plenty of nuclear power plants in the united kingdom, where we come from in france, in germany, and they need that own. it was a 0 to the power that i am power. i think the low save time look at africa, but as we now know, especially they'll probably put pressure on the french the that. but as, as, as we covered a lot on the program, the african nation is now turning around to say, no, we're not going to give you these cheap minimalism results from our country. the african countries are going to want more money for those resources. probably a lot more than what they're paying in russia, and that's going to make energy fall more expensive for the average consumer in the us. the, let's bring you some news now from germany because crowds of protests is attempted to storm with tests of $53.00, outside of the lane, hundreds of law enforcement officers would deploy into the scene, all this environmental tickets. now clashes with the police erupt, it pretty quickly and not resulted in several arrests, and also injuries on both sides. no enforcement, a push. the eco activates back from the facility with offices following him

precision across fields and forests. now water cannons before the sea and the area surrounding the test, the factory was blocked off in fee that the whites could ignite. protesters were opposed to the facts of the electric call. companies, expansion plans could top down an estimated 1000100 taxes street. that's all we have time for this hour. always a pleasure to have your company. don't worry though. rick sanchez is up next week. so right in the the

hello and welcome to cross ok. we're all things are considered. i'm peter lebeau. the 9th of may is a venerated day on the russian calendar in march the victory over fascism in europe in 1945. tragically the collective west just forgotten. the cross talking victory de, i'm joined by my guest, laudermill goldstein and providence. he is the chair of the department of slavic studies at brown university. in belgrade we have steven guides. he is a research associate at build rates, institute of european studies adding b on and we cross blue alexander markovich. he is head of the 2 vote off institute in vienna. all right, tell me costs are pros and effect. that means he can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciate vladimir, you were born in the soviet union. so i want to go down history lane since this is

actually a program about history, a very important history for millions and millions of people around the world, particularly in russia. what was victory day like when you were living in the soviet union as well? it was really, really, you know, joyful a holiday. you know, 1st of all there was a whole kind of glossed out of, you know, may, these may 1st may, 2nd may, may 9. so everybody was like, spring, everybody was so the breaking and you know, there was of course, sergeant beatrice sweet moments. my father was in the war and you know, they always, you know, when people get together there was, remember those google kiel that who, who will not bear with them. but still the mood was at the very 1st year, you know, no school. you're going to watch amazing parade and onto the 8 was, you know, you can see, you know, people marching. so it was just a lot of a lot of lives, a lot of call lots and lots of joy. you know, i, i don't know how many, you know,

rations really at that moment. so we had so you know, and started to use that whatever. but it was like, we all knew, it was like, you know, bones that this is a very on foot. it'd be that there's a new it in your boat and so you know, it that's come that's here again. and i'll talk about that later in the program here, because i want to talk about how the picture day is being read, defined and very good way in my opinion, saving, you know, in my introduction, the collective west is primarily overwhelmingly kind of forgotten this day. this victory day on may, 9th, why is that? okay. i mean, it is, they don't want to give credit to the soviet union slash russians and they have a fascism problem. now in the west though, there's a lot of different avenues we could discuss when we talk about the app it be in the west. i think of the george or little game. it was the answering his 1984. the

ministry of truth is creating are recreating the boss. so that is why, because of the currents of political issues or political agendas, they are a minuscule in the middle of the soviet union. they don't want to mention that almost 30000000 a soviet mostly russian citizens died, were killed or died liberating europe. and especially now that we have this a revival of naziism in the, in the west, in general. but especially on the european content. first, it started with the eastern europe, but then it spread. uh so uh, if the rumors are to the symbolism of the victory, the russian flags, the soviet flags wouldn't be bad in, in berlin for the 9th of may. but we'll see. anyways, uh that is

a is a issue that they have a problem with and also uh well when we talk about historical revisionism, it is germany that is not as k that came out with the resolution. the once the slander ser herbs and it was the germans who during world war 2 shots of thousands of. busy and i believe citizens, but also a screen children, especially in the, in the safety of crowd we have that's during world war 2. so uh now uh, with historical revisionism, his game to outrages levels as well. it's very interesting, alexander, when i was a young man. um, one of the most impressive documentary is i've ever seen up up until today was the world war was made um by the bbc and um, it was a brilliant, brilliant series. it primarily because it had witnesses, people that were actually witnessed the events making these kind of documentary

isn't that were very difficult because it get really, you don't have witnesses that it's essentially been washed away. it's not on youtube anymore. when it was a got, it had millions of hits, it was one of the but i, i believe one of the greatest documents was ever made. but there was a 2 episodes in that documentary series that was, i guess you would say today with sympathetic to the soviet union. that's for bowden today. alexander. well, yes, um. as i mentioned before, there's a certain political trends in the west which actually tries to diminish the soviet casualties. and um, also the soviet contribution to actually defeating fascism, the media and just story all christie. and therefore of course, for example, if you look at the change of the official narrative from the west, if you could somehow get the impression that it was actually not the soviet union

fighting against hitler and the nazis. and while the 2 spots that there were some kind of ally of national socialism and fascism. yeah. instead it was just because of the united states of great britain, that fascist and was defeated, which is of course totally wrong. but since you don't all have this western um, war of aggression against russia and um, in this overall war, so ukraine of cause you're trying to keep an ice russia as much as possible. and um, this means also um, altering the history itself like um that before the ministry of price is alive and well again, it seems and staff for you have this strange kind off. um yeah, history policy um going on? no. the only drum any way or no, uh, no longer locks to show. so if you have the flex on the um associates,

they are for 3, but uh where the drum and media, for example, also try to portray um, letting me put in as the 2nd the other fiddler. um yeah, us back in an hour or it's all a while the same germany that you're talking about is arming a fascist big battalions in, in your, in ukraine. so it absolutely. germany has a lot to it has a lot to answer for particularly today. okay. let me, you know, one of the things that we've seen here is that when we look at the narrative of the destruction of fascism in europe, you have a, yeah, the hollywood version, saving private. ryan, the wars over after the invasion of normandy, apparently to hollywood. and then you have this very despicable trend of equating this, the soviet union. and nazi germany is being the same thing. both are historically obviously wrong. vladimir. yeah,

he is being that asian unfortunately. and it was very, you know, very successful campaign i guess in the west, you know, we know by the side is when do they asked a french people to rise after the war? every contribution in the rush or what would be like i said, it's like the main continued the victory. you move forward 30 years ago and you know, the same ball and all of a sudden the same french people say that, you know, united states, uh, i main contributor and i tell you a complete exec, i don't need any of those from my teaching to the where it is in the course that he hello place on the russian culture. and my call a custodian, a says to the students, they went to talking about war 2. and that's a rush one the war shooters look like with a big surprise. you know, i and he said, yeah, yeah. and brings always going to what was concrete, historical data that they had, you know, k, u, a young students that listen to that, then i am hanging out with my friends all university indicated. and they just refer

to the zip is all they looked at me was of course, americans wonder what are you talking about. so these are them making things up as you know, i know i know this of that. so, but i would add that it is done for a very particular and the new failures. and the reason, because if you're the eyes of the russians lost so many people in the, the, you know, such a, such a major event you're bound to take the country and it's interest very seriously. you're bound to take very concerns about national security. or, you know, the safety of the board has to use if you, if you think that they didn't do anything, they just don't think it was due. and i think it's really kind of funny how the whole narrative shipped event. you know, now 1st of all, take the interest of jewish people serious me. they remember there was a photo of course. so this is taken seriously. but the last of forget about this is kind of really peculiar. so, you know, we won't bend over backwards to understand the drama, still understand it isn't that there's all legitimate it, but what about, you know,

russia, what about the national goods and they've been, the board has been crossed again and again and again. but in reading your being forces, who is there? jessica, because i didn't was another option because initially they just avoid diminishes. and, and just go into and, you know, look, eyes on the gate, tweet now. russians do not. yeah, you know, is stephen the, the historical fact is that the, the, the red army liberated all of the death camps and other camps as it moved west. that history is being forgotten to steven. exactly. i mean, if you ask people, i remember personally, i was starting in the united states and i have these conversations of we were to and, and who was the greatest contribute contributor? i was obviously saying it was the soviet union and people would laugh. i mean, they think that the war was one in the pacific. in babylon, on some islands, withdrew, but with japan and in normandy and the rest is a,

is some blurry picture to doesn't really exist, especially the uh, the story with the death camps. deborah o liberated by the soviet union. and this is why the holocaust ended when the red army entered these places. so up until they were liberated the, the factories of that were working. and this is one of the, the low st gray this, the she, when he, terry and achievements during the war is, is but is only one of the episode. and it is not only not recognized. uh, but uh, it seems that the sanctions, b, c of west against russia are going to be on today's moment. however, uh, by doing this uh, the mainstream west or history other fee has isolated itself as the west has in

general. well, what? well, what they do before we go to the rank here, they celebrate nazis and canada. we saw that. okay, we saw that in the end, and that's not going to be the end of it gentlemen. i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to a short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on victory de state without the the, the, [000:00:00;00]

the, [000:00:00;00] the, the welcome back across stock were all things are considered. i'm peter le belcher mind. you were discussing victory day. the okay, let's go back to alexandria in vienna. one of the interesting things here, since we're talking about history and history all graphy, we look at the present day,

the proxy war that is being waged against russia using ukraine. if we think back into 1941, when the soviet union was invaded, nazi germany had an array of a co, a coalition of countries it occupied. it was allied with and it was a collective west, not the united states yet, but in the collective west, under the rule of the nazi germany invaded the soviet union. now let's go up to the de, russia is facing a wide coalition of western countries, almost exactly the same ones. and it stand off over you crate a lot. you know, if you say that, that's all that's heresy for a lot of people because, you know, with, with russia is saying and invited me or is already touched upon and you know, way back your way, where is the of invasions, where did they come from? they come from the west. go ahead. alexander, i'm yes, exactly. i just recently watched um the great movie um alexander mer, steve, i said, okay, um eisenstein, which actually premier than 19 um,

i guess it was 1941 um, shortly before the start of operation. but most of the not situation of the soviet union, which actually had this very topic that's there is a long history of westland aggression against russia. of course, coming from the west to russia. it because the west is not able to accept russia as the other as a different civilization. right. which is actually not itself and therefore it's, yeah, regularly you could say, tries to destroy russia to obliterate it, to colonize it. um, to carry the parts as we could see in all these plants about the so called the colonized station of russia. and unfortunately, there are also these plans of exterminating russian people as we could see. not only during cannot,

i've gone aust bucks also during the sea of puts machine since 2014 events in odessa. what's happened in don't boss which domestic us there. and yeah, that's what of course the west somehow tries. i'm so mad lives actually, despite the fact that it's that there is a long history also, aggressions coming from the west to russia. instead, of course, russia um is not illuminating um or insane. if it says that it has a need for security guarantees by the west that it has a need for peace in eastern europe and for security zone. and of course the for this 3 maybe is not directly repeating itself, but it's rhymes. yeah, i think there's, there's like tennessee, there's a real, the running from the middle ages. exactly what the nazi regression until no, no doubt that there is a pattern here. vladimir, it's very interesting. again, if you look at it, if you want to take history seriously, russia, what we to imperial russia, what we call russian today,

is the only major land mass, the western powers never call on ice. and that is what they see is a missed opportunity and they, they, they haven't given up on it. they, russia is the only one that stands out there was not colonized by an outside or vladimir. yeah, it's a unique civilization. there is a way to go to the story and marshal ball, and he wrote about that. if you said yes indeed indeed, is that, you know, a peculiar uh, unique cautions organization or which it didn't fall on the other risk than it's x . you know, you can look for it, you know, for most of it is age and older minds, indians, mexicans, and training as they all were crossed by the west and it was shaped in so there they own the image and likeness as opposed to roger who is the addition that goes into the, you know, tremendous efforts to defeat a, you know,

a very innovative and i would say with an ad to alexander is not allow alexander in the near ski film these uh, i did one, it's nice, which in rate is the, you know original lands on in yesterday, and if it is all center they will actually related to this border of west the night school in the 4th grade on their way to every jerusalem. they actually 6 comes on general, but yeah, they just drop this off the ropes in house, and that is what they do. so these are the say that are very, you know, say we were getting ad there also sorta facility just to really just, they mentioned overall. sure as well because it actually is you need a careful of fish. jayenne is sort as ation religion. so somehow the wrist feels very uncomfortable about it because it has the oldest invoice amount over sources and it is a model. yeah. a little. and it was like, you know, a very big interface. the more so for the west ramp and they continue to do that. so it's a lot of noise based on what you expect and that's paranoid, you know,

saving again, broadly speaking, if we look at what would many would call the greatest hills of the, of the 20th century fascism in for many people, communism fair enough here. but they're all, well, those are western ideas, western ideas. they came from the west. unfortunately, it took cold in it, and i'm just expressing my opinion in russia. russia is recovered from that promoters experience. but these are western ideas they've russia, is had to confront. yeah, that is uh to uh, i'd like to go back to the, the issue of broader you're a, be a west here to be a coalition as a guest against russia. this is in a way, a unique situation that we are witnessing now that the west is almost completely united or completely united against russia. but it was not the 1st time only 90. essentially, there was a try me of war uh, look at the quotation of

a broader pollution of western countries. but also before that, the napoleonic wars, we always see it as a russian versus the french. but in fact, the french army goes listed of many other western european peoples and, and small armies that were there were joining in. so in a sense, there is a cycle, a historical cycle, the, the component that you mention ideas. he's all is also very important because russia was before last 300 years, always unfortunately, had some kind of a cultural excuse of pre, uh, looking at the was yes and they didn't get affected by the ideas that the good of actually be almost legal to it and i think that this is a peculiar moment, get a sense that russia is finally awake and, and i don't think that they will repeat the same pattern that started somewhere

with the reforms of peter degrades. and the russia is basically, i think, coming back to itself, well i in and out as stephen, i to add to that i agree with you. absolutely. the difference is rush is modernized itself. it's not it. and it disadvantages, like it was before, particularly as you brought up the crime being more alexandra. i've lived here for 26 years and i studied the european in russian history in a graduate school. and, you know, i always looked at the, the victory day may, 9th is during the soviet union is a legitimizing factor for the communist party. they won the war and they should get the credit. fair enough i, i'm not going to take away from that, but i think now in the 21st century a we've already touched upon in this program. this is also a separate a celebration of values. and i would say conservative values also go ahead. alexander. yes, um i would agree with you since of course the great picture of the board in russian

historiography is um, connected with the defense of the model lines with the defense of russian celebrated to and also of course was the defeat of fascism and definitely worse to defeat or from western aggression against russia. and just that for of course, it's not only an important day for russia, but for yeah, most european countries. yeah, definitely also because it meant the ends of faster as months. there may be also the ordinary germans and all spencer suffert's from the consequences of the defeat of fascism. but i guess that's the wherever the feet of fascism itself is an important event. because unfortunately, neither a communist, smaller conservatives, and all students in germany were actually able to topple the hitler regime and fascism by themselves. so they needed this help from the outside. otherwise we

would maybe still live under fastest rule. and i guess therefore it's also an important day for europe itself. yeah. well, why do i mean it should be, but it's not okay. because, you know, you've been on this program many times and i always appreciated. but this is also a culture or the west reason rejects rush is culture and its attitudes and its value. so that's part of this proxy war against russia. vladimir a yeah, i mean is a, is there, is it, you know, with your or do a weakness as of recently, you know, improve all by the, what in ukraine out of the blue. see, it's a performance is a can. so all the form is a can so in our i so it's going to you but it, it, yeah, it was like, i remember was reading, they took a moment usually they wanted to teach a course on, on the say, yes, you that you, when they came up with the idea, maybe it's not, that's not what it means. it's not that this is like, well caustic list. everybody benefits, you know, i did, you know, i told us they ask you about the semester students, this is do the, is they open up the hippie? you know, we have one of the most popular courses in our department and the other day is the

best. it was wonderful story. you know, this is like universal list and it has to be any customized and appreciate it. but i would also say that to us also have to appreciate, you know, a west and that is there's, you know, we should just, munitions. i mean, these are the great was, was a very wise guy and cut to global guy. he was 50 to rush up with you and use it to deal with the west to fly the where the has to have more than the more than this one that so why don't you have to be very kind of creative in this not, not you know, not slavish, lee beach in western preference, which priority do not walk in, you know, rationally, supposedly different piece that it's under a different culture. but to use them for a magically, there's absolutely nothing wrong with it. and i think i would say that, you know, with some smart west and this extra understanding. and i know that, you know, the caller id, or for example, sustainable agriculture was really actively developed by a russian, you know, scientists. and i know it just grew up working. he was like very much, you know,

very much pretty do it ended in the know that and then on. and so i think the rest of the problem, logical as it should be pro logic, do it well, you know i, i will what we've run out of time. i just, i, i wish the westwood act on its words. you know, like except diversity. they don't accept diversity, but it has a russian present characteristics with it. gentlemen, thank you very much. that's all the time we have one, i think may get some problems. be in it. and in belgrade, and of course i want to thank our yours for watching us here at archie. so you next time, remember process the the

in the year of 1954, the united states of america engaged in warfare against the people of vietnam. the white house supported the corrupt above in the government of southern vietnam. 1965 americans began their invasion following the aim to defeat the forces of vietnamese patriots. defend the gun was confident that the victory would be on the american side, due to its military superiority. however, the vietnamese, during this war into total hail for the occupants. unable to cope with a guerrillas, the american army started blanket bombing alongside using chemical weapons and naples, which burnt all alive. the village of my lay, where he 1969 american soldiers killed 504 civilians, including 210 children, became

a tragic symbol of this war. all and all. during the whole period of this conflict, the usa dropped on vietnam more than $6000000.00 tons of bonds, which is 2 and a half times as much as on germany during the 2nd world war. in 1973, the american army under the pressure of the rebels, withdrew from vietnam, and only 2 years later did the puppet regime. and so i got involved. however, the vietnamese paid a high price for their freedom. more than 1000000 in vietnamese people became the victims of america in the dressers, the what is part of or is this the devil as is it a poly would post that isn't the deepest you of us in that in the word?

or is it something deeper, more complex might be present to that stuff without collision? let's go part of the, the idea once again strikes the densely populated city of rafa as these rated security cabinet. reports of b is green. that another expansion of the information that it will take of some of the trucks to use to clear the roof, but because it will get additional hazards. this could be spun out into a much longer period from unexploded form to schumann were made us action services founding. the law move under breakfast and destruction in golf at