are the ones who are saying she's not a real journalist and the ones for buying law, the fact that he endangered his sources that she has bladder in his hands. yeah, well, i mean, it's a difficult tradeoff. i think that we know for a fact based on us legal submissions in the trial of chelsea mounting, and also julian's own trial that nobody was at the homes by which leaks some disclosures. so, i mean to see people trusting out this perverse libel is pretty repulsive, but it's also to be expected. i think that the uh it as a means of maintaining this main stream. stigma around julian without your even while he's a and a legacy like say to speak as a think of what we've seen. a lot of this me is that have been directed as a science over the past kind of decade and a half. i spun out but the,

the as what majority of people are listening, you know, nobody takes the mainstream media service anymore. nobody believes that the name is a russian agent or a or right test or a threat to national security. they see him as a valued truth. tell the who was persecuted and tortured. so the crime is publishing secrets the us government didn't want it in the public domain. you'll come from the cradle of democracy. indeed. and then i'll wait. here in the balkans we have always a, as we have been for decades asking for those standards of journalism and that kind of freedom of the press. so could you start by telling me how did you get in trouble with your own government, practicing journalism or yeah, sure. well, um, when i see back to the london last which was in may 2023. and there was a team of on account of terror police charity waiting for me on the tomeka. and i've been expecting to potentially be this stop to the border. and ever since i

made these sites lever reporting on pool masons leaked emails. um this pull, my son is a, a breakfast generalist, who has been a distinguished himself as a noisy, 18 propagandist, the nato, and the proxy war and ukraine since february 2022. and a, i'm was targeting a number of people that i needed, including journalist and academics, and activists who were opposed to the proxy will. and these lead email showed that he was toward the nice thing, his activities in coordination. so he was coordinating his activities with a, a position intelligence officer link to my, my 6th. um uh so i mean, the public's interest in reporting on the seemed like pretty clear that i've been subsequently received in the an email from a previous detective inviting me cool daily to an interview in london. what did they do? they say that i know that you said they've fingerprinted, you take, took your dna and that also says dory, or out of trying to equipment. right?

yeah. and so effectively august thoughts on the legislation which is called the 2019 counter terrorism and border act, which effectively creates suspicion with crying. and so the wording is orwellian and it disturbing the vague. so it states that you can be suspected of working in the instruct tress, obey hostile foreign power without knowing you all, and without the foreign power, in whose interest you are operating, knowing you are ease. it's quite some conspiracy. when conspirators don't know that they are conspiring and so uh, the oh yeah, i was subject to dna swab. so i was told by counts of terry officer with a sick northern irish jackson, which gives you some indication of, of his professional background. and what he was getting up to who during the trouble is quite some, quite a that the, if my dna wasn't found on a, on, on an i,

i e, d, in afghanistan, it would be deleted within 6 months, which, you know, it wasn't particularly reassuring. and i was forced to hand over the pos passwords and pin cards to my sim cards to my digital devices. and if i refused, i would have interested to cooperate. yeah. so i decided to cooperate because i felt, well, i have nothing to hide. how to ones that i was almost an extensive questions about my personal and professional background, my personal life, why i write, say, and think the things to, to do and, and then was that was more general that was very, very specific. questions about the greys and it was, it was clear that this was that, that, that the to trust of their interest and the great zone is an independent investigative site in united states. right. that should work for you right for. yeah. yeah, well i mean i, i run the, the k division of whatever the task will do in a way of price on

a shoe string because we are independent and reject cool. the interested in the credit zones. i mean, anything related to belgrade. yeah. they, they didn't have any the, i mean they wanted to know why list and said, yeah, what did you say? all right, well, i said um, cuz uh, because, uh, well i, i stated that i loved the people. i loved the culture and loved the history and the foods pretty good tickets. and they fix that for a reason. yeah. they, they accepted that, although i think that they, it was very, very clear that they found everything about me intensely suspicious. so they all asked me specifically what, how and why i got into writing about national security issues. but also why i writes about the versus government. i mean, it seemed quite a strange concept to them that you would criticize your own government, which i think speaks volumes about that this fact it's on the well, but yeah, the, the, the, they were the so interest was the grazing and why i writes the particular things this i do for them they,

they prefer the initially stated that they were interested in every what this i rightful. but then they didn't tell us one question about the crate where i am a regular countries to again and an independent use results focused on west asia. they didn't off development press news in 5, even referred to at one stage, has been processed. and then there were a large number of questions about my reporting on, on a, a, a cool filing which i did. 2 of the 911 hijackers at least 2 of them were working for the c i. they were very interested, not one of them let slip that he a good at one of the office. i might add the i was not allowed to learn the names. they were the i was given that co sign, so it was like b one an a 2. and at one stage they would the female offices seem to forget what her writing co sign was, which was quite false. so, um, but, but yeah, and there were lots of questions about russia and my whether i passed sending you

an eruption intelligence officials on had regular contact with them to which the on so was of course no. and the also at a completely ludicrous question about whether the grays and had a formal agreement with the speed to publish hacked information, which i kind of that spluttering. the said no, because it is just such a bizarre, all the line of inquiry. and then i was asked why i responded the way decided, why was i so it was us and, and then finally down this done towards the end was in was, you know, how does a, it has a chilling effect. yeah. people who practice or that that it yeah, well actually, and is i mean on, on, on that subject versus government has now paused, is even more horrifying legislation for the national security act, which creates all sorts of new criminal offenses. and like the legislation and which i was detained and interrogated and has very vague kind of always perplexing

language. where it states that, well, we can, some can be convicted of working for a foreign intelligence service without prove, without the pressure state needing to prove what for an intelligent service that working for, or that something that can be convicted for receiving a coaching quite benefits from a intelligent service without that benefit being defined, my overall take is the, this is effectively creating a frame. what web i, literally, anyone can be prosecuted for any reason. it's just a matter of who they choose to prosecute and match. i imagine that they're all mainstream john, this will not be affected by this formation when he comes home loans option for you, right? well, tell me what kinds of things are the government for example, i've noticed and i'm and i'm not knowledgeable in the role of intelligent services . so i've noticed that you have it made it

a habit of saying and by the way, alicia kerns, i think she's an am i 6 agent. mm hm. and by the way, our former ambassador in scope, yet when you look at what she has done, there are a lot of things that make me believe that she has been a lifetime. and my 6th member there are these the kinds of things that upset people . yes, absolutely, and i think the, the britson has and this is level 9 done and i, outside the country has the probably the most pervasive. and i'm under kind of in the system of state secrecy and perhaps the wealth, the, the, i mean set me in the west and well and they're all in it for, for, for very long time. the government has had a very effects, very effective, direct and indirect means of censoring and dictating what does and doesn't get reported on. so there is a very little 9 ministry of defense body known as the d. s. m a committee. this is

the defense and security media advisory committee is quint essentially british, which is to say, gentlemanly and dishonest. so it's run out of the ministry of defense and his stuff by mid a tree and intelligence veterans. but it claims to be independent of government. and what it convenes, regular meetings between major editors of the essence of major newspapers, met members of pressure associations and arranges tours for them around the offices of m y 6 and g c h q. it's great, it's kind of tell me crony type relationship between mainstream jarvis and the security and intelligence services, but it also does as well, is it routine? the issues, what's known as the notice is which effectively means do not published notices. so if they feel a story is about to break, which contains information they don't, once in the public domain, they write to john, listen editors and say, would you be, please be, that's

a good sports. and not mentioned this person's name. all these bits of information, are they good support and invariably uh, it doesn't get reported on. it says bowling trade, quite some quotes, but it's behind that people know that that will be consequences if they don't. you know this heavily censored media, this is not the image we have the united kingdom even deserves who are not too fond of the way the u. k. has handled what's what's your professional and personal background? i mean, how did you turn out the way you did? because most of your colleagues, you do not have to go to this country. no, well i mean, i think i'm, if you have any understanding of how the british private school system and the lee university system work, it's is a very effective means of turning out and uh on questioning. so vile

a fascist believes effectively, who then yes, they are taught to crave power to face power to love power. and then these people invariably end up in positions of power. and that the specs is that for then shape the world around the, the, in the, pretty much the entire seat of the british media is comprised of people who went to a lead british private schools to get up the intelligence services. likewise, the ministry. likewise, governments, likewise, it's a uh, very specific club, which the average person is complete, the shots household. and so no, yes, knowing how the system operates and knowing how actually talks it can crisis because it does give you a desire and drive and the kind of practical framework to challenge

it, which they really don't like. so how does bell grades become your safe haven? um, well, i've been living in london for 30 years, which is longer than anyone should this and not not said to you, i'm a very rare example of someone who was actually born that and that the as it is right transients and made of people from the home counties these days, but in fact i began traveling through eastern europe regularly and largely because it was cheap and which london says to me isn't, and i, uh, i very much kind of identified with the people, you know, parts of goals, hard as nails and ios and like when i went to, when i came to sub yeah, it was a real kind of through the looking glass. and my experience me because i'm old enough to remember the criminal destruction of you can solve you and all of the relentless media tub, something for nato to kill sides. and the,

and the relentless demonize ation of savvy, or in his people as a nation of genocidal a ball barrick savages. and i was actually confronted with the most the kindest, most courteous and welcoming people i've ever met. and, and, and i realized that the numerous number of things that i believed about the well, well, completely untrue. and it was, it was quite liberating, actually. and i might had this, this propaganda runs very deep. i have friends in the u. k. who are scheduled to visit me here. uh, i had 2 friends of friends of mine visited me recently when they told people they were visiting. so it'd be the morning's not to go had they were they were, they were told they they, they would, they were extremely nervous about coming and they themselves had a lot of that pre existing perceptions child challenged. so yeah, and i see,

i think it's, i think that what was interesting as well was when i got stopped in, um uh uh, the case that was an enormous amounts of sympathy for, for me. but it will say there was a large number of main stream versus pundits to what did the national union and the journalist i. right, well, they issued a statement in my defense and then promptly deleted this off to of site. yes. off of intensive public pressure that to do so, and it's like the, the, the site that we're a large number of main street kind of narrative managers who was what justifying what happens me. what ad denying the fibers of john less than suggesting that i was something something else something raw the dock up. and um, the effectively yes painting me is as a, as a light to the crew like criminal and traits up to my country. and the reaction in

serbia was like pretty much universal outraged and the depressed associations here, what it will absolutely furious political a policies what issued statements in solidarity with me. what's global britain? what's i mean from, from reading declassified files from reading things that people drop off to the greens a degrees on? sorry. what's what it, what it, what is it that it's not on the surface? yeah, sure. so i mean, global breton formerly is on assets to promote and that, that you to know each know, make conflict correlations with breasts and across the region. level se, assisting the, the, the components of the former yugoslavia into a e, u. nate's and membership. the u. k. obviously having itself left the he rather

rather contradict totally but um yes, beneath the surface it's very, very clear from the like neat files that we've received with the grace that it's true purpose is considerably more sinister. and this is about feeling government's security service is made it trees with hon picked hungry and british assets. it's about a opening up uh uh, each moment markets, the british penetration and domination. and um, uh yeah, if the politicians stand in the way of breath and then they ought to be neutralized, i'm person has a number of mechanisms for doing this. one of the key methods is by quite some, quite promoting independent media line. we're about to publish a story on bulk and insights and that well known c i a propaganda ref thoughtful where there was the, the lack of self awareness in the, in the lead documents is,

is quite remarkable. it talks about how there is a need for britain to counteract quotes and quote, states capture of the media in the balkans. apparently it's ok for it to be captured by britain, but not by the national government and so on. and the explicit purpose is to question, quite hold individuals and organizations and governments. the person con britson does is life to cantos. yes, i wish i hers is still right until the election. the head of the foreign from the fast misfiring family. yes. yeah. as you apply that she was trying to mount, i've forgotten the exact phrase because it's i meant was, well, yeah, for mentor to, to, to, to get britain to actually do something here. and that's a big fight level. and now is she is she for real?

i mean, can you explain the phenomena of alicia kinds of yes. well i'm gonna think preventive . she went through is her name worth remembering this, you're going to disappear in this election and services lose power, or is she going to to stay interested? what's your sense of her interested in the reach? it's important to understand that the, the british, the, the more the folks who were in ukraine is a product of british intelligence and something that they actively wanted and were pushing for. there was an organization called the ins, cheapest, statecraft, which 10 years ago published an essay on its website, stating, we need to dig through much of the isolate russia. we need to demonize russia in an ad in western countries. and this, this will create the foundations of will, of the old fashioned sort which the west and britain will win. okay. so russia was

drawn into intervening in ukraine due to the uh, the, the attacks on its russian speaking population. which would, and uh, yeah, uh the, uh, the full front of this was that the same people who 10 years ago advocating for will with russia and the to say the least. it's not going very well from the west perspective. britson has tried to escalate this as, as much as possible. they were behind the 12 thing from the blowing up catch bridge, and that they have desperately thoughts to counter us reluctance for this to become will i will, which. and i think that the recent green light thing of the strikes on russia by west and countries as a result of breakfast, pressure and lobbying and help to repeat this 1st piece, negotiation. yeah. and they sabotaged the peace negotiations in april 2022 and the

it. and so, and i think that because it's coming, so by the end because of the risk of the us stepping back from this because for all of its for breast and, and delusion of the us imperial brain for us understands that this is an unwinnable club. my and actually it's not was bankrupting themselves and the minutes rising themselves by providing what is their equipment and i munition to ukraine because rushes not gains back down. so in that context, britson is, is desperate because it's a relevance internationally is entirely contingent on the entirely contingent on the us unsafe. and it's is very very, there were elements within versus intelligence who are desperate to open the 2nd front in the proxy bull and the bulk and that's within the bulk. yes. and the balkans would be was not really well. what would the buttons is it? but the, um, this, this would be an app. so the ideal 5th to draw the us into. now,

you folks bear in mind that the british ship and stirring up trouble in both of you and in response to the in response to the tension that this is mrs. course president has sent tens of thousands of sort of quite some quite peacekeepers into boston yet due to the alleged stretches of russian aggression. yet this is brittany who has invited the country in cost of the scores of british, again, quite some quite peacekeepers. dotted around dotted around the province. well, one stripe trigger pull away from all out war. now if you want to expand the proxy warranty the us and what might you do? not seem to be very much what alicia cons was doing. was important to bear in mind that the intelligence services are effectively low and government onto themselves. and they frequently act in ways to talk concrete, to, uh, the, the, the form of the table structure. so for instance, in, during the 19 ninety's during the was in the former yugoslavia,

britain was adamantly opposed to intervention to the extent that they were big to conflict with the uh, the clinton white house. meanwhile, m i 6 was closing on the se, ask it seems, recording absolutely habits and both of you and, and increase it to the i mean, throughout the 1991, george bush senior was desperately trying to keep the site. you need to complete and stuff, its brakes up i i'm an assist. it's a re imagining is the commonwealth of independent states and foods key. i have to give a speech about how you know, ukraine and rusher are. uh, you know, as one, the one nation and people. and meanwhile, the c i, a in any d was, was they were doing everything in their power to break up the slave unions. they feed the, the, the deep states frequently at a country to the wishes and wells, all of the states. how are we to distinguish between like

in, in united states? you can pretty much see that in your times get some and this seekers information and publish it. and if the news is the white house, and there's a start screaming bloody murder and starting an investigation into who was the, who makes the information, then you can pretty much figure out the white house wanted yes, the information to end up in the new york times right, but what do we do in the, in the u. k? well, i mean, i say, i mean it's, it's remarkable at how rally the, the, the, the agencies lead. and then the, when, when they do once in a blue meaning it's similar to the targeted and it's again, it's a way of them shaping what isn't, isn't in the public domain. and i mean for instance, it's been a while that's

a golf to now, but like, i believe it was last year. the times newspaper published based on leaks, records of how and my 6 is running an isis asset who ended up killing members of design. some, it was quite fairly unhinged individual, but they kept running him and giving him money and direction and that was no doubt leads to get rid of who ever allowed this to happen for, you know, internal reasons, maybe some of them is off of the job. you know, it's a, i think we should always, when things get get published a the appear to be based on inside the source is or an or insider information which is we have to understand what they want this in the public domain. and the reason isn't the actual thrust of the hospital. so to give you an example, new york times recently published a revealed in an exclusive expos that a how british and american intelligence officials were active in intel. vive,

assisting these railways in hostage rescue and tracking down how mass because that doing this, the goodness of the hearts, of course, because they want the more to stop and they won't be coming to stop. so that's why they are conflicts it directly in because the genocide is because they want less people to die. and the, the, i might small is, is the reason that this was published is it's about normalizing direct, british and american involvement on, in, in the world. particularly as israel is up for conflict with has been our 11 on which is the rule that they cannot win. and they've already lost in effect. and so that obviously going to need british and american soldiers on the ground. and this is, this is laying the foundations for that are finding that it's dangerous and somehow very bad to amplify correct information. you can get slapped with a different punishment if you have amplified something. and even in the end it's,

it's like another way of saying don't you the air quotes this? yeah. and it's, but now they don't say don't you? they're closed as they say, don't you there and i'm fine. yeah. but it's, i mean, a quote quite remarkable, and i published from my, from my website, my website, which is kinda comes imaginatively. um, the i published an investigation to how the c i n and my c expected ices. and this was based on the publicly available information, declassified documents, etc. and almost immediately, i mean this close of bits of the sensation when i, when i, when i dropped it and, and almost immediately people started reporting to me that they've been banned from facebook to sharing it because it was produced by, quote unquote, dangerous individual. this is a designation that facebook usually applies to people who's been involved in my shootings and all the, the risk incidents like that. but they apply that to me for the crime. investments

agenda is a friend of mine who runs a very popular independence, the new site council, the state media, and he shared it on his page, which had, i think it was 40 of 50000 likes. um, he was a band and he was forced to remove the content and he was told that facebook would now what from that one would forever algorithmically the boost him to prevent anyone seeing his pace organically. so that for just destroying his page out. right . so yeah, i mean, that's quite frank thing, but i was going to going to the 2nd source of, of all of optimism is the repressive power structures reach that most repressive when on the verge of collapse. and it's like when, when you call and control people with a brain washing and propaganda unemployed like social control, then you reach for the friendship. but this is almost invariably when they are on

the verge of types of collapse. i mean, i mean in the u. k. the you call in for people any more, they realize they're living in a sick collapsing society of 90 percent of people are dissatisfied in what 12 percent of people believe that mainstream political policies represent the public's views. and these are statistics which points to a looming resolution. the take a fresh look around is a life kaleidoscopic, isn't just a shifted reality distortion by power to division with no real opinions fixtures designed to simplify. it will confuse really once a better wills, and is it just because it shows you fractured images, presented to this, but can you see through their illusion going underground?

can the protest as classic believes in 10 years, because this then demonstration, despite the government having scraps of controversial build that's pushed by the i am at the local is called for president mucho to resign. we bought it for you. good, good luck. you have to be a bit of drawers on i was think i used to belong to him. president puts vessel systems on the higher lodge. a lot of the countries toward the siding is select from ukraine. and that's as hungary as prime minister visits kia, have to pull on the block. them is the last key to negotiate with the case with my

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