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tinkov winline bet is more than just a 2% rate from it goes to the development fund of your favorite club. support your favorite club with every bet we we continue our conversation with oleg blin about the sirius experiment. tell us about your relationship with the crew. what was your role? as commander? i don't know what i ordered, given that our crew was special in that it was international. we said at the very beginning, but the fact that he was

an intergenic three men and three women. it imposes features of its own. yes, i was the commander, but other members of the crew had their own positions, like crew doctors , flight engineer. uh, flight specialist and, of course, in this situation it is necessary to be uh, leader and at the first moment of time, of course, it was assumed that this would be directive management? that is, i am the commander. now i will steer everyone and play with you, but it was not there. if we are in an open society, then we have the opportunity to lead and then leave. uh, to some place, uh, to recover and continue to continue to manage when you are inside. eh, enclosed space. eh, a social closed volume, then you willy-nilly need to communicate. uh, with these crew members and in in this case, of course here this directive control it is reduced. and here it is already necessary to agree. let's say than the crew. and thus define. uh, organizational moments in part of our life,

and given that the isolation itself. she does not hide in herself so much, as it were, pleasures. that is, every day it is some kind of psychological confrontation that makes you oppose. this is interaction with each other, as we say at the very beginning, that we initially had 12 people, and then there were six people, and these are the relationships. behind we have already lined up as six people, literally a month has passed and we have five people, this is again before the transformation. and in these conditions, of course, every time i had to adapt and keep my leading positions e. the fact is that it so happened that our experiment recruited specialists from different industries. these were not professional astronauts. these were not people who, uh, were preparing for this experiment with this, it was determined that i , as a commander, had space experience, like would be training on the ground. uh, should accompany them on the performance of scientific

experiments. and to be, well, a senior mentor, one might say, and it so happened that this steering wheel, it is so ingrained that it is, firstly, as a senior mentor and secondly, this is a person who makes decisions on some things, and given that there were always some situations of turning off ventilation. these are problems with lighting water supply. there were some problems with each other. that is, in this case it was necessary to experiment. between start you prepared for it. no, how to deal with emergency situations. we received general information. and here is how we will act in these conditions. it has already been determined by the situation. that is, of course, we knew where everything was. where e. well, we did not have such an onboard instruction for actions. well, for example, ventilation disappears elementary. what does it mean? this means that we emit carbon dioxide, it is not removed. and you start to immediately feel the heat. well, warm, and uh, at some point. you

understand that it starts to rise from carbon dioxide content. in this situation, of course, we immediately stop all our work. uh, if we have other modules, then try to disperse under another sea, where, for example, ventilation. we can still stay there and, uh, plus fix everything, the malfunction that caused the ventilation to stop, of course, immediately. send a message to the soup. but the soup does not always accept information, of course, we recorded and this video file went to the control center and after 5-10 or how many minutes it reaches the control, and there already makes a decision. i'm just talking about gender, as i started talking. i wanted to ask you all the time, and there about sex, how is it, where i am a very important point, uh, in terms of how close some crew members are to each other, and now, if a conditional couple is formed, uh, then it was accordingly. well, let's not put names here, there was a little rapprochement

, a friendly rapprochement, which and thus very strongly rushed in a small team for the reason that jealousy results. especially between girls, this is understandable. that's it it turns out two are approaching, respectively, they are moving away from the rest and this is something uneven. e relationship it brings even more attitude , that nevertheless, well, adults understand that for a long time everyone keeps themselves in das, and then bam two, they are not experiments. i think that or should be originally. e, it's formed, and it's best not to allow such things to happen under these conditions. because it greatly reduces performance. tell me about your daily schedule. what did you do. at our routine was as follows, uh, tried to mimic the same as on board the rise. we had at 7 o'clock. end 23 hours.

well, we have six rises, and at 22:3 it will be. that is, we rested for almost 30 minutes more, and it turns out. uh, in the morning it's to pass various tests right away. uh, then it's uh breakfast, and the attendants themselves cooked it. e, after that, we had a dpc bite. by the way, our food was a-a freeze-dried in tubes. well, that is the same thing, yes, but i honestly want to say that the first time we eat space nutrition. cool. i'm now past a souvenir shop that sells it's china the cheapest. i'm going. by the way, yes, not the most food , really expensive, and i ate it every day every day. you pour out this something breakfast omelette with cheese, and there these 100 g of

sublimated product for me are 100 g . and here it was about 1800, about two thousand. that is, it is valid and in the first even this is not enough land, uh, and in the first there are 2-3 weeks, really. here's me and william who well we don't go. uh, we did walk around with hungry eyes and wanted to eat something, and by this point , we were still uh over-disciplined about diets. i'll tell you. here is your diet. you can't eat anything else. and accordingly, we are at breakfast. this is a cheese omelet. e tea and bread is really not enough. the girls are already telling us, let's dress you up, he says. well, where, if we take this away from you now, then we will all go hungry us. this will not help her as a result of such nutrition, it contributed to a fairly good decrease. plus physical activity, uh,

and the weight has decreased somewhere, our weight has decreased somewhere. eh, 16-20 kg is not bad. yes , he wants to lose weight all in sirius well, tell me all the same in 8 months. it contacted the seven we set up uh, corresponded regularly via uh. these interns are the official internet, and that's all. and also here. no, you could talk. no, it was possible to correspond, only with a doctoral doctoral file, we learned how to insert video. uh, put his password in the dock file, and they keep telling me. and why do you have so much written, and there was a limit, but about 15 mb somewhere like this, as usual, yes, and it turns out that these are short messages, at least something is moving or just insert a photo it happened before.

oh my god, something fresh. yes, there is a child growing up. here, of course, life goes on. yes, life goes on. and what is the most? the main thing, i've definitely experienced it. does it feel like family? yes, this is very important. here's what you don't hear wind, no noise, no rain are not humble seasons . eh, here we are. it was later this early autumn when we were closed. and we returned in the summer and when there are no windows there is no way to see what's outside , only through the perception through these pictures . something, but inside we had a lot of vr, we had, uh, methods that were related to the fact that we could dock in vr glasses in space conditions. e, me i liked that you can dock with

the non-cooperative. e object like e jennibacks? damn, this is what we always talked about, that docking with non-copying and plus riding a rover is also a vr space in a month. two three, probably, i have these perceptions of the lunar surfaces. orbital motion was much more than some terrestrial ones. i write to me in one of the letters. i roll, i perceive that we are real. we are in the world. i don't understand what we are. uh, at the institute of america for biological problems, what we are in moscow or we are somewhere on earth at all, that is, it’s completely my perception that we are completely immersed, and then she sounded the alarm in letters that i ’m returning you all, otherwise you may not return later. we continue our conversation with oleg blinov about a trip to the moon. so the most difficult thing was to wait for the end of this experiment. it so happened that it seems that

now time has already passed, almost a year has already passed, and these are the effects of a negative factor that you are just adjusting to some condition. i don't know if it's psychologists on purpose, either this is how it turned out, or it is a transformation within the team. she constantly got stuck in the most painful thing and every day something happened to you that is not very convenient. and that was probably the hardest part. e, each time to adapt to new conditions somehow and at some point for me, e, the days of stay in these conditions were comparable, as after all three, that is, the day lasted incredibly. although uh, they were painted. well , as if the techniques were in the morning. evening almost had breakfast and yes, dinner with us promises exercise. yes, including physical education, but plus more about physical education. uh,

an interesting approach was to simulate the changes that occur in the conditions of space, and space is to a greater extent. weightlessness is hypodynamia. eh, and here in order to bring us at least a little closer to these conditions. we were forbidden to approach any simulators at all. we certainly tried in some way. uh, physically strain to walk on these modules. here and there. this maximum number of steps was about 2,000 steps. and, of course, for a month of such hypodynamia, the muscles weaken. e, the background is removed and then a month of active cardio load begins, this is either a passive treadmill or an active treadmill for a month with physical inactivity, then strength training equipment. let's go all month you're doing only forces. and so, every month , hypodynamia is an asset. hypodynamia and activity and at the end of each month a complete cycle of removing nut backgrounds, what was the most interesting thing that you remember from the experiment? ah, i

remember. e. probably like me, but interacted with plants, probably like this we had on after, uh second truck imitation truck trucks. yes, two trucks flew in to us, which ensured the delivery. uh, food stuff. uh, the scientific equipment was disposable. oh, well, the food arrived for a week uh no, uh fresh food was only at the laying. at the beginning , the apples were all after that, but when the second truck arrived, along with this truck, we managed to send a greenhouse, as it turned out, the greenhouse is the most dangerous biological object in an isolated space. and now, uh, when we received these containers with soil - unusual soil. we had the opportunity to grow. uh, and those are cereal tomatoes. ah,

leafy root vegetables. that is, all this could be grown , and of course i want to grow it faster to feel this smell of wheat, tomato leaves or something else, especially when you take parsley. she is not my scent. there is no smell at all, no izli- as if cleanliness is absolutely. and so i noticed that when you daily communicate with plants of such a learning, as if they were you hear. they understand you and, uh, when they talk about what kind of psychologists? support is necessary for a person during a flight into deep space. i always say that plants are a very good means for relaxation. here i am behind me. uh, i saw that plants can be grateful. that is, if you pass there in the morning, well, there good morning. well, of course, you are talking about psychologists now, uh, i am silent about the fact that they can react differently. but when you got sick in the morning, then you took care of them. eh, speaking realistically, they

very responsive and as a result when you get already. hey, here's a tomato. well, this is a yellow little tomato. and here we are , little there, cutting the boy into small pieces among ourselves. and let's get each other, and then so much this three bushes of tomato and further on the fruit how many 73 tomatoes, and here we were, of course, delighted. psychologically , it was very good when there is an opportunity to infect something and here in our case. here is just such a situation, but on an arab holiday. uh, with the ship it was delivered uh, a box of dates, how are they called the royal physics. and salik is like that, he says, help yourself, he covered. uh, they ate the table and the bones. i say bones. come here. he says, why am i saying, now we will grow. yes, it cannot be such that something has grown here from a date seed. passes i everything, as by the method turned off the week passes. he says, well, what am i

saying, no, nothing second nothing for the third week. i see that it swelled and growth began. and so. uh, when we already went out like this kind of foliage, uh, and there would already be several of them and he was delighted that something could be grown from a c seed and of course it was a biological problem growing a few date trees. yes, you can go, yes, and eat them with pleasure. how did you take a shower? and we had a shower once, uh, all for 10 days, and every day, and every day, napkins, that is, here they tried as much as possible to imitate what could be on board the space station and this lack of water. he, as it were, was imitated in ordinary beds. yes, we slept, we are in ordinary beds. we had, uh, private cabins. i have each their own yes, each has its own separate cabin. hey,

i had the biggest one. i had a cabin. yes, she was the size, somewhere. e meters meter 70 by 20, but, while others have 2.20 per meter 50 m 30 somewhere so, tell us about the toilet, but the toilet, well, in this case, of course, there were not so many space technologies. it was e three bathrooms, which were earthly, who cleaned. uh, all the cleaning itself and, as it were , the maintenance was distributed among the crew members, each crew member was responsible for his own module. we've had many, many modular design, the commander cleaned. yes i had a central base unit in which i was able to engineer. uh, regularly support. that is, the toilet didn’t clean, you can’t be too proud. e. well, you are the same crew person. yes, you have some kind of task that you have to perform under certain conditions, that is, you either organize or

make decisions, but no one relieves you of the responsibility to do the dishes or, uh, clean the toilet? yes, we had, but the fact is that we do not have dishes, well, except for the fork, we had at first such packages that could be refilled, uh, but in the future there were already simplified packages, which, well, as if without a device for refueling and in further use. tell me a private evening. you took with you. ah, i tried to be as close to the start as possible. i took 1 kg of personal belongings with me, they could take more, and just before the dive, there is such a further possibility that you can take a little more. what did you take? i took photos and headphones a year has almost passed after the experiment ended. some conclusions you can you tell there? were made. i can definitely say that the study of human behavior. in conditions such as

social spatial isolation must be studied before the experiment. i had such an illusory idea of ​​space flight that how cool it is, how wonderful it is. uh, i communicate with astronauts who have already returned that everything is in euphoria, everything is cool. and when you face it directly yourself, you understand that it is difficult here. and when you already meet the tatman, you say, you had it, that is, these factors that manifest themselves in the conditions of earthly sojourn. they are actually the same as his in the conditions of space flight and one thing. when an astronaut is a hero, who, well , maybe does not want to represent himself, that somewhere there is a difficult tester, he can say this calmly, that is, one must foresee this, because that, of course, difficulties arise no matter what

position you have, but the task of the experiment was to maximize uh-huh in case if those calculations were abnormal situations that are prescribed in your on-board documentation. they were the norm for us, that is, we lived in these conditions, plus everything else. uh, well, we didn’t touch on, uh, the solution constantly psychological tasks associated with some kind of ethical problems, that is, what can you do with the crew or with the crew member that you are tired of, either you throw him out, or you leave him or if he is ill, then leave him in this case. uh, there were symptoms, except for this girl. yes , someone had a fever because of what, well, more of a degree it is psycho-emotional, that is, psychosomatics caused diseases inside, that is , as in these ideal conditions, ideal temperature, ideal air, internal microclimate is the same insulation. uh, it's

the immune system, of course, slightly, slowly decreased, and this has been proven by scientists. here, now, according to the results of this , more than a half-year, uh, analysis. uh, there are reports that indeed life status is declining and preventive measures need to be taken. in order to prevent a complete, as it were, decrease. abilities and were like some kind of conflicts within the team conflicts were quite common, but they were so superficial. eh, how would the state and when we have developed ways of leveling - this is only open communication. this is just the immediate relief of all problematic issues. well, at most. our conflict lasted, but for three days we had such an interesting moment when a and one of the crew members were with us. uh, he is the representative of the united states, we have him

the leader and now he wanted to show. we didn't have a physical trial. and we are in the results. uh, the tests tried to compete with each other, that is, according to the result of each cooler. yes, who is cooler, of course, well, then you run through, and you literally have 2 seconds a little more for you, and like that, and of course, that was kind of like that. e, a balancing state that allowed e to understand that we are his poisoning. we can come to an agreement with you, and you don't need strength. tell me, after the experiment you communicate. what do you think in 50 years. uh, what will a man in space do? i'm very hopeful and almost certain. what is it, that a person in 50 years will already have the ability to carry out scientific research on the lunar surface and most likely there will be some kind of orbital, lunar orbit skill base in terms of the exploration of mars. i think it is

premature to say. uh, about the moon and objectively consider that, uh, if everything is fine, then we can organize our bases there. this is clear. uh, space powers in the form of russia china the whole state is good. today we talked about the unique sirius experiment by the commander, who was test cosmonaut oleg blinov. i'm anton shkapper. it was a space history podcast. to paraphrase a little bismarck politics, like diplomacy, is the art of the possible. hello today, we have gathered our thoughts about what is happening with international relations fyodor aleksandrovich lukyanov

, international observer andrey andreyevich sushentsov. historian political scientist dean of the faculty of international relations of mgimo i vladimir legoid. hello gentlemen. hello there is such a concept of historical distance and it is customary to say so a little academic looking up that until some time has passed it is very difficult to assess the situation in which you find yourself. how much is the law. as far as the lack of historical distance. today it allows us to answer the question that i boldly put out the title of our podcast. what is happening with international relations? it seems to me that the historical distance, uh, allows you to look just differently. but this does not mean that being inside the process it is impossible to analyze it. uh, another thing is that well, as the inhabitants of the roman empire of the era of its collapse say, i have no idea that it is disintegrating the ancient greeks, they did not know that they were ancient.

and even the participants of the first world war. they didn’t know that it was called the world later, and therefore, of course, comprehension, uh, which embeds events in the historical line , happens later. probably, but on the other hand, here we are now, if that’s how we live here and now, it seems to me that at least least for people who are professionally engaged in this. right now it is more or less clear where we will fit in later. we do not know how it will end, that is, we do not know the consequences of the consequences, we do not know. and what it is already more or less, i understand. hmm i think that the period of uncertainty, which many specialists, including those that have disturbed the last 20 years, has ended and some clarity has come, at least the dynamics of international events have high inertia. and the fact that in the future there will be stories there in half a century, let's say they will be written textbooks of the history of international relations

of this period and the starting point of the current processes will be named some date. there in the mid-nineties of the last century. the beginning of the formation of a polycentric order, russian-chinese american relations, a bet on nato expansion for a unipolar moment and the accumulation of contradictions, which ended up at the beginning of the third decade, and first in the xxi century in ukraine a. then, somewhere else, they got up to see such a systemic crisis that who knows, not a single one can last. edward carr describes the decade in retrospect. true, the interwar period between the first and second world wars called it a long crisis and it is possible that we are entering such a long phase into a phase in which there are no events of such jerks that change qualitatively and quickly. ah, international relations. how did, for example, the second world war in a relatively historically short period of time, a sharp

re-laying of all the foundations of international relations, the military, economic, legal, ideological and the formation of a stable frame for several decades, while we are inside a slow process in which all these foundations are also under question under a certain pressure and inertia of these processes. god forbid, it would be a slow , long, yet fast reloading means some kind of catastrophe. uh, slow transformation allows you to collect your thoughts already. hmm so slow. i think this is debatable. i agree that it has been accumulating for a long time, but when the accumulated has already detonated, now everything is happening extremely quickly, much faster than possible it would be assumed. also, i thought about, uh, the historical distance question . distance does one important thing that we can't do today. it does not

need to be removed, because these are three things that are happening now and we think are extremely important at a historical distance. they will disappear, they just won't exist. well, yes, small letters. and now we can't appreciate it. this is what makes a historic event. i want to offer you, but a certain cross-cutting thought, which seems to me extremely important and dear, let's even say in life, as a theory, it lends itself to rational construction of life, as reality does not lend itself to rational construction. so you said that well , more or less, everything is clear, in the late eighties in the early nineties it also seemed that everything was clear. period of historical optimism. bipo crash. on the system of international relations , the confrontation is over everything means democracy has won the world will become stable predictable wonderful bright end of history further with all the stops nothing will work, but about how wonderful you are said historical optimism has been replaced by misanthropic pessimism. yes and then it exploded, an abscess. that's all the same, how

rational is the design of forecasting. in general, perhaps you correctly remembered the turn of the eighties and nineties, and indeed then an excellent feature of er perception was that it seemed that we understand what will happen next. well, because it wouldn’t just be, but we just know that nothing else can be, she has laid a track, than regardless of the relationship, whether we like her or not, there’s nowhere to go and the same thing phenomenon. uh, apply globalization has long been thought to be globalization. here it is, and in which everything is and nothing more can be. we can hate it, but it is, but it is necessary. due that not to us, but there were people who already then said something else and it is easy to find people who said no. e lord , it doesn’t happen like that and it won’t happen like that, but here comes the next question. and uh, how should intellectual and scientific and other communication be built in general, so as not to succumb to

this wave, because now this is also actually, fedor very aptly noted that, uh, we need certainty , and this intellectual construction of our life in the late eighties in the early nineties was based on the experience of the end of world war ii , when for the first time humanity consciously approached the results of a catastrophic conflict and refused and now we will come up with a stable world , which will work according to the rules that we will propose in the key document of the united nations and stabilize this framework. possibly a long time. this is a union of five. the main countries, they will support this framework and indeed. uh, except for the periphery, uh, international relations, this framework held out for quite a long time in the late eighties, there was, apparently, the same mm hope that now we will build the

same stable world on a slightly different basis. ideologies, it means american values, universal values, american financial other infrastructure is universal and we will now live in peace and happiness, we must remember that the episode of the end the second world war is exceptional for world history, if you look at the previous episode, let's say the end of the first world war. such an attempt was unsuccessful , we could not rationally build a system that would work and be stably maintained, previous similar attempts to consciously and conservation, an established order. they were extremely short-lived international relations. i just wanted to ask you about my norm of rivalry or the leader, yes, here is this idea that you have already met. he says, that the world today is returning to international relations to its historical norm. yes, that is, but do i understand correctly that, relatively speaking, i recently listened to the lectures of our wonderful antiquity scholar. surikov about the peloponnesian war. and i thought so, here it is. what time am i talking about now,

really this is the same ancient greece or some. well, are there really such things in which it is normativity on the material of the peloponnesian war. actually, the classics about the theory of international relations derive the main maximums. here is his concept realism in international relations, when countries compete with each other for their interests, their national understanding. it is in each case very individual criteria of common sense are also very individual to them must be treated. eh, respectfully. eh, that is, our concept of common sense is not at all necessary. the same in germany, the same in the usa, the same in china , in india, and this requires respect. and i think that cognitive realism allows you to more, or something, stand firmly on your feet, comprehending, this is what is happening, what do you think, well, anyway case, he creates the illusion that you are standing there on your feet. i would like to develop this. i think andrei said a very important thing.

it is important for understanding today that the second world war really had a very strong influence on our consciousness , meanwhile it really was unique in many ways and it ended too, unusual, in general , there are not so many wars in the history of mankind that would end in the complete defeat of one of the parties completely the destruction of germany in its former form did not become japan in its former form. well, you can say, too, there she is later, well , this left a very big imprint on further understanding, when the cold war ended, the feeling arose the same , only this complete rout, as they thought. i have comprehended not a country, but a certain system of thought, a certain worldview, let's say all worldviews, except for one, and now this is the number of the worldview. it didn't even win. it just proved that others are not needed. that's all we have today is a consequence of such an end to this very or there interruption of the cold war,

but that started to change pretty quickly. this is the idea of ​​the victory of the worldview. this is what will provide. here's what we've already said. yes, it seems to be changing. it has become. rather, the idea that the worldview did not defeat others began to change later than the signs of this appeared. well, for a very long time they tried to pretend that it was something. well, costs in the way of the right goal. well, although i don’t know yet, there, if we talk about the academic space, then already in the sixties the concept of political culture appeared there, yes which simply told us that institutions and processes. they will be completely different. work political institutions in different political cultures, then what you said, yes, andrey andreevich well, you know me. er , maybe i'm not quite. here i understand, here is the question, when we associate with the same ancient greeks. yes, indeed, some basic things are basic patterns, they do not change, but this here is the context, life is about the context. yes, he was fundamentally different.

well, that is, military operations there during a the wars of athens and sparta they did not lead to similar results at all, not in human casualties , in anything it was fundamentally a different world, it seems like the laws are different, but the consequences are for everything that hits the nerves. yes, what makes a person, uh, a person exists rational. yes, they were fundamentally different, some historians of antiquity. it is said that even there there are hoplite battles. they are generally more of a sport, for example, they could have had victims there, dozens there. sometimes even a few and actually some others were pushed back, they ran away, we won. then and here they are, so to speak, running around there throughout civilization. it seems to me that brutalization and humanization developed simply along two tracks at the same time. they walked, as it were, together at first. hmm, more and more cruel forms of confrontation and some kind of attempts to curb it. as for, uh, how the nature of war is changing. right now at 23

. there's a lot to discuss here on this subject. where it moves forward back to the side, because , well, those, uh, hostilities that we are now witnessing, generally speaking, no one is going to them cooks for many, many years, or even decades , believed that this was impossible. it remained in the 20th century. well, please. against different types of pain, pentalgin acts against pain, wherever it is, regardless of the causes of its occurrence. pentalgin will do without pain about the sale from june 14, you will have time for 2.799. olive oil was for 399.