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tv   PODKAST  1TV  April 25, 2023 1:25am-2:11am MSK

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[000:00:00;00] i’m complaining that at the same time when he was sitting, that’s where i’m waiting to be shot, his friend eduard bagritsky poet was arrested, to whom kataev then, in general, gave a ticket to literature, that is, he dragged him to moscow and began to drive him through magazines and made him a famous poet. well, in general, a lot of e important interesting things. uh, and here, no, yes, and in this book, too, i felt hmm things. i was just investigating, and there are a lot of uh, unique letters, and lesh uh, and many others. e, there is evgeny petrov e, kataev's brother strongly this topic continues kataev is an excellent writer. and for me this is the main thing, but you are a man. e, who gave life, by the way, to the generation of young twenty-year-olds who then came in
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their youth, and here i want to trust. his daughter evgenia is the same little girl from the seven-flowered flower, who says that dad would be satisfied with the life of today's youth, it was already kataev in life later, but still i would like to return. that's what is commonly called the odessa school, because after all, odessa, uh, the tenth twenties . uh, the levantines are such a mycelium, well we remember shklovsky, viktor borisovich shklovsky wrote about this, but this is babel, this is kataev or petrov this is semyon lipkin, for example, uh, the younger of the eleventh year. yes, he is not from this company, we talked at all. eh, with this petrovich later. well, yes, the cafe appreciated poems from russia in lipkin. brilliant absolutely, and therefore not only that is, important or shy distance lvovna lesnitskaya. that is, this whole is so simple and
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lesha and yuri carlo alyosha of course yes , it should also be called here as, well, it is necessary say that for me kataev is. eh, such an original successor to the bunin line. uh-huh and he is perceived by me as a student of bunin. i would actually call the name of nabokov for me here kataev and nabokov, in fact, such rivals are the students of ivan alekseevich unexpectedly, because bunin was also in odessa, we know that i was the odessa period. and with this are connected cursed days. then yes, what a literary impulse he was very instructing and in the same way, young on his sides. eh, i learned from him wrote to him. here are the letters he sent his first things. and i must say that they were bizarre on the trajectory divorced statistical line. this aesthetic was the main thing for them and it was interesting how they treated each other. but at least for kataev, nabokov was a writer. it's clear. this is an interesting condemnation. really. i think they are rewriting the book. i might even expand on the topic
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when his nabokov this is terrible love worthy of a separate, for example , literary analysis, when i teach students, at the moscow art theater school, which i really love as an actor, not a philologist, of course. uh, so i propose to divide them into nabokovites and yeseninists in no way, without opposing the two geniuses of russian literature, and i adore yesenin on the side, but still, uh, in a sense, these are poles, either life as such, nature, yes, or here such a rapture of beauty nabokov wrote that he hates a person who enters the forest and does not know the name of each herb and so on. this is, uh, an addition to the southern fullness. heat aesthetic vision is very important. it seems to me, yes, why do you say? well, look, are you investigators in the sense that hmm when the first edition of the book appeared, i heard that, well, in vain so many pages are devoted to kataev, because he, like
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so many authors, is reduced to a formula. yes , kataev is the author of the story a lonely sail turns white. come on, this is the trend of the soviet canon regiment the soviet canon, and there is the magnificent and there is the magnificent mavistian prose, that is, uh, maybe, perhaps, his better prose that he wrote in life. that is it explain this term. it means it's bad. uh, well actually the proportion shift. it's great. it was prose that did not fit into any standards, especially socialism, and it was some wild, free, magnificent prose. this is a holy well, my diamond crown i recommend it to everyone. and now i'm writing a book about another writer uh-huh and yuri pavlovich zakon. that is, this biographical line is blown out of you. and yuri pavlovich is an absolute genius. i mean, i'm so glad to hear that from you. i myself am different, but there is also
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something related and, uh, this is related, i will name the password. bunin hmm it is interesting that just kataev and the cossack also had a certain line of rivalry, rolling into the future to the utmost generous to any other gift here , alerted and a little tense, feeling, in fact, just like i think. yes, i think that i also skate nabokov and sense an opponent, because he was highly valued. remember this judgment dear our viewers. it's boldly nabokov valentina skate. i saw an opponent. not all of you will agree. i will think about it here is a hypothesis. this is of course a theorem, but an opponent on the basis of aesthetic dominance. yes, they are very often perceived by the public, no, by no means a stem mob at all, yes, but it is ubiquitous recluse. e. this is a man who miraculously
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escaped execution, went through wars and ended up being such a soviet american, because in the twenties they stormed the heights of life. yes, yes, these guys, and , of course, it was important for them there, even the newspaper gudok is good to live cheerfully, and we bulgakov, by the way, but in the same company there was a wand, kazakov is so lonely. unfortunately the voice. forgotten absolutely transparency is it's just probably the best storyteller. uh, the second half of the 20th century in the snow and wept bitterly, certainly an absolute classic. it's like gashin's stories. uh, four days red flower. you read it and re-read it and you don't feel it. what you read, because you get right there, and you find yourself inside. it's a clear river that carries you. well, it
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, memory recovery and dizziness reduction. well , i would like to return a little more to the theme of the youth of the magazine and young literature. you've already talked about it. this is very correct. this young prose is young, all this literature has been nurtured. kataev of course there is. let's call axions. yes, this is a wonderful thing. ok then. and uh, here is the current youth, you also started about it speech. you are the editor-in-chief of a youth magazine, and that in itself is very cool that the magazine exists, because not all magazines have survived. this is our sadness. this is a big sadness. sorrow pain, all comb literature. this is a pain, but in fact, everything must be done to ensure that this truly national treasure lives on. uh-huh. and actually through that writers' association that i head about it. now i have begun to do a lot in order to somehow support the leading fat men, because this
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really a station of taste this is a combination of very different wonderful genres and nowhere is there such a thing, like inside a tolstoy magazine and this is not archaic. this is an opportunity to publish and speak for good authors of various generations of unknowns. uh, maybe oleg grigoryevich chukhontsev or aleksandrovich kushnar, who, over 80, will write several poems, and they come to the magazine, but in the world znamya a is young and oleg grigorievich is also our wonderful young authors, who are now thinking where they should go there with a story literary-critical text. right now there is a wonderful critic from the city of kamyshin , volgograd region, ivan rodion ivan radio , a regular contributor to the magazine youth man, cleverly and subtly brilliant interprets modern literature. where you live is less important, yes,
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because you still eat immediately. available on the internet, yes youth gives its space to different writers. we have a lot of famous and successful writers, but at the same time it is very important that the lion's share is a writer. new this generation twenty-year-old regions, which is very important, and i am glad that a lot of very noticeable interesting ones have actually appeared. uh, original brand new writers. well, i just read ekaterina manuela hmm perfectly. e, vera bogdanova in my opinion , very interesting things are already known. yes , this fame arises very quickly and rapidly from the debut. i do not think that it spoils the authors, as a rule. on the contrary, it gives some impulses to continue, if it is an example for others who want to write. uh, who has such a need, start try yourself no, restrictions. no obstacles, please, it's very cool. and
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it seems to me that the creative spirit is something that is extremely important for society, well, for society and the society of the nation, the ethnos, as you like, so that there is this e, creative environment. this is right. e, of course, there is no doubt about that, but in thick magazines - this is the authority that is throughout. eh, well, for a century and a half, maybe even more, it was the main one in russian literature, because the book followed the magazine , always the person who wanted to take place in literature went to the magazine. yes, whether it be dostoevsky or goncharov with his farmers' novels, this is still being discussed , and for me it is important, for example, that the story e was written before, for example, the collection was published. i give stories to thick magazines. well, you mentioned the association, uh, writing or publishers that you head and hmm here again. ah, skepticism. that’s what the idea was, after all, how not to unify, but to support the very forces. the fact is that
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after the collapse of the union of soviet writers , several organizations were formed, but 30 years later, tearing all kinds of squabbles arose the flora of the direction, that there is something very important that can be described as a common cause, because you need to support older writers, the needy need to support the young, you need to generally help the writer. as a result, we managed to create some over structure. uh, every rural organization that entered remains independently included all the largest organizations for the next record the forest of the ussr and the creative council of the association included, er, wonderful writers who do not fully identify themselves with any unions. this must also be understood it's great, because it's not a bureaucratic, but a living thing and a real
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writer in a sense, a loner. and we also have writers of different generational worldviews, but there is something that can be done for them, these are trips of writers around the country throughout russia, these are workshops for writers. this is a creative residence. that is , a lady of creativity, when a writer can say, i would like to live here and write, breathe this far eastern air there, take a walk to write. and this is support for thick magazines. this is support national literature and translations. and now we will have trips of writers to book fairs in the cis, which is also very important and great. in general, it is important, the dialogue of culture is very important to set up and establish this communication . hmm well, children's centers, by the way, they called the koroleva artery, what happens in literature?
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yes, uh, and not well, of course, i would like to say separately that the center of the center for the aspiring association with the writer of russia is the house of the rostovs , the legendary house of the rostovs, uh, in moscow on podovskoy street somewhere it was a street, literally every uh, open freely for everyone there are a variety of literary meetings, and that's it. this. i think it is an important and noble task. well, here we are, dear, our viewers went through such a very wide circle, because no one will be visiting sergey shagunov, and sergey shergunov , we also talked about how a writer can and should write about personal will that he perceives e in his creative solitude, and ended the conversation about the writer who organizes the process of literary making. uh, a lot is everything for others, this is, uh, sergey shergunov and i with great pleasure
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i thank you, uh, sergey alexandrovich, for this conversation and i am sure that we will meet with you more than once? thank you very much. thanks from support. so our dear viewers. it was a literary podcast. uh, dmitry baka podcast is called. let them not speak. let them read today's issue. we spoke with the wonderful writer sergei shergunov and together with sergei we tell you to read with pleasure. subscribe. there is a wonderful joke. recommend some guide. take dante hello we gathered our thoughts today
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to solve an unsolvable problem. dante in 35 minutes, these three brave aleksey nikolaevich varlamov, writer, philosopher, rector of the literary institute and archimandrite simeon tomachinsky dentist, or either all the same, or all the same dentist yes, i am vladimir legout and we, as i said, will try to decide, well, really unsolvable task. but you know, dear friends. here's what i want to say right now. i would like to talk about dante, more precisely about the divine comedy, as a book of direct action, that is, this book is for every day, if we read it today only as and look at it as a story about the middle ages, we write dissertations about the influence on the concept of purgatory. and so on. it's all wonderful. interestingly and correctly, this book is part of, uh, our cultural code and so on and so forth, but it was written for what dante himself remembers. you said in one of the letters. yes, he says to take a person out of the state of misfortune in which he
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is now and bring him into a state of happiness, yes, hell purgatory, paradise, state. happiness, father of names, what do you think about this, and you the question is actually quite correct and i absolutely agree here that the divine comedy is rather about such self-knowledge, yes, because dante is, in general, a symbol of a person, that is, each of us, and this is his way of ascent yes this very difficult path through hell through purgatory through paradise, in fact, for the sake of what, as it was called ancient, to become kapok sdey yes , capable of god, yes, that is, he had to. uh, really somehow transform something to do with your soul to be in able to generally look at paradise at its inhabitants and about it. beatrice speaks in one place. dante's trouble was so deep. and
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that it was possible to save him only by the spectacle of those who died forever. that is, he had to pass. here, through all this horror, e, where he fainted there a couple of times, and so on. eh, that's it, time is silly, but you tremble with such fears to really cleanse yourself. uh from the inside to become the best stand up will start to be a real person. alexey shakes. this is possible for a modern person, but perceive here this text has been written for a very long time. yes, many centuries ago, as a text. uh, for every day, i don't think about every day. so i don’t really imagine a person, but if you don’t read their stubborn philologists, who will every day, er, read one chapter of the date, still in my understanding. this is some kind of book that burns every day , i don’t really want to, i don’t really want to. but in general it is curious that there is a very different perception of live. dante is very different. see, for example, mandelstam in his
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famous conversation essay. dante wrote about that reading dante is such a difficult ascent, you need to stock up on swiss shoes with nails in order to go borghis , a well-known argentine writer says that reading dante is a pleasure, that he generally reads borscht books only for the sake of pleasure. and here is dante - it's just that this is super. such beautiful poetry. in nietzsche , one can come across the idea that dante is singing, hygiene among the graves, well, he loved some paradoxical ones less, yes, therefore perception here is one of the french romantics in the 19th century wrote that reading hell is like reading a florentine newspaper. yes, that is, this is actually the binding of this great immortal creation, who is the reality that was created. it also has a place to be, so this is a very planned thing. tournaya it is very difficult and therefore every day i read something very different. i read pushkin
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every day. well, pushkin, you can still read this collection to nikolaevich shevelev, that you read in the sea to swim there. i know why about every day, but there is such an approach, or what about reading the date, that there are, uh, three levels, yes, and each subsequent one is deeper than the previous first level. this is when we realize the greatness of this book, we say yes , something like that, probably, could be, that is, not literary greatness, but there are people who are convinced that the divine comedy is the result of a certain spiritual journey of dante's revelation and so on. something like that could be. this is first class in the first sense , not on an airplane. yes, first class in comprehension. yeah entry level second level when we we say, but such things can happen to me and the third level is the deepest. yes , the most serious and closest to what dante wanted is when we say, listen
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, this happens every day. yes, i tell my students and i don’t think that dante would be offended by such a comparison. i tell them, you know, you wake up on saturday morning and you have to go to the first couple and it's hell. then you get up, because you need to drink coffee, there a little bit and already somehow life is getting better, something already, and if already purgatory and if everything is fine in the evening, then here it is paradise, but in a sense, of course, not in such a primitive everyday way, but this path that we go through all the time. is not it so. do you understand? everyone has their own ladies. yes, yes, i remember my dante, i read it in the first year of philology, because it was necessary to read, a and a the beginning of a thick book that could not be borrowed from the library, because it was all sold out only in the reading room. yes, it was the first book in my life that he was reading so i read three lines climbed to see what it means the next three lines, note again. ah, that is, i felt like a philologist for the first time.
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why reading like i used to read books before. i'm wondering, for now, yes, i'm reading there , the eye is flying, looking at the lines, and now the chips are not working. look, it doesn't matter. this is heaven. this is purgatory yes, this is hell or in another order, yes, but in any case it is difficult reading in this sense, mandelstam's position is closer to me that there is a vector in this book that is actually itself. yes, he did explain. why does comedy start badly? okay question. was it like that in your own life? dante, i understand that it starts badly, but the fact that everything ended well. uh, in dent's own life - that's pretty debatable, father. what is your dante? i agree with alexei nikolaevich that it is really difficult to read. yes, anton but mandelstam still wrote an opera reading. yes, these indestructible swiss boots with nails. this is the first hard bite. that's when it's necessary all the time, i just
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watched it all the time. e in a note. this is for the first for the second government, when you already know well 25 times. yes, then this of course, it's completely different already . eh, regardless, actually. what part did you get into, because if he is in hell, then, of course, it's not just terrifying. and somehow it cuts you off. eh, there these same terrible, so to speak, images of all sorts of snakes somehow connect with a person. yes, and they turn into one of those terrible such scriptures the other day i re-read, of course. uh, well purgatory is really our uh, climbing to god is for me it's like uh metaphor for earthly life. yes, that is, precisely the efforts that are associated with internal purification. yes, and when he says i'm going up to gain vision. and where are we the vision of a shave. ah. this is completely already divine
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objects and communion with saints, therefore, or there, his communion with adam is wonderful. yes, the first person strikes me is this, of course, an episode from the divine comedy. that is, here are some, uh, pieces become familiar to you. and they keep you or keep your wadi without despair, yes, uh, or be inspired. here's the climb to god in this sense. i think that having overcome this first resistance of the material, then you go to some other, e.g., comprehension that is closer to you. pentalgin extragel against pain in muscles and joints it contains the highest dosage of a substance for inflammation pain and a special component for better penetration into the focus
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the 20th century there under the japanese. no, why. because you understand this scale as the scale of the scale. well, now i began to re-read, again, the divine comedy and caught myself thinking. well, and some books around the divine comedy caught myself on thoughts. in general, dante was not a very kind person. well, at least in this book . here, look what happens there, he travels through these three areas and is actually doing interviews. yes, he asks this asks. it asks you, it's amazing from an artistic point of view, it's convincing. it is possible to say so, there are absolutely such people there. well , this is one of the most classic examples of the second round, and see you with the ball and the frenchwoman francesco yes, this is a famous medieval story, not even legendary actual before our eyes. and the blow is these two people, powella and francesca, who fell in love with each other, but this is lawless love. yes, therefore, it means that they are in
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this second circle. in general, yes, well, the lyrical hero, i don’t know how to express it correctly, he sympathizes with them at the same time. and here they are in this position. they have absolutely no remorse for what they have done, but from a point of view. dante, they are just there, because well , they have sinned, so they have sinned, although the person who killed them both. he is in in a more difficult circle of hell, in general, dante is very just, very just, but it is not by chance that we say that in our tradition mercy is higher than justice. here is dante's mercy in my opinion. there is no way, as an artist, he is impeccable more than that, and when paola and francesco meet him and see that he is imbued with sympathy for them, but at the same time, justice is all the stronger. than sympathy, however. they say, they tell him that if we could she we would pray for your soul before god they can't they are in hell. yes, but in them here it is human so strong that they would pray and the lyrical hero does not even have
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a movement of the soul. we can somehow change and maybe somehow forgive them, they really don’t repent themselves, this will tell the cleaning, because if they repented, they would betray their love, there is such a complex moral and ethical complex, that is all this complexity, all this depth of human relationships. dante certainly shows. well he passes by, well he passes by them all. and this is his such passage through the parting grounds. uh, and paradise here in this i can be not right. i'm not about not taking it. what is the first word that dante utters in the first chapter for the mercy of pity, that is, it turns out. if you agree with your vision, yes, to a person who has no mercy, but he himself begins with this , the text begins with this. this is his first word to take
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. i didn't start arguing. there is such a story that here, like everyone else, where is justice, where is justice? why are you still lawless around? well, as justice in hell, and mercy in heaven, and on earth, how will it turn out, so to say, e in this respect , really a danton, after all , he studied jurisprudence in a balloon for him, this idea was very important and it was not by chance that cato put guards, yes, and so on, and she, of course, is present, but dante sympathizes with them. after all, it is no coincidence. i fell like a guy. yes? it's all to him, on the contrary, wilgel, he says, listen dear. if you start your emotions now, and then you simply won’t get to squander. where do we need to go must step aside and accept divine justice as it is. and these people chose their own path. you are correct in saying that they do not want to repent. and by the way, they notice the cleaning. here already the phrase strikes me
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that everyone. the price of dante is devoted to only a few lines, but this is eternal life. this is eternal life, you understand, that is, they are frozen in this state terribly, because the frozen state is only in hell. e, everywhere, in the rest of the dynamics of things everywhere. they understand these winds to drive as long as it is french. they how interesting not fire. here is such a household association, the first, yes or school, i don’t know, whatever. and ice. yes, ice is the ninth circle and there is also an amazing thing, when it goes i don’t remember who it says, well , like, give me an interview, tell me why you don’t want to tell, and then yes, he says, well i will write about you. yes, that's what i got from this, when i watched the icy swamps, and you believe so much that it really happened, that is, when they were talking about dante. yes, that's it, it was printed during his lifetime. and yes, that, here he was in hell, when you read this, you really have the feeling that somewhere he
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saw something. well, in general, i honestly think that you don’t know if there is a lyrical hero or a lyrical one. it seems to me that this is the result of some kind of spiritual experience. well, otherwise such books are not created, or such a book could not have been written in another way. and you know, that's what's interesting, what am i talking about? what turn i wanted to offer you now, i’m starting, maybe from what you said, if the amount is, uh, it’s fair, but there isn’t sympathizers, yes, but in him this sense of justice is stronger. than sympathy. that is, he believes, so it should be a pity for them, of course. well, they deserve it. let them even look at this manfred, uh , sicilian, yes, who in general, excuse the church excommunicated excommunicated, dad, u, he died before that he repented before god and he once again. eh, not in hell, not in any chapel, right? well, he still had his own qualities, because he was wonderfully cute, yes, dad, who realized that he could not deal with these hardships he wanted to leave with papal
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deeds, or rather, go into a hermitage to pray to god. he was not allowed to do this, in general, they imprisoned him and his church, by the way, the roman canonized where dante was placed in limp in the middle. worthless. yes, because from dante's point of view, he is so active and active. you must behave like this, and if you don’t, then the place, and you make contact. yes, you know, he really is, after all . sometimes it seems to me that his position is more difficult, he can hit, like a dead man falls, but at the same time, internally , this lawyer is in him, this lawyer, he does not die in him, and he believes that everyone here is justly given, and in my deeds for me, er, insympathy and compassion , love is impossible. yes, but let's remember the end of the divine comedy, which almost everyone knows, at least the last line , which is actually the beginning, and not the end here of could not, but the high spirit take off, but passion and will. i already aspired as if
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the wheel given the course is love that moves the sun and the luminary. love for dante is not a metaphor. this is what i think is sometimes confused. that's beautifully finished beautifully. it's not a metaphor. it is literally the sun and shone and in general everything in general, the main feeling, love is love, yes, only dante says that there are two problems. where is the sin. yes, or an object. wrong, selected love, or not, measures, love. yes, but, by the way, what does christian christian asceticism and patristic heritage say about this ? it is close to us, very interesting, of course, the topic and it would be worth studying it in more depth, but i met something similar, naturally, not in terms of love. and now the confessor is in maxim's cellar. yes, that is, that is our full strength. yes, they are initially, as if kind, yes, they can be directed to yes in the right direction, and so on, they transform a person, they really lead to
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god, and they can go in a completely different direction, yes and yu. this is not some kind of evil, nature. yes, christianity is natural, you understand that a person is created good. yes , but here is how he will use what is given to him in the subject e talents. here is a common christian thought. what, in general, god does not create evil, that's why there is a person, and all and all his feelings of desire his desire even with us, by the way, here an embryonic italian dontologist wrote a book, uh, which was translated into russian, apparently embarrassed by the original dante who saw god, in the original the book is called dante the poet of desire, because there is such and such without desire, there can be nothing neuro- psychophysiologists. they would say needs. yes, but it's true, but only this desire of dante is associated with love, and the problem arises when you either lost your way, or you don't love it. yes, by the way, this is quite in line with sin according to the orthodox tradition. this is a miss. yes, the word can be translated from greek into russian as a miss. here's dante about it, he says, it's wrong, the target is chosen. that is
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, you love not what you love warrior this is the feeling of love that you gave, god which no one else has, no insects. here is and you have it and you let it in, and the second is a sense of proportion, yes, alexey nikolaevich a. well, i would like to specify this, because danko is clear, and the object of this love is beatrice. yes, it's like that's his personal story and his love for this girl who came into his life when he was nine years old, who was never his lover and was never his wife because he married another she married another. then she died. and so, as far as i understand, uh, the essence of such an underlying reason for the divine comedy is that at some point dante's life went in the direction of sin, life. yes , she went past, and then, as it were, the architecture of the divine comedy, if i'm wrong, because
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when she saw this mother of god yes, she turned to them beatrice and here. driven by love, beatrice shows the date, where, in fact? he had to get there, because he went astray and the only way he can, as it were, take the path of truth. as agreed with the details of the work , i do not dedicate anyone, i need a separate office and materials for the last 6 months, to be more precise , speaking with you. here is the liberation of the city of rostov, the threads go up to moscow , an organized spy network operates in the city. and we could reveal the good german law from now on, everyone in side meets in case of danger always does not show next to nothing happened, but did not try to talk to anyone so that you would not see this according to the laws of wartime new
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