forensic we're can it's ridiculous just tell us what happened and in my opinion you know the united states government that was committed to the values that we should be standing up for would be saying that. we wouldn't be sending people over to. smile next to the crown prince. we wouldn't. be raising ridiculous theories about rogue operators we would be saying we need the facts and we need them yesterday and then we can figure out what the right policy and some top u.s. politicians are already doubting the explanation put out by the saudis here's what republican senator lindsey graham tweeted to say that i'm skeptical of the new saudi narrative about mr bush shows he is an understatement first they were told mr shoji supposedly left the consulate and there was a blanket denial of any saudi involvement now a fight breaks out and he's killed in the consulate all without knowledge of the

crown prince had a claim joins me live from washington d.c. so patty president donald trump says that he finds the story credible obviously lindsey graham doesn't this doesn't really same to be going over well in places like washington. no it doesn't and i can tell you all of the cable news channels all the front pages of the web site web pages on twitter pretty much every politician that you follow is coming out and saying this doesn't make any sense for many of the reasons that andrew pointed out that this gentleman of his age would get into a fist fight with young outnumbered with young saudi operatives that he would be accidentally killed that they would happen to be a forensic expert that had just flown in on private jets and they happen to have a bone saw basically what we're hearing from politicians is this doesn't make sense we've just saw senator rand paul tweet out that it is time to end u.s.

military arms sales aid and also cooperation with saudi arabia so we're seeing two different lines emerge forseen present donald trump and he has from the beginning he said this is all about the money this is all about arms deal the only difference in his stance is it seems every day he's claiming that the saudi arabia spending more and more money in the united states it went from one hundred ten billion to you just said four hundred fifty billion dollars worth of things ordered saying that it created six hundred thousand jobs in the united states i think it's important to point out that there's absolutely no evidence that that is in fact the truth most fact checkers will tell you they found a tiny fraction of that is being spent by saudi arabia but this is a narrative that the president keeps trying to send out his to his supporters that this was a big deal that he made the deal his big business ackermann really paid off and americans are working in the factories again because of it so he is sending the message even with this story that the saudis have put out that he is not skeptical

of that he wants to hear more information he wants to hear from the crown prince but right now he seems to be sending the message that he's willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. scuse me what can congress do to have a a forceful say and how this all plays out. well congress a number of senators have already invoked the magnitsky act that was obviously named for a russian dissident basically what that means is the white house has one hundred twenty days of four months to come back after an investigation and say whether mr. human rights were violated if they were by whom then those people will face sanctions the united states they can have their property forfeited one thing that people in congress are talking more and more about and there were calls for this even before this incident they're saying that it is time for the u.s. military to stop helping the saudi arabia coalition in yemen. right now the u.s. is supplying some bombing targets refueling capabilities it's not at all clear that

saudi arabia would be able to continue the pace of its bombing campaign in yemen without that crucial u.s. support so we could see a resolution from the senate saying that needs to and we could see bills from both houses of congress if they get enough of majority that the president wouldn't be able to veto that i think right now what we're hearing most though is the congress is saying they want to see sanctions and we've seen this once before with the president where he said there was no need to sanction russia the congress got together they had such an overwhelming support that the president couldn't possibly veto it because they would have just overridden his veto so it's not at all clear that the president is going to get is way on this he is sounding a more conciliatory conciliatory tone with congress saying he's going to talk to them he's going to take their advice but i can tell you that people in congress say that if he doesn't act they're going to so we'll see what happens i think it's important to point out this story is not fading from the headlines it is by far the longest foreign policy story of the trim presidency and it shows no signs of fading

from the spotlight how do you how challenging has it banned for members of congress to get actual information that the intelligence community knows about what happened . well it's been pretty remarkable we heard we heard from senator bob corker he's the chairman of the foreign relations committee that's a powerful committee he's entitled to very sensitive information he came out this week and said it's unheard of but he asked for briefings from the intelligence agencies both monday and tuesday and that he was denied that he could force their hand the senate could force the intelligence community hand but there's an it seems there is an active move underway to try and make sure that what u.s. intelligence knows is not shared with congress now i can tell you the intelligence community doesn't often like to share with congress because whatever they tell them is often leaked immediately to the media but we've been hearing a lot in this case about turkish intelligence sources from there less about u.s. intelligence although there have been some reports that they believe that the crown

prince of saudi arabia mohamed bin solve did have some knowledge or at least phone calls were made to numbers that he would have been for military with that's about the extent of the leaks but keep in mind what we know thanks to edward snowden about the vast u.s. security surveillance system it seems highly unlikely that they don't know a lot more than what we're hearing so far atika hang with the latest in washington patty thank you the united nations secretary general antonio terrace has released a statement about the new details that have emerged in this is what he is saying that he is deeply troubled by the confirmation of death and extends his condolences to his family and friends he stresses the need trade prompt a thorough and transparent investigation into the circumstances of the show to his death and full accountability for those responsible as editor of the international interest he joins us now via skype from london so who drives this this this push now samy to actually get to the truth who who or what.

i think it's very interesting that you put the question as drive towards the truth i think this case is a drive towards a deal that will be made between the turks the saudis and the us and each one is trying to get the maximum out of this deal turkey wants to escape political and economic isolation imposed on it by donald trump or stenciling because of this whole past the issue the us wants the issue to die quickly because it has mutual interests not just with saudi arabia but with mohamed bin selman specifically let's remember that might have been cement is an intense player in jericho his deal of the century in applying unprecedented arab pressure on the palestinians to accept impossible israeli conditions and have a businessman is the supposed bulwark against iran and saudi arabia king said man is desperate to save his son who in recent days has looked susceptible to a coup mystically let's remember that compare when he visited the area according to

some reports he essentially told him a big man in his very straight talking manner that your future as king is under threat and this is what leads me to believe that the statement that comes out from saudi arabia was not necessarily done in liaising lives on with the us or indeed with turkey i think this statement is a last gasp from. all chips on the table a do or die approach gambling with everything the reason why i say this is because one of the said man has thrown his closest aides his closest allies under the bus through some of the bunny who is one of his right hand men who in november last year said i do nothing without the permission of my beloved crown prince and as it was considered the most competent in the state's intelligence apparatus and the loss of as it is a big blow for saudi arabia intelligence i think that the reason the statement came out specifically today is because donald trump raised the. question marks over

whether turkey actually has recordings what you have a busy man has essentially that is it belonged to the turks. so when trump yesterday or two days ago said that i haven't seen any tapes yet maybe they exist possibly they exist i don't think they exist he put that he essentially put pressure on the turks to prove that they actually have such tapes businessman is writing this is now the onus is on turkey to prove that it has i mean the states and the problem with these tapes is if they reveal these tapes then they have to essentially declare that they're spying or embassies that's a diplomatic process or they have to find evidence in this investigation that they're conducting and it seems from the information coming out that they haven't found anything concrete so now the ball is in turkey mr man has said this is my narrative don't trip as indicated i'm ready to run with it now it's up to turkey to show either the narrative is true or if they can't show it's true they need to quickly come to some sort of deal some sort of arrangement in order to escape this political and economic isolation where i think the biggest were sort of go no go

ahead. i was going to say i think the biggest tragedy that we're looking at case now is that turkey might have overplayed its hand and it might look for an exit card and this exit card would be a deal in which perhaps their investigation somehow falls in line with some of the narrative that the saudis have come out with and we'll see this issue slowly go to bed simply because there is a lack of evidence that definitively links. to this particular issue i do reiterate as i've said like numerous times in al-jazeera this issue for turkey u.s. and saudi arabia is not to do with human rights or freedom of the press or about jennifer shockey for turkey it's about escaping political economic isolation for truck is about protecting her a big interest with saudi arabia and for saudi arabia it's about killing dissidents and imprisoning them with impunity as they've done with sentimental over there so they manage their wish are over the got me there as is a previous awful how early all of these other figures who remain in prison nobody knows where they are this is just about protecting have a businessman over

a blunder overstepping the mark let me ask you this how much how much pressure as a hammer then someone on their own internally and saudi if any. i think he's under immense pressure i think the reason being is because this is the first time that there's been talk within saudi arabia and within the arab world of potential replacement of mohammed besom and this is actually quite unprecedented and rumors have actually been going around that man has been holed up in his palace . that he has been preventing other princes from gathering together because he feels that they're gathering to discuss possible replacements not only that when the for me a former cia chief john brennan who was a former i work for crown prince mohammed bin nayef comes out and says there's no room for mohammed and that he should step aside as well this is cause a lot of concern for. this is why i describe the statement as a in a poker game somebody puts all their chips in the middle one missile man is going

her and then of course you go hour ago he's put everything on the table his secretary thrown his allies under the bus he's sacrificed those who are mostly loyal to him to save his skin he essentially said to the turks now prove the id if you can't prove it then shut up this is what i have a business actually doing and the problem for don't fought for and again for turkey is don't trump seems to be on board with the saudis turkey released the passage of the u.s. but didn't get any economic relief in return now the dynamics are shifting slightly we're talking a lot about how the story has holes in it but history shows this is a region this is a region where sisi opened fire on thousand the protesters killed hundreds of them and got away with it this is a region where s.n. has killed and made huge millions of refugees from the syrian people and he got away with it this is a region where he can easily get away with murder why because the international community only reacts when the u.s. reacts if there is no desire from the u.s. to punish saudi arabia there will be no desire for france or germany so what is

really interesting now is this what do the turks do when they release these tapes and what will congress do when the u.s. forces donald trump to take a tougher. saudi arabia all watching. and israeli might be succeeded in protecting mama been so mad and protecting this incredible prince who has given concessions to us like no other prince before ok sami handy for us in london sami thank you james harris director of the gulf studies center at qatar university he joins us here in doha were you surprised that u.s. president donald trump said that he found the the version of events that jamal khashoggi got into a fistfight when there are room with fifteen trained professionals in the room were you surprised that he sell bluntly said that he found that to be credible i'm not surprised because i do believe that. the president and his secretary of state they

wanted to protect some of the sentiment and that's the reason why the president sent them to riyadh to one hour discussion on the matter and travel twenty four hours flying from washington to the op i have no doubt that from the beginning the administration was facing a real challenge because they were facing one narrative coming from ankara and they had no other. and i think they pushed for the so days to have their own narrative is one. piece of information which is i think it has to deal with the information available to the americans by the intelligence by the cia cia did confirm that they have information about a plan to get rid of they have. basically they have a concern about contests between. individual within the so the idea is so there they were piece of information here and there with them and with american hands but

maybe they have not realized that it will lead to the killing of. i think there's no doubt the mistake in washington wanted to have two people who had been so man and to protect them had been so much but the problem they faced they have two important element within the political scene in washington the media and the congress they will they had a different song to basically they had a different view on what's happening and that's the reason why we found white house and the severe pressure from the first minute of the event and they have to seize all of this turn and that's what that's the reason why we saw that president trump in the first two three days he was actually having a very tough statement against saudi arabia when he said you know there will be a severe punishment if something happened to. the and you know the saudis are responsible of that so that it was no doubt that this is this is a support to the saudis to bring their narrative to the scene so at least they can

counter the negative coming from ankara if they thought that this announcement if saudi arabia thought that this announcement would tamp things down it seems very clear already even in the hours just a few hours since this announcement that the exact opposite is going to happen there is going to be a lot of scrutiny on this version of events a lot of questions some of the most basic ones being where is his body do you think that this is going to hold up i don't think so because they always say the details because the people know they have the title the soldier admitted that he was killed in the consulate and the consulate itself did you tweet on the tenth of october three times that they are actually considering. the turkish claim that it is a vehicle this so now they. admit that he was killed in the consulate and he was basically and the eighteen people responsible of that so by saying this basically there would be more question to come as we say devil's in details you know who are

those people what are their jobs are they settled in out of the this is the end of stumbled or are they come come to come from up you know what is that was the nature of the job what does that relate to the relation between them and the the the. order is by the king this tonight about you know i mean there are syrians who are the qahtani and the other three major general within the intelligence community why then why why there is a need to restructure the intelligence if it is a normal fight within the consulate there are lowered to the questions and i think the saudis they have to face this wasn't the people wake up in the world today and they would have all of these questions and there's a as you mention the question about the body that according to the reuters just a few minutes few minutes ago. so did a source did confirm that they have no information about the body so how the how

and what is the meaning of admission that you know he was killed in that consulate but there is nobody what is the body who's was sponsored so there are a lot of question will appear and they so did they would have they would find themselves and the them and this pressure from international community but again let's go back to the point it is a previously michel when i said the message is to washington to tom if you if you look at the time the action as he waited for the guests the time he picked the statement and he started actually trying to publicize it and see you know and said you know he's dealing convents of this narrative but let's see the action from the congress the action from the from the. from the media people the media people i think they they will. the the people who are putting pressure on them the solution not only in washington but also in the world i mean today is sort of the to motor on sunday our holy day in europe but we expect more of the actions of from different countries to the world these kind of minutes ok i should say harry thank

you so much money we'll get back to you in just a moment karen greenberg is a director of the center of national security at fordham university school of law she joins us via skype and westchester and new york state and i want to put the same question to you there will be obviously more questions not fewer questions now that this this narrative is coming out karen. it will this stand up will or will it can this narrative continue to to change and evolve. it's hard to imagine this narrative and this stand up for very long if because it contradicts what was first said and so the question is what's going to be contradictory to come down the pike in the future it may be that this is the narrative that the saudis think suits their interests the best and that this is when they're going to stick with but i agree with your guest that this the pushback is not just going to come from the white house it's going to come from everywhere it's going to come from journalist

it's going to come from i think many of the human rights people around the world i think it's going to come hopefully from the congress but it's hard to say with our congress that they do protest and then sometimes but i think look we've seen changes in the narrative from day one we're going to probably see more changes in the narrative and the real question has to be cruised giving us the narrative and what investigation is it based upon and who's who's doing the fighting and if it's the person who is thought to be in charge of what went wrong or what was planned all along whatever it is that's not a good investigation you need somebody outside the story to conduct the investigation and i think that is what the white house need to poll for and that's what the rest of the world will most likely call for king solomon has obviously demonstrated a real commitment to bahamas and zalman to june anticipate that. that's

a that's a really good question i think that's been the question in many people's minds for these seventeen days where was the king come down and i think it could have gone either way to some some experts but i think that this looks like he's going to back him and i think that's going to cause a ripple throughout the rest of the world because if there was some kind of hope that he would not support him that seems at least for the last few hours the last day or so to have two to have been solved but again i think we'll see i think when something's we least in the middle of the night you know you're there time the question is why what went on was it panic is some has said was it strategy to control the news in the united states for example some have said or is there something else that might happen that they wanted to get this out of time so i'm i'm i think there's a lot we still don't know and i wouldn't take anything including where the king

stands supposedly as the final word what does turkey having to balance and all of this now my turkey has to has to balance its own future turkey has to balance its relationship with other countries including the united states turkey has to balance its own trajectory to trying to make a claim of more prominence in the arab and muslim world not the article in the in the muslim world of plenty so i think they are on a very very. thin tightrope and and they're it's so many considerations going on and i think you know in the beginning they have at this information they still have this information how they're going to use it whether they have more information how they're going to use that remains to be seen can really appreciate you joining us for the last few hours of this story has had as its to palatal call on you again thank you you thank. ok we'll take

a quick break now we'll be back in a few moments with more in our special coverage in this news hour the death of saudi journalist mark churchy. from briskness i'm sure it's. to the one trying to it's of southeast asia. hello the rain is building over the southeastern parts of china at the moment predominantly there's a lot of dry weather to be found a good deal of cloud there with the no often that will be thick enough to give us a few outbreaks of rain i think as we had three saturday so bits of particularly heavy rain making its way towards the who bay province wettest of the weather here but ahead of that should be largely fine quite bright as well in shanghai with maximum temperature of twenty three further towards the south there's some rather brisk winds that are bringing in a lot of moisture there so do expect a fair amount of rain for the northern parts of vietnam also the southern parts of

seeing quite a lot of heavy rain at the moment and the main focus of that rain is making its way over parts of cambodia in towards thailand there as we head into saturday so saturday and sunday both looking pretty wet for this region expect some heavy rain and at times funny persistent to go further south that will also be some showers here but in between some good spells of sunshine too that's forcing k.l. and singapore as well for the south largely fine and dry force in java jakarta there getting to around thirty five degrees out towards the west and for most of us across india and pakistan is fine and dry at the moment it's just in the fossil been parts of india and through sri lanka we've got the showers and those are likely to stick around over the next few days as well so some of these a lot need to be pretty heavy. the weather sponsored by cats are at peace. on behalf of her majesty's government i apologize reservedly a historic apology for one of british intelligence is dark a step as there was a growing agreement of that the libyans could be quite useful to the west seven

years after the death of gadhafi al-jazeera world investigates western collusion with the libyan security services. gadhafi rendition and the west on al-jazeera. challenge your perceptions. powerful documentaries i've. accepted by our. debate some discussions you've been out there with the protesters on the streets what are they been telling you. discover a wealth of award winning programming from around the. see the well from a different perspective. on al-jazeera. you're

watching al-jazeera let's recap the story that we are following for you saudi arabia has confirmed that journalist and critic jamal khashoggi was killed inside its consulate in istanbul on october second it says his death was the result of a brawl inside the building riyadh says eighteen saudi nationals have been arrested and two senior saudi officials have been fired one of them met alice sciri was the deputy chief of intelligence and advisor to the saudi crown prince mohammed bin sultan the other and was fired the south the tani he was an advisor to the oil or. gas president donald trump says saudi arabia is announcement of jamal khashoggi step is a good first step he says what happened was unacceptable but he thinks the saudi version of events is profitable. so this is our saudi state media announced his

death i thought at the gotten a while ago let the i will tell me about what i'ma the first investigation by prosecutors regarding the disappearance of saudi citizen jamal khashoggi shows a discussion between him and the people you met while he was at the saudi consulate in istanbul led to an argument and quarrels with cultural jews which caused the saudi prosecutors announce that the investigation regarding this case is still ongoing with the rest of eight hundred saudi nationals in order to reveal what took place for the public and punish those responsible in this case and take them to justice. as a saudi activists based in seattle washington she joins us via skype right now also the version of events in saudi arabia is saying first first said knowledge that he was killed in the consulate but saying that it happened as a result of a fistfight how do you see that happening process that information.

and there has got to. hurt in the story firstly her he got out and we're in our last. it's a difference. to me about this point that were very. it's pretty much as i don't believe it it's not really credible and i've seen an international investigation. to determine the true. cost and present. us president said that he does find it credible and if he is in that particular place. how difficult do you see it being to actually get a different type of investigation. i don't think it's really difficult at all actually

congress has already demanded it or it most of all senators already signed magnitsky act and wanted to activate it in case anything does come out and them from asia is not credible and i don't think that the president's trying to word it is enough especially with this global outrage from all over the world are skeptical about this as they should so i don't and it's impossible i think it's very do we should pursue. what how how do you think that other journalists and critics and activists indeed should be feeling right now how do you think they are feeling how are you feeling about this outraged outraged. people i mean this is very sad. you're pretty much as president and not taken as

this is a clear and open season you know this is putting all of us into really not just activists journalists and anyone who's mind whether you're saudi or not and that's not fair to any of us and to you know. as we have an arm steal what is not fair to anyone and it's not really shared american roundtable. what would you like to see happen in the relationship between the u.s. and saudi arabia recalibration a severing of that what would you like to see. i would like to see an objective i don't like to see i wouldn't want to see. how many instead of making this a casual relationship or i'll cover up occur. for each other i would like it to be factual and to actually help in the bottom of this and have

a transparent and best against and look at evidence and proof so everybody can have the peace of mind knowing what actually happened how do you how are people and in saudi arabia seeing this perceiving this feeling about this. internet and my friends who are honestly worried for us many people who are afraid to speak out and feel like it's at the point where you know you keep your mouth shut keep your head down are your dish are arrested so it's it's really do or die. do you think that the truth will at some point come out maybe not now but do you think at some point the truth will come out i do i do and it was. as just a matter of time but i do you can people should matter. a great and outrage and

speak up about it because we need. every voice matters it's bad enough that all of course is our silence and president we don't hear from them because now we want to say anything because that they said the status quo. is global outrage is very much needed it's needed to help the ones back home and to reshape the narrative and to change the situation or else we're all going to end hostage to the street alec. thank you very much for joining us we appreciate it thank you. josh mills the executive director at the arab center of washington d.c. hole why small fry and fast saudi arabia facts and as not add up doesn't make sense. it's just mind boggling that after all this preparation and

revisiting the issue that they will come up with a story like that. there are tapes frankly and i hope that turkish government soon would release those tapes and they are both you know and video even though they deny the existence of that video at least one of the agencies in turkey does have that and has shared only a small segment of it with u.s. counterparts just the last twenty four hours that video shows exactly what happened is a man who was entered the building he met for a few minutes with the consul general to discuss his papers that he needed and he was immediately attacked by this gang of killers that were sent specifically to stumble to to actually liquidate him it wasn't an accidental death it wasn't a fist fight to the point where the consul general on tape is allegedly screen.