gender pay differences at laing o'rourke, an international engineering and construction company, arean average but there's a concerted effort to bring about change. firstly, it's been getting more women into leadership rules — so recognising talent, developing them and putting them in senior roles. the other thing is closely analysing our data. so we really want to understand whether we to have bias within our remuneration processes. new laws require every australian large business to publish their gender pay data. but will transparency, or naming and shaming those who perform badly, make any difference? on the one hand, there's the kind of "sunlight is the best disinfectant" view of the world and shining a light on this will, you know, hold people to account. if it's used as a "gotcha" thing for politicians and others to get a quick sound bite then i think it won't be all that helpful. while there is progress, it is slow. many people working today will have retired long before the pay gap between women and men in australia is closed. phil mercer, bbc news, sydney. we have been heari