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tv   RIK Rossiya 24  RUSSIA24  January 19, 2024 2:00pm-2:31pm MSK

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what are the statements and how will the industry change? in churches, the ceremony of the great illumination of water is performed, and many believers plunge into the font; orthodox christians celebrate one of the main christian holidays - the baptism of the lord. not only will we tell you more about this a little later on our broadcast, now we’ll move on to other topics. the united states has not achieved its goals in ukraine, the former said. chairman of the nato military committee harold kueth in an interview with a german journalist. historian peter brant, who also participated in the conversation noted that one of the conditions for resolving the conflict is the non-bloc status of ukraine. watch interviews with german experts on our channel - after a short advertisement. we take out loans, it’s easy to apply for, we are all in...
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us today and whom i will be very glad to introduce to you. so, to my left is professor emeritus of modern and contemporary history and the eldest son of former chancellor willie brant, who, like his father, is a member of the sdp, dr. petro brant. hello gerbrant. greetings. yes, to my right, former inspector general of the bundesweir and former chairman of the nato military committee. hello, herkuet, hello, welcome, yes, i'm glad we're here today. mr. coet, we spoke on the phone at the end of the summer when you, along with mr. brant and two other colleagues, published your call for peace, we then
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had the idea to conduct an interview, it took some time to organize it, but i am glad that we met today here in noirupin, about an hour away. north of berlin, i would like to ask you a question, herbrant, do you think russia will agree to negotiate now, when the military defeat of ukraine is visible on the horizon, what do you think? well, i would not go so far as to say that ukraine's defeat is on the horizon, it is becoming obvious or has already become that it will not achieve its goals, but, but i will not because of this.
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conditions, otherwise nothing will come of it, the discussion in the usa was more open from the very beginning, yes, "this is what we want to achieve in the existing ones than in germany, by the way, in a number of other nato countries it was more critical, that’s right, yes, in some nato countries there were more open discussions than in ours, and i recommend that you familiarize yourself with what there..." there is debate going on. there is one point that we have not yet mentioned, namely, to put it simply, ukraine had and still officially has two goals. one is the restoration of the territory within the 1991 borders
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, the second goal is the entry of all of ukraine into nato. it's even written down. in the constitution and during our discussion, i got the impression that the importance of the problem of nato membership is deliberately downplayed, including in terms of its significance for russia, yes, so, every time, first expansion, and then they have no reason to fear nato, this, this is simply absurd , in such matters speech.
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the whole point to me is that mr. putin does n't have a very nice character, that's a real problem, and there might be a way to get ukraine into nato through partition, so if in the end there's some sort of korean solution left, then maybe imagine that when the country is divided, one. one part will be integrated into nato. i, i don’t want to speculate too much, i’ll just say that this, of course, would not be the most pleasant outcome, neither for ukraine, nor for, nor for the northern hemisphere or world
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stability. and therefore i am in favor of solving this problem, which, by the way, was considered at... negotiations in march 2022, where an agreement on this issue was already reached. of course, the agreement was reached under pressure, but... the agreement it was, it was ukraine that should have a non -bloc status, be outside the military blocs, this again needs to be put at the center of the discussion. mr. koet, you were the highest-ranking military man not only here in germany, as inspector general of bundwihr, you were also the highest- ranking.
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prevent this attack, because the russians, i could name names now, but there were many politicians who said that
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ukraine should be a member and that it would become one. i can say that i was and would not like to extol my role here once again, but i i was also the chairman of the ukraine commission, the chiefs of staff of nato and the council of chiefs of staff of nato russia, i know both sides well.
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size, because of the geostrategic location, because of the potential that this country will bring with it, and this must be understood. there is also a second point, when mr. stoltenberg says that ukraine will become a member of nato, he refers to the protocol of the bucharest summit, where president bush tried to put pressure on... the heads of state in 2008 and with great zeal sought an invitation
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georgia and ukraine, in which they did not succeed, then, as usually happens in such cases, in order to save face , they included an excerpt on which mr. stoltenberg now relies in his statements. i recommend that mr. stoltenberg look at the nato treaty, in particular at article 10, then he will discover that ukraine in general. cannot become a member of nato, at least not in the foreseeable future, i don’t know what will happen in 50 or 100 years, but in the foreseeable future it will not be able, firstly, that yes, i will get to that, but first briefly, in -firstly, ukraine is not can say that they could, as we have been hearing for a long time from our minister of foreign affairs, obtain membership in the alliance, having every right to do so, although this is basically the case, according to international law, desire is not enough for nato. because nato must invite each new member based on
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the consensus of all member states. until now this has not happened. this could have happened at the last summit, and ukraine insisted on this, but this did not happen, and this will not happen, because there are countries that understand this strategic relationship different from our government, and they say, “we can’t do this.” secondly, ukraine must, returning again to article 10, meet certain requirements; it does not meet them. perhaps in 10 or 20 years it will fulfill these requirements, but... in any case, now these requirements have not been met, in the foreseeable future this also should not be expected, back in 2002, when i was in ukraine, they asked me when we will finally let's become members of nato. our army does everything you say. i said you don't meet the requirements, you must understand that it is not your army that becomes a member of
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nato, but you, as a state, like ukraine, become a member of nato.
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this needs to be understood, every state should think about this, and germany too, what would this mean for germany? by the way, mr. zelensky publicly stated long before the negotiations in istanbul: we are ready to accept a neutral status, we also renounce nato membership, and this was also in the negotiations with ukraine in the 10-point plan that ukraine presented to the negotiations.
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selensky and putin, an agreement was supposed to be signed at this meeting, but as you correctly noted, this did not happen due to western intervention. and one more thing, the negotiations took place only because the situation was so unclear for both parties that they did not want to take any serious risks. ukraine, together with the west , seriously overestimated russia, and also significantly. overestimated russian ambitions, one of the points of view is that it was planned to capture the whole of ukraine, there is no question of this could with such a number of soldiers, and against a strong ukrainian army of 4000, so the goal was by that time it had already undergone modernization, yes, it was well equipped and trained, no, the goal was simply to march
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to kiev, overthrow the ukrainian government, replace it with friendly to russia, that would be it... the war ended, ukraine, ukraine assessed the situation as too dangerous, the russians underestimated the risk, saw that they were suffering significant losses, especially in the first 14 days, and this led to such a situation, in which both sides were ready to make concessions, they made them, such a situation will not happen again. i would also like to talk about your call for peace, for which, in particular, we have gathered here today, you published it at the end of the summer, it is called ending the war through negotiations. you have previously mentioned two of your colleagues, hajo funki and horsto otelcik, with whom you published your call for peace. there you write, i want to quote you. if
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the offensive fails, expect ukraine to demand that. western soldiers followed western weapons. do you really believe, gerbrant, that nato or the west will go so far and send their military to this war. i don’t think so, but i suspect that there will be some politicians who will speak in this spirit, especially if the united states is partially. will partially refuse to participate in the affairs of ukraine, and what is quite obvious is that if you send soldiers, you become a participant. war, that is , it would become a war between nato, and ukraine on the one hand, and russia on the other, regardless
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of how actively the us would be involved, this is exactly what i'd like to avoid by acknowledging the problem, so i can't imagine it going unscathed. but i still think that it will come to a discussion of such a possibility, and there will also be an intensification, a discussion about the supply of weapons of a new quality, for example, missiles, taurus, this is what they already sound like,
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a clear definition, i spoke about losses, this includes the dead and wounded who are no longer able to fight. if
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you watch the interview with zaluzhny again, you will see that he also talks about significant losses, and now more and more often, finally, in the western media they began to talk about the large losses of ukraine and... it is necessary to understand that russia, the russian military and the ukrainian military are conducting two different types of operations. the ukrainian armed forces are faced with the task of regaining lost territory, conquering square meter by square meter. and this is literally so, said zaluzhny, it is given to them at the cost of a lot of blood.
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small formations to attack these lines of defense in small groups, now with significantly fewer numbers, therefore
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an architectural masterpiece from earlier times, the square seems to be divided in half by an invisible mirror, and its right side is reflected in the left, although there are 90 steps and 200 years between them. soviet times, uzbekistan and cotton, synonyms, nothing grew here except it, now everything is different, hassle is still the locomotive of the economy, but is no longer the curse of uzbekistan. leading textile brands are gradually moving their production from
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china. nauzbek sites, the country is beginning to open up, not only new ones are being built, but old connections are being remembered, but we have centuries-old connections. uzbekistan produces 350,000 cars at breakneck speed and changes the economy. we watch to know everything about russia. the best historical series. let's look, look. in the application or on the website, it is difficult to even say approximately yes, since there are no official sources, but let me ask again, how did you come to the figure of 460 thousand, what sources do you rely on? i do not link to any
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sources. makes it possible to obtain information, this is quite obvious, this is the whole trick, but you will see, the day will come when here in the german media, yesterday i read about this in the mercur newspaper, they will begin to talk about the difficulties of the ukrainian armed forces, if it were not for so, if the losses were not so great, of course, the russians also have losses, this is quite obvious, especially in
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the first two or three weeks, do you have these numbers? yes, there are also numbers and also from american sources, but now i have become more careful in naming the numbers, because this is basically, this, of course, can be said, this is not true, but then you also need to say how everything really is, if i know, that this is not so, then i know how it really is, right? i reason this way, so i can give numbers that i think are correct. they can be discussed, well, we live in a democracy, so you can freely express your opinion, so that, but in any case , i didn’t invent these numbers, i can’t do that, and as i already said, i also have no information, in ukraine no one tells me about the numbers of losses, they wouldn’t disclose them, but the fact is, that the president of ukraine will adopt a new law on...

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