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after inside story. teaching you can watch out to see were english streaming light on nike channels, plus thousands of our programs. award winning documentaries and debt. these reports subscribe to youtube dot com, forward slash al jazeera english. was there, an algerian nation before french conversation? that's the question. french president emanuel macross, reportedly asked the statement has angered algeria, what's behind this? and what does it tell us about france's colonial past? this isn't i spoke with alarm woke into the program. i'm him are on con, france, and algeria have had

a complicated relationship for decades. although french colonial rule ended in the 1900 sixty's frogs has often been accused of interference. and algeria is affairs and present emanuel mac, crohn's recent critical comments about algeria. politics and history are threatening to make things worse. the algerian government has responded to the latest remarks by recalling its ambassador to france and banning the french military from its airspace. french, military aircraft fly through algeria to reach troops, helping the fight against alm. groups in this a hell, algeria says, microns comments are an inadmissible interference in his internal affairs and an intolerable affront to algerians who died fighting french colonialism. now, microns that remarks reported by the french daily newspaper, lemon. it says they were made during the president's meeting with descendants of algerians who fought for france and 1954. 1962 war for independence. mccall is

quoted as saying, algeria is ruled by a political military system, describing the country's official history as having been totally rewritten. while adding, you can see that the algerian system is tired is been weakened by the iraq. that's a reference to the pro democracy movement that ended abdul aziz, beautifully as nearly to decade rule in 2019. he's also quoted at questioning the existence of the algerian nation before french colonial rule. now terry says that more than 1000000 people were killed in its war for independence. it started in 1954 when france cracked down on rebels from the national liberation front, who are fighting for independence. the french government has faced accusations are committing large scale killings, systematic torture, and crimes against humanity. during that conflict. a manual macro acknowledged some of the atrocities in 2018, but the french government has never apologized. the algerians about its actions

during the war that ended in 1962, the tension where the algeria worse and after france sharply reduced the numbers of visas, a grand st. george earrings, tennessee, and morocco are also affected. the french government blames the nations failure to allow the return of undocumented immigrants in france for its decision. the dispute is raising concerns about france, his relation ship with its other former colonies in africa, including molly chad, ivory coast and asia. ah. let's bring in our guests in paris. bruno attach right, deputy director of the foundation for strategic research in doha use if one del professor of political science and international relations, a cattle university, and in casablanca, adam again, a journalist and author, welcome to the program. let me begin in doha, 1st with use of wonder use if um,

the former colonizers, whether it's britain, whether it's france, seemed to have very complicated relations, where the former colonized in france is case, what use be a relationship of take take, take very simply, put, has been very difficult to retool particular in modern times to think that's an accurate representation of what's going on when it's almost a credit. i think that all the last 2 years or so did has been po hope that the relations between our julia and france might improve. especially under the leadership of current president emmanuel backlog. he opened up few windows of hope when for, for his toes. he talked about her colonialism as a crime against humanity in gentlemen. he instructed the benjamin stall on the friendship, eminent professional history of our join descent into the styled some sort of

a dialogue away the undulations and open up ago memories idea that the hands of so many attorneys who were killed duly to welcome but by the french when he turned to angela, he showed that the show that something stops would be taken to waltz, at least opening up one of the most sensible subjects into love, hate relations between angelica and france, but events over the last couple of weeks. and so to lee, over the last few days, have put everything in jeopardy. but i think there and julius were not expecting a front president micro to come up with these particular statements. and i guess that even the french president did not think. but the and julia would give such a little bust or answer to what they have done by closing dungeon as space to for

lunch me to, to read, ah jets, operating in money in paris over a burner trace. is this a simple diplomatic spot, or is it as i guess in the us as a miscalculation of comments by macro that's led to a very serious incident. i think it's somewhere between the 2. just a little bit of context for your viewers. these are courses statements, find my call where actually happened during a meeting and inform meeting with some all french algerians and all jerry and the younger generation. so it was a free flowing conversation. but throughout this conversation, it was clear that mccoy's press a frustration or a disappointment off to, according to him, having tried to reconcile the narratives of french history and all jerry in history and after, according to him,

having generally tried to make some gestures towards the j and leadership. now his conclusion, his main conclusion, the one that has been that has made it all g as very angry, is that the system, what he calls the system cannot be reformed and that the general. so i have the chair in general, has instruments, allies their history to their own political benefits. and that even though he does have a good relationship with, she's all j and come to father, the president children, presidents. so this was not calculator, but this happens just after the 3 countries, the 3 minute countries aware subjected to new procedures regarding visa for going to france. and that included, of course, all jhayah. so that probably adding up to, to a, he's, he's comments or thought of the few days ago, bruno, i just want to confirm your saying that this was, these were off the cuff comments in

a private meeting. can i just confirm the no, i'm concerned that these were also cassie moss, but in a semi public meeting is once it's was a speech, but these were not off the record a comments yourself bundle. there were off the cuff remarks, there was simply having a conversation. there's no reason for the algerians to get so angry. all those off the come for remarks are they simply french organs. one of the things that we need to distinguish between to france or to be a group of people having a coffee, a coffee, a coffee, initially disease, and the french president polk, in to some, a youth of angie in the sense what, what other mccomb says. let's not forget that he is deep president of france, and i do not necessarily believe, but they were michael's frustration about the al jillions is due to some,

his frustration about making up some overthrows good angel in resume and on. jillions are not responding. i think it's much more a serious done that and to my view, no, to a my opinion. it deals also with the french operations in marty. let's not forget that the ongoing government has changed its constitution whereby you can deploy its military for the 1st time since 1973 of o c's. disband, take a little. her article of the constitution was not very, very popular among jillions. a lot of people in virginia saw it as an attempt by france to get to the under the military involved in muddy lust. last june. mclellan said that the alteration bowden in muddy wood and soon and it would be and an international coalition day,

expected. the object is to be involved in that and they, well not the 2nd thing that like you're only a guest from but he said he paused to do with the visas to a certain extent. but let's not forget, last month on the 20th of september, my money and michael apologized to the how keys today there was angelina who fought . we'd france during the elgin wolf independence and even decorated some of them. these particular action was not very well received in algeria, i guessed that the audience did not want to send it immediately to grab or to muddy in support of the french auctions. and that resulted in these particular commands which were reported by mont we'd. she's one of the most, even one should newspapers in france and into the french trying. well,

i don't again, i will come to you in just a 2nd by when it comes to bruno again, just to get reaction to those comments. what do you think? well, i don't entirely disagree. i think my question trying to do, but it's a very dedicated balancing act, is what he calls the reconciliation of narratives and the reconciliation of memories. so you have the hard copies in false. you have the young people, jerry and french. jerry and then you have the relation with the all geron government. so it's a very difficult triangulation, and i think she is actually honest in what he says to each of them. but it's i may need some possible to this reconciliation. maybe we'll say another generation just pretty comments on the question, molly, us so far these questions have been largely disconnected. these, what we do on don't do with all jerry, are in the hell. and there is the question of reconciling the narrative. now of

course politics, this policy is difficult both for paris analogy is to separate to what i do know for sure is that it has been an increasing frustration in paris for what is perceived rightly or wrongly as a lenient as to choose by. o g is regarding some to how the movements, which are freely crossing the borders. and so the retaliation for most comments, which is about it, is it for getting the over flies of french or german government? actually is it very symbolic accent who call recording the message because it doesn't change, right? it doesn't b operations in the cell, but it's a very simple i, b, and it's not the same in any case for the cell. thank you for being so patient adama in casablanca, one of the questions i want to ask you is very simple. a lot of this is

a historical, it's the way the former colonizers of treated, the formerly colonized. and there's a lot of accusations that, although actual rule has stopped interference from the former colonizers hasn't, and that's led to frustration and anger, and all sides is a right? yes, i think we are in a situation whereby we must acknowledge that despite the military you can read it again to mr. mcgraw. a for easy measuring of the country into african affairs is really less to control the military and economic possibilities of the former colonies, west africa, from countries and of course migrated countries. the fact is that if you cation or is that in a video, mr. micron is tried to put some points very important, it across the inner, oh wait,

that indicate that there's a wind. only whole goal is to fix that. but when we have here is on the one hand, the algerian garland. indeed, there is a very strong in refusing to merge just talk others in b. i believe mr. macross was even though they are from ahead of state or the owner of the video is controlled by immediately and they've not been allowing people to move 2 of them a decision to move to an economic modernization. but if you read to their neighborhood, it all the airports and lines are proving them for a place, et cetera, to leave the program for a given and a need in their own internal energy is gonna be really good. the concrete

learning you compare them with nobody, other issues that are really progressing. and i guess what i get is being done by it's a natural resources, gavin. others that never you done. let me, let me, let me be absolutely clear. are you saying then, that, ah, the french president shouldn't interfere in algeria affairs because algeria is a sovereign state and the sovereign state needs to soil its own problems. what mr. ease you better see the word where people remain behind nations age and it won't be in front of your bill. good era is born. you every other. what will be right. okay. and also some plan b it better. but while it is, but it's, let me,

let me adama, let me put that to our other guests and paris and in dallas, begin in paris. her 1st, a lot of this then is to do with internal politics within france. he micron is soft, is facing a very tough right wing challenge a ter, for in these elections are coming up. there's an increasingly, ah, feeling in france, from a lot of observers i've been speaking to her last couple of days. that what is happening is actually micron is being dragged to the right wing when it comes to immigration. when it comes to visas and things like this. and he's having to play on the right wing playing field rather than a level or more level playing field. perhaps i think this is not entirely force and clearly my call has been, who appeared as a center or centralized and censorious candidate in 2016 hasn't b drive slightly to the right. but i would caution those making. so trying to 2nd

guess the governments or the president's actions on that, like i would question anyone about of 2nd guessing politicians, we always suspect politicians to do everything for domestic reasons. well, the may have appointment this good conversation that was reported by them all, which made these flash. i don't think you gain team any anything, any points in terms of, in terms of domestic political benefits. again, i think, i mean, knowing a little bit how he operates, a thing i don't underestimate for him. there isn't gender in frustration as not being able to go beyond the all historical grievances biology. and now does he make it to color calculations? in addition to that, they have so kosher against putting everything on the forthcoming presidential campaign use of 400. i'd like to get your comments. a guy has said in casablanca,

emanuel macro is absolutely allowed to make those comments about algeria, because algeria has failed in some of his promises to front. when i think what i do believe in freedom of speech, and obviously he couldn't make which of comment he wants to make. and also he into my mind. his comments are trying to make a division within the, under the, in a society in which he said, basically, for the 1st time, a french official described. the pointed to consistent in on july as a political military, a system. this is the worst kept secret in ontario, history. we all know doug immediately in australia has always intervened in luxury of politics. so d. c is not necessarily something new, but we bowed to do she both of successive french governments. they

outcome all the democratic transition in algeria might have been different. the 2nd thing also, when he played to say that to the doctor, this is a difference between the r julian people as a whole. and these morality of aid of france is viewed by the on julian elysium. adel julian, people are not involved in this, and this is, well, i think mr. michael is thought to leap along because if there is anything that all and jillions or almost all on jillions agreed on, is that french has committed atrocities in on julia and how's she bolted successive regimes over the years. and most importantly, has provided she bolt for div, bye, think

a little the jeans and the love oversold blow texted some of the norman klatera in france. let's we, if you look at all right. okay. i mean, many of the are jillian leadership in france, a living in france and most of the ongoing money is belle. so mr. mcclure, in this particular situation, is not in a position to say what he said he is, in my view completely long in casablanca, adama j. adama, there is, seems to be a disconnect between a leads of se algeria, morocco, shanicea who are very francophone, who are some hold france for french passports are very sympathetic to withdrawn to the actual feeling on the streets of people who are almost fed up of this colonial rule that seems to be continued through their own leadership. what do you

think? is that true? yes, of course sir. if you look around africa from rose to west africa, across the areas where the speak french language, including my own country synagogue. you have a growing discontent. her friends, she's companies, a business people were and will again, but the political destination of france over those areas. but let's look at the really, the fact is 60 years have gone you most of the independent countries in those nations. the problem can be guessed in your door in the front door for us. there is also an in house in general, and the rest are all people. you kind of be brainy, everybody. outsiders will be of your parents. i feel at this moment was a kid. he did, mr. micra is play politics. you know that he needs the voice in price of the

happiest in the voice of the right. we need the voice of oh, those people that, that 50, or what mrs. le, exterior, mr. zillow, exterior, will our sight lighting to a certain extent, the middle class, we like a general right parties, so easily politics, in the case of africa also, he's been east, believe him, using the prime minister of money a we'll running out to you. and so here we are running out on, i do want to put your points to our other guests are bruno, you are nodding in agreement there to some of our guests in casablanca, his comments, but surely, if there is this anti french feeling, that isn't a merging and african nations french fallen policy is in the wrong place right now, because it's repeating the mistakes of the past. surely, i was only because i was it, it,

it was improving one of the points made by your guess, you're just in casablanca, and that very simply, the point that 60 is off more than 60 officer independence is, is it strange to blame the colonizer for all the evils all the troubles on the trails formerly colonized country, and this is particularly true in our j ever. this also sometimes through indian, the french speaking countries in africa, where playing the french, when in doubt, is a very easy way to synthesize your own responsibility. and i'm afraid that the african elise and y'all, jerry, in a lease or so how to bang themselves from situation or their countries. this is, while i was not into i think that the friendship relies are, is always a little bit of a, an easy skate goad. that being said, again, i called a 170 id that my courses not only for domestic policies when he says, for instance, that when he tells a french people of all jury and dissent,

you are as french as i am. not exactly pandering to the stream right, very quickly, usa because we are out of time. but i do want your reaction to that comment. is it just an easy scapegoats? is it just easy for the algerians to blame the french for their own problems? mom did not necessarily, i would not agree with that is an element of truth in what to the gentleman from parties said, but i would not necessarily agree with him. 100 percent. let's go buck 30 years ago. for instance, when the democratic transition a and b is long policy, won't the policy could little elections if it was not formed for the intervention? all the french and especially as far as you were union, was concerned whenever the object she was brought up on the table. it has always

been her de french who defended d. r. julian or don, it is a dot polity to little i am. if it was more thought does she pulled off the french? i would agree that the r julian, transition to democracy and also over the last few years would have been completely different. france course. sorry, we are actually out of time. yes, we are out of time up, but i do want to thank all our guests, bruno trick, you said wendell and a don't. okay, now, thank and i want to thank you as well for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting our website out there a dot com and for further discussion, go to our facebook page at facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. and you can also join the conversation on twitter. handle is at a j inside story. for me am ron count and the entire team here in doha. i for now

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