and we expect them not to be corrupt. mcafee was on the run from us tax authorities for several years before winding up in barcelona. in october 2020, where he was jailed. in his final tweet on june 16th, mcafee denied having any hidden assets and said his friends had abandoned him. i have nothing he wrote, yet, i regret nothing. ah, this is al jazeera, these are the headlines. if u. p. s military denies it hates a busy market and t gray in an air strike which killed dozens of civilians. but it does have mich attacking to cry and rebel fighters in the area. the u. s. and the un once a full investigation, you and also express deep alarm at the reports of violence says it is pushing for

access to the region. some of the most critically wounded people from what we gather, were evacuated by ambulances last night. and this morning, we have requested access to the area or to assist to assess the situation and see how we can, how we can provide assistance. but so far we've not been able to. the situation in the air remains very, very volatile. it's important that everyone engaged in fighting do their utmost to protect civilians to obey international humanitarian law. for most of the pin presidents been in your keno has died after being hospitalized in manila on thursday. the 61 year old serve one term from 2010 to 2016 and presided over a period of steady economic growth push through a law on reproductive rights. overcoming opposition for the catholic church protest

as in thailand, back on the streets after 6 months brings you to cool with 19 demonstrators in bangkok, demanding the resignation of the prime minister and an overhaul. the constitution? hong kong. furthermore, because he's paper, apple daily has printed its last edition, it's been under pressures and staging and pools and national security law. several of its executives have been arrested. and if the assets of intrusion, libby is foreign minister says sizes of mercenaries could be of her country within days. government representatives have been the 2 worlds ages and then to try to establish security ahead of national elections in december. and us presidents show buys miss cracking down on a legal gun sales warning dealers. their licenses will be revoked if they break federal law is part of a strategy i mean to tackle increasing gun violence. and that's your up to date to keep it here on al jazeera inside story is next field 2 months ago, derrick showing was found guilty of killing george. now he will be sentenced and

could face up to 30 years behind bars to join us on june. the 25th for live coverage as this historic us court case reaches its conclusion. derek show the sentences on al jazeera capital on separate if leaders walk free from jail, spain's prime minister hopes the pardon will heal the wounds from the region failed . succession is 4 years ago, but could his decision backfire and cause more division? this is inside the door. ah . hello and welcome to the program. i'm hammer, jim john, 9 politicians and activists convicted for trying to break the catalonia region away from spain or spending their 1st moments of freedom. they were jailed for up to 13

years for holding an illegal referendum in 2017 spain prime minister gave them a pardon on tuesday. he hopes his gesture will foster a peaceful dialogue about catalonia as future. but the leaders say they'll keep fighting for the region secession. the pardon is deeply controversial. opposition, party se they'll challenge it in court. as sonya guy, you go, reports a tentative olive branch loaded with consequences. the spanish prime minister has been pushing hard to revive talks with catalog separatists and hoping that a pardon for the movement 9 imprison leaders can open the way for dialogue. we are responding to mother to the spanish government has taken this decision because it's the best of the capital lonia and the best for spain and correspondence to the spirit of hominy and co existence in the spanish constitution. yeah, it's not without opposition. sanchez finds himself in the middle of

a storm outside of california. it is deeply unpopular, more than 60 percent of the country against the move and parties from the center to the hard right have capitalized on that discontent. but the procession is movement . the pardon do not go far enough. the cattle and lita said only an amnesty would be acceptable as he could call to continue the fight for independence. but 1st water the lemony thea. it's time for an amnesty on the right to self determination . it's time to agree on the referendum. it's time for a solution to achieve more internal consensus. yeah, the illegal independence referendum in 2017 triggered the biggest political crisis of the country had seen in decade. the 9 succession as leaders was sentenced in 2019 for their roles in the vote, including catalonia, the vice premier,

spain supreme court, which oversaw the trial has also rejected the pardons. as it says, those sentence have shown no remorse. while the ruling is non binding, it could be cited as possible future legal challenges in the constitutional court, which could send the 9 back to prison. the difficulty for the process session is to argument is that while it is very vocal, it is still in the minority. in catalonia, big part of spain is still just about the preferred option that mr. sanctioned. his dilemma is that he is leading a minority government and can ill afford to squander the support in the parliament . he also needs the support of catalan nationalists parties. their leaders know that this piece offering will be extended by the prime ministers, opponents. it is an enormous gamble, yet those determined to move on say the pardon are the only way to repair the deep divisions that still linger between the 2 sides. so i go out there.

ah, alright, let's bring in our guess in barcelona, we are joined by mar vasquez professor of constitutional law at bar slona university in madrid. ruth ferrero lecturer in political science and senior researcher at complet competency, university of madrid and in brussels. pit the clip an u policy analyst and editor of brussels report dot e u. a warm welcome to you all more. let me start with you today. will these pardons from your vantage point help heal the wounds between catalonia and the rest of spain, or could they backfire and lead to deeper divisions going forward? good afternoon. thank you very much for hiring me here. it may have been you on this helps any step of course helps because this people has been in this cut, the leader. they have been in jail, then it's not only about them, it's about all the people that walked toward them. and we even had the pressure,

they know the cut on power many jane. and this has been very shocking porter. the cut, the lance was tired. the in this has been reflected in the last elections where people kept bolting woking. poor independent these parties of course there are many other parties, there are many other opinions to cut on. you know, of course there are, but this is a 1st step, but here in catalonia, many people what they want to because a part of them its individual. and now right now, 9 person will be relieved. whereas if there is an amnesty law, that means that the facts are clear, clarified, and then more than c, persons that are prosecuting court would be clarified and then then, what would be very useful, an amendment of the criminal code to clarify the city show crime and also some

grants have to have to do with the freedom of expression and with these we would linger with the rest of the european countries roof. let me ask you the same question from your vantage point in madrid. do these pardons help foster a moment where it could lead to a reconciliation of sorts between the central government and the capital? i'm nationalists? yes, they will think so. i think this is, you know, the starting point to carry on with dialogue, political dialogue among the parties. and i think it necessary to go ahead. it's a legal issue. so that's sort of that then this are the political negotiations on dialogue. i think the governance to say at the end is funny society already $12.00 way out of the situation of a nation. and so i think it will, they are what we'll want to move on on this on the situation. so yes,

i guess a power don't, it's the 1st is that that would have to wait and see if we can proceed on that political negotiations. i'll find out political solution for this issue. and if we could just step back for a moment and look at the beginnings of this, i mean the 2017 referendum. this created a huge political crisis. and while this crisis may have moved in no way, has it completely been resolved, has it exactly. i think the madrid government has not been properly engaging. it's indeed a 1st good step towards reconciliation between barcelona madrid. now, i mean from the mentally, i think the independent, this in a counselor shillinger stands that at least

a large part of culture on society does not want independence. and i think madrid should accept in confidence. society. there is a strong desire or legitimate desire for more self government, so it should be possible to find the middle grounds. the obvious answer and model to look at is switzerland. a country were indeed the centralized entities have a lot of competence in particular tax competencies. and if you look at spain, there is, there are d the basque country and they have more tax powers at the moment then cotton. so perhaps that could be one way of trying to find a children that catalonia and perhaps older region in spain received the tax powers . that's the boss country already house, mar, polls have shown that

a majority of spaniards were against granting these pardons. now we've seen separatists leaders who were pardoned actually walked out of jail. how was that news being greeted? hearing the only, you know, where they saw is that has to be there just a, there is a large part of the society who and the blue to reframe the this. there is a large agreement on this. and of course, there are people who are not independent, these scores, and people who are, and people who want to or controversial. i need to see what people want or at least go back to politics. and these 1st step, seen all these politician politicians getting out of his chair has been a relief for us. but the steel there are more than $3000.00 persons that are still prosecuted. so that means that parents are not easy. the challenges are still here . we need a response from politics, not from the judiciary,

and specifically not from the criminal court because many things that maybe should be fine or should have a response. the criminal respond should be the last one, for instance, to call it sedition. what's happening here in california for me this is for many like europe, county and i'm, they seem to rational that un, many institutions have said that this was this proportionate. and so seeing all these leaders getting out of jail has been very happy because for instance, the press, the parliament of colonial, this lady, she said, grandma and she's very pop are, she's very well known. and for many cut, these has been very painful, of course, for many capital. and to was very painful to see the touch, dra friendly because,

of course, that proper to put, i don't think for many this was painful to see that a part of the couple in society wanted to be independent of what spain and they've won. and they didn't trust the river ambulance because of that reconciliation and to talk. and also when the president of spring came to the boston on the open house over the person, when i'd say we have spanish lot got on there is the 1st time that we have seen this kind of seduction. and we will like to see more actually, ruth, our political parties in spain, who have been opposed to the granting of the pardons, no matter where they might fall on the political spectrum. are these parties beginning to capitalize with over the anger that's been expressed about the pardons? not at all. i mean, the ride going parties have been trying to lounge campaign as

a was the same in 2006 against they got along in a step by the so far by the population has been finished and they don't get what they were expected. some matter of fact, while they're minding now these, that they're, they're losing support from that they decided the x or such as the a chart or the inter printers or, of course the, the ones who are you saw lisa for the position for the, the, the part of them, so i think it has been a good strategy by the government to get to support those. no, just the political parties that were supporting their government with the approval of the budget in us here. but also getting some up there at one time i just mentioned live 54, which is essential to go farther on these reconciliation and i am political

dialogue process. so i think the opposition political forces are loosing truck. they're losing their argument. they have no legal argument, they have no political argument because says, pardon has been used since the beginning. i mean seems like centurylink, but also the, the beginning of the marker, seeing the same by either either a government right or left wing. so has no legal argument has no political men, and also they are not saying the truth when they say they are negotiating with independence independent. they've got the last because they need it will fly big or not of the country because i guess that their budget has been approved already. so they don't need the government. they need the support of the political party. so i think they have to think about it and half a reflection on,

on that the, and the position on, or that i should say to radical position against the depart them get there from your perch in brussels. how risky does all this look for prime minister sanchez? how much of an impact politically could these pardons have on him going forward while he's trying to find the middle ground, his between 2 sides ready? and that's why indeed he has not gone as far to declare amnesty but, and also why he has waited in order to take this step. and then of course, is the, the rising opposition and they are not very keen to, you know, to accept any concessions. but that said, at some point, there's going to be new elections in spain. and if sanchez wants to achieve something, he should not stop here by just you know, granting this, this, this freedom to, to the policy makers,

to these politicians. he should officially engage and try to find a settlement with lonia and, and, and get a troop legally before the next elections because in these otherwise, some people that are more hard line on the cultural issue may come to power and it's may become even harder to find the settlement now that says, i don't have the impression that mr. sanchez is, is courageous enough to go there, but we will see more where do things stand exactly in catalonia, when it comes to the separatist movement. right now, i mean, since 2017 has, has momentum for this movement. ebd has it slowed? well, it's difficult to say because in the last electron it didn't go down, but the thing is that it was in the middle of cory. so participation was lower. so

it was said that look from the independent target to i say look, the more when what east going up i'm up. whereas from a thing it was said, well, but know many people went to book, but this doesn't mean anything because we don't know what we're going about the one to stay at home. so if we look at the last electrons, independence, this movement, that's not that talk. but i think many people would like to see politics back. i think maybe we're tired of all this judicial edition of the, of the, the process. and so far we didn't see any response from the spanish estate. so in the previous government. so right now, at least a period of time to the government, it's giving it's trying to missteps. and of course, it's criticized by gold right from the hard core of both times like from the

winds up when the unity of expand that they will want to talk at all. and the ones that want to go straight away towards independence. but most of the people, i think, you think the medium and, and step types, these ones or it would remain the, the criminal code if we would talk about the spanish judiciary. because if we talk about transitional adjusted, when you go from the shipping toward democracy, now there are still misstep, internationalist, time there's that to be taken and come up, then we're not thinking to in a spain. so wearing a situation sometimes that has to do with these morelli transition we had in the spring, but maybe we need another transition to enforce or democracy we need to talk about more about inclusive be about as these 2 is more that maybe would be a response or many other factors and towards that could increase. and

i mean, you're a despite a democracy or if you know, critics of prime minister sanchez accused him of abandoning his previous positions on this issue. they say that before that he had stated publicly that he was against giving out pardons to the separatist leaders. and that essentially he's only doing this now because he needs support and his party needs support from capital a nationalist parties in order to pass laws in parliament. what do you say is that a valid criticism? i mean, when the prime minister have done this, if he did not need that support, i guess i just mentioned that in my previous intervention that the suffering the sentence is not really not true. i mean, the main law that has been passed on on day it's, it's legislator and it should be the budget has been passed already. so that's, that's not true. they government need say this for the pick up. they probably got

that political party saying that i should say that i think the socialist party has always been troll political dialogue. we have to remind here that the the most conflict conflicts, if governments and between are the most the most conflict relation has been doing. they got longer remain 2002 in 2006, 7 especially a later on with the referendum when the popular party was on government in a central government. so when the rub, because go varying both sides more radical more radicalism appears, either in catalonia or in the rest of the country. so i think the nice is a good thing, said the parsons,

they said i quite agree with my previous colleague, not marvin wanting brussels when he said that, since he has know enough, a bravery to, to face it, i think we have 2 years ahead to, to carry on the political dialogue and i think if de socially government fail a good be not because of the part of the bus by other stuff like manage menda, socio crisis that we're facing. even though or how they manage the funds coming from europe. but not because of the fire them, and i think we are on the, on the right track to sort out the a political conflict which has been a stagnated for all for so long. bye now, thank. if you are. so we know that the leaders who were pardoned, they're not gonna be able to hold political office for, for some time or, or run for office. but apparently, these pardons are also conditional on these leaders,

not committing serious crimes for a certain amount of time. when we're talking about crimes, what, what do you think that means and what could encompass a crime? what could land, one of these leaders who's been, pardon, do you know back in a courtroom or back in jail going forward? well indeed, as you say, it all looks very shaky and dependent on the goodwill offer of madrid. so we'd have to see legally how permanent it is how solid that is, the future government could not revoke this. also it's clear that people like carlos push de month who is currently in belgium. it's not clear at all that he can go back to stain because indeed there has not been a formal amnesty. i mean, part of the problem is also that the spanish government, or i should perhaps say the judiciary has been using definitions of,

of crime. and that's are not necessarily considered a crime in other european countries, which is an element that has complicated attempts by the spanish drew the sherry, to ask for extra edition, for example, from a from belgium. so belgium judges has of broke this extradition also. now do you are being court of justice as over rules the do you report that served as the legal basis to to, to take the immunity from capital on any piece. so i think a lot of the legal basis that has be used to author to initiators of this or friend them is quite questionable. you also see examples of public officials in catalonia, that are facing legal consequences even if they were merely, you know, doing their job as bureaucrats or rudy and has no political role whatsoever. so i

think a lot of it is very questionable so far. and this also, i should, should race on doubt, on how solids these pardons will actually be in practice, mar, pitter, just mentioned how it's sort of unclear where all this might leave. mr. put your mom going forward. i want to ask you a little bit more about that. i mean, could, could what's happened with these pardons? and if there is a reconciliation or a dialogue going forward, could at any way open the door for me to put your mom who is in self imposed exile to come back in some capacity or perhaps even be granted a pardon or clemency of some type as it has just been said that the situation is that many crimes that or a crime in the saying, according to our criminal court or at least not clear,

not like sedition. like criticizing the, the king of spain or, or an attack to religion. they are not in line with all the criminal quotes in europe, and this is what the european court of human rights have to take all these years. so that mean that you put them on briefly. i'm going to be general and you want to com. she can go around or you wrote that because he's a european in b, but so far from the tradition of ms. payne, it has been said that if you come to spain, he would be arrested. so 2 things should be change because if not, we have the situation that the ones that stay here, the poor man, it has to be seen as more honest the fact that they say that they went through the court. and the once would be in the street, whereas the printing on which a mom who is in a dial, if he comes back,

she could be arrested and also prosecuted and prosecuted chuck he would be released . but 1st of all, these leaders where in preventive prison for many mon mother iep and they are from barcelona, they normally because they could not find themselves in their own language. all right, well we have run out of time, so we're going to have to leave the conversation there. thanks so much to all of our guests mar, get back as ruth for arrow and p. trip and thank you to for watching. you can see this and all of our previous programs again, anytime by visiting our website, algeria dot com and for further discussion, go to our facebook page at facebook dot com forward slash ha, inside story. you can also join the conversation on twitter. our handle is at a inside story for me, my, how much room in the whole thing here for now? the

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