i read it, of course, to younger schoolchildren, but i got it, as you rightly said, i got the soviet word already to m-th students. and it was a second-hand purchase. we know all these names robert sheckley ray bradbury and kurt won a year vladimir savchenko if he recently re-read just alexander belyaev if a little earlier we take patriotic fiction, well, these stanislavl mentioned and so on and so on. well, this is a classic and almost none of those whom we have now listed, unfortunately, are no longer alive. and what is happening now? here is the new award horizons, and i recently read an interview with a very famous publisher. e, who says publishing, more precisely, and she, er, talks about what fiction is among the younger generation of writers. again very popular. what does it mean? some kind of

skipper. this is the continuation of a dream. these are some developments in themes, here, what names of what is happening do you know, if we talk about space, we are still talking about space, then this is a very sick painful painful disease on the topic of less science fiction. yes, there is practically no space in science fiction, then yes, if we are talking about science fiction about science fiction, which is based on some modern scientific ideas about the world around us, then most often the authors turn to information technology. uh, space fantasy. it is definitely present, but it is present. hmm, so this is a background one, maybe this is such a fork, which, by the way, stanislav spoke already in such mature years. in recent years, that humanity instead of conquering the universe, as it seemed at the end of the xix century. yes that we will first fly from a cannon? far

away from the stars. well, somehow it went to the internet in some parallel worlds. no , i think there is. uh, hmm the connection is definitely a connection with what's going on with our space industry, which is the lack of it. eh, some understanding. that's so practical. actually. why does a person go into space in practice. what is the first conclusion ? i look like oleg hooks. eh, doubts look at you the same doubts. no, the questions are generally correct. you, oleg , also said that space is work. although romantic work there, uh book, take a kilo of everything. why is it necessary to return something else and return some kind of payload from there. well, vasily did not expect from you. i thought you quickly gave us some. and you say that you need to understand. why, unfortunately, i talked a lot with our st. petersburg specialists, so to speak, and experts in manned cosmonautics with anton pervushin, whom they probably know, yes. the historian of our

cosmonautics scarf is not very good. uh, they are optimistic about the future of astronautics. well i mean in a global sense compared to dreams. yes, some kind of technological breakthrough must occur, so that this everything will return. uh, so that, for example, well, the delivery of a payload to and from space has become at times or there is an order of magnitude terminal that i took it much easier there should be born the second korolev in the same was born, in the second king and in a row it’s already christmas is growing, i don’t know, but something must happen, really technologically very serious, that is, what will happen. eh, well imagine or science fiction writers certainly remember space, they do not forget about it. they use it in one way or another in their works. and as a rule, cosmos is, but simply a fund that can happen. well, anything can happen some adventurous collisions there, right, eh?

any life events? maybe luna, for example, uh, there is this ian mcdonald, a writer, american not american uh, british irish origin. here he was with us in russia a few years ago, as times i participated in bringing it. he has a cycle. moon action. it happens naturally on the moon. some minerals are mined on the moon and brought to earth. we understand that this is, well, not cost-effective at the current level of development, but nevertheless. here he allowed such a fantasy. the moon is practically the same for him. here again we continue the romance and work. this is the designation of the practical sphere. or is it some kind of cultural symbol there, in addition to, here, purely practical mining, there is also such a laboratory. uh, social, that there are like different scenarios in the future where in what direction will humanity move, there it all happens and develops in real time. basically, unfortunately. eh, our russian-speaking

authors are much less likely to turn to cosmic symbolism and even to space, as a purely entourage. uh, but uh, i can say that not so long ago a collection of new futures was released and, unfortunately, there is again the same story. there is not a lot of space there, in fact, the most interesting, probably, are space stories. this is, uh, the story of eduard verkin, who, uh, describes just under the influence of uh. well, how to say after the ladies of alexander green of the strugatsky brothers, ivan efremov, he describes exactly the very technology that we spoke of the technology of transportation zero transportation, yes, and the transfer from our cosmos to another to another to another area. e solar system or not only the solar system, not necessarily the solar system to another galaxy of some matter, for example, books, for example, books, yes, please, that's when this happens, how

eduard verkin teaches us, yes, everything will change and the cosmos will return to us again in all its shining glory, how great it is, that is, the cosmos develops in all directions and in general the word space in russian from the verb extend, for example, yes expand, the german word, deir raum is empty, like rum in english. yes, there is no prostration space, i don’t know what the internal form of the english word is, but i really like it. i tell students all the time and teach them, because you need to look at what lives in the word yes , the arrow lives in the word shoot although e from a bow shoots only athletes space - it's expanding in all directions. and here we are in our conversation so by itself it turned out yes, we talked about technologies and in real flights and departures and about how it is fixed on the ground, preserved and continues to live for people. and how literature goes, either

following the cosmos, or somewhere a little ahead, so a and e a person who takes a book in his hands learns something familiar from the reports of news agencies. so and vice versa. those who uh like our wonderful power oleg novitsky and off the ground, fly into space , learn something from books. in a word. thank you very much, dear friends. i think that we have succeeded in this threefold approach to space from different sides. let me remind you once again that our guest was pilot cosmonaut, russia oleg novitsky, our guest was the deputy director for scientific work. we are all uh, cosmonauts vyacheslav klimentov and we had a book reviewer vasily vladimirsky so we did it today and so i'm sure it will work out for you, our dear ones. witnesses and

participants in the next issue of a literary podcast, let them not speak, let them read and i , in my usual constancy, say my always final phrase. read with pleasure, dear friends. hello this is a podcast life is wonderful and with you i am alexei varlamov, a writer, rector of a literary institute, visiting. i have a wonderful prose writer, critic, literary columnist pavel basinsky, winner of many literary awards, including the big book award. antibooker award, a very famous writer, popular in modern russia and not only in russia, but today we will not talk about leo tolstoy not about banna

karenina, but we will talk about gorky and why because pavel is the author of several books about alexei maksimovich gorky well, besides, we are with him we both work at the gorky literary institute. pavel graduated from this institute and gorky for us can be said. and for me, a brilliant playwright , gorky is a very interesting, very large personality, in general, this figure of the silver age must be understood that when they try to gorky bind the proletarian writer. this is completely untrue to the pletariat of him, in fact. only one thing. this is the story of a mother, and this is a man of the silver age. this is the key figure of the silver age. gorky is surprising in that this man, who could absolutely adequately communicate

with the fat lion of everything joseph stalin, at the same time be friends with lenin and correspond with the pink rozanov , lenin could not correspond with lenin stalin became ashamed to talk could not . and gorky could, uh, he sews everything together with himself, it's very simple such a fragmented era, and besides, gorky himself, just a very interesting personality. uh, here, for me, this is a very generous person. this is a writer who loved to write to others, or what is a great rarity, whom he read to the young, read attentively to everyone who, both before the revolution and in the first years of soviet power, arranged the life of writers. well, about the soviet period

, the union of writers is better known there. yes, there is peredelkino there and so on, and before the revolution it was a publishing house of knowledge, in which all the best pro hares of that time bunin kuprin hares, and they are there andrey shmelev uh tv show in serafimovich can you continue? they received huge fees. they had the opportunity to eat abroad to live by writing. all this, in general, was arranged by gorky. well, it turns out to be such a blissful picture, just such an ascetic without a piece of silver takes care of others, but in fact he lived in an era when everything was falling apart at the seams, and i have a feeling that he he just had a hand in making the old life end took an active part in revolutionary activities gave money, and lenin, i remember his letter to the writer kndrushkin was such a writer. and where does he directly say that

this is to destroy this country, this empire. and when all this collapsed and the october revolution comes, bitter. i don't like all this at all. come on, so alexei and that means that almost everyone wanted a revolution. well, almost everything except. uh, a very small number of conservative people. and everyone hated the monarchy ; almost the entire intelligentsia was set up revolutionary and he was the first student. he was not the first student. he was basically my student. he made it a revolution. well, one must understand that gorky's life is divided into several periods, indeed his very active participation in the revolution. and indeed the financing of the bolsheviks, including participation in not very plausible deeds. like, for example, receiving part of

the inheritance. there, savva morozova, through the actress andreeva, or the inheritance of such a manufacturer , the young schmidt, who died under very mysterious circumstances, was killed in prison and some other things and there is gorky, another gorky who really burned himself in the revolution and who, uh, began to fight for culture, therefore gorky cannot be different, as it were, to evaluate only from one point of view. ah, revolutionary. yes, a revolutionary, they were all revolutionized, only gorky was active. what do you think, what is the reason, really his extraordinary excess human energy. yes, there is a feeling that this is not one person, but there are just a lot of all kinds, he was a passionary undoubtedly. was he born on the epoch and gorky more than just writing? or it needs to be understood, it's not just writing, or it's a person who is the ruler of the duma of feelings

, a person who really changed the life of that time and before the revolution. after the revolution , of course, on the other hand. gorky spent 14 years in exile in italian migration , first on a cop. where does he go. uh, after she gets into petropavlovka for participating in the revolution of 905, she should be judged, but as they would say now under the pressure of world public opinion, yes yields for her. there are prominent writers, european public figures, and he is sent abroad. he is going to america for her , by the way, also with the specific purpose of asking american millionaires for money for the revolution. something is given to him, something is not given. in general, i got burned a little on this american trip. by the way, he writes a story there, mother, and then he settles in nakapri for 7 years. he can't go to russia and this

is absolutely such a creative period, although a huge number of people came to see him. he continued to communicate with lenin, he left there for a school for e, workers and so on, but , nevertheless, such a period, the second period is also italian, this is 21 to 28, when he lives in saran. there it is also absolutely such a fairly calm period for him. eh, gorky in general, i don’t even understand when he managed to do everything, to be honest, he wrote 10,000 in writing there. here are 25 houses. uh, only there are about the same number of fiction writings to conduct such public political activities, you know, here, there and etc. they can change habitual things. town is designed to nourish the restoration and youthfulness of the eyes. it is recommended to use it. daily for three months, three courses a year. triple

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, born in this bourgeois environment, and with childhood, which he then so brilliantly describes in his autobiographical stories. well, in general, it is clear that childhood was very difficult. chinese youth has no education. that's how it happened that he climbed to the very top. was it just a talented entity here, or was it behind this stood. the calculation behind this was a strategy, behind this was some very correct choice made in life or the people who promoted it. here is the backstage, relatively speaking, the background. what is all this, uh, all at once, that talent is from god - this is unconditional. well, look at his very first story, makarycha-dra, yes, gorky’s debut in the provincial newspaper is a caucasian fleece and, and immediately, a masterpiece was filmed several times, makar is chudra and is still read and amazingly amazingly written, that is, the gift of the gift was certainly a calculation. eh, hmm

gorky was. yes, definitely a thoughtful person. especially from a certain point. this is how he built his life. he was not always successful in politics. i would say politics. here. uh, by the way , about the fact that the destroyer, i would not say that gorky was a destroyer. even in the period of their here are such revolutionary hobbies. here's what he does. as a matter of fact, when he lives in vain, he tries to reconcile laziness and opposition, which, inside the bolsheviks, he generally always tried to try on everyone. really bitter. here is his peacekeeping mission. for some reason, it is less noticeable than the fact that he was a revolutionary there. he tried to reconcile stalin's opposition there. he tried to try on writing or different directions. ah, but at the same time, yes, sometimes he could behave and be tough and even cruel sometimes, you know, i had

such a conversation very short. uh, with the widow is a good very writer. dominate everything. okay, omarova ivanovna said mostly or but she was asked. she knew gorky, she was personally acquainted with him. i asked what was gorky she thought differently. he really was different. very different at different moments of gorky's life before the capricious period, this is one person. e, gorky , who lived on capri hmm, having run in, as it were , this european life, it's completely different, even in the pictures he's different. ok then. well, the revolution wins, the february one, which he most likely treated well, well, of course, and then the october revolution, and here, as i understand it, very big problems begin, because gorky becomes such a staunch supporter of the bolsheviks opposed to what they are doing. yes

, the book does not come out in a timely manner and thoughts, in which it presents a rather tough account, but to the bolsheviks. how to explain this, what is behind this , he had two complaints against the bolsheviks? hmm not suri thought also need to read carefully. you don’t have to think that this is just such a criticism, criticism, criticism bykov and he really ceases to be a member of the party after the seventeenth year, because there, uh, not because he even leaves, but because there was a re-registration, and he didn’t pass it - did not pass. that is, he is gorky, after the seventeenth year, to no one below and more. uh, two claims the first claim is that the bolsheviks, er, imprison and repress the intelligentsia. the same intelligentsia that actually supported them in their time. this is the first claim, the second is more complex. gorky had a very

traumatic experience of communicating with christianity from his youth, when they were with such a populist romasyan. let's go to the village to preach. uh, populist values, and as a result, they just burned a shop there and almost got killed. gorky believed that russian christianity is a dark mass, a huge huge and the main danger is that it will absorb, that small layer. uh, the cultures of the intelligentsia that exist in russia will simply devour, so to speak. and since the bolsheviks fanned just a civil war, that is, they supported it bitterly. this is his claim that, uh, you are, as it were, fanning this civil war, as a result of which the peasantry will simply come and devour the city there will be no these winter palaces, in general all this culture. there will be intellectuals, literature, nothing. that's just the intelligentsia, as he writes. this is salt. uh, a pot of salt

to be thrown into the ocean. was he right or wrong with this, so to speak, peasant mass? this is a very complicated question, but gorky had such an attitude towards the peasantry, and he had, in addition to non-sovereign thoughts, such a pamphlet about the russian peasantry, which was published in berlin and where the russian peasantry is spoken of in a very terrifying way. dear friends, this is the podcast life of the wonderful is with you alexey varlamov writer and rector of the literary institute. we continue our conversation with pavel basinsky about alexei maxim and gorky, is it true or not? they told me such a legend that when gumilyov was being led to the execution, then some person appeared who, at gorky's request , tried to save him and turned to a group of people who were standing there. and who is the poet here, gumilev, to which gumilev said no here. and

this is gumilyov, there is officer gumilyov here, and gumilyov was shot, but gorky tried to save him. is it true or not? well, about the fact that some person , directly during the execution of the gumile of experience, tried to save him. i do not know, but what is bitter, and went from st. petersburg to moscow to lenin, including, uh, to save gomilev. this is true, and there is a version that e heat, in which he was the chairman of the st. petersburg council and was at that time in the counter assembly. precisely due to the fact that he was the main head of petrograd, and gorky was in petrograd with gorky. in the apartment they were hiding from the disgraced bolsheviks, even, by the way, speaking to the members of the royal family, people in his apartment on kronverksky, but zinoviev did not like this, and in gorky's apartment they even staged an obaska once. and that they even hurried up with the execution of gumilyov precisely because gorky went to save him, but this is again such a rather shaky version.

but the fact that he tried to save gumilyov is true , that he tried to get the block released abroad for treatment is true, and he is generally like how very witty viktor shklovsky wrote, which means during the civil war we ate a very large writer i said this in gorky, because indeed, in many respects it is a publishing house, world literature, which was created where the same block as translators were involved. of all the masterpieces, that means, of world literature, it was completely clear that the plans proposed by gorky were simply impossible to carry out under the conditions of the civil war. but it gave them a ration. it gave them a home. it gave them firewood, there and so on and so forth. he simply saved them from death and saved, indeed, very many. well, it's a well-known story. she really

it is real that he transferred the money to rosa through the schizons to sergiev posad, because as far as they could know, but, probably, they could have helped in some way, of course. and it was really he who was trouble-free in this regard, when they turned to him, he did everything he could, and at that moment, in the conditions of this civil war of famine, it was really in petrograd that all this simply went to him, of course. well, you still he was in the civil war, he was for the red or not? and somewhere she has something, in general, not right red and white, he was not not for the reds. what does red mean? who are the reds? well , it seems to me, then there was enough army, which, under the leadership of trotsky, certainly he was not hammered by them. but i don't think he cared at all. at that moment there, gorky

was concerned about culture. yeah, he saved the intelligentsia. he saved artifacts, just cultures, he tried to save the old cultural institutions. and there i don’t know, the publishing house, sytin, yeah. here, uh, they planted. it’s just that at some point they defeated it there, and then this is also an important moment, he leaves soviet russia how and why, well, strictly speaking, it was not migration, because he had a soviet passport, and he was on treatment. he really was very ill at that time, hemoptysis began. it wasn't a cover. how often they write that gorky was very crunchy and did not live for so long. but there were problems with the lungs, especially since he shot himself with a lung for 18 years when he tried to commit suicide in kazan and, in general, he had to be treated. i just needed

to save myself. well lenin insisted on this famous letter. if you don't leave, we'll send lenin’s joke means, and he leaves first a european sanatorium, but rushes to italy of his beloved italy to the south of italy for drops , but in italy there is already a lot of money, therefore, difficulties arise there, they let him in, but for drops, or he himself did not want to go, because he was already such a resort, most likely, they were not allowed. uh, it is known that the musalini there, in my opinion, already dachas, all the rest he absolutely did not need gorky, and most importantly, they remembered what happened on the capra, and 900 hours in 13 years. it's even gone just workers who emigrated. uh, after the defeat of the first russian revolution, they also settled in drops. there were terrorists, there were romantics, but there were murderers , terrorists and bandits. yes, and everyone came there too. the ussr

rotenberg lived there, the killer is full, he came there. dzerzhinsky lenin on the other hand. chaliapin bunin leonid andreev, that is , there was such a very stormy life that for, uh, a small capricious community , it was not very good either. that's why he lives in saren. yes, yes, also the neapolitan coast. he is there writes. eh, the affairs of the riot police are there. there he writes life with a climas, he begins to write, and his relationship develops. on the one hand, with russian migration, on the other hand, with soviet relations operations. he doesn't fit well. generally. you need to understand that inside the migration, there were no good relations at all, no one had writers at all. doesn't love the other. and when they find themselves in such very difficult, i would say very competitive circumstances, including for receiving the nobel prize there. starts especially strong

love each other in quotation marks. as for gorky well, firstly, he was the most famous writer at that time, well, of course, yes, because he was translated a lot abroad, a lot was translated, but there was another very important moment. and he certainly begins financial difficulties. all the same, there is enough vital m-m in italy, dear. uh, gorky's hospitable house different people live there. the buddha lives there and the berbers live there. yes, vladislav and his niece. there, soviet writers come to wear valentina, by the way, one by one, they are released there for what, in order to restore gorky's trace there, they come and tell how, in the soviet union, now it’s become good as a writer, and they really feel good in many ways, but still, when solzhenitsyn wrote about that it was financial difficulties that were the main reason for his return to the soviet one of the reasons. yes one of the reasons. because

after all, he, uh, had to restrain himself from maintaining a fairly large house. here, uh, the bride's family. timosha loved very beautifully dress son. maxim was a terrible motorist and so on and so forth. and this is what he was given here unconditionally. uh has been published. well, i don’t remember. in what year, uh, the expenses for the gorky family are something like a million something, that’s a lot of money. well not this one, that alone would be the main reason for returning. he certainly has a long nobel prize. it really was waiting, of course, of course, he was waiting for belevsky, a prize or a word. he should have been given it to the nobel, but because he was connected with the communists, the communists executed the royal family, the royal family was in kinship with the family of the swedish

king. the swedish king should present the nobel prize to the laureate. and this moment, in general, it is purely political, it prevented me from giving it. she, of course, of course, we wouldn’t give him, but in the soviet union, how they treated him, and in the soviet union, when he returns for the first time, he comes in 28. uh, it's his birthday. that is, this is the eighth year of birth, but there is a photograph - it's huge. just not even a crowd of people from the sea of ​​belarus belorussky railway station. although when i was preparing my book everything same zeu, and we hmm gorky museum here is the grebushinsky's mansion we selected photographs. and then an old one, so, look here. i say, see how he was greeted. she gave me such a look at the equal she says, well, you understand, it's just curiosity, but nonetheless. this is philosophical,

they meet him in their arms, by the way, eleven somewhere is carrying bukharin. uh, who will then be shot, including for allegedly preparing the murder of gorky . here he is met. yes, they welcome him, but it was organized in many ways. here he rides around the country. here he sees this socialism under construction and what does he feel? yes, alexey well , objectively speaking, repression, yes, which in fact there is real. maybe more than thirties. there are camps and so on. it's all behind the facade, and life in cities. in leningrad in moscow , it was much richer than life in europe; here was a book by sergei belyakov about st. george front of the bluemarine. he describes in great detail how

the intelligentsia lived there in general. moscow life in the late thirties. this is a slightly different story. i think yes, and in the end twenties already. in general, life is definitely getting better. there is a letter that is bukharin. e with a zinovy ​​write to gorky very curious about the meeting of the central committee, but i apologize for this rude word. they write alexey maksimovich yes, returning, if you are from this europe, that you will live these beef men in general, well, look, everything is fine here. your beloved leningrad generally blooms and smells, and so on and uh, life was definitely getting better in the cities. at the very least, it can be imagined that gorky is completely sincerely enthusiastic and begins gorky on table, as you know. three monkeys stood like that. this is such an indian character, one closes its eyes, the other one closes its mouth, wipes its ears and does not see anything. can not hear anything. i won't tell anyone. gorky, of course, understood more than what he was saying at that time, especially in journalism in general

journalism. that thirties is monstrous. here, true, it is monstrous, it is monstrously not even in content, because he praises stalin there, who did not praise him. guys who didn’t praise stalin, except for mandelstam who, because of this paid a very serious price, the point is not even that he praises stalin through a word , she is monstrously in her bedding. and how to explain it? i don't know, i don't understand. here is a true riddle of a man at the same time writing the life of the hay territory. yes, he writes, yegor bulychev and others write a brilliant play. this is absolutely furious journalism to strangle these enemies of the people to kill these enemies. on the roll in general, how sincere he is here. i don't even understand, to be honest, i think that we still haven't we know well enough and have studied stupid that in general. hmm it seems to me that

gorky's journalism of that time. you just have to put down the newspapers to watch. in what sequence were these articles published, and for what purpose did he pursue what goals , because at the same time he helps a huge number of people, that is, he continues to do what you do before, of course, but at the same time, it means journalism. i say, okay , enough of stalin, but he simply calls to simply kill and that means to execute all these traitors , traitors, enemies of the people, and even into creativity here it penetrates. unfortunately, because he writes such write reaches others. e, where does it appear, yes, he is such a kvdeshnik who, when he will arrest everyone in the house of yegor bulychev , because in the nest of enemies of the people, well, fortunately, this is his only work of art in which he really changes. here even i, when

faced with bitterness, when i wrote my other books, here is bulgakov yes at the end of the twenties. he still helps bulgakov. tries to help with the play run, for example, in the mid-thirties, when bulgakov writes moliere. gorky actually killed this book andrey platonov in the late twenties. he helps him publish chavengur, that is, he tries to help, nothing happened, but at least he appreciates this injury in the early thirties, the story garbage wind, a brilliant platonic story, gorky just hacked everything and plato blocked his oxygen there. this is all the same, what, what was in it, how to understand this by the end of life. he somehow cursed, i don’t know, he frowned, what was happening to him, there is some kind of secret in behavior. even a trip to the villages, right? by the way, here, uh, to which they exchange me it will be exchanged with a boy. it's true, right? no, of course not, just like all those upside-down newspapers, there and so forth. no, of course, well, it’s clear what they brought there, it’s understandable, but the fact is that

at the end of the twenties, the nightingales are a little bit different from the slavs who become the thirties there. magazines are published there. there is a theater there, there are some newspapers there, uh, there is no cultural life going on there. there, she's quite interesting actually, because people of very different classes of ideological moods get there, they all boil in one boiler. so, why did gorky go there? i wanted to see solovki, i wanted to see. uh, correctional yes, yes the camps, because that's the idea of ​​reforging, yes, he really was infected. here is the belomorkanal that labor will re-educate. i think that it was such an old-fashioned no chance it’s not a chance, but in what sense of culture is the highest e more important than a person culture, in which civilization civilization is more important than a person,

pyramids, pyramids, not a person, egyptian pyramids. you can't build e without using a slave corpse. well, wait , you can't build petersburg without burying a huge amount of pyramids in these swamps. sounds bitter er, proudly, not petersburg sound throat man-channel. this is an important civilizational, as he believed. so to speak construction to connect. from the baltic black sea, he wrote about this not in a timely manner, their thoughts, by the way, he writes about that, but temporary thoughts. he starts writing before october. so after february he starts writing this and he protests against, but sending people to the front of the first world war and writing there a curious phrase instead of sending these people to be slaughtered, wouldn’t it be better to send them to the construction in how he writes the baltic

kherson canal, a case that peter the great dreamed about but this is such hot ideology, er, but which in the first place many were infected. and secondly, well, let's not be cunning, and not be quick, tampas are not done differently, so here. and you can say as much as you want that this is monstrous and so on. ka- what others options, and other options do not make a revolution, yes, go back again. what else is there to do? then? let's go back to the year 1961 and still free the peasant correctly, not like they freed them without land.