this is symphonic music in any case , not necessarily, the same pink floyd, this is such a stripped-down dostoevsky, yes, yes, very fragmented, so they tried, so to speak, to dig into such philistinism, and so, in fact, they achieved a certain effect, of course, dostoevsky is broader a million times, i really liked the statement, i forgot his name, this is the actor who got five or six amy, it's like in the tv series. such an oscar, so he came to orthodoxy, he says: i discovered dostoevsky for myself, i you often have to play scary people , some kind of scoundrels, so i suddenly realized that dostoevsky wrote about terrible things from a position of light, uh-huh, this is very difficult, this is very difficult, and this is a huge strength for rock music - this is simply a colossal field of activity, but do you agree that everything is still ahead at the russian horn? theoretically

this is possible, but the way events are developing diplomatically reacted, no, well, i ’m just watching how music develops, yeah, modern, it’s quite possible, that at some level this will acquire a slightly completely different breakthrough, another turn will occur, and this will be a different level of quality, don’t you think that this is still too much... this is a proposal that is binding specifically for rock music , whether? or am i wrong here? in my opinion, this is a good level that allows a person not only to develop, but even to improve in some sense , we are talking about the spirit, about the form of the word, so to speak , a certain aesthetics of some kind, about how the thought itself is formed , yes, as far as it goes everything is really deep regarding

something and what is happening now, with him are gogol and pushkin, and tolstoy’s years, in spite of everything, with gogol it’s even somehow simpler for me, i can’t explain it, but here so somehow intuitively it doesn’t arise for me, nothing sticks out to me, gogol, rock, i somehow understand it all somehow, gogol is punk in general, in my opinion, it has such a specific language, especially. .. well , from the current point of view, why? when i read, for example, classics, yes, literary ones, i notice how much there is rich language, how everything is carefully built there, how everything is formulated there , gogol has a very unique language, punk among the classics, the message of the president of the russian federation vladimir putin to the federal assembly, live broadcast on february 29 at 12.

understand, so to speak, well, seeing how this world develops over many years, you begin to ask certain questions, and - in general, to be honest, for me - the path of human attention, this is what we notice more and more over the years, how alarming the world is, if we take, for example, childhood and school, yes, i am not enough. i was worried about what was happening around me, except for the fact that in the international panorama one could see some short excerpts of probble, but i can say that this did not concern me at all, not only because it was not interesting to me , and it was as if i was protected by some kind of force, some kind of cover , such, you know, a conditional cap, so mystical, when you begin to think about yourself... to protect yourself, so to speak, so as not to

run out in this raging world, then of course you wonder how this can be achieved. in fact, this is the path to god, but the most difficult thing is when you understand that yes, there is a way out, there is salvation, this is love, this is the path to god, yes, as anthony of surazh said, at the last judgment, it will become clear to us, that the only thing that was valuable in this life was love, and so, when you realize at this moment that well... to go to god, i’m not even talking about improving to such an extent as, as jesus said in sermons, like our heavenly father, yes , to be perfect, at this moment other things terrify you, that you need

to uproot this whole field, and this is a very painful process, uprooting stumps and roots, it’s not like that, like that, just a little a little bit... crashed, very complex, labor-intensive and painful, and after that you can, so to speak, plow this soil and sow it. well, if i understand you correctly, you think that this is still connected with age, with generation, and not rather with what you did, i thought so until some time, until i was faced with the fact that i saw young people, which in our time, perhaps, is even more difficult in some ways. i mean, because it’s more intense, more tousled, yes, because the passions are right on the surface, and so at that moment when i saw these young people, i was a little shaken in my theory, it has nothing to do with age, well it’s good when, so to speak,

we can stagger into theory, alexey nikovich, what do you think, here i am right now about personal search, was it more connected with time, what was in the air, in general, or with what you were doing? like you, i think that the lord determines his own path for everyone, he leads everyone along this path, because when i came to faith, when, probably, the second such important watershed came for me, it was a meeting with a saint, with father nicholas guryany, well, with the great elder, so i had a lot of questions, but one of them, since i heard a lot about music, about rocks, about other things, it was in the bowels of the church, here i am i went up to the priest and said, father, is my craft pleasing to god or not, so he smiled and said whatever, whatever, so he knew that i had positive and negative experiences,

once upon a time when i appeared and we made different works , here somewhere they tried to go deeper, something we had was just straight up rock-rock, it’s true that along the way we started me. so it was about just one song, thanks to you, this song helped me not to commit suicide, it was my first positive experience, although i have not changed then, rock and roll remained, i was still flying like a meteor for a long time, a few more years, now forward, later there was a negative experience, and this is all part

of the journey, that’s why i was just embarrassed and i needed to ask this question and i i asked, look. this is a question, it’s even , today we remembered gogol, maybe not by chance, yes, after all, gogol, without any fate, experienced this colossal internal conflict, and i think, here’s your question, my craft, maybe he said creativity, i don’t know if god wants it anyway, he doesn’t the fact that he answered it, and or certainly not the fact that he answered the same way as you, yes, because, rather, he said, my craft, my creativity is nothing. and there is no need before, i ’m deliberately emphasizing now, yes, that is, this conflict, how it went for you, is going on , maybe still, well, it exists, yes, it exists, and i think it will be somehow way to develop, alexey was just talking about

these things, and i remembered the famous painting by bosch, a triptych, called the garden of earthly delights, you see, there were strict times, then playing music was already considered already a sinful matter, and although it was, in general , by our standards... completely harmless things, just playing musical instruments, notes are also depicted there, so it seems to me that in this case this is a measure that a person chooses for himself, of course, that’s as much as you want, and if you really want it to be as you please, you just need to cut off any blasphemy, any heresy, any foul language in yourself.

such a person or he was not looking for such a person, although we used to often go to optina putin and even lived in skete, now women are not allowed there, but before they were allowed in, we went to night services, they gave me the memorial service to read, those who came there, and there was gogol, there was dostoevsky, they got there, they got there, they came in, unlike tolstoy, yes, i think that maybe he... didn’t ask the most important question from one of these elders, but

about his work, maybe everything would have been different, i’m just saying, swearing is so terrible thing, yes, i just want to come back to you, that’s what i asked about generation or whether it is connected with creativity, because this is how it seems to me, he knows, maybe i’m deceived, but it seems to me that this is my path, for example, it’s quite standard, that is, this is the end. schools are russian literature , this is dostoevsky, when you first begin to think there, then just at the end of the eighties they begin to publish russian philosophers whom we did not know, and you begin to read about the gospel, about the church there and the gospel itself, and then at some point in my life it was just a man, we were taught, by the way, from the conservatory , he taught us the history of music, and he was generally casual, he told us about the music of ancient india or something like that, may there, latin america , this is penatsli chelitli, this is the whole story. musical instruments, i still remember the name, and we asked him about

something, the word church came up, he was fasting, now i understand that he himself was such an absolute neophyte, he says, well, i think that of course you don’t eat white bread there, but black bread there, and it wasn’t that it said, yes, that it was such an unofficial twist, yes, in that he said that well, what’s the point of reading if you’re not there, if you don’t live in this house, here he is, and this the path, it seems to me, well, as i say, the path of such university boys. but for you, it was probably different somewhere, it doesn’t matter, or it seems, we sometimes had to go down to hell in order to push off, in order to understand that there is such a bottom, so, probably, that’s it- yes, there is a slightly different way, well, it’s strong phrase, i think that i came to church quite late in general, because my fate so happened that... i lived for 15 years in krasnoyarsk, where i was born, and i’ll be honest, i

later tried to remember at least one church, i i didn’t remember it, purely physically, i just didn’t meet a church on my way, which means either i didn’t see it, that is, my perception was so dull, yes, or they really weren’t there, which is possible, because the city pretty new. this is how you now live with these memories that they are in your life today

that means you’re trying to forget, no , they can’t forget, i think you need to remember, you need to remember, so to speak, not to be forgotten, this is all for a reason, it’s all part of the path, so the robber had to be crucified next to christ, so that... he had definitely been there before, so, that time, he was the first to enter heaven. today we gathered our thoughts about russian rock as a cultural phenomenon. vyacheslav butusov, alexey belov, i’m vladimir legoeda, we continue. i want to return a little bit to the search for generations, because people yes, that means in different spheres of culture, at

the same time, when we were looking, we were all looking, yes, there were these searches in the cinema, here we are now. a film about balabanov is coming out, it was slava’s anniversary, everyone gathered at my house, they gave interviews, quietly, hello, hello, but here they are celebrating, no, no, slava, what are you talking about, i said the very top to the left, oh, sorry , you have, person, experience, yes, interaction. that's how, how how do you remember it now? firstly, alexey and i knew each other for a long time, starting from college times, then he moved to st. petersburg, then i ended up there, yes, she read the world like a novel, i once gathered a crowd in a cafe, a huge cafe, just

because there. everything is absolutely free, a walk in the park without a dog can become too expensive for you, your mother teaches you how to use the phone number of the morgue, when she is away, at home for too long, all this time, so to speak, we were watching each other in the sense that he was building a career cinematic, and i saw it all happen before my eyes, he naturally, so to speak, watched what is going on with us, at a certain stage i already had thoughts, well, somehow that

we need each other, so to speak, to help just on this path, yes, on the path to god. i may not be a very good , so to speak, assistant in this sense from the point of view of eloquence in pronouncing the necessary words, yes, but one way or another, in general, i tried to talk with alexey on this topic, but sometimes he had a categorical attitude for a long time , because he was very passionate about cinema, for him it was a whole world in which he lived, was in charge, everything else had, so to speak , applied significance to this, as for me, but as you can see, at the end, so to speak, of his path, relatively speaking, yes, professional and human, he still came to this topic, i am very i tried for a long time to persuade him to film some kind of fairy tale or something like that, well, relatively speaking, and i even had

options for writing various stories for synopses, and he... every time he told me that i was not ready yet, i was mentally i’m not ready for this, i want to, but i’m not ready, well, as a result, the last film is in fact, there is such a story, by and large, all this is already happening there in this abandoned bell tower, the film itself, the title of the film, and the essence of this story, what i also want, everyone wants in the end, and i... precisely because ... for that, i could have fallen and that’s it, but because of the people who followed me, here’s

a strange story, yes, i know, it’s like it’s closing in on me, you said it right. connect this with what we are talking about, that’s why for me russian rock is a continuation of russian literature, and inherits russian literature, because russian literature is what gives us a space of meanings and a language, yes , we speak with these images, we remember these heroes, and the same thing with russian rock, but here are your songs, they enter our lives, it’s interesting that soviet cinema was the cinema of our language, yes, here is post-soviet, as far as i am concerned, maybe many will not agree with me, but by and large... here are the films brother brother-2, here are the ones that have entered the language, it seems to me that here it also comes together, but these searches some inside and well, the result, yes, when something made by a person, it becomes a part. language, of course, yes, but i also wanted to add that - in addition to literature, symphonic

music is still of great importance, i have been actively interested in this in recent years, and i can say that in academic music, in symphonic music, there is very there is a lot of pressure that sweeps away even worse. than than rock music, you know, starting there for its time it was cool rock, simply, time forward - this is just a concrete example of the fact that this is a bulldozer coming that you can’t fight against, just, look, it’s about a bright future we said russian rock , we said about symphonic music, but young people, let’s be honest, don’t listen, not all of them, young people are different, and any generalization is unfair to anyone. well, intentionally, but i don’t

see continuity in modern russian music with great russian literature, with great russian culture with russian rock, i don’t see it there, i’m wrong. at one time such a terrible word of music appeared, it appeared in the nineties, the word format, then everything began to be divided, because before that... somehow everything was together, if you take there, let’s say , the seventies, there was rock pop music and some kind of disc, it was all together, and then it began to be divided into formats, and then trends appeared, rap didn’t just appear , you don’t need to know anything in particular, you don’t need to study music especially there, make yourself these beats, so to speak, there and then say what comes to mind, this is what it is and this is supported too.

another thing is how it is used little, unfortunately,

today we have, of course, we had so much theological, cultural and musical, i’m not afraid of that word dimension, but i know, in conclusion, what i would like to ask you about, since we talked a lot today about russian literature, if only... you had to advise our foreign contemporaries to get acquainted with russian literature, well, through some work or works, i won’t say there, name three there, but that’s what first comes to mind, falls on the heart, what would you advise first of all, i’m easily always ready to name pushkin, he has both poetry and prose, right? this is one circumstance, the second circumstance is that he reached such heights in poetry that are already called fairy tales, and in poetry, but

actually, in general, pushkin is our everything, yes, yes, alexey nikolaevich, what would you advise, well i would probably rubanol dostoevsky, of course, but this is not everyone’s idea, yes, this is a person who discovered it for himself. said that he writes about terrible things from a position of light, not everyone can probably understand this, but nevertheless, i said in some interviews that i had just such friends who - they are such cult musicians, there and still there they are cult musicians in the west, now we have been to such very interesting gatherings, where you come to such a house, there and people walk around in clothes from the 18th century, so the hostess sits down to the piano, everyone came just for this , they start playing neoclassical music as so interesting, then they start talking, then it turns out that one of the people is the leading screenwriter, gorevsky. i didn’t even

know, he wrote just so many films, so and we were just talking about literature and when i said the word dostoevsky, and he suddenly changed in his face, he changed and somehow became completely different, he bowed so suddenly, i think he’s bowing to me, i’m so bowed, said, oh, dostoevsky, yes, and, of course, there are people who understand this, understand, sooner or later after all. and i was listening to you just now , i remembered, i recently watched some series, an american detective series, there are two detectives sitting in a car, one opens the glove compartment, dostoevsky, there is an idiot to dostoevsky, he says a good book, that doctor says , it’s dostoevsky, he says, well, the book is good, that second time he doesn’t even say anything to him, he just looks, well, what should i explain to you, thank you, dear friends, i am eternally grateful to you , today we had cult musicians, alexey bilov, vyacheslav butusov, i’m vladimir ligoida, we were gathering

our thoughts about it. to russian rock as a cultural phenomenon, thank you, hello, this is a podcast of the first persons and my hero today, director of the state hermitage mikhail borisovich pyatrovsky, hello, good evening, hello!

he still sees what he wants to see, but what do you see, do you see peeling wallpaper or do you see maybe a loose baseboard or unwiped dust? well, to be honest, of course it’s always more pleasant to walk around someone else’s museum, because there, firstly, you are not distracted by the fact that suddenly a painting hangs a little crookedly or suddenly something is worn out on the floor, in addition, when you notice shortcomings, then you are pleased, but first you should notice your shortcomings, but in general there is time left... to see how the paintings resonate with each other, especially when it comes to an exhibition, how the exhibition is made, what kind of exhibition it is, how it goes, how it all is illuminated, and then you can also watch how it behaves audience , what irritates you about visitors, there are some situations when you feel just such, you know, rising irritation, no, nothing irritates me about visitors when it’s in the halls, because i’m irritated by those visitors who... it's annoying for us

very often there are complaints for... but this is just more on social networks than in the museum, people in the museum are generally normal.

they look very interesting to listen sometimes to what the guides say, both ours and others, if you hear some kind of absurdity or inaccuracy, you can come and correct me, no, i will never correct anyone, i will never correct anyone, even when there is such complete disgrace , when our own guides stand in the small throne room, near the sign, please do not stop and talk for a long time, even then i do not make a remark about the matter later, but in in principle, we sometimes, well, in fact , we listen... especially the gitas who speak foreign languages, strangers and uh, sometimes we tell other colleagues in other museums what we know, we listen to what different guides from countries say, because that of the east, they really like to say that everything that is in museums is stolen from them, and they say this in the lura, they say, what a delight, because they come to your house and say that, well, this this is usually what everyone likes to say now, everyone thinks that someone stole something from them and the museum is again one of

such. who are not talking about armitage at all, but in general about art, about culture, because as a rule, people come who either i know or who know me, they say they know who they like, so there is always a special special topic for talking about everything,

especially if kings come , it’s very easy to interestingly discuss the palace, the state of the palace , how to preserve the furniture so that it doesn’t deteriorate , i must say that administrative and economic issues, yes, yes, i must say that this is exactly what is always very interesting to compare. royal people who have their own palaces that need to be taken care of, they understand that not everything can shine, because he lives near the palace, now there are a lot of people in it, when there are few people in it, life still goes on there, he lives, therefore there should always be some abrasions in it, there should be few of them, but they should be there, it happens that you see that the guest, in general, is not very interested in what you are talking about, he is here rather serving such a votmatic non happens almost never, the hermitage is a place that first of all permeates everyone...

he, firstly, putin had an absolutely wonderful scheme of conversations in armitage, even when he, if there were people before that, well , they came, so to speak, co-generated, although our top russian officials almost never came to armidage, in fact, they were the first yeltsin came to our president, while still the head of the external relations department of the mayor of st. petersburg smolny, he was one of the first, he came and that means... then somewhere in the armitage he held short negotiations since then, in general, he used this quite often, he comes with guests, which means we walk around vermetazh, then they go aside and talk about something, then come back further and so on, something like this happens, that is , they are not even sitting in some room, it

happens, no, they just walk and talk around the museum, of course there is a room nearby where they can go and talk, this always happens too, but this all happens intertwined with stories about armitage sometimes. the devices that were made for her wedding for when she married the duke outside the borders of such wonderful edinburgh churches, this is alexandra’s beloved daughter iigo, but the spirit of zinny exists, some kind of spirit, not of the museum, of the walls that many have seen.

such a storage room for linen, an additional library, all this was removed in order to preserve only such a powerful palace, and the palace of everyday life was leaving, just now we were just doing it, just the other day, by the way, it wasn’t just one who walked here, here’s one, i’m really alone too i walked around the museum only

with a television crew, we made a whole film about the palace of hidden palaces, that is , hidden living quarters that actually come out, and what’s there now some offices or sometimes offices, sometimes just corners. somewhere there are storage rooms , just like there were storage rooms, somewhere the staircase is walled up, somewhere there is a door, then the staircase is already closed, that is, these are the traces that in fact, well, it turned out to be a lot. but it’s very interesting, but what, of course, is more interesting is that this is what always remains from the market, that when it’s already been taken away a little, because it doesn’t fit with the imperial grandeur that today determines the content of hermetage exhibitions, there’s some... then you have artistic advice, maybe whether you coordinate with someone from the head of the country, with the presidential administration, firstly, we do not coordinate anything with anyone.

show, this is not so, this is how dare you show this, how dare you not show this, and so on, and therefore in response to this , various ministers said more than once that they believe that he should do what he does has the right to do this to do, this is really so, another thing is that a museum should give people the opportunity to see different things, we do exhibitions, we always do with one gulp, we have several dates around which we are organizing exhibitions, we are doing them in one gulp for a wide variety of tastes, and there is an exhibition of russian imperial history, russian... an exhibition of russian icons, an exhibition of flomanian painting

, an exhibition of restored oriental things there, all this is going on at the same time , please choose whatever suits your taste. as far as i know, you allow almost every curator to hold their own exhibition, some kind, to realize their idea once every few years, well, that’s how i say, conventionally, that you don’t coincide in aesthetics, do not match in taste, well...

continuing the theme of tradition, you have already said more than once, as i hear some with such bitterness, that today the museum is somewhere between the temple and disneyland, on the way to disneyland? well, first of all, without any bitterness, i actually said a lot of things, i haven’t said them for 30 years, so let’s answer for yours, that’s why i try not to answer, but these words always imply some kind of allusions.

it should be, well, that is, it’s not so that you can come to rent a hall for that you can’t come to rent a hall you can’t come and rent a hall, although people really want to and are offered everything many times, and if some events related to the museum happen, in our style we do one or another type of celebration, around, as a rule, around the event, around the exhibition , around the conference, around what, well, they came and offered you a lot of money to hold some kind of anniversary or wedding, no less, well, no one offered weddings, of course, because... we have it, please, if you want during the wedding

dress, go take a photo in armitage, please, you can buy an additional ticket and take pictures, please, but of course not, but all the time there are some, there are streaks, especially since people are often poorly informed, they even come, it’s not that there are some particularly strong worlds, just there he writes a letter there, i would like to rent a hall there for some events, or i would like to know how much it costs to rent a hall from you to make my exhibition, that ’s all approximately. on defender of the fatherland day, we are now going to the line of combat contact, you will see how ours work doctors, surgeons, nurses. talk to me. everything is fine, you respect me, so guys , quickly get out , we always pull out our own, we have never abandoned our guys on the field, antosha, everything is fine, even though he is a man, they are also scared, we try our best to support them when you you see someone’s pain, you always choose one or two people so that he can calm down

, feel that someone needs him, someone is worried about him now, everything will be fine, i always have the feeling that i - i didn't finish it. you know, there was something i could do a little more, and this is for me, of course, these russian boys do not change, everyone who takes part in this is already the same, we will not become the same, we have not become worse or better, but we have changed, who if not us? to love to save while the heart is beating in the chest, premiere, medical... special forces are on the first day tomorrow, let's go, hello , you're in a hurry, you're my friend, maybe the last one, prince volkonsky pyotr mikhailovich, the chief of the main staff, should be dismissed

on indefinite leave, collapse, all the hopes, madness, you will occupy in my inner circle. from monday on the first. this is the first podcast persons, my guest is the director of the state hermitage, mikhail borisovich peatrovsky. one of the human faces of the hermitage, if not strangely a cat, is such a meme, widespread, popular, do you and

rospotrebnadzor have any questions about this? what kind of supervisory issues might there be? all people in relation to people followed all the sanitary rules, as we follow in relation to cats, there was a story that two years ago there was a certain french donor who left part of the inheritance to your cats, he contacted you executor of this person, in the end you received this money in the best way. there were a couple of thousand euros there, so they got it, spent it on food, on food and on houses for cats. and as i understand it, you have a separate line, too , probably like this, one of the myths, maybe, or memes of the hermitage, this is the hermitage clock, you have a special clock in your office, you know, these are all the things that with do they do it, or

do the visitors come up with it, no, depending on the fact that i don’t know what the visitors come up with, we come up with it, and then we suggest it to the visitors, after all, what about cats, cats? history appeared , there were always two or three cats, but the time has come, relatively speaking, there is post-soviet perestroika, when the first thing people do, when it’s hard, they throw out their pets, so people suddenly began to pick up abandoned kittens on the street, bring them to the premises , try to find them somewhere then save it here, then they began to ask me for permission, can we increase the population of cats a little, it was not easy, because some people liked it, and others killed these cats, that’s all, that’s it not just a game, now it looks like... a marketing ploy, but this was actually instilling in people such a good attitude, when animals are treated, then people will be treated well, this is what the museum instills in such an unobtrusive way, it turns out now that all sorts of wonderful children’s events are happening around this, but watches are another story, which means there are

a huge number of fermitage watches.