was one of the fastest growing sector and astrology economy before the pandemic in 2019 it contributed around $50000000000.00. but the board of closures and the nation, the reputation as fortress of strata and tourism group know they've got a big job on the hands to convince tourists to return. there's a huge drove ahead of us. we have had an incredible disruption to our industry, no international. right? the trucks into the market as well as the name we lost about $18000000000.00 worth of international revenue and on and to put it all back together. it's a complex machine or industry. you have to be ready, but not every state in australia is welcoming arrival. western strategy has been close to both international travelers and had quarantine restrictions in place for vaccinated a strolling systems the most of the pandemic. it will eventually open its borders in, gera, clock out 0, brisbin, australia. ah,

this is al jazeera, these are the top stories, rushes defense ministry says ukrainian forces have tried to infiltrate its border. 5 ukrainians. such have been killed and 2 vehicles destroyed and rust off kia, dismissed the claim, as fake news brushes, precedents considering recognizing to break away regions in eastern ukraine. rebel leaders from the nets, and la hans appealed for support. letting me put in spoke after meeting with the russian security council, and i sure listen to the goal of this meeting is to lay out our future plan. and then we will have in mind the fact that the governments of the done yet can do hands republics have asked me to accept their requests, to have their independence recognized. and the assembly will respond to that request. all these matters are closely related to global problems of security in the world and europe in particular. because using ukraine as a tool of confrontation is

a big threat. that's exactly why in recent months we've asked to work with washington and nato to come to an agreement on security matter. diplomatic efforts to resolve the crisis are continuing. ukraine has called for an urgent un security council meeting. russia foreign minister says he'll meet his us counterpart in geneva on thursday. iran's foreign ministry says significant progress has been made at talks to revive the 2015 iran nuclear deal to iran wants sanctions relief in exchange for the limits on its nuclear program. like instigations between you and iranian delegations have been held in b, enter since april, while the u. s. is involved in directly england is lifting all remaining corona virus restrictions. the legal requirement to self isolate will be removed from thursday. those are your headlines up next inside story. after that, i've got the news for you will see then me.

ah ah, ah, already controversial if he has started generating power from its renaissance down . what does it mean the negotiations between neighboring countries who stand the gain or lose? this is inside story. ah. hello, welcome to the show. i'm sammy's a than if you hope you're has begun generating power from its grand d. c o p and run a songs down with the new source of clean electricity, addis ababa hopes,

the charges economic development. but the project is not sitting well downstream. the giant, hydro power dam is built on the upper part of the blue nile river. it's been a source of controversy from the time the 1st break was lay the decade to go full sudan in egypt. the nile rivers waters are a lifeline for millions. both government say the dam threatens their access to water and are demanding a legally binding agreement to protect their interests. you. c o. p is 5 minutes. tabby med says there's nothing to worry about. hey, cause the dam an opportunity for all countries in the region. you thought, you know, of us as i got the downstream countries, the brothers, the people of egypt and saddam, the water will flow and the world must know that the dam will not fix them. all that was said about ethiopia seeking to prevent the flow of water was untrue and we will not allow the people to starve or thirst. these are our principles in their position and we affirm the flow of water to the people from the dam is to develop

and bring 60000000 ethiopians out of the darkness. we seek integration between the 3 countries and a real partnership. while commenting on e. c. o peers announcement, the egyptian foreign affairs ministry issued a statement saying after the previous unilateral start of the 1st and 2nd stages of filling with them, the arab republic of egypt, the firms. this step is a further violation by the ethiopian side of its obligations under the 2015 principles agreement signed by the yoke in prime minister. well, begin our discussion in a moment, but 1st let's bring you up to speed on africa. his largest hydro electric project construction was started in 2011, under the late former prime minister madison. our civil servants contributed one month salary towards the project for its launch. the government has since issued dam bonds, aimed at the theo, kids at home and abroad. the cost of the grand

e. c. o. p and renaissance dam is estimated to be close to $5000000000.00. by harnessing the force of water. if you hope you're able to provide electricity for 70 percent of its people, many of them don't have electricity at all. filling the dams vast reservoir began in 2000, then 20 hitting a target of 4900000000 cubic meters by july. that year. prime minister abby asset says the project is scheduled for completion in 2020 for the let's bring in our guests. we have joining us from the hague, adam cassie abbe, he's the program officer at the international institute for democracy and electoral assistance. in london, we have alam and president of the world association for sustainable development. and in summerville alex, the vol. is executive director at the world peace foundation. welcome to you all.

if i could start with adam. so does the beginning of operations at this time indicate the project is on track and heading for success? absolutely, the project has been on truck for, for a while now. it has been delayed and it has generated a lot of extra costs. and of course i'll be politicized, but it's making steady progress. alum will the project completes as expected in 2024? will it produce? i think it's, i more than 5000 megawatts of electricity. how's it looking? i think the question of completion and no one can know the answer for that because there's lots of issues going on with that. they've also legal telling you that the land is still receive this beauty and the situation in boss sudan. any sylvia is not settling down. so it's, it's a big question mark, but at least now we have seen the production or form there by reducing may go off.

so it is on the, on the truck to produce and to complete between is quite a big question. no one really can't them, particularly no one knows the technical. what is going on that down really is quite difficult to, to tell. no one has seen the the meeting. if you're like, been awake of that down yet. all right, but now it is switched on. alex is the giving us any clearer clues about its impact on other countries. i think that really remains to be seen. i think prime minister abbey was absolutely correct in saying that there is no reason why the operation of the should affect the downs to stream countries. in fact, it could be to their advantage because it can regulate the flow batch up because it's a hydro electric time is not actually using water for irrigation. and so the, the flow should be unemployed and should be regulated and because the water is

stored at a high altitude in the highlands, there will be less evaporation than in loveland lakes of northern sudan. and egypt that said, the context in which the dam is becoming operational is very different to the context in which it was conceived. 10 years ago, it was the brainchild of the lake melissa, now it was the jewel in the crown crown of the developmental stage. and the reason it's called the renaissance stem is that that is a shout out to the principles of the african renaissance, the idea that the african states should band together for collect to the development for integration, for cooperation. now what has happened since then is to transformations. first of all, the developmental stage has been abandoned and, and reversed and, and there is a big question mark over the economic future of,

of all the field. and secondly, the political and diplomatic context has been transformed. so that instead of ethiopia being embedded in an alliance of african nations, that actually put egypt something in a and something of a diplomatic corner. and what happened is, is atlanta has been dismantled by prime minister abbey, who including resulting in the and tag antagonism that exists between e. c o, p, and sudan. and e, c o, p is now becoming very dependent on its middle eastern patrons for money and weapons. notably, the united arab emirates, so it's a very different political context in which there's a lot of turmoil and a lot of distrust. all right, so it is changing more than just the developmental situation for ethiopia in the region. how adam, how will the operation of the 1st turbine do you think? how will it impact that deadlock in talks between ethiopia on the one hand and

sudan in egypt on the other? a 11 point to our, to what alex do all said, and he's right that the context has changed fundamentally. but the european positioned it european idea towards it. um and how relevant it is and, and also how it perceives it will affect downstream. countries hasn't really changed to the context has indeed changed, but how that the dumb self is perceived and, and the interest and desire to see it to completion hasn't. that is one in terms of, you know, how that, that down and it, the progress that has been made can, can change relations. perhaps it's important to say that if you look at how the 3 countries have approach this particular relationship, it's, it's perhaps a reflection of how they see the politics in their, or in their own countries. it a politics in each of these countries is often founded on mistrust. it is founded on sets that sort of, we know, textual pollard politics and sometimes even of conflict dominance. and so that's

a mistrust that we see at the domestic level in each of these countries is actually reflected in their relationships without leisure. there is one switch, adam, how will that impact the distrust is this going to encourage countries to at least start resuming talk? so all the opposite, while it is necessary, they have to talk, i mean they, they have differences that it's important to know that they haven't met a lot of progress. there's 2 key issues, whether there's still a lot of stickiness, particularly in terms of how in case of a, an of an, an, you know, an unfortunate draw situation, how the water would be bonded to, particularly on the do to sophie to appear to be let go of the water and even some, you know, some of the, the stored water and also in terms of how, in case there are disputes in terms of the please. principle of equitable distribution of water went off, causing no significant harm can be, can be results. but they have to talk, it's necessary, and the progress they have made so far. i think, you know,

despite the fact that there has not been any major breakthroughs, they have actually work together. and there is a sense of developing trust among these countries. and so i think glimmering in allied offers a positive view transformation. do you agree with that? is there a sense of progress being made? i mean, when you look at the history of these talks, it seems like the parties are stuck on some of the same points, drought management, 3rd party arbitration and future adjustments to the agreement. they've been arguing over that for years. haven't they? yes, that's correct. and i think the key issue here to remind mike are in your viewers here. assume it has been blinked at politics quite if you like, sophisticated to here. no one in the last 2 years. or if you remember, all of you as you be, i have used as opportunity, they're very opportunistic. i know this, my so negative. what is true?

when is your fines or found to down in the last 2 years in serious trouble? internally, they try to maximize anything dramatically will not be recovered. a re reverse easy. so that has been going through a very difficult time, i think frankly, speaking pseudo has no government as we speak. so there is no one at all challenging or even talking to this european now because we don't have a government issued on. secondly, if you are, you can see the way a bathroom is talking. i was talking about more of a cara, someone who really take care of sudan and egypt and talking about is not going to fix him. his. he's changing the tone. if you look last year and the year before, the tone was more of threatening, we will do what we want now is more of don't worry, it will not affect you. it will regulate water as own number. 3. also geopolitics of the region has also changed. i agree with alex, if you can see the american in void to the region is now more of residing in is

sylvia. rather than and he just make visit to sudan. so they have somehow behind closed door, which we all don't know. the american are quite significant there, and i agree, or says alec, the involvement of embrace united auto payment is also changing the game now in the se, disputed area. but to go back to your question about the history we have been here before. there are 6, we continue to be standing out. number one, egypt. she is relying almost 90 something there said 97 percent on water of the might. so is for them is the survival issue. the same issue will be in the seat as a survivor and project that you, she and they see the water from the light or the survival project, right? if she and have managed to integrate very well with europe and they are exporting in london, i go to see what market i buy, lots of for some big that were from egypt. so it gives you cannot take any risk on

that. agricultural productivity to be hindered or been affected is cecilia stockier by sadly, if you follow last months that you've shown prime minister was urging is you'll be in again to sign a binding agreement or any legal document is hubie and didn't so done in the boss have been asking for any technical issues if you like, sharing about what is going because you can't keep saying it's not going to fix. have done is going to regulate the water. ok. we have expert from sudan, but they want to see these the condition. i am an expert in water. why not? you show me. i have my my in, you need to show them a more. finally, we haven't seen any independent evaluation. i have been and many others calling internationally for an independent, technical review of the dam make up and they snuck a single, independent review. so these all make it as a classic example. i just really realized that point we should area. this is only

about your, if you will be a, it's the survival project, right? and this is clearly that there's a lot of progress that still needs to be made in addressing the same points. what is the bottom line? alex does. hitting the on button of the dam. make the chances of conflict less likely or more likely. do you think? i think the, the 2 issues that need clearly to be separated here. one is the, the technical issue. and in principle, technically speaking, that is a win win situation. it can make the water management of the nile base and more rational to the advantage of all the repairing countries, especially in the context of climate change and, and the greater fluctuations in writing, poland, and revo level. so it's no doubt about that. the real problem is one of trust and the future person's understand the,

the technical issues perfectly well. their concern is that in the case of a, of, of a political dispute for some other reason between ethiopia and egypt. if yoko now has in its hands a weapon, it can actually block the flow of the nile, should it want to? and that is the existential question. and a no treat cheap. no, no signature on the on, on, on a piece of paper is going to be sufficient to persuade the addictions that there are no circumstances under which e, c, o p a will, will not to use that ultimate weapon as it where can the illusion of everything just really shifted, which is that if you're here today is much, much weaker than it was a few years ago, because it has become diplomatically, much weaker, but above all because it's economically weaker. the country is in

a major economic crisis with its, its bonds trading as junk with a practically drying up of foreign direct investment bad relations with all its a donors facing a major food crisis this year. and, and i am sure is the number one explanation why i'll be up man has tried to reconcile with the americans whom he was condemning just a few months ago while he went cap in hand to the european union. a you african union summit just recently and, and, and while he, why he is also adopting this conciliatory language. he needs some money and he, and he understands that this is a good. and this approach, this much more conciliatory approach is, is, is a way of getting that and it may well work out to the advantage of all i them is sounds like listening to all the guests. but really this may continue to be a source of conflict. and

a source of generating fearful sedan and egypt no matter what guarantees on paper the oceans are or are not willing to give. well i think so you know, 1st it's important to recognize that the egyptians or the sudanese have genuine interest in what is happening in the, in the building of the dominates oppression. so i think that's very important that secondly, it's also important to recognize that aviana when he came to power, the 1st thing he did was actually traveling to egypt and assured them that they will not be any consequence, any significant harm to their interests or so to say that i'll be, i'm at essentially sweet talking them now because the countries in trouble is, is, i think is, is it missed the point that, that's one. and secondly, i know you all right, and i think that though with points i was trying to make earlier, was that the countries in terms of how they relate to each other? a has been defined by the same kind of mistrust and weed or text over politics that

characterize their politics at home and, and as they're making progress now. and as i said that it has not been any big breakthrough. and there are still certain important sticky points, but the only way to develop trust is actually to work together. and the only way also to prevent a scenario that alex spoke about where you took the, i could essentially essentially block the dumb is to connect the countries even more i, i think that denial is, it's a geographic, it's a historical, an umbilical cord that connects the country and it's potentially contrasts for not just the relationship around the river itself, but the relationship among the countries. and i think only that that integration will guarantee that that's the safest bet, 444, egypt. otherwise, even if there is an agreement in this scenario that ethiopia once to, to hearth egypt, it could still valid that particular agreements. i think it's not a written agreement. as important as that is,

it's not that that will prevent any damage to the decanters. i think it's an integration of the 3 countries and beyond that provides the safest guarantee for egypt, for sudan, and the rest of the year i part in countries island. there is a mechanism, isn't that supposed to be handling negotiations to resolve the matter through the a you has the i you proved though that is not very effective in managing this one. yes, sammy the a you. unfortunately, it's not like to say that because failed. and in many, many frances abbas, i mean they have been involved in this on, on, of a lot of, but they have not succeeded either to just even succeeded to bring this to be be will to, to. so i mean, the 2 boys are alex mation, them of the stick to sticking point. the sudanese want to be a short technically is not going to flood and kill their people. and they give she and me to be assured that will not be any time where this you'll be

a got to stop or review this year to florida. so how do you resolve this? simply, it has to be a legal binding agreement. i know there is a loss of historical agreement between students. you've done this, you'll be a, let's forget all that sign one now, where it's going to simply saying which you'll be in the future, cannot change or use or do anything or block water from egypt. and then sudan will need to be given the opportunity to evaluate and see. i'm be assured this down is going to bring them lots of benefit, such as a unit on the flood of the water is going to minimize floating level of all these, all these white. unless this is been happening, i don't see you could have been african union, unfortunately has, has proven from time to time it's failure is sir, these lots of you ballistics in africa itself. and i think the fact i'm, it is very significant in the within the african union, again,

now you've sheehan president, is quite significant in the african unions which left so that out, but to get when you have to be boxed, one of them is quite weak and 2 are very significant, you can get a legal agreement. so i think in a sim, we're also the african union, heartfelt and i do think it can resolve this issue as soon as possible, which we all want it. and also don't forget, we are talking about one of the law and grey compliant and involvement of by world powers whom right now frankly, might be too busy with what's going on on the ukraine. russia border. absolutely, you're right. i think these are the sink, the rest of the well it is very busy with many things. i'm sure you follow the year bullet ticks in the u. k. in america, so on. so done, unfortunately, you know, is more of a nig stopped to be neglected by the rest of the world. egypt is having their own again, does now. so i think,

yes. the one demick of geopolitics. other important issues in general, really going online to write it is to come to it was got a few minutes and try and bring adam back in and say, how realistic it are, the expectations that this could be a game changer for the whole continent. these you can talk about this will provide electricity, not only for ethiopia about, for sudan, for kenya, for other countries. what does it quickly, i think so, you know, if the african union indeed has not been able to secure an agreement about i think we have to recognize that the primary responsibility lies on the 3 countries. and if the 3 countries are not willing to compromise, then the african, there's very little that the african union can do. and, you know, the united states has tried it. russia has tried it. you know, super powers have the potential to influence the direction of the agreement. but ultimately the responsibility for success or failure of the go, she lives with the 3 countries in terms of explanation. i think it's massive.

economically, it's going to generate more than $5000.00 kilowatts of, of energy, and part of that would be exported to, to done there's already process going on. and of course, i think the symbolically that the, the ability of a country to some finance, a massive project as, as, as good. i think it's sense and a massive cigna for the continent in terms of self serve. so lance, let me, it is an economy, corporate unity and a social opportunity, social game changer. we've got a minute though, alex, do you agree with that? could this be the project with africa, into electricity export or even to europe? some of the claims from ethiopia, i think this does this crisis and, and the potential does, does it refocuses attention on the need for an integrated economic and political and peace and security architecture? not just for the horn of africa, but for the horn of africa. and the middle east,

and that is a challenge that was in capsulated in the, the original conception, the renaissance of, of africa, which has to be now 10 years on, be reinvented for the, the current situation of, of, of term island disorder. all right, we're gonna have to leave it there because we are out of time. but let's thank our guess adam cathy, about a alex smith and alex deval and thank you to for watching the show. you can see again, any time by visiting our website al jazeera dot com for further discussion head over to our facebook page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. can also join the conversation on twitter. our handle there is act a j inside story. from me, sam is a there and the whole team here for now, it's good bye. ah

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