and previously thought, though, those of you who want unusual home deck or need look no further than an auction in paris late of this month, french auctioneers have dubbed the so called z fear, a dinosaur for a living room, a just 3.2 meters long. it's much smaller than most specimens. minute you need a lot of money, though it's expected to go for between $4500000.00. as f m, as an iguana don discovered in 2019 by contract is building a road in the us state of colorado. or, i remember you can find much more and all of our stories, including more about that a go on at, on our website. ouch is era dot com. make sure you check out more details on that site. ah, top stories allow jazeera, the us nuclear watchdog, cannot verify iran's nuclear program as exclusively for peaceful purposes. that's

according to an unpublished report. it says the international atomic energy agency has found that iran, c random stock, enriched at 60 percent, has grown by more than 12 kilograms, since may enrichment to 90 percent is usable and weapons such as a nuclear bomb. torso jibari has more from terran, according to those news agencies at the i am reporting that iran has grown. it's highly enriched uranium stockpile over the past 3 months, up to about 30 percent. that means that they now have about $55.00 and a half kilograms of 60 percent enrich uranium. now, according to the i e itself, they identify 25 kilograms of 90 percent enrich uranium as a significant quantity necessary for a simple nuclear weapon. russian president vladimir putin is accused ukraine of cheating, developing countries out of grain shipments by sending its harvest to the european

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attack targeted government services and websites in july about the country response is extreme but proportionate. all right, you're up to date those the headline. so i'll be back with more news in half an hour's time. that's after the stream. stay with us. ah. i i anthony, i call you'll watching the stream on today's episode we think came prison stopped purpose an impact on the incarcerated. is it possible to have more humane presence

cat scans, lexi? that's our conversation started. i think one of the biggest misconceptions about prison is that we are harsh enough and that we need to be tougher with conditions, longest sentences. and that this will encourage people to not want to commit crime by history has shown us time and time again. this approach just doesn't work, and if we look at the countries in half, the toughest ins i use and have the highest recidivism, right? they have the highest deaf, right? because when we trade in people badly and given them not access to the tools they need through education technology, good health care, we're not enabling them to want to become better members of the community for when they are released. and why we're teaching people how to survive in prison. we simultaneously teach them how to foul in society. all right, let's make, i guess hello, fresh. see. and pierre,

and plays. i had good to have you on the street and get your you to introduce yourself. our global audience. tell them what your connection is to prison ritzy you start. hi, thank you for having me on the show. my name is fred c horseman. i'm the founder and executive director of the compassion prison project. and our mission is to create trauma and form prisons and communities in the united states and throughout the world. pia fits are happening. please introduce yourself to the stream audience . yeah. hello everyone. my name's be a go and from finland and forensic psychologist and psychotherapist, and i used to work 10 years as a prison psychologist. and now i work as a project manager in the central administration of our present system in our project called smart present project. thank you so much looking forward to hearing more about that and then hello teresa. good to see you, please introduce yourself to our global audience. thank you very much and hello everyone. my name is to refund your real gave from kenya. i'm the founder and ceo

of a social enterprise called clean soft. we walk to and power to open dignity to in prison and put money in pregnant women and back children. all right, you met the guess and if you're watching right now you're on youtube, you can be part of the conversation as well. speak to, i guess. suppose your question or your comment to be part of today's show. i want to start with teresa and, and get this thought about your concept of what a prison is bad to do. then takes us along to them. what should prison culture be like to raise a you have an inside view because of an unfortunate incident that happened to you. that meant that you experienced prison in kenya. tell us more. and what did you say? very, in your main condition, lack of dignity. it tears you a pot. i remember the day and left prison. i was relieved and i was happy that i

was leaving that crash environment. that was very difficult for my daughter and i. but the truth of the matter that very soon, i realized that the happiness and the relief faded away. but that years then mon of trauma continued post imprisonment. the prison crash if you it like long trauma and it just the human i did you. so i'm going to say site away before i would, it stops commenting the view we're putting to prison for a misunderstanding. it took you a long time to clear your name. but while you were trying to play a name, you experienced the prison culture in kenya at them just bringing fritzy here. certainly in the united states, there's a very punitive idea of what prison is that to do for it. see, why do you disagree with that? the people who are coming to prison who have committed crimes or maybe innocent,

most of them have had incredible trauma growing up growing poverty, growing in violent neighborhoods, growing with parents that are so stressed out that are taking out their frustrations out on their children. and when you're a traumatized child, it's very difficult to learn to be social to function in the world. and sometimes the, your only options are eventually is to commit a crime. and so when they go into prison, they are treated similarly as they were when they were children in their neighborhoods, in their schools and by their parents. and so instead of rehabilitating them, they're subjected to more trauma and more adversity. and then they're not allowed to heal from what got them there in the 1st place. hey, i want to say this headlight, it makes me smile, but there's some real truth behind it. open prisons in finland, i like a holiday camp, but they seem to work. what is holiday camp like with the prisoners that you've, what tim p a, why would people say that and, and why does finland have

a different approach to incarcerating prisoners? a so in sin and we have sort of bullets are close to prisons and the so called open prisons. so the idea is that once the prisoner has been in the close prison and has gotten rehabilitation a he or she is ready to enter more open prison environment. and it's very important to go in the space step by step closer to the norm of society, to the practices and activities of the normal society. so in open prison, prisoners can earn study and work outside of the prison, and they come back to the prison. and then in the evening or during the day time, they are supposed to participate in activities outside the prison. the i'm, i'm going to give out when it's an example of what that looks like. so this video comes from finance, criminal sanctions agency. and what you see here is

a prison has an appointment at i see no boss let's, let's play the video because, you know, i wouldn't to see it. so this, this is somebody who's incarcerated. and in his day he has an appointment. he goes out and about he's not wearing a prison uniform. he has his appointment and then he gets himself back to prison at the end of the day p. how does this what? because why wouldn't he just bow ok, bye? not go back to prison today. i think our model worked so really will and we are internationally known that our, our system works well and all studies show that the punitive approach is not working. so our model at ease made to re, to really reduce recidivism and have prisoners re integrate back to the society. and i think we are succeeding. i want to land on this idea of trauma fritzy because

this is something that is really important for the compassion, prison project. and, and there's a really important film called stepping site, the circle that has been seen so many times. it resonates with educational of facilities with a prism facilities. tell us a little bit about the film because i'm going to show a clip where the incarcerated people that you're talking to, a stepping inside a circle. so just set up, what are we about to say? and why we're about to see $235.00 men step inside the circle for each traumatic event that they experienced in their childhood, from violence in the home to sexual abuse, to physical abuse, emotional abuse, parents or caregivers, addicted to drugs or alcohol, traumatic brain injury which isn't on the original adverse childhood experiences quiz, but it's, it's one of the keys adapt up to 80 percent of the people in prison have traumatic

brain injury. damage to your prefrontal cortex, which is where all these decisions, these great decisions, ability to learn, negotiate follow instructions, reside. but if you're not in your prefrontal cortex, if you're in survival, you're not able to make these decisions comply with orders. so when you see this circle, you'll see people stepping in for what happened to them when they were children and where always, just one last thing. well we and then i'll row the video. where are we? yes, the name of the prison. oh, i'm so sorry. it's in lancaster prison in california. it's also called los angeles community visit los angeles county prison. all right, let's take a look while you are growing up during your 1st 18 years of life. yes, a parent of. 2 other adults in the household often or very often would swear to insult you put you down or humiliate to step inside the circle.

if the parent or other adult in the household often are very often flushed to grab, slapped or threw something at you, step inside the circle imprisoned you not supposed to show your weakness in prison with to want to do good to walk in their circle like take each that was a reminder to ourselves that we still haven't humanity and we weren't to be loved. most people now, sorry, i don't understand and we want to change. so we can really sorry, better than what we learn for. see how just listening to those incarcerated men help us understand a different kind of prison system. they need help. they need help. daniel, who was talking right there. he went through unimaginable circumstances,

both before he got to prison. and while he was in prison from being abused by, as in foster care, being sexually assaulted, hitting bite with 2 by fours in his head. this man is such a glorious man, but he's had so much to overcome that the odds were stacked against him and the odds are stacked against most of the people in prison. and when we shift from annihilation and dehumanization to compassion and safety, making, the men feel safety and the women feel safe so that they can get back to their cortex. we're going to change the prison system. i paused on my laptop when i told it teresa did, it's called what i learned serving time for crime, i didn't commit to raise a what is this scene? what are we seeing here? women are in one of the largest correctional facility here in kenya, coming together in the hood in don, because this is how they come alive with how they remind of them felt of the good

time before they got locked in and trying to make some, you know, meaning, out of the hash conditions that they have to endure while they're feeling prison. so when you got out of prison, you vow to help women children also who was sometimes put into prison as well because a monetary and imprison, help them survive that experience. and then move on. why would you start in terms of improving the situation that they ended up and when they were incarcerated? how do you rethink the prison sent system? in kenya? 90 percent of people in prison will definitely be released to come back into the fact and reign to great and continue with their lives and dissolving over a 2nd chance in a country where poverty very rates are very high. you know,

we do not have enough equip, corporate unity. income generating opportunities are very difficult to come by opportunities that difficult to come by and pick my very high for people who are coming out of prison. so it's really difficult to try and get 2nd chances for women and children who are rebuilding the light post in prison meant a lot of walk advocating and asking the culprit was find the lead. faith based organizations in the community at large can break those who are coming out of prison. and i must say that in a country where we've criminalized property, because that's exactly what we've done. it's the law, it's a bond rebel, it's the marginalized and a very weak amongst asking for a fact. who end up in prison in kenya, you will not find those who i reach and of mean in prison. in

a country where we've criminalized property, we really need to do the decrease like human pain. you know, i'm investing people and not concrete on, because we're really pushing them farther down by sending them to prison, protect your friends. and we're really looking at the classifying the expect your faces so that, you know, we can give better opportunity and look at better ways of resolving social economic issues. because we're trying to resolve the issue is through pre lawn. and you know, we cannot to present to relieve the responsibility. oh oh oh, shall economic need a proof of that not for that reason. i'm meant to keep up the call kathy vague. you know, but when we're taking the poor and the week, i'd like to say that we cannot read, prosecute conflict and imprison our way out of

a socially shoot. i have so many questions for you. guess fits ye, ye go fast and i'm, i'm going to show all these questions as say, stand by get to the question fits, go ahead. i just wanted to say that gandhi said, violence is the worst, is a poverty is the worst form of violence. and that's what we're dealing with here. the people in prison, 85 percent of the people in prison, can't afford a lawyer. they, when they're, when they're at trial, what makes you think they can afford anything, imprison much less expensive phone calls and commissary that's overpriced. and so what we're doing is we're taxing the poor, we're punishing the poor for not being able to afford a lawyer. and that's one of the injustices that starts at the beginning. and, but i have to say the criminal justice system and the retribution that happens in our society is based on fight or flight when you're, when something is wrong, we wanna, we want to react and, and fight back. but we're not in our cortex. we're not here,

we're good decisions are made. so we need to take a deep breath and instead of saying what's wrong with you to the incarcerated, say what happened to you and then you'll find out it's a life time of trauma. and that this trauma needs to be healed. pia, i have some lots of q osteen questions about what's happening in finland. a mock c little says, scandinavian countries that seem to be full of prisons packed to the brim. so that's an observation. well, not yet. this punishment and this being cruel to people. so he sees that there's a lack of cruelty in the way that you incarcerate people, pierre, your thoughts? yeah, i think we are, are quite far in developing these rehabilitative prison system. so prisoners are provided quite a lot rehabilitative services during prison time. and we are also interested in the so called trauma informed approach in our present practice. so we very well know

that prisoners have very traumatic i crowns. the latest project i had was actually in a women's prison and i know that women inmates even more than men have very traumatic backgrounds. there's a lot of abuse, sexual abuse, and or we really have to try to provide them a secure environment during prison time. so that they could heal her from their past experiences and the criminal lifestyle in itself is also very traumatic, abusive, very high stress live. so it, it just repeats trauma and prism is not supposed to repeat trauma. ah, that, that is, that is what i think. and a respect or a humane way is part of all staff's approach to our prisoners including

prison officers. so all stuff is supposed to participate in the rehabilitative work . so i'm getting some pushback here, i guess, to your humane approach to prisons. so another, an earlier comment, send them to do hard labor in siberia, another you chief comment right here, mate prisons, a changing environment. so people don't want to go there. i am wondering pierre, of with this a humane approach to prison in finland. what does the public think? what about victims? oh, of course there's a lot of opinions about our system to an o. so inside of our society, but i want to say that or research or says that de punitive approach, it doesn't work. or it just as good matthias is prisoners more and it will

increase their recidivism, their risk of prissy division. or if you have that kind of a prism system. so also from the point of view of victims, i think it's important that offenders have treated inhumane way. that means that they have to possibility during the prison time to take responsibility for one hit . what they have done faced, the reality faced the reality of their behavior. and all this can be done in a therapist. therapeutic way, i think. so it's not about punishment. it's about making people understand and given them the opportunity to change so that there won't be more victims. i just want to show some pictures that you sent us earlier peer and, and it's a hospital room. it's not here on my laptop. i'm going to show you the pictures their own video, and it's a, a room or like a dorm room. and it looks like you're at university of there's lots of nice knick

knacks around. can we play that video? let's play it right now. add those 2 pictures back to back because it's very different. no, not these to really get there. eventually, it's the one where you can see the plugs in the war. it's a smart, it's a smart, a notice a smart prison. and he said very different. it's a very different look to the look that i'm going to show here, which is the prison museum. it's he or my laptop is, is the prism museum in finland, which looks very much like some prisons in the united states of away you are ivan stuff, been a prison cell. you're locked in for many hours of the day. i'm going to go back to cheap because it was a question for you to res. i'm going to asking to, to ask that question. and the question is about from an jaden, he's in south see dad. and he wants to know, what about people who have been traumatized in prison? how do you get them back to being a andrews? what?

no more. again, tracy, help us out with that one. i'm not saying that it's in her pe. you started then teresa, you pick up because i was because i'm just not south sedans. so i know that teresa knows what, what facilities are available in south sedan to help people get back out of their prison situation. so let me start with theresa. go ahead. theresa. it you know, it as, as you had from my cold underneath. oh, it, you know, when i compare the kind of people with being in finland for example, and what we have in kenya, and that's not very different from what we have in foutz, daniel, other african country the, you know, what the african prison i deal with chronic and our funding all and we currently kind of funding been that green of a crowding. what condition for those who are imprisoned, lack of basic need and definitely very know we have been 80 program and i do

agree that few nickname doesn't want because the more you punish people, the more they repel and rebuild from from the, from the rehabilitation that you're trying to, to, to, to get them. and then of course, mixing the enough and, and the guilty, you know that you know, and then come out, hadn't, and the outside is really, really high. and so, and then as i said in the very beginning that trauma continue, years gone, post imprisonment. so what we're doing is we really try to you we've got an amazing program called that was from your program, which is that healing program where the women come in tackle, which you called hackers, of healing and they've got to shad genuinely ok. the heart said that pain and the

really helps them healed through the process. i've got one more thought fritzy. i want you to respond to this video. this is adam chon, he was formerly incarcerated in san quentin. he makes this point and then react immediately off the back of it. incarceration not only fails to address the root causes of violence, but in fact, reproduces and concentrates the conditions that create violence. and so it's futile to think that we can somehow incarcerate people humanely when incarceration is inherently violent and traumatic practice. prisoners were originally created as a humane alternative to corporal punishment and torture. but since then, progressive projects have only serve to expand the prison system. the quest for a humane prison makes no sense. absolutely.

as you main prison makes no sense. the thing is we have to stop the bleeding. we have to stop. we have to stop. what's happening right now. prisons are military installations. they're basically war zones. and if the incarcerated people are treated as the enemy and the officers that we, we have to also think about the officers. the life expectancy of an officer is 59 years old. what's happening to their lives, to their families lives, to their communities? lives? prisons are destructive for everyone involved, and there's condoned by the state is condone by the federal government. and, but it's an old pattern and i really don't think we have anyone to blame, but we can, we have to make new decisions now, but he's absolutely right. the way prisons are right now on their destructive, but we have to bring as much help as we can while we figure out what, what can replace the prisons the way they are now? i. so our audience, who's watching right now and you to raise that they ought to evaluate between

prison should be punitive prison, shippy more humane. you have one sentence to persuade them, go ahead in one sentence would need could be criminal alive, human pain, invest more in people and not in prison. thank you so much. teresa. p at fred safely pot of today's show. and thanks for your you cio, comments as well. i see you next time. take. ah ah.

ah. ah. safe going home and then international anti corruption excellence award boat now for your hero. ah,

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