i had called them citizens and displaced persons to go to the saved zones. when the displaced persons fled to these areas, the eastern, the occupation on the committed mass of goods and executions. now over the weekend, thousands of people around the world march to demand an immediate cease fight in dallas, and demonstrates is carried palestinian flags as well as ppos. does that re free pala sign and stop the genocide? hundreds of students of the south american nation. it's silly, of course, of that government to cut to for the massive time they can all make ties with, as well as comes as the co founder of human rights sports branded as well as actions in gaza, a genocide over a period of time. israel has obstructed the delivery of humanitarian assistance to gaza, and those who have been most severely victimize on, not the members of from us. but it is young children who are most severely damaged

by now nutrition, and who will either starve to death or if they survive, they will be diminished uh, for the rest of their lives diminished physically and psychologically by the severe mound nutrition band enduring as children. and i thought that severe obstruction of the delivery of humanitarian assistance amounted to genocide. we heard from these folks buys and for photons, were full miss democratic function. dimitri daily on a, he says that the b is really genocide and gone through is well documented by id of soldiers themselves. and i think you have to be live in under a rock for the past 7 months to really not see israel committing genocide in guys. this is the most documented genocide thing. history and a people might deny it for political reasons, for being too cowards to face the truth and fear. so the consequences of saying the

truth, but after all, reality pushes itself and forces itself upon people. and some people might resist the tooth for so long. but they have, at the end of the day, many of them will give up to the, to admit the, to what happening is, god, god, that is not a war. it's a genocide, it's a genocide. would it be cleared, intent, but it's a, it's a genocide by the footage being filmed, but as weighed soldiers. it's a genocide by the reports of in defendant, the national organizations by definition, it is a genocide and it's nothing else but the genocide many thanks, tony gets there and i'll see international this monday coming your way next page level with the latest episode of cross talk will bit that was more news at the top

of the season, the the hello and welcome across by bullhorn john peter labelle. here we just got some real news is you're preparing for direct military conflict with russia. evidence suggests the answer is yes. also international law and the real global community is working to hold israel to account how much isolation is the us willing to accept. to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess, jordan, send me while we in budapest, he's a pod cast with the goggle which can be found on youtube and locals, and in marrow cash. we have martin jay, he is an award winning journalist and commentator. alright,

gentleman cross type rules and effect. that means you can jump any time you want, then i always appreciate it. all right, let's start. i was injured with george in budapest, over the last week, particularly we've seen these rumors of war as it were, coming from particularly something like the hum, gary and prime minister, but to urban. but many, many others in the. obviously escalation of the conflict in ukraine is on the agenda, as you claim continues to fault or i think as we speak right now, they're opening up the jails in the ukraine for convicts to go to the front. um, uh, we have a, a plethora of videos of, uh, circulating online but continued on for cannon fodder to send to the front. and we have simultaneously, we have people like david cameron, reading live, use those weapons deep into russia, british ones, by the way. and, and to be blinking, the state, the part of the, the secretary state,

i'm trying to corral people into some kind do about forceful agenda to escalate even more. so george, where is this all going? is this a because the way i think you can interpret it many ways the, you know there, unrelenting unwilling to accepted this whole project was as far as from the beginning. or this is an opportunity for to mobilize the west where a very long term agenda and not just against russia. george, that's a very good point to the, to and i think of the answer is both the, the hon. gary and prime minister the victor or binds interview a couple of days ago was a very interesting because he says, look hungry is taking part in these needs. so me things and i can tell you that in these meetings they are planning for and made so uh, involved and being ukraine. and he said that, um, you know, if this continues, essentially, um hungry will have to opt out. now,

he didn't exactly spell out what it means, opt out, but what, what type of se, but the fact the country would just simply the seems to be a member of nature. but he's saying that, and he said this explicitly that europe is now in this situation. he wasn't in 1914 and then 19. so it's not, it's on the brink of a well well. and then you have to say, well, why, why is that? and you talk about this, the crisis in the ukraine. the problem arises that uh, you know, when do was bring capital was breakout when great powers refused to give up. they can give up because if they gave up, they so used to be great powers that they, they just seems that they will be seen to be paid for tigers. and therefore they just have to, uh, go home and like a wounds. great powers are very reluctant to do that, and hence the escalation of this rhetoric, i mean one of the things you didn't, you didn't mention was because a good friend, major secretary general,

you installed them, but gave names of you to the economists thing which she also said yeah, absolutely. we have to take a whole restrictions on the use of us and any messiahs given to the brain, but they just don't know the body to the counselor and um and then we have um the, the out probably outgoing u. k prime minister risky soon i can also what he's going to introduce national service within his own which somebody description. everyone can say exactly exactly conscription and now it's true. he's likely to win any strew of labor. it has a criticize them. however, labor is the anointed one, these obviously they, they going to be in that, but i me say that doesn't, a labor itself is not going to introduce this in due course. so everyone of these is getting ready to boil big band. why? because they cannot admit delusion because you lose then basically you will need done it's, it's interesting because you know what, i'm making you made reference to the in the interview that uh the on gary and prime

minister victor are the main with the economist. a martin. i mean, he's absolutely right. i mean, looking at the, the precursors of the complex and for world war one in world war 2. but i think everybody needs to stand back here is that if this is a conflict that the nato european countries want, i mean rushes, not attacking any of these countries whatsoever. there is no in pending invasion of western europe by russia. there is no, and i mean even the, the, the biggest proponents are ukraine but probably wouldn't admit that it least not in pending right now. i mean, this is a craven choice on the part of europe into leads in american awaits is to prepare for a war that they want. go ahead, martin, to go nowhere else to go. i mean us through the problem, you know, wait back to minute themselves into this corner where by now they have run out of new plans, new ideas. and now what is the real point?

the real objective now of these at least is just self preservation. you know, and unfortunately indirectly the grading elite, i would say because that's something else here, but i'm talking about your team leader to see the houses, how the people that shows in my trunk. and also to seem to keep that political base when it, even the device missing phone frenchman or german, can see that we're losing a new crane and russia is gaining a certain point that will be a tipping point with mine's will be focus on the total will go through 3, will be more realistic rather than just to announce that i think when we are edging closer to is just recently the russian investors london told a british m b. but we know you'll storm shadows being side by british soldiers. we know you didn't train, you finance you sent around people to offer them. i think if america follows through with that, with his own equipment, she sends us on soldiers to find them. you know, we're a cigarette people away from the world. well, 3 scenarios, you know,

i'm going to invite dangers, talk to for cameron and others talk about hitting the inside russia. you know, how, how much computes and take, you know, i mean, even, even though he has a break and quite his generals, will be ongoing for, for a much more decisive policy against nate. so because this nato is doing this, but in the midst of this one i see from a distance i suppose is lack of dialogue, lack of debates, lack of effect, and you know, met press coverage, you know. and what happens is when you completely pump down on those this when you start arresting, john lis, oh, you lost the sized them for taking a different line. you know, what happens is the lead start to believe the around b s. and this is really part of the story, is that, you know, just recently last week there was some, as of, we gave soldiers in the british, panama. shameful, absolutely shameful. i'm not one gracious newspaper, right?

well, so we had, we had the secretary of state anthony blank and sitting in a, a p p 3 and in care of with his counterpart with the nazi regatta we um the walls. okay. i mean, george, you know anthony blank and went to israel. is a jew, is he a jew? when he goes many visits, key of when the seen the nazi regalia, i'm george there with writers is reporting number of reports. okay. the good news agreed to freeze the con. uh, conflict. okay. uh i, i would like to read um, you know, i'd like to see those reports myself because i think everyone obviously once you see the complet come to in freezing and complet plus neutrality plus change of reason, they don't mention that they just talk about one thing but it's really interesting when we go back to the interview that the food made with ad with tucker carlson. why don't you this test the russians if you want to freeze the conflict of tell me more, but they won't even do that george? well that's, that's exactly right the to, and i don't think that i would love to say we don't know that roy does report is

very true, but it's not impossible because really is there is only one on file to that is the growing up in the room and, and that's a built in and put in does not want a world war because this is crazy to escalate to was that? um and so i think he's putting forward, i mean maybe, i mean i, i find it plausible, but he was put forward a scenario that he couldn't even hear things. the west can accept without feeling that they'd be humiliated. but obviously anything that they have now seems to be a great powers. i look, you know, if we freeze it along these lines, um, you know, you can at least say that you've got something we can say with the something. and then we can just bring this very dangerous of confrontation to an end. the problem is that isn't losing, there are no jacobs. and this goes back again to the, the, the discussions of man's gun that is done, both russia made and no one was concessions really very on favorable to russia. and

he was the last, i said, no, no, we can, we can go away. we can actually conflict the total devastating strategic defeat on russians total humiliation bratia. and we can get away with the numbers you comp, but it's the same reason you can't just empty the phase as you really, it's a great power, but that was, it was the west, the active response. when is the west now, then instead of engaging in a serious dialogue, because rough is clearly open to dialogue, have these nonsensical peace conference in guest switzerland, which russia hasn't been invited even today to say. and this is an entirely a public relations exercise. nothing to the peace conference, but just in therapy. oh, we own it. it was the landscape based plan, which was russians. capitulation, you know, you know, martin, it's very interesting. we've, we've heard repeatedly, particularly from the likes of the french president mcclellan. you know, russia should not be allowed to win. well, that is, that is a wish list. that is a political statement,

but that doesn't have anything to do with security and moving forward. and that's always been the key issue that the west never really will open. will admit, is that the core of all of this rest of the security demands and we had, we had this process during the cold war, b o s. c. we had the health in the process. no one in the west. no take there's, as george said, go ahead barton. yeah. how's it going to be? intake is now, you know, it, it doesn't seem to be so it, i think we have to wait for something quite a catastrophic to happen before head. so thing together that nascent level of a, you level for people to actually start talking about some the realities of what we can do, you know, the name. so come when this will what it's now looking at some diseases. i mean, i've been told by some of my m a g sources in new kinds of some ministers in the british government. i'm now saying we need to get out of the crane. so these people are now starting to say, look, the reality is, this is a war company, one kind of in be a will, which with is that can be some thickness,

see some grace and losing either can we step back from is, but i don't see any real of this scenario, so you're not seeing, we're going round around in circles and i don't think names. so is the building really? we don't have the people in it who can really look at this realistically, and i've come up with that as the intelligence. you know, so i think there's a, there are a number of elk similar ones that play here, even the narrative, you know, we keep hearing russia is coming. but that narrative is really nonsense because the people who bump bang, bang the drum and say that of the same countries that have completely depleted their own stocks, the minute of hardware. so, you know, you, you obviously don't believe in that in that well, i mean, in another, in decatur georgia last 30 seconds here. is that victoria new and is suddenly back in the newest. i mean, i mean, you know, teach dislodge from her as perch, but she is actually leading the fight for the military industrial complex and the neocons. 15 seconds george. yeah, she's, and she's also echoing this has been,

you talking point no restraints. that's all on the use of missiles and the, and that's what i have that everybody is on board for that. i'm just going back to his mouth. he was saying that story m p, who said that it's the the, the, the british oh actually firing the storm shadow. miss of also says that with the, with the new care style and the government. but actually we will be told that we are more than you just so he said that right on that dreadful thought, gentlemen, we have to go to a hard break and that's about hardwick. we'll continue our discussion. so we'll need to stay with archie. the, the world's largest democracy votes the rest of the planet watches in an emerging multi polar world. india's voice matters, but who will be the power behind it? watches almost 1000000000 people decide and billions more, react the,

the welcome back to prospect bullhorn and peter labelle here, we're discussing some real news. martin is, i guess, you know, you and i, in george, you've been observers of politics for our entire adult lives. okay. and i never thought in my wildest imagination that b i c j and the i c, c would be so focused on, on a focused on the activities of israel. and it's a legal behavior and it's a small town gone. so, but here we are right now, but the problem with all of this is that the israel is isolated, but it's been isolated for much as existence as a pariah of many countries in the world. i've always considered it a pariah. not

a big difference. okay. maybe in magnitude and maybe um, uh, in breadth, but israel has been used to that status. the united states is not. okay. and the, the, the, the problem that is facing the united states and needs that's close as allies is a of the more and more that the can genocide conventions are studied and applied. then you have complicity. and those that are complicit are in the same category is committing genocide itself. this is something the western world is slowly and terrifyingly waking up to go ahead martin with him too. and also i think realizing that the more we go down this right, the more that we start issuing these rates from the i c j ser, nothing higher messing i and others you know, and the more america shows is really what is all about what's in a what is the i c, j for america is his, it's america's own to, for germany. nothing more,

nothing less. and i think when i think it was instagram who said recently and some sort of congressional meeting, you know, it's like going from this, i'm yahoo! and he's raised and will it be us next? and i think that really was martin if i can interrupt that was during a congressional hearing and they were protesters in the crowd witnessing that committees proceedings and they applauded it and he said, go ahead. you can applauded if you want that we're going to mazing moment. sorry for the reps, interrupted was absolutely amazing because it really let the cut of the back now. now with now there was clarity. now, you know, even the last few weeks we will be discussing, i had to wondering, you know, where is this heading on rudy? and i said to you, i think at the very beginning of the conflict on the show, i sent them the current balance of the i, c j will really be hills now to it'll be a real issue now. right. and the very beginning when it, and it had his ruling a couple of months ago. you know, i think that point now is, is a fund even more, and i'm not putting myself on the backs my precedence. what i'm saying is that if

the i c j lose his credibility, you know, of the huge institutions around the world, i think i'm going to fall, or because global south leads or just looking at his institutions and saying, well is last just now, just to help america squeeze by the seals, manipulates people. i'm sorry, people in jail, they come was estimated, you know, then why should we be part of it? and what happens is that just accentuates momentum towards breaks towards the east . you know, so i think come these recent announcements by the button administration following this, the legal case which is building up the, the i c j. i think that's a real, that's a really bad signal towards huge wisdom to control. and so she's, well, i mean, but martin if, if you look at the i, c j, then i'll go in and george right now. i mean, these are all web inventions of the west in the, in the post world war 2 posting are and bird environment. these are all western institutions, and i mean it, and particularly the i, c, c, you know,

the international case in court, which so many people call it. but i mean, it's just of these institutions. it is the legitimacy of the west to, to continue to a lead and, and them and make the demand that they have the right to lead because they can, they stand taller and they see further in the all this other nonsense that we've heard, that is all at stake right now, it's just not institutions. it's this the, the very legitimate legitimacy of the western experiment for the human race. george, this is the also to write these later. and just going back to your original question, which was that the well, yes, israel has often been isolated indians that actual community but not the united states. and what's really going on now is really a kind of a self inflicted wounds on the cause of the united states, because there's no reason for it because, you know, yes, obviously the united states is in the business of being the global headroom. and

once a bit dominate the world, you know the full spectrum dominance that talks with the united states has been about. but this unremitting support for israel stands in the way of that. because the dispenser go for the for many, many reasons antagonizes an awful lot of countries as well as completely isolated being the middle east. it has to be of war with its neighbors ever since its foundation that isn't likely to change any time. so america is on voters that and then you in exchange for nothing. so right good isolates. and so, and for a for goes that's actually the cheap nothing for the united states. and so now it's, it's, are issuing threats against me until i feel criminal court. doubtless it goes us up issue and threats against needs. and i for the board of justice and bid that stands in the way all american global hatred when they, because they're a bunch of bowers, who are more than happy to be american ply and states do with america's bidding.

but not on this issue. particularly in the middle east on this extra bit by calling follow the united states. so it's quite an extraordinary that of the self inflicted wounds that named the united states. the impact of bradley was still the deeper and take even more dangerous work. so, oh, you know, and because martin, if in israel does what it does, because it deals, it has the privilege of impunity. and because it has american backing, it's all we have shielded. but that's why this happens. this is something the united states is allowed since the inception of visual, particularly since the 67 war. and now it's coming back to hunt them because this is not only is georgia is, you know, what does the us get out of this when they, when it looks it, it's global hedge, a monic rich not much. it's may, it may have a good negative returns, but now this is impacting domestic politics in the western world where you see these huge divisions going on and, and it's quite terrifying. you know, i mean, well, you know, george and i covered brushing gates early when, you know,

there was a new mccarthyism. what's going on now is books that level of mccarthyism and it's small potatoes in comparison and for, for what? okay, so this and p energy is destroying the very fabrics of the ideals the, the bad i'll use the we, we claim to hold. go ahead martin. yeah, i think nixon put it very well when he was talking about the book he wrote, you said, you know, we don't really get much out of the relationship with israel. and the main reason why we're so close to these right is because of the holocaust. because the history, you know, but i think to take george's point so very well, you know, self inflicted wounds such and such really and one that is gaping now. but it wouldn't be the button administration that looks at this from, with any objective perspective they want kind of had a cup to view a think about the, the implications of the next 2010 or 20 years. it might be the next adult. this generation of politicians and leaders in america who questioned this relationship.

you know, in the old days it was, well, we need is one in the middle east because if the sort of rebellious children otherwise knows, the adverb stays, but become a little bit north. he had a bit difficult to deal with israel, be that a crack, the width of the show, the rest of the region, you know, who's where the running the show. but, well, i big and also, and also martin unity. great mean may end up the soviet union. george, this is, this is impacted the greater middle east. amazing way. because you had the, the, we have israel was within the context of a cold hor rivalry when that disappears. that's when it became actually far more dangerous, because israel, because they've been sense of impunity, we'd be able to pursue with goals, go back with the westbank for example, and now attacking causal repeatedly. if we'd been in a cold war environment, it's doubtful that would have happened george. so that's exactly right. and this is very interesting because if you go back to the cold war mentality,

it was really henry kissinger who define the issues in the middle east in terms of the cold war. somehow. israel is the look the west leave. the being uh, the cyber lied or you know, waging a, so the, its sponsor and the western the world. and of course, it was nonsensical names, nonsensical at the time in the science. and the mix of did not agree with that analysis of the middle east. so suddenly that his secretary of saint william rogers did not think of that view, but that was case and you again he kind of voice that this idea onto the united states. that's the reason why we're providing israel with this up on question on the remaining support is that israel is fighting the cold war against soviet aggression. all now they have moved, they get them because once a cold war ended, you have to invent new things. and so even as they is law, make a g. huh. then the global islamic revolution, now it's about the work is

a global work is um and israel is in the full front of the 5 or is, or at least people get into fights with national silver entity. and your gains. globalism is always something new. the sides that be as well as in the leader of because it isn't then it's just a way of avoiding ever talking about what google serial issues are in the middle east. and that's, and that's why on this, it goes on is that, you know, everything venting these uh new etiology is why, why we have 2 of the support, the israel unconditionally learn. wait, wait, we have the u. k. elections coming up very, very soon. how is this issue with the israel palestine in the i, c j got them playing out in that election? if at all it's going to have a huge impact on both sides of the huge blocks. because um, it's a general purpose to jump. perception is the labor are going to get how much because of the ridiculous, some sort of support of the genocide of, of a on israel side. but also i think that too, as well we will these be,

or is it very hard only because the lack of decision, lack of strategy on all of other issues by this time it least is, is just want it. so what's gonna happen is the low price can be split right down the middle. but jeremy cool by now looking to be ready to perhaps try and try and make some sort of stand against overlay because we know the tories are going to be desecrated. you know, so i think the emergence now of some of the policies like george galloway's but others as well. you know, i think it's going to be a real issue. you know, we, we, we, this has been so long. since we've had a real phone policy, that makes any sense when i'm known. it's been so long since we've been able to distance ourselves from america. you know that i think people are sick. i'm sick to death of really having foreign ministers and a british government who basically whatever the state diploma. you know, so i think israel and palestine will be an issue, a big issue. but i think it over hit slave

a honda doing well in the same questions and george with we have november elections coming up. what's the difference between trump invite and when it comes to this issue? i ask that because i know it's a short answer. not much, but if that's an interesting question, what was seen in the last few weeks have been big donors, hedge fund managers, people who didn't like chrome. and now suddenly moving towards the trunk, because they said by then is betraying israel by who's throwing israel under the bus. and they think trump would be a more reliable friend of israel. and that could be very interesting. um, within the i think when it was one of the houses, i think what it tells us is this, this line is by the ologies, is corrupted western politics to the core. unfortunately, gentlemen, that's all the time we have one, i think my guess in america and in budapest and of course i want to thank our viewers for watching us here. are to see you next time. remember prospect rules the

grades and may so with the some number of states and family oppose plans to run these weapons supplied by the block deep into russian territory. stable. that is a roadmap to weld for 3. if we cannot contain divorced psychosis that is developed in brussels, these years will be written as episodes of a great european world war to the, the latest icon round hills, at least 45 people despite the international court of justice, rolling that to yourselves, most of the kind of somebody opposes to us saying the taiwan call just

a us delegation vis.