i liked it because it was specific, we weren’t just philosophizing about some heavenly things. oh, in the distance, there and starry lights, and we specifically talked about what a lighthouse is, how to take it and how to get to it. thank you very much it was very informative. hello this is a psychic podcast. my name is natalya loseva and my co-leading clinical psychologist, candidate of psychological sciences, mikhail khors hello, dear friends. we continue to write our library of wonderful , interesting, complex life, and admire our heroes. and by the way we help as best we can to unravel difficult life situations. our heroine today's name is vera, she is the mother of four children and her

request sounds like i am in slavery to my children. vera hello hello what kind of slavery is this? please tell us, well , first of all, i need to introduce myself, i am 41 years old and divorced, and i have been raising children alone for 4 years. yes, 2 years, of course, it was very difficult. it's difficult with work. it was necessary to choose such a work schedule, and in order to receive money while providing for their children, and in one time you are with your children, because this is study, and this is the socialization of my children, that is, clubs a-a, walks, excursions, recreation, and so on and so forth, while you need to earn everything for an apartment for clothes and provide for them, and they are completely sorry, but i wanted to ask, when did you divorce your husband?

he left you something for you, for the children, for the children, the cat, the children, for rides, and you told me to earn an apartment, no, i live. it’s a smart apartment, but i’m a muscovite, and it’s been 20 years. i'm standing in line. i will soon have a grandson. i'm done i’m standing there, living with my mother. well , accordingly, i can’t, because it’s 43 square meters and my family’s apartment is too big. no, we haven’t bought an apartment, but they help you, like my mother-in-law helps me with alimony now. i find the blood from my husband to be very remarkable. from there and so on. there is some help. well, too, i would tell myself blood. this is the last year she has started giving me something as a tutor. well, let’s say, she and i can buy glasses there in half, let’s say, well , listen to something so expensive, you’re both big well done, because in this situation you work as one team, it is clear that your subjects, so to speak, your tasks, are

children, but this is also not possible in every family. how old are the children? can i tell you, huh? the last 13 turns in july, and my son is 10 and 4 years old. well, that is, the eldest are no longer children. not children. well, these are also children, because why are they also children, because sonechka also likes to attract a lot of attention to herself. if she calls me, she only wants me to talk to her, so when she comes. mom, you don’t pay attention to me, that is, that’s all it comes from. this all remains. and when my mother-in-law started coming to us. i say, they’re all mom, mom, well, that’s not even the point, you know, what kind of slavery is that? why do i say slavery? i try for the children, so that their dreams come true, so that they understand that everything in life is real, the main thing is dream of doing something for your dream, you deceive them, when you say that everything in life is real. what do you

mean i’m deceiving, i also have to tell the truth in life, not everything is real, everything is real to a person , everything is real. well, look, yes, done well, no, i mean, material dreams. still, probably, give me 3 billion dollars now, please, what does that mean? do we need to do something for this now? well, if you set yourself such a goal, it is the person who will set it and want it strongly. i think that he will overcome what he doesn’t want to earn this money, but someone has earned it, he will definitely overcome it, of course, all people have the same opportunities, which means it’s not necessary then i ask the question again. why are you deceiving your children? when tell them that everything is real. i want them to start striving, for this you deceive them if a person wants, because they said that different people have different

opportunities. i understand why you are deceiving them, because you told them that everything is possible. you see, well, let's talk, then you'll have questions, and then i'll tell you right, okay? so what is your slavery, what led you to this idea that you are within limits, they don’t want to do anything around the house. although it's time for trash i take it out and do the cleaning. if i want a clean apartment, and although i have already divided the boundaries, i have divided the boundaries in terms of the fact that i am taking care of the kitchen for you. i’m preparing food for you, but i want to eat in a clean kitchen. and you must do this. well, you don't have to say, please take it. um, get everything ready for the table. wash dishes after cooking. yes, vacuum there, wash there, and wash the dishes. i

understand this myself, i never like dishes. it was because of this that i shared the responsibility of telling them. what are you going to do here and what they say no it won't. they they just don't eat. they say, okay mommy. and now the hair is there two or three times at home i say that i am dirty until one of the grandmothers comes and insists on the path of truth. children, such things still get inserted. they don’t hear me, like a senior in rank has come, then we’ll do it, yes, that’s how they perceive you, that there are grandmothers. well, they are there, or maybe they came, that address does not deceive. it's simply impossible. and what grandmothers tell them, how different is the treatment there or

i don't know which command is coming from or just really different. they say, these are completely two different types of people, my mother and mother-in-law, uh, and uh, well, the fact is that, let’s say they grumble about my mother, well , they don’t need blankets for her. and here there is. well, i don't want to. why do this, and why then why? it’s not necessary, it’s not necessary and it doesn’t lag behind until they do it. yes, well, i can also keep up, my son is not there, for example. so i say, alya will throw it away with her. eh, i burned the jar there. alya, throwing away the jar of yogurt with him, alya threw himself into the ivanochka with that's a joke. well, that is, you said you left and did some business and came back, so move on anyway. not from a jar of yogurt. yes, a jar of yogurt, if i get up like this, what do you know how to get something from your children? don't

lag behind, it's the fact that lessons are not done. uh, no, let’s say ira started doing her homework only after, uh, well, closer to april. so ira is 13 years old. alya finished making them closer to january. and it’s always been like this, right from the first grade or now, in their teens, they began to smoke a little like that, and the thinner ones. i think another similar trauma happened in elementary school and i didn’t know, she’s a unique girl. she loved animals very much since she was four years old. she studied biology, she read my eleventh grade encyclopedia. well , that is, she was interested. i am in the living world and every bug. she always looked closely for a long time. she studied it exactly. i only found out about this last year that her teacher called her stupid. well he is like that

she's such a child, you couldn't yell at her. she stood up in a stupor, but she was in her thoughts. yes, she is slow, she is thoughtful, but she is a very intelligent girl, but she never does anything quickly, for real. i say surrounded by silence. i would and ira she’s always worried that i’ll worry, what does it want? here she is, on the contrary, she wants me not to be upset, not to upset me. yes , i understand, but at the same time, she doesn’t clean up when she yes, here you can put it’s always worried, but that she doesn’t want to upset you relationships upset me, other people. well, that is, someone told them something, why because then you will scold her, or be unhappy with her if other people and reasons upset you, and because of this i didn’t have lessons with them, so as not to scold them. once again

, there was no one to shout at. ira, that’s it, come quickly, that’s all. you can sit down to undress and drink tea, and she will get dressed. well, that is, this is good, but grandmothers talk like cheese, well , calm down, just the question is not for everyone, this is me, what is it? no, they didn’t check there, everything is fine. well, i'm fine. i’m telling you, we’re in family psychotherapy, we’re with a psychologist, and i don’t trust, say, commercial psychologists there. i don't contact them. i don’t even trust our social security psychologist. yes , i think that people will come back, besides, it’s still possible for grandmothers to agree on this or that raw one, right? and what do you think they are doing differently, not that they manage to come to an agreement, but she will do it anyway. eh

, in my own way irishka well, somehow already in my own way, or something, i don’t even know how to express it. if she thinks it's she won’t do it, but this doesn’t apply to cleaning and homework, she won’t even do it with the help of her grandmothers. well, somehow , here are two dishes, this is the mother-in-law, she has more influence on her, than let’s say my mother, my mother, can influence the elevator more, which is 10 years old. well, baba luda is taller, of course, and heads are drawn to her, and somehow they can negotiate on the same wavelength. and it upsets you that they can and cannot. no, i, on the contrary , work as one company. yes, on the contrary, i’ll call and tell you. what is this task? this mess is worth it. we need to somehow solve this. now mom hasn’t connected to this situation before. well , somehow this year has

truly changed us all. mom has already begun to be attracted to you, it’s even united, yes, and i learned from your business card that you’re even attracted to your neighbor. talk to us, in fact, that we lack a male figure. yes? this is a bit of a relief, and hmm, i started to think about it. here's about hiero teacher. i am sergei, and our neighbor is on friendly terms with andrey and i asked him too. here they are somehow tell her that mom needs help, that the younger ones need to go there and take them to watch. she's there alone at work while she's there at work. you're the eldest there, well. you owe each other, you are one family and so on. that is, i even hired a male english tutor. well, that is , now i realized that this is such stupidity , they really are somehow special to us. well , the results, i haven’t seen it, it can shake you up

when a stranger says, for example, something, your mom is so tired. well, for example, yes, well, it also happens, yes. even if you don’t notice, he will draw your attention. if this is so, naturally, lord elder, and say to ira yes, i’m sorry, but we need to help, what will she do. she won't do this. yes, because she seems to be doing this kind of protest, not that yes, imposing hunting and i say, and even now you understand, and i give them surprises. what what? they want them there, i foresee them there. well, the next step is that they will wish there for the new year on december 31st and they start a scandal. and that she urgently needed some kind of grandmother grabbed her head, but i foresaw this step. i already bought them skates. new year. this is a holiday called a child dreamed of skates, why was it on

december 31st, and i bought it a month ago. well, i prepared for this holiday, because i know that she will want to skate on the ice. i didn’t ask why you bought her skates , the answer to why is known to me, because i’m a mother, because she gives gifts for new year, because the child wants skates. why don't you do that? as father? no? wait. why then, so that children have a holiday, so that they understand the essence of the holiday, they grow up alive you see, and they will have their own children, he will have his own family. ira asked me uh one time ago. mom, what a tradition we have, and in the family, that is, some kind of family should cry, and events have some common interests, i absolutely, let’s say. here we are often in the morning, when we sit at the table , we have breakfast together, when we manage to get ready. we start discussing something, and information comes from completely different

places. eh, let's say. uh, the life of whales. you see, who is the river dolphin and sonya is here again i forgot where napoleon died. that is, ira actually said that it was a cake. i had to sit down and study the biography of napoleon. you think we have a sad family, you know? or in some way everyone has the right to say something, why did you write in your life like slavery? yes, because they are in the house. and where they live, they don’t want to, but to create, but for me, a holiday, probably, i ’ll do all this comfort. i’m wondering, you say, i’m creating a holiday for them so that they can learn this. they are not learning something. they are not everything ok with training. yeah, sonya dom is doing well. you just said that they do not create separately. that is, she took away from

the house that she had to clean, she had to cook very tasty food, because she also loves to eat delicious food. moreover, she brought out our own tastes. she took everything out of the house. this is what, you have to go to bed early in order to get up early, so that, well, you’ll have time for everything, another conclusion. it's not that they don't learn, they learn more slowly than you would like. no, they won’t do this at home. they will do it anywhere just not a house. well, she studied, you, who do it all anyway. they slept with me for six months. on a bed without uh bed linen, because i was so tired of changing the bed linen, on which i subsequently collected bits of candy wrappers and so on and so forth. but i’m telling you, you want to sleep in a garbage dump. sleep is an interesting experiment. and it’s nothing to you and he’s not there, that is, they sleep for six months and don’t even tell mom where they are passively, in the end. yes , the experiment was not completed. they're just of age then. no, i can't do that either

couldn't stand it. by the way, i mean, i’m the kind of mom that i shouldn’t allow this to happen. as a result, uh, the experiment was not completed. well, it's gone. so what? it's a lot? of course, i should take them out throughout the apartment. see. you again. eh, let’s assume full responsibility towards our children. but let’s not go to such an extreme either loseva and the clinical psychologist candidate of psychological sciences are trying to find a way out of the most difficult situations of our heroes. have you ever had such situations, and then i ask mikhail to work. what are you saying, well, relatively speaking, it’s just a bed with the wrong person, huh, so what are they afraid of losing. with you

, you are not afraid of losing anything on new year's day , taking your phone away, not letting go hmm, really, he always has some kind of currency. eh, it’s so conditional in a relationship when you say, listen, well, if you and i haven’t agreed here, right? yeah, well, here i won’t be negotiable either. mikhail, in general , this situation with children doesn’t work for us, what did they tell me then, can i not pick berries? i don't want ice cream and told me, okay, i’ll go with my old briefcase. uh, when she well, for them it ’s just not a value, yeah, but something else of their value, it’s important to look for these values. i have them all, i guess. excuse me, what happens when you try to take something from them that is really important and valuable to them , they start crying and get offended, which means they stop talking to you, it hurts you. and in this pain they are not ready to endure and speak. well, okay, i'll do it for you, it wasn't

like that. yeah they don't cry. well for them if i she said, well, that means it’s necessary, let’s say, the eldest daughter. she yes, she was somehow an ordinary child, she had leverage because i wouldn’t let you go out. if you don’t do it there, she ’ll cut off the oxygen scissors for the children, the window with her, and so on. yes, this is an ordinary child. and irochka, well, that’s it, ira, you did something wrong there, and i won’t buy you a new school bag because of this. well, okay, mommy the briefcase again, which means it’s no longer valuable and i don’t know, you know the phone number. she has it, i took it, but she is calm, but okay, how much did she take from ali? alya lost her phone for a year and a half, ira. well, that’s a big deal. well, she didn’t have phones

for a year, and i can, well, don’t let them watch tv, that is, well, they do nothing, when they don’t watch tv, they don’t have phones. she can keep herself busy and play with dolls. go there and take a walk, by the way, for modern children. modern children. they are less and less able to occupy themselves with something. i noticed when i told them everything was kira, they start playing together for 13 years and eat like this this, maybe then, well, as if relaxed, i started to sit down and draw on my own beautifully. well, yes. well, that is, they can keep themselves busy. they have quite a lot of valuable and important things in them, somewhere there is slavery, i can’t understand. why should i do anything? and at the same time they will consume it and there will be no return, they have obligations. i tell them, i have obligations to feed you, give you something to drink, and put on shoes appropriate for your age. and

you have an obligation to unlearn and get an education. eh, well, as best as possible, but your abilities? i don't demand it. yes ok. how do you define ability? well, your son is 4 years old and he washes the kitchen floor. yes, maybe the cat is super well looked after, so in fact, let ’s see what he does turns out well. he pays for electricity. no, let him be responsible for this. let him pay for electricity. he can do it no, you know, how we define what people can do. and what they can’t do, one of the ways is to entrust them with something and see. can he do it or can't he? no results studies. i saw when they wanted, but

they didn’t see the result of the cleaning. so conclude to learn. they can, but they can’t clean up? for whatever reasons, they don’t clean up, which means they can’t study now. in the conditions in which they live, there are some external internal restrictions, for example, lack of motivation. good, then. for some reason, my mother-in-law does her homework, but doesn’t do it at home. but this is a very cool question, if you are worried. instead of learning how to interact with with your children. you will have the opportunity to build this interaction better than now. but in principle, if you have two assistants, and they already have this, you can give up and stop demanding from yourself that you be such an ideal mother who succeeds in everything, including building 100% relationships with all the children and maybe, well, take what you have.

i have a good relationship with my children, they love me. and at least i love them. well, let’s not give birth in order to fall into slavery for you. wait, let's do this, bye. we have mikhail has the opportunity to get. tips and recipes. let's try anyway, but the subject is those situations. uh, label them when you feel like you're in bondage. yes, i heard that they don’t wash the floor. they don't do anything, that's not true. well, it can't be cleaned. well, yes, thank god, no one goes to my toilet; they flush after themselves. periodically, judging by the way vera thought again, they do something every time you say that they don’t do anything at all, you are again deceiving yourself. and this makes you sad unpleasant. well, i feel bad. yes, but not because they don’t do anything, that’s a lie,

because you decided that they don’t do anything, but they also make a jar of yogurt. she will throw it out after ten reminders and her little son will wash the cat. that is, your children do. they just don't do as much as you want? let's directly try to think about some intermediate result. yes , what would you like your children to do, so that you can indulge a little. this is the idea, i really want it. this is the arab idea for them to get married your scientists, it means that cleaning doesn’t bother you so much as slavery. so i see, if only with cleaning. what does slavery have to do with education? what are you studying for them? yes, we all study, some essays are done for them, some projects are done for them , no. i'm hiring. me: look here. i have a tutor with them four times a week. here are the avos now, because even

the tutor has already started doing their homework for them, so listen to the lousy tutor. tell you, you understand from us, victoria vladimirovna. very good tutor. she even refused, so the reason is from us, because she realized that it was at her expense that ira did her homework, but she came up with a blank sheet and got two marks. because of this she said. then i won’t need to invest in finding a tutor who is a professional and a teacher. what we need with you is not a trainer who did one or two climbs on you. yes, this is exactly what grandmothers cope with. parents who write in despair, they write them. you need a tutor who would motivate them, do you understand? which would create in them the intention, desire, drive, anticipation of pleasure, you know, you and i are like simple. so to speak, people engaged in a different profession. we may not be able to do this. but you need to find such a teacher. it seems to me that either a psychologist or a psychologist and

teacher will tell mikhail now, that is, he will help. yes, which would motivate to study doable. look , mother and grandmother and school teachers are fighting with them, and the second thing you say is that the alley is started by a speech therapist. and now she’s seeing a speech therapist again. she her but we studied, and four times a week all summer before the second, it really is. well, she's very bad until she's 5 years old i saw we performed an operation on her, respectively , in the background. well, there were some delays and violations. here's the first class. she didn't know anything at all. don't read, don't write. we passed by. don't count, she didn't understand it. here i found it. here is a speech therapist and neuropsychologist. she worked with her. and i didn’t throw away my money in vain, because the second eye got fives and one got fives in january of this year. this is already the third grade. she just deflated and left. no, i just sat and prayed. i wish this year

would end soon, so that we don’t just fail maybe some kind of correction was needed, he’s doing it again. well, now the whole summer has come and i’ve been studying for results. well, for now , this is not an activity. why do you think that you are in slavery? i see how you tell it? i see that you are not a slave to this lamp, but one of your children. what are you as a manager? you know that you need to find a tutor , organize classes, ask your grandmother for help, ask and give. is this the kind of slavery they have, just like that? yes , so. you are not talking about their behavior now, and about your feelings for you, this is something you will feel when you receive a return. i 'll relax. that's it, so you are in tension and you call this tension slavery. yeah, that's the key story. now the important question is that most people

believe that they experience stress because of the environment in which they live, that is , most people accept the position of emotional victims of the circumstance. well , they say, these are the circumstances, which means that i am forced to experience tension because of these circumstances. i was born into such a family. nobody behave incorrectly. that’s all, but it is important to understand that a huge number of scientific experiments have been conducted that prove that in the same circumstances, people with different perceptions of these circumstances experience different emotional states. someone is tense. someone is pleased with himself. feels, and some even make you happy. yeah, so these experiments show that our emotional stress is not a consequence of circumstances. we are not victims of uh-huh situations. yeah our emotional stress is a consequence of how

we relate to these circumstances if we , for example, believe that such relationships are bad and that this cannot be done, that it must necessarily be different. and how and how i once fantasized for myself or i still fantasize, then this is a critical view of reality, which itself does not correspond to reality, because in reality it is already possible and the fact that you have it is not bad. it may not be wonderful and the spread is wonderful, but it’s certainly not a problem. and uh, it can be different. now, if you start being more realistic about this situation in your relationship with children watch. yes, children can be like that and i can be like that as a mother whose children respect her less than their grandmother. why say this? ah, because you made a conclusion. and i made this conclusion after the fact. i look at reality, no, my children don’t like strangers in the apartment, and in russian

i want to offend a little. i'll look again, in fact. no, the word is final, when i say and uh, final and they all understand that if i already say, i won’t get angry, if i put an end to this for the second time already you can come in and not come over, they do, when you put this point or they sleep for six months without bed linen until you put it on. somehow you contradict. you say, actually, like this, but no, in fact, like this, no. just watch. we're really trying to figure it out right now. yes, i want to convey to you, but the other thing i’m not saying is that i lost my authority somewhere, the children no longer want it, but that it’s not me who takes care of their lives, but that they see it themselves, they’re not little momo yet. the point is that you understand, and when let's say i i was little, i knew that mom and dad

were working. they will come at 5:00 to notice the day. they don’t have a dad, and they have a mom who has done everything for them all their life, and you immediately demand from them that they just change their ways. and you always had this requirement every day, even when you had a husband, what, and study. they should know themselves that they need to come home from school. what homework do they need to do? they know that they’re on the street, but they don’t lie, well, they throw a piece of paper, and at home near the tv. do you understand? well, this is elementary me. i don’t put away these pieces of paper, but they end up collecting them themselves. well, what confuses you is if they collect them. it confuses me that they cannot do it right away. well, that means they can’t yet, what’s wrong with this? tell me, you know, a person should live in purity

; they drew something. as it should be, we will leave them in the dirt. well, let them not study, how can you say, yes? they don’t teach, they, uh, something, well, they don’t die. no, look, you go from one extreme to another, either everything is just the way i want, or we just leave it alone. no, the middle. let's take it let's start from the beginning. when i was a child, my lessons were not checked. yes, but you are now in a club. of course, i myself graduated from 11th grade. i entered the school and graduated. i went to college myself. your children are not like that. no, don't bother me. when a child comes and discusses the teacher who is at school, but why shouldn’t it? why should he discuss, he can discuss, or not discuss with friends? well, we've already talked a lot today. i think this is the episode in our podcast where it's not obvious.

answer, maybe mikhail and i didn’t manage to immediately come to some uh, correct conclusions and advice, because, probably, you really need a lot of hours in this situation with a psychologist. they just said it five times. i myself, this is also a lie, your parents did not help you with anything. you interact somehow. there is still a presence there. and the fact that they weren’t there until five o’clock, they helped you with that too, because if they nursed you until five o’clock, then you would be as strong as you are, you wouldn’t have grown every influence. i'm on the child, or they care about something it helps, you understand, you are not all yourself, you are something yourself and your children are also something themselves, that they are less themselves than they appear. naturally, because a lot has changed in this world now. and you demand the same from them.

well, you fantasized about yourself that this is also a fantasy, because with her you are not all faith itself. anyway. i am very grateful to you and grateful that you came with this problem with this question. i think that he does this very often and a lot in our short conversation. unfortunately short. uh, raised problems that i want to think about and reason about, which i will add that in the definition of the word intelligence or in parentheses , mind. there is such a line as the ability to adapt to changing circumstances. it's very difficult. moreover, when a person has not completely made himself strong-willed for people. it’s not easy for hours, but nevertheless, i see in front of me a very caring person, a very passionate person in a good sense , devoted to his family from what i heard from you. i saw that you have come a long way in the evolution of your family relationships. and even the fact that you were able to make

a team not only with your mother. well, with my ex-mother-in-law, this is a huge achievement. it's great. that is, you take it. in my opinion, the right direction is that you are asking questions and experiencing. this is fine. we are people. we are designed to worry and look for a way out. and i sincerely wish you to find that harmony in your relationship with your children, when no one will be in slavery to anyone, and everyone will rejoice a little more in what they have. well, maybe we should put on the brakes those things that we they seem to be not quite themselves at all. this was a psychic podcast in which we spoke with our heroine vera who came to us with a request that what is she in the slavery of her four children? and we honestly tried to find a way out of this slavery, but we came to a conclusion, probably unexpectedly. thank you, dear friends, for visiting us . come again, i remind you. yes , those who want help ask for help.