this will do it for this edition of al jazeera america. for more news and updates go to www.aljazeera.com. . >> from the relative comfort of most american homes, spending a fortune to smuggle your kids from one vast country into another seems hard to imagine, but the conditions in el salvador, honduras and guatemala would be hard to imagine. that is the "inside story."

>> hello, i'm ray suarez. it's been fascinating watching the american reactions to the surge in unaccompanied minors, children traveling on their own, trying to cross the u.s. border from mexico to central america. some have reacted with horror, worried first about the welfare of these kids. others have shown more concern about whether and how quickly the migrants can be sent home in order to stop the human flow from guatemala, el salvador and honduras. still others have used what president obama calls a humanitarian crisis totally opposite. this unfolding challenge a proof for th the call for immigration reform has been a failure. or using the same events as proof that it needs to be fixed and right away. today on the program a closer

look at the condition of these communities and the gamble of accepting kids north. north--sending kids north. >> reporter: 15-year-old trekked 2,000 miles in hopes of beginning a new life with his father, undocumented and living in houston. >> the trip was not easy because we came on the train. when you don't have water or food you get really hungry. you're always afraid because people are telling you that someone has fallen from the train, that the train can kill you. >> reporter: but in april after he was mugged in the mexican desert he surrendered to the u.s. border patrol and he's waiting for his father while he waits for immigration hearing. axle is one of 15,000 uncompanied young people who flooded u.s. immigration centers in recent months. the surge has pushed president obama to ask congress for $3.7 billion to relief

overloaded detention centers, immigration courts and border control. >> we're not going to simply leave abandoned children who are left at our door step. we got to care for them and provide basic safety and security while we determine where we can send them. >> reporter: why are these young people come together u.s.? back in honduras, axel's holder brother said he had two choices, flee or be killed by gangs, even if he didn't join one. >> alex was getting to the age where he would have problems with gangs. they are the one who is forced him to the u.s. >> reporter: the officer nan degrees family lives in one of the roughest neighborhoods, the most dangerous neighborhood outside of a war zone.

when there was a reporting of the story there needed to be an escort, and he still couldn't go everywhere he wanted. >> these opportunities pay extortion. you're in with the gangs or out, and axel decided to get out. >> reporter: the murder rate is 187 per 1,000 residents and there is no surprise that this city is home to the most unaccompanied young migrants. more than 2,000 children have fled since january, citing violence and poverty as leading forces. it's the same scene in el salvador or guatemala. >> they can kill you at any moment, and in a horrible way. but this way it's my decision. >> reporter: many are coming. >> we heard if we presented ourselves when we made it to the

other side of the river, that they would give us permit. >> reporter: but this so-called permit does not exist. smugglers in central america known as coyotes are seen as driving the misinformation. >> the coyotes have taken advantage. the people profit in thing in the situation are those people, the coyotes. >> reporter: the obama administration said 6,000 children crossed the border alone. this year that number is expected to be ten times higher.

>> welcome to our guests. welcome to "inside story." have we used the children as a resource themselves to better understand to what is causing them to leave their towns and countries. >> that's a great question. one of the things that happens in a humanitarian crisis like this is we learn things. and one of the things we've learned is why children are coming, and we learned where they're coming from. in the interviews that our officers have with them when they arrive. we know that the reasons they're coming, families and children, are very complex and they're different in different countries. but we know that there are push factors. there are economic, lack of opportunity, as well as the violence in many parts of the region especially in hon doctor harass and parts of el salvador. we know the factors of living in the united states, and smugglers

who give misinformation to them about whether they will receive benefits under u.s. la law and policy, which are not the case often. >> these have been facts of life. facts of daily life in these countries for years. what happened? what changed to cause this sudden surge in the numbers? >> well, i do think that some of the reasons that we're seeing the children's this "h" to do with family members who may have come in as the u.s. economy picked up. sometimes you have surges in levels of violence in certain urban areas and families want to get their children out of the area, even if they may think that it's temporary. i think you have a very complex series of factors, and i also think that we know that

governments are trying to attack these problems, but they may not always be successful in all of the right places and in all of the right times. so among the things that we learned from these children are where the governments themselves and we in support of them need to be factored--need to be focusing in more effectively. >> but th what can they do at their end to stop the people who are getting together, bribing the coyotes, arranging the trips, shut off that tap? >> well, i think it's really important to note that as the president did in texas the other day that we have a short-term crisis that we have to deal with

right away, but it's a long-term problem. so you got to do both. and so some of the things that we're asking governments to do relate to the short term and other things we've got to do with them in the long term to invest in strategies that work to make opportunities for these families and these children. but right now we also have to do things that send messages that say do not send your children on this journey. it is dangerous, and it i, and these smugglers lie to you and your children. they profit from your miseries. we also know that we work with these countries to make sure that when we return people,

right now whether those are adults or families, soon mothers or adult members of family with their children, we send the message that says it doesn't work. and governments are working with us, getting them out of homes to say that we will work with you on your situation here, and we will help those governments repatriate their citizens and work on the integration programs so they don't have to try these terrible choices. >> secretary, just to be clear because there has been confusion here in the united states. if you come this morning, you're not eligible for do c a. >> correct, we do need to be clear about this. it has been an urban legend promulgated by mugglers that what you get is a piece of paper

allowing you to stay. what you get is a piece of pair that processes them for removal. under doca, you have to have been in this country since before 2007. so young people coming into this country are not eligible for doca. under the senate-passed bill o, you would have had to be in this country since 2011. those options are not available to folks arriving at the border now. >> have there been minors sent home since this surge? >> well, there have always been unaccompanied minors returned home. but what you have seen obviously is the situation in which the

numbers have outpaced our ability to return them through the norm process. this is very difficult. the system is obviously strained. this is not the state department's area of expertise. we work with the receiving countries on their reception, but there have been children sent home in the past. we work with the countries on insuring the right reception for them, that they're returned to their families, that they have social services available, and there have always been families who were returned as well as individuals. but never in the kinds of numbers that we're seeing come to the border now. >> roberta jacobson. thank you for joining us on inside story. >> thank you very much. >> we'll take a short break and when we come back we'll take a broader look at the problem and what unaccompanied children face at home and what happens to them

once they're here. you're watching inside story. stay with us.

>> welcome back to inside story. i'm ray suarez. what's happening in the communities where families are making the decisions to send their children north, and once they survive the journey what conditions await unaccompanied minors in the u.s. we'll answer those questions throughout the rest of the program and look at what the numbers tell us at the problem and conclusions that americans have made on immigration. >> let me start with you, you saw the conditions firsthand in

san pedro sula. you were talking to families who are making decisions on what to do. what is going on down there that is driving families north? >> i think it's a lot of factors. for one thing we cannot lose sight of the fact that honduras has the highest murder rate for a country that is not at war. over all homicide are down but murders of kids are going up. you see parents saying wait a second, how long before this happens to my child? and i do think that in combination with some of the misunderstanding of what is happening in terms of the immigration policy, a lot of people are deciding, you know what, i think the time is now. >> tell us about the brothers. >> there was a sad case in san

pedro sula. they had seven children murdered in one month. in one case one boy was 13 and missing, so his brother decided to go to the local gang hangouts to see where his brother was. apparently he went too close to the spot because both boys were found dead within days of each other. the seven-year-old had been beaten and tortured. this family had two children under the age of 14 both murdered. they were like, what happens to us? the woman was asking, can i go to the united states and ask for asylum? i thought, well, no. i don't know that you can. so there is only so many times cases like that can happen in a city until parents start deciding, you know what, i'm not going to end up like that familiar. >> because word gets out that this terrible thing had

happened, and that drives the story more. >> well, it's been in all the papers. last week there was an 11:00-year-old boy whose throat was slit by other kids in the class because he failed to pay what they called the ward tax. basically the way the gangs charge extortion to bus companies, children are now charging to other children. and so at the morgue the medical examiner was telling me at first the children he saw dead were kids when the gang came to kill their parents, oh, sorry, they were caught up in the cross fire of the shootout. then as it developed he saw children killing children. he said, i see them with knives, with guns, with grenades. now he is thinking of immigrating. >> you've seen some of the conditions that these children are being held in. once they make it to the united states does some of their

treatment depend on where they end up? >> absolutely. we know that most of the problems in terms of overcrowding and children sleeping on the floor, lack of food, are happening at the border with those detention centers in jails that are being administered under the border patrol. once they are processed they then go to a shelter. we have one shelter close to los angeles in a naval base there, and we know that the conditions are much better within the shelter. they really made an effort to make sure that the children have the services of mental health and health in general, educational, and activities for them to do that is something that we don't see at the border. >> a lot of kids are sent with the understanding that if they make it they'll some how be able to contact their relatives who are already in the state. is it groups like yours, the central american resource center that helps create those reunions? >> well, we definitely have a lot of parents and families

coming to our centers and our organizations that they trust and saying i think my child is in detention. i think my brother is in detention. where do i go, where do i call to find them. we're having to walk through the process. we have people asking to fill out the application to get the child released. we're working with authorities. we're working with other community groups and organizations to make sure that the families receive the information they have to find their children and to make sure that they're reunified and brought of detention and to the families and feel safe. the problem is once they are wrought out of the detention they last services. so we're working on that front. >> mark, i think a lot of people don't realize just how sudden and dramatic the rise in people arriving kids especially has

been. >> so if you take a look, for example, in the case of honduras you see in 2009 about 1,000 unaccompanied minors had been apprehended at the border. today that through actually this current fiscal year through 2014 we see 15,000-plus unaccompanied minors from honduras alone. there is a system pattern for guatemala and el salvador. these trends are been gaining steam in 2010, 2011, and 2012. there have been a number of uncompanied minors coming from mexico as well. 12,000 plus so far have been apprehended at the border, and it's been at that level since 2009. while they have seen a sudden increase in recent years we've

seen unaccompanied minors coming from mexico as well. but they've been handled a different way than children coming in from el salvador. >> after the break we'll talk about what those services are. this is not just a question of unaccompanied minors. this is "inside story." stay with us.

>> you're watching al jazeera america, i'm ray suarez. as you heard earlier in the program, the obama administration has asked congress for more money to deal with the problems raised by kids crossing the border, and at the same time has asked the central government for help in stemming the human tide. earlier the assistant secretary of state roberta jacobson was talking about the process of accepting kids home. tell us what you know about that. >> i think the facts speak for themselves. the bottom line is since 2008 until now very, very few

salvadoran, guatemalan children are coming. 58,000 salvadoran kids were deported in 2013. over all we're deporting 20% of what we deported in 2007. because of a lot of issues, mostly laws. laws that protect these kids. and i don't understand why we can't just admit that. >> the timeline is so long when you enter the system that this is a reasonable conclusion to make, that you get your kid out of danger and for some time if you can get them across the border. >> everyone who is talking about the misinformation spread by coyotes, that may be true, but true information is being spread. the information is if you made it, and you were released, you got reunited with your mother.

in the long view is this great? no, but in the short view, i got there, i was released. everyone that i spoke to sand it depends on the question you're asking, very important. if you ask them why do you want to leave, sure, violence, poverty, etc. why are you all leaving now? why are you, ma'am, bringing your children? that's a different question. that answer is because we heard that you get to stay. >> martha, we heard the assistant secretary say earlier in the program one of the reasons the administration wants to send these kids back and send them back soon is to send the message to the sending communities that this does not work. hohow do you respond? >> reporter: we should talk about the dangers of migrating north, especially in regards to children. we need to do that here in the united states and central

american countries and mexico. people are really risking their lives in the trip right north up north. but we need to recognize that that is the way people migrate all over the world. people go where they might have a family member. where they might be able to be protected. that is how those people make those decisions. the truth of the matter is that there is violence at new levels because of the war on drugs, because of civil war, because of the gangs that were created out of the deportation policy of the united states. they're making a life-and-death decision. now the reasoning that the united states could be a country of compassion, receive them and protect them, that is definitely part of the thinking. but to say that the reason that they're leave something becaus leaving, in is a political

issue. this is a humanitarian crisis where children are making life or death decision. if they're sent back they're facing death. so what kind of country do we want to be? >> under current law if you arrive in this country and talk about the violence or extreme poverty in your home country, are any of those things grounds for asylum. >> not necessarily. is there a threat if you return that there might be violence directed to you because of who you are, a particular ethnic group or something else political. that alone is not enough. however, it's one of the options that for many of these unaccompanied minors, they will meet with a lawyer. the lawyer will talk to them about the possibility of applying for asylum, but will talk to them about the possibility of immigration courts and the possibility of being deported. >> are there rules for kids from

central america versus mexico? >> in the case of mexico and canada, because there are unaccompanied minors comin coming from canada but not as many as from mexico. the bush administration in '08 put a policy in place that says if you're a mexican unaccompanied minor at the border, a border patrol agent will meet with you rather than a judge. in the case of anybody from any other country around the world including central america, they must be processed through an immigration court and go potentially through a deportation process or asylum hearing. the way mexicans and canadians are treated versus others are partly out of the policies from the bush administration. >> are there a lot of people ready to enter the process, ready to head north even though the united states is saying don't come? >> absolutely. in fact, i checked to see if the

numbers of people being returned from mexico have declined? and it's in fact, up from june to may, and everyone who got turned back said they were going to try again. >> to my guests, thank you all. we could have gone on for another half hour. great conversation. that brings us to the end of this edition of "inside story." the program may be over but the conversation continues. log on to our facebook page or send us your thoughts on twitter. our handle is aj inside story am and i'm @ray suarez news. we'll see you for the next "inside story" in washington, i'm ray suarez. >> michael: coming up ofte,

we'll go live to gaza and the death toll tops 100. and israeli and palestinians both say they will continue their attacks. plus a look at what needs to happen for the violence to stop. also u.s. health officials explain how their labs mishand mishandled germs on different occasions, and also lebron james is returning to cleveland. all those stories and more coming up at 6:00. george mitchell helped broker peace in northern ireland. he also tried his hand in the middle east, serving as u.s. chief envoy to the israeli and palestinians under president barack obama. >> for both sides, the disadvantages of not getting an agreement are much greater than the difficulties that will come with getting an disagreement. >> he spent 15 years in the senate, first representing maine and as majority leader.