try to get describes exactly what we have seen in the last 2 years. was written in 2019 by the rand corporation. that's outlined a strategy with 6 points. that's this, that's in fact all the time is exactly what we have seen last. so, and the purpose of the strategy was not to help you create it also to instrumental

eyes. ukraine. it was due to weaponized ukraine. if you want to, we can russia, and if it is less confirmed a few days ago by uh, by just the brand, the head of the, uh, the final phase of the european union. who said that this construct is not because we lot of ukraine it, it's because we want to support the us interest. so it's, it's amazing that even a very high ranking guffy show of the european union confessed that it was about, about just supporting us interest, by the way, in the rank operation, the report or strategy the night or 2019 that's it is explicitly right, right. the, that applying or implementing the strategy would close to ukraine. huge loss of territories, huge losses in personnel,

and will force ukraine in 2 of these advantages piece. so we knew from 2019 that's implementing the strategy would, would lead ukraine to look at that stuffy. now that again, the purpose of the whole thing was to we can rec shop. why do we can rush out? because at the, the, the, the, the, the, the, let's say, the center of gravity i would say of the us strategy is in fact china. and the problem is that they, they wanted to prevent russia to be a strong supports to china. and therefore, they had to weaken a russia these, even in the state department, there is an initiative. and you had asked in the last 2 years, 3 years, you had that these 7 in 7 international conferences about this. it's about the circle, the so a so called this, the cut on these i did go to nice inc, russia,

it's about dismantling russia and creating out of russia about between $18.32 countries based on the, the city of the different republics. and in fact, 22 completely dismantled russia as the state. and again, the, one of the conference they've been happened last year in processing the rest of the bottom and the bottom and building. so we have talking about something which is actually the offer schultz, which is on the website of the state department by the way. so, but it hasn't worked out very well. okay. because trying to rush or close it together. we don't match it. okay. i text you, i'll post it up and you mentioned the rand corporation people can watch on monday. we have a modem to help or a new road be rand documents that will leak by down ellsberg friend of the show, the late then those work that help stop the vietnam war last, only after a few 1000000 it'd been killed. why is it that when you talk about the rand corporation, clearly explaining what the ukraine proxy, what was all about?

it's in the public view, and yet the war is unstoppable. can we? but the fatality ration this ocean rates? why is it that when you quote that rand corporation and information on like the vietnam war, it doesn't stop this, this catastrophic war for the ukrainian people tomorrow. the williams tax to the even direct corporation has written several separate reports recently stay is saying that in fact, there is no point to continuing to explore. the problem is not, no, we are in a problem of a face, a face saving and both in united states and in europe and, and, and don't are understood under estimate europe. in fact, for many sanctions, for as an example of many sanctions, that's where applied to russia, where in fact, made by the, by the, by do your opinions against the advice of the americans. like, for instance,

the sanctions about the old pro, older products, or even of hosting a rush out from the swift system. this was a, it was advised by the americans not to do that, but the you pins decided to do it. so no we, we, we, we all know we in a, in a kind of, of a sparrow if you want. and nobody has the courage to stop it. and the we are and it is kind of of uh yes, it is a spiritual violence, not the violence, not yet, but a, do your parents are in fact engaging to that to listen to what the micro said. i mean, the ease, right, paid to sense troops and even if its own, but the nation is against that. you don't think that's gonna happen though, right. i don't see any, you don't think basketball. that's a i'm not sure it will happen. but you know, the problem is that it's so you rational, it's almost impossible to say whether it will or will not, not happen because we are no longer in a kind of rush. or if the,

the decision making in the west was, was the rational. we would have stopped that last year. in fact, you know, he's been here before clearly as the book makes clear how they completely misunderstand the proxy war and what rushes responses to the nature of nation policy. why is it the major powers are so convinced? maybe it's just western european ones that against the advice of washington that say the ministry defense and building in london or the of the count deposited in paris. what would be taken out by presenting this out from russia? because the united because russian and the russian federation needs to make a point and say, look, just cut it off. now we've had enough of this where i'm not sure exactly what, what to do until just continue for location. like, as you said, micro announcing the deployment of 2000 or is 1000 now french, foreign legion to ukraine in defiance of what to as the kremlin and the duma has been saying,

i why are they so convinced the rush will not respond to any of these nato countries and tests that so called optical 5 as well. optical size is circuit is, is property and excluded upfront from that equation. by the way, because if, if uh, friends, find some sense troops, it's not based on the natal treaty, but on, but under biological treaty, which in fact doesn't based on the washington treaty. so in fact and, and, and the americans have, have side, they would not send troops on the ground and probably they would try to avoid that, especially because they are in a presidential election year. and therefore it was, it was probably be not to be very wise to start a new war to engage the us actively in a war. and this started this period. so the, the, the americans don't want to do that. the, i think the,

the problem and the concern i have is that the, the recent didn't drawing toilets a communication between france and, and u. k, especially with david cameron, a trying to have kind of a joints type of activity in ukraine. you know, if in, in an effort to provoke the u. s. to intervene. that's, that's, is that what? because they could, that could lead to a situation where the americans had no choice but to intervene. and you do it the exactly what you know the bite and actually once this, uh 61000000000 to go through it would, it would help him because as defeat approach as well a to pounds, you can then say it was the republicans fault that we lost another war after i've got assigned to syria, libya, or of iraq, and uh, yeah, i'm, and then who knows what i, where else? i think biden would like to have those 61000000000 a for you. okay. first of all,

just emotionally, because i think this conflict for biden is, is just a question of emotion. there is no nice thing, nothing. brushing all into that. the problem comes probably from other parts, including within the state department because they're, they're all different opinions about this. and apparently even, even we, we didn't to the state department. so i mean, if you just would like to stop the whole thing because he doesn't bring it in. and by the way, even depending on apparently, would probably not to be unhappy if, if this would stop because everybody sees the discomfort is going up. so, you know where he's probably, it's just reinforcing russia. they just an additional embarrassment for the president in fact. but the problem is that again, well, i come back on this point. we are not witnessing a rational decision making in the west,

and especially certainly not at the level of biden. and even at a to michael and even camera are on the property. and we'll shut off on the allow you and, and also the so called new europe i, i'm talking about the baltic states and the boat and where you have people who are so enraged against russia, that in fact, whatever happens that would be happy as long as you times directions, and that's a, that's a, a, a kind of a desperate situation that we have, which is, in fact concerning because i come from the strategic asians background and my own working culture, if you won't, is that decision making should be rational and based on factor lanai says when, what's going on on the ground, but what we have seen there in the last 2 years in, in the ukraine, shows that in fact, no decision was really based on the factor of analysis on the ground weight. we

just as it was based on assumptions and even on a totally false narrative. i mean, a, wait, wait for 2 years. we, we kept saying that the russians were losing the war. they had no immunization done . no, thanks anymore. the poor commanders did. the soldiers didn't want to fight, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. and today we are exactly, and the opposite situation. well, just say that russia is about to attack the rest of europe as more weapons and the rest of europe as mo, besides the rest of you and so on and so forth. so we are in the total contradiction with all sense. and that in fact nothing that we have heard in denied the last 2 years was based on any evidence. it was just based on even assumptions, kind of will have to talk about the likes of the other book. uh hopefully when does this east wind garza uh soon, but uh kind of like both. thank you. thank you. thank you very much. thank you for

having the thank you and that's it for the show. continued condolences to those very by you k u. s. u, i'm plumbing in palestine 11 and m and syria and iraq. the new books operational acts up loud, the defeated the bank for sure, and the russian a lot of war, how the west that ukraine defeats arrived. now we'll be back on monday with the us official who worked for obama clinton nixon, johnson and kennedy administrations. until then keep in touch, why will i social media of its own sense of your country and drawing channel going on? they were on tv, hon dot com. don't you know that besides of going underground seem under the oh, when i was wrong?

just don't you have to safe house because after kids and engagement equals the trail, when so many find themselves boils, the parts we choose to look so common ground the the, the previous one says we will lose each kilogram and any sort of separate shift. so are you doing that experience for the rest hold on one of