had several tornados. several homes were hit with wind gusts of over 100 miles per hour. those are the headlines. stay with us, "consider this" is up next. i'll be back at 11:00 pm eastern, with more news. >> north korea ripped by the u.n., we'll ask u.s. ambassador to the u.n. bill richardson if anything will change. how will hillary clinton's time at the state department impact a presidential run. how does she compare to successor john kerry. only on al jazeera. taliban terror, a reporter allowed to cover from the inside. and dick cavett on the new tonight show host jimmy fallon. here is more on what is ahead. . >> united nations a levelling

did you agree reports for what is happening in north korea. >> systematic enslavement, rape, torture, murder. >> the plan is to capture african nationals army base. >> the suicide bombers have been september to blow up the main gate. >> our man jimmy fallon taking over. >> it will be a big night. >> we begin with a report on, "unspeakable crimes" perpetrated in north korea, and an unprecedented warning from the united nations to north korea's leaders. u.n. investigators said that supreme leader kim jong un and security forces could face a trial for ordering systematic widespread and gross human rights violations:

>> denailed a report, michael kirby, the chair that wrote the report, compared to crimes to nazi atrocities and had this challenge for his u.n. colleagues in gen geneva. >> too many times in this building there's reports and no action. this is a time for action, we can't say we didn't know. we now all do know. anyone that wants to know can read the report. . >> i'm pleased to be join by a form area ambassador to the u.n., that made several trips to negotiate freedom of americans in custody. great to have you on the show. >> thank you. >> i want to start out by listening to something else that michael kirkry had to say?

>> at the end of the world war ii so many people said "if only we had known, if only we had known the wrongs that were done in the countries of the hostile forces. if only we had known that." well now, the international community does know. >> governor now that we though, what are we going to do about it. it the u.n. capable of action in this case? >> well, first this is a very, very strong report, and the fact that the u.n. documented these cases makes it more significant. we have had reports by human rights groups, by individuals of this kind of activity. the fact that the international body with the prestige and power of the u.n., now what happens next. that's the problem. first, north korea has been

sanctioned to death, mainly for its nuclear weapons program and the missile test. how do you punish it sanctions >> the problem practically is any kind of international criminal court action has to be triggered by the u.n. security council. any examination, any war crimes charge and there it looks like one of the five powers that can veto china would probably veto an effort if they felt this was against north korea's interests. that's happened before, and that is a dilemma, a potential veto by china while the united states, britain, france and possibly russia, the other four powers that have veto on the security council, the permanent members, would want to push it. china is the key player, once again, as it pertains to north

korea. at some point you have to wonder whether the alliance can hold. as you go through this, it's horrific. it's murder, rape, torture, slavery, and specific examples of a woman made it drown her own baby. people imprisoned and tortured for watching a soap opera. children in prison and starved from birth. in the light of all that. do you think this will change anything? >> north korea has not followed international norms. they are unpredictable. possibly. kim jong un, the new leader sees this and undoubtedly he has to read it. perhaps there's going to be internal forces in north korea, moderate forces in the military, in the political structure

saying we are not going get assistance to the starving people, unless there's changes. that is a limited but possible course that might change things. i wouldn't count on it, but now the best answer is some kind of engagement with kim jong un on this report, on the nuclear weapons reduction, on engaging with south korea. on rekindling the 6-party talks, reducing tensions in the pennsylvania. someone has to engage the guy. it can't be dennis rodman, it can't be somebody that isn't going to find ways to moderate what is happening in north korea. which basically is not good, but be don't know anything about the leader and which direction he wants to go. on the one hand, he is having human rights thoughts on

reunification of families. maybe it's a good sign. when he reads the report, maybe he'll say, "i'm ready to talk, ready to dialogue." hopefully that will happen. >> the north korean government rejected the accusations, and there are references to the fact that there could be hundreds of people in the north korean power structure that could be conceivably war criminals. is there, in a way, a danger that this may make them dig in and not be willing to open up and expose themselves to war crimes trials? >> well, there is that argument, but it could create a bunker mentality. they don't talk to anybody, they isolate themselves and provoke other countries. it can't get worse. my hope is internally some of the military in north korea, the

party structure and perhaps kim jong un himself sees well look, maybe it's time to change course. we are having an international outcry against us. the time has come to negotiate on nuclear weapons, on the regime itself, on isolating ourselves a lot less than we have. this report might be a kindling. i'm an optimist. it can't get worse right now. could it be a kindling there. china is named in the report for aiding and abetting the crimes against humanity, is there a chance the chinese may be willing to get involved in a positive way? >> yes, there is a chance, and the chinese have sent messages to north korea - stop the detonation of the nuclear devices.

stop the launching the missiles. stop the execution. they couldn't stop it, but they are perturbed with what is happening. the question is how much left ridge are they willing to use to send a message that some unseemingly behaviour has to stop. the chinese government with the report, and the pressure they get in the u.n. security council to do something, it could be that it will make the chinese leverage and actions stronger than they have, and maybe there'll be a change. any slight change is roim. >> over a year ago you went to north korea with google executive chairman eric schmidt to try to arrange the release of kenneth bae, held in north korea since november 2012, now we hear that he's been sent to a labour camp and faces 15 years of hard labour, do you thige the report will make things worse for him?

>> well hopefully not. it's unfortunate that the north koreans don't treat kenneth bae as a humanitarian act. they were on the verge of negotiating with an american envoy to turp him loose. it didn't happen because of a military provocations, adelaide by the north koreans that we pursued. maybe after this report cools down, the north koreans will see fit to let the american, who is sick, to come home to his family. >> boy, looking at the report and seeing hundreds of thousands killed, concentration camps, atrocities, it's a horrifying thing to conceive of. governor bill richardson, great to have you on the show.

thanks. >> an al jazeera america exclusive taking us inside the taliban to give us a glimpse on what the war in afghanistan looks like from the taliban's point of view. even if the afghan government were to agree leaving u.s. troops in afghanistan, the first line of resistance will be the u.s. trained afghan national army, al jazeera's "faultline" shows a journalist trailing taliban fighters after they attack a base. >> i'm acutely aware i wouldn't be allowed to film them unless they wanted the world to see what they showed me. >> the fact that they used the media to establish their point of view and get their case across, they should. we do. >> an unusual insight into the other side. michael o'hanlon, director of foreign policy research at the brockings institution joins us and co-author of "toughing it out in afghanistan." great to

have you with us. if u.s. troops withdraw from afghanistan altogether, is the afghan national army ready. this film shows the taliban acting with impunity not far from kabul. >> every time one unit attacks another, and the one unit chooses the time and place of the amburp, it's no surprise -- ambush, it's no surprise they can car i it out. the -- carry it out. the fact that the taliban carried out the raid does not surprise me. the more important question is how well did the afghan army respond, and are they preventing large concentrations of taliban forming. they can prevent that with patrolling and use of intelligence networks. i found the film fascinating in the sense that it gave a more

direct view of the way the war is going on. a lot of people will be curious. they have been reading about the war, seen statistics, and they probably appreciate a bit of a feel for what it's like visually and in real time. it did not strike me as showing a capable taliban movement against hapless and helpless afghan army or police. >> the group did not seem strong. they were operating freely and walking down the streets, and close to the capital, which surprised me. let's take a look for the film that focuses on that attack. >> the plan is to capture the african national army base. the only thing i know is that they say they'll fight until they capture the base. they won't withdraw. >> they haven't told me when they are going to attack, just that it will happen around

sunrise. >> it didn't seem like more tan a nuisance attack. but how well armed are the taliban. >> the taliban are armed. obviously the roadside bombs, those are the main weapons of choice. the problem is they seem to have a limitless supply of fighters, that's it's not a popular movement. it's important to drive home, but there are certain tribes and groups and headquarters over the border in pakistan which proved resilient and willing to seek the taliban. the government cannot really beat it down, we haven't been able to beat it down. it's not winning the war. the cities are in government hands. most of the major transportation roads are. some of the areas around kabul and other cities are invested. that may increase, but my worry

about the insurgency is not that is has popularity, but it is resilient. they'll be around a while. i don't expect them to win. i think they'll create a crisis of confidence. they'll create sympathy and try to erode the afghan will. >> i know the group said they are not aided by the pakistanis. they are not as close as others are, which may get aid with them. i think the taliban wanted the correspondent to go with them. to show power which may be exaggerated. >> suddenly the fighting begins.

>> the taliban's heavy machine guns is ready. >> and the ana fight back. . >> the taliban soldiers that i'm with lost two men. it looks like they are not as positive as they were, attacking the base. >> for these fighters. it looks like a situation might be about to get worse.

>> they lost the encounter and seemed happenless. i know you have written that we should not be pessimistic. the reality is the taliban does not have the numbers of fighters that we have when the soviets withdrew a few decades ago. >> at that time there was a general resistance movement. and we call them freedom fighters, as you know, and we appreciated what they were going. they weren't necessarily fighting for a 7th century calafat with succession for women's rights and then a lack of education or rights. they were in that sense trying to drive an occupier out of their country, a lot of people in their government were leading the military, were mujahideen. it was a quarter million strong, from all different travel

groupings, it is today from certain parts of the push tonne community. again, they have been resilient, able to keep it going, it's true they get a lot of support from inside of taliban. they have sanctuaries for command and control. it's not atrivial enemy. i acknowledge that. >> do you think the number will grow if americans leave. >> the afghan army and police will be tested. they'd face a difficult year, with a higher risk of mission failure and defeat. >> i'm not so sure that the taliban will grow in size. what you could see is a crisis of confidence among the afghans trying to believe in the new kav gan, trying to build a new nation and move back home, or trying to stay put, live in the city, send their kids to school, believe in a new way of life and government. all of a sudden they'll have doubts if the movement, if the taliban scores spectacular

victories, if n.a.t.o. withdraws, if the presidential race goes badly. if that begins, it leads to an unravelling of the general support for the government, the military, the army. that's how i think things would get worse, not by the taliban growing in size. i don't think they have the support to grow in size. >> the correspondent in afghan, he was allowed in by the taliban, was kidnapped by him. what do you make of the fact that he allowed them to do what they did. >> in many ways, because the attack was small scale and localized of what we see weekly, if not daily, i view it as a microcosm of the war, not a big battle. and the enemy didn't have to worry that he might give up information that would set them

back. it was a limited engagement. it was a tiny window into the nature of combat in afghanistan. i personally am not surprised that they let him do it. i have no major criticism of his doing so. i'm not sure an american could have or should have done that. i think it provided a useful window for a lot of people in the conflict. >> thank you very much for joining us, michael hanlon, of the brookings institution. "consider this" will be right back. ♪

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>> 33 months ahead of the nest location, hillary rodham clinton's time is getting an in-depth book treatment. the flattering appoint: >> it looks inside the clinton machines, finds a hit list of enemies, those that loathe hillary land and focuses on a woman that has never stopped running for president. joining me are the authors - jonathan alan, the white house correspondent for bloom bearing and amy pannes. great to have you, congratulations on the book.

many thing john kerry eclipse hillary clinton in the office. you talk about how she was cautious in the job. is the issue that john kerry is looking at history and has no - doesn't feel like he's risking anything, and hillary clinton is looking at the future and what it means for her specifically when it comes to her running for president. >> it may be some of that. john kerry's has key things he's working on - syria, iran and, you know, middle east peace - they are three things that are unresolved. we don't know how we'll score that when outline things are said and down. with iran it is state officials that have the negotiations with the iranians through, you know, direct sit downs in 2012. i think the john kerry scorecard has incompletes on it.

as far as hillary clinton goes, we go into detail on this. we think that there are metrics by which she'll be measured. diplomats - their first job is to make sure problems don't arrive, rather than just solving problems. there are anecdotes in the book of times she did that, where there was diplomatic disasters that she headed off. those who criticise her for not having gotten the israelis and the palestinians to sit and sing in harm ni are accurate. >> you start the book with the clinton hit list, it's got a lot of tapes of what she wrote, ranking friends and foes, from one to seven, one being the best. the senth - ted kennedy, john cary, clair mccaskill among

others. do you buy the line that this was misinterpreted? >> well, they are saying that they don't rely on it or circulate it. i think it serves as a reminder that they keep a track of friends and enemies. the clinton s are looking forward but looking back to this. people ask - how does it pertain to today. it does, if she's running in 2016 it plies to that. bill clinton is on revenge cycles in 2010 and 2012, where he took out people that didn't support his wife. it comes forward in times. >> both of you are convinced there's no question that she has not stopped running for president and will run in 2016. >> sure, the train is rolling and gaining steam for sure. all the outside groups formed around her. she is fundraising. ready for hill larry. all she needs to do is tied that she's running and the landscape is there for her.

>> one thing that the book gives her credit for, talking about diplomacy is destroying the image of america around the world after the bush years. certainly you bring up the positive things that bob gate and general david petraeus have to say about her. given what has happened since you wrote the guts of the book, how vladimir putin reset his authority, and russians negotiations have gone away. was she successful in the lopping run in we storing the image. >> it depends on the country. the united states long-term partners view the united states better during obama's first term than the bush administration. you can measure this in polling.

we saw coalitions between the united states and some folks in the gulf cooperation council, in the arab league, that you never would have seen before, and so i think there are some places where that is true, and there are other countries that have been a harder nut to crack. it is, you know, an almost nothing in pakistan, for instance. so i think there's a record, but if you look at the polling, it's clear that the united states is perceived better around the world today than when barack obama took office. they probably share some credit in that. >> beng assy. >> with all due respect we had four dead americans, was is because of a protest or because some guys decided to go out and

kill americans. what difference does it make. >> that moment beng assy, a tough moment. we'll see that. she received a lot of criticism in reports that came out. a lot have been critical of the state department. >> it is. we will see that again and again. and republican national committee, communications director, john spicer told us as much. there was an ad that mitt romney didn't use that basically pinpointed obama to beng arsy or tried to blame him for it. it's an add that they'll play and accuse hillary clinton of having her hands in this, not being prepared and this happened under her watch. the they are gearing this up. i think we can expect to see it in the coming months. >> we have social media questions. let's go to harmeli aregawi for that. >> hartsfield jackson international has been the subject of many. the latest is a rip off of a new york times magazine cover,

portraying hillary as a planet. the original cover story was written by amy. and even though hill larry hasn't announced that she'll run, major newspapers have called for a focus on her. is she in the campaign whether she declares or not. >> the last person to know if hillary clinton is running for president will be hillary clinton. the way we frame it in the book is that she has been running all along, and the question is whether she stops. anybody that reads the book will get inside details on how she built the clinton political provision inside the government. her husband did the outside thing. to reward friends, punish enemies, in the hopes that that would be helpful for the brand

going forward. there's no question that she has been running for a long time. if she were to stop running, i think it would be certainly the story of the year of 2014. >> excuse me, i would be amiss if i didn't bring up this. >> you had a couple of hundred of hillary people. you have some criticism that the book is too favourable to her. your rehabilitation? >> i don't think that true at wall. we have the leading new york times critic. along with "the washington post" and the l.a. times. the one you are referring to is the one peace. >> there was one from john carl, in "the wall street journal" and the 'financial times' and economists felt it was too flattering. >> we talked to people who liked her, republicans that were thinking about running against her, and lot of different

people. i think we formed a - we are both journalists, we cover the whitehouse and are commercial. >> both sides have used pieces of the book for political ammunition to defend hillary clinton, those that defend and attack her. i just - the reviewer has a right to his opinion, we share it. >> we have a health care peace, where hillary clinton is very much advocating for health care. we are rallying the cabinet. i think both sides are taking the book and using what they want from it. >> there's a lot in the book adding to the debate. it's hrc state secrets and the rebirth of hillary clinton. it was great to have you both on the show. thanks for your time. >> back with more of "consider

this".

>> "tonight show" had 18 million viewers in its heyday, hosted by johnny carson. a generation that barely knows carson's name has more late-night fare to choose from. transitions to late-night television led to great debacles. will late night have another king? joining us now is someone that might know. dick cavett, the host of "the dick cavett show." he was a writer on "tonight show" with johnny carson, and the author of three books: >> he is a blogger at the "new

york times." does it get tiring being referred to as legendary? >> yes, and you did in one breath. two things you said struck me. one was an astonishing thing i read was a brilliant peace in the new yorker about four years ago by a man by menand as in men and women. near the end it was about late night in talk shows and ratings, i learnt that when i was let go after many years on a.b.c., my rating at that time was higher than anything leno and the "tonight show"... >> have ever achieved. >> it stands to reason. there's so many spreadouts than people to watch. >> how big is a deal is it? you were on the "jimmy fallon show", they recreated the old set of the dick cavett show.

must have cost them something. you were an expensive guest. laura michaels, the head of "tonight show." says that fallon is the closest thing she's seen to carrons in a generation, do you agree. >> michael proved to be a genius. i would be the last to argue with lauren's opinion. jimmy is young, he's cole eejate looking in his way, as he was. he's funny. he can ad lib, which is different to being funny. he can - he's a white fellow. he's appealing. >> he can sing, he can do impressions. do you think that will help him? >> johnny, as they say, "a dear friend of mine."

there are more talents in mr fallon, in terms of impressions, voices, dialect, musical circles and a sense of how to handle a guest. he would never step on your punchline, a terrible thing to happen when you. it's like a waiter. what would be - that was no lady that was my... want some more coffee? when ahost does that, you want them dea dead. >> i see you would not want fallon dead. he's likeable. do you think it may help the transition go better than the one with conan, which is a disaster. >> what you alluded or referred, it was a misadventure. jay back, jay out, jay earlier, jay back, jay high ratings.

it doesn't make sense, and conan was bruised unmercifully by all that, i think. >> do you think this might go smoother. >> you think this will go smooth lip. >> it should. nothing is blocking it. i don't see what it could be. people will be wracking their brains to figure out a trick to not letting fallon fall behind. fallon is on top of the world, has everything going for him. and kimmel is good. they are friends, and he knows it. it's a strange world of animosities and friendships. >> it brings up an interesting issue. in this whole discussion we here a lot about kimmel as the competition. stuart and col ber. where is letterman in the conversation. letterman has the second-highest

ratings. >> i know. dave letterman will go until he's sick of it, i am sure. like everyone, there's time in his run where you wish you could do anything. sometimes you'd rather do anything teach english, rather than go to the studio and face whoever it is. johnny, i'm not the first to say - hard to say - only happy when he was on the air, with that mother and wife problems, and alcohol problems and was so tense i that felt sorry for him. i liked him so much. the battle he had sitting in his t-shirt in the office, smoking a pal mall that he knew was goping to kill him, pulled himself and stood in the kings, stubbed out the pal mall - he used to smoke on air and went out there with such class and command.

it brought tears to my old, then young, eyes. >> we have a social media question for you. >> fallion is a powerful force on social media. leno doesn't hit the million mark. on youtube one skit with justin bieber in which he and fallon have a conversation in hash tags amassed 21 million hits. to capitalize the "tonight show" launched an app allowing viewers to interact with the show. will the young people watch the show or the clips online? >> all i can thing of if you suggested to jack bauer people will react to your show while you're on the air, he would have blown up into a million pieces and taken lives around him. it's a nice thing. i don't know how i could do it. i can't conceive of sitting with hepburn or brando or people i

allegedly got that couldn't be gotten and been irritated and bugged by people calling in to the show. i know you are talking about the fact that nothing has to be seen when it's on the air because you can catch it the next day, get it on your device or that device. a friend will tell you he found it somewhere else, and it changed everything. >> no, you have not slid off that question. >> i'm a good slider you have to watch mean. >> i'll get you back to it. >> carefully. >> i'll try. as someone who did it for seven years, in so many different capacities, is there a way of someone else dominating late night or are we in a different universe where the audience is so splintered that no one will be the king of late night. >> are you asking me if there would be another king of the night. there was a book about that.

it might not be. we may be beyond that. things are so dispersed that there may not be a way of somebody killing everyone else. by the way the other thing i learnt in the new yorker article was that johnny carson, this may be an exclusive for you. johnny carson, his friend swifty lesare told me in strict confidence - i better not tell this. >> not now. >> he said - while the people are alive you don't tell it. he said, "johnny said once over a drink dick cavett is the one that could beat me, could have, if he had a full-station line-up", in the article i learnt for the first time, four years ago, that a.b.c. about a third stations.

i could laugh off the idea of knocking johnny off the throne. >> must have been nice to hear that carson thought ta about you. >> it was nice. and another twist, i'm burting it out. once he said, "i wish i had dropped the half hour." >> it was an hour and a half. it was 90 minutes. >> this may take us back to johnny. like many, babies and monsters and giants and creeps and wonders, was happiest at work. >> maybe you should come back to late night and be the king of late night again. >> got an offer. >> i'll talk to the al jazeera folks. see what they say. >> you didn't hear that i'm going to be jimmy fallon's sidekick. >> another exclusive. it is really an honour to have you on the show. >> you are among the very best. >> thank you very much.

i hope it doesn't turn you into pinocchio. >> thank you. >> "consider this" will be right back.

today's data dive gets dirty. men's health looked at a series of studies finding highest traffic areas for germs. office desks have hundreds of times more bacteria. experts say wipe down your desks and don't eat in front of your computer. public bathrooms can be disgusting. finding one out of four soap despencers hold faecal bacteria. once you wash your hands next to terms, you may want to dry them on your clothes, rubbing them under a drier can boost bacteria.

cleaning tools can make you sick. university of arizona researchers found 13% carry ecoli. the film is change the back and disinfect the brush. >> a tms give you more cash. each key had about 1200 germs. that's on every key. cash is not clean much each bill having 26,000 bacteria. grocery shopping is a nightmare. two-thirds of grocery type of affectal bacteria, more than the average public bathroom. free food samples have you paying later. an outbreak was linked to free samples. rhino virus, a cause of the common cold, was found on 63% of gym equipment. weights are the worst. as if i needed another excuse not to go to the gym.

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