near havana. he lived there for 20 years and wrote "the old man and the sea", and "for whom the bell tolls", and it's a museum to his other literary trends. keep up to date on the website at aljazeera.com. president obama told the american public while he believes the islamic state must be destroyed and explains how he wants to do it, now they are taking a closer look on if it can work.

hello, i am ray swarez, that hasn't had all that much time to get used to being out of iraq, that the u.s. has go back this time it is only to get them ready again, to defend itself from the frill la army that controls big chunks of iraq. training syrians and fighting from the air, with partners doing a lot of the heavy lifting along with the u.s.,s it's the recipe for success barack obama gave a people ready for action, but still cautious after the last time. >> i will not he is tave to take action in syria, as well as iraq. first, we will conduct a systematic campaign of air strikes against these terrorists. sek, we will increase our support to force fighting on the ground. third, we will continue to draw on our substantial counter terrorism opportunities to prevent attacks. fourth, we will continue

to provide humanitarian assistance to innocent civilian whose have been displaced by the terrorist organization. so this is our strategy. >> and it is in this next phase of the role in iraq, where the problems began long before his presidency. obama fulfilled his campaign pledge, getting american troops out of iraq, in 2011. but he has been under immense pressure to react to the islamic states destructive crew yade in iraq, and to weaken the groups strong hold in syria. the iraqi military is fighting islamic state forts on the ground now, slowly taking back much of the country's north and west. just wednesday, iraq's defense ministry releases this video of troops retaking the district in the province. >> these areas were part of the islamic militants who had crossed the border, there were about 150 in this area, that

have been captures. >> but the military still needs help, so much of western iraq was overrun by the militants in the first place, because iraqi troops fled. so the president's battle plan to secure iraq and protect america is a counter terrorism campaign. he promised there will be no u.s. combat troops involved in the fighting and instead regional soldiers train and supported by the u.s. >> this campaign will waged through a steady relentless effort to take out isil wherever they exist using our air power, and our support for partners forces on the ground. >> the u.s. will send 457 million military advisers to iraq, and build a coalition of arab countries to join the front lines.

the iraqi forces himselfs, some of it has to be retrained but we are confident together with the efforts of other countries involved that will happen, and it will be sufficient. he is hesitated to do the same in syria. only modestly supported what it called moderate rebels in their fight with president al-asaad. now the solution is to identify, train, and arm those rebels. >> we cannot rely on the reare jet stream to terrorists it's own people. a regime that will never regain the legitimacy it has lost. instead, we must strengthen the opposition.

what risks come with putting more fire power into the hands of desperate fighting groups. how can the u.s. be sure the rebels are trains won't become another threat. the safety, armed security, depends upon our willingness to do what it takes to defend this nation, and uphold the values that we stand for. timeless ideas. will endure long after those that offer late and destruction, have been advantagished from the earth. this time, a closer look at then't cooer insurgency plans. training the iraqis to defend their own country from the islamic state, and finding then training. who aren't terrorists to go after the i.s. in their home bait in syria.

all while american forces fight from the air. joins us from that conversation. senior fellow for middle east security at the atlantic council, rick brannon former adviser for the military in iraq. director of the middle east for democracy, is also a former adviser to the government. gentlemen, welcome. let me start with you. this idea of vetting rebel groups inside syria, then having them trained by the saudis to fight the state in syria. as easy as the president made it sound last night.

that's not exactly it, you are dealing with the army, that calls himself a state. it's got significant resources. it control as lot of territory. i have little confidence to engage in the activities, but that doesn't mean they don't have a role whatsoever. they do have influence over the tribes in iraq. some influence over some of the rebels in syria. but my focus would be more on turkey and jordan. that's what i would lean on to vet, identify, and further provide military support to rebels that are based today in aleppo. >> back inside syria.

>> absolutely. >> that challenge has not evacuated. all of a sudden, there is now i hope a new commitment to step up that effort. let's see what it really produced. >> you set them lose in syria. a trained arm group, what do you do then. >> i think this is a real challenge for the administration. as you just mentioned. the president now will be a counter terrorism mission. and when he says that, he means targeted terrorists the same way they have done in somalia, and yemen as he said on the program, but that's -- has been ineffective, so what do we do after we train them. and we get them on the ground, who do they fight? are they fighting -- isil, or are they fighting the asaad regime. and to what extent are they going to have the capabilities necessary to

conduct those type of operations without having some additional support, u.s. military support to help them integrate into the broader operation. i don't see how this works out. >> as long as you are equipping them, i guess they can't become autonomous, they have no support of their own. >> no support of their own, probably no ability to operate effectively with add jason units. they have no ability to communicate with aircraft that is supposed to be supporting them. unless you have capabilities embedded with them. to include boots on the ground. >> early on in this, it was recognized that just going after the so called islamic state in iraq, was uhn't going to work, if they could simply withdraw back into syria. are you relieved that the president seems ready to widen the front and include syria in this operation? >>

id sounds to me like -- this is not somalia and yemen, the resources they have the dynamic they created in the reare john, the thousands of people that are pouring in,s the roads they have inside may lead to some ebbs at the present time jordan. the expertise they manages to gather, this is a formidable enemy. i would not dismiss them and assume that by unleashing few militias after them, or hitting them by air, they will disappear. they will not disappear. this is going to be long term. entrenched. and my assumption the

more you get others to sign off on doing this, and get them involved and in the neighborhood, the more chances you have in dealing with it. it is way beyond iraq, and it cannot be fixed by air. >> you sound a little skeptical about using the comparison to yemen in those two countries drones were used in order to decapitate al-shabaab and al quaida. the idea was to continue to take out the leadership and you neutralize the effectiveness, is that true. >> we all know that such radical movement of add kyle da, and it's different franchises.

so to me, from my perspective, we need to be careful on are we feeding them. or are we uprooting them. >> quickly, do you share the concern about making a parallel to somalia. >> i do. this is like killing one bee at a time, even though you are dealing with a massive beehive, drone attacks will not be sufficient. i hope in his speech, he didn't really mean to say there will be exclusive reliance on air strikes. i think there are other means. that i am hoping he would use should he be ready to launch military attacks. no harm using bombers also, there is a more intense campaign, the air strikes by themselves will certainly not be efficient.

i am not even talking about the economics of it. >> the united states made a new one. that is is one that crumpled in the face of the offensive, what is going to be different this time. stay with us uh.

the most important money stories of the day might effect your savings, your job or your retirement. whether it's bail-outs or bond rates this stuff gets complicated. but don't worry. i'm here to take the fear out of finance. every night on my show i break down confusing financial speak and make it real.

this time on the program, training up new forces on the ground to push back against the gorilla army, while the u.s. press it is fight from the air. that's the plan, but what is the united states learned in it's last experience in iraq that is going to help us not make the same mistakes this time around? >> that's a great question, and the problem is if you look back to where we were in 2011, we knew that the iraqis had significant short falls in areas like logistics maintenance communications, intelligence, operation gnat planning. and when the military is planning to leave, they recommended leaving 24,000 troops in order to

continue the missions that were necessary to get the iraqis to point where they are able to stand on their own. when you look at the very small number of troops that they are engaging. at this point, there appears to be no ability to be able to conduct that type of advice train and assist missions. that have essentially disintegrated since the end of may. i don't see how this worked out, with the unwilling to devote more resources to accomplish this. >> but the task you just set out also sounds like one that take as long time. >> lit take a long time, the united states hassing to willing to stay engaged. iraq, if you look at the missions of having a strong stable self-reliant iraq, that always meant having a long term commitment, between the united states and the government of iraq.

question i think we have to be prepared to do this for a long time. >> how long? three months, three years in five years, what are we talking about? >> i think any time you put an end date on a strategy, the artificially constrain that which you need to do. with the purpose this is what we are going to achieve, and sufficient time. if it takes ten years if that is what is necessary to protect our interests. then you spent ten years to do it, you don't put an artificial date on leaving. >> the new iraqi prime minister. says they are all onboard. the new iraqi government is ready to support this mission. >> are you skeptical when

you hear that. >> i think compared to where we were two monos ago, where we started from, i think he made substantial progress. that is real, compared to where we were. compared to where we need to be, i think there is still distance to cover. up until now the two most critical ministries are not felt. the minister of defense and interior, these are where the guns are, where the armed vehicles move in, and go to neighborhood and arrest people, and do everything. and unless the sunnies and the rest of the nation have confident, they look to those two ministries as national ministries. unless that happens, i think iraq is not out of trouble.

supports say what brought the saudis in off the sidelines, was the appointment of hider as the new prime minister that that was a necessary precondition. to move aside in order to restart. >> i think it is a genuine shift, it is not nominal. i think it is a different politician, and a leader all together. they are now working with the threat, inside saudi arabia, who can turn against the house, and i think that makes the threat existential to the saudis. >> on the last edition of this program, it was noted that germany for the first time since the second world war, which is getting to be a long time ago now. is aiding a country outside it's borders

militarily aiding one side in a military conflict. this is a big deal. it's the kurdish army, does that complicate the future picture of iraq. >> it certainly is a hot topic as well for the syrians. i don't want to say that -- look, the kurdss have been a huge partner. for the united states, and even for the iraqi government. there is been a shift in attitude from baghdad to the kurdss given the threat posed by isis. there's been a conflicting relationship for a long time, but given the threat that they have been facing there's been a much less adversarial relationship, and this is -- this gives us hope for a better relationship in the future, i think that the issue of independents would have to be postponed, this has to be deferred, it is still a very hot topic.

wait a minute, that sort of says they will talk about that down the road. it is what he has been gunning for for decades. >> and frankly, not to say that we should go ahead and ask for a referendum, and see who really wants inspects, i bet you the majority wants it, and they are also smart enough to know there is cause for pushing for independents. i think they would want something along the lines of taiwan. not really confronting the community. to go for it on the basis, i think there are more pressing issues as far as finances and distribution of oil. as far as further decentralization, and really being part an effective part of the

iraqi body political. the issue of independent could be deferred i am not sure it is a pressing priority for them today. it would have to be discussed down the road. >> they will be pack with more inside story after this short break, there's a big difference between the plans to continue battling the islamic state from the air, and training forces to do it on the ground. timeframe, what will the u.s. be doing in the meantime. as iraqi army 2.0 is trains and a nonterrorrist syrian resistant is vetted and prepared? stay with us. >> a new episode of the ground breaking series, edge of eighteen >> just because your pregnant don't mean your life's ended. >> intense pressure... >> i don't know if this whole dance thing will work out. >> tough realities... >> we chicago ch-iraq, because we have more killings... >> life changing moments... >> shut the camera.... >> from oscar winning director, alex gibney, a hard hitting look at the real issues facing american teens. the incredible journey

continues... on the edge of eighteen only on all jazeera america

news... we are assessing the plans outlined by the president in his speech to the nation, for defeating the so called islamic state. still with us, senior fellow from middle east

security at the atlantic council. former adviser for the u.s. military,s is also a political scientist at the rand corporation. the president took great pains to reensure that the country was not getting emeshed again. they are now talking to an entirely american audience, do you want to at least start getting them ready for the idea that this is going to be longer and more complicated than the president was telling them last night. >> well, i mean the -- i think the president hinted, clearly, that it is going to take longer to conclude this business. nobody has the illusion that this is going to take a few months. i think it will take years. especially bearing in mind that going into syria will be very

selective and up until now there is no understanding or agreement. so my -- my hunch is that this is going to take a long time. and it is going to get messier, and there will be a lot of backlash. pause of that -- and there is going to be messsy. it is not a clean cut war by which we can preserve our position. and just to take some financial involvement. >> rick, can the united states keep it's promise not to revolve ground troop in the that part of the world. >> i think it would be impossible to achieve the objectives that the president set out, without the engainment of troops on the ground. if you simply look at the period from 2004 and 2010, when the united states and iraq were countering -- al quaida

and iraq at that point, it took tremendous effort from our counter terrorism, and cooperation to finally expel them and get to the point where they are nearly defeated. to think that the iraqis can do this on their own, without the engangment of our counter terrorism, without forces to advise, crane and assist and perhaps without the engangment of special operation forces i think it is a fanciful idea, that can just never achieve the objectives. >> but very quickly, doesn't sound like americans are ready for that. >> it is unclear. i think that the beheadings that were shown on the t.v., fundamentally changed public opinion. in terms of the threat posed by this organization. and that we needed to do this to protect our friends and allies and it's partner organizations that has real threat or potential

threats to u.s. homeland and security individuals, i think the americans would support this. >> it's long been said that plans don't survive the first shot. what the president lays out last night. >> well, first disrupt the enemy. right, this has to be happening on a sustained bases. i think this is achievable. you have to be on the offensive. to keep it on the run, but the ping that would take a long time, and this is what we all agree on, is the actual defeat of the organization. and by the organization, we mean also the ideology itself. and that will require fixing the politics of syria and iraq which will take a long time, be uh the disruption of the enemy to prevent it from growing in new capabilities and posing a threat to the homeland. nonexistence by the way. that will require sustained efforts military efforts to disrupt it. >> again, barack obama stressed the need of the people of that area to do

most of the work. they will have to do it because this is the region, it is their lives. everything is at stake for them. >> from the atlantic council, lathe, and rick brenneman, thank you all. good to talk to you. >> that brings us to the end of this edition of inside story, thank you for being with us, the program may be over, be uh the conversation continues we want to hear what you think about the issues raised on this show. are you ready as an american for reengangment in some form in iraq or syria, for that matter, log on to our facebook page send us your thoughts on twitter the handle is a. j. inside story a.m., or you can reach me directly, at ray swarez news, we will see you for the next inside story, in washington, i'm ray swarez.

announcer: this is al jazeera. hello, welcome to the newshour, i'm darren jordan in doha with the top stories. britain's prime minister promises to hunt down the islamic state group fighters that murdered an humanitarian aid worker. a u.s. citizens sentenced to six years hard labour in north korea - details later. thousands stranded by a flood in pakistan. we'll have the