tv The Bottom Line Al Jazeera May 21, 2021 10:30am-11:00am +03
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it was a toaster, but you know, of course we're mostly concerned about what is happening next to our borders. know, why is our closest neighbor with which we have very good relations. however, problems linked to the escalation of military political tension remain because of foreign troops in norway and in the baltic region. if the baltic, you only last month, no way agreed with united states to all, to see a lot of territorial control in the form of military bases. 4 of them which do not state have an interest in and obviously the objective is quite, quite clear that would like to use this, this presence in norway in order to challenge russia and are at the end of the council. the ceremonial gamble was passed on to russia, which intends to use its chairmanship to prioritize sustainable development in the far north. but of course, any development strings, environmental impact friction between the natural human worlds and increasingly the possibility of political and even military conflict. pull brennan al jazeera
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ah exactly half past the hour. let's recap the top stories for you. a ceasefire between israel and hamas does appear to be holding. it came into effect on friday after 11 days of fighting, which killed more than $230.00 palestinians. 12 people died in israel, harry force it has worn out from west jerusalem, both the israelis and the leadership of hamas claiming victory. hamas is saying that it exacted concessions out of israel both in terms of israeli activities in shaquira and on the alex are most compound known as the temple mount to jews. the israelis are entirely denying that saying it is a lie. the ready line is that hamas has been put back by years. that's what the defense minister benny guns says in terms of these strikes on the tunnels on
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missile production on senior commanders to in turn, hamas is denying that saying that their men proudly striding through the tunnels as we speak. the news of the ceasefire has been met with celebrations across the palestinian territories displaced families with become returning to their homes following news. the truce us president joe biden welcomed the agreement, saying, israelis and palestinians deserve to live in peace. he says, washington will continue to support israel militarily and pledged humanitarian aid to palestinians in garza local media, atlanta. and me and mom are reporting that the political party of the state leader on some suit. she is being dissolved by the countries electoral commission, the commission, which was appointed by military rulers following the coo and february, accused the party of electro fraud. you are right up to speed with all the top stories up next, the bottom line. i'll have more news on this channel in 30 minutes. i'll see you then. i am sorry, i should be about raising prices
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a harley down to the government. we bring you the stories and developments that are rapidly changing the world. we live in time in that says, i don't have a boss. has the task of fixing a war torn economy? counting the cost on al jazeera, i am steve clements, i have a question. is the democratic parties traditionally rock solid support for israel slowly eroding. let's get to the bottom line. ah. when president joe biden got to the white house, he had a long list of priorities that he wanted to tackle. and the palestine israel issue was probably competing for last place on that list. but he always does that open wound of the palestinian israeli conflict has a way of forcing itself onto the world's agenda. and now biden is facing calls from within his own party to really address it. the u. s. president finally called for a cease fire. after about 10 israelis and $200.00 palestinians were killed, including scores of women and children. but the administration has mostly
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emphasized strong support for israel and issued some mild statements expressing concern about the loss of life on both sides. the bite, white house is also blocked, the un security council resolution, criticizing israel for the hostilities. 3 separate times. there's been a harsh criticism of israel not only by progressive members of congress and even centrist like foreign relations committee, chairman senator bob minette as are now demanding that bite and do more. some american see a change in the dynamic of the palestine. israel issue in the united states, but are things really changing. today we speak the university of michigan history, professor juan cole, whose influential blog on u. s. foreign policy in the middle east turns 20 years old. next year. it's called informed comment, and it's a must read blog on this crisis professor called before we begin, i had a chance to ask senator chris murphy about the biden administration stance on the bloodshed in palestine and israel. do we have tools in our tool kit that can help the u. s. b inflow. so this time because we seem to have been in this episode again
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and again and again. and the question is, do we have more latitude today after the abraham accords? do we have less latitude? what tools do we have? well, as you know, it's harder for us to influence events in israel or in the palestinian territories because of the lack of leadership on both sides that are interested in dialogue. unfortunately, netanyahu has been rewarded politically for moving further away from the palestinian state. equally, hamas has been rewarded for organizing militant opposition to israel, so we don't have the kind of brokers that we used to have in the region to get to a peaceful future. so well, we still have tools, right? we have leverage important security relationship with israel. important humanitarian relationship in the palestinian territories. we don't have the leadership there that we've had the fast. okay, so that was sen, chris murphy, democrat of connecticut, whom i caught up with in congress earlier today. now let's get to our discussion with fessor call one. let me just ask you,
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we've been discussing this for decades. are there elements of this particular crisis that seem different to you? the well, the differences primarily on the american side in the sense that you have had impassioned speeches of while mainly democrats on the left in congress, pretty roundly condemning the net 10 yellow government and israel for its actions in gaza. and not accepting the israeli narrative about these things, which is that this is merely a matter necessary as self defense are the issues are being re framed almost like black lives matter in terms of palestinian human rights. there is a change also in the middle east and that we have for the
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1st time in a long time seen solidarity across the green line. so the palestinians are striking today, not only in the west bank and gaza, but in israel proper, where 20 percent of the population is of palestinian heritage. so there is a cross border solidarity in the middle east. there is some solidarity with palestinian right. that doesn't necessarily mean a lack of sympathy for israeli wounded in congress. and this is not something we saw into 20142012 or earlier. you know, i think a lot of people are looking at, you know, what were the sparks of this was the grenades and the ox. um off was it be, you know, you know, the residents in east jerusalem that had been were being removed and now it's under supreme court review it when we kind of look, is it, is it
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a mahmoud abbas not postponing presidential elections yet again. but when you look at that origin, and you sort of look at joe biden, i have to say there's love loss between b, b, netanyahu and joe biden. what is your, how would you grade the, by the administration's response so far? because it seemed to me that he really said, you know, as a days before he called for a cease fire, and i'm not really sure yet what the u. s. position is. oh, there isn't any daylight between the biden administration and the not to know government on the issue of garza, the israelis are taking advantage of the height intentions and the firing of those little rockets from gaza to degrade mars military capabilities. and to do so without regard to civilian life in property. and probably although this is difficult to know for sure,
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some of the israeli actions and gods are intended just to make the gaza strip even more uninhabitable, to encourage emigration from it. but in any case, the burden administration has blocked un security council attempts to call for a cease fire and has given every support. israel announced $725000000000.00 or a $1000000.00 in, in through the military aid, right. in the middle of all this, there isn't any daylight between washington and israeli government on this issue. one, i want to play a clip for you of an exchange with net price, the spokesman of the state department. let's listen. i won't ask you, buddy jefferson, but the talk about what you said about the principle of self defense. does that in any way apply to the past? can you do?
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they have a right to self defense to palestinians have a right to self defense. i'm in broadly speaking side, we believe in the concept of self defense. we believe it applies to any state. i don't think that i certainly wouldn't want my words to be construed as i understand i want to do. i don't want to hop on this either, but you know, those rate is killed. 30 people just now. you know, including maybe 5 or 6 children, you condemned that you can condemn the killing of children side. i'm asking you condemn the killing apparel for new children. obviously, these reports are just emerging and i understand i was just speaking to the team. i understand we don't have independent confirmation of facts on the ground. yes, i'm very hesitant to get into reports that are just emerging. no, i think many people understand the notion of self defense and they understand that there's, you know, their issues on all sides of this. but when it gets to the horrific pictures that we have seen, of the death of women of young children,
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scores of them may be more than 100, as we, as we said earlier in the show. why is it so difficult for our officials to basically say that to red line? well, because the doctrine of force in self defense pertains to states are, according to the united nations charter. and the palestinians don't have a state of the self defense tense issue as the red herring. in the case, the issue is rights. the palestinians have no rights there. stainless, when you don't have a state, you have no court, you have no, you have no structures that guarantee your rights palestinians don't know if they own anything. is really can show up and take away their home. and the only recourse palestinians have at the moment is really court. sometimes we really military wards by which are on the whole and by and large, going to favor israeli things. and so they don't know if they actually own their
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own home. they don't know what rights they have and, and guys, at the moment they don't have a right to have a bookshop that may be blown up at any moment. and so this is the actual issue here is rights. and it's not a matter of self defense. the palestinians can't defend themselves, they're seamless. they don't have means to defend themselves. the world community is always talking about. last is a terrorist organization and him, us engages in terrorism occasionally. but the fact is that there are a few tens of thousands irregular militiamen who, if they actually went out to fight israeli army would all be killed in an afternoon . i'm os has been firing those little rockets at israel. most of them land in the desert or 3rd of them have landed inside garza, some of them have injured palestinians, but they're not an actual military force. and they've killed so far since i still
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of these began over a week ago, very tragically, because all life is precious, but they've killed le people then in some mass shooting attacks in the united states by one individual. so this is not a military confrontation. they're not, we're not talking about self defense here we're, we're, we're talking about occupation. we're talking about denial of rights many years ago, professor cole, we were together at a conference and the late now late national security advisors, big brzezinski, spoke there about a crisis sort of like this. and he said, look, this is like a killing hostages, that you know, these people are in the care, they're occupied by israel, and this is like killing hostages. and the, i'm quoting brzezinski, this, these are his views. but when you kind of look at that legacy of time at that moment, palestine always came, came up as
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a strategic fault line between the west and the arab world. that was, it was filled with that much consequence with the abraham accords. now with so many arab states having normalized with israel, one wonders if there's any strategic relevance in palestine any more. and whether it's just a moral play at this point. what are your views of that? because i, i remember you being in the room and brzezinski said that, but that was a moment when, when palestine and its fate seemed a matter more than it does strategically to the various stakeholders in the region . today. i would argue that the palestinian said never been strategically important and that's why they're in the position that they are. i've never been important to anyone to settle this issue and make sure that they don't remain stateless. there been lots of statements people, but their state listeners has been resolved by the international community because
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it's been recognized as a kind of atrocity tie when he's in japan and 971. when, when japan recognized the one china were left without you know, diplomatic recognition for a while, but eventually the japanese solve that problem in one way or another. but to palestinians, there are $5000000.00 of them who have been less state less inside the area controlled by israel plus the state was palestinians in lebanon, in syria, and even the palestinians in jordan, who were given citizenship. their citizenship is 2nd class citizenship and often fragile and 40000 of them had taken away from them not so long ago. so that's the big issue is that these people are state was and there's no o since since since egypt made peace with israel, which was a separate piece and the late 1970. or there's been no
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strategic player. any place that had an interest in protecting the house and one, richard hoss the president council on foreign relations has said that the that the real instigator of this was president mahmoud abbas, of palestine. who yet again postponed elections. he's been in office, you know, something like 1112 years past. he's going to his 12 years passed his 4th 4 year term. and that this created the dynamic where hamas wanted to demonstrate its muscle in strength and legitimacy to palestinians. what, what complicity does mahmoud abbas in the palestinian authority have for the conditions we see now? well, no, no. the boss is irrelevant. and, you know, the palestine authority was supposed to have all of palestine by the late ninety's
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and maybe not 10 yah, himself. destroyed that prospect of the oslo peace accords and left the color, staying authority with only 40 percent of the west bank and even they're, they're, they're under the thumb of the israeli military occupation. they can't do anything with israel, doesn't want them to do. and they're basically policing these people for israel. so ma'am, i mean richard hobbs just wrong. what about the situation on the ground? the people in the united states don't, don't actually follow events in the west bank and gaza and they're almost never on the news unless there's some big blow up like this. but if you read the, the colors sitting israeli newspapers about what's been going on in every little town in and dillard's in the west bank, then you see, brutalization,
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you can see colonization. you see these militant squatters settlers from israel on palestinian land that they stole from palestinian families a burning down there. all of trees cutting them down in dating their property, a building on it, taking over their homes. and this is a daily staccato performance of occupation. and in garza, the israelis bomb the airport 20 years ago. and there's no harbor the guys you can heavily on protein for fish, for protein. they're not allowed to fish beyond 3 to 6 miles by the israeli navy. the israelis carefully monitor what material and when building material goes into the gaza strip. so these people are,
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are living in health and it's a tinder that can explode at any time. and so looking for a particular trigger for it is a fools, aaron did not at my boss. i mean, the particular event of the invasion by the israeli government outrageously of the locks, the loss of the attack of worshippers throwing the flash bombs, the setting of fire due to rugs during a holy period of the past month of ramadan. sure. that's that set off a lot of problems, but it's not one incident. it's it's, it's everyday life that's creating these, these, these constant tensions and flare ups. and as long as the occupation goes on like this, and as long as israel is actively colonizing palestinian land,
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then there's going to be trouble. one in my discussion with not only senator chris murphy, but just casual conversations with other senators i had up to day. i heard from them that what has hit their radar screen, what they feel is different that they have noticed about this conflict versus that many other times we've been, you know, around the circle is that era of israel e, her rising and protests that there is violence inside between jewish israelis and arab israeli is inside israel. this is a new feature. is this a key element of how this unfolds? how does this fit into the puzzle? right, so i called the palestinian israeli on the model of italian american the palestinian israelis had been relatively cool. yes. and they're heavily please. and until $966.00, they were actually under internal military rule inside israel. but they,
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you know, a lot of toasting in, in israel live in villages that are not officially recognized by the israeli government as existing. and they don't have permission to, you know, it's a wall falls down to repair it or to fix their, their, their toilets. and the will include party has actually gone in and recognize some of these villages. and given them these permissions to have a decent life in return to which some of the palestinian israeli are voted, look food, even though it campaigns on them being terrorists threats to the state and so forth . so there had been mechanisms inside israel, whereby the palestinian israelis were kept with us and they are the least educated and the least will last a part of the israeli population. i think their frustrations have to
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do with in part with their attempts to become more part of the israeli fabric, their, their joint list in the we've been so many recent elections. but last summer, they managed to get 13 members of parliament of 120. and they should have been a swing vote. and all the other parties which are jewish based parties refuse to deal with them, refused to have them in the cabinet, refused to have any talks with them. and they were sideline. so it would be as though, you know, the african american caucus in the house of representatives were poised into all the other politicians and congress, and you can never have an african american in the cabinet and so forth. so i think
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that the nice, the relative electoral success of the joint was and then at sidelining and then recent election, they didn't bother to come out and vote very much. all of this as added to the trust ration there are local problems that i said they're heavily police with regard to security. but actually there's a lot of crime in the palestinian israeli areas that really police don't bother to follow up on. and there have been protests about lack of state provided security and the right agent. so there are, there are a lot of tensions here. and then i think the actual mosque invasion really set them off because the majority of them on the one i remember back in 2006 instigating an enormous uproar against himself. jimmy carter said that israel was becoming an apartheid state, were now many years past that point. and i guess the question is, what are your views on, on, on that framing? and is there any solvent?
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see any more to a 2 state solution which, which is hardly discussed anymore, occasionally comes up with sort of, you know, the, the, you know, the religious incantation that the 2 state solution must exist. but what are your thoughts on, on the choices that face israel and palestine now? well, there is no plausible to state solution any longer. if you look at a map of where the squatters settlements are from israel over into most di, and territory, it's become swiss cheese. ballast indians bided up into can times they're, they can't even get to one another without going through his really checkpoints, their roads were israelis only so there's not going to be 2 states. and by the time jimmy carter talked about apartheid in israel, palestine, it had already been a reality for, for decades. and that's just going to go on and should,
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on your line that apartheid has become a term of art in international law. some people say, well, the situation isn't exactly like in apartheid south africa. but actually, south africans often say that from their point of view, what's going on seems worse than what they experienced in the park at south africa . but the rome statute of the international criminal court defined apartheid as a systematic denial of rights to one ethnic group by another. and that's certainly what's going on in israel palestine. indians are being denied rights that the jews out there on the order of 14000000 people between jordan and the mediterranean. all of them under israeli rule and one way or another. and jews are privileged to policy. they're just the which, if you were sitting down with president biden or other stakeholders who may matter
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more than president biden, what would be the bank shot that might get us into a different course than we're in today in this, in this tragedy that's unfolding every day as we watch, you know, the new palestine is real, situation is so heartbreaking, and most people just turn away from it. and there's always this hope that there is some magic bullet. there's some solution. there's some set of negotiations that were resolved. there aren't, this is that this is as hopeless a diplomatic situation as you could possibly imagine. this is, this is beyond diplomacy. now this is apartheid. and then we'll just go on like you and i will be ancient and sitting on a rocking chair is a near death and we'll still be talking about it. there is no prospect of us getting better anytime soon. well, it's one of the few times. i fear you're right. i wish you were wrong. thank you for your sobering comments. juan cole, university of michigan professor of history and founder of the inform comment blog
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on u. s. foreign policy. really appreciate you joining us today. thanks so much steve . so good to you. so what's the bottom line? the murder of george floyd spark the national conversation in america, the centers on white supremacy and the races legacy of colonialism. so naturally the debate on palestine and israel has shifted slightly in the united states, especially among the younger generation and within the democratic party. notice how new york city candidate for mayor andrew gang had to immediately acknowledge that palestinians actually exist after he took a one sided position on the conflict last week. and notice that some american media and human rights groups are coming out israel for being an apartheid state now. but that doesn't change the harsh reality of us policy toward the region is really interest still reign supreme in washington. and israel is the regional superpower, and it's closely aligned with united states. now that israel has normalize relations with the u. e, with bahrain, sudan, and morocco, plus jordan and egypt who are already there. you can see that the fault lines in the region have dramatically changed the israeli government. thanks. there's little
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cost to doing what it's doing right now. and in less than 2 years, the republicans who are unapologetic supporters of israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu major when back control of congress from the democrats. all he has to do is wait. so even if it's true that support for israel and the democratic party may be shifting ever so slightly, it's not likely that america is going to save the day. and that's the bottom line. ah, the news news
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