it's a guns aerospace. this is a place where we can locate the original sin for young fun, rubik, the colonizer pissed his pole onto the sacred terrain. for the 1st time that stabbed, at the ancestors of mankind's itself, not all indigenous groups are against the development. in a written statement, the developers deny they will be a negative impact on the environment, is the leisure properties trust says if anything, the development will quote, see degraded, private land transformed into beautiful and publicly accessible space. but critics are not convinced despite efforts to show the authorities that the development is not appropriate despite the fact that here it is with in cape say that the heritage elements of the plan are not adequate and don't meet the requirements of law. the authorities of going to hit and approve this development as construction vehicles role in. so to do names on a petition to stop the development activists on all hoping

a court will rule against the 1st bricks being laid. robinson this algebra kept on . ah, let's thank you through some of the headlines here now. just now launch contain a ship that caught fire off the shoreline can coast is now thinking the brief from the vessel is already cause the countries worst ever maritime environmental. disaster reports a shim pin shipping. the iranian navy has sunk in the gulf of oman. that's after a fire broke out on both. the crews believes to be safe. us president joe biden is the ceremony in the state of oklahoma to mark the santini of the health of race massacre. 300 blank residents were killed by white mobs in 1921 biden, from his support for black businesses,

but made no mention of reparation. do ourselves no favors by pretending none of this ever happened or doesn't impact us today because it does still impact us to we can't just choose to learn what we want to know. and not only should the good, the bad, everything. that's a great nations do. they come to terms with their dark sides and we're a great nation. the only way to build a common ground isn't surely repair and to rebuild. i come here to help fill the silence. because in silence wounds deepen. those i are headlines sits inside story, next. talk to al jazeera,

we owe me, we're attacking ringer, and now they're attacking everyone and me on my do you regret? well, it's like that we listen. absolutely. nigeria with a woman, preston, it would be great. we meet with global news makers and talk about the stories that matter on al jazeera. first, that was the one child policy. then it became 2. now couples in china are allowed 3 children. but will this be enough to reverse following birth rate and deal with a rapidly aging population? this is inside sort. ah, ah. hello and welcome to the program. i'm a hammer, jim jones, the world's most populous country, is facing a crisis. chinese population is aging rapidly, or people are reaching retirement age and soon there won't be enough young people

to replace them in the workforce. worried about the implications for the economy. china is relaxed. it's infamous one child policy and allowed couples to have 2 children. but this wasn't enough to boost population growth. so the government is now pushing a 3 child policy. but many people say they can't afford to have more children. we'll bring in our guests in a moment. first, this report by katrina, you engaging as thousands of children participate and passivity is across china to celebrate the countries. children stay, its leaders announced a policy shift encouraging families to have more of them. chinese couples can now have up to 3 children. it comes just weeks after national census results pointed to the slowest population growth in decades. the workforce is also rapidly shrinking with roughly 20 percent of people. now over the age of 60 and analysts say this could hom, china's economic growth. would it would this will lead to the chinese economy

losing its vitality? there is an aging problem with threat has not only china's economy, but his defense and foreign policy. previously, the chinese government predict the economy would be double in 2035. compare with 2020, but that will be mission impossible. now. the ging ended its decades long one child policy in 2016. raising the child limit to to the dis failed to significantly boost the number of children being born. china's birth rate has fallen for the 4th year in a row. 12000000 babies born in 2020 short of government expectations. chinese social media pages are full of comments about the new 3 child limit. many a critical or ridiculed governance dramatic policy turnaround from the 1980 until 2016 millions of women were subject to fines and even forced abortion and sterilization. after having one child in 2014 liberty film directed john, the mall was find more than $1000000.00 for having 3 children. though these

penalties no longer apply, china's rising cost of living remains a barrier for families. many are unable to afford having more than one child. increasingly educated women are also putting off all foregoing having children over together, largely because of workplace discrimination. if the state really wants the birth rate, the crude birth rate to increase, it has to produce more welfare. the government will delay the retirement age and offer support to families who have more children, but to avert a looming democratic crisis. some say it may be too little, too late. katrina, you all to 0 paging the now right, let's bring in our guess in shanghai. don, one chief economist at hung, sing, bank china in hong kong, stuart, google, boston professor of social science and public policy at the hong kong university of

science and technology. and in washington, dc, sophie richardson, china director at human rights, watch a warm welcome to you all down. let me start with you today. do you think that this new policy is actually going to increase the birth rate in china as much as the government would like it to? i don't think so, because if you look at the policy i introduced 4 years ago about a 2 child policy. it has only brought in about 5000000 new babies and increased the birth rate temporarily from 1.5 to 1.7. but then the policy impacted dissipated very quickly. 3 years later. so this time i think this new policy probably will bringing about 2000000 more, maybe that talk the overall birth rate won't change as much. stewart, what do you say is this new policy likely to alter china's demographic trends? no, i would agree with. with that, i don't think that it's going to make

a massive change to the overall population structure of china. whether or not we use looking at the survey that we have weight suggest a very little appetite for 3 or 4 children. or even just looking across the region is chinese population becomes more and more modernized and more similar to all the heritage around the region. of course, the appetite for such large families is really just not there. so human rights watch has just released a report that found pervasive discrimination under china's to child policy. what specific kinds of discrimination are you detailing in the report? well, the reporter looked primarily at pregnancy related discrimination in employment. in a nutshell that employers don't want to hire women who either haven't had children at all or have only had one child because they don't want to have to deal with people asking for maternity leave. and of these recent developments,

it's or view that it's not just a question of the state getting out of trying to regulate reproductive rights at all. it's also a question of dealing with this kind of discrimination. leveling the playing field around, things like paternity leave and really giving people the full set of rights that they need to both be parents and participate in the economy down. i just want to expand a bit more on what sophie was saying there and talk a little bit more about potential examples of discrimination in the workplace from your vantage point. what kind of impact is this new 3 child policy going to have when it comes to discrimination that women face in the workplace, in a, in china. and does this have the potential to either increase or decrease that discrimination? well, for chinese companies, they practically have no incentives to hire that many women child their age

because it's a very realistic problem. they're not getting compensated for all those extra cost . just think about the to maternity leave and now there are 3 maternity leave. i can understand why companies don't want to incur that cost. and one at your point, which i want to point out is that there is a tradeoff between having extra babies and a women's right to work on. because we know that china has one of the highest women's participation retail work. and ironically that's because the one top policy, the parents money had nowhere to go, but how to spend on that $1.00 child, even if it's a girl. so women to women gosh educated and they went to work and you're working so much on so many of them decided to have fewer children. but now there is this increased incentive from the government side to push more women to have more kids.

and we know that that are still a deeply entrenched departure in china that women do most of the house work. so i'm afraid with more babies being born. a lot of women will have to decide whether they can stay in the workplace anymore. a lot of them may have to quit their job and return to the housewife stuart. even if people in china where to start having more babies immediately, this isn't going to have any kind of immediate impact on the underlying issues. is it? i mean, you're not going to see any real impact for a while, because if you're talking about, you know, babies now that still another at least 20 years before those people would enter the workforce. right? yeah, that's absolutely right. it's very easy to get the babies don't actually work. right, babies don't pay tax. and so any babysitter born under this new policy change,

they're not going to enter the labor market realistically until the early twenty's 40. by which time course, many things will be different. the labor market will be different, the entire systems of social security will be different with the 5 year plan, not only the 5 year plan, we currently will work through that and then the next full year find your. ready plans we'll, we'll go through the more of course, the problems which exist at the moment. i'm just going to become the urban pension fund, for example, the chinese academy social sciences. don't suggest that that's going to come on stock possibly come on in solving by 2035 to having more babies is not going to fix the pension system. i have more babies is not going to increase productivity. how many more babies are not going to to improve the health care system across the country? so it requires a lot more holistic perspective in

a longer term. so if you want to talk about another issue for a moment, i mean, you have now chinese authorities that are encouraging women to have more children and to raise birth rates in the country. but that's not happening in every part of the country, right? i mean, china has been accused of forcing women of muslim ethnic minorities to have fewer babies to suppress their population growth. the chinese government, of course, denies this, but what is human rights watch found on this issue? well, maybe the best way to answer that question is to point out a concern that really sort of links these to issues what's happening to weirs and other target muslim communities. what's happening with the decision to shift 2 or 3 child policy you 10 years ago. we've been having this discussion, i think we probably all would have agreed that the abolition of the to child policy to move to the retail policy was inconceivable. but we probably also would've

agreed that trainees government committing crimes against humanity in against target communities was equally possible. but i think one concern is now watching government policies, young and on reproductive rights is the prospect that the authorities may start. why doing women to have children that will go from having impositions on the number of children that you have to requiring people to have a certain numbers of children. and we've seen reproductive policies play out in different regions, but there are concerns about for sterile nations and other reproductive related uses in she and john done the fact that the population in china is aging and that the available labor pool is shrinking. what are the ramifications of that for china's economy overall? the immediate impact is that there will be declining trends in consumption and the

aging population means the innovation capacity will also be declining in a few years. but then for the long term, i actually think the declining population is more of a blessing than a curve for china. otherwise, unemployment will become a bigger problem. if we have china, the labor market now for many of the sectors, we're having a labor surplus problem, not a labor shortage offer example. if you look at industry, usually the quarter age is cap at $35.00. if you're about 35 years old, you're not going to be hired by many companies as a coder and as a researcher for college. and then that's similar situation. 35 years is basically age. so for the next 10 years to china's program to replace humans with machine will only accelerate. so we'll see a temporary or says no shortage in the last year. workers along the assembly line. but over time, this won't be

a big problem. the biggest problem still would remain to be how do we solve the pension problem, 20 years down the road? because according to un estimate around 2035, that's the year we'll see a peak in china, the aging population. and that's where the real challenge began. stewart, you touched on this a little bit in your last answer, but i just want to ask, i mean, are the reasons that people in china aren't having more children, comparable to the reasons that people are having more children in east asia in places like south korea, or japan or singapore? yeah, i think there's a lot of similarities, particularly in urban areas. and actually to go back to that issue about about discrimination in the workplace and pregnancy discrimination. you know, this is, i would say yes, of course. this is a problem and it's a real issue, but it's really symptomatic of the kind of attitude

among many employees, i think across the region which are just not supportive of families and, and supportive the women making the who are trying to balance work and family and so there's that kind of playing out of both the power dynamic, but also this, this, this very kind of a few gender approach as well. and the rate the reasons are in china is across, across the rest of the region are related to the kind of the direct costs of child bearing of child rearing education, particularly extra curricular education. it's very expensive, but then also the difficulties of just getting started in life is getting, getting the house of getting a decent job of getting, getting that kind of strong pathway. and then compared to that,

you want to have these very high opportunity costs. as i said before, particularly for women's work. and so women, korea, and this is really something common in, in china, urban china, but also across the region. but even is not even in urban is not only, you know, very highly paid, highly skilled women to be talking about. this is even in the countryside that you know, that's why the expectation of kind of 3 or 4 child damage in the countryside. i think he's slightly misplaced that in the countryside. we see many, you know, the majority of people want to make, want to give the children a better opportunity the night cells. so that means invest in more in one or 2 children to give them the opportunity for education and to get a good job rather than spreading these resources more than the. so i think if we do see a bump in the number of children that i suspect might well actually be in the hiring come brackets rather than in the lower brackets, which i think many people are afraid that that would be this kind of baby,

but they're sophie, i saw you nodding along to a lot of woods where it was saying there, did you want to jump in and add to the point he was making? just to say that i think the, the experiences that we've just detailed in this new report really support and what stuart and long have said about who might benefit. or i should say this way. who might take advantage of these policies. but it's also so interesting to look at as we detailed from the state propaganda. but recently, that is not just encouraging women to have a 2nd child, but really encouraging them to return to the home. and the mother is in play these very traditional social roles. and when a 3rd child nelson came through over the weekend, we are very close play watching some of the commentary on chinese social media. and, you know, and it wasn't just making fun of the decision and wait. and what about all the

abuses that people suffered of one child policy, but it also really flag up a lot of concerns about inequality and who would be able to take advantage of this policy and who wouldn't. and i think it, it really speaks to the point about higher income people versus what, what already extremely limited opportunities are available to people at the lower end of the income spectrum. down the government is also promising to increase support for families. and they've indicated that they would boost some workplace protections. what might, what might we expect to see as a result? i think one of the biggest move is changing the tax system. because in the past there was no tax return for families with multiple children. and then there's also no tax break for companies, the higher women of childbearing age. i think this will change very quickly. and then on top of that, there will be some social campaign to have more support

towards women towards family than needed help. and i think it's relatively easy for government to feel more schools and more hospital, but it's extremely difficult for them to provide local housing. they need to figure out a way to provide sufficient housing for bigger families. and many of them will have to deal with the fact that education might be too expensive for their children to attend. so their route the reallocation of the educational resources among different bracket of income. it's also going to be of very difficult issues. resolved. stewart from your perspective, is it at all likely that the chinese government, whatever completely scrap all of the restrictions in place on how many children people can have? i think he, i think he will likely happen. but i think it will take time. i mean that the, the,

the announcement that we saw yesterday, i mean it's really that kind of it just the late this change, i guess it's really what 984 mean like the one child policy gave me right at the very thought the 980 piece, the 1st change came in in 1999 people which allowed another certain group to have 2 children and i mean gradually changes all the time. and so i think that we will see that gradual ship but, but remember, it's not about scrapping the one child policy of the to child. it's, it's, it's about refining or changing or adapting or even improving base these policies. and you've got to realize that, you know, mean like there are many, many tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of officials at the local level of card. is it the local level who need to be

a need to adapt to need to re oriented this new low facility scenario having less work to do frankly. but then also in, in, in some cases are going from kind of restricting birth towards supporting best. and then, and also he talks about the nature of as a chinese politics and chinese policy that address a, you know, kind of scrapping any policy completely in some ways make some kind of gesture or, or, or some information about how successful the policy work in the past and so it's always makes sense rather than just getting rid of something will gradually say this check, but i would anticipate that maybe we'll go or child at some point in the next year or so. and then remove all restrictions, maybe like throw but on the other hand it might have been more but we would just

have to say, so if you let me ask you, there are commentators out there who do believe that this change in policy is sort of a tacit acknowledgment by the chinese government that it's reproduction, policies in the past have failed. do you think that's the case? i don't know that they're quite saying that they have failed, but clearly they're having to grapple with the fall out. pass policies. you know, the situation exists because of the existence, the one child policy and, you know, in our view, the solution is not just scrapping the restrictions entirely, but also, you know, doing the work for example of promoting the idea of paternity. we use the societal change that has parents taking equal responsibility for children for the most burden doesn't just fall on women, but also meaningful redraft for the kinds of employment discrimination that we're

detailing. you know, there are numerous chinese laws on the books that should prevent this from happening with the jacket, badly stacked against women. such that, you know, their best hope, even in trying to take an employer to court, is to get at least some kind of superficial acknowledgement that the employer was wrong to discriminate against the fines that companies pay are so small. that they're not likely to be deterrence, but i think there's also, you know, a real discussion to be had about the kind of horrific abuses women endured under the one child policy. the family planning authorities were notoriously abusive, you know, and actually providing some redress for that as well. done overall. what is the reaction been in china to the announcement of this new policy? and also i just want to ask me for those who grew up as part of the one child policy generation, what must they be thinking right now? i'm part of the generation. my parents have only one child. i have to say it has

been quite lonely to grew up alone. and then there's a lot of pressure to satisfy the parents expectations because they would want to grow up or get married, have child. but then with all those economic constraints, like the high housing prices, the high cost in other patients, many women are deciding to get married later if at all. and even if they get married, it's so hard to combine work with a family life. so they tend to have fewer children. i think in the future, probably we're looking at a huge trajectory for china that a population will grow at a very low rate. and women would have more flexibility, actually freedom in choosing what they want, especially in urban urban region. the biggest problem now i think though, is because of this rapid organization and a rapid growth in women's education,

there's a mismatch in gender. on normally what we call the laughter, we're women in china are, are highly educated, most of them. but then for the last minute, their family receiving sewer and years of education. so there's a imbalance in the marriage market and i think that in the future we're prevent the birth rate to go back to normal trajectory. all right, well we have run out of time, so we're going to have to leave the conversation there. thank you so much to all of our guests today, don, one, stewart, google, boston, and sophie richardson and thank you to for watching. you can see this and all of our previous programs again, anytime by visiting our website, algebra dot com and for further discussion, go to our facebook page at facebook dot com forward slash ha. inside story. you can also join the conversation on twitter. our handle is at a g inside store for me. how much i'm doing the whole thing here for now. the

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me. the important see if you were walking around and david was not to be in the line of fire from the holiday, but we heard gunshots. i was the 1st one to flee. the hoping the battle lasted 3 days and 3 nights and there were no prisoners at the control. and you control the region around. and that's why it was such a bloody, an icon of conflict at the heart of the lebanese civil war bay route holiday in war . hotels on al jazeera when much day arrived, the green army comes to life, but football is not all they shout about a club where societies disenfranchised the loudest voice. and political descent

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