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elliptical unrest around the country through an earlier them, then do a new election laws being put in place and the government now deliver on a promise, a it an open process. person traveling on a da 0. hi anthony. ok to say on the street, we're going to be exploring racism that is been built into the jury system of 2 specific states in the united states. his william c snowdon with a one 0 one on how julie's work in the united states. the jury is determined to serve phase. the 1st page is the some process that an individual overseas, the son in the mail, letting them know that they've been called for jury serves. the 2nd phase is called one deer, also known as jury selection. this is the conversation that takes place between the lawyers and, and the tenant jurors to figure out who might be

a good for that to entertain. now we still use during criminal trials in the united states, primarily as part of our checks and balances system. we are able to assemble 12 or 6 people on a jury, and they will sit and decide whether or not the case is brought by the government against an accused person is worthy of a conviction, worthy dominic will. so what is typically how jury's walk, but until 2020 in the state of oregon and louisiana, it was possible for just tender. it's not 12. did you say that somebody was guilty of that person? then? did you prison time say to day on the street, we are exploring the race his past and present of non unanimous julie verdict. i cannot do this by myself. that is why i have to mila and jason, and make right here with us to minute. please introduce yourself to the steam body . it's good to see it for you. my am camilla john. then i am the managing attorney at the promise of justice initiative. and my job quite literally is to help the

state of louisiana. figure out how to heal the injury is after more than a 120 years. busy of jim crow law impacting a jury system like a daddy. hello, jason. please introduce yourself to have you as watching around the welt. i'm jaycee williams, i'm a native new romanian. and i was recently elected this past january as the district attorney of orleans parish to in a system that has been racist and sexist by design. i'm not going to have, hey, on the screen, please introduce yourself to athey willis. i'm a criminal justice recorder in new orleans for the lens are non profit investigative newsroom. and i recently produced a documentary along with our sierra all lines on industry convictions, or we're gonna got into that in just a moment. but 1st, let me tell you if you, if you're watching light and if you're watching on youtube, use the comment section. that will be many things that you want to ask questions

about. you can decide right here at be part of today's show. let us just start with jim crow joyce, jimmy camp. that phrase, what does that mean even? and so after the civil war, more than half of the state of louisiana with black but white louisiana and were afraid of a shifting power. and so they put in a lot of met a lot of mechanism to try to insure the primacy of, of the white race. and in 1898. the louisiana had a constitutional convention. they brought a whole group of white legislators together and they found a number of different ways that they could explicitly put in place ways to injure black, louisiana, and to give power to white louisiana. and one way they did that was the jim crow jerry, where historically you would need 12 jersey, a unanimous jury to convict them on they wanted to find the voice of the black

church and convict more black people. so they made a rule that that is 10 people said you were guilty and to think you were innocent. you were still going to go to prison. jason. so i described this as racism being built into the jewelry system in louisiana and in oregon was i over stating that case. no, no, absolutely not. for far too long, our city and our state have been ground 0 for the unfairness of the criminal legal system for black and brown people. this is not an accident. this was not negligent . this was a choice in the 1800s to silence certain voices on yours. and i wanted this office to send a very clear message that it is no longer a jim crow air office. on my laptop, i've got of the current 4 lines. appetite that he's running on now to say over right now that jim crow convictions. i, nick,

i want you to tell us the story of brandon jackson because this is not a theoretical legal situation that we're talking about real life sipping impact aid . what do we know about need to know about brandon? so yeah, brandon jackson was convicted of armed robbery in 1997 and, and his trial at his trial who was convicted by a non unanimous jury. so 1010 people voted to convict him. and 2 people voted not to convict. so in any other state except for oregon, this would have resulted in a miss trial and he would have had the right to under trial. i'm in louisiana that he was convicted. he was sentenced initially to life in prison, although no one was, was injured during this armed robbery. ah. and that sentences was later reduced to 40 years, but he remains in prison now, you know, 25 years later on. so that,

that's sort of the, the short the short version of brandon story. yeah. i, i bring in bramble jackson hall because in the fort lines documentary that you've worked without a 0 on a brandon is interviewed while he is incarcerated. and this is how he tells his own story, have a listen, have a look at only with they. there is a word that i can describe and have been of a joint over a year, no one that i've been incarcerated for something that i do. i mean, they're level word dictionary and i've been waking up like dead since 1996. i think about it all day every day. oh boy no. i'll be 50. ready december to 9. so you have spent all of your young adult life and to now in prison you, you basically say i grew up in prison. is now just looking at my laptop at

a headline supreme court rules. joy, verdict must be unanimous. why is this not the end of the story, jason? well, you know, it doesn't address retro activity and they're talking about what happens with cases that come from that ruling on. but they don't go back and look at and try to reckon with or begin repairing a 120 plus years of injustice. and, and that retro activity is truly what must happen. i mean, brett, kevin, i'll describe this this as a brutal pillar of jim crow. and when you look at just the, the bodies and lives that were ruling when there were at least one or 2 jurors who thought the person was innocent of the crime that was committed in one instance. when germain option. we exonerated him because of the alleged victim. in his case came florida, after he heard about us starting this work and he said the crime never even was

committed. he lied to his father, then call the police in this man. where did you know for an armed robbery that never even heard? i mean, people like to remain, we represented mr. hudson and we represent mr. jackson and our office brought the case to the left supreme court that found 9 unanimous jury verdicts to be unconstitutional. and i think all of our clients, if you'd ask any one of them, or rashad green, who your office also brought home, if you ask them when the us supreme court health you a lot unconstitutional, and tell you that if the jim krauss law that was based on racism, they expect that they would get some sort of remedy and went to the district attorney and william was talking about here in that in retro activity in the i think we don't always make sure that that happens. and we're hoping that at some point in time, you know, for the legislature or through our court system, you folks will get a remedy. yeah, so yes,

brenda jackson is one of about 1500 of people who are still in prison on these not unanimous jury convictions and, and, and in it because because the united states from court did not mandate retro activity for the state. ah, but he is not entitled to a new new trial. ah. now there are other ways to go about ensuring that he gets a new trial in the state legislature. they could pass a law which is jamilla is, is actively working towards. but this last legislative session they, they declined to do it. and then another way is if the district attorney in a specific parish decides that that they are independently going to go back and grant new trials to it for these people. and that's something that da williams has begun to do um and is, is a sort of in the process of reviewing those cases,

we can get him to the details of that, i'm sure, but in both repairs were branded, jackson was convicted, the da is not doing that and has said that he is his opposed to a new trafford, brenda, i've actually got a lot of it. i'll show you in just a moment, which the latter is the an incentive to for, for eyes between for jeremy young. it is impossible to speculate with any degree of certainty whether mister jackson's verdict would have been any different. had the julie being charged with united united liberty, my office will not vacate a retry conviction solely because of a non unanimous verdict. nick in this reporting that happened on the jim crow convictions in fort lyons. we have from a black, george, jimmy, you about to say something i've been, i'm going to have in the black joint because it's the pressure of i'm here is my voice here in my doubts. but because you don't have to have all 12 come to the same decision jamila go ahead pick up. no, i mean in this exact situation, we do have

a juror who said he did not believe that brandon jackson is guilty. and so to have a response like that from a district attorney that they, we don't know what could have been in the minds of these derb, these journey voted not guilty. we know what they voted for. and so to say that you're not going to look at these convictions because you can't speculate as to why someone voted not guilty. they noted not guilty because they didn't feel the fate met it. burden to prove it. and let's hear that voice tamika. this is the, the jura, one of 2 who wasn't convinced that brandon jackson was guilty. no one say it that they know what it was free and that i recognized them they did mannerism. no one was able to say enough to convince me that they were sure that it was remitted to robbery. you. did you express your point of view to the jurors? i'm sure i at least may 1 day sent in with it. and

when they dismissed your concerns, how did that make you feel? i feel like ok, i voice my opinion and i was hoping that maybe what i say it as i can i'll someone is made. i'm think about it. is that change your mind even if they did a lot of the guy in farmington room, but from the verdict that did not happen? so jason, anew chief drift says, this is common as you've been talking. jim crow never really went to way. what so push back your thoughts about that and how are you trying to make sure that the past these not being repeated in the present well, is absolutely right. racism and sexism for that matter really found very fertile land here in this soil. you know, the rest of the country outside of oregon realized that and we're talking about unanimous juries today. but that is just one example of how racism is baked into

the system. there are a number of other situations and circumstances in which people have m m m had a promise is broken in terms of plea deals, folks known as 10, sixers or, or the forgotten men. there's the over use. are there mitchell been to law and predominately black parishes? so he is absolutely right on the racism. and sexism is in the system by design. and it is designed that there is protection and service to one demographic and controlling over policing and over prosecuting for another demographic. this is, it is very american, but it is up to us to begin to address it. reckon with it. and this man's, what make it fair, i want to bring in the voice of frank culverson to post conversation, because this is not a hopeless conversation. that is what that he's being done right now. so glen davis

is an exxon lee, and he told us this story just a few hours ago. have a look, have allison, and rested in august of 19, and it won't charge, removed and automatically a year later when will config saying mirth. bananas jury was only consistent the blacks the only 2 black women on june with me, and i will give her at a possibility, the role issues the same. we were exonerated after this project was to our case similar using the law to defeat the law. that what else, what tools do you have?

yeah, i mean, i think what's been happening in louisiana in the last year is pretty unheard of. so we put together a group of lawyers in our office from justice initiative, but also $780.00 volunteer. and lawyers from law firm from seattle to singapore. and we said we were going to find each of these people with a non unanimous jury verdict. and we were going to file for them. and they may not have had lawyers for years and years and years before, but we were going to find a way to get them a lawyer and get them filed. and i'm the 1500 men and women who we believe have non unanimous jury emetics. is jim crow, jerry vertex and louisiana. we were able to represent 1049 of them. and that is a huge undertaking and a way to create that voice and to create that change. but ultimately what we're seeing now is there has to be more, there has to be more people involved in this. and that's where legislative change really makes the difference. and then having

a district attorney like district attorney williams, who was willing to not only campaign on this, but then turn around and start actually bringing home our clients and the people who are sitting in prison and had to watch the events unfold over the summer of 2020 and the protests of our race. and then wonder where and their protest was. nik i'm thinking about what's happening. he was as an attempt to fix the wrongs of the past. how does your reporting? how does this, the jim crow convictions, fort lines, film? how, where does that play? what difference will that make? well, i mean, i think it, you know, jemila is, is talking about the, the work that organization is doing in the, and the, you know, tremendous, you know, do a just volume of cases that they're dealing with. ah, but you know, the reality of that is it's going to be a really uphill battle for, for, ah, jamil as organization. and for these,

these are men and women in still in prison on split jury verdicts. you know, the, the legislature, i think it is, is reluctant to, to go back and force a prosecutors to look at these cases. i, the, there's an association of district attorneys that is, has, has quite a bit of power. and as opposed to that, ah ha, louisiana state, supreme court could also, uh, step in and do something, but it seems, ah, as far as i can tell, i think somewhat unlikely that that's gonna happen. and so our da williams is, is really the only prosecutor in this, in the state to, to take this on there. there's another, a prosecutor who's, who's, who's um, you know, looking at some cases it seems slightly more selectively. ah, so, so how exactly these individuals don't prison on this law are going to get a new,

you know, get a new trial or, or get some, some remedies. i think i, you know, i think it's gonna be hard and, and they, you know, i, i think even if you look frame in hiring how i have them grow it it's, it's, it, yes indeed. um, but i just, i just think that the challenges are, are definitely great. and i what the point point being is that brandon jackson's case i think is, is a representative of that. you know, there, there are certainly people coming home but, but, but brandon remained in prison and, and if it remains to be seen, whether not he'll, he'll get in, which i have a remarkable soon that's very prefer offer over phrased these. and for somebody who's been in calculating for so long. all right, so i, they point to question jason, i'm putting the very point to question to you for one of avi is watching light now . has the new orleans da. jason addressed o jim crow convictions. if not,

what's the hold on that we have not we, we've, we've developed the civil rights division with our office to go through all of them . we and we're still working through that process because it, it would be a, a compound, a tragedy. for example, if we had pushed mister germain hudson into a plea deal to just get him out of jail for a crime, and he did not commit even worse for a crime that never even occurred. so we are reviewing all of these cases, but we're reviewing them for wrongful conviction. and not just assuming that a parson was guilty, what to piggyback on what nick was saying, i am absolutely convinced and we have glass half full glass half empty. you have, i'm very happy to have a glass and be very happy to be able to build off of the work that promise started . i'm convinced that this work will be catalytic. i think that once the human mind is stretched,

it doesn't revert back to its original form or its own way of thinking. and i think we not, not just we in this office, but there the big we, p j i in other strong organizations that help change the law. and bring this to a vote and journalist like nick, who care about telling, complete a historically accurate new stories. this is what's very, quite literally changing the dynamics of a debate about what it means to reckon with the past and right and confront the sins of the past. it's a larger effort than jest, criminal, legal, the criminal legal system. it's a larger ever than just me or promise, but gotta change the culture and the thinking of the public. and i think it's starting to happen. nick, mention idea, stuart in cat o parish. it's beginning to review some of these cases, whether he looks at 2 or 3 to start off. i am convinced that i've been jamilla. what would agree with this once he looks and sees what is happening we into that,

i'm going to want to make him look even more. and those are the only 2 days in the state of louisiana who are looking at these cases. and we have conversations about once every, every 2 weeks now with the new da, when we walk through the cases in their jurisdiction. and try to create a mechanism that either parallel what, what or lean parents are doing by looking at all of the cases or really has the conversation about what is what specifically can be done in their jurisdiction. so we're seeing that we're seeing growth across the state, but not fast enough and not enough of the recognition that these folks were convicted unconstitutionally. and to really the remedy for that should be a new try. i might believe i just need to tell me if i'm being naive, but what we're talking about $1500.00 cases that could be keyed in a year. could they could be jamila said something when it was dog and she

said it's hard. every art in this work, that's true. you need man and woman power, you need resources. pci, these more resources, these are the smaller da's offices need resources. that's why we need legislators to fund this work. what we need to change or law doesn't that really isn't it? can be the parole. ringback board, so some of the problem is logistics. as i do we have enough person pallet do we have enough money to get this done? do we have enough resources to do re trials? so some of it is logistics. and meanwhile, people are stuck in prison because the logistics of writing the wrongs the past are complicated or hard to stream. and i said to me, i need your, your legal brain from moment here in a sentence ramos versus louisiana. yeah, rama ruth and louisiana found jim crow jerry's to be unconstitutional. now, unanimous theory burdick, i so that is a beautiful set up sanctity mila for professor kaplan, who was talking about revisiting these cases, re

a revisited them to see if you can actually just write the rocks he, she is here in oregon, the only other state besides louisiana that had non unanimous juries until 2020. when the united states supreme court ruled them unconstitutional, has hundreds of people behind bars based on non unanimous jury convictions. our supreme court will be addressing the issue in 2022, but in the meantime, the best way to get help and relief and justice for the people behind bars is to pass a law here in oregon and our state legislature that would provide retro activity under ramos versus louisiana. so i guess i just want to show you some of the thoughts for matthew is her watching on youtube right now. this is so sad and disgusting. america, still unjust, in convictions against black people. and then another one here. this is

heartbreaking. thank you so much for showing your work. jason, nick and jim miller. you want to find out more about the jim crow convictions. i can highly recommend the current episode of fort lines called the jim crow convictions. it's on lie right now. just gonna move this up a little bit so you can see more about this film and what shape i've online on al jazeera. thank you so much for being part of today's show, really appreciate it. jim miller, jason and nick, i, we following your work very closely on youtube. thank you so much for being part of today's program for incisive questions and comments. i will see you next time. take everybody. ah ah.

ah. ah for the congolese, but journey to work or means unimaginable. hodge. i prefer to like go with the captain tooth chancing life and live on a dangerous journey through the jungle. i fell on to the rails. i merely died of our children, teeth go to school and live because of the print risking at all the democratic republic of congo on al jazeera. ah, each and every one of us is about to responsibility. to change our personal space for the mirror, we're in, we could do this experiment. and if by diversity could increase just

a little bit, that wouldn't be worth doing. anybody had any idea that it would become a magnet who is incredibly rare species for women to get 50 percent representation in the constituent assembly. here in getting these people to pick up to collect the signature, to say the re saying this is extremely important. service that they provide to the city. why we, we need to take america to trying to bring people together and trying to deal with people who left behind when freedom of the press is on the threat. so in all you just called thought genuinely about your thoughts towards the baking government step outside the mainstream. there has been a policy to implement your system of access towards the internet shift. the focus

that pandemic has turned out to be a handy little pretext. the prime minister to clamped out on the press, covering the way the news is covered. the listening post on the just 0. ah, this is al jazeera. ah. hello, this is the news our on al jazeera. i'm fully back to go live from our world headquarters in doha, coming up in the next 60 minutes. austria chancellor sebastian cursed under investigation on suspicion of bribery and corruption.