is of the normal monitor use those the cf money system get more powerful because their message is being promoted via that. but i don't know if that makes more sense now than that. and of course, your background is not through apologise and a financial broker who nearly ended up in leaving brothers just ahead of the crash . clearly evident there and what you're saying that and, and i think you written about gold. this missed the how gold is taught in schools within the media. how john list use it has the hey day of money when it wasn't the new liberal model of money you. you smash that to pieces as well as i'm not like a academic co star and that specializes in talking about every, at every era of the monetary system, right. there's a lot of new on some stuff that has been out as to what the about the thing. but the most important to realize that the, in the modern imagination rides,

a lot of conservatives will stick sites upon an imagined history of gold rush. and the political use of that is to create the idea that what money should be as good as i mentioned is that's, that's the right idea. that it should be a constrains commodity that's in the hands of credit. so essentially, right, and the 2 students dilute the power, right? so the whole kind of story about gold being the positive money has a very strong conservative lineage. in reality, there are elements of gold use in a positive cost. you would have certain types of gold systems, but they never operated in the way that's a lot of conservative economists would, would claim it. they operate to the worst. for example, a lot of nation states would actually define the value of goals. it wasn't sort of sell for parents to everybody. and furthermore, most every day congress wasn't done was go scratch was done with credit systems. so the main points to take away is that the kind of the imagination of gold as the

sort of, uh, almost like platonic ideal of money is very problematic grads. and this is, this was not to say that it wasn't to start to use. the 2nd thing to know that different affords to inter bank blending rates in london. the controls of cove left the misuse, political, political control of the goals system in the past. it was never was imagines that a few a commodity money like people want to squints. imagine and very much in that picked one. well, they're drawing on that imagined history of gold to say in the past, money was pure, then it became corrupted. now we've made a cure again in this digital form. it's a very kind of puritanical way of thinking about money and as also it has started seeing that your it, well, let's just get through a definition and then of money i should just say personally, you know, when i was 1st at the bbc in london, i go to loads of trouble, i was the only place no night shift went bearings, banks went bust and the city of london. and i chose casino

b roll pictures to illustrate voiceovers. and right from the top of the bbc they said, never use roulette tables ever a game. when talking about the finance you, however, use the analogy when defining money, what is money? the method level. um, if you're looking for the most kind of generic description, i would tend to say the money is a system of network access titans. um that enable us to access a network of human labor brands. um that's a very broad way of speaking about it. um, and if you think about it, a lot of traditional ways of describing money, people imagine that there are some like value stored in money dealt with. but it has been a store all that value as if somehow the objects carries something a bit like, you know, blog or something. right? and the reality is that all of the value in an economic system is stored in human

beings and natural systems, right? that's way everything comes from the monitoring system is embed it into that a bit like a nervous system, perhaps if you want to use a biological medical. but the units of money essentially are costing claims upon our labor, right. so when you folding money, you're holding claims upon other people. this is what i'm saying is like a network access to it. and it's an access token and able to access people. that is a very generic description that does a lot of a lot more technical detail about how many pieces and so actually constructed or ad . so the re, the construction of industries systems takes multiple different forms right now the way that the money because of them is constructed and as, as in the layers are at higher optical layers using credit instruments in the core of that as a central bank. but the commercial banking sector right now, issues, lots of the, of the money that we use as well. i can go into the different layers if you'd like it to. but the network asset access code is token has similarities to casino chips

. i know that in nato countries, the atm machines seem to be being reduced in lots of uh, in the city areas of just explain how the atm it works within the analogy of a caching in the chips. yeah. so what, but basically when you look at the construction of the model, monetary system, um, it has about at least 3 layers, right? so the base le, let's do a kind of a single base money. so i just collect le one money. it is from central banks, right? and those are pushed out and also stop the backend. right? so you push them out when states of spending and sucked back in when there's taxation occurring right in the public. that's the cash just right. so the, any form of you want to put a la one money that we can access. so states money is cash, right?

then the 2nd la built on. so i'll put that, which is the bank exec to arrive in the mid the mid of for you want to think about you understand that as i use a casino, as a medical is to help people to cross that. so if you walk into a casino and you take cash and you handed over to the casino tasha, they're going to push out tips to you, right? and those chips are as secondary form of money, privately issued rad. that is connected back to the cash. and you at the end of the not because you can go back and reclaim the cash and woke out. so in the banking sector, how does medical works? do you want to think about it? when you handing of the cash to a bank, they're not storing the cash to you, they taking ownership of it from, from you. and then they push out digital casino tips to you. so those units that you see in your bank account, or if you're looking on your online account and you'll find those units or digital casino, substitute up on the banking sector and what's called the cash list. society is when you basically become totally dependent upon those digital casino chips, right?

and when you're closing down a gm's right, and these countries and a lot of goods in europe, for example, such as you can write all that kind of branches and the atm, they'll be sucked down as a bit like shutting down the ability to exits the system to cache out of a system, right? so it's like going back to the end of a, not the casino and saying, hey, i wanna convert my chips back to cash. and then saying, sorry we, we don't do that anymore. you're not kept it in our system. right? you cannot exit our system. one of the main problems of that medical, the of, of the casino is that to the, to the new onto the bid is that in the normal casino. so every unit of cash is connected to a to a ship, but it's not a bad thing. sacked to the banking sector has the ability to issue spa more digital casino chips and they're having cash reserves. and that's what sometimes called facts or is the banking is i want to be very creative of money at basel, these,

these strange records in, in switzerland with an organized how much the ratios are. yeah, exactly. that's basically just explaining that. yeah, those are the different races, the technical ratios and banking are basically about how you manage that. the risk that emerges from that process, right? so the banking site is pushing out huge amounts of the digital casino chips and, and red sudden they're harvesting loan assets, right? so they're not pushing them out for nothing that they so that they pushed them out a different circumstance as a result of utah. now put a band, can you say get some cash, some deposit ticket, they taking that for you and giving you tips. but you could also be a person who's borrowing money, you turn up at a bank and say that borrow some money and they'll just push out new tips to read. what that's what they dragging back from you in return as a loan asset. right? so, and so what's happening is banks will construct these 1000 seats with a, with a pushing at these, these speed digital steps, which are actually

a liability to them. but they are stretching back assets and what's on. and that puts them in certain types of risk. so those capital adequacy races and things and basel with their debate. so basically about how do you manage the risk of this process? right, scott, i was more complex brett's god. i'll stop you. the more from the or through the crowd money. why the warren cash and dangers of freedom up to this break the, what is a part of the, the employee would posted isn't the defense you of us and bidding the word part? is it something deeper, more complex might be present? good. let's stop without cases. let's go out of

or the the hello and welcome to the cost of full force. here we discuss a real name. is earned h a y is can be started by line. peace can be expanded by true importance

and we can never be of a station. so that transparency is an extraordinary drawn mistake. patrice then just succeeded in finding documents that existed in making them available to the world. that mean water could be more holding back by publishing information and sharing information with the public. he was exercising the right to free speech. he did so in the public interest, wants to so long realize tends to me, uh, engulfing endlessly, to relate continuously. and i know why advice may assume that no one who is the guy that illegal anymore wisely bought. adjustments for to be on box weighing a 175 used to go through the sentence all week. going to let that stay

the now you need your visa, stipulate here you have to nothing comes in the book. is that for dollars then that's just me very the it's the only showcase is use the so i'm just going to the, by the ways that the boys, the the probably the most name that will be for them. i'm not sure if this slaughter

doesn't want that extra them, but adults up under that the welcome back to going underground. i'm still here with bread, scalded with real kind of money. why the war on cash and dangers of freedom? bread. we were talking about those ratios, which they don't really talk about in the financial press of that much meant they leverage levels that eventually get bailed out to actually as they did off the 20, always in fact, maybe want to personally just mention how when you are a university, they managed to recruit the so called brightest and best into these industries. and actually they, many of them may go into the media to just spread the wood. that cashless society fintech, these great new changes are important then if you don't believe in them, you are a luddite. yeah, so, but as a university,

goldman sachs and jp morgan and you know, maryland sold it as big players, but a sort of hover around the elite universities and try to recruits and since the 5 is still the graduate. so please create the idea that what success meant as being part of the professional services industry. and that was around but, but i was in the financial sector around the time of the financial crisis. interestingly, since the financial crisis, what happened around that time is actually big tech started to get more sexy grad. so actually the idea of what was uh, something to aspire to start to shift the next the over the years since the financial crisis. a lot of those graduates, so to get attracted to the big tech companies, lots of things that companies and the fintech sector is actually the sort of rome with big tech needs, big finance, right. with the automation of big finance. but in the early post, the financial crisis of 2008, the student tech industry condos looks

a little bit black. it was a kind of revolutionary, democratization of finance, which the various of the typical tech narrative when they ultimate things i talk about it as being a revolution. oh, somebody is going to democratize stuff so. so the fence x i had that narrative. so um, so, so this situation right now is it actually big tech has become more powerful than big finance, but there certainly are joining together in various ways, right? via these been 2nd for structures. and part of that is a part of products manifesto in our society right now, for example, is an attack on the cast system, right? because their minds, cash is a full of money. that's very a sides of ultimate. a lot of human beings really love the cast system and find it very useful, but big companies do not like the cash system because it con, automates it scratch. um and so you know, in the case of big tech companies like amazon there will literally cannot operate with cash. but even the big supermarket scenario and big is big retailers and stuff

. say they actually would prefer to work with a big tech companies and to deal with ordinary human beings dealing with physical money. right. so the automation drive is part of corporate capitalism more generally and does money. first thing in our society is a sort of ideological attack on the cash system. and they'll tell you that if you still want to use cash or somebody stuck in upon something wrong with you, you're not. you don't believe in progress, which is another way of saying you don't believe in corporate automation of our society. is it different though, in global south countries where the development is not at the stage of late capitalism, they're catching up to a stage where they might be able to democratize. we spoke to former ecuadorian central banker. i talked to andrea as, who said, uh danny digital, uh, national bank guarantees would be important. give people ideas of stakes and their

societies rather than private bank. yeah. so was, if you look at power and the, the levels of some live strides that lives in the us and europe and new jersey assist you in the china, right? so, so the actual narrative is set there in a many global south countries. when you have leaders who all have both to sort sort of the cool a doesn't where they will often actually parent that same ideology and even live in global south countries. often people actually know, for example, items that africa and south africa of electrical infrastructure is down for 4 hours a day, sometimes 6 hours a day. but the idea that you're gonna do, just as everything is expensive, right? actually in this country like semester, you're interested in resilience throughout, so things are cash, but actually really useful. but still the ideology that comes from silicon valley will come the 8th through the, the, the consonant tribes. now inside of clay,

it'd be honest in a different way. it could be on a search in south africa because they to yeah. so for example, in the afternoon context, you'll have talks about digital suffering. so you're right, you'll have local and select those local politics until debates whether it's possible to the tax from the main it's national system. and so actually for something of autonomy to say, okay, we would have to not be touching the reliance but visa, mastercard. so you mentioned andreas arouse from from ecuador, is a friend of mine under s, so that basically the global digital payment systems are controlled. essentially, by visa, mastercard, the swift network, the us bands federal reserve, the data at the sort of apex of that system. and if you're a country like equitable, you basically have no rights within that system. so if you're a us citizen, you can maybe dom on some rights in the, in the sort of these are mazda cod system. you can say, well i, i don't want to be spied upon, but if you're in ecuador and citizen, you don't get those rights. so in that context, that's called

a digital sovereignty becomes very important because you can say, well, actually with maybe forms on parallel system. all right, so it's a very hard thing to do. that's that's, that's why, for example, under, as little promote the idea of a central bank digital currency in a place like equity. all right? and, but yeah, what do you see mass look at the overall system? the power lines of the big us funds and at least and the sort of western world in a chinese that's when we, i know we were talking about casual society and, and the myth of convenience and the p r spin to persuade us on digital central bank currencies then, do they offer more national sovereignty over the economy of, for any democratically elected the government because they're outside and could be outside of the washington. good type of physically. yeah, i mean, it depends on how they're other implemented. i mean, even even actually in european countries and stuff as potential to cbd,

it seems to have the ability to counter the power of the banking set to remember that that, that sort of image i painted of the amenities is the mountains of having multiple players and kind of, you know, there's a sort of central bank that ends all the commercial banks and what you called a, with the cash flows society is rarely when those commercial banks take over and you have to use their kind of digital casino tips that we have payments now, many years ago actually monitor a form groups started saying the commercial banking sector is too powerful. right? so we need to actually have a new phone with digital states, money to compete with it. so hypothetically, if a central bank started is doing a new type of digital money or offer you an alternative to, to having a bank account. so, um, and so is this gonna be even in countries like the u. k. for example. imagine that the bank of england started saying we're gonna offer an account that you're gonna use, and that's gonna compete with players i bought plays and h as the see. right?

and that's what actually a central bank digital currency, it's hypothetically, could be, it's not where the w t o steps in or yeah, yeah. so, so the reason that somebody's saying this is against privatization and therefore i a liberal a. so is it a radical version of c? b, c is definitely not popular among mainstream leads, right? and so, but that was a potential way of doing it in the past. as i do it, you could actually have this almost like a public infrastructure on digital payments that would compete with the private one . the reason why things like sense of bank digital currency are being discussed right now. there is not because of that radical vision. and the reason is that during the pandemic is a mass of dropping cash usage, as everyone was forced online and central bank. and suddenly you realize that there's a potential financial stability problem that emerges when the cash system goes down . right? now, that's a whole kind of structural problem in the monetary system. so they said,

maybe we need to sort of think about creating some kind of alternative to cash and digital form. but because the central bank is don't want to harm the banking sector and don't want to compete with it too much. they're watering down all their cdc proposals to say, if we do this, we'll get the private banks to kind of run it for us and that was the stubs them. but basically, so there's, there's multiple versions. obviously, if it is the uh of the design, it's gonna have that the current version is being proposed in the, you know, sort of the european countries. i'm not very radical. the hypothetically in us level south country, you could implement the cdc some way to create a local digital infrastructure because there might be, even in the global south country, your local banks also going to be starting with visa and mastercard, right? cuz they give me, wanted to get into the international system. so sometimes your local banks are working against your digital sovereignty as a way central bank digital guarantee will just find these a year of elections. how do you think uh,

the powers that be easily managed to persuade? electra tool around the world will be voting this year, that the grocery shop analogy of how and economy works is the way the economy works . they seem to manage should be able to say there isn't enough money to pay for this. they will offer this in the manifesto. given that you are explaining something, even more complicated about the future of money. are you, are you asking me how they will the grocery store, i mean this grocery shopping that there isn't enough money. does that make any sense to you when the yeah, well, i mean, i suppose though the, the traditional way they, they try to present themselves as being like a house. so that's a very classic steps for rides, idea that the government has like a, is like a household like any other and it has limitations on as budgets. right. which is not true. i mean, one of the ways to think about this is to imagine like um,

doing it as medical for the works, but i can open the 3 vs squirrels. right? so squirrels run around trying to get the acorns, but the auxilary once the squirrels that take its acorns. right. and this is very much like the states in the monetary system. we imagine ourselves, the squirrels are, you know, trying to get the money, trying to work hard to find the money. but actually the state issues, money is like an oak tree. so when it's a gauge and it's got a mess, the raid that is like a giant squirrel that also has like a limits to how much, how many knots it has. that's a kind of fantasy as a political fantasy. and it's also very useful political fantasy, post certain types of people who want to privatize stapo good public services, right. so there's a huge politics to speaking about money as this is some kind of, you know, limited supply of knots. and that's classic austerity politics, right? so, um and yeah, so that i don't know how positions will will do it this coming. yeah, but it's always

a massive top of electoral politics. and yeah, there's a, there's also the big elements of it as well that that comes into it. and this has been a scam hungry about inflation to say if we try to employed so many people will be in slice. and so we gotta keep a bunch of people unemployed to keep that, keep it down. so i know that's what you answer your question, but it's a big question. answerable logistic on them is who all? logistically bred scott. thank you. all right, thanks a lot. that's it for the show for them. but we're bringing you new episodes every sunday and monday until then you can keep in touch. my last social media is not sunset in your country and i do i channel going on the ground to be a normal. they'll come to watching you and all the episodes i'm going underground season, the

summer executive. and i'm going to plan with you whatever you do. do not watch my new show. seriously. why watch something that's so different by little opinions that he won't get anywhere else. welcome to please, or do the have the state department to see i a weapons bankers, multi 1000000000 dollar corporations. choose your fax for you. go ahead. change and whatever you do. don't want my show state main street because i'm probably going to make you uncomfortable. my show is called stretching time, but again, it's not, we don't wanna watch it because it might just change the way in things. the russian states never is as tight as i'm one of the most sense community best most i'll send send up the same assistance.

must be the one else calls question about this even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin mission, the state on russia scooting s r t sports net keeping our video agency roughly all the band on youtube tv services. for what question did you say a request to change the the or my little assess the store? okay. the model girl that i got you. no problem seem to them out of the thing. 30 minutes. yeah, side of the drive i showed my brother through he was sudden to hoping for a lo so now i never look at searches as being the same. well,

i guess i lost my list. that's the outcome of chicago police. it'd be gang chicago is like, you'd be a photo that police you really think your life as another crap thing. another one. this could have been a doctor. a nurse could have been the next president. we can't keep losing people out here. the is a lives can be started by live please can be started like for the importance of working right now. but the kind of a study, since that transparency is extraordinary. john mystic latrice then just succeeded in finding documents that existed in making them available to the world public. i mean,

what could be more holding back by publishing information and sharing information with the public. he was exercising the rights for a speech he did so in the public interest. so mom realized tends to me and, and the slate of late continuously. and i know why advice may assume that no one who is the guy that illegals anymore wisely. fort adjusted for to be on box weighing a 175 used to go through the extensions. are we going to lift that? stay in the, in a modern parking lot of waldo smartphones and tech upgrades are chairs, no crafts and hand painted traditions of yesteryear seemed to be fading away. protective stuff outside of the bustling metropolis of moscow. and you'll find that traditional russian, the full parts culture is still going strong. the

hello and welcome across by bullhorn john peter labelle. here we discussed some real news is you are preparing for direct military conflict with russia. evidence suggests the answer is yes. also international law and the real global community is working to hold israel to account how much isolation is the us willing to accept. still discuss these issues and more. i'm joined by my guess, george semi while we in budapest, he's a pod cast where the guy goal, which can be found on youtube and locals, and in marrow cash, we have martin jay. he is an award winning journalist and commentator. all right, gentlemen, cross slack rules and effect, that means you can jump any time you want that. i always appreciated.