1000000 people, half of the population are internally displaced, piece talks between these really government and how much come in fits and starts, but they never really seem to amount to anything. and many is re lease for a long time, could not understand why and is really government that in the past has been willing to trade 500 or even a 1000 palestinian prisoners for one single is really hostage. was this time willing to just let it's hostages? sit in limbo and how much those hands. and at the same time, reports of leaked out of israel, of atrocities against palestinian prisoners in his really presence they are deliberately starved. for example, there's no medical care. they're not even permitted to walk and instead have to crawl everywhere on their hands and knees and many are beaten mercilessly. now we're learning that the situation may even be worse, much worse is really media led by the newspaper heartbeats have recently confirmed that the is really military had deployed. it's so called hannibal directive,

which allows the military to use what it calls all necessary force to prevent the capture of soldiers, even if that force results in the depths of civilians, including is really civilians which means hostages. the directive has been around for almost 20 years, but until recently it was a closely guarded secret. now that the information is out there for. busy to see, it has led to a debate over whether these really army is actually trying to free hostages, or merely to kill more palestinians. you are just today is these themes journalist, richard silverstein, he writes for dakota alum, the foremost blog covering is really national security issues. he is also a contributor to the middle east. i jacobin magazine, the new era, and i'll just 0 is work also has appeared in the new york times. richard, thanks so much for being with us. thanks for having me, john. 3 to be here. i'd like to begin with something of a broad question. richard,

what makes this more different from any other war that israel has fought against a non state actor? there have been difficult years long wars against has by law for example. why is this one so much more difficult and why is it so much more violent? this war started with this particular aspect of the ongoing decades long war between is their own palestinians. started with a mazda attack on israel. at totally 7 set was devastating. the punctured or missed so this is really and instability that broke through billions of dollars were savannah section technology designed to prevent just section attacks resulted in a killing of $1100.00 is relays, $400.00 of whom were security agents and i the soldiers this had

never happened to israel before uh, in this kind of fashion. so it was the surprise attack carried out in, in broad daylight actually after the fact, israel discovered that several of its intelligence operatives had warned their superiors that plan how much was planning this and their, their warning was ignored. so as a result of this shocking and his flow to these really psyche, the government decided that they had to react in a massive fashion. the one that had no proportion in terms of the damages, the actual damages did to israel. and that resulted in the genocide that we're finding here in which we're at close to $40000.00 guidance murder. and it explains why he is really responsive, so different than all the previous invasions of whatever and on,

and tax advisor and similar kinds of operations in the past. tell us what's happening inside the israeli government. this is the most right when government is really history, and indeed, several ministers have previous criminal convictions for anti air of hate crimes. and for the most part, these are the ministers who are in charge of security is the, is it, these ministers who are influencing prime minister netanyahu on the conduct of the war is it is rarely public opinion. it's guiding policy or didn't netanyahu need no outside pressure to launch a war that has focused so heavily on civilians and has been accused by the international court of justice of, of genocide. in the answer to your 1st question, i think to that it's a martin vera, who's the grease minister and they, one of those said, you mentioned that who would you, victor, a believe 8 times in a different instances of anti arab incitement. and it's all

a small church who actually as administered controls all of a sudden an activity on the west bank and who when he was younger, was arrested by that shouldn't batch and found with an explosive device in his car . this was during the withdrawal from cause i know 2004 by israel, and he planned to detonate this explosion device on the audio on highway, which is the major highlight until the and he was arrested and held for 3 weeks and refused to answer his interrogators and he was eventually released so we have to really i call him is really jewish terrace and they are running the security operation in israel. and this is why these really police have become so vicious, not just a palestinian. so of course they've always been bitch to,

but they're attacking protested, they're attacking the families of the kid that the the hostages were protesting against the lack of a ceasefire. and it's me, i was refusing to agree on seats fire. so is there using whips out a recent horses with whips, and they're whipping the protesters. so this is a violence mass violence, at least by the is real estate against the is really the citizens themselves. i think the government is impermeable to a political grassroots action. there had been before the war started, there were weekly rallies of hundreds of thousands of his reverence opposed to the government as rarely. so we're choosing the premier certain being corrupt. any faces for indict he's indicted on 4 charges of corruption and that haven't been

adjudicated. and there is no reason then that's in, you know, has to pay attention to this or did pay attention is the only constituents he has just been clear and, and smoke just because of a control his coalition. if they withdraw, they resign from the coalition. there's no government and attorney, i'll ask you about elections and he will be vulnerable to the court cases, which are for some reason it's in, i've been phrased this way, but they seem to have been put into bands while he is prime minister. so the war itself is critical to him, remaining its prime minister with no more, we revert to a status, quote, antiques and go back to the kinds of protests and unrest that happened before $107.00. and he is in the read. this is the reason why he

refuses to read. it says fire is the reason why he's given the hostages short trip, which is on, which is unforgivable and also unprecedented. and is really history for a leader of the government to have no concern for the opposite. just course he mounts concern, but he does nothing and refuses every opportunity to negotiate as he's fire. and by the way, president by announced a week or 2 ago with fanfare, that her boss had softened its demands, and that there was no new promising bases for cease fire. and as soon as that happened, the time jago announced 5 new dive as that must never be to. and this in effect has sabotaged and killed that latest attempt to cease fire. richard, let's talk about the hannibal directive. this is a story that you broke. this came out of the 1986 war against has by law and was

formerly implemented about 20 years ago. it has been a secret until recently, and the bottom line is that it's significantly changes the way the public sees, the government's commitment to is really hostages. so actually, let's start with that is the, is really government still committed to rescuing hostages or is the prime directive now to not be taken prisoner and to just kill palestinian combatants even if it means killing is really hostages. well, let's talk about the animal director and then give some background on what it entails is a policy that the idea of follows in war time. this is how it originated, follows in war time to prevent the idea of soldiers from being captured by uh from us. um and this uh, i started reporting this 10 years ago during operation protective edge which was in 2014. and that uses the invoking of the animal dog,

the doctor, and actually ended up killing to heidi of soldiers who are being carried back to gaza or carrying away from their units and into captivity. the idea is not only killed or 2 soldiers, but it destroyed the neighbor. and if she die, which is where the hostages were about, as the captives were about to be taking literally mass destruction and the entire neighborhood was destroyed. and this is similar to what happened in new serrato about 2 weeks ago when the israel, when the idea of mounted a rescue operation there and since 4 of the hostages in order to do that, and to prevent from us from initiating a counter attack, which they were doing to stop the rescue. they basically went in and carpet from the neighborhood, and they killed nearly 300 pallet, a pallet,

city and civilians in the process and succeeded in releasing are free for those hostages. hannibal is heinous and it fits because it's the a one of the 1st episode is one of the 1st pieces of evidence i've seen of as the military of the country willingly, unintentionally murdering its own soldiers. that was 2014 and bringing a subsidy to 2024 on on october 7th, actually at 2.23. the worst on for 9 months time slides. but in uh on october 7, they expanded hannibal and they said that we are going to invoke it to jo is really civilians. these were civilians who were being sped and jeep, stacked towards gaza after being captured in israel during the invasion by come us

. these were soldiers who had been captured on that basis in southern israel, and we're being taken back. the reeds were in another instance, an id, a general commanded a tank to fire shell point blank into a home in a few woods where they knew there were hostages is really civilians, along with some last fighters. and instead of negotiating, we're trying to figure out a way to the previous realize they actually killed. thank you, richard. we're going to take a short break. and when we come back, we're going to continue our conversation with richard silverstein, and we'll discuss new reports. that's a palestinian death toll maybe astronomically higher than what has been previously reported state june. we have a lot more coming up. 2 2 2 the

hold on the hollywood local now i was working on the dreamland for janesville through the we have approximately 10000000 people in california that are risk of becoming on house looks good man pulls up somebody for working to 3 jobs and still not enough because of the cost of leaving also has increased co bags and then he'll buy todd, she has last year long. the amount of a homeless rose by 12 percent in california. the the welcome back to the with the blowers,

i'm john curiosity. we were speaking with journalist richard silverstein, he writes for t. kuhn along the foremost blog covering, is rarely national security issues. he's also a contributor to the middle east di jacobin magazine, the new era, the end of june 0. and his work also has appeared in the new york times. richard, thanks again for being with us. great to be here. john. thanks again. my pleasure is mine, richard. let's talk about the guys a deaf tall and about a recent piece in the lancet. now the list is the pre eminent british medical journal. as of june 19th, 2024, the guys and ministry of health had determined that 37396 palestinians had been killed in gaza. is really military confirmed that the ministry's numbers were likely correct. the ministry further estimated that at least another $10000.00 people were likely buried under the rubble. but the length of the article goes on

to say that the actual number of dead could be much, much higher as high as 186000 people. can you explain that to us? well, the last the publication and as you said, um ballistic does not publish reports like this, you know, just willy nilly it it to has a lot of data that uses and is very conservative in these sorts of situations in which there's a lot of contention. there's a lot of this information, especially on the, is really side to discredit the health ministry figures. but the reason that i suggested that it could be a 186000 is that it's not just the 30, if, by the way it's, the latest figures are closer 230000 more than 30000. but it's not just 30, is that those are the ones we know or did we have

a nearly half of the buildings in gaza or destroyed? that's not just homes that include schools, universities, power plants, and rich on rochester facilities, united nations, early organization. the entire landscape of cause a is, is a ruling underneath all of those ruins or thousands, perhaps tens of thousands of buttons. there is no excavation machinery in gaza that can like in the case of earthquakes, where you can bring in massive excavators and whatever and, and take for buildings and work for bodies. and the dog shoot can see about the corpses and try to re maria the freedom from the rubble. so there are, there's a huge number of people that have their, their desktop account. in addition, you have um, you have uh you have impacts that are not direct. for example,

people will die of disease after the conflict will die of starvation after the conflict. they'll die from medical neglect because um, i think, you know, the, all the hospitals have been destroyed exhausted. so without medical treatment, you may not right now, but you will die later of the implications that it causes of that brought you to need the medical care in the 1st place. so the key factor here in coming to that number is they've compared cause it to other similar conflicts. and they've said that for each known victim whose die there or somewhere between $3.00 and $5.00, the people who have died that they do not know about yet won't know that until well after the conflict ends. so if you do the multiplication there you come up with,

you know, nearly 40000 times 3 or 5, you're getting up to the 186000 a year. and this, what's the genocide and i use that term very deliberately and i think we're going to talk about that in the 2nd. so this genocide puts it in the arena of the genocide in rwanda. in the genocide in east timor. and it actually is greater than many of the really well known just sites like in cost positive. so we're talking about an unprecedented historic event in which no, no global. uh no, no criminal or regal system such as the international criminal court in the international court of justice. none of them, even though they've attempted to address the genocide, none of that has been able to have any impact on israel. and the reason why is the

israel's ours, especially in the united states, but many european countries support the israel support waited student and do so with 18000000000. in the case of us congress, 18000000 in weapons had been sent to israel since october 7th. so that's the reason why there is no rule space or difference, right? what everybody likes to call it. that's the reason why the manager and effort has failed. there basically is hardly any monetary deafening causes. because israel, as, as if by killing many of the aid workers, in addition to killing the journalists themselves, were reporting on this. there's a 125 journalists who have been murdered in and use the term murder because they deliberately targeting, not only the journalists themselves, but in some cases the families of the journalists, the on to 0, corresponding cause not on which he died. but his wife was, was murdered,

and this was done intentionally as a warning to thousands and a journalist and israel does not want this, reported the only journalist who side from the gods and sort of strangers for various media. who can go into gods, the only foreign journal to go installs that have to go in with the idea has to be embedded with the idea for this use the coverage that you'll see in world media, you will mostly be getting the is really the point of view, and that really is another factor that renders it impossible for the outside world to have much impact to stop this or, or to amount power for protests that will, you know, lead to the end of this and as well as you've so correctly noted. so many of these debts are a result of disease. 3rd, starvation and an utter lack of medical care even for injuries and failing to count

these depths is actually a violation of international law. the international court of justice in january of 2024 required israel to quote, take effective measures to prevent the destruction and to ensure the preservation of evidence related to allegations of acts within the scope of the genocide convention. and quote, has this real done that? and if yes, why are the death numbers so far off? israel has ignored every outside sector in attempting to exert some controller hold israel accountable. i'm just mentioning international criminal court. and the chief prosecutor several months ago announced that he was going to ask a few additional panel in the i c. c to issue arrest warrants for be mentioned, no annual, and cost the defense minister. however, the panel is not announced any decision. so israel, by the way,

screamed bloody murder about these global judicial words and attacked and attacked anyone inside israel or the palace thing to collaborate with these un bodies and treated them as terrorist or an image of the state. including by the way, is really a human rights. and yes, i have been spirit and targeted as well with not just a variable with tax, but physical attacks as well. so israel has been able to completely ignore, ignore, of these. it is just actually has impunity. it certainly is pursuing, continuing and genocide. the difficult whole continues to mount despite the fact that israel claims that it's trying to or is separating civilians from, from, from, from us fighters. and that's actually

a lie. and i don't think that anyone in the world reeves it but it's not helped by the fact that you have state departments folks. people make us secretary of state who ignore this who, who, when there were genocide as mentioned to them they bristol. and they claim that it isn't genocide, it can't be genocide. it's as if the word star is showing is really talking points . and it's speaking as if it is israel itself. and this is really an aspect to the american people. 60 percent of the american people disapprove not only of israel's genocide in casa, but they are disapprove of bind policy and approach towards it. but they will not negotiate a solution to these early pos conference. they will not accept a few state solution. so anyone, especially someone white present by an anti blanket who believes that they want the

opposition and power because they might be able to achieve their goals of the 2 state solution if they're really serious about that, which is another question. i don't think there will be any major change. and the same thing holds true by the way the us policy won't change very much in gaza or elsewhere. they'll be continuity. and, and, and the things that we would like to see changed in u. s. foreign policy will not change the things that we might want to see changes mostly policy regarding in immigration and such issues. those won't change either. but in this real it's, you know, it's even more critical because you have the capacity of a regional war is real, is on the verge, perhaps isn't being lived on and, but when you're war against your board. and if they do around as promised to uh, to, to enter on the side of as more. so yeah, the situation like, you know,

just before we're, we're one, we're gradually, all the major powers in the region have been drawn into one side of the other of the conflict. so you have israel's enemies, the actual access of resistance. it's called include iran and because the ball on the booties and iraqi shiite militia and syria, by the way. and so all of them could be entering the conflict on the half of the, of those more. and you'll have israel in the us and its allies. so this is an extremely volatile situation, extremely dangerous situation, and we have to really, really work hard to restore some sanity to the situation. even though it doesn't seem that's possible right now. but we have to do as much as we can to stand in the way of discharging on a trade destruction. richard,

thank you so much for joining us. it's a pleasure. genocide is a tough word. what distinguishes genocide from murder and even from acts of political violence that claims as many victims as the intent, genocide is the desire to make of people extinct. the idea of genocide is a crime. nelson mandela, worn the world years ago to not look the other way. it is within all of us to prevent genocide from happening. i'd like to thank our guests, richard silverstein for being with us today, and thank you to our viewers for joining us. for another episode of the list of lowers, i'm john curiosity. please follow me on subset at john curiosity. we'll see you next time, the. 2 2 2 the,

[000:00:00;00] the release of come to the russian states never as tight as i'm one of the most sense community best ingles, all sense and up the in the 6595 and speed. what else calls question about this. even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin machine, the state on the rush to day and split the ortiz full neck, even our video agency,

roughly all the band on youtube, the fitness center for the question, did you say even closer to the in the year of 1954, the united states of america engaged in warfare against the people of vietnam. the white house supported the corrupt public governments of southern vietnam. key in 1965 americans began their invasion following the aim to defeat the forces of vietnamese patriots. defend the gun was confident that the victory would be on the

american side, due to its military superiority. however, the vietnamese, during this war into total health for the occupants. unable to cope with a guerrillas, the american army started blanket bombing alongside using chemical weapons and naples, which burnt all alive. the village of my lay, where he 1969 american soldiers killed 504 civilians, including 210 children, became a tragic symbol of this war. all and all. during the whole period of this conflict, the usa dropped on vietnam more than $6000000.00 tons of bonds, which is 2 and a half times as much as on germany during the 2nd world war. in 1973, the american army under the pressure of the rebels, withdrew from vietnam, and only 2 years later did the puppet regime. and so i got involved. however, the vietnamese paid

a high price for their freedom. more than 1000000 in vietnamese people became the victims of american aggressors. the, i mean, everyone chasing the same dream. everyone's doing the same thing. having to get a job making it rich majors good to have the money that that, that,