freight of me, i'll tell you my point of view and those fighting on the front, when people recruited in the street spied buses come to our trenches, what should we do with them? they say that they wipe fight. and now in training centers, they again say that they won't fight some of your current in this trust in their military is not unfounded. footage of men being snatched off the streets for military service has been widely circulating online. in addition to that, ukraine has tightened its control on reserve send is ramping up a sanctions against draft dodgers to flew forcible mobilization, some ukrainians risk illegal border crossings, including across the river te set to try to get the remaining up. the journey is perilous. with at least $32.00 bodies recently recovered in the area, and experts say the desktop could be much higher as the river is fast flowing and littered with obstacles such as fallen trees. you have the mocking of these tragic deaths by comedians, as testament to the polarization and ukrainian society. i'm drawing your funds on

the size like draft gorgeous in a dizzy river. wait, wait. i'll take this for the evening. that's the shock was new when one more for yourself. and while ukrainians continue losing their lives, trying to escape conscription the hash tag. i am a draft. dodger has gone viral across social media with ukrainians. lucky enough to leave the country, you started posting videos of their lives abroad. intel in war correspond to andrea lucida says the patriotic sentiment, new crane is declining with people questioning why they are dying for the interests of lawmakers. and yeah, there is not abstract eltic sentiment in ukraine. now fossils from the people from the people, from the area of people for the ukraine, young man, now it's may be a good to treat disease soon or a school life for cross or either and sorry romania illegally. that's

a try to survive on the bulk of see it was a one time i make any interview with you can work prisoner. and you said me, i was on the front line. i make my duty for the county. but where are, where are the people that make these the cesium? what are the people who create these war? they are in key if they are sitting up to him at the office, who with or calling for us. and we need to go to the front for the friends. they're interesting. this was okay. i think their view, and i think now people like these, the people that are starting to escape when you're off the, they are thinking the see why i need to die for defend. the interesting of these to may occur in kia that's our leaving. we thought. com, 410, that they created the big door for us to stay with our to international up next on cross talk,

peter levelland his guess discuss the dangerous world. we're entering a 0 if appears to be preparing for direct military conflict with one of the the hello and welcome across by bullhorn john peter lebow. here we just got some real news is you are preparing for direct military conflict with russia. evidence suggests the answer is yes. also international law and the real global community is working to hold israel to account how much i solution is the us willing to accept. to discuss these issues in more, i'm joined by my guess george, send me while we in budapest, he's

a pod cast with the goggle which can be found on youtube and locals. and in marrow cash, we have martin j. he is an award winning journalist and commentator. alright gentlemen, cross like rules in effect, that means you can jump any time you want that. i always appreciate it. all right, let's start. i was in job with george in budapest, over the last week, particularly we've seen these rumors of war as it were coming from particularly someone like the home gary and prime minister, but your urban but many, many others in the obviously escalation of the conflict in ukraine is on the agenda, as you claim continues to falter, i think as we speak right now, they're opening up the jails in the ukraine for convicts to go to the front. um, uh, we have a, a plethora of videos of, uh, circulating on line of the continued on for cannon fodder to send to the front. and we have simultaneously, we have people like david cameron, reading live,

use those weapons deep into russia and british ones, by the way, and, and to be blank and the state, the part of the, the secretary state. i'm trying to corral people into some kind of a forceful agenda to escalate even more. so george, where is this all going? is this a because the way i think you can interpret it many ways the, you know there, unrelenting unwilling to accepted this whole project was as far as from the beginning. or this is an opportunity for to mobilize the west where a very long term agenda and not just against russia. george, that's a very good point to the to and i think up the answer is both the, the hon gary and prime minister the victor or binds interview a couple of days ago was a very interesting because he says, look hungry is taking part in these needs so me things and i can tell you that in these meetings they are planning for and made so uh, involved and being ukraine. and he said that, um, you know, if this continues,

essentially, um hungry will have to opt out. now he didn't exactly spell out what it means, opt out, but what, what type of say, but the fact the country will just simply the seems to be a member of nature. but he's saying that and he said this explicitly that europe is now in this situation. he wasn't in 1914 and in 90. and so it's not, it's on the brink of a well well. and then you have to say, well, why, why is that? and then you talk about this, the crisis in the ukraine. the problem arises that uh, you know, when do was bring capital, who's breakout when great powers refused to give up? they can give up because if they gave up, they used to be great powers. they, they, they just seems that they will be seen to be, they for tie, goes on that for, they just have to, uh, go home and like a wound. great powers, a very reluctant to do that. and hence the escalation of this rhetoric,

i mean one of the things you didn't you didn't mention was it was a good friend made the secretary general young sheldon but gave the names of you to the economists thing which she also said yeah, absolutely. we have to take a whole restrictions on the use of us and any messiahs given to your brain, but they just don't know the body to the conflict. and um, and then we have um the, the out probably outgoing u. k prime minister risky. soon i can, how's it going? he's going to introduce national service within his own which somebody description . everyone can see exactly exactly conscription and now it's true. he's likely to win any strew of labor. it has criticized them. however, labor is the anointed one. these obviously they, they going to be in that, but i me say, that doesn't mean labor itself is not going to introduce this in due course. so everyone is, is getting ready to boil big band. why? because they cannot admit to lose it because you lose then basically you will need

. um it's, it's interesting because you know what, i'm making you made reference to the in the interview that uh the on gary and prime minister victor are the main with the economist a martin. i mean, he's absolutely right. i mean, looking at the, the precursors of the conflict of world war one in world war 2. but i think everybody needs to stand back here is that this is a conflict that the nato european countries want. i mean, rushes, not attacking any of these countries whatsoever. there is no in pending invasion of western europe by russia. there's no, and i mean, even the, the, the biggest proponents are ukraine, but probably wouldn't admit that it least not in pending right now. i mean, this is a craven choice on the part of your opinion. the leads in american awaits is to prepare for a war that they want. go ahead, martin, to go nowhere else to go. i mean, that's true. the problem, you know, wait a minute themselves into this corner where by now they've run out sort of new plans,

new ideas. and now what is the real point? the real objective now of these at least is just self preservation. you know, and unfortunately indirectly, the grading elite, i would say because that's something else here, but i'm talking about your team leader to see to how those, how the people that shows in my chrome and also to seem to keep that political base when it even the device, missing phone frenchman or german, can see that we're losing a new crane and russia is gaining a certain point that will be a tipping point. web mines will be focus on, the total will go through 3. will be more realistic rather than just to announce that i think when we origin closer to is just recently the russian investor in london told a british and be but we know the little storm shadows being flooded by british soldiers. we know you didn't train your finance, you sent your own people to offer them. i think if america follows through with

that, with his own equipment, she sends us on soldiers to find them. you know, we're a cigarette people away from the world. we're 3 scenarios. you know, i'm very, very dangerous. talk to, for cameron and others talk about hitting the inside russia, you know, how, how much computes and take, you know, i mean, even, even, even he has a break. and quite his generals will be ongoing for, for a much more decisive policy against night. so, because this nato is doing this. but in the midst of this, when i see from a distance, i suppose, is lack of dialogue, lack of debates, lack of effect. and, you know, met press coverage, you know, i mean what happens is when you completely calm down on those, this when you start arresting john, unless, oh, you lost the sized them for taking a different line. you know, what happens is the elite start to believe the around b s. and this is really part of the story, is that, you know, just recently last week there was some, as of, we gave soldiers in the british,

panama. shameful, absolutely shameful. i'm not one british newspaper. right. well, so we had, we had the secretary of state anthony blank and sitting in a, a p p 3 and in care of with his counterpart with nazi we go, we own the walls. okay. i mean, george, you know anthony blank and went to israel. is a jew, is he a jew? when he goes many visits? key of when you see nazi regalia, i'm george a there with writers just reporting number of reports. okay. they had put in is agreed to freeze the con. uh, conflict. okay. uh i would like to read um, you know, i'd like to see those reports myself because i think everyone obviously once you see the complet come to in precinct complet plus neutrality plus change of reason. they don't mentioned that they just talked about one thing. but it's really interesting when we go back to the interview that the food made with ad with tucker carlson. why don't you just test the russians if you want to freeze, the conflict doesn't tell me more,

but they won't even do that. george. good less. exactly right. the the, and i don't think that i would probably say we don't know that right. those reports is very true. um, but it's not impossible because randy is there is only one on file to that is the grown up in the room and, and that's a built in and put in does not want the world war because this is crazy to escalate to was that um and so i think he's putting forward, i mean, maybe, i mean i, i find that plausible, but he would put forward a scenario that he gave he things the west going to accept without feeling that they'd be humiliated without feeling that they have now cease to be a great powers, i look, you know, if we freeze it along these lines, um, you know, you can at least say then you've got something we can say with the something and then we can bring this very dangerous confrontation to an end. the problem is that isn't living, there are no take goods. and this goes back again to the, the,

the discussions of man's going to that is spend both rusher made and no one was concessions really very on favorable to russia. and he was the last, i said, no, no, we can, we can go away, we can actually conflict the total devastating strategic defeat on russian total humiliation for russia. and we can get away with then of those you comp. but it's the same reason you can't just simply the phase as you really have a great power, but that was, it was the west, the active response. when is the west now, then instead of engaging in a serious dialogue because life is clearly open to dialogue, have these nonsensical peace conference in switzerland, the which russia hasn't been invited even today to say. and this isn't entirely a public relations exercise. nothing to do with a peace conference, but just if you repeat, oh, we own it. you know, the landscape based plan, which was russian capitulation. you know, you know, martin, it's very interesting. we, we have heard repeatedly, particularly from the likes of the french president, mac chrome. you know,

russia should not be allowed to win. well, that is, that is a wish list. that is a political statement, but that doesn't have anything to do with security. and moving forward, and that's always been the key issue that the west never really will open will admit, is that the core of all of this rest of the security demands. and we had, we had this process during the cold war, b o s. c. we had the health in the process. no one in the west. no take there's is george said go ahead barton. yeah, i'll, they're going to be and take us now. you know, it, it doesn't seem to be so it, i think we have to wait for something quite a catastrophic to happen before head. so thing together that nascent level of a, you level for people to actually start talking about some the realities of what we can do, you know, made so count when this will what it's now looking at some diseases. i mean, i've been told by some of my m a g sources in new kinds of some ministers and the british government. now saying we need to get out of the crane. so these people are

now starting to say, look, the reality is, this is a war company, one kind of in be a will, which, whether that can be some dignity of some grace and losing either can we step back from it. but i don't see any real of this scenario, so you're not seeing like going round around in circles and um, i don't think names. so is the body really? it doesn't have the people in it who can really look at this realistically. and i've come up with anything intelligence, you know, i think there's a, there are a number of elk similar ones that play here, even the narrative. you know, we keep hearing russia is coming. but that narrative is really nonsense because the people who bump bang, bang the drum and say that of the same countries that have completely depleted their own stocks, the minute of hardware. so, you know, you, you obviously don't believe in that in that well, i mean, in another, in decatur georgia last 30 seconds here. is that victoria new and is suddenly back in the newest. i mean, i mean, you know, teach dislodge from her as perch, but she is actually leading the fight for the military industrial complex and the

neocons. 15 seconds. george. yeah, there she's, and she's also echoing this has been, you talking fine. no restraints. that's all on the use of missiles and the, and that's what i have that everybody is on board for that. i'm just going back to the mouth. you were saying that tory m p who said that it's the the, the, the british oh actually firing the storm shadow miss of was and it says that with the, with the new care style and the government. well, actually we will be told that we are more than you just so he said that right on that dreadful thought gentlemen, we have to go to a hard break. and after that, hardwick will continue our discussion. so me on the stay with our to the

the welcome back to cross that boulevard and peter lavelle here, we're discussing some real news martin, i guess, you know, you and i in george, have been observers of politics for our entire adult lives. okay. and i never thought in my wildest imagination that b i c j in the i, c c would be so focused on, on. uh, let me focus on the activities of israel and it's a legal behavior and it's a small town gossip. but here we are right now, but the problem with all of this is that the israel is isolated, but it's been isolated and for much of it's existence is a pariah. of many countries in the world of always considered it a pariah. not a big difference. ok, maybe in magnitude and maybe a in breath, but israel's been used to that status. the united states is not. okay. and the,

the, the, the problem that is facing the united states and needs that's close as allies is a more and more that the can genocide conventions are studied and applied. then you have complicity. and those that are complicit are in the same category, is committing genocide. it's so this is something the western world is slowly and terrifyingly waking up to go ahead martin with him too. and also, i think realizing that the more we go down this right, the more that we start issuing these rips from the i c, j to nothing. i missing you. i know those, you know, and the more america shows is really what is all about, what's in a, what is the i c, j for america is his, it's america's own to, for germany. nothing more, nothing less. and i think when i think it was instagram who said recently and in some sort of congress who were meeting, you know,

it's like going from this and yahoo and he's raised and will it be us next? and i think that really i was martin if i can interrupt that was during the congressional hearings. and there were protesters in the crowd witnessing the committee's proceedings, and they applauded it and he said, go ahead. you can applauded if you want that we're going to mazing moment, sorry for the reps, interrupted was absolutely amazing because it really left the kind of the back now . now with now there was clarity. now, you know, even the last few weeks we will be discussing, i had to wondering, you know, where is this a heading? really? and i said to you, i think it the very beginning of the conflicts on the show. i sent them the 20 minutes of the i, c j will really be hills now to it'll be a real issue now, but in the very beginning, when it had his ruling a couple of months ago, you know, i think that point now is, is a fund even more and i'm not putting myself on the back from impressions. what i'm saying is that if the i c j lose his credibility, you know, of the huge institutions around the world. i think i'm gonna follow because global south leads or just looking at his institutions and saying, well is last just now,

just to help america squeeze but as deals manipulates people, i'm sorry, people to jail, they kind of have a sense of nature. do you know? then why should we be part of it? and what happens is that just accentuates momentum towards breaks towards the east . you know, so i think come these recent announcements by the button administration following this, the, the legal case which is building up number the i c j. i think that's a real, that's a really bad signal towards huge west and the controls institute. i mean, but martin if, if you look at the i c j, then i'll go ahead and george right now. i mean, these are all web inventions of the west in the, in the post world war 2, posting during bird environment. these are all western institutions that i mean, and particularly the i c, c, you know, the international case in court, which so many people call it. but i mean, it's just of these institutions. it is the legitimacy of the west to,

to continue to a lead to end and make the demand that they have the right to lead, cause they can, they stand taller and they see further in all this other nonsense that we have heard. that is all at stake right now. it's just not institutions. it's just the, the very legitimate legitimacy of the western experiment for the human race. george, this is the also to write the list and just going back to your, the original question, which was that the well, yes, israel has often been isolated indians that actual community but not the united states. and what's really going on now is really a kind of a self inflicted wounds on the cause of the united states, because there's no reason for it because, you know, yes, obviously the united states is in the business of being the global hedge. i'm on bunch of and dominate the world in a full spectrum dominance that talks about the united states has been about. but this unremitting support for israel stands in the way of that because it

is been ago. um for, for many, many reasons. antagonizes an awful lot of countries this way. it is completely isolated, being the middle east. it has to be of war with its neighbors ever since its foundation that isn't likely to change any time. so america is on board. is that anything you exchange for me? nothing, so i could isolates it, so and we're for a full goals. that's actually the chief, nothing for the united states. and so now it's, it's, are issuing threats against me until i feel criminal court. doubtless it goes this up issue and threats against me. it's the last report of justice, and that stands in the way all american global history. me that because there are plenty of powers who are more than happy to be american clients states do with america's bidding. but not on this issue. particularly in the middle east on this extra bit by calling follow the united states. so describe an ex road rate of the self inflicted wounds that the united states,

the impact of bradley was still good the but let me take even more dangerous words so well, you know. and because martin, if me in israel does what it does, because it deals, it has the privilege of impunity. and because it has american backing, it's always shielded. but that's why this happens is that this is something the united states is allowed since the inception of visual, particularly since the 67 war. and now it's coming back to haunt them because this is not only is georgia is, you know, what does the us get out of this when they, when it looks it, it's global hedge. a monic reach not much. it's may, it may affect goods negative returns, but now this is impacting domestic politics in the western world. we see these huge divisions going on and it's quite terrifying. you know, i mean, well, you know, george and i covered russia, gave thoroughly, when, you know, there was a new mccarthyism. what's going on now is what's that level of mccarthyism? and it's small potatoes in comparison and for, for what, okay,

so this and p energy is destroying the very fabrics of the ideals, the, the values that we use. we claim to hold. go ahead martin. yeah, hit next and put it very well when he was talking about the book he wrote, you said, you know, we don't really get much out of the relationship with israel. and the main reason why we're so close to these right is because of the holocaust. because the history, you know, but i think to take george's point, put sort of very well, you know, self inflicted wounds such as a specially i'm one that is gaping now. but it wouldn't be the button administration that looks at this from, with any objective perspective, they weren't going to have a cup to view. i think about the, the implications of the next 2010 or 20 years. it might be the next above just generation politicians and leaders in america who questioned this relationship. you know, in the old days it was, well, we need is one in the middle east because if the sort of rebellious children otherwise knows, the adverb stays, but become

a little bit north to it. a bit difficult to deal with is real. be that a crack the width of and so the rest of the region, you know, who's where you're running the show, but well, and i be and also, and also martin in any, they mean the end of the soviet union. george, this is, this is impacted the greater middle east. amazingly, because you have the, the, we have israel was within the context of a cold hor rivalry when that disappears. that's when it became actually far more dangerous because israel, because of its sense of impunity, would be able to pursue its goals. go back with the westbank for example, and now attacking causal repeatedly. if we'd been in a cold war environment, it's doubtful that would have happened george. so that's exactly right. and this is very interesting because if you go back to the cold war mentality, if it was really henry kissinger who define the issues in the middle east, in terms of the cold war somehow,

israel is the look the west league they've been, uh, they satellite or you know, waging a soviet sponsor and the west and the world. and of course it was nonsense that games nonsensical at the time. and he said it's a mix of did not agree with that analysis of the middle east. so certainly his secretary of state william rogers did not take that view, but that was case and you again he kind of voice that this idea onto the united states. that's the reason why we provided israel with this up on question. unremitting support. is that a israel is fighting the cold war against soviet aggression, all now they love, they get them because once a cold war ended, you had to invent new things. and so you allows the islamic jihad in the global islamic revolution. now it's about the work is on global work is um and israel is in the full front of the 5. what is the earliest you probably get into fights with national silver entity and your gains. globalism is always something new. the sides

that these are our lives in the leader. of course you isn't. that is just the way of avoiding ever talking about what google secrete. alicia's are in the middle east, and that's and that's why in this it goes on, is that and you know everything, inventing this uh, new etiology is the why, why we have to the support the israel unconditionally learn. wait, wait, we have the u. k. elections coming up very, very soon. how is this issue with the israel palestine in the i c j gotten playing out in that election? if at all it's going to have a huge impact on both sides of the huge blocks. because um, as a general purpose to jump perception is the labor are going to get how much because of the ridiculous, some sort of support of the genocide of, of a homeowner's ro side. but also i think that too, as well, we will, these booby hit very hard only because that lack of decision, lack of strategy on all of other issues. by this time,

at least this is just want some what's gonna happen is the low price can be split right down the middle. but jeremy cool. but now i'm looking to be ready to perhaps try and try and make some sort of stand against overlay because we know the tories are going to be desecrated. you know, so i think the emergence now of some of the policies like george galloway as others as well. you know, i think it's going to be a real issue. you know, we, we, we assess, been so long. since you've had real foreign policy, that makes any sense well known, it's been so long since we've been able to distance ourselves from america. you know that i think people, us sick, i'm sick, the death of really having foreign ministers and the british government who basically what have in state diploma. you know, so i think israel and palestine will be an issue, a big issue, but i think it over hit labor honda doing well in the same questions and george with we have november elections coming up. what's the difference between trump invite and when it comes to this issue? i ask that because i know it's a short answer. not much,

but if that's an interesting question, what we've seen in the last few weeks have been big donors, hedge fund managers, people who didn't like chrome now. so they moving towards the trunk because they think by the end is betraying. israel bite is throwing israel under the bus and they think probably be a more reliable friend of israel. and that could be very interesting. um, within the i think one of the houses, i think what it tells us is this, this line is by the ologies, is corrupted western politics to the core. unfortunately, gentlemen, that's all the time we have one, i think my guess in america and in budapest and of course i want to thank our viewers for watching us here. are to see you next time. remember, prospect rules the, the,

i don't want to leave the gates and my children, the 3rd world war. so nato cannot force us to kill him. russia, italy's prime ministers, laminator chiefs called to give the green light to use the lion's weapons to strike it side russian territory for hungary calls europe dressed into war, irresponsible. you. it was drifting into a world without even having a rough estimate of the costs and resources necessary to achieve it stated no 3 objectives and never seen anything more irresponsible in my life. the idea of slightest right on rock like hills, at least $35.00 people despite the international court of justice ruling that the assault must also have.