with the money company is not complying with the social and environmental regulations, but it isn't so easy for us to shut down this industry for the violations. to me. last week, the european commission voted to band the sale of vehicles that run on gasoline or diesel. by the year 2035 electric car cells are already on the rise. so is the demand for box act enjoyed to solve an environmental problem? it seems automobile in mining companies are universally harming the environment, altering this precious landscape. nicholas hawk al jazeera. ah, this is al jazeera and these are the headlines. indonesia is know the epicenter of the latest wave of corona virus in france, east asia. it's reported mon and 1400 deaths and 35 size we cases just one day. he was jessica washington was the latest from jakarta. the situation is growing

worse every day we just received in the past few minutes, the updated numbers for today. for 1449 death studies the highest daily just toll ever since the pandemic began in indonesia and indonesia has now passed more than 3000000 cases. in total, what we have seen on the positive side is that the government has been able to ramp up testing, and they were able to test 200000 individuals in one day, which is a market improvement. however, still way off the target of trying to test 400000 people each day. thailand and south korea have both reported a record number of new infections. the highly contagious down to variance is driving the search across the region. china has deployed its military to her and province. the central region is struggling with its worst flooding in recent history. at least 33 people have been killed. officials in madagascar say they

stopped support to assassinate president, andrea roger alina. the attorney general says several foreign nationals and citizens have been arrested. the penitent has voiced alarm that the worsening security situation in afghanistan. the most senior us general sense the taliban no control nearly half the countries $400.00 plus the streets. it coincides with the ongoing pullouts of american troops. france's presidents as cold and urgent national security meeting to discuss the pegasus spyware scandal. it follows reports that emanuel my crew and several governments ministers were targeted for foreign hacking by an identified rural can security service. morocco has denied those reports and that you up to date to keep it here on our to 0. the news continues after inside story, which is coming up. next. news

. news. news. news on the us and a number of its western allies claimed china for an allege cyber spying campaign. washington says is a threat to national security. staging says the accusation is groundless. so what the fall out from that route. this is inside story. ah, ah, welcome to the program on the hill roman. this was a unified condemnation of china on cyber attacks. the united states, the european union, nato, and other world powers. also,

beijing was responsible for an attack on microsoft serve as early this year, but stopped short of announcing punishment measures for alleged cyber activities. around a quarter of a 1000000 computers, a said to have been compromised in march effecting at least 30000 organizations worldwide. nations including canada, new zealand, australia, and japan's had chinese state linked hacking groups were behind the exploitation and they use beijing of a broad range of militia cyber activities, including ransomware and cyber espionage. the chinese ministry of state security was singled out. the white house has not ruled out consequences of aging, but president joe biden said china, his behavior is different from that of russia, which has faced us sanctions on a number of issues. the chinese government, not unlike the russian government, is not doing this themselves, but or protecting those who are doing it may be accommodating and being able to do

it. that may be the difference. the number of countries involved of else to the largest condemnation of china is 5 activities. it's also the 1st time that nato has denounced alleged chinese cyber attacks, the 30 nation alliance once all states, including china, to uphold international obligations, and act responsibly in cyberspace. while the e u condemned what it described as malicious cyber activities conducted from china and said it was resulted in security risks and major economic loss, the government institutions and private companies and the united kingdom. foreign secretary said the chinese government must end what he called systematic cyber sabotaged the could expect to be held to account if it does not. china has rejected the accusations, calling them politically motivated. here's what the foreign ministry spokesman had to say. may well, judy money or the u. s. ganged up with its allies and launched an unwarranted

accusation against china on cyber security. this is made out of thin air and confused the right and wrong. it is purely smear and suppression out of political motives. china will never accept this. china will always stand firmly against and combat any form of cyber attacks. still less we will encourage support or condone any cyber attack. american security agencies of published more than 50 tactics. they say we use by chinese hackers to target networks. and the us says, indicted for chinese nationals linked to the ministry of state security with a large scale campaign to have computers between 20112018. we'll get to august surely the 1st katrina year reports now from beijing. this collective condemnation of chinese cyber attacks by at least 30 countries, including the u. s. has mean deeply embarrassing for aging. china has responded by

denying that it's supported or encouraged any cyber attacks. and it's called these accusations groundless and politically motivated. now bay ging is trying to undermine the credibility of the u. s. allegations by saying it has not provided enough evidence. there are simply too many of the actors around the world. it's very difficult to pinpoint their exact location, let alone tie these to a single government waging, as also trying to turn the tables on washington and saying that more cyber attacks around the world occur from inside the united states. it accuses washington of indiscriminately eavesdropping on the world, not only on competitors, but its own friends and allies. it also says that the c i a has for 11 years be launching cyber attacks against chinese institutions, including technology ation and energy companies. now, while broadly denying these claims by the u. s. and the other countries launching these allegations, china has failed to detail. acknowledge any of these allegations of the attacks on

microsoft email exchange servers, which had affected at least 30000 companies, as well as the indictment of for chinese national by the us department of justice. katrina, you in beijing, the inside story. the. well, let's bring in august now for this edition of inside story. joining me now via skype from washington. d. c is brett brewed president of the global situation room and a full global director engagement at the white house under president obama from light and in the netherlands. james shy is that assistant professor at the institute of security and global affairs at lightning university and in beijing on a tank in china. political analysts who also advises the chinese provincial government will welcome to all of my guess mr. brewing can just start with you 1st, no smoke without fire and despite seems to be getting found politically from all sides. and yet, at the moment, i have to say that the binding ministration has taken

a rather restrained reproach. approach to china and chinese hacks and attacks, quite frankly, on our infrastructure, use a different approach been taken with russia and i think raises a number of questions about the motivations on the one hand, clearly they're trying to assemble that coalition of countries that are going to hold the line, i'm china, but i don't think it actually has the desired effect. and in some ways it allows staging to claim that they are being unfairly persecuted without actually that penalty that it is so critically important. if we are going to dissuade them from engaging in teacher and it's hanging over in beijing, let's get your reaction to what mr. bruce just said, but also the feeling at the moment from beijing because obviously the very angry at

the moment. yes, i mean the, just remember that what is this all based on this is based on a u. k. in for, i mean, investigation by the things that says it's highly likely, quote unquote that an affiliated entity to the chinese government instituted these hacks problems. you know, that's not exactly the kind of proof that a country or coalition of countries who are saying that the rule of law is something they believe it. this is the whole basis of it. so you have, these people come together based on this rather dubious claim and, you know, how do you just prove that from beijing's point of view. also, innovation thinks it's kind of rich, they're being falsely accused in their mind. and at the same time, you know, you have the snowden revelations, showing that the u. s. was doing far more than anything that the chinese are quote accused are doing. so there's an air of hypocrisy, not only coming from washington,

but also those who are joining in and that's an element we'll discuss as well as, as we pick this program that let me go over to the netherlands now, which i'm charles is standing by me. would the e u, the u. k, australia joining this chorus if they wasn't enough, credible evidence and shared approach to the condemnation while as they tangled just said, it's a theory without producing any evidence and where you, where do you see this at the moment? yeah, i think they ought to be the right to emphasize you did not say it was certain, it is highly likely standard, speak around attributions aside because you can never be certain. i would not describe it as a dubious lane. the fact that countries have come out the father, the u. k, and the u. s. i was the youth and the nato have all come out and suggested that if rich empirical evidence behind it,

we seen some of the public domain from private security companies. but not all of it is very difficult to prove to an extent in international law becoming back to how we actually unpaid that and find the evidence for it in the members to tank and click about to invasion. china is response, as you say, has been robust, that quite angry about these accusations that have been made facilitating the potential hack, but they are leaving the question the chinese government may have accommodated groups who tacitly are working from chinese soil, who may be happening in a similar vein to the way that the, the us is treating russia as well and saying that the various hacks are coming from russia. what makes this narrative difference as far as beijing is concerned? well, beijing is not acknowledged that there's any groups. they're just pointing out that if there are private interests, just like there are private chinese citizens who are for their own enrichment, stealing intellectual property. i don't think,

but american steals something from germany or from russia. it is attributed to the nation, but for some reason, the chinese feel that every time you know anybody, chinese shows up there automatically a spy. you'll note that they've just refused 500 students who are postgraduate students in stem areas because they're all spies. you've heard this repeatedly by republicans and democrats on both sides. so this idea that somehow china is guilt before you provide any proof. i, i beg to differ with my colleague from australia. i'm a lawyer, i was a prosecutor. i would've been laughed out of court by went in there and said, you know, judge, it's highly probable that there may have been an affiliation with a government. i therefore think we should, you know, condemn these people. i mean, if you stand by this rule of law, produce the evidence, don't stand there and throw nameless accusation on a kind of drunk. remember,

this is part and parcel of almost j li criticisms of china for this, that or the anything. how is it possible that china is the center of all evil in the world? or if not china, russia, then they happened to be what geopolitical competitors and mr. talking just very briefly then, can i ask what policies laura, in place in china, just to stop hacking from a local position, do they have laws in place that stop the sorts of groups? oh, absolutely, absolutely. it is against the law to do that. this is not some sort of lawless society or something like that on from it. they have very good laws. the question is enforcement and making sure that they, if they know who these people are, they go after. remember, it's one of the few nations that actually go down something about corruption as opposed to those who cast stones. okay, mr. ben, back in washington, dc, you think the with a combined, you might say brain power of silicon valley, big tech to the say, the u. s would have found a way with its allies to stop hacking all side. the espionage in some shape full

over the yes. well, certainly, and efforts have been made, but this is one of those challenges that sort of continues to evolve and to morphine to different ways. so you saw one problem and then another once emerges and i would take issue with my friend in beijing. he may suggest that, you know, presenting evidence in a quarter why don't know what the chinese quarter an american one. but the broader point is that not that nothing happens in china without express permission of the chinese government. so this notion of possible deniability. oh, there were these very sophisticated hackers that were operating from chinese territory unbeknownst to or, or. ready without the consent of the chinese government simply does not ask much, i'm sorry. okay, mr. shy that sir. bring you in here from light and to try and clarify how do you

start to investigate tracking, where do you start technically in the process? sure. so that's a really important point in that many, the investigation starts in the private sector. in the case of the exchange hon. he's been detected by security researchers who are not stake affiliated and then they want to take it by private security companies working for organizations who were their clients. they did these kinds of intrusions and then they escalated that other than that meeting. and eventually they also left the state as well. this went back to microsoft in this case. and then michael tried to issue some stuff from some point of detection, but as a security researcher, finding a hole in the system or by someone noticing unusual activity on corporate, that was thinking, this is wrong. this is unusual for me to investigate behind it. now i was going to school to technically trade all the way through to the person sitting behind the

keyboard, but it has been done. and this is worth remembering that in previous cases, you are indicted specific individuals associated with chinese. they will try a military or intrusion all the time. they have provided evidence the why to expand the evidence out there in the domain from these private companies, from the u. s. government as well. so even for the exchange, there is not, is highly likely that extra development has been done. you know, the time that we, we probably expect similar items to come out in the future just very long to make sorry, please, please finish. please finish to me in terms of what happened after that happened to scope because this is all about the recklessness of the half and it impact initially, it just would like espionage, maybe on a large scale, malicious. i was trying to collect data, trying to read emails from these microsoft exchange servers. once they knew that

they'd be caught, once you find out they tried to multiply it as much as they could try to compromise as many organizations. and in that way, they left the door open, they left the window open to lots of other side. criminals ran to act as you name it. so that was a record of incident, not the only one which could be considered allstate to it, but the records partly it's wrong when they try to spread it all over the world. okay, so we can, we can go back and forth on, on the blame game, but let's move forward then, trying to come to you in beijing. the recent g 7 meeting that happened in the united kingdom declared as one of its statements that china posed a huge global threat. trying to argue that it's big enough to be part of the global order. and it doesn't need to be part of the g 7, but would like to be part of the g 7 to be able to explain itself to be able to take be taken to task if needs be. because at the moment it seems to be on the outside. and as you say, this is ongoing scenario where china,

china seems to be brow beaten at every, at every opportunity in turn. well, let's put it this way. i think china wants to be part of the un, which it is. i think it is not too fond of these kind of cliques that have grown up . remember, the g 7 used to describe itself is most powerful and, and economically advance countries on earth. this time around, if you look through all the verbiage, you'll notice that they dropped economically advance because all of them know had basically that negative growth. during this covered period, china had positive growth. for the last 40 years, china has succeeded, and the developed countries around the world have moved sideways. this is an extra central threat to them, and they don't want to, things have changed. so that's why there is this ever louder drumbeat that somehow china has cheated simply because it has succeeded. it's a sad later affairs, but it won't end to jill countries realize that there are many pastor prosperity,

not just one. okay, let me take it, take you over to mr. brewing in washington, dc because the recent debate and the recent argument to the last 18 months has been about was way that the chinese technologic technology fund that wanted to invest. it's a know how in the you case 5 g project for telecommunications that isn't going to happen. while always chief executive was arrested incarcerated in canada. that cases are going a real big a real blow for china to advance its technology across not just western europe, but also north america. well, if i could contrast yesterday's statement by united states and its allies with the approach that the trumpet ministration took to china, trump really tries to bulldoze to bully a lot of countries, including the united kingdom into turning down why weighs 5 g capabilities i

think divided administration is making more progress and that this is probably more sustainable in trying to work alongside allies. they're not willing to go quite as far as we would like them to. and that is a worry. because what we saw yesterday was the world standing together and declaring with one voice that this is unacceptable. i think it builds on the statement. it came out of 7. and you're going to see more of this. you're going to see efforts by, you know, those countries that are aligned with democratic values saying to china, this behavior, this kind of reckless risky behavior is not going to be tolerated, the, the question that lose large. so is what are we going to do about it? and we'll, united states will european and other allies be willing to put some penalties

alongside those strong words. will penalties be enough for beijing in a tang? and one wonders whether or how china would retaliate. s the e o u s. start walking down the road of sanctions. well, it's not going to change china and you know, this kind of pious tone that somehow the whole world is sad. this one, it is in fact just a bunch of colonial countries who used to are responsible for many of the atrocities that growth green. china hasn't started. any wars ever broken any countries or leaving afghanistan behind they, they didn't do the things that were put forward by snowden, in terms of actually hack into the cloud and making sure they had access not only to china, but everybody else's information in the world. i mean, this is really an age of post hypocrisy. when i'm on

a show where people are talking about how evil and terrible china is when, in fact, they're just accusing china of things that they have done themselves. yet they don't have any proof against china. it's fine for my colleague in australia to say that g was, you know, there were, it's this and that, but he hasn't, didn't say it one at any point that it was definitely tied back to china. yet he is quite happy to have that. i wonder how he would feel if the situation was reversed and australia was being handled. august isn't in australia, but washington, d. c in the netherlands, but i know, you know, you getting the sense, but these accusations all coming from you might say the west to, well they all coming from europe, the all coming from north america and quite surprisingly with united world. how's that possible that the g 7 speaks for the entire world where they won't even give a cobra vaccines? brett bruin, the united world on you know, i think the point being is that you're seeing a much stronger alliance across pacific cross the atlantic,

among some of the most significant global powers. and that is unprecedented. and we can quibble about what use a global voice, what is regional or collection of countries. i also would say to my friends in beijing that have been not just, you know, these activations, but a whole series of accusations and with a whole lot of proofs. and let's not forget that there are millions into james who might be to different rosie pace of china, and it's record on human rights and respects the rule of law. so i think what is important here in the statement to bring the conversation back to the core question is what rules as a global community or countries story perspective, especially when it touches on cyberspace. and this is somewhat the wild west,

and we're starting to see countries in coalition countries come together to try to set some standard. you saw this in the meeting that i didn't had with president, and i think there will be more. okay, but, but let me just bring in then james shy is because if this is the wild west in terms of cybersecurity, cyber development, what needs to be done? who needs to be policing it? and can it be policed through an internet that is so wide and varied? so the starting point in the wall went analogy is maybe i read like describing actions in cyberspace as well because they are connected to other political, economic and other options that are international legal rules that do if i decide to say there are national norms, the applied cyberspace as well. these are being discussed extensively and they be

agreed after us for that being groups of governmental they've been larger working groups with all relevant states who will agree that norms are responsible, state behavior in finance, they should be adopted. well, why did you include things like not engaging in ratcliffe cyber attack? so saying that it was really under values the extent to which we have the norm out . that the question then is how do you try and, and improve compliance with the norms. and you say how sanctions apartments women are. now you can have known cyber responses such as sanctions, such as diplomatic statements, as we've seen before, we have responded in cyberspace. and this is where i guess a little bit more tricky when state shoot respond side operating with their own cycle questions. in response to our friend in beijing, they said, well, is we're trying to, this could be not true in the cyber security media many cycle by the us and it

allies much of a to pulled out china and russia. so the intellectual community, the experts community, is much more objective and they do have a lot of evidence. finally, i'd like to say on the point of responses from things we've seen from china, written responses in europe to record around him right around the we get, they respond very strongly to auditions and to accommodate in your top. and similarly here, i think that might be the right moment to actually and our conversation folks are, we have just run out of time. i'm sure it will be a subject that we come back to in the not too distant future. it's always good to get your inside like to thank but brewing and washington, d. c. james, shy as in leyden, and i'm a tangle in beijing. gentlemen, thanks for joining me on this edition of inside story. and thank you for watching and see the program again. anytime by visiting our website to downtown or dot com and for further discussion, go to a facebook page on facebook dot com forward slash ha inside story. you can also

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this is the place al jazeera has teens on the ground over 19 how to bring you more award winning documentaries and live need on air and online. ah, hello, i'm pete adobe here and how the top stories from al jazeera, indonesia is not the epicenter of the latest wave of corona virus in south east asia. it's reported more than 1400 deaths and 35000 cases. and just one day, as jessica washington, with the latest from jakarta, indonesia has now passed more than $3000000.00 cases in total. what we have seen on the positive side is that the government has been able to ramp up testing and they were able to test 200000 individual.