i'm morgan radford. i look forward to seeing you again at 4:00 a.m. eastern. pl the largest number remain in any mi ni nimibia, a very unlikely source a group of hinters in texas who say they want to help the black rhino by killing one.

>> this weekend, the dallas safari club, allows the hunt of an aging male african black rhino, unable to mate. >> we'll be able to give a lot money back that's going to be able to expand the black rhino population in africa. >> this is the first one available for purchase outside the african country. it's expected to raise up to a quarter of a million dollars, up all to go to nimibia to help thwart poaching efforts. the auction has been approved by the convention of international trade in endangered species. still, it doesn't set well with some animal rights advocacy. >> it's a hunt that is immoral. a black rhino on the verge of extinction.

one member slaughtered for a trophy is one too many. >> jen samuel has organized a protest rally for saturday and a global tweet event. but the dallas safari club say some protest ersers that are tag this too far. >> e-mails have threatened our members. i don't think they should be subjected to such e-mails or threats whatever their being message is. >> the message is the life of an endangered species that is on the line. >> what is the future? wayne pacelli, president of the humane society of the united states. i suppose it would be no stretch to say that your organization would be opposed to this. tell us why. >> there are many aring species

in the world, the black rhino is the rarest. the idea of linking a trophy hunting exercise with conservation may make sense to folks who are involved with trophy hunting but i don't think it makes sense in the grand scheme of things. a thousand rhinos have been poached in south africa in 2013. there are only 5,000 black rhinos, there are some white rhinos that have been poached part of that 1,000 we need to do what we to protect them. >> in this case, we know that -- first of all it is a permit that is given, even though the dallas hunting club isn't involved in that that permit would be given osomeone. >> the nimibians, to start auctioning off, where does it

end, we want to offer an auction for an or angutang, where does the poaching work have to be involved with giving the person an opportunity to to shoot one of the rarest animals in the world? they are spending a lot of money but not linking their efforts to the idea of shooting one of the animals. we should be all in to protect the rhino. >> from their point of view, to present it just so their voice is heard in this. look the nimibians have a situation, they clearly need money, this is a very expensive operation for them. what they have offered is a permit to kill an animal who is apparently elderly past reproductive age. if this is something that can bring them some resource that helps the other animals, why not? >> i think a lot of the dallas safari club are older and past

their reproductive prime as well. i think it creates an incentive to get out of control. especially when they have a regulatory authority. they have done this with polar bears in canada, led to overkilling of polar bears. what about cheetahs in nimibia? we have a list of federally endangered species, in the u.s. and other endangered species. there is no hunting of those endaingz speakers. this is a past policy and sends a wrong message when we are asking people all over the world to protect the rhino, but we are going oallow u.s. citizens to shoot a few of them because they want to mount their heads on a wall. >> not over any international whatever the nimibians choose to do is what the united states responsibility is.

>> we have an international arm, we are active in africa and asia and all parts of the world. these are dlas based safari club members and we think they should be ybting to conservation if they care about the rhino, i'm sure many of them do. but why do they want to link that are contribution to conservation by killing one of the rarest animals in the world? >> i believe they would say they want to protect the greater goal of conservation. wayne pecell ink, thanks for being here. >> joie thank you. >> looking ahead to next week on america tonight, a trashed pacific. >> i think the misconception anything with japanese writing on it is from the tsunami, however we have found numerous items with various writing, korean, japanese, things from the united states as well. >> does it ever

amaze you how far this stuff travels? >> pretty amazing actually. >> it's classic in -- plastic in pair dies. adam mays sorts through monumental cleaning effort. and still to come, food for thought.

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>> that is a harsh reality that's hard to watch. welcome back. we're talking about haiti. how far it's come four years after its devastating quake. ben, is there any way to know how much the money donated actually got in the hands of the haitian people or programs that directly benefit them? >> overall not really. the organizations that are raising these dollars are not subject to information laws. you can look in their tax returns to see how much they spent in the caribbean each year in the last three years. but in their tax returns, they say operations in the caribbean, that's it. unless they tell you specifically what they've done,

that's the problem. the partnerships and relationships maybe a bunch of organizations are contributing to the same program. they might say we did this so that inflates the success of what really happens. >> what bill was mentioning, a group of ngos were driving on the beech through the disaster area in a $60,000 car. >> it's not that the relief can be done cheaply put the results should be much more than they have been. much more resilient for disasters and civil recovery organizations are not that resilient and haiti is dependent on outside support looking at those numbers, the pictures of people on the show of such dire straits, the immediate reaction

is they want to help. and you can't blame them. the question is how can people help effectively and give without middle men? we don't need organizations regranting. we don't have need organizations doing things for people in haiti. we need people in haiti getting dollars directly and doing things themselves. 90% of these organization he left. >> ben doesn't just talk about they has worked for them. >> i want to point out actually something else, take a quick look at my screen here. la von la mont is the prime minister of healthy haiti, he wants to know why there isn't anyone from authority on the show, we reached out to him to see if we could get him as a guest but didn't hear back. government to government aid, ben says, never gets to the

victims. gabe says you might as well flush the money down the toilets, the people don't get it. mary says put the money directly in the hands of the people who need it. the same haitians who were fighting over a bowl of rice, were fighting over a bag of rice on the 13th. do you agree that the aid has actually divided haitians? >> just to show haiti is bad, to be honest with you, most people don't to to haiti to look for good news. they just go to haiti just to talk bad about our country, which is the first black country in the world. i don't have any trouble with my government, access is government more than government in the past. the problem is if anybody would like to bring haiti, they must do the haitian people, people in

haiti don't have any skill. when you don't care for the people, you don't know their feelings. you don't know what they really want to do. haitian people they don't really have a dream. to be honest with you they do have it but they don't have any opportunity to access that dream. >> i know you want to jump in. >> sorry, but i have to say that it's not people who coming, they not coming to see better the way they do it is not the best way. when we not saying that the same person was prize for fighting on the 23rd, i mean because the head was distributed on a bad way, because the people was coming and say hello haitian people, this is uncle sam who coming to help you. but this is what we can offer you, we have the technician, what do you want to do, that could be better.

you know, it's not really like the help in general. it's more about all that's being distributed and how it's being organized. for example when you say tons of rice in the haitian market, you know it's produce that of lots of money they cannot sell their rice anymore because too much free rice on the market right now. people can get for free. so it's smart, but what itself, when you say shoes for haitian people what they will do with shoes? they will wear it but did we really need shoes, rice and stuff like this. >> i want to put you on pause. go ahead. >> i think there's plenty of blame to go around, it is not who is to blame but exactly what is to blame and the structural

iinequities, make a big difference, and put you in these inequities, after an earthquake and billions of dollars pledged to haiti, four years later we're still asking where did the money go and the haitians didn't see much improvement in their lives. >> and this brings up these land use issues you deal with so closely in haiti. can you explain why haitians have been displaced when physically it did not affect them? >> that is a good question, puzzling people outside of haiti. the haitian people do not have stocks, they do not have bonds they do not have bank accounts, they do not have retirement accounts. their sland their most important asset. in haiti, 95% of haitians do not

have secured access to land. they may have a title to their land, the title can be taken away, it can be contested in court, the title may be out of date and sometimes they have been occupying the land and using the land for decades under what you would call a social relationship. and that land is easily taken away from them now in the name of reconstruction and this is what happened in the north of haiti, where indeed far from the epicenter of the quake and in the north of haiti, about 250 hectares of land prime agriculture land was taken away from 266 farmers in their families and the agricultural workers who use that land regularly for communities, to pay for their school and market that land was taken away in the

name of benefit. >> does that yow weigh displacement? >> if you speak to the community not at all. in the wages that have been offered in that industrial park are about $5 a day and they are still struggling to -- >> to eat. >> to eat. doesn't make any sense whatsoever. >> clearly haiti was struggling before the quake. so what is it going to take to rebuild the country back to that level, how involved should the u.s. be, keep tweeting us, we'll be back in two minutes.

consider this: the news of the

>> welcome back. that video that you're watching was taken just days after the quake. very much showing the resilience of the haitian people. something not very often talked about, as we see lots of images of poverty and destruction. ranel you tapped into the psychological needs of haitian people very early on after the disaster. and that was the need to express their emotions about what was going on and you did it with a hairbrush. tell us about that.

>> yeah, it was like a quake like on the night me and todd a friend we take a hairbrush and a camera look a plastic bottle and we go we ask the camera what you feel tonight and what do you want tonight? who you lose, what you lose, and the answer is like i lose all my friend my family my house. but when we have them what they -- ask them what they need tonight, they say we need that everything back to the normal. and i think it's reflect what all the haitians want everything back to the normal. but the question is: what is the normal? the normal what is it for haitian people? because we live like lack of pure slavery, haiti before we got independence not so late after we got dominated like for

almost 20 years by the u.s., you know when they were takings possession of our land. after we got the capture and then arristide demonstration, another earthquake but what is normal for haitian people? >> there's a tremendous amount of resiliency among haitians but do you see that level of optimism changed at all due to the lack of progress or do you see a sense of resolve that still exists there? >> i think haiti is in a process. i think haiti is better than the way haiti used to be. young people in haiti we stand to change our country. because one thing you said, how can someone, just asking myself that question, how can someone they not change a country if you do not trying to help change the people's life?

everything about haiti is like haitian people, people everybody that's going omeat how they can have haitian people, the only way is knowledge. haiti do not have problem with food. haitian people we strong we can work. haitian people we do have knowledge when people talk about building school in haiti, they don't build any library in that school. after they just built a building. they don't build like a place where kids can go do research. you live like in 2014. trying to -- >> we actually have some community -- we have some community weighing in talking about what it is things acan be done to help. ngos who drive 60,000 dollar

vehicles have got to go. there should be a balance of profit and loss statements. lynnie, she goes on saying, seriously, where all the money went for the relief aid i donated. and finally, we should at the core if we're going to talk about what a prosperous inflation, talking about the united states, we should be able to give like we are one. >> we have about 30 seconds left. how do you measure progress? >> you measure progress what the haitian people need. you need food, you need resources, you need to be in the driver's seat. in the u.s. government itself there is a bill that is by the house called the assessing progress in haiti bill one that will hold the u.s. government accountability. >> accountability is needed across the board. thanks for all our guests for joining us, until no then, joins

online. >> extreme human suffering in syria, the united nations urges all sides to allow access to the starving residents of a besieged refugee camp. >> welcome to al jazeera. i'm jane dutton. also ahead, south sudan's army captures an important town from the rebels as talks enter their sixth day. celebrations in central african republic. the president has quit but there's no end to the violence. >> more doctors smoke camels than a