enforces the latest all about, and they funded our team. come combine the, [000:00:00;00] the executive, and i'm here to plan with you whatever you do. do not watch my new show. seriously . why watch something that's so different. listed of opinions that he won't get anywhere else. welcome to please, or do the have the state department, the c i a weapons, bankers,

multi 1000000000 dollar corporations. choose your fax for you. go ahead. change and whatever you do. don't want marshall state main street because i'm probably going to make you uncomfortable. my show is called direction, but again, we don't wanna watch it because it might just change the way you known in vietnam as the american war, the vietnam war lost its almost 2 decades and dragged in numerous countries. not any time between now and then you don't really know what to go on. empty. hundreds of thousands of american troops was sent to the country to bank the south vietnamese on me. i got to say no not that not, but american soldiers murdered resistors mercilessly burned down entire villages

and spread dangerous chemicals. and lee by all right, did the americans ever fully acknowledge what they did on the vietnamese veterans ready to forgive? yeah, yeah, yeah, that's. that's a ways to go. yeah. the 2024 has been a busy year for whistle blowers. we've all seen the media reports of whistle blowers coming out of the f. b. i the internal revenue service and other us government entities. we've seen media reports about crooked hospital administrators, criminal bank executives, and stock market cheap. and i'm not talking about just in the united states. beer opin union has taken action to further protect whistle blowers and member countries . but in several african countries,

there has been back sliding on with the flow of protection. and in some of those countries with the floors lives are actually in danger. i'm john kerry. aku welcome to the whistle blowers the . 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 there has been so many important whistle blowers over the years . big names like daniel ellsberg, edward snowden, bradley burke and feld. any meshawn and catherine gun, just to name a few, that you wouldn't be wrong to think that official opinion, the opinion of governments had changed. so that these truth tellers were protected for the revelations, but that's not necessarily the case. certainly many countries have moved forward on with the blower protection. the european union immediately comes to mind, but the us and u. k. are not among those forward thinking countries, in most cases at least involving government whistle blowers, the u. s. and

u. k. site. national security is the reason for not welcoming new disclosures, and indeed they use the espionage jack and the official secrets act respectively to prosecute whistle blowers. but why hasn't more been done to protect private sector whistle blowers? why do people who blow the whistle on waste fraud abuse, illegality, or threats to the public health or public safety at big pharma, in international banking, international conglomerates and elsewhere still face the untampered raft of their companies. where are the protections for these whistle blowers, or next guess jane turner was a trailblazer at the federal bureau of investigation. she joined the fbi i in 1978 and became the organization's 1st swat member swat is the special weapons and tactics team. she investigated some of the most high profile crimes of the last 40 years, including the abortion clinic bombings and the central park preppy murder. she was

involved in the capture of christopher boyce, whose story was told in the film the falcon in the snowman. and she worked on the case of gary allan ridgeway the notorious green river killer, who murdered 49 women in washington state. in 1999 jane turner brought to the attention of her management team, serious misconduct concerning failures to investigate and pressed to crimes against children on native american reservations in north dakota. she also reported on the criminal theft of property from the 911 ground, 0 crime scene. and just to make matters worse, her superiors discriminated against her just because she was a smart and accomplished woman. in the n, jane turner suited the f b i, and she won a large monetary settlement. beyond that, government watchdog groups used her case to demand that the f, b i and the broader federal government address the issues of wisdom blowing and

retaliation. jane now heads the national whistle blower center in washington. jane, thanks so much for joining us. it's great seeing you again. your work with whistle blowers, literally every single day across industries. whether it's some government, the military or the private sector. what does the landscape look like for whistle blowers compared to a year ago or 2 years ago? is it getting better or worse? well that's a really good question, john. it's. 7 i think better it gets better every year of what's happening now is we're reaching out to international whistle blowers and we're really getting together with those leaders over in europe who are heading a whistle blower organizations. and it's quite exciting. and of course now the d. o j is looking at the stablish in a whistle blower office, which if it happens would be revolutionary. i've seen in the press that the department of justice has initiated a whistleblower program and that there is currently

a public comment phase. what can you tell us about that program and might it be a model for elsewhere and government? well, i'll tell you, this is exciting news. what is happening is a on a plane might the department of justice put out an inquiry program? it's a 90 day sprint, they call it and it is to start its own whistle blower rewards program. that is quite exciting because as you know, whistle blowers have sat on the other side in court with the department of justice sold for them to embrace whistle blowers is revolutionary. but they've started this 90 day sprint. what is this is how they call it to get input about this program that would be established at the department of justice. and we're

hoping and advocating for everyone to go to the national whistleblower center web and sign the petition. it's critically important because to help this program would help whistle blowers tremendously. and the course there calling for the national was the lower center, has written to deal j and asked them to make a, not the most and confidential reporting channels for woodside lowers establishment of the office, which would be revolutionary. like i said, the inclusion of whistle blowers involved in criminal misconduct. so they have a way to voice their truth and get some awards. and of course the discretionary administration of awards. it's quite exciting. and if we could get people to sign that petition, it would change the world. it really would. they based on the fcc award system, which has been incredibly successful and brought in millions and millions of

dollars. you are heavily involved in an anti corruption conference at the national whistle blower center. much of the consulting work that i've done related to whistle blowing has been around the issue of anti corruption. tell us about the conference and about what you hoped to accomplish their as well. the conference hopefully brings in people from all different elements, you know, with the dodd frank and what that has done is established in the financial industry, tremendous awards. and you've seen a more people have gotten anonymously a, a $110210000000.00. ready wildly successful, more than they can handle. so this anti corruption, a policy or program is to include more whistle blowers,

more than just what is in the financial realm. and it should be highly successful gain. why is whistle blowing sometimes so partisan? i'm speaking about government with a blowing here, a whistle blower goes public about a conversation that donald trump has with the foreign leader. and the whistle blower is labeled a democratic hack f b. i. agents go public about the 100 by laptop and they're labeled. busy as republican hex, why is that? well, as you and i both know it is to marginalize the whistleblower. that is the simple explanation. you can uh try to destroy them with one slash for your pin. um i, i've been disheartened by what's happened with the f b i whistle blowers and them being branded that way because it's just not stare. but that's how you know, i remember when we came out, if you were a woman with the blower, you fell under the knots and slots, right?

if you were a male or they referred to, you was a crank. this just happens to be the new way of kind of handling whistle blowers not only taking your security clearance, but labeling new. is partisan, unfortunate, and please stay with us jane. we're going to talk about trends in with the blowing and why laws and public opinion haven't kept up with those trends after we take a short break. so stay tuned. we'll be right back. the. 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2

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the water is part of the leg, isn't it? but it would post that. is it the defense you of us in that, in the word? or is it something deeper, more complex might be present? let's stop without collision. let's go out of as the ukraine in leadership will probably be happy to have a low intensity conflict,

a constant marshall low awards elections and continued engaging external uh, financial assistance precisely because then the stem that once there's these it will be much more difficult to pass or the huge spending on the train through the american then you're being far women's. the welcome back to the whistle blowers. i'm john kerry onto we're speaking with famed f b. i whistleblower jane turner. she's also the director of the national whistleblower center based in washington dc. good to have you with this jane. pleasure to be on your program to explain these programs through whistle blowers and advocate for them. jane, i'd like to discuss official responses to whistle blowing. i recently attended an event on capitol hill in honor of to whistle blowers from the internal revenue

service who were given an award for their work on the hunter biden case. this was a well publicized event. it was honoring to whistle blowers who had been in the news. and besides senator charles grassley, who's a well known friend too, and supporter of whistle blowers, nobody showed up nobody besides their friends and a small group of other whistle blowers. why do you think that is there are 535 members of congress? why do you think that only one thought that this was an event where the of his time . wow, i'm very disheartened to hear that john. uh, that makes me very sad. i did not, i did not hear about that, but you're right to, you know, even in minnesota here i cannot get my senators to get involved amy clover char as close the door. um it's uh, i think they're afraid they're afraid to support

a whistle blower and it worries me that grassley may be gone at the uh, at the next election that that makes me very sad because who do we have to advocate for us on the hill? i bought some step forward. i really do that makes me very sad, john. yeah, me too. i've spoken recently with an increasingly large number of whistle blowers in the private sector who reach out to me and ask for advice. most of these whistle blowers are involved, either in medical care or in pharmaceuticals. and in the meantime, we're seeing more and more reporting about waste fraud and abuse in those industries. do you think that's a co incidence or are you seeing a trend from where you sit to? well, i'll tell. yeah. it seems like we're getting more and more whistle blowers are stepping forward. which tells you the culture surrounding whistle blowers might be changing . which is great, as you know,

we're trying to make national whistleblower date permanent. we have also had a petition for that to go forward with making it permanent. we think it's time to honor the whistleblower which is or to see change from uh, decades ago as you know, you've suffered through it, i've suffered through it and we're trying to change the culture surrounding it. and so we're doing these things like making national was a lower de permit of by trying to get this office of whistle blower in the department of justice. what a wonderful thing to have. people in pharmaceutical, other areas like that medical could certainly, uh, uh, put in their claim there at the department of justice. it would be a wonderful thing to happen. and we've got to get everybody on board to sign a petition up for this office to be established in the d o. j. critically important

. critically. another question that i get jane is about attorneys. there are very few attorneys out there who focus on whistle blowing, and so it's very difficult to find representatives who actually know the world of whistle blowing. is that improving in your experience or is there a shortage of whistleblower attorneys? there's definitely a shortage of knowledgable whistle blower attorneys. oh, it's definitely lacking in that spear. and the reason of course is 2 things. first of all, the d o j has made it extremely a lengthy process to accomplish a whistle blower. it takes you and i both know that it takes years and years and years. so i think here again, if we can get an office a deal j that might change the blockades that they set up. they're supposed to set up these block h. um so you know,

that's one reason it's steven comb with my case and i know your case is the same. went for almost 15 years. i mean that's ridiculous. you think any attorney wants to take the case that last 15 years? no. no, no, that doesn't happen. so very few are willing to jump in. some of the ones who do are not knowledgeable, and you have to be knowledgeable about these incredibly confusing rules. they're terrible on regarding whistle blowing in the process. and um, i think it's getting better, more and more jumping in because you know why monetary awards a, get a big chunk of the monetary rewards that are now awarded to whistle blowers. so again, that's why we need the d o. j office, a whistleblower in,

in order to get these awards that make more attorneys feel that this is lucrative and worth their time. jane, what can you tell us about the co operation between american whistle blowing organizations like the national with of lower center and whistle blowing organizations overseas. i'm thinking particularly of the myriad of whistleblower protection groups and the u. k. or the european union, or perhaps even something like blueprint for free speech and australia. oh, you bet there is close cooperation. steven cohen has gone over to england. worked with the. busy w b, whistle blowers of the u. k. and i know the executive director stream like, well, i've been to her house. we work very closely with the u. k. right now there's a conference. it's going to happen in june and greece and i am on assume panel for that, jackie garrick of whistle blowers of. busy america is going over there. so yes,

in south africa i coast whistle blowers from there all the time on my part guess whistleblower of the week. so this is the change we're seeing is this interface thing with the international whistle blowers. and we're also providing training which they desperately need because uh, they're about 15 years behind us in terms of whistle blower law. and how about, you know, work with whistle blowers. so those organizations you have mentioned are wonderful and they're, and they're really working hard to kind of bring our whistle blower programs into their countries. it's steven has been on the road a lot. national was the lower center staff has just returned from mexico and a conference down there. so this is the future of whistle blowing. is this anti corruption? oh,

focus and getting them up to speed kind of where we're at. and we're certainly not hitting on all cylinders here, but we're working hard to try to get there. this office of whistleblower at the department of justice would be incredibly positive for the whistleblower world. that's why it's so important and your whistle blowers go to the website. uh, the national whistle blower center and sign that petition. and if they've got a few loose coins in their pocket, also go to go fund me and support whistle blowers were trying to get a lobbyist upon the hill to advocate for whistle blowers. here again, you know, how important the lobbyist is. it's about the only way you can get things done in washington. absolutely true. absolutely true. finally, jane, what do you think the near term future holds for whistleblowers? is that landscape improving or is it worsening and has your advice for would be was

have lowers, changed at all over the past year? so a well, that's a good question john. and i'll tell you we're having our national whistle blower day on july 31st. and what do you see? the crowds get bigger and bigger. and i hope you'll attend this year. you wonder if that's an incredible it's on the hill and it's an incredibly time a gathering tribal gathering for whistle blowers and july 31st of this year. and they will have some incredible people there. and i see whistle blowers cold less the much more than they used to. there was a lot of in fighting inviting. i'm struggling for control. i think those days are over. i really do. um, we're working hard on getting whistle blowers on the same page aimed in the same direction like this office,

a whistleblower at the department of justice. and that's critically important if you need to have a good lawyer if you're going to have a whistleblower case. but i'll tell you this office of list of lower department of justice if that comes to reality. that's a check part. that isn't in credit. busy happening so i really, really like your listeners to do those 2 things. go to the national, was the blower center sign the petition for the office, the whistleblower at department of justice, which would be a see change and go to go fund me support whistle blowers and give some coins out of your pocket. some paper out of your pocket and the support whistle blowers so we can get a lobbyist up on the hill. and thank you, john, for all you do for whistle blowers. i mean this is why we're making positive changes. is because of people like you or bringing the word to the masses or

getting with lowers together. i cannot tell you how important you are in the world whistle blowing. i cannot emphasize enough what youtube jane turner, thank you so much for joining us. thomas jefferson, who was one of the founding fathers of the united states and who served as the countries 3rd president, one said quote, honesty is the 1st chapter in the book of wisdom and quote, honesty and was blowing go hand in hand. forgive me if i sound like a broken record for the internationally recognized definition of whistle blowing is bringing to light any evidence of waste, fraud, abuse, illegality, or threats to the public health or public safety. it really is as simple as that. not every thing in life is a shade of gray. not every thing in life must be rationalized. some things are black and white right or wrong. it's the whistle blower who holds the government's corporations and others to account. it's all for the public good. and that's why as

difficult as the road may be, we need more and more whistle blowers. thanks for joining us for another episode of the with the blowers. i'm john kerry. aku, please follow me on sub stack at john kerry. i will see you next. 2 2 2 2 2 2 the it was a major issue, you will probably be doing it by giving me the conditional insurance little opinion, appreciate the code and because of the issue simply went through because you will get to the subject yourself. okay, so should the cases,

i chose customer care of them and then i just need to spell the name and you're shipping them us from the folks on the plaza road, norma jean, you know about what it was, the turn your customer simply didn't do some of the scriptures, to the point, this is sort of able to study section 4, we want to build some of the treasures to go at actual need on that i'm forward to for so from the, from ranking to when the take a fresh look around his life kaleidoscopic isn't just a shifted reality distortion by power to division with no real opinions fixtures designed to simplify all confused who really wants

a better wills and is it just as a chosen few fractured images presented to this, but can you see through their illusions, going underground can known in vietnam as the american war, the vietnam war lost its almost 2 decades and dragged in numerous countries. not any time right now and then you don't see it. now. what is all i'm empty? hundreds of thousands of american troops was sent to the country to bank the south vietnamese on me. and the american soldiers murdered resistors mercilessly to down entire villages and spread dangerous

chemicals and lee. by all right, did the americans ever fully acknowledge what they did on the vietnamese veterans ready to forgive? yeah, yeah. yeah. that's, that's a ways to look forward to talking to you all that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, except we're so shorter is that conflict with the 1st law show your mind, anticipation. we should be very careful about our personal intelligence. the point obviously, is to rates trust rather than fit the various jobs. i mean, with the artificial intelligence, we have somebody in the, in the

a robot must protect this phone existence for the or the trying to welcome to worlds a part just by the old, the western military assistance. and the escalating retorted calling him also to the conflict in ukraine is still constrained by some unspoken understanding between the russian, the west as to what's allowed or what's not. where are these van lines and what may happen if they are cross of to discuss that? i'm now joined by it was

a caution director and the center for comprehensive europe and then international