in $3000000.00 at an auction, as a new record for any item of sports, memorabilia, so called had of god shirt was worn by marijuana during the $986.00 world cub court a final against england. the jersey got its name after 2 goals scored by him during the match. one of them came about after he punched the ball into the net antenna, went on to win the cup. ah, i'm give it out. with the headlines on al jazeera, the european union wants its 27 members to ban russian oil imports. it's part of its laser sanctions for the war and ukraine. the blog wants it done in stages to give government's time to look for alternative supplies. but several countries are pushing for exemptions from any embargo in ukraine. the mayor of mary paul says, rush and forces are again attacking a besieged steel works. and the last contact with the soldiers hold up inside the reporter. fighting threatens to disrupt efforts involving the un to evacuate

civilians trapped in the plant. here as president joe biden says, his administration has made huge progress and reducing the nation's deficit. he's defending his record ahead of unexpected interest rate hike. robber can say he's not doing enough to curb soaring inflation. room track could to failure deficit by another. another $1.00 trillion dollars by the end of this school year. the biggest decline, single year ever in american history. the british decline on top of a $350000000000.00 drop in the depths last year. my 1st year is prison. we also learned for the 1st time since 2016, the treasury department planning to pay down the national debt issued to the public . this quarter rival protests for and against abortion have been held across the u . s. after an unprecedented league of a draft opinion from supreme court,

it's suggested women's right to abortion in america could be ended. that right was guaranteed nearly 50 years ago on the supreme court's rovers wade rolling. a joint report from the un european union and world food program says 193000000 people did not have enough to eat last year and 40000000 more than the year before. aging is closed dozens of subway stations and suspended bus routes to stop cove at 19 spreading through the city. restaurants and bars are only allowed to serve takeaways. all gyms and schools are closed. a miramar court has rejected an appeal by deposed liter uncensored. she, the legal team was hoping to reverse a 5 year sentence for corruption handed down last week. so she was removed from power in a military coup. last year. laser headlines and use will continue here on al jazeera run off the latest episode of the inside story. i'll see you after that. uh by. ah,

sweden and finland said they want to join nato. that's despite warnings from moscow, with washers invasion of ukraine are. those countries on the threat, and what will nato membership mean for the nordic region? this is inside story. ah, hello, welcome to the program, i'm adrian finnegan, before the russian invasion of ukraine, nato membership barely featured in political debates in finland and sweden. but moscow's actions and nuclear threats may have gained the western military alliance

to new members. the leaders of both countries have the support of germany, where they recently met chancellor of shots to talk about security in the region. moscow's repeatedly warned of serious consequences if finland or sweden joined the alliance of the decision will be neither easy nor quick if they apply the parliaments of all 30 nato countries. b to approve new members. and that could take time is a bi lender and sizes. so if these 2 countries decide that they want to join nato, they can count on our support. the members of the government made that clear here in the talks. and i think that is an important signal is in any case, both countries can always rely on germany support at a godless of nato membership. and in the period before our decision is made on such membership with the leaders of finland and sweden say, the decision will come down to what the respective parliaments think is in their

best security interests. as russia romilly claims to write to dictate the choices of others, nato's open door policy is even more important for us all to decide on whether to apply for nato membership or continue on our current path. that is the discussion we are having now in our national spoil parliament, whether finance decision willoughby coordinator or not, it will be based on our will to contribute to our common security. my government is right now to get it with all the political part is in the swedish parliament carrying out the supplementary security policy analysis. and this will be presented on may 13 and a miss that way. we're la. i have very goods and thorough discussions and the loudest within this group, denalis is include in tonight, future international lead defense partnerships for sweden and including

a discussion on ne so, and all auctions are on the table. now, before we get to our discussion, let's quickly remind you of what nato actually is. it stands for the north atlantic treaty organization. it's the world's biggest military alliance. it was founded in 1949, partly due to a perceived threat posed by the soviet union during the cold war. but it's not stop expanding since the fall of the block. it's grown from 17 countries in 199232 day. it pools weapons and resources from its member countries that include battleships, warplanes, missiles, i'm more than 3000000 personnel if and they to a members attacked the others. consider that an act of violence against them all the. so let's bring in our guests for the day from moscow, which went by dimitri babich, a political analyst at in else me. the internet media project based in moscow from

helsinki and mcnamira is visiting research fellow at the finish institute of international affairs and from brussels. we're joined by international affairs strategist nicholas white gentlemen. welcome to inside story dmitri, let's start with you. how will russia react? if the 2 countries join nature, it's threatened to deploy nuclear weapons to the baltic border region and colored grad. should those threats be taken seriously? well, so far i was basically where most amazed by for me so i wouldn't read too much into the basements from iraq is very upset about the possible membership. we don't the nato reminder that during the whole while relations with people and they were actually good. so in fact, these membership, all being much of a team was bought with us or

the last year, all of them directly to be brushed in all of them. russia was basically almost officially named installation. there are legal groups or maybe not on the basis. and they, they all have a chance to do with very quickly. so in fact a strategically this membership will be martin. so i think most of the products from most reach of all of these was supposed to happen. i think when he took his decision, when you break, when do you think that's right? the president puts the taken this into account. i mean, how likely is it that sweden and finland will become they? so members, in the near future, is there any doubt that they soon will be? well, it looks more and more probable by the date right here. now, i agree

a surprisingly with dimitry in the sense that i don't think it will, it will make a very, very big difference because finland and sweden being very intensely, are cooperating with nato for the past decade or more. what i do crucially, i disagree with dimitry in the sense that these exercises on these drills to which they have been cooperating through. i have been directed against russia, nato, and the, the, the independent defense postures of been on and sweden. i have been offensive and defensive up against the russia that has proven itself. i ever more evangelist. i over the past decade. i'm so that is how things have been, how things are now that boats the sense in finland and sweden is that although

strong there in the independent defense capacity is no longer ah enough of it, of an insurance policy i am considering ah, the very brutal aggression that we are seeing are from russia, ukraine at present, and they need an extra layer of deterrents. ah, and they need to be, ah, never again, alone and nato's. i collected the fence, offers them on that option. so it is very, very likely, ah, that both states will apply for nato membership within the next few weeks. and, ah, the ratification process is, is very likely to begin at nato's madrid summit in june. ok to make sure you're giving you a chance to come back on that and remember. but let's bring in nicholas white that in brussels. nicholas, both countries are officially not aligned militarily. other they both as,

as we've been hearing, become nato partners taking parson exercises and exchanging intelligence of both countries now permanently abandoned. that previous stance of strict neutrality. yes . well, if you talk to finish and swedish politicians, they will, they will object that they had abandoned this some time ago. that they, they were no longer being equity systems as they had been in the cold war. but that they were very definitely collaboration with nato, from an external perspective. and they simply won't convert this to internal to, to being part of the team rather than cheering on the sidelines. but this really goes to the harsh of the ho current conflict. and this began because the, the, with the war began because russia was unhappy about ukraine, does things self determination and choosing its own path in terms of security in terms of external licenses. now we see the blessing that finland and sweden are drawing, is not that they should take russian concerns into account, but that they should make these decisions autonomously for themselves. and i think

it's very interesting that the, the major, an external intention of the russian war against you crane has backfired quite spectacularly. okay, dimitri and i don't one of the want to come back on on what you heard. and those 2 answers that let me put it to you that but rushes foreign minister ministry rather the spokes person to the foreign ministry insisted that sweden and finland are being dragged into nato by the us of a well to a certain extent. but so i think this is something that russians are ready and willing to meet the euro exchange exchange of wars. they're actually no more you. ringback you know, for many decades the dream will run was to go in europe or drill peaceful compass. this europe just doesn't exist anymore. i mean switch is no longer and you know, if the bank is going to sanction against sweden

is obviously also been phases. surprisingly, you know, the central ation when they have a meeting. so they are putting in the organization when they remember, they say that when you have some meetings of natal, this is all about russian press cheney trap. so unfortunately, it is easier to find no new carpet, surprisingly in the previous need toward the waste and all the europe asked. war reasons why russia basically continue the war. and you'll be frank with the team. well,

no way be done with this country doors. and so the police were killed. oh, of course it was not a beautiful sold in 1015 in 2000 and then keep to present to my role. but he decided to disagree with you that actually, you know, russia who depended them. no. russia was quite happy with your brain become in relation until my table, who is 2004 but russia wasn't to take the time to rush. you know, we are not thinking independent very gays. was the same story away as a need to exercise and been going to need in been was said that these are

the 1st of that on their own defense if again, who is feel and again cool with them against these repairs. so you said all that was going to defend them. so again, i was always talking, this is sad because of the region should be a regional. unfortunately, natal membership, it will be a region of the it will, it will be a region to box. okay. and do want to come back on that particularly dimitris assertion that the war in ukraine began in 2014 with what he describes as a violent qu. we can go back longer than that and we, but we have a phrase in english once bitten, twice shy, and we can go back to the war in,

in 2008 in georgia. i'm the efforts of the obama administration after that. and we can go back into nato enlargement. in this effort to extend a liberal democratic peace and prosperity, nato did something very unorthodox in the sense that it had it put in the pledge of no troops, no new eastwards. so essentially, to reassure russia to, to show russia it timed in a way. and it didn't have very strong provisions up against russia's borders, which of course, the baltic states on the polls had been highlighting for many, many years and nato, to, to reassure russia. i stayed a persistent with this, i ride up against or right up until i the illegal annexation of crimea in 2014 and even then the nato read in this action plan our

operational atlantic result. and later on the enhance forward presence. these deployments have been very, very light and scalable and nato has relied for it's the turns on mobilization. keeping most of its troops in the west on only saying that it will call them all call them in the region. if the security situation on deteriorates further on russia displays even more aggression. ok, so this idea that nato is, is, is the cause of this major build up. but russia are, is fearful of is a red herring eye that is featuring in the russian narrative as they attempt to justify their revisionism and their efforts to re consolidate and their sphere of influence,

of former glory in central eastern europe. something that finland and sweden, i do not want to be part of on this is what is on propelling on their efforts towards nato right now. ok. 2 questions for nicholas starting with what will sweden and finland bring to to the alliance? just how, how useful are they to european security o sweden, films, of course, very impressive, military built free establishments, certainly on a par with any of the decent western european countries. so from that point of view, they bring a very professionalized, well experience force of personnel. and of course, they also close the strategic gap around the baltic sea. the geographical dimension is very, very important here, that they basically turned the baltic into, into a nato lake,

which it previously was not. so it's very helpful. can they so for to have them? and so what are the dangers then for the white baltic region for estonia, for latvia, for lithuania? ah, the baltic states south of finland, of course, which also border russia, bearing in mind that we've got the, the exclaim of, collin in grad sandwiched between poland and an lithuania. all of these countries have been very concerned about the potential for aggression from russia since their independence in 19191991. and all of them, with the exception of sweden and finland, had already made the determination that the best way to preserve that independence was to join nato. as i said earlier, this conflict began because russia did not accept that ukraine was an independent state. it's absolutely clear if you look at what present patients said or of the russian politicians have said, this is about whether countries have the right to choose their own future. finland

and sweden of now decided they will choose their own future and their choosing their future within nato. and russia needs to accept that. that is how the world works. dmitri, russia needs to accept. that's how the world works. the country's deputy foreign minister said that swing that sweden and finland joining nature would seriously worse than the military situation in the region and lead to the most undesirable consequences. what was meant by that? well, i think nicholas was quite right when he called the walks and made to a league, or whenever you are all c o, o, you know, controlled by just one needed you walk. this is all was back like woman by back. see you there 7 canadians century, the same story here are in fact, oh, the image of sweden and finland in rough is you where it was all want to be in with that. and of course there is a 0 chance or where military solution. why? wonder?

oh, would you use the gaze, ukraine? simply because info at sweden behave march racially than the corolla and breezily nationalist, ukrainian regime that established itself by force in vogue. so i don't expect for anything. what will happen when you bring? ah, but i expect a lot seat and i would start to walk away local hours. i did remind you that every year in sweden there is a part of the way of all the sole old russians. oh, there was only one sylvia somewhere that was once g or in the, in this week one of the what them, i know they were, you know, we cover. all right, so you see just one example, right? so here i'm just going to be a number. let me just throw that to nicholas very briefly, but you want to respond to that nicholas? to be true, you say so cold. russian submarines are for not russians. submarines for order from

as you know it was i was this was just why for person lead seen the summary was there was no, i'm almost have to do justice. there are no graces had to run somewhere and they never really used all. never. ok. i don't get bogged out into into a robot about submarines, particularly owen here in her in helsinki. to what extent is this nato membership bid bid being driven unusually by finland here. that sweden is, is actually being swept along and into the alliance because of its eastern neighbors desire to join. well, i wouldn't say any one is being swept along. here are these states, nato was a democratic alliance on and on. prospective members have to apply for membership, so all states will make their own a sovereign decisions based on,

on their strategic calculations. ah, what jess ah, you're right out. been on is at the front runner. so to say are among the 2 states and things have been, says mich here throughout the spring, i mean, before february 24th, where we're russia launched. it's large scale military assault. ah, it's a legal assault on ukraine. i'm before dot days, only, only a number of weeks before they finish prime minister, santa marine said, i'm not finished. nato membership was very unlikely to happen. i during her tenure, that is what she said. what? because all of russia's brutal aggression i that is displayed. i in ukraine, over the past. i'm number of months i the finish public. i'm has now flipped. it used to be i, you know,

in the last number of years 60 percent against i natal membership, 20 percent for the rest. don't know. now it's more than 60 percent for 20 percent against on the rest. don't know. so there's been a, a resume sounding reversal in, in favor all nato member ship. i'm driven by rushers aggression, not driven by anything else as finland and the finish public. i now believe, ah, russia is no longer taking calculated risks. it's. it's taking up major major risks as barack obama reflected on putin's actions in ukraine, who has bet the farm on this very, very aggressive. i'm. i'm fin not needs the maximum, the parents option and the maximum i collective defense option so that it's never, you know, villain has quite an impressive right or fighting alone. but it's still that is not a desirable option and been undesired to be never again alone. and that is very

much a bottom up process that is occurring here in finance right now. and that is what is preparing. i'm the big right or finish, or nato membership forward. i'm sort of took to cut you short of time is against us here. a couple of more questions for, for nicholas, what changes nicholas would membership require both countries to make in terms of, of foreign and security policy? it's a good question and the answer is that by and large these changes have already been made. it will require finland and sweden to align their military policy, their procurement policy, their general stance of engagement in the outside world with the north atlantic council with the north atlantic treaty organization. but the fact is, as you mentioned in your introduction that finland and sweden have already been largely participating in nato exercises. so to a large extent,

disintegration has already happened. what we're looking at is the formalization of a relationship, as until now has been provisional, am's, and transactional, and shifting it to towards something that is more fundamental and strategic. okay, and will nicholas both countries act in unison regarding nato membership. could you perhaps foresee a situation where, what one joins without the other and, and how long will over the ratification process take? i mean, always from ministers on recall to saying, oh it's, it's going to take a matter of weeks 2 weeks. he said that she said it's not realistic. yes. first of all, i would not like to tell any fitting that their destiny is linked to sweden. let alone vice versa. of the 2 processes will proceed independently, but in parallel, it would be the least surprising outcome if the 2 of them end up joining at the same time. but other outcomes are of course possible the ratification process. first of all, everybody really is in favor of this,

so it won't take all that long. having said that in some countries, there are formalities that simply take a while to get through. the presence of croatia has mentioned that he wants to make the process conditional on a completely different issue, the reform reflection law. in bosnia, i don't think that's just sustainable position, but we'll have to be overcome. i would have thought it's likely take less than a year. i can't really see why it would drive on from much longer than that even than the most convolution of parliamentary systems. ok, gentlemen, there we must leave it. thank you. to all of you for being on the program today to me to regard which in moscow and mcmurry in helsinki and of course in brussels. nicholas white as always, thank you for watching. don't forget you can see the program again at any time. but just by going to the website at our 0 dot com for further discussion, join us at our facebook page. you can find that at facebook dot com forward slash ha inside story. and of course, you can join the conversation on twitter or handle at ha, inside story from me,

adrian finnegan and the whole team here. and uh huh. thanks for watching. i'll see you. ah, ah a conflict between deal with one and one east. the kashmiris, i honestly on al jazeera, may on out is iraq frontline reporting an in depth analysis. we bring you the latest on the ukraine war and the unfolding humanitarian crisis documentary. but

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